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Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? - Culture - Nairaland

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Why Did The Bantu's Migrate From Eastern Nigeria To Central And Southern Africa? / The Bantu people descended from the Igbos of Nigeria: / Traditional Eastern Ijaw Attire In Pictures (1) (2) (3) (4)

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Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 6:40pm On Aug 08, 2012
During one of my visits to South Africa, I became fascinated to the language of the Zulu peoples, ISIZULU. I noticed some distant similarities in the spelling and phonetic styles of the Igbo and Isizulu languages. This curiousity led me to the research into the Bantu people of Africa. The Bantu people are a massive group of African people believed to have migrated from somewhere around Eastern Nigeria and Western Cameroun between 1500 BC-2000 BC. Although recent discoveries [http://www.kaa-umati.co.uk/Bantu%20in%20Ancient%20Egypt.htm, http://eduplace.com/kids/socsci/ca/books/bkf3/imaps/AC_06_206_bantu/AC_06_206_bantu.html] have traced their origin to somewhere around Central Sudan, around the Sahara areas and even Southern Egypt.

According to Wikipedia [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bantu_peoples], their migration point started from the areas around Eastern Nigeria and Western Cameroun (see below). Today, their descendants are found in Central Africa, Eastern Africa and Southern Africa in millions. The Bantu Languages in Africa may be classified as Niger-Congo languages too. The Bantu identities are found in languages such as Bemba, Ingala, Isizulu, Ambo, Bemba, Ndebele, Shona, Swazi, Xhosa, Venda, Khoikhoi, Luhya, Makonde, Hutu, Tutsi and so on. The widespread migration of the Bantu peoples is amazing and breath-taking. Though, what I find interesting is the exclusion of the Igbo language among the Bantu language group. By my estimate, it seem the Bantu ancient migration indeed passed through the ancient Igbo-land, and therefore, must have influenced the customs and language of the people of those times.

There is a general belief that the word "person" means "muntu" in the original Bantu language. Through the centuries, this word has assumed many spellings and tonal inflexion in different Bantu subgroups. In the Igbo language, "umu-" could mean "children" which could be a shortened form of MU ntu. Even the Yoruba and Edo languages are not spared as "omo-" is the adopted word for "children" in their languages. I am still researching on this amazing people but at this point, I have these questions:

1. Can we safely assume that the actual Bantu migration started from Central Sudan or the Nigeria/Cameroun areas?

2. Could the Bantu people be the actual dwellers of the once flourishing Sahara areas in the ancient times?

3. What could have pushed them to migrate deep into the African jungle apart from war and famine?

4. Why didn't the Bantu peoples chose to migrate into West Africa? Could they have encountered stiff resistance from the people around this areas?

5. If indeed the migration started from Nigeria/Cameroun areas, what could have been the major source(s) of the supposed migration?

6. Can we accurately say the Bantu migration is the largest in the African history?


I would like historians and interested individuals on Nairaland to make substantial contributions to this topic. I think it deserves a front page treatment too, Seun. Thank you very much!

Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by anonymous6(f): 8:29pm On Aug 08, 2012
interesting
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by Nobody: 11:00pm On Aug 08, 2012
Very
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by PhysicsQED(m): 11:14pm On Aug 08, 2012
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by PhysicsQED(m): 11:15pm On Aug 08, 2012
their migration point started from the areas around Eastern Nigeria and Western Nigeria

I think you meant Western Cameroon here.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by PhysicsQED(m): 11:32pm On Aug 08, 2012
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by Nobody: 12:06am On Aug 09, 2012
Tony Spike:
1. Can we safely assume that the actual Bantu migration started from Central Sudan or the Nigeria/Cameroun areas?

2. Could the Bantu people be the actual dwellers of the once flourishing Sahara areas in the ancient times?

3. What could have pushed them to migrate deep into the African jungle apart from war and famine?

4. Why didn't the Bantu peoples chose to migrate into West Africa? Could they have encountered stiff resistance from the people around this areas?

5. If indeed the migration started from Nigeria/Cameroun areas, what could have been the major source(s) of the supposed migration?

6. Can we accurately say the Bantu migration is the largest in the African history?


I would like historians and interested individuals on Nairaland to make substansial contributions to this topic. I think it deserves a front page treatment too, Seun. Thank you very much!

I agree@the Bold
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by pleep(m): 4:58am On Aug 09, 2012
Could the Bantu people be the actual dwellers of the once flourishing Sahara areas in the ancient times?
I don't think so, there was an old ethno-linguestic group called Nilo-Sharen that once inhabited that entire area.

It has since diminished in size, and been absorbed mainly by afro-asiatic ppls.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 5:55am On Aug 09, 2012
Thank you, PhysicsQED. I'll go through your links once I'm online. What is your opinion on the influence of the Bantu language on Igbo, Yoruba and Edo. Were Nigerian languages equally influenced?
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by PhysicsQED(m): 8:11am On Aug 09, 2012
I don't think they were "influenced" at all, because the way I see it, diversification/differentiation of languages was the reason for the split of Bantu from non-Bantu and the Bantu languages are just a more recent unique subgroup of "Niger Congo" that attained a very large size/population of speakers.

Looking at the specific languages you mentioned (Yoruba, Edo, and Igbo), when either read or pronounced, they seem very different from (many) Bantu languages, and this difference (which is apparent not just for Yoruba, Edo, and Igbo, but for other West African languages) is probably why there was some initial resistance on the part of professional linguists to claiming that there was some sort of deep relationship between West African languages and Bantu languages, before they finally joined them. I believe there is a relationship, as attested to by the shared roots of several words, but this relationship doesn't mean that words shared between Bantu languages and non-Bantu West African languages are due to influence of one upon the other, but just that, sharing a recent origin in the same place, they diverged from a common root. However, some other language groups came from the same relatively recent common root as well.

A good example is the word you brought up in your original post, the word "omo/umu" meaning "people" or "children". Far from being a Bantu or Proto Bantu remnant/aspect of Niger-Congo languages that was derived in non-Bantu West African languages from "muntu" or variations on "muntu", I would actually see it as a remnant of an even older original language from which Niger Congo languages and Afroasiatic languages emerged. Look at the word and compare it with Hebrew and Arabic (Afroasiatic languages):


Yoruba:

omo - child (omo is also child for Edo and umu is child for Igbo)

Edo:

omwan - person

emwan - people

Igbo:

umunna - children/descendants (umu) of the same father (nna)

Arabic:

ummah - commmunity or nation

Hebrew:

ummah - nation


wikipedia:
Ummah (Arabic: أمة‎) is an Arabic word meaning "nation" or "community". It is commonly used to mean either the collective nation of Islamic state, or (in the context of pan-Arabism) the whole Arab world. In the context of Pan-Islamism, the word ummah is used to mean the diaspora[citation needed] or Commonwealth[citation needed] of the Believers (أمة المؤمنين ummat al-muʼminīn), and thus the whole Muslim people

Origin

The phrase Ummah Wāhidah in the Quran (أمة واحدة, 'One Community') refers to all of the Islamic world unified. The Quran says: “You [Muslims] are the best nation brought out for Mankind, commanding what is righteous (معروف Maʻrūf, lit. 'recognized [as good]') and forbidding what is wrong (منكر Munkar, lit. 'unrecognized [as good]')…” [3:110].

On the other hand, in Arabic Ummah can also be used in the more Western sense of nation, for example: Al-Umam Al-Muttaḥidah, the United Nations.

The Constitution of Medina, an early document said to have been negotiated by Muhammad in AD 622 with the leading clans of Medina, explicitly refers to Jewish and pagan citizens of Medina as members of the Ummah.[1][2][3][4]

In modern Hebrew, the word Ummah (אוּמָה) means "nation", from the root[citation needed] ʿam (עַם), or "people".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ummah


There are other examples, of course. Another one: iya (Yoruba) - mother, nwanyi (Igbo) - woman/female, iye (Edo) - mother, eym (Hebrew) - mother

And there are others, though it would take quite a while to dig them all up.


There is a very fierce (kind of) debate I've come across that is still ongoing where some anthropologists and linguists are trying desperately to "separate" Afroasiatic from other African language groups and group Proto-Afroasiatic with proto-Indo-European or just consider Afroasiatic an isolated language family separate from other African language groups - and part of this debate revolves around (not always explicitly, but it's a relevant factor) whether one specific group, the Egyptians, are to be seen as some unique East African group with Western Asiatic influence or as some kind of "racially" Middle Eastern/Semitic/Western Asiatic group with East African influence - an argument which I don't think that those trying to change/distort the existing classification will win in the end. You can't just have Yorubas, Edos, and Igbos, totally and undoubtedly black African groups, sharing some roots for very fundamental words (not obtainable through trade) with some Semitic languages without Proto-Afroasiatic sharing the same ultimate origin with Proto-Niger-Congo. The weird thing about the debate is that it is rarely acknowledged that human languages are not discrete, but form a kind of continuum with languages in between different extremes or endpoints with respect to different aspects/features and words, so classifying a language as being closer to one group than another does not really cordon off that group into a "separate" branch of humanity like some people involved in that debate are making it seem. At the end of the day, every group is just a subgroup of an older original group until you go back to the very start of humanity.

3 Likes

Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by odumchi: 8:49am On Aug 09, 2012
Very interesting topic.

Physics, what you wrote was very interesting (not to in any way subtract from the integrity of your work), but I believe you made a small error. Child in Igbo is nwa whereas umu is the plural (children).

1 Like

Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by PhysicsQED(m): 8:53am On Aug 09, 2012
^^

Thanks for the correction.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 9:49am On Aug 09, 2012
Wow, PhysicsQED! Merci! Merci! I have some other contributions to add and will do that soon. Also, it's obviously beginning to look like Africa is one big family in terms of linguistic origin.

1 Like

Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 4:26pm On Aug 12, 2012
I was wondering, could Bantu language be the language spoken by a large population of displaced persons during the Hyksos invasions of ancient Egypt? I read that these invasions started around 1800 BC. This period also coincides with the peak of the massive migration of ancient Bantu speakers (set around 1000 BC to 2000 BC). The Hyksos invasion was said to have been engineered by Asiatic peoples. Could this also explain the pseudo-asiatic influence in modern Bantu languages? So many questions that need answers. By the way, I'm just a curious Engineer with an unusual interest in history and archeaology.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by bokohalal(m): 5:25pm On Aug 12, 2012
Bantu language is characterized by prefixes and suffixes.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by snydergp(m): 1:17pm On Aug 15, 2012
I strongly disagree with the one who wrote that Khoisan and xhosa people came from the west africa cause that's a total lie and misrepresentation of any truth.

Khoisan people people's roots can be traced over 200,000years ago in South africa, Namibia, Botswana even as far as Angola and parts of Congo. The khiosan rock paintings in the western and northern areas in South Africa are more then 50,000 years old and is even older then the Egyptian parimids itself. Khiosan people are southern africa's first known enhabitants and is widely seen by scientist and geologist as one of the worlds first people and civilizations so please son don't come with your foot-foot nonesense.

South Africa and parts of Kenya and Ethiopia are considered as the cradils of mankind.

South Africa and Kenya showed that humankind had differrent stages of developement and that took place it the same time.

West and North Africa according too well reseached data was never the origin of mankind but Kenya and South Africa was so do your research transparently before u post your BAFOONARY here for others to read.

Don't believe in the hype son educate your mind than you can have a debate on the origins of bantu people. Maybe that's why Nigerian universities has some of the least published researched papers in the world on early human developement. Sorry but please go climb back in that tree you jumped out son
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 4:53pm On Aug 15, 2012
snydergp: I strongly disagree with the one who wrote that Khoisan and xhosa people came from the west africa cause that's a total lie and misrepresentation of any truth.

Khoisan people people's roots can be traced over 200,000years ago in South africa, Namibia, Botswana even as far as Angola and parts of Congo. The khiosan rock paintings in the western and northern areas in South Africa are more then 50,000 years old and is even older then the Egyptian parimids itself. Khiosan people are southern africa's first known enhabitants and is widely seen by scientist and geologist as one of the worlds first people and civilizations so please son don't come with your foot-foot nonesense.

South Africa and parts of Kenya and Ethiopia are considered as the cradils of mankind.

South Africa and Kenya showed that humankind had differrent stages of developement and that took place it the same time.

West and North Africa according too well reseached data was never the origin of mankind but Kenya and South Africa was so do your research transparently before u post your BAFOONARY here for others to read.

Don't believe in the hype son educate your mind than you can have a debate on the origins of bantu people. Maybe that's why Nigerian universities has some of the least published researched papers in the world on early human developement. Sorry but please go climb back in that tree you jumped out son
I don't know who you are, but can you please quote the person on this thread who mentioned the Khoisans? I started the thread and I know too well that the Khoisans are the oldest residents in Africa as far as I know. If you had read the thread properly, you'll know that we are discussing about the Bantus. Any research material used in this thread is a product of years of Bantu language studies, and not from Nigeria. I won't join you in using offensive languages. Try to be decorous on this forum. Cheers!
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by 19naia(m): 7:05pm On Aug 15, 2012
the various tribes of africa cannot be summarized by what is most available in researched history..Researched history becomes so dim as time goes further back and summarizing bantu people migrations by language distributions has to go back 50 thousand years where language history in Africa is estimated around 200,000 years....It must be considered that before the Islamic crusades sent migrations across africa even through the time of Mansa Musa more recently,there were migrations around africa during the drying out of the great lakes of the sahara of which lake chad is one of the last...The misterious Nok people would provide missing links of migrations and then 4000-6000 year old settlements found across southern nigeria,the saharah has so much buried truth under it as latest satelite imaging from NASA has shown...The bantu or any other tribal group may not have been known by the modern BANTU name if we consider 50,000 year old history and the number of migrations around africa that have happend in that time...50,000 yr old migrations are linked from africa to asia where words similar to yoruba and other african languages flourish,like the word OKURIN in yoruba for man:as the word OKARI in japanese for man and not to mention the many dialects of china..The word Okari has even migrated from japan through the pacific into hawaii where it trans morphed to the word Okane for man and King...Its not enough to learn one african language to see the extent of african language migration globally..Even from yoruba alone,i have to consider several yoruba dialects to compare to old english and latin based words..Phono as in phonate to make a sound has no real counterpart in yoruba but Say or sound has counter part for "so" which means say in youruba..S and O are the primary cognates for the word sound and say and sonic...In my fathers Akure Ondo state dialect,they say "fon" for "so" and it means the same as in to say or sound..."fon" is also the primary cognate for phono or phonate....The "SO" version is more germanic with cognates such as sound,say,sonic,spiel,speak etc all retaining the early roots by starting off with the S as the primary cognate....the "fon" version is related to the latin language with phono,phone,phonate ,etc....There are too many of these types of cognate relations to european,asian languages to be coincidence and as such deduces that africa was the likely root of language, but the neccessary migrations to carry it out of africa predate 50,000 years with some clues pointing to 200,000 years....The same type cognate linking system is also used to decipher links in genetic language contained in everyones body and its no coincidence that language architecture trans morphs with similar system to Genes...When people migrate and their features change, it affects say the shape of the mouth cavity and the nasal cavity and it can affect pronounciations that they originaly had over thousands of years...I can even see in USA after white people of europe took the country over,they speak and pronounce their english much differently after only 400 or so years...I can even see the difference in the resting shape of the mouth of a lifetime london english speaker and a lifetime USA english speaker with the same european ancestory ,and the differneces in mouth resting shape goes for german and other european region migrants to USA...I try to magine the extent of change to language and body features after 50,000 years of migration.... VERY NICE TOPIC HERE ALL YOU THREAD CONTRIBUTORS AND AT BEST WE HAVE MANY CLUES BUT EVEN MORE MYSTERY TO UNCOVER...Thanks

1 Like

Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 7:26pm On Aug 15, 2012
19naia: the various tribes of africa cannot be summarized by what is most available in researched history..Researched history becomes so dim as time goes further back and summarizing bantu people migrations by language distributions has to go back 50 thousand years where language history in Africa is estimated around 200,000 years....It must be considered that before the Islamic crusades sent migrations across africa even through the time of Mansa Musa more recently,there were migrations around africa during the drying out of the great lakes of the sahara of which lake chad is one of the last...The misterious Nok people would provide missing links of migrations and then 4000-6000 year old settlements found across southern nigeria,the saharah has so much buried truth under it as latest satelite imaging from NASA has shown...The bantu or any other tribal group may not have been known by the modern BANTU name if we consider 50,000 year old history and the number of migrations around africa that have happend in that time...50,000 yr old migrations are linked from africa to asia where words similar to yoruba and other african languages flourish,like the word OKURIN in yoruba for man:as the word OKARI in japanese for man and not to mention the many dialects of china..The word Okari has even migrated from japan through the pacific into hawaii where it trans morphed to the word Okane for man and King...Its not enough to learn one african language to see the extent of african language migration globally..Even from yoruba alone,i have to consider several yoruba dialects to compare to old english and latin based words..Phono as in phonate to make a sound has no real counterpart in yoruba but Say or sound has counter part for "so" which means say in youruba..S and O are the primary cognates for the word sound and say and sonic...In my fathers Akure Ondo state dialect,they say "fon" for "so" and it means the same as in to say or sound..."fon" is also the primary cognate for phono or phonate....The "SO" version is more germanic with cognates such as sound,say,sonic,spiel,speak etc all retaining the early roots by starting off with the S as the primary cognate....the "fon" version is related to the latin language with phono,phone,phonate ,etc....There are too many of these types of cognate relations to european,asian languages to be coincidence and as such deduces that africa was the likely root of language, but the neccessary migrations to carry it out of africa predate 50,000 years with some clues pointing to 200,000 years....The same type cognate linking system is also used to decipher links in genetic language contained in everyones body and its no coincidence that language architecture trans morphs with similar system to Genes...When people migrate and their features change, it affects say the shape of the mouth cavity and the nasal cavity and it can affect pronounciations that they originaly had over thousands of years...I can even see in USA after white people of europe took the country over,they speak and pronounce their english much differently after only 400 or so years...I can even see the difference in the resting shape of the mouth of a lifetime london english speaker and a lifetime USA english speaker with the same european ancestory ,and the differneces in mouth resting shape goes for german and other european region migrants to USA...I try to magine the extent of change to language and body features after 50,000 years of migration.... VERY NICE TOPIC HERE ALL YOU THREAD CONTRIBUTORS AND AT BEST WE HAVE MANY CLUES BUT EVEN MORE MYSTERY TO UNCOVER...Thanks
That's quite a lot of research you have up there, sir. Talking about the language and tonal variations around the world, I read recently that Africa has largest variety of tonal inflexions compared to other parts of the world. This revelation could also confirm that migration started from Africa. On a serious note, I support physicsQED's assertion that language is a continuum, knowing where it all started is a pretty wild guess, but Africa is a highly probable starting point.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by 19naia(m): 7:26pm On Aug 15, 2012
Dont forget that the genes people carry in their bodies are used to date migrations and relationships in ancestory and that helps to subside some of the mysteries that come about with just following language...Genes have a unique way of being dated through mitochondrial DNA and can date back the 200,000 year mark and so can languages be put through a process that gives an estimate to their early forms date...The african languages have varieties or forms that link to every corner of the globe..Outside africa,the nuber of dialects is not so high except in few places..So the most basic method for rateing the age of a language,is to date the peoples history at the location or on the continent and then to asses the number of dialects assosiated with their ancestory...It takes time for dialects to evolve and so africa is given merits for age in language because of that, and also for artefacts of early inhabitants...None of the Hyksos or latin circle cultures have very wide range of dialects...The asians do have wide range of dialects but not as diverse in styling, but the asians are finding artifacts to place themselves there well beyond 200,000 years,Tonal language forms are another aspect of asian and african languages and possible a trait from before 50,000yrs..There is not really any thing to trace a distinct culture with a modern name ,beyond 200.000 years ,or even any language beyond 200,000 years..I will try to look up again the name of the system used to date languages as i was taught when i studied anthropology course in university...Not many peolpe know how to calculate in that sytem because it takes immense linguistic exposure....African speakers would make the best linguist in the world if the could easily travel the world and be interested in the subject
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 7:27pm On Aug 15, 2012
-Deleted multiple post-
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 7:28pm On Aug 15, 2012
-Deleted Multiple posts-
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by 19naia(m): 6:30pm On Aug 16, 2012
Tony Spike:
That's quite a lot of research you have up there, sir. Talking about the language and tonal variations around the world, I read recently that Africa has largest variety of tonal inflexions compared to other parts of the world. This revelation could also confirm that migration started from Africa. On a serious note, I support physicsQED's assertion that language is a continuum, knowing where it all started is a pretty wild guess, but Africa is a highly probable starting point.
Its all a continuum and recycles into itself over long periods of time where there are always older migrations overlapping newer migrations making the mix really extensive beyond any real trace to an original form..But its true that africas diversity in languages and cultural groups is a sign of lots of time in africa with prehistoric Bantu language being the most proven source of all african languages with estimates 200,000 years back..To say that they were even known by the name bantu so long ago is not right,but we use the names we can link them to without a doubt,and that can take credit away from other current tribes like khosian that show history going far back even if they also did not go by that modern name so long ago.Maybe they were one tribe 200,000 years ago by another name other than bantu or khosian....Its proven very well that we are all linked by language and genetics and thus its not esy to explain the links without infering that the originator of one culture was "this one" and not "that one" all going by a tribal name that may not have even existed at the time in question...we continue to mix across the world and that will make a different story for far future if the world last longer still...
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by 740megawatts: 7:07pm On Aug 18, 2012
Interesting topic!
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 3:34pm On Aug 31, 2012
Time to resurrect this thread and discuss it properly....I'll be back!
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 4:09pm On Aug 31, 2012
Here are the details according to Alain Delvilani's website: http://www.everything-zulu.com/bantu-migration.html

WHO ARE THE BANTUS?
300 to 600 ethnic groups of black people in Africa speak related languages which form the Bantu language group.

These groups are distributed from east to west from Cameroon to central and east Africa and expand south to Southern Africa.

Zulu belongs to the Bantu group of languages.

Bantu means “The people”.

They originated near the south western boundary of Nigeria and Cameroon where they were settled around 2000 B.C.


CAUSES OF BANTU MIGRATION
Obviously, the exact reasons are not known but some factors may have played a role.

1. climate change: The climate may have changed and made the rain unreliable in their territories and they had to move to keep their cattle healthy and avoid famine.

2. Overpopulation occurred: Grazing land became scarcer and they had to move. Land scarcity led to war and conflicts.The pressure from the Arabs increased.

In any case, they followed different routes and the migration took centuries to reach the south of the continent. Most probably a group left an area to establish itself a little bit further and so on, in a continent which was mainly empty of human life except the pygmies in the rain forest and Khoisan groups in the east and south.

It was not a fast moving horde but more a gentle flow of newcomers.

They were not colonizers too or at least did not have that in mind.

When they met with settled group it is admitted that absorption took place by intermarriage but they could also displace them to less favorable grounds due to their higher physical force and their weapon’s superiority.


Then about 1500 B.C, the Bantu began to move westwards and then south.

TIMELINE OF THE BANTU MIGRATION
By 1500 B.C, they had reached the rain forest and by 500 B.C small groups emerged from it in the savannahs of the south where the Democratic Republic of Congo, Angola and Zambia are actually situated.

By 1000 B.C, some other groups went east and reached the great lakes of east Africa where they could flourish in a better environment.

Then they went south east following the coast and establishing themselves next to rivers.

They finally reached Kwazulu by 300 A.D and the northern province of South Africa by 500 A.D

THE CONSEQUENCES OF BANTU MIGRATION
The Bantu migration brought:

1. The use of iron smelting which was a huge technological step: Tools like hoes to till the land or machetes to clear it, were manufactured which increased the food production.

2. The way of living changed and permanent dwellings were built. New staple foods were introduced like bananas, yams and millet. The excess crop could be bartered or sold which led to the development of trade.

3. They introduced the concept of a ruling authority (the King) with an embryo of administration (councillors) running a centralised state.

On the negative side:

1. They destroyed other groups and their culture even if some intermarriage occurred.

2. They brought war and insecurity in previously peaceful areas.

In any case and as a result black people were present in Kwazulu as early as 300 A.D.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 4:17pm On Aug 31, 2012
The implication of the Bantu migration is that most of the indigenous tribes along the Weatern and Southern African tribes are distantly and genetically linked to the Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun. A look at the map below will confirm the migration patterns. It will should be noted that the Khoisans and Pygmies were well-established at their various settlements before the Bantu migrations.. Like I earlier suspected and suggested at the onset of this thread, the Zulu language of South Africa retains some tonal features that sounds like modern Igbo language, even after hundreds of years! This is quite astonishing and needs further research....

Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by TonySpike: 2:51pm On Oct 24, 2012
One of the easiest ways of identifying Bantu-linked cultures language similarities in the spelling of man, person and child/children. Another way as you have mentioned is by observing the generic similarities in the naming of towns/cities/villages right from Igboland, through Congo, Angola, Namibia, Botswana and down to South Africa. There is an obvious and ingenious way the ancient Bantu migrants have left the trace of their existence all over Africa. It was as if they were fleeing from something very disastrous at the North of Africa. Here is a list of spellings for several Bantu groups around Africa, it's simply amazing. I got the original table from http://www.kaa-umati.co.uk/bantu_rosetta_stones_part_c.htm. I have however modified the table, based on my research, to include countries where these Bantu language groups exist. Enjoy!!!


BANTU GROUP SPELLING FOR PERSON BY COUNTRIES

Kiswahili-Bantu Mtu DRC, Tanzania, Angola, Mozambique, Kenya, Somalia and Rwanda

Bemba Bantu Muntu Zambia, DRC

Lingala-Bantu Moto DRC, CAR, Republic of Congo

Oshindonka-Bantu OMuntu Namibia, Angola

Zulu-Bantu Umuntu South Africa, Zimbabwe, Swaziland, Lesotho, Malawi, Mozambique

Luvale-Bantu Mutu Zambia, Angola

Rukwangali-Bantu Muntu Namibia, Angola

Setswana-Bantu Motho Botswana, South Africa, Namibia, Zimbabwe

Tsonga-Bantu Munhu Mozambique, South Africa, Namibia, Zimbabwe

Southern-Sotho Motho South Africa, Lesotho

Chichewa-Bantu Munthu Zambia, Malawi, Mozambique, Zimbabwe

Ruknyankore-Rukiga- Bantu Omuntu Uganda

Lega-Bantu Monto DRC

Thimbukushu-Bantu Munu Namibia, Angola, Botswana , Zambia

Kuria-Bantu Omonto Tanzania, Kenya

Shona-Bantu Munhu Mozambique, Zimbabwe, South Africa, Zambia, Botswana



and now adding,

Igbo Umu (Children) Nigeria (East)
Yoruba Omo (Children) Nigeria (West)
Bini Omo (Children) Nigeria (South)
Igala Oma (Children) Nigeria (Central)

Surprising, the ancient Egyptian way of spelling MAN is MTU. Guess what? The modern English word for it is also MAN.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by Nobody: 3:11pm On Oct 24, 2012
PhysicsQED: I don't think they were "influenced" at all, because the way I see it, diversification/differentiation of languages was the reason for the split of Bantu from non-Bantu and the Bantu languages are just a more recent unique subgroup of "Niger Congo" that attained a very large size/population of speakers.

Looking at the specific languages you mentioned (Yoruba, Edo, and Igbo), when either read or pronounced, they seem very different from (many) Bantu languages, and this difference (which is apparent not just for Yoruba, Edo, and Igbo, but for other West African languages) is probably why there was some initial resistance on the part of professional linguists to claiming that there was some sort of deep relationship between West African languages and Bantu languages, before they finally joined them. I believe there is a relationship, as attested to by the shared roots of several words, but this relationship doesn't mean that words shared between Bantu languages and non-Bantu West African languages are due to influence of one upon the other, but just that, sharing a recent origin in the same place, they diverged from a common root. However, some other language groups came from the same relatively recent common root as well.

A good example is the word you brought up in your original post, the word "omo/umu" meaning "people" or "children". Far from being a Bantu or Proto Bantu remnant/aspect of Niger-Congo languages that was derived in non-Bantu West African languages from "muntu" or variations on "muntu", I would actually see it as a remnant of an even older original language from which Niger Congo languages and Afroasiatic languages emerged. Look at the word and compare it with Hebrew and Arabic (Afroasiatic languages):


Yoruba:

omo - child (omo is also child for Edo and umu is child for Igbo)

Edo:

omwan - person

emwan - people

Igbo:

umunna - children/descendants (umu) of the same father (nna)

Arabic:

ummah - commmunity or nation

Hebrew:

ummah - nation




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ummah


There are other examples, of course. Another one: iya (Yoruba) - mother, nwanyi (Igbo) - woman/female, iye (Edo) - mother, eym (Hebrew) - mother

And there are others, though it would take quite a while to dig them all up.


There is a very fierce (kind of) debate I've come across that is still ongoing where some anthropologists and linguists are trying desperately to "separate" Afroasiatic from other African language groups and group Proto-Afroasiatic with proto-Indo-European or just consider Afroasiatic an isolated language family separate from other African language groups - and part of this debate revolves around (not always explicitly, but it's a relevant factor) whether one specific group, the Egyptians, are to be seen as some unique East African group with Western Asiatic influence or as some kind of "racially" Middle Eastern/Semitic/Western Asiatic group with East African influence - an argument which I don't think that those trying to change/distort the existing classification will win in the end. You can't just have Yorubas, Edos, and Igbos, totally and undoubtedly black African groups, sharing some roots for very fundamental words (not obtainable through trade) with some Semitic languages without Proto-Afroasiatic sharing the same ultimate origin with Proto-Niger-Congo. The weird thing about the debate is that it is rarely acknowledged that human languages are not discrete, but form a kind of continuum with languages in between different extremes or endpoints with respect to different aspects/features and words, so classifying a language as being closer to one group than another does not really cordon off that group into a "separate" branch of humanity like some people involved in that debate are making it seem. At the end of the day, every group is just a subgroup of an older original group until you go back to the very start of humanity.



Verrrry interesting. Will add my million dollars to this post when i get off of work. smiley

Awesome thread btw.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by somegirl1: 4:50pm On Oct 24, 2012
Tony Spike: One of the easiest ways of identifying Bantu-linked cultures language similarities in the spelling of man, person and child/children. Another way as you have mentioned is by observing the generic similarities in the naming of towns/cities/villages right from Igboland, through Congo, Angola, Namibia, Botswana and down to South Africa. There is an obvious and ingenious way the ancient Bantu migrants have left the trace of their existence all over Africa. It was as if they were fleeing from something very disastrous at the North of Africa. Here is a list of spellings for several Bantu groups around Africa, it's simply amazing. I got the original table from http://www.kaa-umati.co.uk/bantu_rosetta_stones_part_c.htm. I have however modified the table, based on my research, to include countries where these Bantu language groups exist. Enjoy!!!


BANTU GROUP SPELLING FOR PERSON BY COUNTRIES

Kiswahili-Bantu Mtu DRC, Tanzania, Angola, Mozambique, Kenya, Somalia and Rwanda

Bemba Bantu Muntu Zambia, DRC

Lingala-Bantu Moto DRC, CAR, Republic of Congo

Oshindonka-Bantu OMuntu Namibia, Angola

Zulu-Bantu Umuntu South Africa, Zimbabwe, Swaziland, Lesotho, Malawi, Mozambique

Luvale-Bantu Mutu Zambia, Angola

Rukwangali-Bantu Muntu Namibia, Angola

Setswana-Bantu Motho Botswana, South Africa, Namibia, Zimbabwe

Tsonga-Bantu Munhu Mozambique, South Africa, Namibia, Zimbabwe

Southern-Sotho Motho South Africa, Lesotho

Chichewa-Bantu Munthu Zambia, Malawi, Mozambique, Zimbabwe

Ruknyankore-Rukiga- Bantu Omuntu Uganda

Lega-Bantu Monto DRC

Thimbukushu-Bantu Munu Namibia, Angola, Botswana , Zambia

Kuria-Bantu Omonto Tanzania, Kenya

Shona-Bantu Munhu Mozambique, Zimbabwe, South Africa, Zambia, Botswana



and now adding,

Igbo [b]Umu (Children) Nigeria (East)
Yoruba Omo (Children) Nigeria (West)
Bini Omo (Children) Nigeria (South)
Igala Oma (Children) Nigeria (Central)
[/b]
Surprising, the ancient Egyptian way of spelling MAN is MTU. Guess what? The modern English word for it is also MAN.


coincidence in my opinion.

We'd have to examine a fair amount of words to establish a relationship between west african ethnic groups and bantu speaking groups.
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by shymexx(m): 5:35pm On Oct 24, 2012
Everyone is mixed and most west Africans migrated from East/North East Africa, anyway...
Re: Origin Of The Bantu Peoples: Eastern Nigeria/Western Cameroun? by Nobody: 10:02pm On Oct 24, 2012
some-girl:



coincidence in my opinion.

We'd have to examine a fair amount of words to establish a relationship between west african ethnic groups and bantu speaking groups.

coincidence? lol.
no. no such thing.

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