A simple question for the anyone (believer or non-believer) on nairaland. Do you believe the universe was created in 7 days? Do you believe Adam and Eve are the progeny of the entire human race? Tracing the genealogy of Christ from Adam and Eve, human civilization as we know it is 6000 years old - do you really believe this to be true? Do you believe in the Tower of Babel: that thousands of years ago, men could build a sky scraper reaching the clouds which resulted in the punishment that creates the anthropological differences between various ethnicities and races today? Do you believe in the Great Flood and Noah's ark and that Noah was able to round up the hundreds of millions of animal species into his ark in his conservation efforts?

I could go on but to be brief, just how literally do you interpret the Bible as the incontrovertible, unequivocal word of God?

I believe everything in the Bible as far as it is translated and interpreted correctly, which is by the Spirit of God guiding us as we read it, for it was the spirit of God that originally inspired those who contributed to it.

2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

2 Peter 1:20-21 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation.For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

100% literal with the leading of the Holy Spirit.

k2039: I believe everything in the Bible as far as it is translated and interpreted correctly, which is by the Spirit of God guiding us as we read it, for it was the spirit of God that originally inspired those who contributed to it.

2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

2 Peter 1:20-21 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation.For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

You do realize that what you call divinely inspired scripture was conceived, written and documented, rediscovered, translated and interpreted, printed and published by men. It was concieved and arranged in its current format by men who chose the suitable scripture that conforms to their intended religious message. I'm not sure many realize this when they go on about the divine inspiration of the Bible as if it was thrown down from heaven like the ten commandments.

frosbel: 100% literal with the leading of the Holy Spirit.

Ah yes, the "Holy Spirit". The invisible guide and inspiration every christian claims to have but who can't seem to prevent the multitude of varying scriptural interpretations that has created a very divided house in christianity. You mean that Holy Spirit?

Obi1kenobi:
Ah yes, the "Holy Spirit". The invisible guide and inspiration every christian claims to have but who can't seem to prevent the multitude of varying scriptural interpretations that has created a very divided house in christianity. You mean that Holy Spirit?

Because they are too lazy like you to read their bibles studiously , patiently , intelligently and with the guidance of God's Spirit and wisdom.

Rather they follow men's interpretations of the beloved book, hence the ensuing confusion.

As you know lazy students who depend on others to pass their exams hardly achieve much in the area of true knowledge.

Well, as can be surmised from my replies above, I think it's somewhat naive if anyone truly believes those biblical stories are true. For example, it's a little far fetched that the manpower, know-how and technology was available thousands of years ago to build a tower of Babel that would sweep the clouds. Or that this incident is responsible for our different languages. No credible scientist, historian or anthropologist could hold this to be close to the truth.

Obi1kenobi: Well, as can be surmised from my replies above, I think it's somewhat naive if anyone truly believes those biblical stories are true. For example, it's a little far fetched that the manpower, know-how and technology was available thousands of years ago to build a tower of Babel that would sweep the clouds. Or that this incident is responsible for our different languages. No credible scientist, historian or anthropologist could hold this to be close to the truth.

whatever rocks your boat or cocas your cola or pings your pong.

have a splendid day Pal !

if u take the bible literately , u will get confused,or will seem like chemistry to u

u CAN NOT get the message behind the bible with ur ,and give it a literal interpretation.

it is spiritual book and only ur spiritual eyes can pick,the main message,paul says the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life

frosbel:

Because they are too lazy like you to read their bibles studiously , patiently , intelligently and with the guidance of God's Spirit and wisdom.

Rather they follow men's interpretations of the beloved book, hence the ensuing confusion.

As you know lazy students who depend on others to pass their exams hardly achieve much in the area of true knowledge.

I'm sure you find Catholic faith to be anathema from true christian teachings. Yet, a great many priests of varying ranks and priestly orders are a lot more schooled in the Bible, theology and philosophy than you'll ever be. Maybe you're deluded enough to think they're lazy as well unlike your exceptional, spirit-guided self. You do know that that's exactly the point, the interpreter lives in the illusion he's spirit guided just like ynu believe in your illusion of exceptionalism.

Obi1kenobi:
You do realize that what you call divinely inspired scripture was conceived, written and documented, rediscovered, translated and interpreted, printed and published by men. It was concieved and arranged in its current format by men who chose the suitable scripture that conforms to their intended religious message. I'm not sure many realize this when they go on about the divine inspiration of the Bible as if it was thrown down from heaven like the ten commandments.

Everything you wrote above is true. But somehow you seem to think that because men did all the writing, selection & production of the bible, therefore it contradicts divine inspiration. If god had to personally write & produce & distribute the scriptures, then where's the inspiration then? your logic simply & blatantly fails to understand the meaning of inspiration.

cescky: if u take the bible literately , u will get confused,or will seem like chemistry to u

u CAN NOT get the message behind the bible with ur ,and give it a literal interpretation.

it is spiritual book and only ur spiritual eyes can pick,the main message,paul says the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life

Interesting, so how exactly do you interpret those passages spoken about in the original post?

okeyxyz:

Everything you wrote above is true. But somehow you seem to think that because men did all the writing, selection & production of the bible, therefore it contradicts divine inspiration. If god had to personally write & produce & distribute the scriptures, then where's the inspiration then? your logic simply & blatantly fails to understand the meaning of inspiration.

I'm saying it contradicts the infallibility of the written word. I'm saying the writings are little different from a book written by any pastor or "man of God". There is a lot that's disputable in the bible and there are fair few inherent contradictions in it. A pastor could write a controversial portrayal of God or his word and tell you it was divinely inspired.

Obi1kenobi: Well, as can be surmised from my replies above, I think it's somewhat naive if anyone truly believes those biblical stories are true. For example, it's a little far fetched that the manpower, know-how and technology was available thousands of years ago to build a tower of Babel that would sweep the clouds. Or that this incident is responsible for our different languages. No credible scientist, historian or anthropologist could hold this to be close to the truth.

scientists, just discovered of late, that there are water springs underneath, the great oceans of the world.

Job mentioned this fact, years ago!

archeologist way back found a coin with the inscription of king Solomon, way back...............

whom are scientist? ........to some extent guess workers

theirs more to life than meets the eye

the greatest scientist ever albert Einstein later, believed in Jesus at least to some extent tho..........

choice really is urs, BUT, what if one tiny little bit of the stories are true then what.......

Obi1kenobi: A simple question for the anyone (believer or non-believer) on nairaland. Do you believe the universe was created in 7 days? Do you believe Adam and Eve are the progeny of the entire human race? Tracing the genealogy of Christ from Adam and Eve, human civilization as we know it is 6000 years old - do you really believe this to be true? Do you believe in the Tower of Babel: that thousands of years ago, men could build a sky scraper reaching the clouds which resulted in the punishment that creates the anthropological differences between various ethnicities and races today? Do you believe in the Great Flood and Noah's ark and that Noah was able to round up the hundreds of millions of animal species into his ark in his conservation efforts?

I believe in it all

Obi1kenobi:
I'm saying it contradicts the infallibility of the written word. I'm saying the writings are little different from a book written by any pastor or "man of God". There is a lot that's disputable in the bible and there are fair few inherent contradictions in it. A pastor could write a controversial portrayal of God or his word and tell you it was divinely inspired.

So if a message seems literally contradictory and fallible, then it cannot be divinely inspired? If a book is written by a pastor, then it cannot be inspired? If the contents of message are disputable and a controversial portrayal of god, It definitely cannot be divinely inspired?? So god must appeal to your values & pleasures before he can qualify as god? Like I said before, you simply and absolutely have no idea of what it means to be inspired, let alone divinely inspired or the nature of god himself.

cescky:

scientists, just discovered of late, that there are water springs underneath, the great oceans of the world.

Job mentioned this fact, years ago!

archeologist way back found a coin with the inscription of king Solomon, way back...............

whom are scientist? ........to some extent guess workers

theirs more to life than meets the eye

the greatest scientist ever albert Einstein later, believed in Jesus at least to some extent tho..........

choice really is urs, BUT, what if one tiny little bit of the stories are true then what.......

Einstein was a Pantheist and never believed in a personal god, talkless of believing in Jesus. People get this wrong a lot.

Obi1kenobi: A simple question for the anyone (believer or non-believer) on nairaland. Do you believe the universe was created in 7 days? Do you believe Adam and Eve are the progeny of the entire human race? Tracing the genealogy of Christ from Adam and Eve, human civilization as we know it is 6000 years old - do you really believe this to be true? Do you believe in the Tower of Babel: that thousands of years ago, men could build a sky scraper reaching the clouds which resulted in the punishment that creates the anthropological differences between various ethnicities and races today? Do you believe in the Great Flood and Noah's ark and that Noah was able to round up the hundreds of millions of animal species into his ark in his conservation efforts?

I could go on but to be brief, just how literally do you interpret the Bible as the incontrovertible, unequivocal word of God?

The problem is the bible does not say the things you listed, your interpretation of it does - outside of the very direct & oft simple teachings of Jesus Christ in the gospels, the bible can be tricky to understand, and even trickier to apply to today's times - considering how fluid & dynamic language is, ever changing with each generation & culture.

I believe evrything in the bible is useful bt nt al from God. Inspiration is different from authouration(if there's a word like that

okeyxyz:

So if a message seems literally contradictory and fallible, then it cannot be divinely inspired? If a book is written by a pastor, then it cannot be inspired? If the contents of message are disputable and a controversial portrayal of god, It definitely cannot be divinely inspired?? So god must appeal to your values & pleasures before he can qualify as god? Like I said before, you simply and absolutely have no idea of what it means to be inspired, let alone divinely inspired or the nature of god himself.

Who's talking of God appealing to me? Christian doctrine portrays him as infallible because he's meant to be omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent and omnibenevolent. So yes, inherently contradictory or risible or factually incorrect or inaccurate passages raise red flags which has me questioning the authencity or "divine inspiration" behind the story. I think you're the one unable to grasp the point. If you tell me Noah rounded up 2 of all animals on earth, I will question the authencity of the story due to its logistical impossibility and that tells me there can't be divine inspiration in such a tale.

Obi1kenobi:
Who's talking of God appealing to me? Christian doctrine portrays him as infallible because he's meant to be omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent and omnibenevolent. So yes, inherently contradictory or risible or factually incorrect or inaccurate passages raise red flags which has me questioning the authencity or "divine inspiration" behind the story. I think you're the one unable to grasp the point. If you tell me Noah rounded up 2 of all animals on earth, I will question the authencity of the story due to its logistical impossibility and that tells me there can't be divine inspiration in such a tale.

You will note that I'd simply presented your words back to you logically, just to demonstrate the serious flaws in such line of reasoning. If you'd taken time to do any research on christian origins and history, you should be able to answer whether the jews, who handled the scriptures before christianity, whether they interpreted the scriptures literally or allegorically, Also, whether jesus and the apostles interpreted them literally or allegorically. Yes, some are literal, some are allegorical and that is all you need to know as an outsider, but to the spiritually minded, there is absolutely no mistake or contradictions in the messages, they are absolute truth and infallible. Of course you and every other non-believer out there won't understand and we the spiritually guys expect such, we are not surprised by your oppositions and it is not our intention or duty to convert you. We separate spiritual matters from secular ones, unlike you and your kind(no offense) who insist that they must be one, that there must be a universal principle by which all beings must willingly conform. We on the other hand understand that there are different and diverse realms of realities and understandings,that there is more to life than what can be scientifically tested & measured. So, you are simply asking for proof of something that was never promised or claimed in the first place.

Obi1kenobi: A simple question for the anyone (believer or non-believer) on nairaland. Do you believe the universe was created in 7 days? Do you believe Adam and Eve are the progeny of the entire human race? Tracing the genealogy of Christ from Adam and Eve, human civilization as we know it is 6000 years old - do you really believe this to be true? Do you believe in the Tower of Babel: that thousands of years ago, men could build a sky scraper reaching the clouds which resulted in the punishment that creates the anthropological differences between various ethnicities and races today? Do you believe in the Great Flood and Noah's ark and that Noah was able to round up the hundreds of millions of animal species into his ark in his conservation efforts?

I could go on but to be brief, just how literally do you interpret the Bible as the incontrovertible, unequivocal word of God?

not very literal. i take it symbolically and allegorically. however in between the symbols and allegorys are some literal truths. you just have to know how to decipher what is literal and what is not. a lot of people err taking the bible literally

You probably didnt understand my post

Obi1kenobi:
You do realize that what you call divinely inspired scripture was conceived, written and documented, rediscovered, translated and interpreted, printed and published by men.

no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation.

Obi1kenobi: I'm not sure many realize this when they go on about the divine inspiration of the Bible as if it was thrown down from heaven like the ten commandments.

I believe everything in the Bible as far as it is translated and interpreted correctly, which is by the Spirit of God guiding us as we read it, for it was the spirit of God that originally inspired those who contributed to it

okeyxyz:

You will note that I'd simply presented your words back to you logically, just to demonstrate the serious flaws in such line of reasoning. If you'd taken time to do any research on christian origins and history, you should be able to answer whether the jews, who handled the scriptures before christianity, whether they interpreted the scriptures literally or allegorically, Also, whether jesus and the apostles interpreted them literally or allegorically. Yes, some are literal, some are allegorical and that is all you need to know as an outsider, but to the spiritually minded, there is absolutely no mistake or contradictions in the messages, they are absolute truth and infallible. Of course you and every other non-believer out there won't understand and we the spiritually guys expect such, we are not surprised by your oppositions and it is not our intention or duty to convert you. We separate spiritual matters from secular ones, unlike you and your kind(no offense) who insist that they must be one, that there must be a universal principle by which all beings must willingly conform. We on the other hand understand that there are different and diverse realms of realities and understandings,that there is more to life than what can be scientifically tested & measured. So, you are simply asking for proof of something that was never promised or claimed in the first place.

You've demonstrated no flaw in anyone's reasoning. You've not commited to any point and are basically being elusive in your replies. I know my bible and its history very well, thank you. And lose the patronising tone. I was a hardcore christian all my life till a few years ago so I wonder what you feel your exclusive "spiritually minded folk" are privy to which an "outsider" like me isn't. Laughable comment.

Do you interpret everything in the bible literally? It's a simple question really which your prevarication tries to compound with pseudo-logic.

k2039: You probably didnt understand my post


no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet's own interpretation.





I believe everything in the Bible as far as it is translated and interpreted correctly, which is by the Spirit of God guiding us as we read it, for it was the spirit of God that originally inspired those who contributed to it

I don't think you understand mine either. The fact you're told in Bible school it's divinely inspired doesn't stand up to academic or logical scrutiny. A Hindu, Buddhist or Taoist could tell you the same about his books and you wouldn't believe it. For example, contrary to popular assertion, Moses didn't write the book of Genesis and it's not known who wrote it. How then can you say with total conviction that it's the divinely inspired word of God? That's a little biased.

If a pastor wrote a book you disagree with and he told you it's divinely inspired, would you indulge him just because he said so?

Obi1kenobi:
Do you interpret everything in the bible literally? It's a simple question really which your prevarication tries to compound with pseudo-logic.

Simply speaking: NO!! I apologize for my "prevarications & rigmaroles"

Obi1kenobi:

I don't think you understand mine either. The fact you're told in Bible school it's divinely inspired doesn't stand up to academic or logical scrutiny. A Hindu, Buddhist or Taoist could tell you the same about his books and you wouldn't believe it. For example, contrary to popular assertion, Moses didn't write the book of Genesis and it's not known who wrote it. How then can you say with total conviction that it's the divinely inspired word of God? That's a little biased.

If a pastor wrote a book you disagree with and he told you it's divinely inspired, would you indulge him just because he said so?

I get your point now. 'By quoting the Bible to prove the Bible does not prove anything. Why should the claims of the Bible be believed? There are many religious books that claim to convey truth'.


It's all about my personal encounter with the Holy Spirit(I cant explain more than that).

I will allow the Bible to speak for itself. It clearly claims to be God's Word. It doesn't need defending. If I attempt to defend the Bible, then I am placing some other standard as the ultimate judge.



The Holy Spirit will show the truth of its claim to anyone who is interested in knowing. Nothing else is necessary.


Shalom