Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / New
Stats: 3,143,337 members, 7,780,885 topics. Date: Friday, 29 March 2024 at 02:31 AM

Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? - Islam for Muslims - Nairaland

Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? (1871 Views)

Do Muslims from Northern Nigeria have native names? / Why Do Muslims Face The East When Praying? / Why Do Muslims Hate Christians So Much, Could This Be The Anti-christ Coming? (2) (3) (4)

(1) (2) (Reply) (Go Down)

Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by solbil: 9:21am On Nov 23, 2012
i just dont know why! Anytime you tell muslims that jesus is the son of God, they tell you something like; how can god have a son when he doesnt have a wife? To them, you can only have a son through biological means. But is it true that it is only through biology that one can become a son to another person?

Jesus made us to understand in the early part of the gospel of john that a man becomes son of his father through biology. But he becomes a child of God through the spirit. (john 3:6) good news bible.

The quran agrees that Adam is the son of God. And the same quran knows that "God does not have a wife". Yet it knows that Adam is the son of God. Which means that the idea of having a son without biological means isnt elusive to the glorious quran. Despite this, muslims just cant understand it when you tell them jesus and by extension, christians are sons of God!
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by F00028: 9:46am On Nov 23, 2012
solbil:
The quran agrees that Adam is the son of God...
say what?! where does the Qur'an agree to this ?! shocked
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by solbil: 10:16am On Nov 23, 2012
F00028:
say what?! where does the Qur'an agree to this ?! shocked
thats what i hear from muslims. They would say: if jesus were son of god who then is adam?
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 10:56am On Nov 23, 2012
First of all, the quran never calls anyone the son of God not Adam or Jesus or anyone.

Let's agree to use common sense. Please read carefully and reason.

See there are only two options involved in having a son:

i. begotten: The very meaning of which connotes sexual intercourse.

That is ludicrous, so he is not literally the son of God. Now you only other option is that he was adopted.

ii. Adopted

This is also absurd.

Imagine i had a fish bowl and inside the fish bowl is a fish called floppy.

I say to you, this is floppy my son.

You will probably say, that is crazy, it is a fish

I insist that floppy the fish is my son, I have all the adoption papers signed and all. He eats dinner at the table and i have a room for him.

You will probably say: No, that is a fish and you are a human.

Point: You can't adopt a fish as your son, it doesn't have any meaning. You can only adopt something as a son which is like you, a human being.

Historically humans have used the names of these lower animals to insult each other, by calling them names of animals.. Ex: you cow, pig , son of a.... e.t.c.

Why do you think that is the case? This is because you are equating the human to something lower than it. This is considered an insult to most of us.

The point here is that, this is more insulting to God to say that God has a human being as a son. Humans and animals do share a lot of characteristics, we are both needy and finite. we were all born and we will die.

God does not have any of those traits. God is the Opposite of all of these. To equate the creator to having as His son, a human being is actually insulting and has no meaning.

You have another option though, which is a common feature is semetic languages... People are addressed as the fathers of what they love. For instance, in Arabic, a man is called Abu hurayra- father of cats... Basically, one who loves cats. We see that in the bible that many people are called sons of Gods. It simply refers to one that God is pleased with or loves. If you mean that God loves Jesus (Peace and blessings be upon him), i have no problem with that.

However, you can not make a square to be a circle and still remain a square. It makes no sense. The man, Jesus (Peace and blessings be upon him)according to your bible, ate food, got tempted, drank, slept, prayed... This is completely the attribute of a man and the opposite of a self-sufficient God. You can not have a square-triangle. It makes no sense.

On Judgement day, if i stand before God and i am asked " why didn't take Jesus as God or son of God?' > I can say: Oh God, how can i believe the self sufficient creator of all that exists, is a dot on a planet which is a dot on our galaxy which is a dot on the Universe.

It simply makes no sense. If i am condemned to hell, i will never for a second think justice was done..

If you are asked: Why did you reduce the Creator of the heavens and the earth to a man?.... What excuse do you have?? What can you possibly say??

2 Likes

Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 11:53am On Nov 23, 2012
A common christian contention is that: Oh well God can do anything...

And i ask : Can God tell lies

The Christian would probably say: He can but he would not do that.

And i say: Exactly, God does not do things that do not befit his majesty. Humans lie and have children. It is an attribute of Humans not of God. God is by definition self sufficient, Humans are not..

God having a son is an absurdity, it makes no sense. It is a square-triangle.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by solbil: 1:04pm On Nov 23, 2012
tbaba, all of your long arguement become weak when you come to realise that jesus is not human. Yes, by the power of the holy spirit he became man only for about 33 years. But jesus is first and foremost not man. He is spirit. The bible said not one thing was created without him. Which means,he existed before the world began, before humans were created. How can some who existed before humans be equated with humans.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by F00028: 2:26pm On Nov 23, 2012
solbil: tbaba, all of your long arguement become weak when you come to realise that jesus is not human. Yes, by the power of the holy spirit he became man only for about 33 years....
if that's your argument then Jeremiah occupies the same position.

God says He knew Jeremiah before he was in his mother's womb and had even appointed him a prophet. see jer.1:5
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 3:37pm On Nov 23, 2012
solbil: tbaba, all of your long arguement become weak when you come to realise that jesus is not human. Yes, by the power of the holy spirit he became man only for about 33 years. But jesus is first and foremost not man. He is spirit. The bible said not one thing was created without him. Which means,he existed before the world began, before humans were created. How can some who existed before humans be equated with humans.

I thought we agreed to use common sense, you do not cross the road blind folded. In everything you do in your life, you apply your common sense. God gave you that for a reason.
This is probably the most important thing in your life and you decide not to use it.

What makes a man? Jesus was born of a woman,ate like a man,slept like a man, prayed like a man.
Was he praying to himself? Common sense tells us that a thing can not be its opposite. A self sufficient God can not be s needy man at the same time.It makes no sense n it is not
possible. Are you willing to stake your fate on something so irrational n improbable? Something you have no proof of?

1 Like

Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 8:59pm On Nov 23, 2012
tbaba1234:

I thought we agreed to use common sense, you do not cross the road blind folded. In everything you do in your life, you apply your common sense. God gave you that for a reason.
This is probably the most important thing in your life and you decide not to use it.

What makes a man? Jesus was born of a woman,ate like a man,slept like a man, prayed like a man.
Was he praying to himself? Common sense tells us that a thing can not be its opposite. A self sufficient God can not be s needy man at the same time.It makes no sense n it is not
possible. Are you willing to stake your fate on something so irrational n improbable? Something you have no proof of?


LOL
Have you considered the following;

Is it rational to have a sex filled heaven? How probable are Quranic revelations true when we have no one but Prophet Muhammed to rely on ( and given the several improbable "scientific" theories therein and historical incompleteness and inaccuracies). Why was the Prophet so akin to wage war, sometimes unprovoked. How can Islam be the right path when many kill and find justification in the Quran? Killing even people of their own faith (Over 20,000 shias (including 6,000 children) murdered by other Muslims over faith matters just in Pakistan in the last 30 years alone!, thousands more elsewhere (Iraq, Syria Bichi and co))? Why is Allah allowing this? Why would Allah allow his religion to be spread through invasion, plunder and killings? (India, Iraq, Iran, Syria, China etc), Why would he allow some to spread terror in his name even on their own kind; flesh and blood? Why would Allah allow early Caliphs to murder themselves so in the struggle for power?

Why didn't Allah mention Jerusalem in the Quran, but allowed later Muslims to claim the place (Jerusalem)as the 3rd holiest place in Islam and the site of the Jewish temple (ironically a holy place in Judiasm known as a temple site since King Solomon) as the site to the Masjid Alaqsa? Was he not setting the foundation for future crisis that will threaten world peace? Why did Allah allow the Jews to come back to Israel and cause this violence between the Arabs (majority his best of people) and Jews(the people his Prophet cursed, and Allah once turned to apes). Why didn't he keep them scattered but allowed them to return as the Bible prophesied? Why didn't he prove the Bible wrong?

How probable is it that Allah turned some people to Apes and Monkeys because they didnt observe the Sabbath? Why, if Islam is the right path, did it recommend child brides. Even the Prophet had one; had slaves, slept with them and traded in them. If Islam is the right path why couldn't it have shown us that all these were wrong. Why would Allah intervene in the domestic affairs of the Prophet and his wives (and his sleeping with his slave without marriage) and yet refuse to save him from poison despite even the intervention of an angel?

How probable is it that the devil sleeps in our noses? Or that shooting stars are hurled at the Jinns? Or Alexander lived a ripe old age? Or Adam is superior than Angels when the later have significant control over the laws of physics? How did the Devil come about? If the Devil refused to bow to Adam what prevented God from dealing with him ASAP? If angels are less than humans, how come they can do more than we can?



Now consider this


If God is omnipotent, and nothing is beyond him, does he need a wife to have a son? Is being on earth and in heaven at the same time impossible? If understanding God so difficult or beyond our comprehension, are we expected to humanly understand the concept of the 1+1+1=1? If God can forgive humans, and indeed judge them, is it improbable for him to make himself manifest through his constituent part (remember nothing is too great for him... or are there?) If he is too great to come down to our level to offer salvation, then isn't is too great to waste his time judging us? Or even create heaven for our enjoyment? If he took such great care to make us are we not deserving of his intervention then in the form the Christians believe? Or did he waste his time creating us?


If God is great and mighty, why would you try to use your puny brain to judge his actions as improbable or not? In fact, from your logic, who are you to?


SMH
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by maclatunji: 9:25pm On Nov 23, 2012
^Stop ranting, Greek mythology makes more sense than the concept of the trinity. You know it holds no water. At least, the Greeks recognize that if they attribute children to the Supreme being, it can't stop at one and if divinity becomes shared, conflict must thereafter arise. Go and reflect and come back to the truth, God is one without any conditions and His absolute divinity is incontestable.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 9:33pm On Nov 23, 2012
^^^^^
What is this?

[size=20pt]F9[/size]

My poser still remains.


What is more irrational than this?



LOL
Have you considered the following;

Is it rational to have a sex filled heaven? How probable are Quranic revelations true when we have no one but Prophet Muhammed to rely on ( and given the several improbable "scientific" theories therein and historical incompleteness and inaccuracies). Why was the Prophet so akin to wage war, sometimes unprovoked. How can Islam be the right path when many kill and find justification in the Quran? Killing even people of their own faith (Over 20,000 shias (including 6,000 children) murdered by other Muslims over faith matters just in Pakistan in the last 30 years alone!, thousands more elsewhere (Iraq, Syria Bichi and co))? Why is Allah allowing this? Why would Allah allow his religion to be spread through invasion, plunder and killings? (India, Iraq, Iran, Syria, China etc), Why would he allow some to spread terror in his name even on their own kind; flesh and blood? Why would Allah allow early Caliphs to murder themselves so in the struggle for power?

Why didn't Allah mention Jerusalem in the Quran, but allowed later Muslims to claim the place (Jerusalem)as the 3rd holiest place in Islam and the site of the Jewish temple (ironically a holy place in Judiasm known as a temple site since King Solomon) as the site to the Masjid Alaqsa? Was he not setting the foundation for future crisis that will threaten world peace? Why did Allah allow the Jews to come back to Israel and cause this violence between the Arabs (majority his best of people) and Jews(the people his Prophet cursed, and Allah once turned to apes). Why didn't he keep them scattered but allowed them to return as the Bible prophesied? Why didn't he prove the Bible wrong?

How probable is it that Allah turned some people to Apes and Monkeys because they didnt observe the Sabbath? Why, if Islam is the right path, did it recommend child brides. Even the Prophet had one; had slaves, slept with them and traded in them. If Islam is the right path why couldn't it have shown us that all these were wrong. Why would Allah intervene in the domestic affairs of the Prophet and his wives (and his sleeping with his slave without marriage) and yet refuse to save him from poison despite even the intervention of an angel?

How probable is it that the devil sleeps in our noses? Or that shooting stars are hurled at the Jinns? Or Alexander lived a ripe old age? Or Adam is superior than Angels when the later have significant control over the laws of physics? How did the Devil come about? If the Devil refused to bow to Adam what prevented God from dealing with him ASAP? If angels are less than humans, how come they can do more than we can?



Now consider this


If God is omnipotent, and nothing is beyond him, does he need a wife to have a son? Is being on earth and in heaven at the same time impossible? If understanding God so difficult or beyond our comprehension, are we expected to humanly understand the concept of the 1+1+1=1? If God can forgive humans, and indeed judge them, is it improbable for him to make himself manifest through his constituent part (remember nothing is too great for him... or are there?) If he is too great to come down to our level to offer salvation, then isn't is too great to waste his time judging us? Or even create heaven for our enjoyment? If he took such great care to make us are we not deserving of his intervention then in the form the Christians believe? Or did he waste his time creating us?


If God is great and mighty, why would you try to use your puny brain to judge his actions as improbable or not? In fact, from your logic, who are you to?


SMH
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by maclatunji: 9:43pm On Nov 23, 2012
^There is nothing you have there that hasn't been debunked before and you know it. Leave obstinacy and begin to embrace the truth. No need to be going round in circles with you. God is not a member of any trinity, stop diminishing yourself by associating partners with him.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 9:50pm On Nov 23, 2012
You have managed to spill a whole lot of nonsense, as usual.....

Most of what you have written are either false or irrelevant to the truth of Islam and to the topic at hand. I am talking about the very basis of your faith and you are telling me about sectarian violence in pakistan. What does that have to do with the topic?

Who is a child? you use your 21st century goggles to look at events that happened over 1400 years, something that was perfectly normal then and perfectly normal event a hundred years, how convenient...

You are chasing red herrings, trying to distract from the main issue, stick to the topic and defend your irrationality.


Now consider this?


If God is omnipotent, and nothing is beyond him, does he need a wife to have a son? Is being on earth and in heaven at the same time impossible? If understanding God so difficult or beyond our comprehension, are we expected to humanly understand the concept of the 1+1+1=1? If God can forgive humans, and indeed judge them, is it improbable for him to make himself manifest through his constituent part (remember nothing is too great for him... or is there?) If he is to great to come down to our level to offer salvation, isn't is too great to waste time judging us? Or even create heaven?


If God is great and mighty, why would you try to use your puny brain to judge his actions as improbable or not?

The very thing on which your faith hangs makes no sense, the thing that your salvation hangs on is irrational. That, i would consider very unfair don't you think??... To shut off common sense which is a common feature in your everyday dealings for the most important thing in your life.

When you say God is omnipotent, it refers to His ability to actualise an event. If i ask why God doesn't eat, what would you say? Would you say he eats because He is omnipotent. It is meaningless, it makes no sense... It is same thing with attributing a human son to God whether adopted or begotten, It is meaningless and senseless.

What stops krisna, buddha or Sango from being God's sons? You are opening a box of various possibilities, all irrational. The ancient arabs attributed daughters to God, maybe there were right too.

God does the things that befit his majesty because He is self sufficient. If 1+1+1 =1 is needed for my salvation, then it has to make sense because i will not cross the road blind. Common sense. Opposites can not be the same. Common sense.

Let examine the basis of the two faiths:

The Christians claim God was born, Muslims say Allah (swt) was always there.

The Christians claim that God died, Muslims say Allah (swt) is ever Living.

The Christians claim God has a son, Muslims say Allah (swt) is unique

The Christians claim God was over-powered by man, Muslims say Allah (swt) is all powerful.

The Christians require you to believe in something that makes no sense, and is never explained anywhere in their text. Muslims say Allah (swt) is our Rabb, and this message is reiterated on every page of the Qur'an.

The truth is clear from falsehood.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by maclatunji: 10:00pm On Nov 23, 2012
^Thank you for not falling for the bait. Tiarabubu, accept the truth, your heart knows it. Stop playing ostrich.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 10:23pm On Nov 23, 2012
tbaba1234: You have managed to spill a whole lot of nonsense, as usual.....

Most of what you have written are either false or irrelevant to the truth of Islam and to the topic at hand. I am talking about the very basis of your faith and you are telling me about sectarian violence in pakistan. What does that have to do with the topic?

Who is a child? you use your 21st century goggles to look at events that happened over 1400 years, something that was perfectly normal then and perfectly normal event a hundred years, how convenient...

You are chasing red herrings, trying to distract from the main issue, stick to the topic and defend your irrationality.



The very thing on which your faith hangs makes no sense, the thing that your salvation hangs on is irrational. That, i would consider very unfair don't you think??... To shut off common sense which is a common feature in your everyday dealings for the most important thing in your life.

When you say God is omnipotent, it refers to His ability to actualise an event. If i ask why God doesn't eat, what would you say? Would you say he eats because He is omnipotent. It is meaningless, it makes no sense... It is same thing with attributing a human son to God whether adopted or begotten, It is meaningless and senseless.

What stops krisna, buddha or Sango from being God's sons? You are opening a box of various possibilities, all irrational. The ancient arabs attributed daughters to God, maybe there were right too.

God does the things that befit his majesty because He is self sufficient. If 1+1+1 =1 is needed for my salvation, then it has to make sense because i will not cross the road blind. Common sense. Opposites can not be the same. Common sense.

Let examine the basis of the two faiths:

The Christians claim God was born, Muslims say Allah (swt) was always there.

The Christians claim that God died, Muslims say Allah (swt) is ever Living.

The Christians claim God has a son, Muslims say Allah (swt) is unique

The Christians claim God was over-powered by man, Muslims say Allah (swt) is all powerful.


The Christians require you to believe in something that makes no sense, and is never explained anywhere in their text. Muslims say Allah (swt) is our Rabb, and this message is reiterated on every page of the Qur'an.

The truth is clear from falsehood.






Buahahahahaha! Your understanding of what Christianity is is sooooo flawed, I can begin to understand your ignorance! God was born indeed! lol


But I ask how rational are these posers?


LOL
Have you considered the following;

Is it rational to have a sex filled heaven? How probable are Quranic revelations true when we have no one but Prophet Muhammed to rely on ( and given the several improbable "scientific" theories therein and historical incompleteness and inaccuracies). Why was the Prophet so akin to wage war, sometimes unprovoked. How can Islam be the right path when many kill and find justification in the Quran? Killing even people of their own faith (Over 20,000 shias (including 6,000 children) murdered by other Muslims over faith matters just in Pakistan in the last 30 years alone!, thousands more elsewhere (Iraq, Syria Bichi and co))? Why is Allah allowing this? Why would Allah allow his religion to be spread through invasion, plunder and killings? (India, Iraq, Iran, Syria, China etc), Why would he allow some to spread terror in his name even on their own kind; flesh and blood? Why would Allah allow early Caliphs to murder themselves so in the struggle for power?

Why didn't Allah mention Jerusalem in the Quran, but allowed later Muslims to claim the place (Jerusalem)as the 3rd holiest place in Islam and the site of the Jewish temple (ironically a holy place in Judiasm known as a temple site since King Solomon) as the site to the Masjid Alaqsa? Was he not setting the foundation for future crisis that will threaten world peace? Why did Allah allow the Jews to come back to Israel and cause this violence between the Arabs (majority his best of people) and Jews(the people his Prophet cursed, and Allah once turned to apes). Why didn't he keep them scattered but allowed them to return as the Bible prophesied? Why didn't he prove the Bible wrong?

How probable is it that Allah turned some people to Apes and Monkeys because they didnt observe the Sabbath? Why, if Islam is the right path, did it recommend child brides. Even the Prophet had one; had slaves, slept with them and traded in them. If Islam is the right path why couldn't it have shown us that all these were wrong. Why would Allah intervene in the domestic affairs of the Prophet and his wives (and his sleeping with his slave without marriage) and yet refuse to save him from poison despite even the intervention of an angel?

How probable is it that the devil sleeps in our noses? Or that shooting stars are hurled at the Jinns? Or Alexander lived a ripe old age? Or Adam is superior than Angels when the later have significant control over the laws of physics? How did the Devil come about? If the Devil refused to bow to Adam what prevented God from dealing with him ASAP? If angels are less than humans, how come they can do more than we can?



Now consider this


If God is omnipotent, and nothing is beyond him, does he need a wife to have a son? Is being on earth and in heaven at the same time impossible? If understanding God so difficult or beyond our comprehension, are we expected to humanly understand the concept of the 1+1+1=1? If God can forgive humans, and indeed judge them, is it improbable for him to make himself manifest through his constituent part (remember nothing is too great for him... or are there?) If he is too great to come down to our level to offer salvation, then isn't is too great to waste his time judging us? Or even create heaven for our enjoyment? If he took such great care to make us are we not deserving of his intervention then in the form the Christians believe? Or did he waste his time creating us?


If God is great and mighty, why would you try to use your puny brain to judge his actions as improbable or not? In fact, from your logic, who are you to?


SMH


Chew on that! grin
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 10:28pm On Nov 23, 2012
grin grin grin

hehe!! i thought as much!!! Keep the blind folds on, you will come to know
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 10:40pm On Nov 23, 2012
maclatunji: ^Thank you for not falling for the bait. Tiarabubu, accept the truth, your heart knows it. Stop playing ostrich.


Haba Mac, what truth? Honestly, lets even leave matters of faith altogether (God, Judgement and heaven). Given the antecedents of Muslims and Islam, do you really think its the right path? An example is as recent as Wednesday in Bichi - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-20448565 and Pakistan - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20425510 http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2012/11/22/273968/shias-receive-death-threats-in-pakistan/

Can this be the right path when death and blood even from within flow sooo cheap? In this day and age? No. It can't be. Sorry.

Then of course discussing faith is a whole new kettle of fish.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 10:48pm On Nov 23, 2012
tbaba1234: grin grin grin

hehe!! i thought as much!!! Keep the blind folds on, you will come to know


Hey chew on this posts to Maclantunji (modified). I think its apt for you too.


tiarabubu:


Haba Mac, what truth? Honestly, lets even leave matters of faith altogether (God, Judgement and heaven). Given the antecedents of Muslims and Islam, do you really think its the right path? examples is as recent this month and last Wednesday in;

Bichi - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-20448565 and
Pakistan - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20425510 http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2012/11/22/273968/shias-receive-death-threats-in-pakistan/
Baghdad - http://www.guardian.co.uk/guardianweekly/story/0,,1818778,00.html


Can this be the right path when death and blood, even from within, flow sooo cheap? Right from the time of the Prophet to THIS DAY and age? Is this the right path? No. It can't be. Sorry!

Then of course discussing matters faith is a whole new kettle of fish.


"By their fruits you will know them. Do you gather grapes from thorns, or figs from thistles? .... A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit". - Jesus Christ Matthew 7:16

Ignorance is bliss. Enjoy! grin
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by ZhulFiqar2: 10:56pm On Nov 23, 2012
tiarabubu:


Haba Mac, what truth? Honestly, lets even leave matters of faith altogether (God, Judgement and heaven). Given the antecedents of Muslims and Islam, do you really think its the right path? An example is as recent as Wednesday in Bichi - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-20448565 and Pakistan - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-20425510 http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2012/11/22/273968/shias-receive-death-threats-in-pakistan/

Can this be the right path when death and blood even from within flow sooo cheap? In this day and age? No. It can't be. Sorry.

Then of course discussing faith is a whole new kettle of fish.

Those spilling the blood of Shia Muslims in Pakistan do not belong to the religion of Islam.they are not even Sunnis.these are the followers of tyranny and the spiritual descendants of Yazeed.the same Yazeed who was a follower of Arabian Jahiliyya culture which was violent and the greatest source of terror.the first people to suffer from that terrorism was the Prophet (s) and his Household members,especially in the Tragedy of Karbala.it is saudi petro-dollars that is fueling sectarian killings in Pakistan and also Indian intelligence agency with the aim to destabilize Pakistan.

And mind you northern ireland also experience catholics and protestants fighting and killing themselves,even though Wahhabism takes the crown for terrorism.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 11:04pm On Nov 23, 2012
^Again, missing the point...

I could begin listing acts committed by practising christians but you will not get it linked to their faith. You are missing the point and beclouding your judgement, all of these actions/crimes by members of both faiths are irrelevant to the concept of truth or the irrationality of God having a son or the concept of a trinity.

Look at the basis of your faith without shutting down your brain and see how meaningless it is. Trying to divert from the topic shows your inability to defend your own beliefs. It fails at the door step of common sense.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 11:21pm On Nov 23, 2012
Zhul-Fiqar.:


Those spilling the blood of Shia Muslims in Pakistan do not belong to the religion of Islam.they are not even Sunnis.these are the followers of tyranny and the spiritual descendants of Yazeed.the same Yazeed who was a follower of Arabian Jahiliyya culture which was violent and the greatest source of terror.the first people to suffer from that terrorism was the Prophet (s) and his Household members,especially in the Tragedy of Karbala.it is saudi petro-dollars that is fueling sectarian killings in Pakistan and also Indian intelligence agency with the aim to destabilize Pakistan.

And mind you northern ireland also experience catholics and protestants fighting and killing themselves,even though Wahhabism takes the crown for terrorism.

Whether you classify those murderers as Muslims or not, they pray to Allah, scream Allahu Akbar before massacring poor Shia Children, Women and Men (some pilgrims!). They do it for religious reasons. ITS NOT A WAR, AN INSURRECTION, A STRUGGLE - JUST PLAIN MURDER!

Afterall the Wahabis are the custodians of Mecca and Medina abi? If they are not Muslims are Mecca and Medina in the hands of non-Muslims? I would love to hear you say so.

As regards Ireland, I refrained from including political strife and blaming it on Islam because there are wider issues at stake not just religion.

For example as at today 40,000 (fourty thousand ) Syrians have died in the conflict with Bashar and co, but its largely (as least publicly) a political war (we know what Iran and co are doing behind the scene), so I will not include that. And so also the war in Mali. And for that reason, your example of Northern Ireland is lame. The key issues at stake in Northern Ireland is political as Unionists and loyalists generally want Northern Ireland to remain within the United Kingdom while Irish nationalists and republicans generally want it to leave the United Kingdom and join a united Ireland. The conflict is considered ended with the Belfast Agreement of 1998.

Try harder. Look for another religion aside that prompt people to systematically murder at will not as a result of insurrection, war, rebellion etc but pure murder on an epic scale, then we will have something to talk about.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 11:30pm On Nov 23, 2012
tbaba1234: ^Again, missing the point...

I could begin listing acts committed by practising christians but you will not get it linked to their faith. You are missing the point and beclouding your judgement, all of these actions/crimes by members of both faiths are irrelevant to the concept of truth or the irrationality of God having a son or the concept of a trinity.

Look at the basis of your faith without shutting down your brain and see how meaningless it is. Trying to divert from the topic shows your inability to defend your own beliefs. It fails at the door step of common sense.


You have nothing to say, simple.

How much of God do you know to determine what is rational or not about him. Consider this; to an atheist, the existence of God himself is irrational! If God is soo powerful, does he need a wife to "procreate"? shocked That position itself is stupidly irrational. In Christianity, God has no limit and nothing is hard for him. So is the concept of trinity impossible? Of course no; he is all powerful. You can't use your human brain to rationalize God and say the concept of trinity is irrational. If God is All Powerful and omnipresent, as the Quran says, and yet can't have a son without procreation, is the Quran not limiting God? But all this argument is based on faith and belief and will go back and forth forever. Lets look at mundane issues, shall we;


Show me a religion today aside Islam that prompt people to systematically murder at will not as a result of insurrection, war, rebellion etc but pure murder on an epic scale, then we will have something to talk about. A religion that murders its own kind because of ideological differences. See how Shia's are murdered in cold blood, Bahais hounded, Wahabis doing their thing.

And that is the straight path?! No thanks.

What I am getting at is the foundation of belief. The practice and actions of adherents reflects what those fundamentals are. All your sugar coating Al-taquiyya will not cut it.

What further examples are there than what is happening today. By their fruits you shall know them.... remember?
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 11:32pm On Nov 23, 2012
^ You completed relegated the religious aspect of the Northern Ireland conflict? What a joker!! grin grin grin . T
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by ZhulFiqar2: 11:37pm On Nov 23, 2012
^
Followers of Yazeed are not Muslims,even if they occupy paradise.so holding custody of Mecca and Medina means nothings,if those holding custody are blood thirsty murderers,who not only kill muslims but also justify and defend a tyrant unbeliever like Yazeed.Mecca and Medina are under Saudi Wahhabi illegal occupation.the rule of al-saud in the Hejaz is illegitimate.

Did I hear you say "what iran and co" are doing behind the scene in Syria in support of Bashar,the lion and slayer of Wahhabites termites? Who is sending terrorists into Syria to fight against Bashar because he is an alawite? Who is executing the zionist plan in Syria in the name of supporting democracy? Is it not the same tyrants of saudi arabia? The war in Syria is being fought between the supporters (allies of america) and opponents of Israhell! The war by proxies in Syria,is not been fought for Syrians.how many foreign "jihadists" sent into syria by the saudis and turks have bashar,the lion,butchered?

The role of the followers of Yazeed have always been to destroy Islam,deceive Muslims and eliminate them.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 11:47pm On Nov 23, 2012
tiarabubu:

You have nothing to say, simple.

Show me a religion today aside Islam that prompt people to systematically murder at will not as a result of insurrection, war, rebellion etc but pure murder on an epic scale, then we will have something to talk about. A religion that murders its own kind because of ideological differences. See how Shia's are murdered in cold blood, Bahais hounded, Wahabis doing their thing.

And that is the straight path?! No thanks.

What I am getting at is the foundation of belief. The practice and actions of adherents reflects what those fundamentals are. All your sugar coating Al-taquiyya will not cut it.

What further examples are there than what is happening today. By their fruits you shall know them.... remember?

Emotional arguments not rational ones...

You still can't defend your beliefs::

If you are open-minded we can discuss your misconceptions on another thread or outside Nairaland. You are beclouding your brain, not giving it an opportunity to learn. All these emotional arguments are irrelevant to that truth, the vast majority of muslims everywhere are just normal folks trying to practise their faith and make a living.

1 Like

Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 11:51pm On Nov 23, 2012
grin grin grin Zhul Figar

Wahhabi this, wahhabi that
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 11:52pm On Nov 23, 2012
tbaba1234: ^ You completed relegated the religious aspect of the Northern Ireland conflict? What a joker!! grin grin grin . T





Quick Guide: Northern Ireland conflict


The conflict in Northern Ireland, which has killed thousands, has political and religious roots that are centuries old.
In modern times the conflict is centred on opposing views of the area's status.

Some people in Northern Ireland, especially the mainly Protestant Unionist community, believe it should remain part of the United Kingdom.

Others, particularly the mainly Catholic Nationalist community, believe it should leave the UK and become part of the Republic of Ireland.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/quick_guides/04/uk_northern_ireland_conflict/html/1.stm


Enlighten yourself.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by ZhulFiqar2: 12:00am On Nov 24, 2012
tbaba1234:

Emotional arguments not rational ones...

You still can't defend your beliefs::

If you are open-minded we can discuss your misconceptions on another thread or outside Nairaland. You are beclouding your brain, not giving it an opportunity to learn. All these emotional arguments are irrelevant to that truth, the vast majority of muslims everywhere are just normal folks trying to practise their faith and make a living.

If I'm to be fair,you're the one that should defend christianity here.why did you bring so many false(off) topics about Islam here? The topic of the thread centers on christian doctrine and muslim rejection. I don't think that is fair for you to change the topic as "counter-strike".you seem to be running away.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by maclatunji: 12:00am On Nov 24, 2012
@tiarabubu, see how you are derailing the topic just to avoid the issue raised by this thread's starter. You know, I understand your reasoning. You are fighting hard to reject the truth like a young lady who is too proud to admit that she has feelings for a man and seeks to mask it by looking for flaws to highlight even if she knows that she is deluding herself.

Hahaha... tbaba, what shall we do with her? Humour her or heckle her.
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tbaba1234: 12:01am On Nov 24, 2012
^ Again proving my point, it does have religious and political roots, the same with most conflicts in the middle east..... You are talking of modern times grin grin grin... You conveniently ignored the religious aspect. Joker grin grin
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by tiarabubu: 12:03am On Nov 24, 2012
tbaba1234:

Emotional arguments not rational ones...

You still can't defend your beliefs::

If you are open-minded we can discuss your misconceptions on another thread or outside Nairaland. You are beclouding your brain, not giving it an opportunity to learn. All these emotional arguments are irrelevant to that truth, the vast majority of muslims everywhere are just normal folks trying to practise their faith and make a living.

That is classical trait that many find unnerving. Death and the dying mean little to you.

Still the question remains;

Show me a religion today aside Islam that prompt people to systematically murder at will not as a result of insurrection, war, rebellion etc but pure murder on an epic scale, then we will have something to talk about. A religion that murders its own kind because of ideological differences.

Show me ONE Islamic country that allows freedoms taken for granted elsewhere. Yea right Muslim are normal folks - of course. I am talking about Islam and the influences to has that causes some to deprive others of life and limbs. If Islam is the right path, you would expect that these countries will be the leading light, an oasis of calm. Doesn't that tell on the ideology.

I can bet my Sunday lunch another a couple of lives will be taken by this time tomorrow. And I will just be arguing "emotionally" about the dead while to you, it'll be ok... just another day defending the faith! By their fruits you shall know them.....


What a path to follow!
Re: Why Do Muslims Fail To Understand Biology Is Not The Only Way To Become Father? by maclatunji: 12:07am On Nov 24, 2012
tiarabubu is getting desperate. Don't allow her divert your attention, point her to the theme of the thread!

(1) (2) (Reply)

Del / Meet The Ex-Hindu Who Converted 108,000 People To Islam / Build A Mosque In Your Lifetime.

(Go Up)

Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health
religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket

Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10)

Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 132
Disclaimer: Every Nairaland member is solely responsible for anything that he/she posts or uploads on Nairaland.