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Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier - Religion - Nairaland

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Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 8:56am On Dec 27, 2012
You may have noticed that the cold war between religious people and atheists has been seriously heating up the past few years.
And it’s only getting more intense.
The war, of course, has been going on for
centuries—but now, with so many
communication options available, it has migrated into venues accustomed to tamer exchanges.
Reasonable people, religious or otherwise, can
agree to argue reasonably, without toxic assaults that only add to the rage. At least in theory. But the reality is that wherever these debates are happening, strong feelings overpower restraint.
Hate mail, bile-laden comments and death threats are unfortunate but not uncommon. I was cautioned by more than one friend in the research community that I would not be able to come up with quantitative data to address the question I asked because there are simply too many variables, and too much disparate data out there to even try. I didn’t doubt them, but still spent hour culling through discussion forums, blogs, comment threads on newspaper and magazine articles, etc.
They were, of course, right. It’s a mess out there, and pretending to apply scientific methods to the chaos isn’t feasible, and any results I could come up with wouldn’t be defensible. But, I did glean enough to at least make a few qualitative observations. Again, I am not claiming scientific backing for these; they are my takeaways from reading a lot of content.
First observation: Generally, atheists responddismissively to Christian arguments. By that I do not mean that they don’t respond with substance(they often do), but that the tone of the response comes across as dismissive. I’m going to call this the Logicboy Tone because it echoes the way Logicboy03 characteristically dismisses religion-based arguments.
Second observation: Christian comments are usually defensive. And they have a defensive tone even when it’s not clear who they are defending themselves against. Often, they seem to be responding to the atheist audience overall instead of any one person. This, in particular, interests
me because the responses seem to target a force(for lack of a better word) more than individuals.
I’m going to call this the “Defense Against Evil”
tone, because I can’t think of a better way to
describe it (if you can think of one, please feel
free to suggest).
Third observation: When you plumb the depths a little bit, very nearly the opposite of the first two observations starts becoming clearer. Atheists sound dismissive on the surface, but if you read enough of the responses it’s evident that they are
defending a position perceived as under attack.
The tone (from Logicboy03 or anyone else) is
misleading, in my opinion, because it’s really a
veneer on substantive arguments that atheists
believe are not being heard.
Likewise, while Christian comments come across as defensive, there’s a certain aggression under the surface—a sense that they aren’t just defending their territory, but that atheist voices are dangerous wherever they are heard. To the extent that they believe atheists have usurped part of the public forum, the aggression in responses intensifies.

2 Likes

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by AtheistD(m): 9:06am On Dec 27, 2012
As long as there are no threats and insults then both groups can debate accordingly.

What about muslims? How do they debate with atheists?
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 9:20am On Dec 27, 2012
Atheist:-D:
As long as there are no threats and insults then both groups can debate accordingly.

What about muslims? How do they debate with atheists?
I deliberately left out Muslims from the topic.
From what I garnered from research, they are mostly unreasonable abusive bunch.

4 Likes

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by AtheistD(m): 9:48am On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
I deliberately left out Muslims from the topic.
From what I garnered from research, they are mostly unreasonable abusive bunch.

Ok. So what other groups are there. Have you got any stats on the breakdown of xtian denominations and how they debate?
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 10:11am On Dec 27, 2012
Atheist:-D:


Ok. So what other groups are there. Have you got any stats on the breakdown of xtian denominations and how they debate?
The topic is Religion vs Atheism. Religion is represented by Christians of all denominations.
As for how they debate, visit some of the topics in religious section of NL and see for yourself.
I 've already made some observations based on my personal research and opinion previously.
Frostyzone :

First observation: Generally, atheists respond dismissively to Christian arguments. By that I do not mean that they don’t respond with substance(they often do), but that the tone of the response comes across as dismissive. I’m going to call this the Logicboy Tone because it echoes the way Logicboy03 characteristically dismisses religion-based arguments.
Second observation: Christian comments are usually defensive. And they have a defensive tone even when it’s not clear who they are defending themselves against. Often, they seem to be responding to the atheist audience overall instead of any one person. This, in particular, interests me because the responses seem to target a force(for lack of a better word) more than individuals.
I’m going to call this the “Defense Against Evil”
tone, because I can’t think of a better way to
describe it (if you can think of one, please feel
free to suggest).
Third observation: When you plumb thedepths a little bit, very nearly the opposite of the first two observations starts becoming clearer.
Atheists sound dismissive on the surface, but
if you read enough of the responses it’s
evident that they are defending a position perceived as under attack.
The tone (from Logicboy03 or anyone else) is
misleading, in my opinion, because it’s really a
veneer on substantive arguments that atheists
believe are not being heard.
Likewise, while Christian comments come
across as defensive, there’s a certain
aggression under the surface—a sense that
they aren’t just defending their territory, but
that atheist voices are dangerous wherever
they are heard. To the extent that they believe
atheists have usurped part of the public
forum, the aggression in responses intensifies.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by AtheistD(m): 10:14am On Dec 27, 2012
So you didnt break down the xtian denominations?

Xtians too are very diverse. You need to look into that.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 10:17am On Dec 27, 2012
Atheist:-D:
So you didnt break down the xtian denominations?

Xtians too are very diverse. You need to look into that.
But they tend to stick together when arguing against atheist.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by AtheistD(m): 10:32am On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
But they tend to stick together when arguing against atheist.

But they argue with different objectives and through different means. They also display different characters.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 10:52am On Dec 27, 2012
Atheist:-D:


But they argue with different objectives and through different means. They also display different characters.
I get where you are coming from, but the topic isn't religion vs religion.
So please, let's not deviate from the topic at hand.
 
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Heatblast(m): 11:57am On Dec 27, 2012
Front page already shocked
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by dridowu: 11:58am On Dec 27, 2012
Round 1
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by tbaba1234: 12:01pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
I deliberately left out Muslims from the topic.
From what I garnered from research, they are mostly unreasonable abusive bunch.

Really? Where are your stats to back this kind of assertion.

I have had many discussions with atheists and I am Muslim. I do not use abusive words.

Your statement seems to stem from some kind of perception, rather than being objective.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 12:02pm On Dec 27, 2012
Hailedin9ja:

Why say that?
Visit Islam for Muslims and see why.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Billyonaire: 12:10pm On Dec 27, 2012
Both fight dirty, apparently because both have little knowledge of the existentialism and/or morphology of the Energy called God. Mysticism is key to the true knowledge of the Cosmic.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by tbaba1234: 12:10pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
Visit Islam for Muslims and see why.

There are far more insults per poster in the religion section than on the Islam for Muslim section.

Most of the insulting come from non Muslims trying to bash Islam n some Muslims respond.

To say Muslims are generally abusive is a statement borne out of bigotry, I fear.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 12:10pm On Dec 27, 2012
tbaba1234:

Really? Where are your stats to back this kind of assertion.

I have had many discussions with atheists and I am Muslim. I do not use abusive words.

Your statement seems to stem from some kind of perception, rather than being objective.
Muslims tend to put their religious ideology above all else. That kind of inelasticity makes it very difficult for them to tolerate criticism or outright abuse.
The evidence of this can be witnessed in the Islamic section where 95% anti-Islamic comments, or what the mod perceived as anti-Islamic, are hidden.

2 Likes

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by k2039(m): 12:12pm On Dec 27, 2012
Fanatics fight dirtier be it atheist or theist
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Billyonaire: 12:14pm On Dec 27, 2012
k2039: Fanatics fight dirtier be it athiest or thiest
Atheist; theist.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 12:17pm On Dec 27, 2012
tbaba1234:

There are far more insults per poster in the religion section than on the Islam for Muslim section.

Most of the insulting come from non Muslims trying to bash Islam n some Muslims respond.

To say Muslims are generally abusive is a statement borne out of bigotry, I fear.
Stop playing the victim card, it doesn't suit you.
Atypical. Calling anybody that challenges your religion a bigot. Welldone for your predictability.

1 Like

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by tbaba1234: 12:19pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
Muslims tend to put their religious ideology above all else. That kind of inelasticity makes it very difficult for them to tolerate criticism or outright abuse.
The evidence of this can be witnessed in the Islamic section where 95% anti-Islamic comments, or what the mod perceived as anti-Islamic, are hidden.

You are describing something totally different... Muslims do not tolerate insults to revered personalities. Certainly, we can have constructive discussions without insults.

You still haven' shown me how Muslims are generally abusive.

1 Like

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 12:19pm On Dec 27, 2012
k2039: Fanatics fight dirtier be it athiest or thiest
But which do you think are more incline to hurl mud at the other.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by k2039(m): 12:20pm On Dec 27, 2012
Billyonaire: Atheist; theist.
Thanks, I was confused about the position of 'i'.l
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by k2039(m): 12:21pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
But which do you think are more incline to hurl mud at the other.
The more fanatic one between the two
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by tbaba1234: 12:23pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:
Stop playing the victim card, it doesn't suit you.
Atypical. Calling anybody that challenges your religion a bigot. Welldone for your predictability.

You threw out a very broad based allegation. All I am asking is some substance to that allegation. And yes, if it has no substance, it reeks of bigotry.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Sweetgurl2(f): 12:23pm On Dec 27, 2012
I think that the reason some NOT all Christians may be defensive when debating with an atheist is probably because of the attacks they receive from them. Humans are humans regardless of religion. They are many religions out there that believe in God. Hindus, Islam, Buddhist and many more. There is just too much attack against Christian's from a lot of different directions. While other religions, are ignored. For example, there are numerous video's, books, cd's and the lot out there against christianity or the doctrine's they hold. A couple of a years ago, Da DiVinci Code was a blockbuster hit in the cinemas. The book also sold massive amounts. This movie and book was pretty much offensive as it was against Christian doctrine, yet there was no death or violence...(no one said a word). Recently we saw the tragic result of the movie "innocence of islam". Many people died and many more were injured. President's all over the world condemned the movie in other to attain peace... president Obama even requested that the movie be taken down from google, youtube and the lot. So, for you to say that you think Christian's are defensive or have a defensive tone is not only ridiculous because it's normal for every human being in a debate, its also irrelevant. Not all atheist's speak the same or respond the same either.

4 Likes

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Oahray: 12:24pm On Dec 27, 2012
You know how many times I have been insulted by atheists? When you go logical or scientific with them to make them see reason, insults go flow. No be small thing o. I simply return the favour at times grin
There is one that cracks me up each time. A certain ooman said he'd rather analyse the thory of evolution with a cockroach than with me grin
check this thread out:
www.nairaland.com/1139208/youre-too-insignificant-claim-there/2
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 12:25pm On Dec 27, 2012
tbaba1234:

You are describing something totally different... Muslims do not tolerate insults to revered personalities. Certainly, we can have constructive discussions without insults.

You still haven' shown me how Muslims are generally abusive.

We have already derailed the topic enough. I'm not here to talk about the morals of Islam.

Back to the topic, please.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by USarmy: 12:28pm On Dec 27, 2012
This Nigerian atheist are the most gullible being on earth, no prove for any of there statement,

All they blab is there is no GOD, there is no heaven, there is no this there is no that without proving otherwise.

At least Darwin tried to prove otherwise, but this Nigerian atheist are just so blank, they claim to believe in science more while non of them can carry out simple experiment to prove the age of a common stone using fossil records

2 Likes

Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Frostyzone(m): 12:31pm On Dec 27, 2012
Sweet.gurl:
I think that the reason some NOT all Christians may be defensive when debating with an atheist is probably because of the attacks they receive from them. Humans are humans regardless of religion. They are many religions out there that believe in God. Hindus, Islam, Buddhist and many more. There is just too much attack against Christian's from a lot of different directions. While other religions, are ignored. For example, there are numerous video's, books, cd's and the lot out there against christianity or the doctrine's they hold. A couple of a years ago, Da DiVinci Code was a blockbuster hit in the cinemas. The book also sold massive amounts. This movie and book was pretty much offensive as it was against Christian doctrine, yet there was no death or violence...(no one said a word). Recently we saw the tragic result of the movie "innocence of islam". Many people died and many more were injured. President's all over the world condemned the movie in other to attain peace... president Obama even requested that the movie be taken down from google, youtube and the lot. So, for you to say that you think Christian's are defensive or have a defensive tone is not only ridiculous because it's normal for every human being in a debate, its also irrelevant. Not all atheist's speak the same or respond the same either.
Obviously you didn't read what I said in observation 3.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by Sweetgurl2(f): 12:32pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:

We have already derailed the topic enough. I'm not here to talk about the morals of Islam.

Back to the topic, please.

Hmmm... This may be because your topic said 'religion' in your post you only mentioned 'Christian's'. Given that you are talking about religion's being defensive and aggressive other religions will be compared.
Re: Christianity Vs. Atheism: Which Side Fights Dirtier by tbaba1234: 12:36pm On Dec 27, 2012
Frostyzone:

We have already derailed the topic enough. I'm not here to talk about the morals of Islam.

Back to the topic, please.

Next time, you make such an allegation, at least have the facts to back it up... Making careless broad based allegations does not give you any credibility. Needed to clear that up.

Back to topic.

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