thegoodjoehunt:



In the game against Barca and Bayern, Chelsea was the mediocre side. Congrats to them that they won but no one should tell me they were the better side.

thegoodjoehunt:



Pls understnd the text wrtten before you type. I was talkng of the statement tht there is no luck in football. When Ghana plyed Uruguay at the World Cup, Appiah made. Funny Statement, "we tried our best but lucky wasn't on our side".

In the game against Barca and Bayern, Chelsea was the mediocre side. Congrats to them that they won but no one should tell me they were the better side.

By the way saying a teams performance is mediocre doesn't mean the league is mediocre.

I prefer a match with skillful players and good ball controls and that is what you get watching a bundesliga match with Nurnberg and Hamburg.

You don't get that watching Stoke aaand West Ham.

never_say_never:
Sentiment! That's what you're oozing, if not you wouldn't have said Chelsea weren't lucky when you know the truth. Believe it or not, there's luck in football, but you have to work towards it, so i don't see why you're using 'zaragoza' as an example. Would you have placed your bet on zambia winning AFCON?

Against the strong force of CIV, who were awarded a penalty (the same way barca was awarded against chelsea), but somehow drogba lost it, that's when you know there's luck. It doesn't happen often, but when it happens, it's amazing. You said europa league winners get €5m? Exaggeration! That's what you just did, go research it again.

coogar:

so drogba missing a penalty means zambia were lucky? what kinda argument is this? drogba missed his penalty cos he was poor in his execution on the night. that's entirely drogba's fault or the zambia goalie's brilliance - nothing to do with luck. do you fans even give the opposition any credits at all? when penalties get saved, you blame luck - like the goalkeeper standing between the post is a dummy and he is not expected to make saves.

cocoduck:

That is the problem with Nigerians is that they do not prepare before going to competitions. You guys go ill prepared and count on luck.ie the 2012 London Olympics coming back empty handed. If you say that Chelsea was the mediocre side but chelsea won fair and square and who said they were the mediocre side.
stoke city vs west ham will be a very tough match. or recently QPR VS WBA which ended 2:2 that match was very very tense and interesting

There is nothing skillful in a match between Real zaragoza vs getafe the only skillful game you get is RM VS barca or except atltico madrid

coogar:

stop arguing like a football illiterate....,
the premier league rakes in more money from overseas than any other league in the world. la liga is trying to model their tv broadcast like the premier league - this is why some la liga matches now show in the afternoon so that asian fans can tune in. la liga is miles below the premier league in terms of global viewership unless you have been living under a rock. by the time el classico is on 9pm(UK time), the asians are fast asleep!!!!

Sybellah:

DD threw the ball in the air, cuz of stress, the goalie never caught the ball.

Luck plays. Even though i support chelsea, I recognize their CL victory was mainly luck. Bayern in the final and Barcelona semi finals, were the better teams in both game but they still lost against chelsea. Chelsea struggled bitterly before to win the CL, with goal possession below 40 if i remember, and with only one shot on target. They won but they were not the best. And that CIV - Zambia game was pretty much similar to the Bayern-Chelsea one.

kalokalo:

The success of the EPL with global viewers is mostly due to the status of the English Language as the international language for pretty much everything. That is why almost anyone on the planet including Nigerians can watch their matches and understand the play or read their sports news and know what is going on in the football business.

Do you think if the EPL matches were run and conducted in another language, say Spanish, there won't be a drastic drop in viewership and following? Its the same reason why Hollywood is popular around the world. Almost everyone can watch their movies and understand. How many french or German or Italian movies do you know? Try producing a Clint Eastwood or Johnny Depp movie in french and see if most people will even hear about it. How many non-English speaking music artistes have you heard of? If Rihanna or Beyonce sang in German despite their talent, you probably won't know them. They are not better than artistes in other countries. They only have bigger audiences due to language.

The EPL enjoys benefits massively from the above trends which explains why they make the most money. They are not as good as their media hypes or markets them. The Spanish, German and Italian leagues are technically better which is why any of those countries will most certainly beat them in a World Cup for example.

thegoodjoehunt:


Please go and checkout Sarabia and Pedro Leon of Getafe and make that statement that there is nothing skillful. You guys only watch ϑ EPL and feel you know it all about football.

thegoodjoehunt:




I am shocked people are arguing with ϑ kind of simple logic you are explaining. Please thank you for your well elaborated points.

Sybellah:

DD threw the ball in the air, cuz of stress, the goalie never caught the ball.

Luck plays. Even though i support chelsea, I recognize their CL victory was mainly luck. Bayern in the final and Barcelona semi finals, were the better teams in both game but they still lost against chelsea. Chelsea struggled bitterly before to win the CL, with goal possession below 40 if i remember, and with only one shot on target. They won but they were not the best. And that CIV - Zambia game was pretty much similar to the Bayern-Chelsea one.

kalokalo:
The success of the EPL with global viewers is mostly due to the status of the English Language as the international language for pretty much everything. That is why almost anyone on the planet including Nigerians can watch their matches and understand the play or read their sports news and know what is going on in the football business.

Do you think if the EPL matches were run and conducted in another language, say Spanish, there won't be a drastic drop in viewership and following? Its the same reason why Hollywood is popular around the world. Almost everyone can watch their movies and understand. How many french or German or Italian movies do you know? Try producing a Clint Eastwood or Johnny Depp movie in french and see if most people will even hear about it. How many non-English speaking music artistes have you heard of? If Rihanna or Beyonce sang in German despite their talent, you probably won't know them. They are not better than artistes in other countries. They only have bigger audiences due to language.

The EPL enjoys benefits massively from the above trends which explains why they make the most money. They are not as good as their media hypes or markets them. The Spanish, German and Italian leagues are technically better which is why any of those countries will most certainly beat them in a World Cup for example.

cocoduck:

Sarabia and Pedro Leon of Getafe ko skillful ni abegi go and have seat wetin i no go hia

thegoodjoehunt:




I am shocked people are arguing with ϑ kind of simple logic you are explaining. Please thank you for your well elaborated points.

coogar:


technically better my foot!
there are several ways to win a match - technically better is a subjective statement. define technical? you mean english teams have not beaten italian teams in the past or have you been living under a rock all these years?

thegoodjoehunt:

Scholes told sky sports that England will never win anything until they change their thinking on how the game should be played. He said there was a massive divide between the Spanish teams and English teams.

Yet you are arguing blindly.

In ϑthe game that sparked Scholes to make this statement, ϑ Spanish Young team had 64% possession and most of ϑ players were from teams other than Barcelona, yet people are saying only Barca and Madrid have skillful players.

thegoodjoehunt:




You just proved you know nothing about what we are discussing. Sarabia is one of ϑ brightest and most skillful youngsters to break out of Real Madrid Academy. He delivers some of ϑ best curling passes in ϑ game today.

Pedro Leon left Real Madrid because Mourinho wanted to play him of position (as a Right Back) and he told Mourinho that it was wrong and Mourinho dropped him. Remember he was brought to Real Madrid as a star, along with Sergio Canales. Do you think Real Madrid will sign Pedro Leon if he wasn't world Class?

Finally when Mourinho was asked why he left Pedro Leon out of ϑ squad, Mourinho replied, " You talk of him as if he is Maradona or Zidane". Do you think Mourinho will talk about him like that if he was ordinary.

Pedro Leon and Sarabia are very gifted. If you don't know, research.

Same goes to players like Parejo, Banega, Isco, Feghouli, Giovanni Dos Santos, guardado, iker Munain, Herera, rakitic, Perotta etc.

ΘThe Spanish league is flooded with very skillful players who are not in Barca or Real Madrid.

coogar:

and how did spain do at the olympics with their tiki-taka? they were taken apart! the whole "lets model our play like spain" is myopic. the true masters are the triumvirate at barcelona(busquets, xavi and iniesta). when one of those 3 magicians get injured or missed a tournament, you would see how ordinary spain are football wise......

it's spain's time to dominate - their dominance would soon fade as soon as xavi retires.....if tiki-taka really works, spain should be winning every tournament in all levels - from the age grade competitions to the senior competition but we know that ain't so. tiki-taka has an expiry date just like Brazil's samba style is now long forgotten.

coogar:

there's no luck in football - the better side on the day wins a football game. if enyimba of aba are more well-prepared than barcelona in a one-off game, they would beat barcelona. at the end of the day - it's 11 players versus 11 players. chelsea took the little chances they had on the night - barcelona wasted all their chances. chelsea won, where's the luck? what is luck? let west ham use all their luck to win the premier league......




so drogba missing a penalty means zambia were lucky? what kinda argument is this? drogba missed his penalty cos he was poor in his execution on the night. that's entirely drogba's fault or the zambia goalie's brilliance - nothing to do with luck. do you fans even give the opposition any credits at all? when penalties get saved, you blame luck - like the goalkeeper standing between the post is a dummy and he is not expected to make saves.

are you aware goalkeepers are also trained to save penalties just like strikers are tutored to score them? it's the player that is most prepared for the task that wins - zambia's goalkeeper read the situation better than drogba and he saved it. luck had no role to play on that occasion! barcelona had the numerical advantage against chelsea on their home soil....they even managed to get a penalty put the game to bed. messi couldn't handle the pressure and he missed the penalty. what has luck gotta do with messi missing a penalty that would have guaranteed barcelona a final place in munich?

coogar:

and how did spain do at the olympics with their tiki-taka? they were taken apart! the whole "lets model our play like spain" is myopic. the true masters are the triumvirate at barcelona(busquets, xavi and iniesta). when one of those 3 magicians get injured or missed a tournament, you would see how ordinary spain are football wise......

it's spain's time to dominate - their dominance would soon fade as soon as xavi retires.....if tiki-taka really works, spain should be winning every tournament in all levels - from the age grade competitions to the senior competition but we know that ain't so. tiki-taka has an expiry date just like brazil's samba style is now long forgotten.

baby-boy:



You speak as if you only need skill to win, you could have all the skill in the world and not be effective or effiecient.........

never_say_never:
I'm suprised this is a long argument, football analysts/legends admit it too. Your points become lower with every of your post. Zambia were outplayed in almost every of their match on their way to their AFCON triumph, so drogba's penalty miss just goes to show how well luck has been on their side, or is there a particular penalties are taken? Zambia were mentally strong though, no doubt. Chelsea FC's luck is running out/has ran out, it's evident in their season so far, & how has Barcelona/Bayern munich gone so far....? That's just to differentiate between luck & quality.

thegoodjoehunt:

•You honestly know that no matter how good the team is, winning all competitions is impossible. So that pont holds no water.
Go and check, Spain is the most successful team in all age grade competition put together. They are dominting most European age grade competions along side with France, Followed by Italy.

•So if that is your criteri for Superioritty, then the Spanish side should be top of your list. By the way no Xavi or Iniesta in those competitions.
Finally you feel the English Kick and Hush football as Scoles put it is superior, what has it done for England in age grade competitions?

•They have won nothing. The match that made Scholes complain was filled wth EPL stars and it was embarrassing.
In Nigeri '99, Spain won the tourney, while Englnd crashed out first Round without scoring a goal and managing only one shot on target in 3 games. Isn't that hilarious?

baby-boy:


I agree..... A world cup winning team is based on their engine room, The Barcelona triplet form the core part of the national team, yes they do bring in Xabi Alonso... but the brain box of the Spanish national team is Xavi and once he goes that's it, Just like when Zidane retired from the international scene.

coogar:

there's no luck in football, my friend!
the better team might not win and that happens when they fail to do the most important thing on the pitch - score goals! see all those accurate passes, dribbling, crosses and exquisite ball control are all means to an end(goal scoring). if you concentrate so much on the means and forget the end product, then you deserve to lose. the game is decided by who scores more goals and not possession stats or dribbling stats or shots on target stats. you can be the smartest dude in your classroom, getting 100% in your homeworks, courseworks, etc but if you fail on the examination day - dont blame it luck......you failed cos you didn't prepare well or you let the occasion overpower you! i want to see southampton use all the luck in this world to win the premier league or nigeria using all the luck in this world to win the world cup - then i will believe in luck.




1) which then goes to show the spanish tiki-taka is not 100% foolproof. they are successful at it cos players have been groomed into it from a young age. you would need to refurbish all the academies in england to do what you are asking - which is impossible. england academies concentrate on speed and strength, the spanish concentrates on nimble feet, movement and techniques. spain are not dominating shyte! they have been beaten fairly well in the last european age grade competitons.

2) one senior competition that iniesta missed(confed cup), spain were beaten bluish blackish......xavi is the conductor of that spanish side. without him and his fellow barca brothers, spain are very ordinary. alonso's passing stats is horrible and the likes of martinez, cesc, mata and david silva are 2nd tier to xavi/iniesta. the moment xavi hangs his boots is the day spain's dominance in world football ends. just like zidane for france, okocha for nigeria.

3) why are you lying?
european under 19, spain and england have won it the most(9 times each)
european under 21, italy have won it 5 times, spain 3 times, england 2 times.
the european under 17 in 2010, england beat spain 2-1 in the final and holland have won it twice since then(2011 and 2012) so what's your point?

thegoodjoehunt:

Go and check the records of Nigeria '99. The only shot England manged was a header from a long ball to Luke Chadwick (who later joined Man Utd), I think it was against Japan. Go and look at it and see if England scored a goal.

Andreas Iniesta and Xavi are legends, it doesn't mean that other stars aren't there. They are leading because of Experience. It doesn't take a way the fact that Thiago, Sergi Roberto, Isco, Deulofeu, Paco Alcacer, Aaron Boria, Merida, Oliver Torres (definitely the replacement of Xavi, might even become a greater player than Xavi became) are geniuses and wonderful talents for you guys to predict the depature of Xavi and Iniesta will be the end of Spanish dominance.

By the way Spain has won 6 European Under 19 tournaments since 2002, Xavi and Niest ddn't play in those.
So Spanish success can be achieved without Xavi and Iniesta.

coogar:

there's no luck in football, my friend!
the better team might not win and that happens when they fail to do the most important thing on the pitch - score goals! see all those accurate passes, dribbling, crosses and exquisite ball control are all means to an end(goal scoring). if you concentrate so much on the means and forget the end product, then you deserve to lose. the game is decided by who scores more goals and not possession stats or dribbling stats or shots on target stats. you can be the smartest dude in your classroom, getting 100% in your homeworks, courseworks, etc but if you fail on the examination day - dont blame it luck......you failed cos you didn't prepare well or you let the occasion overpower you! i want to see southampton use all the luck in this world to win the premier league or nigeria using all the luck in this world to win the world cup - then i will believe in luck.




1) which then goes to show the spanish tiki-taka is not 100% foolproof. they are successful at it cos players have been groomed into it from a young age. you would need to refurbish all the academies in england to do what you are asking - which is impossible. england academies concentrate on speed and strength, the spanish concentrates on nimble feet, movement and techniques. spain are not dominating shyte! they have been beaten fairly well in the last european age grade competitons.

2) one senior competition that iniesta missed(confed cup 2009), spain were beaten bluish blackish, clint dempsey destroyed spain because the barcelona trident was not complete.....xavi is the conductor of that spanish side. without him and his fellow barca brothers(iniesta and busi), spain are very ordinary. alonso's passing stats is horrible and the likes of martinez, cesc, mata and david silva are 2nd tier to xavi/iniesta. the moment xavi hangs his boots is the day spain's dominance in world football ends. just like zidane for france, okocha for nigeria.

3) why are you lying?
european under 19, spain and england have won it the most(9 times each)
european under 21, italy have won it 5 times, spain 3 times, england 2 times.
the european under 17 in 2010, england beat spain 2-1 in the final and holland have won it twice since then(2011 and 2012) so what's your point?

coogar:

there's no luck in football, my friend!
the better team might not win and that happens when they fail to do the most important thing on the pitch - score goals! see all those accurate passes, dribbling, crosses and exquisite ball control are all means to an end(goal scoring). if you concentrate so much on the means and forget the end product, then you deserve to lose. the game is decided by who scores more goals and not possession stats or dribbling stats or shots on target stats. you can be the smartest dude in your classroom, getting 100% in your homeworks, courseworks, etc but if you fail on the examination day - dont blame it luck......you failed cos you didn't prepare well or you let the occasion overpower you! i want to see southampton use all the luck in this world to win the premier league or nigeria using all the luck in this world to win the world cup - then i will believe in luck.




1) which then goes to show the spanish tiki-taka is not 100% foolproof. they are successful at it cos players have been groomed into it from a young age. you would need to refurbish all the academies in england to do what you are asking - which is impossible. england academies concentrate on speed and strength, the spanish concentrates on nimble feet, movement and techniques. spain are not dominating shyte! they have been beaten fairly well in the last european age grade competitons.

2) one senior competition that iniesta missed(confed cup), spain were beaten bluish blackish......xavi is the conductor of that spanish side. without him and his fellow barca brothers, spain are very ordinary. alonso's passing stats is horrible and the likes of martinez, cesc, mata and david silva are 2nd tier to xavi/iniesta. the moment xavi hangs his boots is the day spain's dominance in world football ends. just like zidane for france, okocha for nigeria.

3) why are you lying?
european under 19, spain and england have won it the most(9 times each)
european under 21, italy have won it 5 times, spain 3 times, england 2 times.
the european under 17 in 2010, england beat spain 2-1 in the final and holland have won it twice since then(2011 and 2012) so what's your point?

coogar:

so a poorly organised nigeria 99 is the yardstick to measure age-grade competitons? you must be brilliant!

xavi/iniesta are legends and players like them only show up once in 50 years. one would be deluded to even dream spain would produce another player like xavi and iniesta in another 20 yrs. since zidane retired, france have not even found a replica. mikel obi is a poor imitation of okocha and neymar is not even close to fat ronaldo! what barcelona/spain are doing at the moment is a one off, it won't happen again in decades to come.

there are plenty of countries who don't even reckon with age grade competitons - the focus is on the world cup and other senior competitions. how did spain fare in the last olympics with their loaded squad? they didn't even qualify from their group. so much for tiki-taka.

never_say_never:

There's luck in football, it doesn't matter whether you believe or not. Football is won by who scores the most goals quite all right, but what would you say about a team who scored 4 goals, 3 own goals, & opponent scoring 2 goals, hereby making them lose 4-5, did they not score enough goals, or weren't they just unlucky? If a student who gets 1OO% in tests fails his exams, then he didn't merit his test result, i.e. he cheated in the tests cos it makes no sense. A league season has 36+ matches, & you expect a 'southampton' whose budget isn't even half of 'arsenal' to win it? Now, how does that sound to you? Mancity didn't become league contenders until they were taken over by billionaires. Luck happens, but football doesn't exempt reality.

thegoodjoehunt:

•Yes and England won it. So Nigeria '99 that had Xavi, Casillas, Forlan, Ronaldhino, Cambiasso, Aurelio, Abelda, etc is poorly organised. In a poor tournament, England with their superior system, had only one shot on target.

•By the way you don't know if Spain will fall or grow, but they re working harder than any country ever did to keep the fre burning.

•As for Neymar, no youngster in the history of Brazil have ever done what he has done, if that isn't special what is.

coogar:

1) poorly organised.....the climate/humidity didn't help england and besides, many of their stars even failed to turn up for the competiton. owen, terry, ferdinand, etc did not come for the competition even when they qualify to be there.

2) no dominance lasts forever - you would be deluded to think spain would reign forever.

3) fat ronaldo won the best player on the planet at age 20 and 21!! has neymar done that yet?