wesley80: ^ I just dont get people like you, this line of thought about "Ghettos not supposed to exist" shocks me to the marrow. Do you know "jack" about Lagos state? Like really do you even have a clue? How do you define a Ghetto? Is the population of Lagos state an asset or a liability? If you were to fashion out an economic policy you mean you'll recommend de-populating Lagos to say the size of Abuja? To what end if I may ask?
This whole line of thot has been circling on and on and you all are beginning to make it sound like population is the problem of Lagos rather than the obvious case of "skewed and poorly co-ordinated development". I put it to you that the population of Lagos is her greatest asset and those shanties and ghettoes you say should not be allowed to develop are just a natural consequence of the govts poor development plan.

I put it to you that the population of Lagos is her greatest asset and those shanties and ghettoes you say should not be allowed to develop are just a natural consequence of the govts poor development plan.

[size=14pt]Fashola explains current government intervention in Makoko[/size]

Tuesday, 24 July 2012 09:18 Agency Reports

Lagos State governor, Babatunde Fashola, on Monday explained why his administration has to intervene in the Makoko fishing community in Lagos Mainland, saying it had become necessary to halt the continuous expansion of the community into the lagoon with its negative impact on the environment.

Addressing scores of Makoko residents who came to the Lagos House, Ikeja to appeal for a reconsideration of the decision to demolish parts of the fishing community, Governor Fashola explained that while the state government was finding a solution for residents within the recognised boundaries, it would not allow further expansion of the community.

Fashola said sequel to several meetings with leaders of the community and an agreed boundary set, the state government had been working in the area to find solution to the difficulties which the indigenous residents encounter by way of providing basic infrastructure and amenities to uplift the standard of life of the people who, according to him, have been there for a long time.

Continuing, the governor explained that rather than maintain the established boundary, what had happened over the years was a rash of illegal shanties which expanded towards the Third Mainland Bridge and underneath the high tension electricity cables across the area.

Expressing the readiness of his administration to meet with genuine representatives of the community, Fashola advised them to be wary of people who are profiting from their difficult situation. He also advised the community to resist being used by people who want to take advantage of them, adding that some people were already collecting grants from the outside world under the guise of helping them.

The governor noted that piling saw dust on the lagoon, discharging wastes in it and blocking the discharge points for storm water had contributed to the flooding in places like Bariga, Shomolu, Ebute-Metta, Ogudu, Owode, Ajegunle and Ikorodu, among others.
“The truth must be told; some people are benefiting from your difficulty and that is the truth. They are taking advantage of you in the guise of being your friends.

They are taking all sorts of grants purporting to help you but it never gets to you. But as your government, we understand the challenges you face there and we are working to solve them”, the governor said.

According to the governor, who said the primary concern of his administration is to uplift the standard of living of the indigenous members of the community which has existed for over 60 years. “Now, as we are finding solution to the boundaries we recognise, we will not allow further expansion”.

“We owe you a duty, but we also owe the greater part of Lagos a duty. That lagoon is the only lagoon where we drain water during rainy season from Akoka, Bariga, Shomolu, Oworonsoki and from Macgregor Canal. The lagoon is shrinking because they are expanding and building into it; it has to stop”, the governor said.

Fashola said the way forward was for the leaders of the community to team up and meet the state government to find a lasting solution to the problem, adding that he is currently working with people within and outside the country to find a way to expose the community as part of the culture of Lagos where the indigenous people could live in a clean environment with clean drinking water and other basic amenities while they also engage in their fishing occupation.

He said the doors of the government were open at all times and that he would welcome such a team as appointed by the community to find lasting solution to the problem, adding that the community’s peaceful approach would lead to much more progress.

Governor Fashola explained that the state government has no problem with those living within the recognised boundaries, adding, “We are working to provide water, schools, libraries and so on for you. But those who have just come must leave. That is the reality”.

emiye:

Yes, ghettoes are not supposed to exist !!!!, it is an eye sore to the state, all over the world attempt should be made to depopulate slums,and not expand slums, even the MDGs recognises that in goal 7, target 7.10.

Many of the slum dwellers have no business staying in urban lagos, they also do not make wise decisions, they breed like pigs with no concrete plan for the offsprings thereby enthrenching a vicious cycle of poverty, hopelessness and an expanding slum.



Yes the population is one of the greatest asset, but it can also be a curse, most especially when majority do not pay tax and create a nuisance value. You talk about govts poor development plan a cause of the ghettoes, i agree with you, but the biggest blame goes to the FG at the centre, and many other state governors not stemming the tide of rural-urban migration, lack of employment opportunities across the nation e.t.c

naptu2: One of the reasons I feel very strongly about this issue is because I remember how Lagos was before the military governments decided to ignore planning laws. There was a time when it was impossible to find traffic jams on Victoria Island, because it was a quiet residential area. This was a time when you wouldn't find rubbish being dumped on the roadside.

The military came and ruined everything. You had people building anywhere they wanted. Lagos was touted as the dirtiest city in the world. Pictures of filthy Lagos was broadcast around the world. A government that wants to restore sanity has come to power, but some people (mostly for political and ethnic reasons) do not want it to do its job.

wesley80:

If you re-read my post I'm sure you'd finally understand I never said ghettoes were desirable but only pointed out that they are a natural consequence of skewed development and govt inattention. As for who should actually shoulder shoulder the blame, I also mentioned it was'nt entirely BRF's fault didnt I?

wesley80: A growing - booming population can only be a curse if its potentials are not harnessed

wesley80: the ease with which you throw words like "depopopulate"

wesley80: and your likening slum dwellers to breeding pigs leaves a lot to be desired, such uncharitable words gives you up as being crassly ignorant and unfit to discuss the issues herein

wesley80:
. Do you realize a huge area like Ajegunle would fall into the "ghetto" class if a threshold were set? Would you recommend de-populating Ajegunle? If you say Yes then I have to ask if you understand the concept of the "Food Chain"? Those Ghetto dwellers are now a part of the Lagos ecosystem, take them out and you disturb a level of that chain that balances the Lagos ecosystem and the resulting negative domino would leave you running away from Lagos! It's one thing to sit your butt down and proffer ignorant policies, it's another thing to know what you're talking about.

naptu2: What processes did Eko Atlantic City go through before construction began? Did Makoko go through the same processes? Did they conduct environmental impact assessment? Do they have C of O? Do they have planning permission? Would any sensible and reasonable government allow people to set up illegal structures anyhow and anywhere they want?

By the way, about musicians rising from rags to riches, have you heard about Daddy Showkey, Baba Fryo, Dagrin, General Pype, Vector Tha Viper, etc?

emiye:
What do you then mean by "this line of thought about "Ghettos not supposed to exist" shocks me to the marrow"

How do you harness the potentials with very limited funds,if the bulk do not pay tax, they are a burden !,

depopulate is simply to reduce the population of those living in the slum, the Millennium development goals has 8 goals, 21 targets nd 60 indicators. Goal 7 , target 7.10 focuses on depopulating slums.

i said breed like pigs, a metaphor indicating having more children than they can cater for, a smart man can move away from a slum after a brief stay and proper planning, a slum is not where you plan to stay forever!

Stop talking nonsensical shiit, i am an environmentalist, I am as ignorant enough to educate you. What do you understand by the ecosystem, introducing filth in to water bodies is a way to balance the ecosystem in your ignorant mind, most of the fishes and aquatic organisms in those water bodies are filled with heavy metals like lead, and not particularly okay for human consumption.

wesley80:

I mean you have to understand you're talking about PEOPLE living in subhuman conditions because they have little or no choice.



Wrong, wrong, wrong. They contribute their quota to the State's economy through their productive activities and creating a huge market for consumer and other products. Without some of these Ghetto dwellers, Guinness, Star and others would struggle, no?



Depopulate in the MDG sense does not mean knocking down peoples houses and forcing them back to their villages like you and Fashola seem to favour. It entails giving people better alternatives in terms of outlook and living conditions, it's imperative y'all understand this.


How would you feel if I said you were thinking thru your anus? Of course I'm being metaphorical arent I?




Yeah, you saved the best worst for last didnt you? You really had to prove you're a nutter? SMH.
Yeah you're an environmentalist and I guess that explains your abysmal level of understanding of developmental issues - sorry pal. I wasnt really making reference to the "ecosystem" in an environmental sense when I mentioned it, I only tried to demonstrate the relationship in a society between the rich, middle class and the poor by likening it to the same kind of balance an ecosystem needs to thrive and flourish. The society needs a level of poverty to thrive - yeah quote me! The menial jobs and the low wages would only exist if there's a group willing to accept whatever is on offer, it's how the greatest nations on earth were built so when you speak of "depopulating" ghettos in the sense you and Fashola appear to favour, you'll be altering that naturally thriving balance the society needs to grow.

wesley80:

I mean you have to understand you're talking about PEOPLE living in subhuman conditions because they have little or no choice.



Wrong, wrong, wrong. They contribute their quota to the State's economy through their productive activities and creating a huge market for consumer and other products. Without some of these Ghetto dwellers, Guinness, Star and others would struggle, no?



Depopulate in the MDG sense does not mean knocking down peoples houses and forcing them back to their villages like you and Fashola seem to favour. It entails giving people better alternatives in terms of outlook and living conditions, it's imperative y'all understand this.


How would you feel if I said you were thinking thru your anus? Of course I'm being metaphorical arent I?




Yeah, you saved the best worst for last didnt you? You really had to prove you're a nutter? SMH.
Yeah you're an environmentalist and I guess that explains your abysmal level of understanding of developmental issues - sorry pal. I wasnt really making reference to the "ecosystem" in an environmental sense when I mentioned it, I only tried to demonstrate the relationship in a society between the rich, middle class and the poor by likening it to the same kind of balance an ecosystem needs to thrive and flourish. The society needs a level of poverty to thrive - yeah quote me! The menial jobs and the low wages would only exist if there's a group willing to accept whatever is on offer, it's how the greatest nations on earth were built so when you speak of "depopulating" ghettos in the sense you and Fashola appear to favour, you'll be altering that naturally thriving balance the society needs to grow.

zetdee:

God I hate this type of thinking, there is nothing good about slums, getting rid of them should be the top priority of any city. If a city's ecosystem requires slums to be maintained than it should not exist at all. Slums are what give a country the statues of being a shithole.

emiye:

I have one statement for all the fallacy you have stated up there.

THE POOR DOES NOT HAVE TO LIVE IN SLUMS. !

zetdee:

God I hate this type of thinking, there is nothing good about slums, getting rid of them should be the top priority of any city. If a city's ecosystem requires slums to be maintained than it should not exist at all. Slums are what give a country the statues of being a shithole.

wesley80:
Sadly, neither of you got my point. I wasnt advocating for the continued existence of ghettos but only trying to point out the economic significance of having those considered to be less well off existing alongside the very rich. My reference was to highlight the danger of tearing down and depopulating ghettos (Fashola style) without recourse to their economic significance, dats all!

wesley80: ^ Do you have any sense at all? How do you "get rid" of slums without creating an avenue for improving the lives of its occupants? You think demolishing ghettos and rendering people homeless would solve any problem? You guys are just darn impossible SMH.

wesley80:

I understand the seniments you've shared and cannot fault your desire to see a better planned, clean and organized city, I also have thos dreams but it's quite sad you'd reduce all this to the bolded above.
There are many issues I wld go down that "Political" or "ethnic" road for but sincerely, this isnt one. We must separate the issues for this to be worthwhile -the Lagos state govt has ignored it's poor populace and that's a fact. It's acting like the proverbial woman that intends to cover her pregnancy with her hands. While the grounds on which you fault the construction of a well intended slum school may hold true legally - granted, the issue is what has the state govt done to reduce the inequity and help balance out the shocking level of contrasting advancements between the rich and the poor? A govt that has been seen to help the poor and disadvantaged would have no difficulty making a case if it chose to demolish whatever it chose but not in this case. These people have been ignored and assumed not to exist and just as a ray of hope appears, the govt rushes out to extinguish it. While their action may be legally right, it is morally wrong. Development specialists have always judged societies and govt's not by the scale of opulence or economic aggregates but sometimes by the way they treat their most vulnerable citizens - those without a means to defend or assert themselves, how would you score Fashola?

naptu2:

1) So, do you now accept that the settlement is illegal and an environmental hazard?

2) The fact still remains that many people (though not all) take up these causes for ethnic or political reasons.

3) I will score the government highly when it comes to poverty alleviation. Out of all the governments we've had in Lagos, this government and Jakande's government have been the best with regards to poverty alleviation and taking care of the poor (the worst and worst government inn the history of Lagos was Oyinlola's government a.k.a. "No bitumen" ).

The problem is that the media prefer to report grand and spectacular projects, rather than projects that will improve the lives of the poor. They would rather report about Eko Atlantic City, than report about Lagos HOMS, they would rather report about the cable stayed bridge than report about Tekunle. These things exist. The fact that you don't hear noise about them does not mean that they do not exist.

In fact, the government is doing exactly what I thought would be necessary to turn Lagos around after the madness that was military rule. That is, the carrot and stick approach. Give them the carrot, but those who refuse to take the carrot will be beaten by the stick. The act of beating with the stick is more controversial, so it will take up more column inches in newspapers, but there's an alternative. . .there's the carrot.