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Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe - Politics (44) - Nairaland

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 11:09pm On May 30, 2013
ACM10:


here

Nomination by consuls was during the dying days of the Roman republic. Does this form of government look similar to what is obtainable in ancient Igbo society?

By the way, do you want to intimidate me with your good-for-nothing library?

Good you got your laptop. In the early days when Rome was just evolving from Romulus, entry into the senate was by birth or rank. however, it was a very weak political institution. the executive magistrate was in control until Rome became a republic. I do not see any relationship between Alaigbo and the roman system of Government. Rome evolved into an empire. Alaigbo remained village states controlled by family heads until the invasion of the Brit. By the way, you need more than one page web page to understand the political evolution of Rome.

In fact , you need a Library my dear. A private library.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by ACM10: 11:43pm On May 30, 2013
percipi1:

Good you got your laptop. In the early days when Rome was just evolving from Romulus, entry into the senate was by birth or rank. however, it was a very weak political institution. the executive magistrate was in control until Rome became a republic. I do not see any relationship between Alaigbo and the roman system of Government. Rome evolved into an empire. Alaigbo remained village states controlled by family heads until the invasion of the Brit. By the way, you need more than one page web page to understand the political evolution of Rome.

In fact , you need a Library my dear. A private library.

I don't expect someone who is selectively blind to see where 'birth or rank' was mentioned. Equally, it will be a punishing mental task to ask you to draw its correlation with the ancient Igbo system of government. By the way, Igbos are peace-loving and contented people that harbours no imperial ambition. We can't submit to a dictator.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 11:54pm On May 30, 2013
ACM10:

I don't expect someone who is selectively blind to see where 'birth or rank' was mentioned. Equally, it will be a punishing mental task to ask you to draw its correlation with the ancient Igbo system of government. By the way, Igbos are peace-loving and contented people that harbours no imperial ambition. We can't submit to a dictator.

Good that you have admitted that ancient Igbos did not have in place a system of government, otherwise, they would have evolved into city states. There is nothing wrong harbouring imperial ambition and the Igbo have attempted same during the Nigerian civil war by annexing the Midwestern state. I don't see anything wrong about that.

By the way, you dont need too be versed in political science to see the difference between a village state and an empire. It's actually arrogance to compare ancient Alaigbo with the Roman Empire. It really borders on intellectually hara kiri

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by ACM10: 12:01am On May 31, 2013
percipi1:

Good that you have admitted that ancient Igbos did not have in place a system of government, otherwise, they would have evolved into city states. There is nothing wrong harbouring imperial ambition and the Igbo have attempted same during the Nigerian civil war by annexing the Midwestern state. I don't see anything wrong about that.

By the way, you dont need too be versed in political science to see the difference between a village state and an empire. It's actually arrogance to compare ancient Alaigbo with the Roman Empire. It really borders on intellectually hara kiri

Please don't misquote me in your bid to score cheap point. By the way, I'm still waiting for your criteria for the system of government that is acceptable in civilized climes.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 12:08am On May 31, 2013
ACM10:

Please don't misquote me in your bid to score cheap point. By the way, I'm still waiting for your criteria for the system of government that is acceptable in civilized climes.


I do not think we need to debate the criteria for the system of governments that is acceptable in civilised climes. You just need a text book on Government or political science.. No where in the textbook is family representative authority as applicable in ancient Alaigbo considered a system of government.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 5:19am On May 31, 2013
percipi1:


I do not think we need to debate the criteria for the system of governments that is acceptable in civilised climes. You just need a text book on Government or political science.. No where in the textbook is family representative authority as applicable in ancient Alaigbo considered a system of government.

you are stupid and bigoted in saying igbo society had no system of government. The igbo society enjoyed both constitutional monarchy and republican systems of goverment, not necessarily suited after the european model. The ewe people of ghana were also republican in their style of government, yet it wasnt after the european model. Every seasoned anthropologist and political historian knows these, am not surprised you don't. Bigot.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 5:41am On May 31, 2013
My God, the facts are out there for everyone to see. Even wikipedia has REFERENCES on it! Precip1 or whatever you freaking name is, you are a sadistic igbophobe. Igbo system of government is known to be quasi-democratic/republican in most areas. Ours was just as republican as that of ancient europe but not necessarily the same model. Eat your words...again.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 6:06am On May 31, 2013
percipi1:

Are you that thick? What does my running a private library got to do with you. If you have problem understanding people, its okay to ask question, it does not diminish your intelligence. But if you get annoy just because someone has something you don't , its a serious problem.


...and seriously, you think you've made a strong statement right?
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by remarkD(m): 7:12am On May 31, 2013
her doing fact checks. I think its just his ability to take any stance in a debate and argue it very well... a skill not too many have... anywho... I kinda misss him, if you are reading this sir, it will be nice to be gracing this section once in a while...

Remark D once more, signing out!
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by funnyx(m): 7:27am On May 31, 2013
Son-Of-El:


you are stupid and bigoted in saying igbo society had no system of government. The igbo society enjoyed both constitutional monarchy and republican systems of goverment, not necessarily suited after the european model. The ewe people of ghana were also republican in their style of government, yet it wasnt after the european model. Every seasoned anthropologist and political historian knows these, am not surprised you don't. Bigot.

Can't you make your point without being abusive? Must every poster agree with your point of view? You call someone a bigot but judging by your posts you're bigotry personified. I just hope you are not like this in real life undecided

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 7:37am On May 31, 2013
omonnakoda:


Please do not argue like a child. Orishas are not gods

What does "godless" mean? You just make up meaningless categories like "in the true form" of a god . what is the "true form of a god,exactly?
Have you met a god before? for tea or lunch.


Even more ridiculous is your argument that an animist is godless.
Is there ONE animism in a "TRUE FORM" of animism too?
When you are in a hole,pause stop digging and think. In this case think before you type because you are sounding very glib and superficial

The fact that a man does not subscribe to a so called "true form " of god but chooses his own version of god or gods does not make him "godless" .
If I decide Chinua Achebe or Beyonce is god then so be it after all how is the case of Jesus Christ different? from Ogun?? is he too and his mother not Orishas
I won't pick up issues with you because you don't understand what is being discussed. Your knowledge of orisha is very poor, and you think it can be explained by that of the Jewish Yahweh. It can't. My memory of a paper titled "Self Knowledge and Intellectualism: A Perspective from the Yoruba Cosmology" delivered at an Internation Conference early this month in OAU, Ile-Ife, is still fresh. What do you know about Yoruba culture?
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 7:44am On May 31, 2013
This thread has been infested by illiterates who were probably taught by the same people that "taught" the ESUT FOUR. It is a show of illiteracy for you to say a person whose stand is different from yours is a bigot.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by omonnakoda: 9:31am On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson:
I won't pick up issues with you because you don't understand what is being discussed. Your knowledge of orisha is very poor, and you think it can be explained by that of the Jewish Yahweh. It can't. My memory of a paper titled "Self Knowledge and Intellectualism: A Perspective from the Yoruba Cosmology" delivered at an Internation Conference early this month in OAU, Ile-Ife, is still fresh. What do you know about Yoruba culture?
All of that is irrelevant.
The issue here is the ENGLISH word "godless" and what it means .
Naturally that raises the question of the meaning of the word "god" . You said Wole Soyinka admitted to being godless but is an animist. This is all about the meaning of words,ENGLISH words.
An animist by definition cannot be "godless"
No one is interested in me or my knowledge of Orishas or butterflies or whether you attend conferences on embalming serpents.

My issue is that a person that worships any deity of any description is not "godless" by any stretch of ENGLISH so spare us your biography and address the issue.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by EASTSIDAZ: 10:07am On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson:
As far as I'm concerned, as you know, if you've started reasoning, Things Fall Apart, is not rich in literary prowess; it is widely used in the United States as more of an anthropology/sociology piece than as a literary text.
Before Chinua Achebe published the novel, people were publishing novels. For example, we have "Ogboju Ode Ninu Igbo Irumale" published in 1938 by D. O. Fagunwa. It was translated into English by Wole Soyinka as "Forest of Thousand Daemons" in 1963. Fagunwa who was the first Nigerian to employ folk philosophy in telling stories had the title of Member of the Order of the British Empire (MBE) conferred on him in 1959 by Queen Elizabeth. I know the "Jews" will play on this title, calling it a European title like that of the Nobel Laureate.

Amos Tutuola was another great novelist that published before Chinua Achebe. He wrote his first novel, "The Palm-Wine Drinkard" in 1946 and published it in 1952. It was translated to French by Raymond Queneau as "L'Ivrogne dans la brousse" in 1953. Tutuola wrote two other novels before 1956.
Get that into your head and not a none existing title.

Then why is Achebe TFA the most powerful and most read book out of Africa?
The fact will outlive yerobas, that Achebe is the father of African literature.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 10:40am On May 31, 2013
funnyx:

Can't you make your point without being abusive? Must every poster agree with your point of view? You call someone a bigot but judging by your posts you're bigotry personified. I just hope you are not like this in real life undecided

keep quiet before you wish i never faced you. If you have been following my post on this thread from the beginning you'd realise how wrong you are.
Where were you when the anti-achebe and anti-igbo posts infested this thread? Its so bad that someone mockingly said igbos have no traditional system of govt! I know their subtlety even if you are blind to that.
Funnyx, lay low, or get hit, that's my advise to you. Now get off my back.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 10:59am On May 31, 2013
EASTSIDAZ:

Then why is Achebe TFA the most powerful and most read book out of Africa?
The fact will outlive yerobas, that Achebe is the father of African literature.
Things Fall Apart is more of an anthropological/sociological piece than literary from an African, I can say that again. That was why the Europeans received it with joy. During the colonial days, it was not uncommon for the Europeans to send anthropologists to Africa, to study their culture in order not to have problems with the natives. Go digest this first then you come back. And mind you, be careful the way you use abusive words on other people's ethnic groups.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 11:10am On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson: This thread has been infested by illiterates who were probably taught by the same people that "taught" the ESUT FOUR. It is a show of illiteracy for you to say a person whose stand is different from yours is a bigot.

you know you are fooling yourself, trying to act like you are not the infester. Who dosen't know that ola johnson is a tribalistic, incorrigible, and repugnant nairalander? You (alongside cameroonpride and co) poisoned this post with your bigotry. Percip1 got infected. Stop playing rational when you know WE KNOW you are irate.

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Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by funnyx(m): 11:16am On May 31, 2013
Son-Of-El:


keep quiet before you wish i never faced you. If you have been following my post on this thread from the beginning you'd realise how wrong you are.
Where were you when the anti-achebe and anti-igbo posts infested this thread? Its so bad that someone mockingly said igbos have no traditional system of govt! I know their subtlety even if you are blind to that.
Funnyx, lay low, or get hit, that's my advise to you. Now get off my back.

Your can keep barking for all I care it obviously change nothing especially as your anger cannot be transmitted on a faceless forum grin grin To disagree that Achebe is not the father of African literature does not translate to being anti Achebe.
Also to disagree on Igbo traditional system of govt does not translate to beibg anti igbo. All you need to do is to provide him with your evidence and debate rather than barking and being abusive . Unfortunately you cannot hit me online grin grin I can simply choose to ignore whatever you post back simples.

1 Like

Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 11:43am On May 31, 2013
Son-Of-El:


you know you are fooling yourself, trying to act like you are not the infester. Who dosen't know that ola johnson is a tribalistic, incorrigible, and repugnant nairalander? You (alongside cameroonpride and co) poisoned this post with your bigotry. Percip1 got infected. Stop playing rational when you know WE KNOW you are irate.
You did. You and other "Jews" didn't even read Wole Soyinka's interview before you started using abusive words on him and saying the LIVING LEGEND is jealous of the LATE CHINUA ACHEBE, that I pray should REST IN PEACE. The interview, if you have any problem with it which I guess could be its grammar, ask for clarification. WS only confirmed CA's position that he shouldn't be called father of African literature. CA knew he never was, not in death. I ask again, if you are able to tell me one person apart from Nadine Gordimer that says that, I will quit this thread.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 11:48am On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson: Those that always cite Nadine Gordimer's statement, not even speech, that Chinua Achebe was the father of African literature when the latter won the Booker Prize in 2007, should ask themselves why didn't she make the same statement earlier in 1991 when she won the Nobel Prize in Literature. Is it not obvious it was a human error which we are all susceptible to as pointed out by Wole Soyinka? What was the basis of calling CA that when it was obvious that his last known book, Anthills Of The Savannah (1989), was published two years before Nadine Gordimer won the Nobel Prize in 1991? He later published There Was A Country in 2012, less than a year before he died.

Could it be that Nadine Gordimer was trying to compensate him because she knew CA would never win it. While the reason why a winner of the Prize is made public, the reason why other nominees lose is not. Gordimer, and by extension, Wole Soyinka, being past winners and possibly, possessing the power to nominate, probably knew why CA could not win it even more than twenty years before his death. It could be a thing which past winners keep secret to themselves. Of all his books only three are translated in Swedish. The number of his books which includes five novels, one list of short stories, one poetry and some children's book, could have also had an adverse effect on him not winning the Nobel Prize.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by vanhelsing(m): 12:17pm On May 31, 2013
The points made by WS were obviously mis-read,deliberately or due to lack of understanding...it's Shame it was relegated to tribalism and jealousy.unfortunately it is rocket science for the shallow mind.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 12:18pm On May 31, 2013
funnyx:

Your can keep barking for all I care it obviously change nothing especially as your anger cannot be transmitted on a faceless forum grin grin To disagree that Achebe is not the father of African literature does not translate to being anti Achebe.
Also to disagree on Igbo traditional system of govt does not translate to beibg anti igbo. All you need to do is to provide him with your evidence and debate rather than barking and being abusive . Unfortunately you cannot hit me online grin grin I can simply choose to ignore whatever you post back simples.

laughing jackass, when bigotry tries to defy intellectual fact and common sense, the only solution to it is KILLING IT. By the way who says i don't welcome disagreements? But i don't entertain tribal insults too. Someone trying to tell me igbos don't have a traditional system of govt is an INSULT to we igbos. Some belittling achebe's achievements to mere storytelling is an INSULT to african literature and to the memory of achebe. Downplaying the honorific given to achebe by gordimer which resonates the world over from many literary circles to world renowned media centres is an INSULT to his enthusiasts. achebe graciously ignoring it does not mean he wasn't deserving of it.
Funnyx, once again, stay off me. If you just want to be noticed, fine, i have noticed you. If you snoop around me again, you will know that bites can be received online.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 12:55pm On May 31, 2013
I see blind patriotism within people of a particular ethnic group here which could be more profitable for them if channelled towards mainstream of Nigerian politics.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 1:01pm On May 31, 2013
[quote author=Ola Johnson]
You did. You and other "Jews" didn't even read Wole Soyinka's interview before you started using abusive words on him and saying the LIVING LEGEND is jealous of the LATE CHINUA ACHEBE, that I pray should REST IN PEACE. The interview, if you have any problem with it which I guess could be its grammar, ask for clarification. WS only confirmed CA's position that he shouldn't be called father of African literature. CA knew he never was, not in death. I ask again, if you are able to tell me one person apart from Nadine Gordimer that says that, I will quit this thread. [/quote

there you go again with your costly assumptions. Who told you i have not read the interview saharareporters did with soyinka? Who told you and soyinka that gordimer called achebe 'father of african literature'? Who told you kenyan and ghanaian literary scholars in their tribute didnt acknowleged achebe's pioneering and mentorship role in mordern african literature, thereby refering him as the father of it? Who says cnn, bbc, aljazeera, chinapost, forbes, hindutimes, etc are not critics in their own right in appraising popular figures?
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 1:10pm On May 31, 2013
Son-Of-El, you're confused. That's the reason for your continued rigmaroling.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 1:13pm On May 31, 2013
[quote author=Son-Of-El][/quote]
If you've read the interview and are still saying this, it means you have a probem - bigotry. Think about it.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 1:33pm On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson:
If you've read the interview and are still saying this, it means you have a probem - bigotry. Think about it.

oh now you've resorted to insults? Just wait for me...
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 1:39pm On May 31, 2013
Son-Of-El:


oh now you've resorted to insults? Just wait for me...
I've not insulted you, like you do to other people. I only told you what your comments portray you as. I'm waiting and will engage you in a debate. If you resort to insult, I'll leave you to heaping it on yourself.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Duru1(m): 1:47pm On May 31, 2013
percipi1:

Good that you have admitted that ancient Igbos did not have in place a system of government, otherwise, they would have evolved into city states. There is nothing wrong harbouring imperial ambition and the Igbo have attempted same during the Nigerian civil war by annexing the Midwestern state. I don't see anything wrong about that.

By the way, you dont need too be versed in political science to see the difference between a village state and an empire. It's actually arrogance to compare ancient Alaigbo with the Roman Empire. It really borders on intellectually hara kiri


It is plain idiocy to refer to village empires that dotted landscape of what is known today as Nigeria as empire. I thanked God Ndigbo adopted communal democracy. What happened in colonial Nigeria represents the silly fanfare surrounding the Nobel Prize or Rhode Scholarship. Most Europeans that visited Africa were under the influence of monarchical government and thrilled to see some Africans imitating them. This is the reason the so-called village empires gained notoriety over the communal democracy-representative governance practiced by Ndigbo.

One wonders why the same Europeans jettisoned the monarchical government that fermented silly empires to embrace representative government practiced by Ndigbo before the advent of Europeans in Africa.

1 Like

Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by SonOfEl(m): 1:51pm On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson:
I've not insulted you, like you do to other people. I only told you what your comments portray you as. I'm waiting and will engage you in a debate. If you resort to insult, I'll leave you to heaping it on yourself.

me...debate with you? That will be a wasted effort.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by TheBookWorm: 2:34pm On May 31, 2013
Ola Johnson:
Your dream of being like the Israeli Jews who have things come to them easily, hence your calling yourselves 'Jews', is a mirage. Until you realize this you will remain where you are even in the politics of Nigeria. It was that same mirage that made you feel Things Fall Apart which is not rich in literary skills could fetch CA the Nobel Prize. For me, its being used in the United States is more of an anthropology/sociology for people to see the culture of the Igbo. All his books put together could not fetch him anything. Nadine Gordimer only compensated him with a mere verbal statement.

First of all, who told you that I was Igbo?

I have never mentioned my heritage.
Re: Wole Soyinka's Interview About Chinua Achebe by Nobody: 2:43pm On May 31, 2013
Son-Of-El:


me...debate with you? That will be a wasted effort.
You're indeed "wise" as your people always claim, not wanting to debate but to be engaged in insults.

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