I just stormed across an article today on msn, with the rather bold claim that "hip hop is not music".

http://entertainment.uk.msn.com/music/features/article.aspx?cp-documentid=8456889

It was shock coupled with exasperation that made me open the page only to find out it was a hyperbolic portrayal of my very own point of view.

The writer started by by quoting Oasis' Noel Gallagher who blamed JayZ for one of the biggest rock gigs not selling out. In JayZ's response, he pointed out that other genres try to victimize hiphop. He said and I quote 'We don't play guitars, Noel, but hip-hop has put in its work like any other form of music'

Even if as Nas claims, Hiphop is Dead, does it mean it should be discriminated against? do you feel hiphop is disregarded by lovers of other genres?

do i think rap is judged harsly? nope. because now all they talk about is the same ole thing that doesn't make sense. i used to love rap like i don't know what when they used to rap about reasonable things. now they rap about nothing, just making noise.

@naija-diva
I knew sumone would say sumn like this, let's remember the fact that hiphop has been the most creative and innovative music for the last two decades.

It has brought in such a diversity that we haven't seen since Mozart.
Hiphop evolved from the golden ageof the Public Enemys and Rakims to the Nas and Pacs and now to the Kanyes and TIs
Each of those artistic ages have provided nothing less than headnodding and soulfilling pleasure

Even in Hiphop's darkest Days (Death of Pac to the Birth of Eminem), we still had the artists that laid a foundation for this generation, like Big L

R'n'B has been singing 'I love you till death' and 'you broke my heart' since the days of Luther Vandross and Lionel Richie
No one complains, hiphop has had our 'One Mic', 'Homecomming' and the modern day crunk and everyone's beefing

i still like hip hop, i just don't like what they talk about about. hip hop back in the day wasn't as bad as it is now. back then, they rapped about things that you can relate to. i can't relate to someone who talks about getting with someone at a club cuz that's not what i do. i can't relate with someone who talks about bling all day, cuz i don't own expensive jewelry and neither do they, most of them rent the cars and jewelry that they rock in their videos or that they wear period. if you look at other genres of music, you will see that its relatable to normal people and that is why certain people are drawn to certain music. rap doesn;t necessarily draw a crowd who can relate but those who just feel like listening to fast pace music. i know i like fast pace music of any genre including hip hop. so if they are lacking in beats, then i ain't listening to it.

Good point there. . .
But you have to admit that hiphop is about being real

Every hiphop artiste relates to the hood he represents
And think of it, is that not what happens over there?

We have Kanye West who relates to his own educated world, his mum is a prof. . .
Nas relates to a world of political rivalry, he was born in an era when blacks weren't allowed to vote
Every rapper has his influence, and that's just the way it is. . .we have to respect their ability to paint their lives with words


And you said you relate to other types of music
Please how do you relate to rock?
Believe me rock is far more violent than Hiphop. . .

But you have to admit that hiphop is about being real

it is about being real. that's why they have a large audience because its about realness.

Every hiphop artiste relates to the hood he represents
And think of it, is that not what happens over there?

and that's what starts the beef. where i live, peole fight over the stupidest thing because they want to represent. we live in the same freaking neighborhood but i live on this street and you live up the street. what's the point. people get shot randomly just because someone knows you belong to this hood that they don't like. doesn;t make sense. why not rep about the black race as a whole in oppose who's from where.

We have Kanye West who relates to his own educated world, his mum is a prof. . .
Nas relates to a world of political rivalry, he was born in an era when blacks weren't allowed to vote

and that is why those two are big and are known world wide. all these other rappers with stupid funny names are usually one hit wonders.

And you said you relate to other types of music
Please how do you relate to rock?

i never said i relate to rock. i do like rock. i try not to limit my self to just one type of music. i listened to most american music and musics outside of america.

Believe me rock is far more violent than Hiphop. . .

not all. it depends on which kind. like heavy metal rock is quite violent but punk rock and pop rock aren't that bad.

I think the problem with modern rap/hip hop is that most of these new artistes are giving a different phase to the music. A phase that was not known with this kind of music in the past. You can say hip hop is violent and I'll agree with you but, it is still one of the genre of music that give hope to the poor, talk about the societal ills and how they can be corrected.

I still believe there are still a lot of 'real' hip hop artistes. The problem is just that majority of them think of the crowd they want to win, the money they want to make thereby, making them lose concentration on representing what they claim very well.

@topic
I think rap (modern or old school) has never been really judged well. Even if Hip hop is 'revived', there will always be critics.

i'll take from errone that has posted. truth is, Hiphop is heavily criticized, i daresay the most particular reason that being is because the artists themselves don't do their music with instruents and other organs unlike other genres. apart from that, i also think it's because the artistes don't do vocals and shit, we rapheads rhyme over beats. get that into ya thick skulls hatas!

PS: them new cats killing Hiphop slowly mayne. . .errbody don't wana think no more, theyjust wana talk about a glorified lifestyle that in the end is BS.

@Naija_diva, hey girl, long time.
I'm gonna have to disagree with some of ur points(I feel u tho on the old-school and modern-school rap thingy). Well personally, I don't depend on music(any form) to give me emotional support whatsoever because most of the time, these songs can't really give me that. Sure, some songs have touched me positively but no, I can't tell u that without them, I wlda committed suicide or sumn.(lol). So,I don't agree with ur point about old school rap being better than new school rap because rap hasn't changed much. What has changed is d influx of new, amateur rappers. Take for instance Soulja boy(lol), he's kinda wack to me but that's cause he's an amateur. It's not like Jay-z or Nas suddenly turned wack. They still rap about d same stuff but in a more modern way, I guess, gotta keep up with d pace. . I agree that rap has changed from what it used to be but that's only because back then, there were very few southern rappers. Now, some raps sound weird to the ear. But u could stick to the old rappers u used to like, they ain't dead.


@topic, umm, I'll be baq, I already wrote a page.

@ chiogo

i understand what you are trying to say cuz the whole southern movements is something that i am still getting used to because i not used to their style of music. i grew up listening to mostly rappers from new york and/or west coast. artist from the north, yes rap in a more modern way but the style/message of whatever is kinda of the same. southern rappers like literally rap about crap.

naija_diva:

@ chiogo

i understand what you are trying to say because the whole southern movements is something that i am still getting used to because i not used to their style of music. i grew up listening to mostly rappers from new york and/or west coast. artist from the north, yes rap in a more modern way but the style/message of whatever is kind of of the same. southern rappers like literally rap about crap.

That's exactly what I find wrong about the matter
As I said before, all artistes sing about what happens in their environment

Why don't we attack the R'n'B guys that sing about love all the time?
What of the Pop musicians that always talk about how they want you to feel their bodies?
We don't even want to start with[b] rock[/b]. . .

The bling culture didn't just start today, the problem is that 'The South' shifted our focus from 'black on black violence' to the dignified street life.
Is that not what music is about?
Is it not about self expression?
Why should one expression be winning countless grammys while the other is termed crap?

That's exactly what I find wrong about the matter
As I said before, all artistes sing about what happens in their environment

not all artistes. you can talk about your "environment", all you want but why diss someone and their environment. that's is why people start hatin on each other. so what if pop, rnb, rock are the same. atlease they don't try to talk negative about anyone or anything in general.

The bling culture didn't just start today, the problem is that 'The South' shifted our focus from 'black on black violence' to the dignified street life.
Is that not what music is about?
Is it not about self expression?

okay, lets' forget about the bling thing cuz everyone talks about it. and bling is not necessarily the issue with rap. yes music of any kind is about self expression and what not. whatever. but when you said that "The South' shifted our focus from 'black on black violence' to the dignified street life. umm, i don't think so. they still in a way talk about black on black violence but maybe not as much or not in the same way as before. southern rappers barely talk about their hometown. you might hear a little "A-town" chant/rep at the end of the song. that's cool. most of their music is nothing but about learning a new dance. who cares.i'm sure everyone is tired of doing the superman dance by soulja boy.
once the dance wears off, what next. but other styles of hip hop are music that may not go out of style. but to be realistic, i'm still going to listen to rap/hip hop regardless because i like listening to music that won't make me fall asleep.

Wordsmith:

PS: them new cats killing Hiphop slowly mayne. . .errbody don't wana think no more, theyjust wana talk about a glorified lifestyle that in the end is BS.

this is basically the point. no one thinks anymore. and if people think living in the ghetto is the best thing ever, well more power to you.

naija_dive: you might hear a little "A-town" chant/rep at the end of the song. that's cool. most of their music is nothing but about learning a new dance. who cares.i'm sure everyone is tired of doing the superman dance by soulja boy.
once the dance wears off, what next. but other styles of hip hop are music that may not go out of style. but to be realistic, i'm still going to listen to rap/hip hop regardless because i like listening to music that won't make me fall asleep.

How will you say Modern rap is about new dances?
Now tell me, TIP, Lil Wayne, Rick Ross, and others, which of 'em have brought out dances?

That's the concept of the LP, you can't judge them by their hit tracks. . .
I think they've been given a tag, which is making it hard for us to see how poetic they can be.

naija_diva: southern rappers barely talk about their hometown. you might hear a little "A-town" chant/rep at the end of the song. that's cool.

Are you kidding me?? They don't represent their culture??
Did Asa have to scream 'Naija' before we know what culture she represents?
Is culture no more about the way of way of life of a group of people?

I believe in keeping it simple, because when one does that you get a true perspective.

At any point in time there will always be good rappers and wack ones, the same way there will always be god films and bad ones, good pop and really soul depressingly cheese pop, the fact is people pick on something they don't understand, and sadly we buy into the crap.

When a lot of rap was about fighting the power, it was pick it on because it gave people a voice.

When rappers realiased that they could make more money by rapping main stream, it was pick it on by people who were afraid that they were begining to make more money than ever before.

To say we have to turn our backs on rap about money and bling because we don't have it is just nonesense.

You don't need to have it to relate, like a good film good rap places that which you haven't seen in your lap.

Question: How many people bad mouthing rap today, said anything about the spice girls, hmm?

You don't need to know anything about the Mona Lisa to buy into the fact that it is an outstanding painting.

It is this simple, if you enjoy a form of music, it is your responsiblity to search for that which is quaility and not bad mouth the whole act form. An act form that as brought and is still bringing so many people joy.

After all anybody can sing, but there will always only going to be a few good ones, this doesn't make singing bad.

how many times is this thread going to move.

Did Asa have to scream 'Naija' before we know what culture she represents?

if only i knew who she was.

why una dey move this thread up and down

@eldee
asa no be rapper o, rappers must always represent their hood. rap died with big n pac, 50 and kanye na pikin rappers

FLOWSHOW:

@eldee
asa no be rapper o, rappers must always represent their hood. rap died with big n pac, 50 and kanye na pikin rappers

I never said she was a rapper, I was trying to compare hiphop to other genres
What I meant was, if a soulstress represents her own environment without calling names, then why was she criticising South guys for not naming their whole album 'ATLANTA'

To say we have to turn our backs on rap about money and bling because we don't have it is just nonesense.

You don't need to have it to relate, like a good film good rap places that which you haven't seen in your lap.

Question: How many people bad mouthing rap today, said anything about the spice girls, hmm?

Exactly my sentiments!!!
We've had many overnight popstars in the last decade, no one says nuffin bout them. . .
The problem starts when it comes to rap

I just have this to say.

Abeg, rap is good. Rap is music. It's culture(d). I mean does anyone listen to what these rappers (usually) say? Bo, I love rap ie biggie, kanye, queen latifah(way back), even P-Diddy. The list should be much richer but I can't think of them right now.

Listen to what they talk about, even if it's just about money, they make sense haba. And they use big big grammar cos if u no no book, u can't flow oo. It just won't rhyme.

Our naija guys are tryin, I dunno if I can call Tuface a rapper but he raps good, also eldee, mode9 and Sasha. I've learnt a lot listening to rap. It helped my way of thinking. It would also help the thinking of all those playa-hating-from-the-sidelines folk. 'Nuff said.

As a lover of rock music and alternative music, i think rap promotes violence and show cases alot of immorality. correct me if i am wrong but some rap music makes women look cheap and also makes young people day dream about what they are not.

maybe its my own view but personally i never liked the concept behind rap. its part of the black culture to hv that kind of music but i embrace it when i can.

Noel gallagher is an Asshole so i think he should be disregarded, the reason why some people disregard rap is cuz of pure jelousy and stupidity. the Noel guy mouths off like some deranged idiot

not all rappers are the same;you'll hate some and you'll love some

simply a bunch of matured bead busters speaking their mind on rap music precicely,this sh*t kind of reminds me of AHH,

Rap has always being a gabage right from it's start, promoting violence, drugs, sexual materials and female degrading.
People open mouth to talk senseless in the name of rapping.

R'N'B is far better than Rap.

to hell with RAP. Back then there used to be 2 types of rap, gangstarr rap and then normal rap. The Normal rap i consider as positive and reflects real life experiences of a lot of artist. But now all we have is just gangstarr rap cause all they talk about is buying grills, amount of money they have, selling drugs and pimping Hoez (whores, bitches ) etc! COMMON PEOPLE! But back to the question, according to the definition of the term GENRE, Rap is definitely a genre of Music, more so than other "genres" in America for example. Rap is definitely known all over the world, mostly cause of its negative message and style for the most part! This is just my opinion and I DONT THINK WE AS NIGERIANS SHOULD EVEN BE DISCUSSING THIS! LAST I CHECKED RAP DID NOT COME FROM NIGERIA! I CHALLENGE THE MODERATOR OF THIS FORUMS TO AT LEAST HAVE SOME SORT OF STANDARD OF SCREENING, BEFORE ALLOWING POSTS. BEFORE You KNOW IT WE WILL START HAVING PRO-GAY POSTS AND ALL. PLS WE ARE THE FUTURE OF NIGERIA, WE SHOULD EMBRACE OUR OWN WAY OF LIFE MORE BECAUSE WE DO HAVE VALUES, CULTURES AND BELIEFS THAT ARE VERY REFINED AND POSITIVE, YET WE STILL HAVE ALL THIS PROBLEMS FACING OUR DEVELOPMENT AT HOME. MY POINT IS WE SHOULD NOT LET ALL THE NEGATIVE WESTERN LIFESTYLE WEAR AWAY OUR MORAL VALUES. NOW CAN WE GET BACK TO HAVING FORUMS THAT ARE MORE MEANINGFUL TO OUR LIVES AS NIGERIAns, AND NOT TOPICS LIKE THIS ARGUING/ DEFENDING A PARTICULARLY NEGATIVE FORM OF MUSIC ( NOT ALL OF EM' TO BE FAIR). WHAT ABOUT A TOPIC LIKE THIS, HAS ANYONE NOTICED HOW SOME OF THE RICH/FAMOUS/POLITICIANS ARE DYING ?? CALL IT WHATEVA, BUT I CALL IT THE HAND OF GOD AND THERE IS DEFINITELY MORE TO COME! ANYONE THAT HAS MILKED NIGERIA DRY WILL DIE , CORRUPT LEADERS IN PARTICULAR, THEY will all KEEP DROPING DEAD OR HAVE TERMINAL AILMENTS, I CALL IT KARMA! THE BLOOD OF THE AVERAGE NIGERIAN THAT WORKS HARD AND STILL CAN'T AFFORD TO EAT, HAS NO ACCESS TO COMMON GOOD ROAD, GOOD WATER , IN A LAND THAT MAKES BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN EXCESS FROM OIL SO PLEASE TAKE UR FREAKIN "RAP MUSIC FORUM" TO HIPHOPWORLD.COM AND NOT HERE!

Pastor engineerd,
Nice post ,but it should have been better if you move it to politics. no fighting.

is this the same eldee extra large of rythm fm

No it he ain't. .
@topic,
Rap is taking the mainstage, and some people are pissed, so? Rappers'll keep rapping, and they'll keep making money, and chart toppers. If rap was no good, Jay-Z won't have equalled elvis's record. So some rappers talk bout nothing but profanities, they're just taking a less evil lead from their metal rock brothers . It's like Eminem said '. . . music can alter moods and talk to you, can it load a gun up for you and cock it too?' Besides rap ain't all bling and gunz and booty, songs like 'If i ruled the world', 'Jesus Walks', 'Minority Report', e.t.c make for very good listening if you want to yap about lyrics. And who stuck a porcupine up that engineerd guys ass?

ok, maybe i will reply appropriately to ur post without getting deleted, but on the second thought i dont think u are worth my time!

me i love rap music, though i take their messages with a pinch of salt
the songs are usually all about (ill gotten) wealth, sex, drugs, guns,bad language etc
thank God for Kanye, we are beginnning to see some sensibility in the music
i often feel rap has encouraged a lot of ills but you cant blame those who 'beef' the genre, most rap songs have negative messages you wont want your child to imbibe.

Hip hop is always being talked badly. I don't blame anyone
cos hip hop as caused many lives and damages than any other genre of music
It promotes sex, smoking, drinking and a whole lot of bad influences, although it
has it's own good side almost all hip hop video have parental advice tag.

But i will say that hip hop follows the trend and and has stolen the scene
over the last two decades. Hip hop is getting better thn ever as it's not all about hard
core rap anymore, it's now very diversified, most r n b singers want their song remixeed
in hip hop and more and more pop and rock singers too. so i say hip hop is still representing
and i'm so so into it. i love it.

the truly funny thing is that in the end , its the record labels ( run by white boys) that usually instruct rappers on the content of their albums.

a lot of rappers did not start out as 'gangstas' bling blingers and all of that. read up bios on wikipedia. however, it seems that on getting a record deal, the label says do this, rap about that, and another gangsta ( or should i say wanksta) is born.

thats why eazy e called dr dre 'studio gangster ' in his reply to dre day. 

50 cent, in my opinion, is a classic example of a studio gangster. big tough guy, but when he came to naija in 200? and idris raised hell, he immediately flew back to yankee claiming his life was in danger - so much for not fearing death.

most record labels will probably not promote rapppers who keep away from bling bling etal. thatw why there are so few of them out there. on wikipedia's article onBET, it was stated that BEt has come under fire for not giving airtime to rappers who are considered to be too'intelligent '(eg little brother) for target audiences.

as to most of the critics of rap - i see most of them as pricks looking for political recognition. this was parodied in CB4, in the case of a george bush lookalike, who had no political agenda, who stumbled on being anti rap as a means to promote himself. y'all should watch. old move, parody comedy, chris rock, with a lot of satirical pointers to the nature of the industry.
all i'm saying in the end, is that everyone, including the buyers have played a part in the way hiphop is today. if lupe fiasco's kind of rap suddenly became popluar, record labels would immediately start promoting that sort of rap.