lomomike:
Oº°˚˚° jare tnx brother mi, "...It is most times placed as a base trim level of a car specific model (I stand corrected) ..." The placing or non placing of a diesel engine as a base trim level for a model was the reason for the "(I stand corrected)". Sometimes the rationale behind manufacturers placing a variant as a base trim may be based on but not limited to:
1. type of engine diesel or petrol,
2. Engine displacement / number of cylinders,
3. Level of equipment upgrade found as standard,
4. Size of vehicle. (Short or long base). Etc. That's why I said "(I stand corrected)".

Hope I explained my clause clearly?

Denn: A little bit of economics.....bandwagon theory.

If you own a business in Nigeria, just pray that the bandwagon does not swing against you because no amount of logic and advert will be able to win back your customers....

Shina Peters, IBB, ST Soap, dadawa seasoning, aji no moto, etc all have these in common

Olaposij: @Nuzo... You made my day with your write ups.. I'm a car enthusiast, I can't claim to be in the same class with ikenna and sienna, but I know I love my cars.
I've been driving a Toyota camry 2006 model for 3 years now and its been a wonderful experience. I have never had to visit a mechanic except for a oil change or to change my brake pads.. I'm thinking of upgrading to a 2008 highlander.
Reading opinions of car experts on NL make me feel like a toyota is not a vehicle.. Nigerians that use toyota are not stupid... u cant live in Uk or canada and advice us on d type of car to drive on our roads.
I daresay I wont mind to have a 2013 bmw or audi as a 3rd car if I can afford it... But such a car will not be my only car..

Nuzo':


You are a very funny guy Shoot@sight. I like that.
But the problem is you are so bent on shooting yourself at the foot.

Given, I may have bitten more than I could chew by comparing a GLK to Tundra. Pardon me, I was merely looking for the easiest way to let you guys into my mind and of course the mind of Nigerians when it comes to brands and their workability (Toyota compared to other brands). That example was lost in translation.

Now, allow me to compare a GLK to Toyota Highlander. I was opportune to drive a friend's Highlander a couple of times. After all said and done, a Toyota Highlander still comes out tops in terms of durability, reliability and cost

imsparkling: They r so used 2 fuel cars

Nuzo":
1. Siena and Ikenna stated clearly that Nigeriiaans are only using diesel cars because their "mentor" (America) is using it. More like saying that we Niigerians foolishly copy whatever the Americans do

Nuzo":
2. Ikenna and Cooldun also made a condescending statement about how Nigerians suck up auto-transmission vehicles...just because its lazy Americans favorites..

Nuzo':
3. Ikenna and co has also been furious about Nigerian preferring the Toyota brand of cars to other brands. They went further to beret Nigerians for thinking very high of American specs when compared to European version.

Ikenna351: Simple, because Americans don't drive diesels. The moment they start, Petrol cars will become "problematic" in Nigeria, to Nigerians.

Ikenna.

shejane: Dot kw much abt diesel cars thou bt I love my fuel car

Mayb if I try diesel car is possible I wil lyk it

Bt 4 now fuel car all d way nd toyota is d best

Nuzo':
Siena, Ikenna, cooldun et al.

These aforementioned are just like Jakumo, Mannylife etc in aeronotics. They are well versed, experienced and well traveled.
Some months ago, I was opportune to follow Ikenna's journey from Abuja to Anambra via Enugu. His story or maybe the way he told it made me feel like I was the actual traveller. I could count that thread as one of my most educating yet entertaining threads I've come across on Niaralnd since when I joined the forum in 2006.

I've leant a lot of maturity, professionalism and straight to the point kind oof approach to issues, especially in the auto section. I appreciate them.

That being said, I must note that sometimes I don't feel comfortable with the way they counter/confront some Nigerian regarding their opinions on automobiles. This confrontation is very evident in Siena, Ikenna nd Cooldun's comments here.

1. Siena and Ikenna stated clearly that Nigeriiaans are only using diesel cars because their "mentor" (America) is using it. More like saying that we Niigerians foolishly copy whatever the Americans do.

2. Ikenna and Cooldun also made a condescending statement about how Nigerians suck up auto-transmission vehicles...just because its lazy Americans favorites..

3. Ikenna and co has also been furious about Nigerian preferring the Toyota brand of cars to other brands. They went further to beret Nigerians for thinking very high of American specs when compared to European version.

I can't claim to know the major reasons why Nigerians are "ignorant" of their automobiles and their preferences. But I can't at least speak for myself. And before I do that, I want to also make it clear that I'm not a car/auto enthusiast...but I'm a big fan of sophistication, simplicity and efficiency in all I do. And that includes automobiles.

As I agree with assertion that Nigerians prefer petrol cars cos America do same. I would want Siena and co to do further research oon why Nigerians prefer this other than using the usual line "Nigerian likes copying Americans for the sake of it" to shut down any debate.

Aside from first hand experiences affecting the use of diesel engine cars like:
A. Higher pump price
B. Lack of good auto mechanics
C. Excess carbon dioxide
D. Noisy engine
E. Low speed (for older version)
F. Faulty injector
Et al.

I would love you guys to look into the fact that this love for American product and service is not just a Nigerian thing but a global phenomenon. From Brasili, Beijing, London to even Germany...the residents of these places prefer American specs of most products even if the product is an ididgenous to those places.
Now, the question is why is the world in love with American specs. Simple! High quality nd standard plus its uniqueness! So, what's actually wrong in people believing and going for American specs?

And as for Nigerians preferring Toyota to any other brand, I stand with them on that. I've been blessed to accelerate different brand of cars in my life; Datsun/Nissan, Mazda, Ford, Honda, Peogot GM, Mercedes and Toyota. I drove cars from these brands between 2 months to 10 years. Nothing compares to Toyota!

Aside from the value and compatibility, I would choose Toyota Tundra over Mercedes GLK450 (no be me get am o) without thinking it thru. I can't begin to recount my sweet times with Toyota Tundra as opposed to the not-so memorable time I had with the GLK450.
Is it the cheap maintenance, availability of spare parts, fuel economy, engine durability? There's just something about Toyota!

I'm not going to respond to Cooldun's comments regarding auto-transmission and manual. Cos if I do, he may even come with the idea that we should even prefer animal transportation to automobile...just because we want our roads to be free from accidents.

Once again, these guys are professionals and experts in automobile but the whole country can't be wrong.

Ps: Please pardon my incoherent essay.

Ikenna351:

Let me make my statement "Simple, because Americans don't drive diesels. The moment they start, Petrol cars will become "problematic" in Nigeria, to Nigerians." clearer for you.

If North Americans (USA & Canada) decide to ditch petrol cars and start using Diesel cars and avoid petrol cars like they do with diesel cars, what do you think you will in Nigeria? Petrol cars? From where? Europe? If like as you have confirmed above why you and majority of Nigerians prefer American speccs vehicles, is it not going to be from the same America that you will still order for cars or buy tokunbo cars from? Or are you now going to hate American cars because they are no longer petrol engine powered? Where will you order for cars then? India? Or do you think Inspired_m will convert those American specs cars from diesel to petrol engines before shipping them down for you to purchase? So, are you now going to ditch Toyota when all Toyotas that come from USA & Canada are diesels?

How many percentage of cars on Nigeria roads are tokunbo and how many are new? If tokunbo are more, do you think it won't affect the fuel type of new vehicles they will start selling in the country? Back then, PAN produced and sold only manual transmission Peugeot 504, 505, 406 & 607 (am not sure of 307 & 407). But they have come to realise that Nigerians have accepted auto tranny or prefer it more than manual tranny, hence, they recently introduced auto trannies in their new products in Nigeria, along side their manual counterparts: 308, 408, 508, 3008 & 4008. If tokunbo cars in Nigeria, most especially from USA, have made Peugeot to introduce auto transmission in their new cars, do you think if 90% of diesel tokunbo cars from US won't make Toyota do the same by introducing new diesel cars in Nigeria?


And as for "Nigerians like copying Americans". I would suggest you drop it because you do not want us to go down that road/argument. Because, If you want to insist, then tell me why of all the systems of government, Nigeria ditched the one they were operating and switched to Presidential System Americans were practising at that time till date. How is that working out for us? All of a sudden, Nigeria ditched the Europe number plate style and switched to American style. Can you honestly tell me which of them best suits Nigeria? The Europe style which is very bold and glaring everyone can see from afar, which will help Nigerian policemen? Or is it the tiny American style which can only be seen when you are standing directly close to the vehicle? Did it ever occur to Nigerians why Americans number plate is like that? When CCTV is there to snap and track any vehicle at any point in time, even if the numbers on the number plate are not visible to human eyes from afar, but for CCTV and other gadgets. What about Nigeria? How many States in the country have the CCTV, aside Abuja and maybe Lagos state? If a poor policeman can't see a number plate of a vehicle involved in a crime from afar, how then do you expect him to note the numbers? Even with their database, is it not when you have the numbers that you can do your search? Probably, the poor policeman may not even have a Camera phone to snap the car, in case they will zoom and get the numbers from there. Or may be a Nigerian Policeman is expected to have a telescopic eyes, may be.

To cut the story short, an average Nigerian is an "American -Wannabe". Our Sedentary lifestyle explains that a lot. If Americans switch to Diesel cars tomorrow, Nigerians will follow sharp-sharp. You can argue from now till tomorrow, but its a fact. Take it or leave it.

Ikenna.

elektra80:

Europe cars tend to be faster and more luxurious but those japs brings a balance to economy, reliability and comfort. if u can own only one car as ur daily driver and u have option between a 2008 Mercedes Benz e320 and a 2008 Toyota Camry which one would u choose. I mean a car that u drive everyday around the city,good and bad roads. most people will choose the Toyota because its more of an everyday car. Most people that own those exotic Europe cars have more than one car, and their daily driver is always these japs that u condemn
.



Diesel engines make more noise too and not environmental friendly based on emission

elektra80:

Now the big question is why do Americans drive more petrol cars instead of diesel, abi Dem too Dey follow follow. On the basis of Nigeria, I don't think its follow follow. We don't manufacture cars in Nigeria so we source from abroad and the USA still remains the biggest market for used cars, especially Toyota and Honda which is what we appreciate most in Nigeria. Yes that's true because they are more reliable. Europe cars tend to be faster and more luxurious but those japs brings a balance to economy, reliability and comfort which no other cars can even come close to. Ask urself, if u can own only one car as ur daily driver and u have option between a 2008 Mercedes Benz e320 and a 2008 Toyota Camry which one would u choose. I mean a car that u drive everyday around the city,good and bad roads.. Will u choose the Benz? Even if u do, most people will choose the Toyota because its more of an everyday car. Most people that own those exotic Europe cars have more than one car, and their daily driver is always these japs that u condemn.

Back to the topic... Diesel cars are more expensive to manufacture compared to petrols, manufacturers have to install turbo into diesel engines just to make their speed close to diesels. Diesel engines make more noise too and not environmental friendly based on emission and these are factors Americans take serious. U can't say Nigerians use petrol just because Americans use more of petrol... Petrol cars bring a better balance to speed, reliability and are more environmental friendly than their diesel counterparts and that's why Americans , thus Nigerians embrace it. Don't forget Americans use left hand drive too... So next thing u will say is Nigerians use left hand drive just because Americans use it. If Toyota and Honda are readily available in Europe, with left hand drive and cheaper, trust me Nigerians will buy their cars from there instead of USA

shoot@sight:

Comparing a Highlander, and a GLK ? Damnit I give up! Highlander is a CROSSOVER, more like a compromise between a car and an SUV. GLK on Τђε other hand is a full fledge no nonsense SUV. First and foremost if u must compare please compare with a Nissan murano, Honda crv etc.
That aside please Neva compare a Mercedes with a Toyota ,they αяє not in ∂ same class and will not βε̲̣ for a very looooong time. If ever... Mercedes is a premium brand okay??
Let mε put it this way ,Ɣоυ αяє comparing a bajaj150cc bike with a Harley Davidson ! make comparison with a landcruiser perhaps okay ?

Nuzo':
Oga Ikenna,

I appreciate you and the rest of the car enthusiast for taking your time to reply me. I've learnt a lot between yesterday and today.
I also want to use this opportunity to apologies for a minor and wrongful accusations.

That being said, I would be happy to refer you to Electr80's comment. Most of the points and questions I wanted to raise are already in his last post.

But for posterity sake, I would love to make some points very clear:
That my opinion was formed from the model of diesel cars between 1990s to 2004.

If there are new and distinguished innovations in diesel cars in recent years, I don't know. But I'm very sure that Nigerians will not hesitate to massively aquire and drive it the moment it passes the necessary Nigerian reality check: cost, durability, air and noise pollution, mechanical manoeuvre etc.
Coincidentally, Americans would have noticed the same improvement/innovation and do the same. We will still go ahead and tag it what it is; coincidence...not follow follow mentality.

elektra80:

Now the big question is why do Americans drive more petrol cars instead of diesel, abi Dem too Dey follow follow.

elektra80:

On the basis of Nigeria, I don't think its follow follow. We don't manufacture cars in Nigeria so we source from abroad and the USA still remains the biggest market for used cars, especially Toyota and Honda which is what we appreciate most in Nigeria.

elektra80:

Ask urself, if u can own only one car as ur daily driver and u have option between a 2008 Mercedes Benz e320 and a 2008 Toyota Camry which one would u choose. I mean a car that u drive everyday around the city,good and bad roads.. Will u choose the Benz?

elektra80:
Back to the topic... Diesel cars are more expensive to manufacture compared to petrols, manufacturers have to install turbo into diesel engines just to make their speed close to diesels.

elektra80:

Diesel engines make more noise too and not environmental friendly based on emission and these are factors Americans take serious.

elektra80:
Petrol cars bring a better balance to speed, reliability and are more environmental friendly than their diesel counterparts and that's why Americans , thus Nigerians embrace it.

elektra80:
Don't forget Americans use left hand drive too... So next thing u will say is Nigerians use left hand drive just because Americans use it. If Toyota and Honda are readily available in Europe, with left hand drive and cheaper, trust me Nigerians will buy their cars from there instead of USA

Ikenna351:

Did you actually read my post you responded to?

"Why do Americans drive more of Petrol cars instead of Diesel?" We are not here to discuss why Americans drive Petrol cars instead. Let's focus on the topic.

"European cars vs American cars?" Really? Who is comparing car brands here? I was making reference to specifications not brands, please.


"RHD vs LHD?" Don't you think you may be contradicting yourself here? Have you forgotten that Nigeria was formerly RHD, but later changed to LHD. Any reason why we changed the UK driving position to LHD American driving position? Or was there any other reason for that change I do not know? Or were you trying to prove the point "copy-copy"?


" If Toyota and Honda are readily available in Europe, with left hand drive and cheaper, trust me Nigerians will buy their cars from there instead of USA" Seriously? Are you saying Europeans don't drive petrol Toyotas and Hondas as well? Or you saying there are no LHD European countries that drive Toyotas and Hondas? Have you taken your time to compare car prices between America and Europe?

Sorry, you just proved my point in this thread. Lol!

Ikenna.

jcshols: Thermal efficiency is gud in diesel.
"Accordin to d British Society of Motor Manufacturin and Traders, d EU average 4 diesel cars account for 50% of d total sold, includin 70% in France and 38% in d UK" Please take note of d 38% in UK(So its not TOTALLY a 9ja thingy)
I believe its a general ish. Even with manufacturers,on d whole,u v more 'non-diesel' cars than u have diesel. Else if it was down to strictly "copying yankee',how come we have few American cars(Parent Company in America and not 'built for American market')in 9ja.How many cadillacs,chevys,dodges,pontiacs,GMCs,Lincolns etc do we v hia?'Diesel exhaust is well known 4 its xtic smell; but this smell in recent yrs has bcom much less because d sulfur is now removed from d fuel in d oil refinery.Diesel exhaust has been found to contain a long list of toxic air contaminants. Among dese pollutants, fine particle pollution is perhaps d most important as a cause of diesel's harmful health effects.''Naturally aspirated diesels tend to lack power and torque at d top of their speed range. This narrow band is a reason why a vehicle such as a truck may have a gearbox with as many as 18 or more gears, to allow d engine's power to be used effectively at all speeds. ' Naturally aspirated diesels, almost without exception, have a lower power output than a petrol engine of d same capacity whilst d same time requiring stronger (and thus heavier) internal components such as d pistons and crankshaft to withstand greater stresses of diesel engine's operatin cycle.These factors give naturally aspirated diesels a poor power-to-weight ratio.Diesel engines v longer life span but r xpensive and make use of heavy materials.Diesel is less readily available,glow plugs in diesel engines require u w8 b4 startin so it cld heat up.Diesel engines, because of weight and compression ratio,tend to hav lower maximum RPM ranges than gasoline engines,this makes diesel engines high torque rather than high horsepowa and that tends to make diesel cars slow in terms of acceleration.Many of d new diesel engine designs usin advanced computer control are eliminatin many of these disadvantages --smoke, noise, vibration and cost are all declinin.In d future, we are likely to see many more diesel engines on the road.Its worthy to note d@ an average Nigerian does not drive a car made 2010 upwards 4 example talkmore of drivin a new car,well @lest from wia I de(South West,ignore gidi) and whch means a lot of ds improvmnts on diesel engine might nt b available on wht they ride whch leaves room for only d rich n probably d enthusiast.d rich wu isn't an enthusiast(whch's most likely wht an avrage rich Nigerian isnt)will probably base hs judgement on d historical disadvantages of diesel n hence won't go 4 diesel.

jcshols: Thermal efficiency is gud in diesel.

jcshols:
Diesel exhaust is well known 4 its xtic smell; but this smell in recent yrs has bcom much less because d sulfur is now removed from d fuel in d oil refinery.Diesel exhaust has been found to contain a long list of toxic air contaminants. Among dese pollutants, fine particle pollution is perhaps d most important as a cause of diesel's harmful health effects.''Naturally aspirated diesels tend to lack power and torque at d top of their speed range. This narrow band is a reason why a vehicle such as a truck may have a gearbox with as many as 18 or more gears, to allow d engine's power to be used effectively at all speeds. ' [b]Naturally aspirated diesels, almost without exception, have a lower power output than a petrol engine of d same capacity whilst d same time requiring stronger (and thus heavier) internal components such as d pistons and crankshaft to withstand greater stresses of diesel engine's operatin cycle.[/b]These factors give naturally aspirated diesels a poor power-to-weight ratio.Diesel engines v longer life span but r xpensive and make use of heavy materials.Diesel is less readily available,glow plugs in diesel engines require u w8 b4 startin so it cld heat up.Diesel engines, because of weight and compression ratio,tend to hav lower maximum RPM ranges than gasoline engines,this makes diesel engines high torque rather than high horsepowa and that tends to make diesel cars slow in terms of acceleration.Many of d new diesel engine designs usin advanced computer control are eliminatin many of these disadvantages --smoke, noise, vibration and cost are all declinin.In d future, we are likely to see many more diesel engines on the road.

Ikenna351: @ electra80,

Did you say Autralians don't drive diesel cars that much? Where exactly are you getting all these your information from? Why are you trying so hard to prove a point with wrong information?

This thing with your "Nigerians can't afford newer Diesels, let's wait it out". Do you know how long HDI engines have been out there? How many Toyota Camry Pencil light, fish light, Big for Nothing and Muscle is out there on Nigerian road? How many Honda Accord Halla, Academy, Baby boy, EOD, Discussion continues and Evil spirit is out there on Nigerian roads? Are you saying all these while Nigerians were buying these cars, modern diesel cars have not been in existence? When was Peugeot 406 production started and when did it end? Are you saying 406 HDIs never existed when the petrol versions were produced, used, sold and shipped into Nigeria for 2nd, 3rd or 4th hand use? Are you saying all those while Toyota Camry '98-2007 models never got modern diesel engines we all have been pointing out? So if majority of Nigerians can afford these cars sold between 1m - 3m or more, are you saying such amount couldn't have bought them the diesel counterparts? Haba!

About Nigeria switching from RHD to LHD, you brought it up and i stated if you want to go that road, who knows if Nigeria switched to LHD because of US, following other changes that have taken place at that time which i noted. Did i not state there could be other reason for the switch other than copy-copy? Why do you have to twist it my words to prove a point?

Anyway, you still have not not proved my position in this thread wrong. I want someone to prove to me that if Americans switch to diesel cars tomorrow, that Nigerians won't follow suit. If i can be proved wrong, then i will park and leave this thread for good.

Ikenna.