Syncan:

Is the definition of relativism now relative? Am I in this debate based on your opinion of what relativism is, or does it actually have an objective definition? Relativism has no place for truncating one truth over another, Its stand is that everything known as true is true for the people involved. However, Killing of twins is wrong,there was no "agreement" to stop it, the people where told the truth; they knew the truth and it set them free.

You had earlier told me you disagreed with my term "Christian God", while not taking cognizance of the circumstance in which it was used. Now you talk about Christians agreeing to what God has revealed, through mohammed or budha or Jesus I must ask. Going foward, there was no agreement to use what God has revealed, God gave the ten commandments to the Israelites, It was absolute, it was not based on their agreement. When the Israelites turned away to other ..."truths" according to you...they were punished, they were not excused, why, because they were not free to pick "truths" based on agreement. As a matter of fact, they had agreed upon a "truth"...to make a golden calf...we saw what followed.

The bold is not what relativism is, no, even the reference you sent me to didn't say that about relativism, it is just what you think it is as you rightly said. Maybe when you come back to what it really is, then you'll see why I made my opening statement.

What do the following definitions suggest to you?

1a : a theory that knowledge is relative to the limited nature of the mind and the conditions of knowing

b : a view that ethical truths depend on the individuals and groups holding them
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/relativism

striktlymi:

What do the following definitions suggest to you?

1a : a theory that knowledge is relative to the limited nature of the mind and the conditions of knowing

b : a view that ethical truths depend on the individuals and groups holding them
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/relativism

1a: That there is no absolute fact, but what your mind calls fact based on its nature and conditions of knowing.

1b: There exists no absolute truth, but what individuals and groups hold as truth; is truth, it matters not if they are varied or even opposite, they are all truth.

Is this what you believe in?

wonda26, I see you, welcome to the Catholic thread.

Syncan:

1a: That there is no absolute fact, but what your mind calls fact based on its nature and conditions of knowing.

1b: There exists no absolute truth, but what individuals and groups hold as truth; is truth, it matters not if they are varied or even opposite, they are all truth.

Is this what you believe in?

Now I see where the challenge is. To answer your question directly: NO!!! That view on Relativism is not what I believe in.

Though the definitions can be seen in that light but I have a very different view on them. Both definitions are as summarized:

1a & b. What we know is limited by experience and perception.

That for me is the summary of both definitions. Every other thing would be individual applications of those definitions. The extreme application of no 'absolute truth/fact' is purely academics. In the real world, that kind of application does not exist. Let me illustrate...

Mr. 'A' caused the death of Mr. 'B' by a single gun shot wound to the head.

If the above is taken for its face value, then the fact would be that Mr. 'B' is dead. That truth or fact is absolute and not subject to any individual opinion. Relativism in its extreme form has no role to play here.

However, if we consider the same scenario and introduce factors like cultural differences etc such that one child was brought up to believe that "death" means "life" then we would have a situation where what is 'true' becomes dependent on some other factors.

striktlymi:

Now I see where the challenge is. To answer your question directly: NO!!! That view on Relativism is not what I believe in.

Though the definitions can be seen in that light but I have a very different view on them. Both definitions are as summarized:

1a & b. What we know is limited by experience and perception.

That for me is the summary of both definitions. Every other thing would be individual applications of those definitions. The extreme application of no 'absolute truth/fact' is purely academics. In the real world, that kind of application does not exist. Let me illustrate...

Mr. 'A' caused the death of Mr. 'B' by a single gun shot wound to the head.

If the above is taken for its face value, then the fact would be that Mr. 'B' is dead. That truth or fact is absolute and not subject to any individual opinion. Relativism in its extreme form has no role to play here.

However, if we consider the same scenario and introduce factors like cultural differences etc such that one child was brought up to believe that "death" means "life" then we would have a situation where what is 'true' becomes dependent on some other factors.

You may actually be arguing against the concept of relativism, I'll leave that for Ubenedictus. However, take a look at the bold in your post, and take a look at my opening post below, especially the bold part, then tell me again what you said you don't agree with in my post.

Syncan:

In my opinion, I do not think it will be moral to do so in its strict sense. Imagine the morality behind excusing killing of twins because its ok in a particular culture, what could justify burying someone alive with the corpse of dead kings just because its relatively fine with a people?

At some point the relativist cannot satisfy his conscience without creating an absolute ground. What is fundamental human right if such rights are relative? Even the mere talk of moral, brings in some absoluteness, for a chief pillar for morals lies in the "golden rule", and this is absolute. So for a relativist to stake a claim on morality, he has to at some point abandon his position, else he will be endorsing quite a number of things that offends charity and morals.

Syncan:

You may actually be arguing against the concept of relativism, I'll leave that for Ubenedictus. However, take a look at the bold in your post, and take a look at my opening post below, especially the bold part, then tell me again what you said you don't agree with in my post.

I do not agree with the following:

Syncan:

In my opinion, I do not think it will be moral to do so in its strict sense. Imagine the morality behind excusing killing of twins because its ok in a particular culture, what could justify burying someone alive with the corpse of dead kings just because its relatively fine with a people?

At some point the relativist cannot satisfy his conscience without creating an absolute ground. What is fundamental human right if such rights are relative? Even the mere talk of moral, brings in some absoluteness, for a chief pillar for morals lies in the "golden rule", and this is absolute. So for a relativist to stake a claim on morality, he has to at some point abandon his position, else he will be endorsing quite a number of things that offends charity and morals.

Rich4god: Na wetin she tell you....

I did not eat and drink anything

Kamsified:
I've never bn far from you dearest
I greet you sir

Is that why u never checked on me

Syncan: wonda26, I see you, welcome to the Catholic thread.

Bros... Thanks.. I be dey a little busy for one kind thread like that

https://www.nairaland.com/1878872/what-origin-catholic-church

All these our 'brothers' won't let us be...but we dey kampe!

Greetings house.... How was church today? Mine was good. We had our children/youth harvest today: 'Harvest of Testimony' ..... I must testify

I have a prayer request... And by God's grace, I would testify very very soon

And by the way, what's popping here?

wonda26:



Bros... Thanks.. I be dey a little busy for one kind thread like that

https://www.nairaland.com/1878872/what-origin-catholic-church

All these our 'brothers' won't let us be...but we dey kampe!

Greetings house.... How was church today? Mine was good. We had our children/youth harvest today: 'Harvest of Testimony' ..... I must testify

I have a prayer request... And by God's grace, I would testify very very soon

Yeah, I saw you there. May the good Lord meet you at your point of need. Amen to the testimony.

wonda26: And by the way, what's popping here?

Anything goes actually, so far it catches the fancy of the brethren, you may want to do a little catch up first. Beware, some people like to speak much grammer sha, if you get strength you fit join them, we go de clap for side.

Syncan:

Anything goes actually, so far it catches the fancy of the brethren, you may want to do a little catch up first. Beware, some people like to speak much grammer sha, if you get strength you fit join them, we go de clap for side.

He he... Tried doing some 'catch ups' ooo.... All I see is big big grammar

So, I'm chilling by the sidelines first o

striktlymi:

I believe some people would want to use Relativism in that regard but this is not saying that is what I believe Relativism should be about.

Ok.

What do you believe it should be about?

Wonda26, welcome here...

italo:

Ok.

What do you believe it should be about?

Every other thing about Relativism except for the extreme application of no 'absolute' truth or fact.

I believe what we consider to be true or factual can be Relative to the experiences of people. I believe Relativism is a good excuse for those who, based on their experiences, are not exposed to the truth as revealed by God.

POPEII:

Is that why u never checked on me

My boss spiritual , are you saying you didn't see my missed calls

SalC: Hmm too many mentions thanks all am very ok now, and out of the hospital,

Kamsified you are still cooking since yesterday? Smh

Wait until you taste the food, then u'll understand why it took so long

Welcome back sis you were surely missed

Rich4god: Welcome dear... I will take this that "you are strong now"... Well, I knw why kamsified is delaying, but make I never talk until she comes...

Ah ah now, I had to take my time to cook for my mil na, before she changes her mind

POPEII:

I did not eat and drink anything

@Kamsified.... You no tell PopeII...?

wonda26:



Bros... Thanks.. I be dey a little busy for one kind thread like that

https://www.nairaland.com/1878872/what-origin-catholic-church

All these our 'brothers' won't let us be...but we dey kampe!

Greetings house.... How was church today? Mine was good. We had our children/youth harvest today: 'Harvest of Testimony' ..... I must testify

I have a prayer request... And by God's grace, I would testify very very soon

Mass was refreshing dear
Amen to your testimony

Ubenedictus:

i've been fine dear, how u dey?

I'm fine sir thanks and welcome back

Ubenedictus: Good marwing all.

I've gat a few questions...they are of the moral nature so answer with care.


The first.

Is it moral to be a relativist?

A very interesting debate going on here!!!!!


If we took cultural relativistism seriously, what could be the consequences?
Firstly, we're not allowed to say the practice(s) of another culture is morally inferior to ours. So for instance we cant say our society that respects freedom of speech is better than another where there is political oppression because that would mean that we’re applying a standard for comparison. So when we see journalists being executed for no other reason other than for reporting what they saw(that maybe against the government), we should all keep mute. But political oppression seems wrong no matter the society it happens. But the cultural relativist excuses such practice from being critisized

Secondly, We’re not permitted to criticize the code of conduct of our society:- According to cultural relativism, the way to know if an action is right or wrong is to ask a simple question ‘is this acceptable within the code of the society in which it took place?’
For instance if you want to know if killing an innocent person(just to give a king a befitting burial) is right or wrong, all you need to do is to ask if it conforms to the moral code of the society in question. If yes, you’re good to go at least from a moral point of view. Isnt this idea very worrisome? More often than not, there are practices existing in our cultures that we might want to improve but according to the cultural relativist, we’re barred from considering ways other cultures might be better than ours.

Thirdly, there would be no such thing as moral progress:- Before now, in the western culture, women were not allowed to vote or be voted for, and they couldn’t even own properties not to talk of running for political positions. Also slavery was a normal thing at some point but for job well done by reformers like Martin Luther King Jr. Now, all the things mentioned have changed and we (or at least most people) view it as progress. But cultural relativism wouldn’t have allowed for any such practices to be challenged. By what measuring stick did we arrive at “no slave trade is better than slave trade”

For me,cultural relativism has plenty flaws and cannot be right. So my answer to your question is NO

*runs to the kitchen to make breakfast before my prince charming Rich4god finds me here

striktlymi:

I understand and agree.

Is it impractical to hold the view of Relativism and still go ahead to correct what is perceived as wrong? I don't think being a Relativist would hold one back from furthering whatever it is the individual considers to be 'appropriate behaviour'.

striktlymi:

...but is truth not relative?

I think that Relativism is an attempt to let people know how unfair it will be to use one 'measuring stick' to judge the actions of men.

See the contradiction in those two posts? That's one of the flaws of relativism. At some point, the relativist shoots himself in the foot especially whenever he dares to correct some other person(s) on what he (the relativist) believes to be wrong

Happy new month brethren

Kamsified: Happy new month brethren

A happy new month to you Kamsified.

Even as i dey vex with all of una


make una pray for me o. I dey travel today and i no wan hear say cherekambia. I wan live plenty plenty.

"...I came to you in weakness and fear and much trembling, and my message and my proclamation were not with persuasive words of wisdom,
but with a demonstration of spirit and power, so that your faith might rest not on human wisdom but on the power of God". 1Cor2:1-5

How very often we look for God in the mighty wind, only to miss him passing by in the gentle breeze. Oh, how many saints must have passed us by yet we didn't know, overlooking them, or even treating some badly. Imagine that Jesus own people overlooked him...“Is this not the son of Joseph?”...Lk 4:16-30. Yet right before them was the messiah they were waiting for. Many cases have there been, where people were embarrassed after finding out that the one they ridiculed earlier, wasn't that nonentity they thought at first. There's this case of a lady that slapped a top military officer(in plain clothes) in a traffic fracas, having assessed that her wealthy husband could arrest and deal with this man who was driving a car lower in value than her's. Things changed for the woman as her husband was humiliated publicly on the spot, by a group of soldiers acting under the watch of their assaulted Oga. How differently would I have treated Jnrbayano if I knew that God is pleased with him, would I have snapped at Ify124 if I knew she is an authentic visionary who see's the heavenly beings, don't you think I would have been more patient with wonda26 had I known that he stays up all night speaking to the Lord, nor would i have pushed away Chidima disrespectfully; if I knew that despite being my neighbor's maid, she is often visited by the blessed Virgin. Yes, yes, we would have done things differently had we known...but that is the koko... we wouldn't know, for we are expected to see Christ in all, because though he came being weak in appearance, yet exhibits a "demonstration of spirit and power". That person you may treat badly, may just be in possession of the power to bring your miracle home.

Dear Brethren. As we enter once again a new month, may the good Lord look kindly on your good heart desires, may he lighten the burden you bear, give you the serenity to accept graciously what you cannot change, courage to change those you can, the discernment to know the difference, and more so; to guide your path with Divine light. Amen.

Good morning and a splendid day ahead to all.

KiddaBlingzz: Even as i dey vex with all of una


make una pray for me o. I dey travel today and i no wan hear say cherekambia. I wan live plenty plenty.

May God's angels go with you. Journey mercies bro.

Syncan:

May God's angels go with you. Journey mercies bro.

thanks sir.

Syncan: "...I came to you in weakness and fear and much trembling, and my message and my proclamation were not with persuasive words of wisdom,
but with a demonstration of spirit and power, so that your faith might rest not on human wisdom but on the power of God". 1Cor2:1-5

How very often we look for God in the mighty wind, only to miss him passing by in the gentle breeze. Oh, how many saints must have passed us by yet we didn't know, overlooking them, or even treating some badly. Imagine that Jesus own people overlooked him...“Is this not the son of Joseph?”...Lk 4:16-30. Yet right before them was the messiah they were waiting for. Many cases have there been, where people were embarrassed after finding out that the one they ridiculed earlier, wasn't that nonentity they thought at first. There's this case of a lady that slapped a top military officer(in plain clothes) in a traffic fracas, having assessed that her wealthy husband could arrest and deal with this man who was driving a car lower in value than her's. Things changed for the woman as her husband was humiliated publicly on the spot, by a group of soldiers acting under the watch of their assaulted Oga. How differently would I have treated Jnrbayano if I knew that God is pleased with him, would I have snapped at Ify124 if I knew she is an authentic visionary who see's the heavenly beings, don't you think I would have been more patient with wonda26 had I known that he stays up all night speaking to the Lord, nor would i have pushed away Chidima disrespectfully; if I knew that despite being my neighbor's maid, she is often visited by the blessed Virgin. Yes, yes, we would have done things differently had we known...but that is the koko... we wouldn't know, for we are expected to see Christ in all, because though he came being weak in appearance, yet exhibits a "demonstration of spirit and power". That person you may treat badly, may just be in possession of the power to bring your miracle home.

Dear Brethren. As we enter once again a new month, may the good Lord look kindly on your good heart desires, may he lighten the burden you bear, give you the serenity to accept graciously what you cannot change, courage to change those you can, the discernment to know the difference, and more so; to guide your path with Divine light. Amen.

Good morning and a splendid day ahead to all.

Awwww! as always so touching and inspiring.

May God grant many Megabytes to your phone because you touch lives with these words of yours.

And may the good lord continue to bless and keep us all.

Happy new month darlings

HAPPY NEW MONTH MY BELOVED PEOPLE....Remember,there is nothing difficult for God to do.
Was the last month not so good for you?
Were you disappointed?
Did you see yourself not achieving what you set out to do?
Are you doubting the promises made over your life?




But you are alive to see this new month,so cheer up...we have a loving Father who see and knows the best for us.
Always trust in him,even in the most difficult situation
HE IS ABLE
MARANATHA