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| Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 12:18pm On Nov 22, 2013 |
INTRO. Was The Holy Prophet Unlettered? To an average muslim, scholars alike, the answer is YES. Some are even of the opinion that it was part of his miraculous act. But they got it all wrong. "Illiteracy": inability to Read or write. In a conventional sense, people believe that kind of a person is a 'fool or unintelligent or ignorant'. But truly that's not necessarily so. However in the case of the holy prophet, he was taught by His Lord. "Read, and your Lord is the most Generous - Who taught by Pen" ~Sura Al-Alaq ARGUMENTS TO PONDER ON! The first revelation to the holy prophet (saws) revealed the importance of being literate. The command was: "Read!(Iqra) NOT "Repeat". Another earliest sura was "al-Qalam" - The PEN. Some Mufassir (exegist of the Quran) believed this sura to be second revelation. Now you can deduce the importance of literacy from the day one of prophetic mission: "Read + PEN (write)!" Going through the book of hadith and Sirah on the account of the first revelation, Ibn Sa'd and al-Tabari agreed that when archangel Jubril appeared to Muhammad and said: "Iqra (read)"! The respond of Muhammad (saws) was "Ma iqra - 'what should I read?". Some historical accounts put the respond to be "I cannot read or write"! ; Hence, the command: "Read by The Name Of Your Lord..." QUR'AN TESTIFY TO HIS LITERACY The fact that Allah in various places in the holy Quran refer to his prophet as 'Ummi prophet (Nabiyy Ummi), millions of muslims led by scholars concluded that the holy prophet (peace be on him and his family) cannot read and write. Many Scholars often cited this verse: "Neither did you (O Muhammad) read any book before it, nor did you write any book with your right hand. In that case, indeed, the followers of falsehood might have doubted" ~Quran 29:48 The word "Ummi" has several meanings. An unlettered person is an Ummi. Likewise every person of Makkan origin is also an Ummi. Another name for Makkah is 'Umm al-Qura (mother of cities)~Quran 6:92. So, linguistically, anyone from Makkah may be called a Makkan or Ummi. However, the above ayah seem to undermine rather than strengthen the claim that the prophet (peace be on him and his family) was unlettered as people claimed. Muhammad never wrote and read any book BEFORE the Quran. This suggests that he actually wrote and read after the start of its descent. Allah confirm in his book: "A messenger from Allah, reading purified pages. In them are correct and straight laws." ~Quran 58: 2-3 "He it is Who sent among the "Ummiyyin" ones a Messenger (Muhammad SAW) from among themselves, RECITING to them His Verses, purifying them, and TEACHING them the Book and Al-Hikmah" ~Sura Jumu'a vs 2. Somebody who cannot read or write cannot refer to as above ayah (verses). Imam Bukhari confirm the Literacy of the Holy Prophet 'Ubayd Allah b. Musa - Israil - Abu Ishaq - al-Bara, may Allah be pleased with him: When the prophet, peace be upon him, intended to perform 'Umrah in the month of Dhi al-Qa'dah, the people of Makkah did not let him enter Makkah till he settled the matter with them by promising to stay in it for three days only. When they wrote the document (of treaty), they wrote: "These are the terms on which Muhammad, the Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him, agreed." They said, "We will not agree to this, for if we believed that you are the Messenger of Allah, we would not prevent you, but you are Muhammad b. 'Abd Allah." He said, "I am the Messenger of Allah and also Muhammad b. 'Abd Allah." Then, he said to 'Ali, "Rub off (the words) 'the Messenger of Allah." He ('Ali) replied, "No, by Allah, I will never rub you off." So, the Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him, took the document AND WROTE, "This is what Muhammad b. 'Abd Allah has agreed upon..." Ref: Abu 'Abd Allah Muhammad b. Ismail b. Ibrahim b. Mughirah al-Bukhari al-Ju'fi, al-Jami al-Sahih al-Mukhtasar (Beirut: Dar Ibn Kathir; 3rd edition, 1407H) [annotator: Dr. Mustafa Dib al-Bagha], vol. 2 p. 960, no. 2552. Imam Tabari in his "Tarikh al-Tabari" concluded the same version as above: "It is not proper for him (the prophet) to write but HE WROTE" |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 12:21pm On Nov 22, 2013 |
HADITH TESTIFY TO HIS LITERACY 1. "When the time of the death of Prophet approached while there were some men in the house, and among them was Umar Ibn al-Khattab, Prophet said: "Come near LET ME WRITE FOR YOU a writing after which you will never go astray." Umar said: "Prophet is seriously ill, and you have the Qur'an, so Allah's Book is sufficient for us." The people in the house differed and disputed. Some of them said, "Come near SO THAT PROPHET MAY WRITE FOR YOU a writing after which you will not go astray," while the others said what Umar said...." Ref: Sahih al Bukhari Arabic-English Volume 9 hadith no. 468 and Volume 7 hadith 573 ;Sahih Muslim Book 013, Number 4014 etc 2. "We were with Prophet, and there was a screen between the women and between us. Prophet said: Wash me with seven waterskins and bring something to write upon and an inkpot,I SHALL WRITE A DOCUMENT for you and you will never be misguided till eternity. The women said bring to Prophet what he wants. Umar said; I said to them: Keep quiet. You are like the women of Yusuf when he is ill and you shed tears, and when he is healthy you hold him by his neck. Thereupon Prophet said: They are better than you" Ref: al-Tabaqat al Kabir, Volume 2 page 305 English translation by S. Moinul Haq In these hadith, the holy prophet (saws) NEVER said "so that I can DICTATE to you". WHAT PROPHET's HOUSEHOLD SAYS: Narrated Ja’far ibn Muhammad al-Sufi: I asked Abu Ja’far Muhammad ibn Ali al-Rida (a.s), saying: “O son of the Allah’s Apostle, why was the Prophet called the Ummi?” He answered: “What do the people say?”. I said: “They claim that he was called the Ummi because he was illiterate.” He replied: “They lie! May the curse of Allah be upon them for this. Allah has clearly said in His Book: “He it is Who sent among the Ummi a Messenger from among themselves, to recite to them His Verses (i.e. the Qur’an), to purify them, to teach them the book (i.e. literacy) and to teach them wisdom (i.e. knowledge and ethics). [Qur'an 62:2].” How would he teach what he himself could not do? By Allah, Allah’s Apostle used to read and write in 72, or he said 73, languages. He was called the Ummi because he was from Makkah. Makkah is one of the mother (umm) towns, and this is why Allah the High and Exalted said: ‘So that you (Muhammad) may warn the mother (umm) town (i.e. Makkah) and whoever is round about it’.” Muhammad ibn Ali ibn al-Husayn ibn Babuyah al-Saduq, Ilal al-Sharai (Beirut, Lebanon: Muasassat al-A’lami lil Matbu’aat; first edition, 1988) vol. 1, p. 151, Chapter 105, Hadith Number 1. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 12:22pm On Nov 22, 2013 |
Wa salam alaykum |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by LagosShia: 6:51pm On Nov 22, 2013 |
I think being illiterate is one thing and being unlearned is another thing entirely. being illiterate does not mean the Prophet (sa) lacked divine knowledge and the ability to read and write.the Prophet (sa) was unschooled but could read and write by divine guidance.the same title the fourth holy Imam (as),Imam Ali Ibn al-Hussain Zainul-Abideen (as) gave his aunty, the Prophet's (sa) granddaughter, Sayyida Zainab Bint Ali (as),can be applied to the Prophet (sa) himself.he is the "the knowledgeable who is not schooled".Imam Zainul-Abideen (as),great grandson of the Prophet (sa),referred to Sayyida Zainab as "عالمة غير معلمة"/"ALIMA GHAIRA MUALLAMA". 1 Like |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 8:49pm On Nov 22, 2013 |
LagosShia: I think being illiterate is one thing and being unlearned is another thing entirely. Of course dear brother. Who want to school the holy prophet? Only His Lord. Then he was the teacher of his ahl al-bayt. Each in turn teach the next. The believe in the sunni world is that the prophet cannot read and write therefore depend on some scribes. They are even generous saying Mu'awiyah ibn sufyan was one of "scribe of revelation". Then people are given theory upon legend that even if the prophet ask you to write (since he cannot) and you make mistake he will know and correct you (miraculously). They knew its an insult to say he was an illiterate (nauthubillah) then there's a need to create legend to fill that void. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by babylolaroy(f): 9:07am On Nov 26, 2013 |
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| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 11:42am On Nov 26, 2013 |
babylolaroy: Do you subscribe he was an illiterate (nauthubillah)? |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by babylolaroy(f): 8:03pm On Nov 26, 2013 |
sincerely make ah no lie. if i were asked in a quiz maybe, i wud say he was an illiterate. Buh my intention is clear. its not to regard him as ignorant or anything of such. but now after your clarification, i subscribe to the view of the better word 'unlettered'. buh still dats wia i agree with you to. i dont agree with everyoda thing yu said....as usual nau. you know we two no dey gree on top any matter |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 10:26pm On Nov 26, 2013 |
Being illiterate is being illiterate but it is different from being innumerate or uneducated. The Prophet (SAW) was illiterate and there is a reason for that. There is no reason to revise history to that effect. However, he was numerate and educated in trade. These skills were not really important as he would eventually get divine enlightenment upon assuming Prophethood. If God teaches you, why would you need another teacher? No reason at all. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 10:49pm On Nov 26, 2013 |
maclatunji: Being illiterate is being illiterate but it is different from being innumerate or uneducated. The Prophet (SAW) was illiterate and there is a reason for that. There is no reason to revise history to that effect. Which history are u talking about Mac? Can an illiterate write a document? Its like you've zero your mind to disagree on what is crystal clear. Nobody can teach a prophet. Only prophet can teach prophet! In the case of Muhammad (saws), His Lord taught him;hence, he was called "unlettered". "...who taught man the use of Pen..."~Sura Alaq His (saws) Last Will: "...Prophet said: ... and bring something to write upon and an inkpot, I SHALL WRITE A DOCUMENT for you and you will never be misguided till eternity. The women said bring to Prophet what he wants. Umar said; I said to them: Keep quiet. You are like the women of Yusuf when he is ill and you shed tears, and when he is healthy you hold him by his neck. Thereupon Prophet said: They are better than you" Ref: al-Tabaqat al Kabir, Volume 2 page 305 Bukhari, Muslim etc |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 11:07pm On Nov 26, 2013 |
babylolaroy: sincerely make ah no lie. if i were asked in a quiz maybe, i wud say he was an illiterate. Buh my intention is clear. its not to regard him as ignorant or anything of such. but now after your clarification, i subscribe to the view of the better word 'unlettered'. buh still dats wia i agree with you to. i dont agree with everyoda thing yu said....as usual nau. you know we two no dey gree on top any matter Lol. But E be like say we don agree many times on many issues naw. Lol. Besides this has nothing to do with sectarianism so I see no reason why you can't agree in totality. Or is it because of this: "...Prophet said: ... and bring something to write upon and an inkpot, I SHALL WRITE A DOCUMENT for you and you will never be misguided till eternity. The women said bring to Prophet what he wants. Umar said; I said to them: Keep quiet. You are like the women of Yusuf when he is ill and you shed tears, and when he is healthy you hold him by his neck. Thereupon Prophet said: They are better than you" Ref: al-Tabaqat al Kabir, Volume 2 page 305 Bukhari, Muslim etc |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by Memz(f): 12:00am On Nov 27, 2013 |
Al-Baqir: |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by Memz(f): 12:03am On Nov 27, 2013 |
[quote author=Memz][/quote]may Allah guide us to the right part because am getting confuse about this illiterate issue but if he was an illiterate how was he able to right down the Quran and preach it to people? May Allah guide us. (Am seen) |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 1:05am On Nov 27, 2013 |
Al-Baqir: Figure of speech my friend. My grandmother falls into the same category. She writes several letters through her children and grandchildren. The word "write" in the hadith is figurative not literal. It is only the relatively unexposed that you can confuse with this kind of argument. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 1:12am On Nov 27, 2013 |
Excellent analysis is done here http://www.onislam.net/english/ask-the-scholar/acts-of-worship/zakah/misconceptions/169176.html People, do not be confused by people who seek to manipulate events for their own ends. Do proper research... |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 2:12am On Nov 27, 2013 |
maclatunji: You are very funny you know! The first revelation says "Read (Iqra)" and the second revelation is titled "al-qalam (the pen)". What else do u need from the Qur'an to explain to u the importance of being Literate? If the holy prophet (saws) was able to read and write, will that affect the authenticity of the Qur'an being from Allah or the greatness of Muhammad (saws)? Qur'an has spoken whoever doubt it, let them bring a sura like it! Whoever doubt it let them scrutinize it and they won't find discrepancy in it. A crystal clear hadth is presented to u with replicates abound in Bukhari and Muslim where the prophet confirmed his literacy; you said its "figurative speech". No wonder why certain sahaba accused the prophet of "delirious" and "hallucination" in the very same hadith. Here you are doing exactly the same. May Allah have mercy on your grandma! Was she anything like Muhammad? What kind of example is that Mac? You only follow conjecture or an age-long tale. No Qur'anic or hadith reference! Brother pls don't let this sectarian clash get into your intellect for this has nothing to do with it. Such a thing blind one's reasoning and heart. I will appreciate if you have a sensible reference for me. PLOTTERS REVEALED! Mu'awiyah was said to be a scribe of revelation! Uthman was said to be the compiler of the holy Qur'an after being left scattered for nearly 2 decades. May Allah shame the liars and plotters of evil thoughts. What was the existence of Muhammad based on if not Qur'an? What is the bed-rock of Islam if not the Qur'an? What is the final message of Allah and the last hope for mankind if not the Qur'an; then, how is it possible for 23years of revelation, Muhammad (saws) will not compiled what he worked, fought and labored for? How will he (saws) left Qur'an in the midst of many hypocrites warned of several times by his Lord; hypocrites of whom he did not know all their identity? Then what's the meaning of "Today I have perfected your religion for you..." What kind of Religion is being perfected with its nucleus (Qur'an) left scattered and never attended to till almost 2 decades? Umar retorted at the death-bed of Rasul (saws): "As'buh kitabullah" (BOOK OF GOD is enough)! Why calling what's being scattered and not-well-arranged "Book?" An Arab will never mistakenly used the word "kitab (book)" for a scattered piece of written bones, piece of rocks, written fibre leaves etc. All the plot of Muhammad is illiterate, cannot read or write, is simply to give accolade to certain people who were legendary scribe and compiler of Qur'an! How many liars and feeble tales have been told about the holy prophet (saws) abound in the books of hadith! May Allah guide your heart aright. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 2:25am On Nov 27, 2013 |
maclatunji: Excellent analysis is done here http://www.onislam.net/english/ask-the-scholar/acts-of-worship/zakah/misconceptions/169176.html Mac! What are you thinking? Where's your aql bro? The very first verse from your so-called link has debunked and collapse the whole write-ups: "(And thou (O Muhammad) wast not a reader of any scripture before it, nor didst thou write it with thy right hand, for then might those have doubted, who follow falsehood. ) (Al-`Ankabut 29: 48) " Allah is talking about Qur'an being truly from Himself. Had Muhammad (saws) been exposed to scripture of the past, they (people of the book and associates) would have accused him of copying their book and forged his own called "Qur'an"! "...before it, nor didst thou write it..." What does "it" refer to? The subject matter here is "it". Meaning "Qur'an". In fact this verse is even an armor tank to wipe all the assertions of your so-called Ustaz in that web-page! How has ("...wast not a reader of any scripture before it - Qur'an" and "...nor didst thou write it -Qur'an- with your hands..."  translated to "Muhammad Cannot read or write" Mac! Mac!! Mac!!! Please wake up from your slumber and ease yourself of "Al-baqir-sectarian-shi'a brouhaha" perhaps you can comprehend a simple Qur'anic verse that has been made clear to you by Allah! Free yourself from the shackle of reading to find-fault and take on the cloak of reading to understand! |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 2:50am On Nov 27, 2013 |
Memz: may Allah guide us to the right part because am getting confuse about this illiterate issue but if he was an illiterate how was he able to right down the Quran and preach it to people? May Allah guide us. (Am seen) Please ma'am! Take your time and read the article then you can follow step by step the comments and replies. I believe with your God-given intellect, Allah will guide you to the truth amidst falsehood in the cloak of truth-hood. Salam. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 5:53am On Nov 27, 2013 |
maclatunji: Twice it appears here; one by the prophet, two by the sahaba; yet to your understanding, its Figure of speech "When the time of the death of Prophet approached while there were some men in the house, and among them was Umar Ibn al-Khattab, Prophet said: "Come near LET ME WRITE FOR YOU a writing after which you will never go astray." Umar said: "Prophet is seriously ill, and you have the Qur'an, so Allah's Book is sufficient for us." The people in the house differed and disputed. Some of them said, "Come near SO THAT PROPHET MAY WRITE FOR YOU A WRITING after which you will not go astray," while the others said what Umar said...." Ref: Sahih al Bukhari Arabic-English Volume 9 hadith no. 468 and Volume 7 hadith 573 ;Sahih Muslim Book 013, Number 4014 etc |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by babylolaroy(f): 7:24am On Nov 27, 2013 |
in a lecture i heard about the death of muhammad, i think by yasir qadhi...he said" i will cause you to write...." besides i think we shouldnt debate this so that we wont fall into error. we agree together that the prophet was not 'schooled' and he was divinely taught. so why else are we dragging the English |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 8:16am On Nov 27, 2013 |
Al-Baqir: What kind of scholar bases comprehension of a write-up on its introduction rather than conclusion? In any case, that post was not meant for you but the innocent people you seek to confuse. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 8:18am On Nov 27, 2013 |
babylolaroy: in a lecture i heard about the death of muhammad, i think by yasir qadhi...he said" i will cause you to write...." Wise words, but Al-Baqir is on a mission to confuse people, this thread and its topic is only part one. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 8:23am On Nov 27, 2013 |
Al-Baqir: I am not my grandmother, yet I said she "writes" letters when she cannot actually write. A million people can say the same thing. I know where you are coming from and where you are headed with this thread. Rather shameful of you to seek to confuse people. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 11:45am On Nov 27, 2013 |
babylolaroy: in a lecture i heard about the death of muhammad, i think by yasir qadhi...he said" i will cause you to write...." Dear sister, here you are quoting Yasir Qadhi while a word-for-word quotations of sahih al-bukhari, Muslim and Tabaqat al-kubra of Ibn Sa'd are being presented to you. No ðoubt qadhi Yasir have read the hadith but choose to interpret it to mean "cause you to write" in order to be harmonize with his ideology of Muhammad (saws) cannot read and write. Just like the English translator of sahih Bukhari (Dr. Muhsin khan) try to manipulate the word "Yahjur" in the same hadith, and choose to translate it to "unconscious" instead of the real meaning "delirious". He found the word insulting being used by certain sahaba and since he's an adherent of the faith that "all sahabas were righteous"; then, he will naturally use a mild language rather than insulting one. You can clearly see how Mac's Ustaz on that web-page interpret sura Ankabut vs 48 to mean "he cannot read or write". Pls kindly study the verse, peep (if u cannot read that much) at its explanation on that web and compare with my understanding of the verse as explained to stone-cold Mac. Forget about the fact that certain companions overstep their boundary by raising their voice above that of the prophet and prevented him from writing. Why did the prophet (saws) and the sahabas unanimously used the statement: "give me pen and writing pad so I CAN WRITE A DOCUMENT..." And "...go and bring pen and paper so that the PROPHET CAN WRITE FOR US what will prevent..." respectively. These statement is not vague as Mac. Understood saying its just a figure of speech. These statements are clear. Nabi Idrees (Enoch) was the first being to display the use of pen. Who taught him? I believe Allah. Only prophets can teach respective prophets (e.g Ibrahim taught his two sons Ismail and Isaac etc). Who's there to teach Muhammad? Nobody except his Lord. I believe he was endowed with knowledge of "Read (Iqra) and Pen (Qalam)" by Allah. And can write and read. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 12:09pm On Nov 27, 2013 |
maclatunji: Lol. It is obvious you should realize you need a lot of studies on Islam. Not just dogmatic and stubborn adherence to a set of belief. No point so far! You are just talking. All your thought is that only shi'a believe Muhammad (saws) was not schooled yet could write and read? You miss the road! That's why I said do not let the hatred of ....blind you. Search "Was Muhammad an illiterate?". No doubt you will see varieties if only you can read and open your heart. You will discover great defence of many Sunni to prove the prophet can read and write. maclatunji: Since the beginning of the world has the Lord and Satan (in the robe of God) invite to their respective path. So why will this age be different? The fact that we have no prophet in person amongst us to guide, Allah has been so merciful that our intellectual power is more developed than our predecessors thereby whenever evil whispers and Allah also whispers, with Du'a, we will be able to recognize the true path unless you set a lock to your heart. You see many scholars interpreting "He frown and turned away..." to mean prophet despite Qur'an (early verses before Abasa) declare: "Indeed you (O muhammad) are of the most exalted character". "They have eyes yet cannot see; they have heart yet cannot perceive; they are like cattles. Nah! Worst than cattle" |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by maclatunji: 12:31pm On Nov 27, 2013 |
^#Yawns. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by lanrexlan(m): 4:46pm On Nov 27, 2013 |
Salam Al-Baqir,can you kindly please explain this verse of the Quran? Surah Ar-Araf 7:157 -Those who follow the Messenger,the Prophet who can neither read nor write whom they find written with them in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel) -he commands them for Al-Ma'ruf (i.e. Islamic Monotheism and all that Islam has ordained);and forbids them from Al-Munkar (i.e. disbelief,polytheism of all kinds,and all that Islam has forbidden);he allows them as lawful At-Taiyibat [(i.e. all good and lawful) as regards things,deeds,beliefs,persons, foods, etc.],and prohibits them as unlawful Al-Khaba'ith (i.e. all evil and unlawful as regards things,deeds,beliefs,persons, foods, etc.),he releases them from their heavy burdens (of Allah's Covenant), and from the fetters (bindings) that were upon them.So those who believe in him (Muhammad SAW),honour him,help him,and follow the light (the Quran) which has been sent down with him, it is they who will be successful. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by babylolaroy(f): 8:05pm On Nov 27, 2013 |
hmn...its good to know the Qur'an o...al baqir fi bread komi lomi obe je. Even if thats not express enough, why must we debate his state of 'illiteracy'. He simply was a man who didnt learn to read or write buh was taught divinely to recite the Quran as revealed |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by kaybyte: 7:36am On Nov 28, 2013 |
Al-Baqir:this guy sef! Nawa ooo. Why is that anytime you are posting, you will divert to trying to dicredit the companions of the prophets and go ahead to tell us how people hate ahlul bayt. Please stop all this and free your mind off this. Salam |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 9:17am On Nov 28, 2013 |
lanrexlan: Salam Al-Baqir,can you kindly please explain this verse of the Quran? Salam dear brother, The arabic word used in this verse is "Nabiyyil UMMIY" meaning "UMMI prophet". Ummi has various meaning: 1. Mother 2. Gentile (one who haven't read Torah before) 3. Unlettered or Illiterate. THE ARABIC WORD USED The exact word used in the holy Qur'an is "UMMY" (pl. UMMIYIN). Going through many English translated Qur'an, you see "illiterate" or "Unlettered" etc. Is that the only meaning for Ummi?. In the Qur'an, it means "GENTILE" or "ONE WHO IS NOT PRIMARILY FAMILIAR WITH A LAW (apparently Moses's Law). Ref: Edward Lanes Lexicon explain this in detail (vol. 1) Difft translation: 1. Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation (Araf vs 157): "Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel, ..." 2. Shakir Translation: "Those who follow the Messenger-Prophet, the Ummi, whom they find written down with them in the Taurat and the Injeel 3. Sahih Int'l "Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel,..." 4. Arberry translation: "those who follow the Messenger, 'the Prophet of the common folk, whom they find written down with them in the Torah and the Gospel,..." 5. Mohsin Khan "Those who follow the Messenger, the Prophet who can neither read nor write (i.e.Muhammad SAW) whom they find written with them in the Taurat (Torah)..." Ref: corpus.quran.com/translation.jsp?chapter=7&verse=157 You can clearly see different translators with different usage of the meaning of "Ummi". 1. Do not limit yourself to one translation if you cannot handle Arabic yourself. 2. Kindly ask yourself why have some translators opted for the meaning "Illiterate" while others choose the word "ummi" in its arabic form and yet some used "common folk" and some "gentile"etc? Please kindly find time and read my thread (if you haven't ) and then search on the internet different thought of different scholars and groups on the literacy of Muhammad esp on the usage of "ummi" as expressed in the holy Qur'an. Why do some choose to use the word "illiterate or unlettered" and not Gentile? In sura Jumu'ah vs 2, Allah says: "He it is who has sent to the Ummiyin, a messenger..." Here the same "ummi" is used but in a plural form "ummiyin". Some translators used the word "unlettered or illiterates" and some used the word "Gentile". Which one make sense and compatible with the context of the Qur'an? If you said "illiterates" is best used in sura Jumua vs 2 above; then, the question is were the Arabs in general or Quraysh in particular from whom Allah raised a prophet, were they altogether unable to read and write? But using the word "gentile" gave the true meaning in that they were not familiar with the Torah. Likewise the holy prophet (saws) has never been taught by anybody the Torah nor has he been a reader of Torah before Qur'an revelation which the Jews might confronted him that he copied to forge his own Qur'an. Thanks |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 9:50am On Nov 28, 2013 |
kaybyte: this guy sef! Nawa ooo.Were you not the one that accused me of "talking non-sense" on salatil Fatih? I actually waited for your reply but you choose not to for a reason best known to you. Sorry if I mistakenly accused you. kaybyte: this guy sef! Nawa ooo. Why is that anytime you are posting, you will divert to trying to dicredit the companions of the prophets However, as per your assertions here. Islam has 3 source of extracting knowledge: Qur'an, hadith and Tarikh or seerah (history). All the three conform that the sahabas of the holy prophet (saws) were divided into various groups. 1. Some were devouted, sincere, steadfast both during and after the life of Rasul. 2. Some were like the first but renegade after prophet's demise 3. Some were open Munafiq (hypocrites) 4. Some were hidden Munafiq only known to Allah (Q.9 vs 101). Haven't you read they planned assassination attempt on the prophet? And most of these Munafiq survived after the demise of the prophet and managed to get one post or the other in Islam. So tell me why should I stupidly believe that ALL of them were righteous? Why won't I do a thorough research on them to know who is who? After all believing in the sahaba is never part of an article of faith. Many lies about the holy prophet abound in some of the so-called valuable books yet muslims keep on buying the bait saying "sahih" sahih". Nobody questions! But the moment you talk about the evil ways of some sahaba, you have committed a grave sin in your thought. kaybyte: . ...and go ahead to tell us how people hate ahlul bayt. Please stop all this and free your mind off this. Salam AHL AL-BAYT! Truly ask yourself what you know about ahl al-bayt? Those dubbed as "ark of Noah in which if you enter, you are saved..."; Those in which if you pray and did not salute them in your prayers, your salat is null and void! Those in which if you salute the prophet alone and left them out, your salawat is batil (false). These are not Shi'a claims: it is right there in your sunni books but your scholars choose to sweep them under carpet. Do you know what happened to them? 1. Ali was murdered 2. Fatima was murdered (Miscarage) after being denied of her rights 3. Hassan was poisoned 4. Hussain was brutally butchered along with 72members of prophet's ahl al-bayt with friends and associates. That's summary of how muslim community treated the ahl al-bayt of their prophet. The question still remain what do you know about them? Salam. |
| Re: Was The Holy Prophet (saws) Unlettered? by AlBaqir(m): 10:55am On Nov 28, 2013 |
babylolaroy: hmn...its good to know the Qur'an o...al baqir fi bread komi lomi obe je. You see I always appreciate a healthy discussion where both party truly open their heart. Where did I fi bread ko e lobe je? I gave u an assignment, you didn't share your thought rather you choose to divert and accused me of "fi bread ko e lobe je". Lol. E be loke say u wan chop agege bread. Lol babylolaroy: Even if thats not express enough, why must we debate his state of 'illiteracy'. Good question! If you've ever study Arabic Qur'an deeply, you will agree with me its more than just recitation and memorization. The use of language, grammatical expression, figure of speech never heard of by the then Arabs abound in it. We must clarify his literacy/illiteracy issue: 1. Because Qur'an laid emphasis on the importance of being literate (read + pen) 2. It is important for Rasul to write down (apart from memorizing and engraving in the heart) what his Lord revealed to him. Kindly read this: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Quran Shia doesn't believe in the theory and fallacy that the holy prophet (saws) left Quran scattered, unarranged and uncompiled until a certain sahaba suggested that Qur'an should be arranged and compiled after nearly 2 decades of the demise of the holy prophet (saws). Now you see how history asserted that different copies of the Qur'an with grammatical errors, different readings and writting, abound at difft places of Arabia until Uthman standaradized it and approved only one version. What kind of history is this? What kind of prophet (nauthubillah) was history tried to portray to us? A prophet sent solely for the purpose of the revelation of the Qur'an revealed for 23years yet left the qur'an un-attended to, scattered here and there with diFferent version ranging from one sahaba to another? Sunni traditions says it got worst to the fact that Aisha claimed that a goat entered her house and ate certain suras kept under her bed. Sahih bukhari even claimed prophet forgot certain verses until he heard one sahaba reciting it and he said "you remind me of this verse which I forgot"(nauthubillah). These are grave historical lies. All to one point: that Muhammad cannot write thereby left the writing at the hands of some scribes (among whom were hypocrites, some were even kids) and he (saws) did not compiled it until Uthman did the yeoman's job. babylolaroy: He simply was a man who didnt learn to read or write buh was taught divinely to recite the Quran as revealed Who dare to teach teacher of all teachers, Muhammad? Only prophets can teach themselves and since he was the greatest among the prophets, his Lord is his teacher. If Nabi Idrees (a.s) could be reported to have been the first to display the use of pen and reading taught by his Lord, why do you find it difficult to believe Allah taught his beloved Muhammad how to read and write? Haven't you read sura Alaq? "He who taught (the use of) pen" History never recorded a teacher for him! And naturally his pride family will find teacher for him if they ever suspected he cannot read and write just like ordinary sane people send their kids to school at early age. No single Qur'anic verse or hadith gave impression he was an illiterate; infact, all prove to the contrary, yet you choose to follow what lagbaja says etc. |
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