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All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. - Religion - Nairaland

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All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 8:51am On Nov 23, 2013
As the war against homosexuality keeps raging in the country partly due to religion and our culture, liberals and secularists are quick to point out these salient points why homosexuality should be legalized.

1. It is between two consenting partners

2. The activities are done in private

3. Their activity does not in anyway pose harm to any other.

4. Both partners are adults.

Going by the above reasons, there is hardly any reason why inc.est shouldn't be allowed if it is between two consenting partners, the activities are done in private, both are adults and of course, the activities pose no harm to any other.

Why then do we all see inc.est as bad and not homosexuality when the same reasons used to back up homosexuality can be used to back inc.est.

Your views and opinions are highly welcome.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by ezme(m): 9:52am On Nov 23, 2013
subscribing
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 10:04am On Nov 23, 2013
ezme: subscribing

I'm also patiently waiting for the big guns. Plaetton, manfrommars, logicboy, Mr Troll, Uyi, Jaleel, alfa seltzer, pagan 9ja, macof and the likes
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by ezme(m): 10:16am On Nov 23, 2013
Do you realize you have only made general statements and have not stated clearly the arguments which are used to support homosexuality that can also stand for Inbreeding?
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by macof(m): 10:19am On Nov 23, 2013
Abraham married his sister
Nahor(Abraham's bro) married Haran's(another bro) daughter

Isaac married Nahor's daughter
Jacob married Laban's(son of Nahor) daughters(two sisters)

Judah married his sons wife

So let me see Christians condemn the above people first.

As for homos, Jesus was more gay than straight
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 10:22am On Nov 23, 2013
ezme: Do you realize you have only made general statements and have not stated clearly the arguments which are used to support homosexuality that can also stand for Inbreeding?
How about these ones?


1. It is between two consenting partners
2. The activities are done in private
3. Their activity does not in anyway pose harm to
any other.
4. Both partners are adults.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 10:24am On Nov 23, 2013
macof: Abraham married his sister
Nahor(Abraham's bro) married Haran's(another bro) daughter

Isaac married Nahor's daughter
Jacob married Laban's(son of Nahor) daughters(two sisters)

Judah married his sons wife

So let me see Christians condemn the above people first.

As for homos, Jesus was more gay than straight


Lol, I deliberately decided not to involve christians. I'm aware few of them may have tangible things to say but majority are just going to come here to demonstrate their folly. Let's just leave them out of this.

So, in your opinion, do you see anything wrong in ince.st? If yes, why?
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by Nobody: 10:51am On Nov 23, 2013
I suppose it has some biological implications... limits the gene pools or something like that if you're considering raising kids also.

Beyond that, I really can't say. I guess the same arguments that work for homosexuality also work for Inbreeding. Personally, I wouldn't want a family member involved in that.


And yeah, let's not make this about what Christians think.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by Nobody: 10:55am On Nov 23, 2013
The main issue against inbreeding is the moro.nic. And deformed offsprings that csn come out of such relationships.......


Also, there is the issue of laziness and child abuse within family....mother poking the young son and also it shows that the inbreeders are too lazy to look out of their family to fawk.



However, what if a bro and sister who are both adults have sex with conraception? What next? Are we really going to arrest them?




As disgusting Inbreeding is, i dont think that it should bé a punishable offenmse that someone goes to jail for. Except in the case where the incestous couple brings in a deformed baby and then tries to dump the baby in an orphanage or institution- they should face the responsibilty.

1 Like

Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:16am On Nov 23, 2013
aManFromMars: I suppose it has some biological implications... limits the gene pools or something like that if you're considering raising kids also.

Beyond that, I really can't say. I guess the same arguments that work for homosexuality also work for Inbreeding. Personally, I wouldn't want a family member involved in that.


And yeah, let's not make this about what Christians think.

That means if there are no considerations for raising kids, like they are just in it for the sex, you have nothing against it.

Still, according to you, you said you wouldn't want a family member involved in it. Don't u think that might be due to some cultural bias or some form of childhood religious indoctrination coming to play.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:20am On Nov 23, 2013
Logicboy03: The main issue against inbreeding is the moro.nic. And deformed offsprings that csn come out of such relationships.......


Also, there is the issue of laziness and child abuse within family....mother poking the young son and also it shows that the inbreeders are too lazy to look out of their family to fawk.



However, what if a bro and sister who are both adults have sex with conraception? What next? Are we really going to arrest them?




As disgusting Inbreeding is, i dont think that it should bé a punishable offenmse that someone goes to jail for. Except in the case where the incestous couple brings in a deformed baby and then tries to dump the baby in an orphanage or institution- they should face the responsibilty.

Good one bro. But I need you to clarify a few things before I reply. Do you consider homosexuality disgusting as you consider ince.st?
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by macof(m): 11:29am On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:

Lol, I deliberately decided not to involve christians. I'm aware few of them may have tangible things to say but majority are just going to come here to demonstrate their folly. Let's just leave them out of this.

So, in your opinion, do you see anything wrong in ince.st? If yes, why?

U right it shouldn't be about any religion but I just wanted to point that out so Christians can shouldn't just come and start condemning

Personally I don't like Inbreeding. As a spiritualist I believe it's bad for soul because it isn't part of Yoruba customs

But communities have different laws and tradition
I heard inbreeding was cool in ancient China
And still happens in Niger
If the community has nothing against it, no one should condemn the people.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by UyiIredia(m): 11:31am On Nov 23, 2013
Like monogamy, society has brainwashed us into thinking inc£$t is wrong. That said, inc€$t, paedophilia, and polygamy and are favourite picks (also extensible to serial killers) I would gladly use in a debate on same-sex marriage (thereafter SSM) when their supporters draw parallels with inter-racial marriage. The poser is simple, why would they consider thoughts against their position discriminatory and not consider their stances, easily presumably negative, against other deviancies not discriminatory. The reason is simple, to show that if a thing is deemed evil then 'discriminating' against it would be in good stead except it is deemed good. Just to make it clear, I think being gay's immoral and I'm against gay marriage.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by UyiIredia(m): 11:36am On Nov 23, 2013
That said, believe it or not, there are a number of inc€$t affairs, consensual inc€$t affairs in the world, and in Nigeria, especially, as I hear, in the North. It so happens an aunt of mine works with a lady who confessed to being in one, in fact, the father of the lady chased her mum out after the mum forced her daughter to abort a pregnancy she had for her Dad. It took me aback hearing it.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:37am On Nov 23, 2013
macof:

U right it shouldn't be about any religion but I just wanted to point that out so Christians can shouldn't just come and start condemning

Personally I don't like Inbreeding. As a spiritualist I believe it's bad for soul.

But communities have different laws and tradition
I heard inbreeding was cool in ancient China
And still happens in Niger
If the community has nothing against it, no one should condemn the people.

Good one bro. But I have a question for you. As a spiritualist, is homosexuality also bad for the soul?
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by Nobody: 11:44am On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:
That means if there are no considerations for raising kids, like they are just in it for the sex, you have nothing against it.
Yeah. Understand that our sense of what is right or wrong is down to prevailing circumstances.

rationalmind:
Still, according to you, you said you wouldn't want a family member involved in it. Don't u think that might be due to some cultural bias or some form of childhood religious indoctrination coming to play.
Yeah, my views are probably influenced by them. Inbreeding is unheard of and considered a taboo where I'm from.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:45am On Nov 23, 2013
Uyi Iredia: Like monogamy, society has brainwashed us into thinking inc£$t is wrong. That said, inc€$t, paedophilia, and polygamy and are favourite picks (also extensible to serial killers) I would gladly use in a debate on same-sex marriage (thereafter SSM) when their supporters draw parallels with inter-racial marriage. The poser is simple, why would they consider thoughts against their position discriminatory and not consider their stances, easily presumably negative, against other deviancies not discriminatory. The reason is simple, to show that if a thing is deemed evil then 'discriminating' against it would be in good stead except it is deemed good. Just to make it clear, I think being gay's immoral and I'm against gay marriage.

Hmmm. I recently read a book tittled "gay manifesto" (I no be gay o, I just read it out of curiosity). Can't really remb the name of the author. The author was arguing that, there are people who are naturally born gays. They are from birth naturally attracted to same se.x. How would you consider it immoral then when its just their genes at work just as your genes are at work thereby making you heterosexual.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by Nobody: 11:46am On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:

Good one bro. But I have a question for you. As a spiritualist, is homosexuality also bad for the soul?

This is from a thread I opened earlier.

So I've been thinking a lot about homosexuality these past few hours.

Let's be clear: I do not detest homosexuality. I'm just indifferent to it.This might partly be due to the fact that I've never met a homosexual in real life.

That being said, the homosexuals on NL have done a good job so far in throwing more light on the issue and for that, I say a big kudos to y'all..


So these are the thoughts that have been going through my mind.

The general Christian belief is that we're all souls in containers. These containers are our physical bodies. So in a sense, these physical bodies are what associates us to any gender. In some cases, people can choose to change them if they do not feel comfortable in them.

In essence, what this would mean is that our real 'self/soul' has no gender.

According to Christianity, God is LOVE and a spirit. I could go further to say that love itself is spiritual, attraction between two souls. Is it possible that love goes just beyond our physical containers, beyond how we perceive each other, basically attraction between our 'real selves'?
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:47am On Nov 23, 2013
Uyi Iredia: That said, believe it or not, there are a number of inc€$t affairs, consensual inc€$t affairs in the world, and in Nigeria, especially, as I hear, in the North. It so happens an aunt of mine works with a lady who confessed to being in one, in fact, the father of the lady chased her mum out after the mum forced her daughter to abort a pregnancy she had for her Dad. It took me aback hearing it.

Hehehehe, grin grin quite hilarious. The man really wanted her to leave the baby?
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:48am On Nov 23, 2013
aManFromMars:
Yeah. Understand that our sense of what is right or wrong is down to prevailing circumstances.


Yeah, my views are probably influenced by them. Inbreeding is unheard of and considered a taboo where I'm from.

cheesy cheesy
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 11:55am On Nov 23, 2013
aManFromMars:

This is from a thread I opened earlier.


Can I get the link to the thread please? Your hypothesis there applies to ince.st as well.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by Nobody: 11:59am On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:

Can I get the link to the thread please? Your hypothesis there applies to ince.st as well.

Go through my profile. On mobile now and could be quite tedious. tongue
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by UyiIredia(m): 12:03pm On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:

Hmmm. I recently read a book about tittled "gay manifesto" (I no be gay o, I just read it out of curiosity). Can't really remb the name of the author. The author was arguing that, there are people who are naturally born gays. They are from birth naturally attracted to same se.x. How would you consider it immoral then when its just their genes at work just as your genes are at work thereby making you heterosexual.

This reminds me of Van Vickers naïve argument that being gay is okay because it's genetic. My rebuttal to this is on two fronts:

1) Being gay is not entirely genetic, there is some level of plasticity to be found.

2) A genetic trait is poor grounds to makesomething moral

From the second I argued that psychiatric disorders are known to have a genetic basis. That doesn't make them okay. Even serial killing, which Van Vickers pathetically attempted to deny. Serial killers are known to have an MRI scan different fromthe average when looking at a horrific murder scene. Specifically, their limbic system, isn't as active, which suggests apathy, because the limbic system mediates for emotional response.

I can understand people are naturally born gays but that won't make it right. The same ways they are many birthed traits (physical or mental/behavioural) which are deemed bad.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by UyiIredia(m): 12:04pm On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:

Hehehehe, grin grin quite hilarious. The man really wanted her to leave the baby?

Yeah ! Same with his daughter. And his wife knew.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 12:12pm On Nov 23, 2013
aManFromMars:

Go through my profile. On mobile now and could be quite tedious. tongue

K bro smiley
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by macof(m): 12:15pm On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:

Good one bro. But I have a question for you. As a spiritualist, is homosexuality also bad for the soul?

YES and No

Yes because where iam from it is unheard of, in all of yorubaland homosexuality and inbreeding isn't encouraged

No because where one thing is bad, it could be good in somewhere else,
In America homosexuality is cool and even some are initiated into Ifa.

So it's not my spirituality dat is against It, it's my ethnicity dat is.

when growing up, there are things that u perceive as right and wrong due to ur community, and dat becomes part of ur consciousness(Ori) as a taboo, when u go against these rules it damages ur consciousness and affects ur soul.

1 Like

Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 12:19pm On Nov 23, 2013
Uyi Iredia:

This reminds me of Van Vickers naïve argument that being gay is okay because it's genetic. My rebuttal to this is on two fronts:

1) Being gay is not entirely genetic, there is some level of plasticity to be found.

2) A genetic trait is poor grounds to makesomething moral

From the second I argued that psychiatric disorders are known to have a genetic basis. That doesn't make them okay. Even serial killing, which Van Vickers pathetically attempted to deny. Serial killers are known to have an MRI scan different fromthe average when looking at a horrific murder scene. Specifically, their limbic system, isn't as active, which suggests apathy, because the limbic system mediates for emotional response.

I can understand people are naturally born gays but that won't make it right. The same ways they are many birthed traits (physical or mental/behavioural) which are deemed bad.

I get your point bro. Thanks for the input
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 12:32pm On Nov 23, 2013
macof:

YES and No

Yes because where iam from it is unheard of, in all of yorubaland homosexuality and inbreeding isn't encouraged

No because where one thing is bad, it could be good in somewhere else,
In America homosexuality is cool and even some are initiated into Ifa.

So it's not my spirituality dat is against It, it's my ethnicity dat is.

when growing up, there are things that u perceive as right and wrong due to ur community, and dat becomes part of ur consciousness(Ori) as a taboo, when u go against these rules it damages ur consciousness and affects ur soul.


The bolded is what I don't think I fully agree with bro. While growing up, there are certain things considered right and wrong in our community that We've grown to consider as superstition and we easily go against them. A very good example is this idea that when your father dies as an igbo, it is wrong and a taboo to eat at any other burial ceremony until the burial ceremony of your father has been conducted.

Same applies for ince.st or homosexuality, I don't think I agree that going against them on the basis of community acceptance while one was young is damaging to the soul (if there's any) since many of those stuffs are either just superstitious or ancient and worn out beliefs.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by Beretta92(m): 12:37pm On Nov 23, 2013
Although I find homosexuality disgusting,am not against gays.Provided they don't bother me in any way,they can do their thing.Inbreeding however is something I find so rancid and unthinkable.Yeah,no doubt society and culture has greatly influenced this,but while growing up I never needed anybody to tell me it wasn't right.I couldn't even think it.The first case of Inbreeding I heard about was as marvelling as it was apalling.Also,as other posters have noted,I learnt that kids born from inbreeding are genetically impaired.So,am against Inbreeding but I admit the cultural bias.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 12:54pm On Nov 23, 2013
Beretta92: Although I find homosexuality disgusting, am not against gays. Provided they don't bother me in any way,they can do their thing.Inbreeding however is something I find so rancid and unthinkable. Yeah,no doubt society and culture has greatly influenced this,but while growing up I never needed anybody to tell me it wasn't right.I couldn't even think it.The first case of Inbreeding I heard about was as marvelling as it was apalling.Also,as other posters have noted,I learnt that kids born from inbreeding are genetically impaired.So,am against Inbreeding but I admit the cultural bias.

Nice one bro. Same thing applies to me and manfrommars admitted to the same. I think its just some form of cultural bias. Nothing more, nothing less.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by ezme(m): 12:55pm On Nov 23, 2013
rationalmind:
How about these ones?


1. It is between two consenting partners
2. The activities are done in private
3. Their activity does not in anyway pose harm to
any other.
4. Both partners are adults.

rationalmind: As the war against homosexuality keeps raging in the country partly due to religion and our culture, liberals and secularists are quick to point out these salient points why homosexuality should be legalized.

1. It is between two consenting partners

2. The activities are done in private

3. Their activity does not in anyway pose harm to any other.

4. Both partners are adults.

Going by the above reasons, there is hardly any reason why inc.est shouldn't be allowed if it is between two consenting partners, the activities are done in private, both are adults and of course, the activities pose no harm to any other.


Why then do we all see inc.est as bad and not homosexuality when the same reasons used to back up homosexuality can be used to back inc.est.

Your views and opinions are highly welcome.

I needed you to come from the medical angle to back up the "bolded" assertions, especially the last clause.
Re: All Atheists, Agnostics And Pagans. Let's Discuss Ince.st. by rationalmind(m): 12:57pm On Nov 23, 2013
aManFromMars:

Go through my profile. On mobile now and could be quite tedious. tongue

Went through the thread. Those religious folks were just derailing. Same reason I never wanted them here.

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