What the

Haaa! Abeg o! I no do Engineering o! Na Urban and Regional Planner i be o! Make una wey dey explain these things take am easy o

lomomike: Haaa! Abeg o! I no do Engineering o! Na Urban and Regional Planner i be o! Make una wey dey explain these things take am easy o

No vex. I am of the believe that if your audience can't understand you then you then whatever you said is nonsense.

Track is smart but he doesn't explain for everyone to understand so i did my best to get everyone involved (this is a public forum). If you read your ss3 physics book you will find everything i explain there.

icemann:

No vex. I am of the believe that if your audience can't understand you then you then whatever you said is nonsense.

Track is smart but he doesn't explain for everyone to understand so i did my best to get everyone involved (this is a public forum). If you read your ss3 physics book you will find everything i explain there.

I agree.

This is not an engineering forum.

Somorin#1:


I agree.

This is not an engineering forum.

I have said this before, but Trac wouldn't understand.

Ikenna

gbonsalifus:

A turbocharged or supercharged engine is more economical than a non turbocharged one. Now, the problem is with the definition of fuel economy and fuel efficiency.
Auto enthusiasts use the two expressions interchangeably but in engineering, there is a little difference. While Economy puts the cost/price of achieving the output into consideration, efficiency only considers the unit ratio of input to output of a particular system like 'fuel' for example. Can't say it all here, I should write about this on my blog soon.
for those who can comprehend, consider a Nissan GTR vs Audi R8. Also, a Bugatti Veyron vs Koenniseg Agera in relation to this topic Efficiency vs economy'.
Chech out 101carsense..com soon for a detailed talk.

For anyone to say turbo engine is more economical to run than NA engine is laughable. Sometimes, you guys really need to drop those your books and get practical.

Back then in Awka, our Peugeot 504 GL propeller shaft failed and also damaged the input spline of the rear differential. While a mechanic was replacing them, a friend came, who was in 400 level, Mechanical Engineering. He pointed at a long pipe and asked me what it was. I told him it was Propeller Shaft. The guy said no, that i was wrong. That it wouldn't be the propeller shaft of the car. I asked why would he say so. He said the drawings of propeller shaft in his books all had fan on one end and bla bla bla. Even when he left, the mechanic who was silent and looked confused all those while the argument was going on asked me " So, is this what they teach you guys in Schools?"

Before, Peugeot turbo engines suffered from cracked cylinder heads, compared to their NA engines. I don't know if the problem has been corrected in their modern turbo engines.

Generally, cost of running turbo engine is higher than that of Naturally Aspirited engine, of the same number of cylinders.

Ikenna.

Ikenna351:

For anyone to say turbo engine is more economical to run than NA engine is laughable. Sometimes, you guys really need to drop those your books and get practical.

Back then in Awka, our Peugeot 504 GL propeller shaft failed and also damaged the input spline of the rear differential. While a mechanic was replacing them, a friend came, who was in 400 level, Mechanical Engineering. He pointed at a long pipe and asked me what it was. I told him it was Propeller Shaft. The guy said no, that i was wrong. That it wouldn't be the propeller shaft of the car. I asked why would he say so. He said the drawings of propeller shaft in his books all had fan on one end and bla bla bla. Even when he left, the mechanic who was silent and looked confused all those while the argument was going on asked me " So, is this what they teach you guys in Schools?"

Before, Peugeot turbo engines suffered from cracked cylinder heads, compared to their NA engines. I don't know if the problem has been corrected in their modern turbo engines.

Generally, cost of running turbo engine is higher than that of Naturally Aspirited engine, of the same number of cylinders.

Ikenna.

Boss, I think what he's trying to say is that turbocharged engine is more efficient than an NA engine( more power from same displacement) Yes, turbocharged is more expensive to build and requires more plumbings than an NA engine.
With advances in technology and reliability, most turbocharged engines require little to no maintenance than a non turbocharged one.

Ikenna351:

For anyone to say turbo engine is more economical to run than NA engine is laughable. Sometimes, you guys really need to drop those your books and get practical.

Really. So you are saying dropping our books would do more good for us? You keep saying Turbo engines are not economical please prove with a logical explanation, otherwise stay silent and accept a worldwide proven fact.

Ikenna351:

Back then in Awka, our Peugeot 504 GL propeller shaft failed and also damaged the input spline of the rear differential. While a mechanic was replacing them, a friend came, who was in 400 level, Mechanical Engineering. He pointed at a long pipe and asked me what it was. I told him it was Propeller Shaft. The guy said no, that i was wrong. That it wouldn't be the propeller shaft of the car. I asked why would he say so. He said the drawings of propeller shaft in his books all had fan on one end and bla bla bla. Even when he left, the mechanic who was silent and looked confused all those while the argument was going on asked me " So, is this what they teach you guys in Schools?"
Before, Peugeot turbo engines suffered from cracked cylinder heads, compared to their NA engines. I don't know if the problem has been corrected in their modern turbo engines.
Generally, cost of running turbo engine is higher than that of Naturally Aspirited engine, of the same number of cylinders.
Ikenna.

He was trying to describe a propeller(hence talking of the blades)and something else you called "bla bla bla" .

I noticed in most replies you keep referencing your 504 or 505 and most times you are fixing it or having some one fix it. Its say a lot about how unreliable that car is. So with all this "i am fixing my car" memories/incidences you still stuck with Peugeot and the disappointments it has given you?

Like i always say " No matter how you see it ever fan is a sucker"

Somorin#1:


I agree.

This is not an engineering forum.

But we can't neglect the Engineering part of any car conversation and still have a meaningful conversation. We can simplify it at much as possible (detail explanation on a secondary school level) so every one can participate and learn.

icemann:

But we can't neglect the Engineering part of any car conversation and still have a meaningful conversation. We can simplify it at much as possible (detail explanation on a secondary school level) so every one can participate and learn.

Of course not, but you are missing the point.

I know it's long forgotten now but the OPs first question was "what exactly is a turbo charged engine?".

An engineering answer would be lost to an OP that asks this question and especially on this forum. IMHO.

It's like a 4 year old asking his Mom where did the eggs for breakfast come from.

Mom can answer (1) from the grocery store or (2) she can start from the farm where the mating took place, the biology involved in making the egg, the farmers delivery and marketing strategy to get it to the store, etc

This is supposed to be an educative forum, not a place to grandstand.

icemann:

Really. So you are saying dropping our books would do more good for us? You keep saying Turbo engines are not economical please prove with a logical explanation, otherwise stay silent and accept a worldwide proven fact.




He was trying to describe a propeller(hence talking of the blades)and something else you called "bla bla bla" .

I noticed in most replies you keep referencing your 504 or 505 and most times you are fixing it or having some one fix it. Its say a lot about how unreliable that car is. So with all this "i am fixing my car" memories/incidences you still stuck with Peugeot and the disappointments it has given you?

Like i always say " No matter how you see it ever fan is a sucker"

Some of us that are non posers and are autoist to the core appreciates someone that is maintaining a 504/404 instead of buying the latest plastic crap from Korea.

Just saying.

Kudos to Ikenna for sharing his automotive accomplishment. Some of us love reading them and appreciates what is involved in the hobby.

Can any one give a quote on the cost of replacing a turbo?

And compare price of turbo engine to fuel savings, how long to break even

sultaan: Can any one give a quote on the cost of replacing a turbo?

And compare price of turbo engine to fuel savings, how long to break even

As an example, not in Nigeria but $190.00 shipped on eBay.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/K03-Replacement-Turbocharger-Turbo-1-8L-for-Passat-and-A4-w-Gaskets-Studs-/231107249991?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35cf10c747&vxp=mtr

Cost to install is free for me, it's a simple bolt off and bolt back on accessory just like an alternator or starter.

You chaps really need to start working on your own cars at home. Break even cost fades away the first time you go into boost and the bov gives a salute.

Also, it's a repairable unit. Usually it's the bearing that goes that allows play in the shaft.

Never knew they were that cheap

sultaan: Never knew they were that cheap

[img]http://www.dnamotoring.com/crc/listings/TBK-12PC-T04E-63+TM-D-C+DP.jpg[/img]
Here's a complete kit for $490.00 shipped for a Honda Civic, Dek Sol.

A savvy buyer will give proper attention to this statement by the seller "*No instruction included and Modification such as welding may be needed
Professional Installation is highly recommended*"

Even after you hang the bits you will still need to deal with the ecu.

When well tuned, proper octane, etc a Civic can easily make up to 300 horsepower (I will yield that you need to have a strong engine to start with).

Did someone say NOS? lol

Somorin#1:


[img]http://www.dnamotoring.com/crc/listings/TBK-12PC-T04E-63+TM-D-C+DP.jpg[/img]
Here's a complete kit for $490.00 shipped for a Honda Civic, Dek Sol.

A savvy buyer will give proper attention to this statement by the seller "*No instruction included and Modification such as welding may be needed
Professional Installation is highly recommended*"

Even after you hang the bits you will still need to deal with the ecu.

When well tuned, proper octane, etc a Civic can easily make up to 300 horsepower (I will yield that you need to have a strong engine to start with).

Did someone say NOS? lol

Bro, it's not that easy . I remenber wanting to turbocharge my 95 maxima 6 years ago and it was such a headache.
Those ebay parts are not reliable, no shop would advice you to buy ebay turbo kit.
Let's say you decide to go all in. You need to consider some of these points.
1> Low mileage engine is preferable because of strong internals
2>. Lots of moving things around in the engine bay to make space . The plumbing involved is a lot. Small displacement engines like the 92-97 civic hatch back was favorites among my boys. ( lots of room in the engine)
3> injectors, remapping and tuning the ECU. Reliability . Reliability is very scary with those ebay parts. I remenber my boy turboed his Acura TSX and 3 weeks later, the turbo was gone.

It's not a cheap adventure . But a rewarding one . I would rather buy an OEM turbocharged car than going my own turbo route unless I have lots of cash to burn .
You can get decent power from updating exhaust , headers, intake , pulleys, CAMS , chip. Little power here and there and it adds up .

icemann:

Really. So you are saying dropping our books would do more good for us? You keep saying Turbo engines are not economical please prove with a logical explanation, otherwise stay silent and accept a worldwide proven fact.




He was trying to describe a propeller(hence talking of the blades)and something else you called "bla bla bla" .

I noticed in most replies you keep referencing your 504 or 505 and most times you are fixing it or having some one fix it. Its say a lot about how unreliable that car is. So with all this "i am fixing my car" memories/incidences you still stuck with Peugeot and the disappointments it has given you?

Like i always say " No matter how you see it ever fan is a sucker"

It's no longer a car anymore . It's your child. There is a certain connection you have with the car . It's becomes a part of you.
My maxima is 2002 6 speed . I have driven around the US and Canada in that car(40,000km last year) . Most of the things I do to it are updates, I can never sell it. Bit*h requires a lot of maintenance but I still love it.
Heck, am coming to Nigeria in 2 months and am shipping "big hoe" to Nigeria so I can drive it around .
So I understand where ikenna is coming from, I like his passion for peugeots. Am happy there are still people in Nigeria that take care of their cars the same way he does.

KA24DETT:

Bro, it's not that easy . I remenber wanting to turbocharge my 95 maxima 6 years ago and it was such a headache.
Those ebay parts are not reliable, no shop would advice you to buy ebay turbo kit.
Let's say
1> Low mileage engine is preferable because of strong internals
2>. Lots of moving things around in the engine bay to make space . The plumbing involved is a lot. Small displacement engines like the 92-97 civic hatch back was favorites among my boys. ( lots of room in the engine)
3> injectors, remapping and tuning the ECU. Reliability . Reliability is very scary with those ebay parts. I remenber my boy turboed his Acura TSX and 3 weeks later, the turbo was gone.

It's not a cheap adventure . But a rewarding one . I would rather buy an OEM turbocharged car than going my own turbo route unless I have a lot of cash to burn .
You can get decent power from updating exhaust , headers, intake , pulleys, CAMS , chip. Little power here and there and it adds up .

Yes, I know it's not easy and hence why I added the sellers disclaimer A savvy buyer will give proper attention to this statement by the seller "*No instruction included and Modification such as welding may be needed
Professional Installation is highly recommended*"

I've had nothing but good luck with eBay parts especially from China.

The key, for me, is inspecting all the parts and replacing the ones that don't meet my spec. First thing I do is turn the boost down, if they say 10psi, I'll do 8psi.

sultaan: Can any one give a quote on the cost of replacing a turbo?

And compare price of turbo engine to fuel savings, how long to break even

If you install a turbo engine in you car, you can never break even on gas price . NEVEr,
Most people that turbo their cars do it for the power and need for speed. To some, it's a project .
In Canada , to turbocharge a maxima, you are looking at a cost of $6,000. That's for parts and labour .
If you got a shop and are mechanically inclined, cost falls down considerable .

KA24DETT:

Boss, I think what he's trying to say is that turbocharged engine is more efficient than an NA engine( more power from same displacement) Yes, turbocharged is more expensive to build and requires more plumbings than an NA engine.
With advances in technology and reliability, most turbocharged engines require little to no maintenance than a non turbocharged one.

He said "more economical ", and not "more efficient ". They are two different things in automobile, as far as am concerned.

Ikenna

icemann:

Really. So you are saying dropping our books would do more good for us? You keep saying Turbo engines are not economical please prove with a logical explanation, otherwise stay silent and accept a worldwide proven fact.




He was trying to describe a propeller(hence talking of the blades)and something else you called "bla bla bla" .

I noticed in most replies you keep referencing your 504 or 505 and most times you are fixing it or having some one fix it. Its say a lot about how unreliable that car is. So with all this "i am fixing my car" memories/incidences you still stuck with Peugeot and the disappointments it has given you?

Like i always say " No matter how you see it ever fan is a sucker"

Am really disappointed with your comment about, especially "how unreliable Peugeot 504 & 505 are". Couldn't imagine such statements could come from you.

How unreliable a Peugeot 504 GL bought brand new in 1976 by my father, is. Simply because it had a failed propeller shaft in 2002/2003, after been driven on Nigerian road for more than 26 years old, still having the original engine. What an irony!

How unreliable my Baby is? Peugeot 505 V6, a 1986 production, that still takes me to any part of the country and brings me back without a cough? Really? How unreliable she is?

Am really disappointed, honestly.

Notwithstanding, why not bring those your Toyotas and Honda to Nigeria and lets see how they will hold up together, after driven hard on Nigerian roads for just a year. Of course, the "Honda Surprise " is not your portion, because your Honda is different from others in Nigeria that have proven how reliable their front swivels can be on Nigerian roads. And may be the ever frequent failing dampers of Toyotas driven on Nigerian road is not your portion, because yours was not produced with balloon like others. Talking about durability!

Back then in the East, the frequent failure of CV joints of Japs made the mechanics to start converting the Japs drive shafts with Renault & Peugeot ones, since the French cars CV joints appeared indestructible. It got to a point, the French cars CV joints and/or drive shafts became scarce commodities in the East back then. And you are here telling me how "unreliable " Peugeots are, compared to your Japs. Wonders shall never end.

Why not ask Peugeot owners in Nigeria how many times they have replaced their front ball joints, CV joints and shock absorbers, of all the long years of ownerships of their Lions? Likewise, ask the Toyota and Honda owners the same and lets find out which of the car brands are so unreliable and not durable.

Next time, however you want to impress Nairaland members of cars you drive, speak of what you know.

Ikenna

Ikenna351:

Am really disappointed with your comment about, especially "how unreliable Peugeot 504 & 505 is". Couldn't imagine such statements could come from you.

How unreliable a Peugeot 504 GL bought brand new in 1976 by my father, is. Simply because it had a failed propeller shaft in 2002/2003, after been driven on Nigerian road for more than 26 years old, still having the original engine. What an irony!

How unreliable my Baby is? Peugeot 505 V6, a 1986 production, that still takes me to any part of the country and brings me back without a cough? Really? How unreliable she is?

Am really disappointed, honestly.

Notwithstanding, why not bring those your Toyotas and Honda to Nigeria and lets see how they will hold up together, after driven hard on Nigerian roads for just a year. Of course, the "Honda Surprise " is not your portion, because your Honda is different from others in Nigeria that have proven how reliable their front swivels can be on Nigerian roads. And may be the ever frequent failing dampers of Toyotas driven on Nigerian road is not your portion, because yours was not produced with balloon like others. Talking about durability!

Back then in the East, the frequent failure of CV joints of Japs made the mechanics to start converting the Japs drive shafts with Renault & Peugeot ones, since the French cars CV joints appeared indestructible. It got to a point, the French cars CV joints and/or drive shafts became scarce commodities in the East back then. And you are here telling me how "unreliable " Peugeots are, compared to your Japs. Wonders shall never end.

Why not ask Peugeot owners in Nigeria how many times they have replaced their front ball joints, CV joints and shock absorbers, of all the long years of ownerships of their Lions? Likewise, ask the Toyota and Honda owners the same and lets find out which of the car brands are so unreliable and not durable.

Next time, however you want to impress Nairaland members of cars you drive, speak of what you know.

ikenna i really agree with you on that part u mentioned renault cos i used a 1997 laguna for four years, and i didnt know it has shaft and ball joint and i also notice my mechanic converting their shaft to be use in hondas and co

my take on this topic is the speed of a 1.8ltrs turbo charged engine is equivalent to a v6 of same car....

eddy42k: my take on this topic is the speed of a 1.8ltrs turbo charged engine is equivalent to a v6 of same car....

And what's your basis for such conclusion?

eddy42k:


ikenna i really agree with you on that part u mentioned renault cos i used a 1997 laguna for four years, and i didnt know it has shaft and ball joint and i also notice my mechanic converting their shaft to be use in hondas and co

there are about just a few outstanding cars to ever have come out of a production plant: The 504/505 are some, as solid as the old Saab...
meanwhile Turbos are more economical than N/A engines...up to 10% more economical...

Op thanks for the topic. I have been greatly educated on this topic.

Men ah mistakenly bought a golf 4 turbo 2.0 ...took it to d mechanic to replace d plate n dis n dts d beginning f my hating Volkswagen product.
a screw ws sorta like hard to loose so we kald a welder to help out.we removed all d connection leading to d plug n tried welding d screw out buh d damn engine ws still working.
we tried n tried buh anitym d weldering iron touches any part f d car,d car engine starts working.lata we gt to find out dt d weldering burnt everydamn wire n d car.no electrical part ws working.had to spend close to 300k to get d car working.
wanna ask,what ws it dt caused d engine to b working wit all d plugs disconnected n leading to d burning f d car electrical system..ah criously need an ans

KA24DETT:

You are right . Turbochargers get their air from the exhaust. Force fed induction.
That's a simple lay man explanation . Of course it gets more complicated but I don't think OP is interested in the technicalities and the engineering factors that goes into designing one .
Here in North America with government mandated fuel economy standards . Automakers are turbocharging small displacement engine to satisfy consumer taste for power and govt fuel economy standards .
Good explanation

I doubt if Turbo charged engine save or economise fuel usage. Considering Air/Fuel ratio, cos the more air in the combustion chamber, the more fuel usage to balance the equation. Turbo charger connected to outlet manifold supply pre heated air extracted from from power stroke back to the combustion chamber which increase the burning process resulting to more work by piston-crankshaft-camshaft-oilpump-waterpump-fanblade............
NB my definition was based on day to day deal with diesel engine.. . . .PRACTICAL

pawesome: Men ah mistakenly bought a golf 4 turbo 2.0 ...took it to d mechanic to replace d plate n dis n dts d beginning f my hating Volkswagen product.
a screw ws sorta like hard to loose so we kald a welder to help out.we removed all d connection leading to d plug n tried welding d screw out buh d damn engine ws still working.
we tried n tried buh anitym d weldering iron touches any part f d car,d car engine starts working.lata we gt to find out dt d weldering burnt everydamn wire n d car.no electrical part ws working.had to spend close to 300k to get d car working.
wanna ask,what ws it dt caused d engine to b working wit all d plugs disconnected n leading to d burning f d car electrical system..ah criously need an ans

You're blaming VW due to your shadetree shenanigans?

pawesome: Men ah mistakenly bought a golf 4 turbo 2.0 ...took it to d mechanic to replace d plate n dis n dts d beginning f my hating Volkswagen product.
a screw ws sorta like hard to loose so we kald a welder to help out.we removed all d connection leading to d plug n tried welding d screw out buh d damn engine ws still working.
we tried n tried buh anitym d weldering iron touches any part f d car,d car engine starts working.lata we gt to find out dt d weldering burnt everydamn wire n d car.no electrical part ws working.had to spend close to 300k to get d car working.
wanna ask,what ws it dt caused d engine to b working wit all d plugs disconnected n leading to d burning f d car electrical system..ah criously need an ans

Maybe the battery terminals are still connected while trying to do the welding

MicroBox:
I doubt if Turbo charged engine save or economise fuel usage. Considering Air/Fuel ratio, cos the more air in the combustion chamber, the more fuel usage to balance the equation. Turbo charger connected to outlet manifold supply pre heated air extracted from from power stroke back to the combustion chamber which increase the burning process resulting to more work by piston-crankshaft-camshaft-oilpump-waterpump-fanblade............
NB my definition was based on day to day deal with diesel engine.. . . .PRACTICAL

The air passes through the intercooler before it goes back to the engine .
Yes . A turbocharged engines is more economical than a high displacement engine with both engine making the same horsepower.

When it comes to Diesel engine properties. Most Diesel engine comes with turbochargers . U have to cram as much air as you can in the cylinder to generate power . Moreover with diesel, very little or no risk for predetonation so u can run turbos with very high PSI.
I don't think they make an NA diesel anymore .. It's more efficient to have a turbo on a diesel