Did Jesus Experience Failure? - Religion - Nairaland
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| Did Jesus Experience Failure? by coolruler(m): 11:25am On Sep 01, 2008 |
Ok, before I'm torn into pieces, here's my argument: 1. We know Jesus came into the world in human form as the Bible says 2. He went thru all those things we humans go thru e.g hunger, temptations, death e.t.c 3. Failure is one of the biggest and most constant human experiences - at least I know I failed in so many endeavours 4. There was no record of Jesus experiencing failure in the Bible (so far as I can tell) So, to you scholars, did Jesus Christ experience any instance of failure while on earth? |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by GODLOVES1: 4:43pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Hey I like that question. Let me just say that my knowledge of the Bible is not as great. I am young and have just started to study God's word. with that sad: My answer to the question would have to be Yes, Christ must have experienced Failure are else how could he know what we go threw wenn we fail. I DO NOT believe that e sinned, but that he failed to accomplish something. Failure to do something that you tried to do is not sin its just Human. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by AKO1(m): 5:07pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Does anybody have biblical proof that Jesus failed? I cant think of any. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Cayon(f): 6:27pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Well first of all, the catholic erased all the early years of Jesus. so we will never know unless we are the priests that keep the papers away from the public that document Jesus as a teenager. But I am sure like all teenagers he made a few errors. He was a carpenter and I am sure when his step father was trying to teach him carpentry he was grumbling and pushing up his mouth. And I am sure when he wanted to date young ladies - he got upset after he was told he can't date or get married. I am sure he raised His voice at his mother saying "What? What do you mean I can't get married, Mom? Everyone else my age is married! I want to have sex!" What? I'm just here to die for everyone? ****!"  Well thank God, at 30 He turned His life around. Got baptized by John and died for our sins. Thank you Jesus |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by AKO1(m): 7:10pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
But the bible says that He was tempted in like manner as we are and yet was without sin. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by MissyB1(m): 9:46pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Cayon:What do you base your certainty on? Please if the bible didn't record such events ,endeavour not to invent 'em. Poster I'D rather remain quiet pertaining to your ques if i have no answer to offer and that is exactly wha i'm doing. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Cayon(f): 10:05pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
@missB He was human. Like every human we all make mistakes. But God forgives. Jesus was even angry at one time. I am sure you know the story about The money changers in the temple. He even overturned all of their tables. Listen up child, God gave us a choice for us to THINK  |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Lady2(f): 10:31pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Well first of all, the catholic erased all the early years of Jesus. so we will never know unless we are the priests that keep the papers away from the public that document Jesus as a teenager. First of all the Catholic did not erase anything. There were no reporters at that time to document what he was doing in his life, there were no reporters at the time he started his ministry either, so what you have in the Gospel are accounts given by those who were there with him, don't forget the Gospels were written after his death and even after the deaths of some apostles. How do we have the information of his annunciation and parts of his life? Well let's see as for the annunciation, Mary told the apostles of it seeing that she was the only one in the room when the angel appeared. She also told the story of his childhood or at least the ones we know, because she was the only one there. The apostles did not know Jesus until he was a full grown man. Common sense would tell us this, but I have come to realise that a lot of people on nairaland don't have that simple gift. Let's also not forget that Apostle John also told us that there were many things that Jesus did that were not written down, well because the whole world won't be able to contain the books that would be written. So quit with the whole conspiracy thing in the Catholic Church. We know what we know, because of sacred tradition handed down to us from the apostles themselves, the Bible itself is sacred tradition, so you have all that you need in there for your salvation. I don't believe that he had any failures, but that is not to say that he didn't experience hurt. Hurt does not mean failure. Maybe the poster would do well to define what he means by failure. But seeing that Christ himself is God, he is perfect and is not one to fail. So if you're a Christian and you believe Christ is divine then be careful in answering this question so as not to deny Christ's divinity. He was human. Like every human we all make mistakes. But God forgives. Jesus was even angry at one time. I am sure you know the story about The money changers in the temple. He even overturned all of their tables. He was human and also divine. He had the human form does not mean that he sinned along with us. He had the human form so he could feel pain. But he is divine therefore he could not fail. God is not a failure. Jesus is the only one in human form that could do no wrong. As for his anger, God himself gets angry, but that doesn't mean he is a failure. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Bastage: 10:50pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Gospel of John, chapter 11, verse 35. "Jesus Wept". The fact that Jesus felt misery and pain meant that he also experienced the feeling of what it was like to fail. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Nobody: 10:52pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
@POSTER for me failure is not an option,pple fail because they failed to apply wisdom,knowledge and understanding,jesus did not experience failure.jesus as a teenager was very intelligent,remember jesus in the temple @ d age of 12 with d wise men, u might consider him falling as a failure, for me it was not a failure, he fell 3 times,in spirit realm it was for us to learn that when u fall or fail or backslid,u can stand up and dust urself up and start again, my friend's think back to when u fail, check properly u'll see that u messed up somehow someway or u'll see that it was ur fault somehow, i am not saying that it's not ok to fail nor neither am saying it is ok to fail, as children of god we have a choice, to choose ye which way to follow ,,,,,,,,,,failure or success,,,,,,,,,,,think before u do,,,,,u'll see it is hard to fail, may god bless us all jesus never fail |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by MissyB1(m): 10:53pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Cayon:Pls read ur post again and tell me whatcha talkin abt cuzz i don't get it at all.  |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by MissyB1(m): 10:58pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
All of you who says he failed may wish to provide biblical reference.Una dey give me bible verse wey nor rhyme wit d message How can sm1 wit so much wisdom fail? |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Lady2(f): 10:59pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
"Jesus Wept". Why did Jesus weep? Weeping does not mean failure. Feeling pain does not mean failure. He was human and could feel as human, yet he was without sin. We are not talking about a random joe here. Please don't deny his divinity, thanks. All of you who says he failed may wish to provide Thank you!! People forget Jesus is without sin. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Bastage: 11:41pm On Sep 01, 2008 |
Pain and misery are negative feelings and therefore associated with failure. It is not a denial of divinity to state that Jesus experienced a sense of failure. As you've said, he was human. Therefore he would have had all of a human being's emotions. An ability to experience failure is one of the attributes of being human. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Lady2(f): 1:30am On Sep 02, 2008 |
Pain and misery are negative feelings and therefore associated with failure. So a litle child that gets molested by her step father feels pain for the rest of her life and is miserable for the rest of her life, does that mean that she is a failure? It is not a denial of divinity to state that Jesus experienced a sense of failure. As you've said, he was human. Therefore he would have had all of a human being's emotions. An ability to experience failure is one of the attributes of being human. He was human in form, but not in sin, meaning he could do no wrong. To fail is to do wrong. He did no wrong and did things perfectly. Christ did things perfectly. He was without flaw. To fail is to be filled with flaw, sin. Get it now? |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by olabowale(m): 6:34am On Sep 02, 2008 |
Did he convert or gathered the lost hof israel, into his way; Christianity? If one was not gathered, and there were many not gathered, compared to the few gathered, we have to declare that he failed in the most foundamental way, in his mission. ~Lady~, I miss you. I hope you are save from from the Gustav and its mayhem. Cayon, I will get back to you on our pending date. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Bastage: 9:12am On Sep 02, 2008 |
Lady. There is a difference between experiencing failure and being a failure. To fail is not to do wrong. Sometimes we fail because things just don't work out. This does not make us wrong. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by coolruler(m): 4:22pm On Sep 02, 2008 |
Bastage: well put Bastage As God in human form, I believe he would have had to experience the full gamut of human emotions to fully identify with us. Being without sin has nothing to do with experiencing failure. To fail is human after all. Anyways, I'm still searching the Bible, |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Lady2(f): 3:28am On Sep 03, 2008 |
[Lady. There is a difference between experiencing failure and being a failure. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Bastage: 10:28am On Sep 03, 2008 |
And maybe you should get down off your high horse and stop spouting illogical nonsense. Why would Jesus have to have killed someone to be a human being? Please stop talking crap and look at logic. As for cursing - didn't Jesus curse the fig tree? And what about when he threw the money-changers and pigeon-sellers out of the Temple? Do you reckon he just asked them politely to leave? That's not what the Bible says is it? In fact not only did he probably curse but the Bible says that he made "a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple". And sin? Even Jesus himself admitted that he was not without sin: Mark 10:17-18: "And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Pah. Blind followers are the worst.  |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 11:27am On Sep 03, 2008 |
Meeeen. This is one of the reasons I hate being in this section of NL. People mis-quote and yearn rubbish on matters they no nothing about. Bastage: This is the dumbest post I have ever seen in recent times!!! |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 11:28am On Sep 03, 2008 |
Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God." Pray, tell me, is Jesus not God? My God. What a high level of display of ignorance!!! |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 11:32am On Sep 03, 2008 |
I shake my head. It's really a sad case. If you can say Jesus failed, then invariably, u are saying God failed. Why not follow Missb advice and keep shut if you don't understand scriptures. Sigh |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 11:41am On Sep 03, 2008 |
People make statements that they can't substantiate with scriptures. Pls convince me how he failed and i don't want any of those your illogical argument. Is it cos he wept? Don't people cry when they give their child away in marriage? Don't you cry over the soul of a lost one? Don't you cry when you are hurt or sad? Does that make you a failure? Moreover, when discussing biblical issues, the ideal thing is to stay within the confines of scriptures. If the bible does not say anything on a matter, why isinuate it. This is one major issue that is wrong with the church today. We love injecting words and phrases into scriptures. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by olabowale(m): 1:39pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
@naomijt (f): « #20 on: Today at 11:27:13 AM »
When you don't know how to respond, this is a good way to extracate yourself. Thats a deep subject. Its heavy.
You didn't get it? Its very thought provoking. Most Christians can get it. And those who do, it brings a greater confusion. Only a handful among them will leave and become muslims, hopefully. But observe that what the entrant said about Jesus is right on the spot of truth. « #21 on: Today at 11:28:49 AM » Pray, tell me, did Jesus call himself, God in that verse, above? My God. What will ignorance not bring out!!!! We see clearly, that Jesus differentiated himself from God in that verse. Jesus said that he was not good enough, when a person called him good. He immediately told the person, in a repreminding tone that the Only One who is good is God. Please read it and digest it. « #22 on: Today at 11:32:03 AM » Don't be frustrated. I have news for you; Jesus failed in the very reason that he came, to save or bring to the path of salvation, the lost people of the house of israel. He also failed since after him, the laws and the prophets were disregarded by Paul and co. I guess the warnings of Jesus fell on deaf ears. Didn't Jesus say that no single jot of the law will go unfulfilled? Didn't he say that whosoever discard even a jot, or encourages any to do so, such a person or persons will be the least in the kingdom of heaven/Kingdom of God? Tell me, are you satisfied to be one of the least in the Kingdom of God, especially when Jesus had hinted the possibility of it asa hard and unfavorable place?
If you understand "scriptures," tell me what Jesus meant when he said in Mark 12 Verse 29, that the audience and his own Lord and God is but one God? Did he mean that he was the Lord and God of his audience, since they both have the same Entity as Lord and God? Could he have been his own Lord and God? Did he ever say anywhere that he has no Lord or God? « #23 on: Today at 11:41:23 AM » No. From the Bible, we see that he did not have in his days, too many Children of Isreal following him. Today, we see that not much have changed about him, within the group known as Children of Israel, or today's Jews. We also realised that his mission has been compromised by the likes of Paul. While Jesus was alive, he clearly provided us statement that Lord God was different from him. After he was raised up by Lord God, we see that some people, including Paul came to change Jesus' statements and they began to postulate that he was more than human. These are signs of failure.
But Lord God Almighty the Creator, does not have a child to give away for marriage. Crying in that state does not apply to God. More importantly, crying is part of human expression of emotion, joy or sorrow. God is not within the classification of human.
If this is your pattern of reasoning, then consider then that if God were to cry because of souls being lost, it will be hard for Him to stop crying. The fact of the matter is that souls are dying every moment, around the world. God is aware of those dying souls. He has designed when each soul will die. It s not a surprise to Him or is not that He will miss the dead soul. But we as human are surprised and we will miss the dead soul, part of our reason to cry. He also do that realising that we will die someday, in the future. But God does not die!
Every human is a failure if left out of the guidance of God. But God by His Mercy forgives. He is the One who altimately have the decision of who failed and who succeeded. And God does not get hurt or saddened like we do, as human. Your problem maybe that you are not capable to know that God stands alone as the Creator fro all His creations. What affects humans do not affect God, in the same way and manner.
So tell me without insinuating or injecting words and phrases into scripture, in the same way as the wrong of the church of today; what is it that you get from Mark 12 verse 29? Who is Jesus in that verse? Who is God in that verse?
Its like the so called Big Bang! It couldn't have been a big bang, considering how small the matter was. It could never have been capable of producing even a wimper of a sound. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by MissyB1(m): 1:45pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
Naomi You crack me up babes. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 1:57pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
olabowale: Don't tell u included my signature as part of my post. Ohh mine so much for being smart. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 1:59pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
Yeah MissyB, someone sure needs to speak up.  |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 2:06pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
Now Olabowale, I really don't mean to be insultive. It's clear you have no understanding of scriptures at all. If you do you won't need nairaland to learn if Jesus is God or not. I will provide you one or two scriptures to help your ignorance. Before I go on. Mark 12: 29 reads And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:I don't see anywhere there where he said he is not God. Anyway, let me just help you out. Check out the following scripture and tell me if it is not clear that Jesus is God in the flesh Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. 1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. Search this scriptures well. If you still don't get it, you can buzz me on my mesenger. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by MissyB1(m): 2:12pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
Save ur strength.Olabowale is a muslim nd doesn't know jack abt d bible but you find him nd his cohort parading demselves arnd christians and criticising christianity.Fashi the dude nd those who misquote d bible in the name of "JC failed" |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by naomijt(f): 2:23pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
Missy B: Wow!!! Thanks for that info girl. It will def save me some energy. I could just imagine. See how dem dey mis-quote scriptures. And if na their Mohammed now, riot go burst. Hypocrites!!! I don't blame. Na the poster I blame. |
| Re: Did Jesus Experience Failure? by Bastage: 5:27pm On Sep 03, 2008 |
Save your strength.Olabowale is a muslim nd doesn't know jack about d bible but you find him nd his cohort parading demselves arnd christians and criticising christianity. He may be a Muslim but I am not. I am also a student of theology and can tell you that your arguments so far have been crass, illogical and without any grounding in sensible argument. You haven't disproved a single point that I've made - just come out with a load of crap that "Jesus is god so he couldn't experience failure" a hundred times. You've even managed to misquote a very important part of what I have stated. Argue the point and I'll maybe give you some respect. Until then you're just dumb noise. |
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