reedonne:
English have already became an international language, even monoethnic states like korean and japan still learn english as a compulsory subject.
It is not about accepting an europian language, but about having a language that will make us understand each other and at the sametime help us to be able to communicate with the outside world easily.

Omarbah:
Again , common culture can be built if the political power is shared and every group is represented. The common culture doesn't just happen, it is something built overtime. If all the regions of Nigeria were sharing power since its conceptions, ethnic differences would not be as strong as they are today. I gave you the example of Senegal which is ethnically diverse but does have a common culture built over the years.

Cote d'Ivoire is hardly war torn, yes they did have a civil war but that did not let to the massive destruction of infrastructure. Their economy grew by 9.8% in 2012 and 8.3% in 2013. And the African Development Bank just transferred its seat there from Tunisia, I don't think they would've done so if it was "war torn". Liberia on the other hand is in really shape. But that's besides the point, the war in those two countries did not oppose Fulanis and Maninkas. Both groups were treated as foreigners in those two countries. They actually had to work together.

Omarbah:
yes to learning a European language, English in particular but NO to giving up your own. Like I said in my previous posts, nothing prevents an education system in native languages with English being taught as a second language. At the current pace, we will stop being Africans in the long term. We'd be another version of Akatas LOL

Omarbah:
True if they have a large population and resources at their disposal. Could you imagine just within Nigeria, how many tiny states will be born out of this? Let alone the whole of West Africa.


they did thrive but times are different today. None of those states except Germany due to its high end manufacturing, can compete thus the need to be a member of the EU.


Not only there was a debate on whether or not, Sweden would do better by breaking out of the UK but even when independence became a probable outcome, they were talking about joining the EU. Being part of a bigger union is out of necessity.

reedonne: These are what african needs.
The universities
We have more than 100 universities in Nigeria but none of them have come out with a solution for our political problem, it is really disheartening. We have seen many report from foreign university about african problem, but african university seems to be dedicated to teaching us what have already been created by others.
If we want a cultural renaissance, we need to involve our education. Let us forget about western education type, and create our own system atleast it will encourage more people to read. Let us include our culture in our education.
I read about a NAZI propaganda subject during WW2, why cant we do something like this too. Encourage our young people to explore from their early primary education. Tell our people how we are superior to others and how we must show this superiority by innovating ideas. Use education and media to make europe looks like an immoral place where everything is bad.
We should use primary school to learn about culture, disscipline, community, national superiority, language,proper physical and health care, national language and mathematics.



We should use middle education to learn about law, civic responsibility, patroism, english, community order and discipline and business study.
We should use secondary education to learn about introduction to engineering, medicines, and other profession.
With this, our people have been orientated on community life since primary school (imagine our people learning to keep their house and community clean from primary school, learning community discipline from primary school and then proceed to learn law and civic responsibility in middle school, we wont need WAI lol).
They have also learnt about ethnic superiority from primary school and patroism from secondary school, so when they finish their university, they will try to proof their superiority to the whole world by inventing new things.

chulla12: There are countries with little to no resources (many in the northern hemisphere come to mind) that have done extremely well. It takes brains and inventiveness.

pleep: Pretty much hits the nail on this head. Africa at the time of colonization was in its dark age, and remained frozen in that state due to artificial borders and colonization.

The only way for africa to break free of this state would be warfare and conquest, through which the stronger ethnic groups would incorporate the weak and grow strong in both national identity and size. That is the natural state of human progress. This, however, would never be allowed to occur due to humanitarian concerns and western interference.

That is the reason i advocate unconventional methods of progres, because so long as africa looks like the map above natural progress will never occur.

pleep: Pretty much hits the nail on this head. Africa at the time of colonization was in its dark age, and remained frozen in that state due to artificial borders and colonization.

The only way for africa to break free of this state would be warfare and conquest, through which the stronger ethnic groups would incorporate the weak and grow strong in both national identity and size. That is the natural state of human progress. This, however, would never be allowed to occur due to humanitarian concerns and western interference.

That is the reason i advocate unconventional methods of progres, because so long as africa looks like the map above natural progress will never occur.

Omarbah:
sure it does but only if it is big enough and has the resources to compete with the outside world. Do you think a Yoruba, an Igbo state could compete with the rest of the world? There is not a single African ethnic group that control vast land and resources to do that.
Which is why I do believe giving up foreign policy, currency and army to a larger union is our best bet. The rest could be left to the ethnic groups.
Could you imagine, an Igbo president negotiating trade deals with the representative of the EU?

Omarbah: world wide trade with only Africans as the human commodity. We lost on this trade, however you look at it. We did not get anything valuable from it.

Omarbah:
yes to learning a European language, English in particular but NO to giving up your own. Like I said in my previous posts, nothing prevents an education system in native languages with English being taught as a second language. At the current pace, we will stop being Africans in the long term. We'd be another version of Akatas LOL

kingston277:
Which is why pleep suggested absorbing different ethnic groups into a state with one dominant ruling ethnic group like it was done in the olden days. Sounds difficult doesn't it? Well thats your only other proven to work option other than ethnic nations.

kingston277:
Only Africans? Where did you get that? My slave trade book im reading even has an example of Africans fighting and capturing Arab slave traders and selling them off to the West. Not to mention this: http://www.jstor.org/stable/25118876
https://www.indiacurrents.com/articles/2007/05/16/indian-slaves-in-colonial-america
Not sure where you got "only Africans as the human commodity" from.

reedonne: These are what african needs.
The universities
We have more than 100 universities in Nigeria but none of them have come out with a solution for our political problem, it is really disheartening. We have seen many report from foreign university about african problem, but african university seems to be dedicated to teaching us what have already been created by others.
If we want a cultural renaissance, we need to involve our education. Let us forget about western education type, and create our own system atleast it will encourage more people to read. Let us include our culture in our education.
I read about a NAZI propaganda subject during WW2, why cant we do something like this too. Encourage our young people to explore from their early primary education. Tell our people how we are superior to others and how we must show this superiority by innovating ideas. Use education and media to make europe looks like an immoral place where everything is bad.
We should use primary school to learn about culture, disscipline, community, national superiority, language,proper physical and health care, national language and mathematics.



We should use middle education to learn about law, civic responsibility, patroism, english, community order and discipline and business study.
We should use secondary education to learn about introduction to engineering, medicines, and other profession.
With this, our people have been orientated on community life since primary school (imagine our people learning to keep their house and community clean from primary school, learning community discipline from primary school and then proceed to learn law and civic responsibility in middle school, we wont need WAI lol).
They have also learnt about ethnic superiority from primary school and patroism from secondary school, so when they finish their university, they will try to proof their superiority to the whole world by inventing new things.

chulla12: There are countries with little to no resources (many in the northern hemisphere come to mind) that have done extremely well. It takes brains and inventiveness.

I'd wager that population alone (no matter how small) is sufficient to make a country work. African groups need to work on nurturing intelligent and forward thinking people to realize this though.

With respect to the EU, member countries are bonded mainly by economic ties. There still remains the defining characteristics and ideologies that separate member nations... not to mention the obvious political autonomy. France and Portugal are not now culturally and politically identical enough to be one country by virtue of being part of EU.

I'm sure that similar unions comprising of functioning autonomous states will work for Africa as well.

AmunRaOlodumare:
That's a big problem you talk about here.

Since the colonial era, African countries like Nigeria have done nothing but try to use the "European Model" and apply it to Africa without any adaptation. But in Europe all the countries (France, Finland, Sweden, Britain, Norway, Germany, Czechoslovakia, Turkey, Israel, Russia, etc) use their own languages and their own culture as a foundation of their education system.

Since the colonial era African countries used the English language as the language of instruction and it failed. It failed. When something fail, you change it.

That's why (along with research done by Unesco and African universities) I made this post.

https://www.nairaland.com/1915272/what-preventing-africa-experiencing-cultural/4#26577116

^^^In fact, a bit ironically, this is more like the European model (it's also the model of previous large African Kingdoms) because it places African language and culture at the center of the education system the same way the "european model" place their own language and culture at the center of their own society and education system. Like Chinese, Japanese, South Korean, and European people do. We must not try to be like them but be ourselves. Use our own language and culture as a base for development. Integrate what is good from outside into our own culture, not the other way around which I recall failed. Times to do things differently in Africa. Good examples are Scandinavian countries, Japan, Israel, Russia, China, South Korea. Scandinavian countries and South Korea are interesting because they are small countries very advanced in term of technology, Research and Development (RandD), social security, support to locally owned enterprises in all main fields of science and manufacturing, and quality of life. They also use their own cultures and languages as foundation for their development.

Fulaman198:

Forward thinking people does not mean withdrawing from one's culture to become westernised. Forgetting your own language, culture and tradition does not make you forward thinking. It just means you have a major inferiority complex.

Every nation needs the core essentials for success. This means Engineering, math, science. What Bandirawo OmarBah is saying is why can't those subjects which usually lead to a nation's success be taught in our native countries like in Asian and European countries that don't speak English.

Currently the only place that can be done is in Northern Nigeria within Nigeria due to the fact that many ethnic groups like my own speak Hausa as a second language. The only issue which isn't much of a big deal would be finding people that can teach these engineering courses.

I'm actually considering uploading some engineering tutorial videos in Fulfulde and Hausa on YouTube. I'm contemplating my teaching methods to make it easy for people to learn.

Omarbah:
Yorubas could do the same in western Nigeria.
Again, nothing prevents them from teaching English as a second language.

Omarbah:
Yorubas could do the same in western Nigeria.
Again, nothing prevents them from teaching English as a second language.

AmunRaOlodumare:
They also use their own cultures and languages as foundation for their development.

AmunRaOlodumare:
It's VERY important to teach english as a second language. It's done in many places around the world (Europe, Asia). But it is easy due to the influence of American culture in media and the position of the english language in Nigeria already. Otherwise all Nigerian languages can be used as language of instructions.

Fulaman198:
I don't see the reason why they learn in French when they all mainly can speak Arabic. That is still one thing today that confuses me. When you have countries in the middle east that are educated only in Arabic, the Tunisians, Moroccans, and the Algerians are educated in French....Does that also go back to the inferiority complex we discusses earlier?

Omarbah:
I think they use Arabic for primary and secondary schools and French in Universities and Professional schools, at least in Morocco that's the case.

Fulaman198:

That's very interesting. I wonder why they do it that way. What is your take on it?

Fulaman198:

Forward thinking people does not mean withdrawing from one's culture to become westernised. Forgetting your own language, culture and tradition does not make you forward thinking. It just means you have a major inferiority complex.

Every nation needs the core essentials for success. This means Engineering, math, science. What Bandirawo OmarBah is saying is why can't those subjects which usually lead to a nation's success be taught in our native language just like countries like in Asian and European countries that don't speak English.

Currently the only place that can be done is in Northern Nigeria within Nigeria due to the fact that many ethnic groups like my own speak Hausa as a second language. The only issue which isn't much of a big deal would be finding people that can teach these engineering courses.

I'm actually considering uploading some engineering tutorial videos in Fulfulde and Hausa on YouTube. I'm contemplating my teaching methods to make it easy for people to learn.

chulla12: Not sure where you got the impression that I said forward thinking and intelligence means forsaking your inherent ideologies or languages.

Igbos, Yorubas, etc already have an established basis for nation building due to a central language and unique ideologies and languages. Nice and dandy, but they also have to create opportunities that address problems peculiar to nation states such as Yorubaland or Igboland. Hence my allusion to "inventiveness."

What defines a nation's competitive advantage, for instance? If there isn't an organic or homegrown definition, how do you create one?

Japan is a testament to the possibilities for a country that has found the answers.

chulla12: Not sure where you got the impression that I said forward thinking and intelligence means forsaking your inherent ideologies or languages.

Igbos, Yorubas, etc already have an established basis for nation building due to a central language and unique ideologies and languages. Nice and dandy, but they also have to create opportunities that address problems peculiar to nation states such as Yorubaland or Igboland. Hence my allusion to "inventiveness."

What defines a nation's competitive advantage, for instance? If there isn't an organic or homegrown definition, how do you create one?

Japan is a testament to the possibilities for a country that has found the answers.

Omarbah:
it used to be worse actually. All of the teaching in formal education was done in French, then Arabic was introduced in social studies leaving Maths and Science to French. And progressively, Arabic took over primary and secondary education with French still being taught.
Who knows, maybe they'll get rid of French altogether some day.

Omarbah:
wrong, if the Europeans with their stronger economies are uniting why can't we?

Omarbah: Good luck going through the war thing, what a sweet opportunity that would be for Europeans to come back.

Omarbah: You seriously aren't the enslavement of Indians with that of Africans are you? How many Arabs got sold by other Arabs as slaves to the Americas?

Omarbah: The issue here is very simple. Europeans did not sell Europeans to Africans but Africans did sell Africans to Europeans.

Omarbah: Do you realize the difference here? They got human cattle and we received cheap junk. The same with the Arabs, they never gave us humans in exchange for something.

kingston277:
Where have you see Europeans uniting? Other than EU/NATO I haven't. In fact the USSR and Scotland issues are suggesting otherwise.


Good luck trying to unite people with no ethnic, historical, linguistic, or religious affiliation. The mass tribalism will surely keep that super-nation under Western thumbs.


Quite a few, along with Irish, Chinese and Indians. Africans were the largest but it remains under debate what lead to the scale the slave trade got to. We don't have all the answers.


Africans didn't need to buy any slaves, warfare allowed them to capture, enslave, and extract information from reversal Europeans. Look at King Agaja or the Kanem-Bornu Empire. Foreign slaves were very valuable in those days.


To an extent they did...
http://historum.com/middle-eastern-african-history/68815-slaves-brought-into-sub-saharan-africa.html
...But they also traded beast of burden, weapons and horses, too.

kingston277:
Where have you see Europeans uniting? Other than EU/NATO I
haven't. In fact the USSR and Scotland issues are suggesting
otherwise.

Good luck trying to unite people with no ethnic, historical,
linguistic, or religious affiliation. The mass tribalism will surely
keep that super-nation under Western thumbs.

kingston277:
Where have you see Europeans uniting? [b]Other than EU/NATO I haven't. [/b]In fact the USSR and Scotland issues are suggesting otherwise.

"kingston277:

Good luck trying to unite people with no ethnic, historical, linguistic, or religious affiliation. The mass tribalism will surely keep that super-nation under Western thumbs.

"kingston277:

Quite a few, along with Irish, Chinese and Indians. Africans were the largest but it remains under debate what lead to the scale the slave trade got to. We don't have all the answers.


Africans didn't need to buy any slaves, warfare allowed them to capture, enslave, and extract information from reversal Europeans. Look at King Agaja or the Kanem-Bornu Empire. Foreign slaves were very valuable in those days.


To an extent they did...
http://historum.com/middle-eastern-african-history/68815-slaves-brought-into-sub-saharan-africa.html
...But they also traded beast of burden, weapons and horses, too.