Pr0ton:


Yh. He makes you a sinner, condemns you as a sinner and sends you to hell for being a sinner. But you yourself don't understand what is going on. That's why it's called mystery. Remain blessed.

clevvermind:
you know we humans don't have the right to question God.



20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it , “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor? Romans 9:20-21.

Precioussilas10:
You can't be too fast to draw conclusions,broda..we need someone to enlighten us on this.

clevvermind:
it seems i didn't get your question at first.

Hiswordxray:

I don't know about predestination but I do believe God cannot infringe on our free will.

Pr0ton:


Let's say you were a father (God) and Pharoah was your son. Would you treat your son that way? by 'hardening his heart to continue in evil' so that you can 'punish him severely'?

adexsimply:
How do you direct questions meant for God to humans?

Hiswordxray:

Pharaoh wasn't a son of God. You can say he is a creature of God which God loves so much but he isn't a son of God.
God loves Pharaoh so much but God is a God of justices and every sin must be punished. God cannot be unjust because He loves somebody.
Pharaoh was given the right judgment because justice must be severed.

Pr0ton:


So created us all and then separated children from ba.stards. I love His style.

Hiswordxray:

Do you know the meaning of children?
Is God the father of goats just because He created them?

clevvermind:
if you direct it to God, you would not get an answer until u meet him in heaven. there are mysteries in the bible that humans cannot phantom until we meet him. maybe this is one of them. but let those who can try answer it carry on.

MzNelly:
Pharoah was mistreating God's people(the Israelites), so he was 'doomed' already, more or less.

God hardened his heart in order to prove to his people that he was their God with the power to save them.

A time is also coming when God will harden the hearts of our leaders to wipe out religion entirely.

Wait for it....

Pr0ton:
BabaGnoni.
Those analogies are false.
God never tried to pacify Pharoah. He intentionally made him hellbent.
Guess you need to reread Exd 7:3 very well.
God hardned his heart even before He sent Moses to him.
There was no prior fight which God was trying to save Pharoah from till he let him be (because he was hellbent).
No, God already left him before the fight started.

Pr0ton:


Why should the word of an all powerful all knowing God be difficult and confusing to comprehend. An intelligent person would know how to format his scripts in way that will be understood clearly, even by the ordinary reader. The creator of intelligence should have his/her/its to be more impressive; unfortunately it doesn't.

Pr0ton:


Remember also that was God's will for Pharoah to punish Israel. Israel was under slavery for 400years or so because of what Abraham did that offended God. God was using Pharoah to punish Israel, and not Pharoah using his freewill again.

Pr0ton:


Your xray brain should have detected that we are taking about humans here.

clevvermind:
the issue is, what have you done with the little he had revealed to you?

Pr0ton:
BabaGnoni

Whether "I have" or "I will" it was God doing the hardening. But wait... You mean there was a possibility that God might not harden Pharoah's heart even after saying "I will"? Not likely, because "tho heaven and earth pass away; my word will never pass away".

It is even more clear in Exd 9:12 that what God told Moses came true.

And I'm not claiming to have a better knowledge.
Let's just get things straight, not twisted

Pr0ton:
BabaGnoni

Whether "I have" or "I will" it was God doing the hardening. But wait... You mean there was a possibility that God might not harden Pharoah's heart even after saying "I will"? Not likely, because "tho heaven and earth pass away; my word will never pass away".

It is even more clear in Exd 9:12 that what God told Moses came true.

And I'm not claiming to have a better knowledge. Let's just get things straight, not twisted

Pr0ton:


There is nothing to make out from the "little he has revealed"

MzNelly:


Okay.

Please expatiate if you can.

I'd like scriptural references, if possible too.

Hiswordxray:

Not all creature of God are God's children.
Then not all humans are God's children.

BabaGnoni:


Before we move on Pr0ton, have you dust out your bible to read Hebrews 3:15 yet?

Also please dont play the selective forgetfulness card on this one
I requested:
Please indulge me and tell, what to your knowledge symbolises the voice of God OR word of God in the bible
(i.e. what symbolism(s) is used for the voice of God or word of God in the bible)

Should we be surprised at Exodus 9:12?
Anyone that agrees that God is Ominiscient, that God is Omni-all-knowing,
that God knows the end from the beginning wouldnt bat an eyelid at Exodus 9:12
PS: By the way, no one has a monopoly of knowledge except God. We are all learning Pr0ton

Pr0ton:
But he created them.
Why the difference?

Pr0ton:


But he created them. Why the difference?

clevvermind:
it seems Pharaoh's heart was already hardened before.


1 Afterward Moses and Aaron went in and told Pharaoh, “Thus says the LORD God of Israel: ‘Let My people go, that they may hold a feast to Me in the wilderness.’ ” 2 And Pharaoh said, “Who is the LORD, that I should obey His voice to let Israel go? I do not know the LORD, nor will I let Israel go.” Exodus 5:1-2.


pharoah wants to contest with God and God had to prove to him that he was far superior to him. no one contest with God. satan tries it and he was cast out. Nebuchadnezzar tries it and he was turned to an animal for seven years. Herod tries it and his body gone rotten and eaten by worms. etc.

BabaGnoni:


You havent provided me your answers to my questions

The difference is as simple as, will you take ownership of what you didnt create, didnt or havent adopted?
- only a thief, a thief like in John 10:10, will do such

Hiswordxray:

Because children are born not created.
"12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born,not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. " (John 1:12-13).
"23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever," (1Pet 1:23).
"6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit." (John 3:6).
God created humans but He gives birth to His children.