Goshen360:


Holy Ghost thought you what is plainly written? The bible interprets itself and it's simple except we're going into deeper word meaning, the scripture is clear

yes sir. he went deeper than just a lady covering her hair that was why I kept asking if she knew the spiritual significance of a woman Covering her hair in church.i have a malfunctioning Screen else I would have stated it here.

If you naturally have long heir like the white women,you need not to cover your head,because it was given to you by God. But if you have the black woman's heir you have to cover it,because you do not naturally have long heir,it is wrong to use relaxers and attachments and say "Long heir is given for a covering" that attachment is not your heir and thus it was not GIVEN by God. So lets understand that fact. God bless you.

spencerwilliams:
If you naturally have long heir like the white women,you need not to cover your head,because it was given to you by God. But if you have the black woman's heir you have to cover it,because you do not naturally have long heir,it is wrong to use relaxers and attachments and say "Long heir is given for a covering" that attachment is not your heir and thus it was not GIVEN by God. So lets understand that fact. God bless you.

Is the veil you cover your hair with also given by God? Is the veil not added to the hair also? So why is long weave or long attachment or long braids not a covering enough for an african woman but a long veil is?

That's just turning semantics into doctrine. As long as a woman does not have a short hair, she is covered. Whether its natural, or brazillian, it is a covering. Trying to say weave is not a covering but veil is a covering, is turning semantics into doctrine.

Natural long hair, weave, wig, or veil are all coverings for the head.

Shalom!

I've discovered that most doctrinal divisions in the body of Christ are caused by men attempting to say and go above what is written.

Paul said a woman should cover her head. That's all he said.

Whether you cover your head with natural long hair, or weave or wig or veil; all are coverings for the head.

Trying to say natural long hair is a head covering but weave is not a head covering is going above what is written. Saying veil is a head covering but wig is not is going above what is written.

And these are all the causes of doctrinal division and confusion in the body.

This is similar to the doctrinal division of drinking wine and getting drunk.

The bible didn't say we shouldn't drink wine; even the wine used during communion was alcoholic. It only said we should not get drunk.

But some will go above what is written and say drinking wine is a sin. That's the cause of confusion.

If you want to go the extra mile and not drink wine all together; that's fine, but those who drink without getting drunk are fine too according to scripture.

So also if you want to go the extra mile and cover your head with your hair and then cover the hair with a veil; that's fine. But those who decide to cover their head with just their long hair or weave or wig are equally fine too.

Cover you head was what the scripture said. And long hair, weave, wig or veil all cover the head.

Let's stop going above what was written and causing confusion and division in the body.

Shalom.

PastorOsamede:


A Kingdom that has no rules is a Kingdom of brutish outlaws. When did head covering become a gift? I won't be surprised at your opinions on homosexuality, abortion, divorce, pornography, masturbation, and so many other issues.

Madam, madam, madam... Quit twisting the Bible to suit your thoughts.

All these you clearly stated here are sins. They are clearly written in the word of God as sins of the flesh. God clearly spoke to me about masturbation. He told me it is sin because he likened to to cancer. He says it hinders one from making progress.

Hey you must understand that Peter said Apostle Paul words are hard to understand. Jesus was God, he laid no emphasis on the flesh but the spirit.

/2peter.3.15-16. "and consider that  the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they  do also the rest of the Scriptures."

PETER acknowledged here that most of Paul's teaching are hard to understand. They are not as simply written as you think. You need the help of the Holy Spirit to understand Paul's writings.

ayoku777:
I've discovered that most doctrinal divisions in the body of Christ are caused by men attempting to say and go above what is written.

Paul said a woman should cover her head. That's all he said.

Whether you cover your head with natural long hair, or weave or wig or veil; all are coverings for the head.

Trying to say natural long hair is a head covering but weave is not a head covering is going above what is written. Saying veil is a head covering but wig is not is going above what is written.

And these are all the causes of doctrinal division and confusion in the body.

This is similar to the doctrinal division of drinking wine and getting drunk.

The bible didn't say we shouldn't drink wine; even the wine used during communion was alcoholic. It only said we should not get drunk.

But some will go above what is written and say drinking wine is a sin. That's the cause of confusion.

If you want to go the extra mile and not drink wine all together; that's fine, but those who drink without getting drunk are fine too according to scripture.

So also if you want to go the extra mile and cover your head with your hair and then cover the hair with a veil; that's fine. But those who decide to cover their head with just their long hair or weave or wig are equally fine too.

Cover you head was what the scripture said. And long hair, weave, wig or veil all cover the head.

Let's stop going above what was written and causing confusion and division in the body.

Shalom.

Actually, I agree with you. The reason I posted this here is not to cause division but to make Christians in Nigeria understand this topic. And so that people who attend churches where scarfs are used would stop thinking they are the only true Christians around. Considering how much they judge other denominations.

misreal:
you simply don't know what it mean to be led of the spirit. You think because your mind deceived you into thinking women should not cover their head in worship then you are spiritual. If the scripture that says women should cover their head wasn't relevant, y did the holyghost allow it to be placed in the Bible. My screen is bad, else I would have told you the SPIRITUAL relevance of covering the head during worship. The spirit that spoke to you is not the holyghost.i have met many of your type.

Peter spoke of Apostle Paul's writings. /2peter.3.15-16. "and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures."

PETER acknowledged here that most of Paul's teaching are hard to understand. They are not as simply written as you think. You need the help of the Holy Spirit to understand Paul's writings.

misreal:
you simply don't know what it mean to be led of the spirit. You think because your mind deceived you into thinking women should not cover their head in worship then you are spiritual. If the scripture that says women should cover their head wasn't relevant, y did the holyghost allow it to be placed in the Bible. My screen is bad, else I would have told you the SPIRITUAL relevance of covering the head during worship. The spirit that spoke to you is not the holyghost.i have met many of your type.

You keep saying your screen is bad but yet you have time to say irrelevant things. Long hair was given to women for head covering. Isn't that explanatory enough? There is a reference to the OT about head covering when Aaron's sons died. I guess you are used to what your pastor teaches from the pulpit when the scripture clearly says you do not need man to teach you but the Holy Spirit will teach you and guide you to all truth.

PastorOsamede:


@ reedmund,

Keep promoting theological researches that seek to shove aside clear Scriptural precepts. The most worrying aspect of your epistle is your ascription of it to the HOLY SPIRIT. I am very worried for you. Tread carefully! Any dream, vision or revelation that does not align with Scriptures should be dumped in the wastebasket of falsehood.

I don't see what it will cost a female to cover her hair with something for just a few hours or even minutes of prayer in church or at home. Few hours or minutes! What will it cost you? Please tell me.

@Pastor Osamede

I can see you have a religious Spirit that has blinded you to seeing that the hair is what covers the head. You keep saying "cover her hair" whereas scripture didn't say we should cover our hair but HEADS. And long hair has been given to women has a covering for their heads. It is a shame for men to have long hair as covering for their heads. I have explained it already above but you are too carnal to see spiritual truths. Why did Jesus speak in parables? So that only those who are spiritual can understand it. If not, even Muslims and atheists who read the bible like newspapers will understand the full concept of God. But the word of God is living and active, sharper than any double-edged sword... It is not just the written letter you see but the life giving word that the Holy Spirit guides you towards. If only you know all my experiences with God and how he saved me from witches and ritualists... And how he kept me from being killed in 2015. He sent His angels to me to rescue me. I saw Jesus praying for me. He also told me to study Colossians 3 so well... If only I can tell you everything about my Christian journey here and how I have heard God's voice, you would not have said what you said.

Shalom!

reedmund:


@Pastor Osamede

I can see you have a religious Spirit that has blinded you to seeing that the hair is what covers the head. You keep saying "cover her hair" whereas scripture didn't say we should cover our hair but HEADS. And long hair has been given to women has a covering for their heads. It is a shame for men to have long hair as covering for their heads. I have explained it already above but you are too carnal to see spiritual truths. Why did Jesus speak in parables? So that only those who are spiritual can understand it. If not, even Muslims and atheists who read the bible like newspapers will understand the full concept of God. But the word of God is living and active, sharper than any double-edged sword... It is not just the written letter you see but the life giving word that the Holy Spirit guides you towards. If only you know all my experiences with God and how he saved me from witches and ritualists... And how he kept me from being killed in 2015. He sent His angels to me to rescue me. I saw Jesus praying for me. He also told me to study Colossians 3 so well... If only I can tell you everything about my Christian journey here and how I have heard God's voice, you would not have said what you said.

Shalom!

You completely muddled up the Bible!
GOD of mercy! The antichrists are truly here.
Why did Paul say that if she is not covered it would be "as if" she were shaven? 1 Corinthians 11:5. "As if" means she is not covered and she is not shaven. If covering here refers to her hair, what is she going to shave if she is not covered? Open your eyes oo.

If you say that a woman covers her head with her hair, what then did Paul ask her to shave or be shorn when she is not covered? 1 Corinthian 11:5-6. Why did Paul tell her to choose between covering her head and shaving it? What do you shave? If the hair sufficiently covers her while praying or prophesying, what then is she going to shave if she is not covered?


Part 2. 1 Corinthians 11:14-15.

What Paul does here is to encourage women not to cut their hair. Here the word covering is used in the same context as the word pride/beauty. Her hair is her glory and her beauty. First Paul makes it clear that long hair for a man is shame (1 Corinthians 11:14).

For a woman it is for her glory and pride. This is the meaning of covering here (1 Corinthians 11:15). Long hair is a woman's pride (covering). Why do some customs deliberately shave a woman's hair? It is to humble her, bruise her ego and take away her beauty. Paul clearly examined the natural place of hair to a man and a woman from 1 Corinthians 11:14-15. Long hair adds grace to a woman and shame to a man.

reedmund:


All these you clearly stated here are sins. They are clearly written in the word of God as sins of the flesh. God clearly spoke to me about masturbation. He told me it is sin because he likened to to cancer. He says it hinders one from making progress.

Hey you must understand that Peter said Apostle Paul words are hard to understand. Jesus was God, he laid no emphasis on the flesh but the spirit.

/2peter.3.15-16. "and consider that  the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they  do also the rest of the Scriptures."

PETER acknowledged here that most of Paul's teaching are hard to understand. They are not as simply written as you think. You need the help of the Holy Spirit to understand Paul's writings.

Your ascription of everything you write as an explanation from the HOLY SPIRIT is very disturbing. Anyway I am not in shock over it. After all that's the easiest way to sell a lie to believers these days.

You remind me of Apollos an eloquent fluid words merchant. But thank GOD for Aquila and Priscilla who quickly discerned that he needed proper guidance in Scriptural knowledge (Acts 18:24-26). Madam, go sit under a called preacher (Romans 10:14).

Finally, one, you need to be wary of your unhealthy reliance on dreams and revelations for interpreting Scriptures. Most of your write-ups here are replete with your boastful references to how this and that appeared to you in dreams. Two, you must carefully examine the voice(s) you hear. Don't just test that voice only for Scriptural teaching. Confirm its authenticity by looking at how many things you have heard about the personal lives of others which later came true.
Three, how many times have you heard things that turned out false? Be sincere to yourself.

Even with the prophetic mantle, one still listens carefully and not speak hastily.

misreal:
my brother, this generation of Christians are just strange. the holyghost has thought me why a woman should cover her hair in worship. while the op is claiming the same holyghost bthouht her not to cover her hair. my screen is bad, else I would have countered the op well..

Thanks. May God bless you.
Some reasons why women in the western world don't wish to cover their hair during prayer, worship and prophesying:

By Michael K.10:31 AM
www.headcoveringmovement.com
" If we are honest there are two reasons why the church does not teach that women should cover.

1: Women don't want to cover. They don't want to be distinct from the culture. They want to be 'fashionable'.

2: Most men are afraid of women, their wives included. So those that teach, find an excuse to dismiss passages that they know will offend women.

In both cases, it is sin. The fear of man, or women in this case, above a reverence for God's Word."

PastorOsamede:



You completely muddled up the Bible!
GOD of mercy! The antichrists are truly here.
Why did Paul say that if she is not covered it would be "as if" she were shaven? 1 Corinthians 11:5. "As if" means she is not covered and she is not shaven. If covering here refers to her hair, what is she going to shave if she is not covered? Open your eyes oo.

If you say that a woman covers her head with her hair, what then did Paul ask her to shave or be shorn when she is not covered? 1 Corinthian 11:5-6. Why did Paul tell her to choose between covering her head and shaving it? What do you shave? If the hair sufficiently covers her while praying or prophesying, what then is she going to shave if she is not covered?


Part 2. 1 Corinthians 11:14-15.

What Paul does here is to encourage women not to cut their hair. Here the word covering is used in the same context as the word pride/beauty. Her hair is her glory and her beauty. First Paul makes it clear that long hair for a man is shame (1 Corinthians 11:14).

For a woman it is for her glory and pride. This is the meaning of covering here (1 Corinthians 11:15). Long hair is a woman's pride (covering). Why do some customs deliberately shave a woman's hair? It is to humble her, bruise her ego and take away her beauty. Paul clearly examined the natural place of hair to a man and a woman from 1 Corinthians 11:14-15. Long hair adds grace to a woman and shame to a man.

Thank you Sir, you've hit the 'nail on the head'
In the original Greek bible the word 'Katakalupto' is the word that the Apostle Paul used in I Corinthians 11:4 -13. 'Katakalupto' means ' to cover up', or the covering you have to put on, such as a scarf, hat, veil.
Then the Greek word for 'covering' in 1 Corinthians 11:15 is 'Peribolaion'.
Therefore, 1 Corinthians 11:15 is saying that God gave a woman long hair as a 'Peribolaion' - a natural covering or mantle or veil to distinguish her physically from a man.
So despite the God-given 'Peribolaion', a Christian woman has to practice 'Katakalupto ' when praying and prophesying. Thank you.

reedmund:


@Pastor Osamede

I can see you have a religious Spirit that has blinded you to seeing that the hair is what covers the head. You keep saying "cover her hair" whereas scripture didn't say we should cover our hair but HEADS. And long hair has been given to women has a covering for their heads. It is a shame for men to have long hair as covering for their heads. I have explained it already above but you are too carnal to see spiritual truths. Why did Jesus speak in parables? So that only those who are spiritual can understand it. If not, even Muslims and atheists who read the bible like newspapers will understand the full concept of God. But the word of God is living and active, sharper than any double-edged sword... It is not just the written letter you see but the life giving word that the Holy Spirit guides you towards. If only you know all my experiences with God and how he saved me from witches and ritualists... And how he kept me from being killed in 2015. He sent His angels to me to rescue me. I saw Jesus praying for me. He also told me to study Colossians 3 so well... If only I can tell you everything about my Christian journey here and how I have heard God's voice, you would not have said what you said.

Shalom!

In the original Greek bible the word 'Katakalupto' is the word that the Apostle Paul used in I Corinthians 11:4 -13. 'Katakalupto' means ' to cover up', or the covering you have to put on, such as a scarf, hat, veil.
Then the Greek word for 'covering' in 1 Corinthians 11:15 is 'Peribolaion'.
Therefore, 1 Corinthians 11:15 is saying that God gave a woman long hair as a 'Peribolaion' - a natural covering or mantle or veil to distinguish her physically from a man.
So despite the God-given 'Peribolaion', a Christian woman has to practice 'Katakalupto ' when praying and prophesying. Thank you

Yahushuabride1:


Thank you Sir, you've hit the 'nail on the head'
In the original Greek bible the word 'Katakalupto' is the word that the Apostle Paul used in I Corinthians 11:4 -13. 'Katakalupto' means ' to cover up', or the covering you have to put on, such as a scarf, hat, veil.
Then the Greek word for 'covering' in 1 Corinthians 11:15 is 'Peribolaion'.
Therefore, 1 Corinthians 11:15 is saying that God gave a woman long hair as a 'Peribolaion' - a natural covering or mantle or veil to distinguish her physically from a man.
So despite the God-given 'Peribolaion', a Christian woman has to practice 'Katakalupto ' when praying and prophesying. Thank you.

Thank you very much for this all-important background information. I appreciate.

spencerwilliams:
If you naturally have long heir like the white women,you need not to cover your head,because it was given to you by God. But if you have the black woman's heir you have to cover it,because you do not naturally have long heir,it is wrong to use relaxers and attachments and say "Long heir is given for a covering" that attachment is not your heir and thus it was not GIVEN by God. So lets understand that fact. God bless you.

In the original Greek bible the word 'Katakalupto' is the word that the Apostle Paul used in I Corinthians 11:4 -13. 'Katakalupto' means ' to cover up', or the covering you have to put on, such as a scarf, hat, veil.
Then the Greek word for 'covering' in 1 Corinthians 11:15 is 'Peribolaion'.
Therefore, 1 Corinthians 11:15 is saying that God gave a woman long hair as a 'Peribolaion' - a natural covering or mantle or veil to distinguish her physically from a man.
So despite the God-given 'Peribolaion', a Christian woman has to practice 'Katakalupto ' when praying and prophesying. Thank you

PastorOsamede:


Thank you very much for this all-important background information. I appreciate.

You're most welcome Sir.

J

ayoku777:
I've discovered that most doctrinal divisions in the body of Christ are caused by men attempting to say and go above what is written.

Paul said a woman should cover her head. That's all he said.

Whether you cover your head with natural long hair, or weave or wig or veil; all are coverings for the head.

Trying to say natural long hair is a head covering but weave is not a head covering is going above what is written. Saying veil is a head covering but wig is not is going above what is written.

And these are all the causes of doctrinal division and confusion in the body.

This is similar to the doctrinal division of drinking wine and getting drunk.

The bible didn't say we shouldn't drink wine; even the wine used during communion was alcoholic. It only said we should not get drunk.

But some will go above what is written and say drinking wine is a sin. That's the cause of confusion.

If you want to go the extra mile and not drink wine all together; that's fine, but those who drink without getting drunk are fine too according to scripture.

So also if you want to go the extra mile and cover your head with your hair and then cover the hair with a veil; that's fine. But those who decide to cover their head with just their long hair or weave or wig are equally fine too.

Cover you head was what the scripture said. And long hair, weave, wig or veil all cover the head.

Let's stop going above what was written and causing confusion and division in the body.

Shalom.

In the original Greek bible the word 'Katakalupto' is the word that the Apostle Paul used in I Corinthians 11:4 -13. 'Katakalupto' means ' to cover up', or the covering you have to put on, such as a scarf, hat, veil.
Then the Greek word for 'covering' in 1 Corinthians 11:15 is 'Peribolaion'.
Therefore, 1 Corinthians 11:15 is saying that God gave a woman long hair as a 'Peribolaion' - a natural covering or mantle or veil to distinguish her physically from a man.
So despite the God-given 'Peribolaion', a Christian woman still has to practice 'Katakalupto ' when praying and prophesying. Thank you

One thing is clear, people don't want their deep rooted beliefs overturned.

Yahushuabride1:


Thanks. May God bless you.
Some reasons why women in the western world don't wish to cover their hair during prayer, worship and prophesying:

By Michael K.10:31 AM
www.headcoveringmovement.com
" If we are honest there are two reasons why the church does not teach that women should cover.

1: Women don't want to cover. They don't want to be distinct from the culture. They want to be 'fashionable'.

2: Most men are afraid of women, their wives included. So those that teach, find an excuse to dismiss passages that they know will offend women.

In both cases, it is sin. The fear of man, or women in this case, above a reverence for God's Word."

true.

Yahushuabride1:
J

In the original Greek bible the word 'Katakalupto' is the word that the Apostle Paul used in I Corinthians 11:4 -13. 'Katakalupto' means ' to cover up', or the covering you have to put on, such as a scarf, hat, veil.
Then the Greek word for 'covering' in 1 Corinthians 11:15 is 'Peribolaion'.
Therefore, 1 Corinthians 11:15 is saying that God gave a woman long hair as a 'Peribolaion' - a natural covering or mantle or veil to distinguish her physically from a man.
So despite the God-given 'Peribolaion', a Christian woman still has to practice 'Katakalupto ' when praying and prophesying. Thank you

Let's study it carefully:

1Cor 11v15 -But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a COVERING (peribolaion).

"Peribolaion" -means "a covering thrown around or a mantle or a veil".

So from this verse, a woman's hair is her covering, her mantle, her veil.

You defined your own "peribolaion" as " natural covering or mantle or veil". That's not true. The "natural" part was added by you to aid your argument. And its wrong.

Peribolaion simply means a covering, a mantle or a veil; whether natural or not. Look at this:

Hebrews 1v12 -And as a VESTURE or veil (peribolaion) shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

You see this? Here peribolaion is used as veil or vesture, and not in the context of natural covering. Natural or not natural is immaterial to the definition and scriptural usage of peribolaion.

So when scripture says a woman's hair is given her for a peribolaion (covering); it means that to God, a woman's hair is a mantle or a veil for her. Her hair is just like a literal mantle or veil in God's eyes.

So a woman wearing a literal veil on her head and a woman with a hair that covers her head are both covered. Because to God, hair and veil are both coverings (peribolaion).

Then for the other word -"Katakalypto"

1Cor 11v6 -For if the woman be not covered (katakalypto), let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered (katakalypto).

"Katakalypto" -means "to cover up; to veil or cover one's self."

So what is the difference between "katakalypto" and "peribolaion" ?

Katakalypto is a verb; it means to cover up or to veil one's self. It is the act of covering one's self.

While peribolaion is a noun; it means a covering, a mantle or a veil. It is the thing you cover up with.

So you cover up with a covering. In other words; you katakalypto with a peribolaion.

Katakalypto is not an extra covering on top of peribolaion as you implied. No. "Periobolaion" is what you "katakalypto" with. And peribolaion can be a veil, or a mantle or a woman's hair.

In the eyes of the scripture (and of God); a womans hair is her peribolaion (covering). So a woman with hair that covers her head is covered (kaatakalyto).

If a woman decides to wear a mantle on top of her hair, that's fine. But even if she doesn't, her hair is covering enough in the eyes of God.

Mantle, veil, wig, weave, hat, beret ...and a woman's hair ARE ALL PERIBOLAION (covering). They are things you cover up (katakalypto) with.

Shalom

spencerwilliams:
If you naturally have long heir like the white women,you need not to cover your head,because it was given to you by God. But if you have the black woman's heir you have to cover it,because you do not naturally have long heir,it is wrong to use relaxers and attachments and say "Long heir is given for a covering" that attachment is not your heir and thus it was not GIVEN by God. So lets understand that fact. God bless you.

Somebody is giving us another insight.

Christian, Muslim women inherited the hair covering tradition from Judaism.

The reason is to avoid tempting angels from heaven to come down and Bleep them.

Do your research properly.

What a generation, like lawyers, scanning for loopholes in the Bible in order to give credence to their ill actions. What will it cost you to cover your hair with a piece of cloth for a few minutes or hours of prayers?

Quite pathetic that some Christians are not ready to let anything go, unwilling to count anything dung for eternal glory. No one wants to make any loss while following JESUS. Sugar-loving milk-buttered Christians...no selfless sacrifice whatsoever!

For those of you citing Americans and Europeans, they were never, are not and will never be GOD'S standard for Christians.

Broad is the way that leads to destruction and many will opt for it. But narrow is the way that leads to life eternal and only a few will find it. Many are called but few are chosen. Let me walk with the few because the friendship of this world is in enmity with GOD.

As for me and my house we will serve the LORD in righteousness, peace and joy in the HOLY GHOST.

My God, no be small thing dey go on for here oo, I begin dey see kpatakalypto and peribololoan all because some women want to show off their braids while others want to cover their thread style

But on a more serious note, even though I do not agree with the OP and her postulations, I think 1cor11v16 has a very important role to play in all of this,when Paul had finished his argument he said "But if anyone seems to be contentious, then we have no such customs, nor do the Churches of God." kjv

imas:
My God, no be small thing dey go on for here oo, I begin dey see kpatakalypto and peribololoan all because some women want to show off their braids while others want to cover their thread style

imas:
But on a more serious not, even though I do not agree with the OP and her postulations, I think 1cor11v16 has a very important role to play in all of this,when Paul had finished his argument he said "But if anyone seems to be contentions, then we have no such customs, nor do the Churches of God." kjv

Brother, you're right, and its very unfortunate about the petty things we let divide us in the church. I even feel ashamed getting involved in this debate and letting everyone see the petty things we christians are still arguing over.

We need to understand the pagan practise of the time of the apostles to really appreciate the reason why Paul said what he said to the Corinthian church.

During that time (the first century church), many women in pagan worship, always cut their hair in sacrifice to their gods, when they need something. And some keep short hair as an act of penance for sin or for self-mutilation as a sign of piety or devoted worship. That practise is even still common in hinduism and budhism.

I believe this was the practise christian converts from pagan worship were trying to bring into the Corinthian church. Using cutting of their hair as tool of supplication to God, or keeping short hair as a symbol of piety and devotion.

And Paul gave instructions to counter this pagan worship culture that new converts from paganism were bringing into the church.

He told them (I'm paraphrasing), your hair is given you as a covering by God, don't cut it in supplication to God, or keep it short as an act of worship to God. If you will not grow your hair, why not just go bald altogether? If you're ashamed of going bald, then cover up with it by letting it grow.

The pagan worship of cutting the hair as a tool of supplication or keeping it short as an act of sacrifice and worship was the custom Paul said we christians don't have in the church.

The whole instruction was about stopping the introduction of that pagan practise into the church. In christianity, God does not need your hair as an offering or sacrifice to answer your prayers.

But along the line; hard line conservatives highjacked the doctrine and went above what was written; and said even the hair is not covering enough, you must wear a veil on top of the hair. When scripture already said a woman's hair is her peribolaion (covering, mantle, veil).

The custom the churches don't have is the pagan custom of cutting the hair in supplication or keeping short hair as an act of sacrificial worship or devotion.

Shalom!

ayoku777:


Brother, you're right, and its very unfortunate about the petty things we let divide us in the church. I even feel ashamed getting involved in this debate and letting everyone see the petty things we christians are still arguing over.

We need to understand the pagan practise of the time of the apostles to really appreciate the reason why Paul said what he said to the Corinthian church.

During that time (the first century church), many women in pagan worship, always cut their hair in sacrifice to their gods, when they need something. And some keep short hair as an act of penance for sin or for self-mutilation as a sign of piety or devoted worship. That practise is even still common in hinduism and budhism.

I believe this was the practise christian converts from pagan worship were trying to bring into the Corinthian church. Using cutting of their hair as tool of supplication to God, or keeping short hair as a symbol of piety and devotion.

And Paul gave instructions to counter this pagan worship culture that new converts from paganism were bringing into the church.

He told them (I'm paraphrasing), your hair is given you as a covering by God, don't cut it in supplication to God, or keep it short as an act of worship to God. If you will not grow your hair, why not just go bald altogether? If you're ashamed of going bald, then cover up with it by letting it grow.

The pagan worship of cutting the hair as a tool of supplication or keeping it short as an act of sacrifice and worship was the custom Paul said we christians don't have in the church.

The whole instruction was about stopping the introduction of that pagan practise into the church. In christianity, God does not need your hair as an offering or sacrifice to answer your prayers.

But along the line; hard line conservatives highjacked the doctrine and went above what was written; and said even the hair is not covering enough, you must wear a veil on top of the hair. When scripture already said a woman's hair is her peribolaion (covering, mantle, veil).

The custom the churches don't have is the pagan custom of cutting the hair in supplication or keeping short hair as an act of sacrificial worship or devotion.

Shalom!

Well, you've made your submission, but how can you explain away 1 Corinthians 11:10 ' for a woman ought to Cover her head because of the Angels ?

Are angels not ageless beings that don't grow old ? But have been existing for eternity ?
Are angels changed by changes in cultural and societal norms of human beings on planet earth ?
Have Angels stopped beholding the face of God every day ?

God's Angels are observing Christians and all humanity all the time.

Let's not forget even for a split second that ' forever oh Lord thy word is settled in heaven ' Psalm 119:89 KJV

If the woman's long hair is the 'covering' why don't all Christian men ensure that they are bald before they pray or prophesy ?

ayoku777:


Brother, you're right, and its very unfortunate about the petty things we let divide us in the church. I even feel ashamed getting involved in this debate and letting everyone see the petty things we christians are still arguing over.

We need to understand the pagan practise of the time of the apostles to really appreciate the reason why Paul said what he said to the Corinthian church.

During that time (the first century church), many women in pagan worship, always cut their hair in sacrifice to their gods, when they need something. And some keep short hair as an act of penance for sin or for self-mutilation as a sign of piety or devoted worship. That practise is even still common in hinduism and budhism.

I believe this was the practise christian converts from pagan worship were trying to bring into the Corinthian church. Using cutting of their hair as tool of supplication to God, or keeping short hair as a symbol of piety and devotion.

And Paul gave instructions to counter this pagan worship culture that new converts from paganism were bringing into the church.

He told them (I'm paraphrasing), your hair is given you as a covering by God, don't cut it in supplication to God, or keep it short as an act of worship to God. If you will not grow your hair, why not just go bald altogether? If you're ashamed of going bald, then cover up with it by letting it grow.

The pagan worship of cutting the hair as a tool of supplication or keeping it short as an act of sacrifice and worship was the custom Paul said we christians don't have in the church.

The whole instruction was about stopping the introduction of that pagan practise into the church. In christianity, God does not need your hair as an offering or sacrifice to answer your prayers.

But along the line; hard line conservatives highjacked the doctrine and went above what was written; and said even the hair is not covering enough, you must wear a veil on top of the hair. When scripture already said a woman's hair is her peribolaion (covering, mantle, veil).

The custom the churches don't have is the pagan custom of cutting the hair in supplication or keeping short hair as an act of sacrificial worship or devotion.

Shalom!

If the woman's long hair is the 'covering' why don't all Christian men ensure that they are bald before they pray or prophesy ?

ayoku777:


Let's study it carefully:

1Cor 11v15 -But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a COVERING (peribolaion).

"Peribolaion" -means "a covering thrown around or a mantle or a veil".

So from this verse, a woman's hair is her covering, her mantle, her veil.

You defined your own "peribolaion" as " natural covering or mantle or veil". That's not true. The "natural" part was added by you to aid your argument. And its wrong.

Peribolaion simply means a covering, a mantle or a veil; whether natural or not. Look at this:

Hebrews 1v12 -And as a VESTURE or veil (peribolaion) shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

You see this? Here peribolaion is used as veil or vesture, and not in the context of natural covering. Natural or not natural is immaterial to the definition and scriptural usage of peribolaion.

So when scripture says a woman's hair is given her for a peribolaion (covering); it means that to God, a woman's hair is a mantle or a veil for her. Her hair is just like a literal mantle or veil in God's eyes.

So a woman wearing a literal veil on her head and a woman with a hair that covers her head are both covered. Because to God, hair and veil are both coverings (peribolaion).

Then for the other word -"Katakalypto"

1Cor 11v6 -For if the woman be not covered (katakalypto), let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered (katakalypto).

"Katakalypto" -means "to cover up; to veil or cover one's self."

So what is the difference between "katakalypto" and "peribolaion" ?

Katakalypto is a verb; it means to cover up or to veil one's self. It is the act of covering one's self.

While peribolaion is a noun; it means a covering, a mantle or a veil. It is the thing you cover up with.

So you cover up with a covering. In other words; you katakalypto with a peribolaion.

Katakalypto is not an extra covering on top of peribolaion as you implied. No. "Periobolaion" is what you "katakalypto" with. And peribolaion can be a veil, or a mantle or a woman's hair.

In the eyes of the scripture (and of God); a womans hair is her peribolaion (covering). So a woman with hair that covers her head is covered (kaatakalyto).

If a woman decides to wear a mantle on top of her hair, that's fine. But even if she doesn't, her hair is covering enough in the eyes of God.

Mantle, veil, wig, weave, hat, beret ...and a woman's hair ARE ALL PERIBOLAION (covering). They are things you cover up (katakalypto) with.

Shalom

If the woman's long hair or hair is the 'covering' why don't all Christian men ensure that they are bald before they pray or prophesy ?
Mind you, majority of Christian women in the western world right now don't have long hair. They are busy sporting short hair. In fact the shorter the hair, the more fashionable they are. Therefore , all those theologians who are corrupting the newer bible versions and misinterpreting God's instruction have removed ' long hair ' from their bible commentaries and new age bibles. They keep shifting their bible commentaries as dictated by the mandate given to women from the secular fashion patterns.

ayoku777:


Brother, you're right, and its very unfortunate about the petty things we let divide us in the church. I even feel ashamed getting involved in this debate and letting everyone see the petty things we christians are still arguing over.

We need to understand the pagan practise of the time of the apostles to really appreciate the reason why Paul said what he said to the Corinthian church.

During that time (the first century church), many women in pagan worship, always cut their hair in sacrifice to their gods, when they need something. And some keep short hair as an act of penance for sin or for self-mutilation as a sign of piety or devoted worship. That practise is even still common in hinduism and budhism.

I believe this was the practise christian converts from pagan worship were trying to bring into the Corinthian church. Using cutting of their hair as tool of supplication to God, or keeping short hair as a symbol of piety and devotion.

And Paul gave instructions to counter this pagan worship culture that new converts from paganism were bringing into the church.

He told them (I'm paraphrasing), your hair is given you as a covering by God, don't cut it in supplication to God, or keep it short as an act of worship to God. If you will not grow your hair, why not just go bald altogether? If you're ashamed of going bald, then cover up with it by letting it grow.

The pagan worship of cutting the hair as a tool of supplication or keeping it short as an act of sacrifice and worship was the custom Paul said we christians don't have in the church.

The whole instruction was about stopping the introduction of that pagan practise into the church. In christianity, God does not need your hair as an offering or sacrifice to answer your prayers.

But along the line; hard line conservatives highjacked the doctrine and went above what was written; and said even the hair is not covering enough, you must wear a veil on top of the hair. When scripture already said a woman's hair is her peribolaion (covering, mantle, veil).

The custom the churches don't have is the pagan custom of cutting the hair in supplication or keeping short hair as an act of sacrificial worship or devotion.

Shalom!

The reason why the Apostle Paul made this statement in 1 Corinthians 11:16 is because, this same argument we are having now in 2015, was also happening back then, as the early church consisted of a mixed multitude of believers, just as we have today. The apostle Paul was saying that ' if anyone wanted to be contentious or argumentative about the issue of head coverings as it applies differently to Christian men and women, then no other explanation was recognised or to be observed by the churches.
See, not every one accepted what the Apostle Paul preached back then, especially on this topic.
For one, it was very easy for male converts from Judaism to Christianity to be easily spotted and persecuted by their unconverted Jewish brethren for their conversion to Christianity, as the Jewish man would always pray with his head covered like the Jewish Rabbis still do today.
However, once the same Jewish man was seen praying or prophesying without the 'Tallit' or shawl on his head, then he was surely declaring publicaly that he was no more practising Judaism which wouldn't have gone down well with the other Jews.

[quote author=ayoku777 post=38605741]

Let's study it carefully:

1Cor 11v15 -But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a COVERING (peribolaion).

"Peribolaion" -means "a covering thrown around or a mantle or a veil".

So from this verse, a woman's hair is her covering, her mantle, her veil.

You defined your own "peribolaion" as " natural covering or mantle or veil". That's not true. The "natural" part was added by you to aid your argument. And its wrong.

Peribolaion simply means a covering, a mantle or a veil; whether natural or not. Look at this:

Hebrews 1v12 -And as a VESTURE or veil (peribolaion) shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

You see this? Here peribolaion is used as veil or vesture, and not in the context of natural covering. Natural or not natural is immaterial to the definition and scriptural usage of peribolaion.

So when scripture says a woman's hair is given her for a peribolaion (covering); it means that to God, a woman's hair is a mantle or a veil for her. Her hair is just like a literal mantle or veil in God's eyes.

So a woman wearing a literal veil on her head and a woman with a hair that covers her head are both covered. Because to God, hair and veil are both coverings (peribolaion).

Then for the other word -"Katakalypto"

1Cor 11v6 -For if the woman be not covered (katakalypto), let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered (katakalypto).

"Katakalypto" -means "to cover up; to veil or cover one's self."

So what is the difference between "katakalypto" and "peribolaion" ?

Katakalypto is a verb; it means to cover up or to veil one's self. It is the act of covering one's self.

While peribolaion is a noun; it means a covering, a mantle or a veil. It is the thing you cover up with.

So you cover up with a covering. In other words; you katakalypto with a peribolaion.

Katakalypto is not an extra covering on top of peribolaion as you implied. No. "Periobolaion" is what you "katakalypto" with. And peribolaion can be a veil, or a mantle or a woman's hair.

In the eyes of the scripture (and of God); a womans hair is her peribolaion (covering). So a woman with hair that covers her head is covered (kaatakalyto).

If a woman decides to wear a mantle on top of her hair, that's fine. But even if she doesn't, her hair is covering enough in the eyes of God.

Mantle, veil, wig, weave, hat, beret ...and a woman's hair ARE ALL PERIBOLAION (covering). They are things you cover up (katakalypto) with.

Shalom[/quote ]

Many smart women read the I Cor 11 passage and are led astray by commentaries and the confusion of the translation using the word "covering" for both the covering and for the hair. Really smart women check it out in Greek and some of those stumble over the word "instead" thinking they have Found something that lesser Christians have missed. They read the passage in a transliteration and think that their hair is their covering. Let me explain why it is not.

There are many issues hidden by the translation from Greek into English. The biggest one is that from v 5 through v 13 the Greek is using the word Katakalupto and akatakalupto. The "a" in front of the word means "not" the same as when "a" is put in front of the word moral.

Then, at the very end of the teaching a whole different word is used and that is about the hair. That word is peribolaion which is only used one other time in the Bible. The BEST translation of peribolaion is Vest or mantle.

Long hair is like a vest or mantle. Peribolaion also means something you can throw around oneself like a shawl.

At the close of the passage the teaching is totally different than putting a covering, a katakalupto, on your head. The passage in Greek teaches women to do that and in addition it teaches that your long hair is like a vest. When the passage says, "instead" the hair is given instead of a covering the Greek is saying that the hair is given instead of a vest, not instead of the head covering katakalupto.

I know it's difficult. I know it would have "popped" out so much more clearly if the translators had simply translated the close of the passage the way the Greek does ...

"A woman/wife is have long hair, glory to her it is; for the long hair instead of a vest is given to her."

That is the exact teaching in Greek.

There is no way the Bible is saying wear your hair instead of your vest. It's saying that your long hair could be vest-like, mantle-like it covers that well. But the passage does not say that your hair/vest is THE covering, the katakalupto, so painstakingly taught above.

If the hair is THE covering then men need to take their hair off to pray or prophesy and it makes the passage silly because people don't put on hair and take off hair. The verb tense is in the "putting" on. An action; that's the tense when teaching the katakalupto covering.

I too looked for any way to get out of covering. Any way to get out of it would have worked for me. I too noticed that with 3 strong reasons given in the passage to cover I could not find an excuse.

The headship order = God, Jesus, Man, Woman
The order of creation = man, then woman
The Angels = which have been around a long time

No cultural reason is given, only "long-term" reasons are given.

This is why Christians obeyed I Cor 11 for 2000 years and only stopped around 40 or 50 years ago. Coverers are outnumbered now, but that was not the case for 2000 years. This "not" covering situation is new in church history.

http://peaceablewisdom..com.au/2011/03/hair-is-not-covering.html?m=1


Thank you.