before i read about it in hadith's av seen it in Chinese film... eating flies isn't odd.. it's hadith's that make me understand why to eat it... understand?

shahydbinaliyu:
before i read about it in hadith's av seen it in Chinese film... eating flies isn't odd.. it's hadith's that make me understand why to eat it... understand?

How often do you eat it since you have discovered? You need not buy meat again as there are more than enough in open toilets. Islam is capable of turning humans into something else.

You will not have gathered a basket full before you find yoursel in Yaba left or Aro.

talkingtruth:


How often do you eat it since you have discovered? You need not buy meat again as there are more than enough in open toilets. Islam is capable of turning humans into something else.

You will not have gathered a basket full before you find yoursel in Yaba left or Aro.

no wonder you a christian... foolish idiot

shahydbinaliyu:



no wonder you a christian... foolish idiot

Yes, am a Christian who do not believe in the medical science of an illiterate Muhammad. He knew medicine but failed to prescribe one for his terrorists who ate poison. He too died of same poison for which he had no medical solution.

talkingtruth:


Yes, am a Christian who do not believe in the medical science of an illiterate Muhammad. He knew medicine but failed to prescribe one for his terrorists who ate poison. He too died of same poison for which he had no medical solution.

laughing... you no nothing about your religion, you know nothing about Islam, we teach you about it and you refuse.. you wey no know Jesus real name and language he spoke when he was alive a go dey follow argue... smh.. park well.. go bring your pastor to come debate with me

shahydbinaliyu:



laughing... you no nothing about your religion, you know nothing about Islam, we teach you about it and you refuse.. you wey no know Jesus real name and language he spoke when he was alive a go dey follow argue... smh.. park well.. go bring your pastor to come debate with me

Trash!

To me , if house fly land ontop my food, if I'm sure I can locate the part of the food it fell on , ill remove that part and throw it away. If I can't locate it and I dnt have any other food , ill remove all the top exposed part of the food.
I wunt deliberately swallow a known desease cus I feel the antitdote is in the wings.

Now my questions, is it scientifically proven that the antitdote is in the wings ?
Can those antitidotes work for man as it works for the flies without adjustment to the natural nature of the antidotes present in the wings of flies.

Man and flies have different biological makeup. viruses, bacterias dangerous to man can be harmless to flies and vice visa, antidotes that man use to cure deseases can be dangerous to flies and vice visa.

Flies use their so called antidotes in their so called wings to prevent diseases and not to cure them. But in human case , prophet moh was postulating a cure and not prevention which should have been a better postulation.

Interesting Topic?! Interesting Responds?!

So many scientific theories and discoveries later found to be myth. And so many reliable scientific discoveries which have helped the development of human race in one way or the other. Scientific discoveries sometimes go back and forth.

Here comes "Islamic-scientific claims" in the Qur'an and Hadith?! Many muslims are fond of interpreting Quran and hadith in line with scientific facts to prove their respective authenticity. That's a deadly approach. If tomorrow science correct its initial blunders, muslims tend to find himself at a cross road to re-interpret or fanatically stood by his initial "scientific-faulty Qur'anic interpretations".

I am proud to say there is absolutely no scientific blunders in the Qur'an. Obviously because God Himself promised to protect the Book from alteration and distortion. Leaving aside what man have not discovered yet, there are lots of blunders and lies ascribed to the holy Prophet (peace be upon him and his household).

I never doubt the sayings of my beloved Prophet but the doubts revolve round the chain of transmitters, the collectors and the compilers of the Saying. These people are obviously not infallible (masoom) and Allah never promised to protect the "recorded sayings of the Prophet". Another thing is the accuracy in the transmission of the report (exact wording); and of course the comprehension of the reporter.

Sunni believed so much in every single hadith found in "Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim" and always try hard to defend by all means even if such hadith blatantly contradict the text of the infallible Qur'an and common sense. There are many ahadith in these two grand books that were nothing but fabrication.

Hadith of Camel's Urine and Flies
I first read these ahadith 18 - 20years ago with commentaries claiming those "prophetic-wording" were found to be true after years of research at the University of Medina, Saudi-Arabia. Unfortunately, till date most of these so-called researches were only discovered in Saudi Arabia.

On the contrary, non-muslim scientists that have proven so many Quranic and hadith scientific theories to be true, proved these claims of Camel's Urine and Flies of a thing to be nothing but myth.
We tend to believe them if their conclusion synchronize with our theories but disregard them if it doesn't.

Professor Maurice Buccaile, a renown French scientist who wrote "The Bible, the Qur'an and Science", talked extensively on these pseudo-hadith to be scientific wrong. Not to mention some other Muslim scientists in this modern, technological developed age.

There are lots of ancient believes and cultural practices of the Arabs pertaining to Camels. And there is possibility that bedoiun Arabs as part of their age-long cultural norms used to drink Camel's urine before the Prophet. Perhaps these hadith is fabricated to keep the norm. Allah knows best.
[size=25pt]The Hadith of Camel's Urine and Flies are nothing but Lies Ascribed to the holy Prophet[/size]


The following are scientific respond to the myth and claims of those ahadith:
http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Diseases_and_Cures_in_the_Wings_of_Houseflies

http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Camel_Urine_and_Islam

They ask you (O Muhammad) as to what is allowed to them (for eating and use). Say: The pure/good (toyib) things are allowed to you..." {al-Maidah:
4}

^ that's fair enough albaqir. But understand that some of these modern medicines contained animal products including but not limited to their sh*t itself.

Empiree:
^ that's fair enough albaqir. But understand that some of these modern medicines contained animal products including but not limited to their sh*t itself.

Yes. I like it the way you put it "animal product". Absolutely not their excretion (urine and sh*t). Islam forbids these because they are impure.

AlBaqir:


Yes. I like it the way you put it "animal product". Absolutely not their excretion (urine and sh*t). Islam forbids these because they are impure.

Agree

@ AIBaqir . I hope ur post stops any further attempt to claim the correctness scientificaly or otherwise of those hadiths where the camel urine issue or fly wing cure are claimed.
So now What is to be done to those hadiths, pull it out the rank of authentic hadiths?


@others , modified extracts from components that make up animal poo is what in used as part of the make up of drugs. U dnt just swallow the whole poo or urine just because something good is in it ! Haba !

@ AlBaqir

Warn that your fanatical brother, shahydbinaliyu who said he would be eating flies before he kills himself o!

Now, I read your post in the muslim section on science of hadiths. I noticed it was hypocritical. As far as you are concerned, any hadith that can be faulted is fabrication. How can you term as a fabrication hadith written by authentic writters, which you accept their other writings that favour islam as correct? That is double standard.

Why not simply eat the house fly if it contains a disease and its cure?
And catch a few more and eat them?
Why dip it in your food while you can simply chew the darn thing?

The prophet has a way of idiots of having his followers desperately trying to prove his stupid theories. Had he said one shud eat the house fly landing on his food we would be seeing these Muslim idiots looking to justify his Allah nonsese.
How long should one dip that housefly in his food before the antidote is released? Two minutes?

talkingtruth:
@ AlBaqir

Warn that your fanatical brother, shahydbinaliyu who said he would be eating flies before he kills himself o!

Now, I read your post in the muslim section on science of hadiths. I noticed it was hypocritical. As far as you are concerned, any hadith that can be faulted is fabrication. How can you term as a fabrication hadith written by authentic writters, which you accept their other writings that favour islam as correct? That is double standard.

I said this on the first page actually

E.mpiree:
The way to agree or disagree with hadith is through classifications.

@underlined, is talking about if hadith is Sound, Good, Weak, Fabricated. I am not in position to really say whether it's a fabricated hadith or not. And I dont know its classification either. I have to check that. alBaqir could be right though. And if it's a fabricated hadith, (which probably the case) because of the verse of Quran quouted by baqir, then it's not from the prophet(saw). And Allah knows best

As for what to do with it, well, it stays there. Maybe in another century, it will vanish. Hadith resembles Bible where different folks narrated stuff. But hey, even hadith is more reliable than Bible because most hadith narrators are known by their first and last names. No offence intended.

Empiree:
I said this on the first page actually

@underlined, is talking about if hadith is Sound, Good, Weak, Fabricated. I am not in position to really say whether it's a fabricated hadith or not. And I dont know its classification either. I have to check that. alBaqir could be right though. And if it's a fabricated hadith, (which probably the case) because of the verse of Quran quouted by baqir, then it's not from the prophet(saw). And Allah knows best

As for what to do with it, well, it stays there. Maybe in another century, it will vanish. Hadith resembles Bible where different folks narrated stuff. But hey, even hadith is more reliable than Bible because most hadith narrators are known by their first and last names. No offence intended.

If hadiths are more reliable, why do you guys say many of them are fabricated?

Who fabricated them?

Who ever said any part of the bible is fabricated?

Why is the quran so inconsistent, is it not due to fabrications by the scribes or deliberate attempt by allahh to deceive mankind?

talkingtruth:


If hadiths are more reliable, why do you guys say many of them are fabricated?

Who fabricated them?

Who ever said any part of the bible is fabricated?

Why is the quran so inconsistent, is it not due to fabrications by the scribes or deliberate attempt by allahh to deceive mankind?

who told you that?. You are a christian so you have no idea of classification of hadith. So go and take your sit. @ underlined, that's just you opinion. Take your sit

Empiree:
who told you that?. You are a christian so you have no idea of classification of hadith. So go and take your sit. @ underlined, that's just you opinion. Take your sit

You couldn't answer other questions.

Quran is inconsistent, this just one of them:

https://www.nairaland.com/2317388/does-allah-choose-messengers

I will give you more if you like.

Empiree:
I beg to disagree with AbuuUsamah. Be careful brother. Op is a kufar. He's only looking for loopholes. The way to agree or disagree with hadith is through classifications. I dont care what Op think. Urine from Carmel was raised on another thread a while back which I answered. See there is wisdom in what prophet(SAAW) taught in as much as it's authentically narrated. For instance dying beard etc.

The issue of Urine was in fact proven to be true medically. It's irrelevant whether the kufar agreed with it or not. This is not to say drinking directly from Carmel bosom in our time is appropriate. Thats not the case since we now have aesthetics which did not exist back then. There are Muslim medical students that research on issue like this in USA. I kind of dealt with it a little on this back in March I think. A little bit of research (if you can) will put the op in permanent state of shut.

There is always wisdom behind every authentic statement of the prophet(SAW). We just dont know yet. I dont think this kufar self proclaimed truthman realized that there are animal products in the so called pills that he takes. Yes, many of them contain animal products like horse manure and pig urine etc.

[b]
Thank you so much my brother, Empiree, for your observation. May Allah love you. By Allah, I do not give a damn about the OP's feeling! I am one of those who are soft and merciful towards my Muslim brothers and sisters, but hard on the infidels. I practise the sunnah; I grow my beards, I practice nisfussaq (hanging the hem of my trousers halfway between the knee and the ankle), and I even dip flies in my food whenever they fall in it. I love the Prophet and I'm proud of his sunnah! And let me repeat this: I am hard on the infidels!!!

So don't think I'm an apologetic Muslim. I did not say all that I said because I had a feeling of complex practising the sunnah, or because I felt the sunnah was not for the modern day Muslim. Rather, I said them because I knew what I was saying.

Now, the main issue: Is there wisdom in everything the prophet says? Wallahi, there is. But mind you, I say, if it is outside the realm of how to worship Allah, or issues which are solely of the deen, then it is investigable. I repeat, it is investigable. Whatever the prophet says outside 'how to worship Allah' is investigable, but valid till it is proven otherwise.

Let me bring this closer to you - Although, I can't remember the hadith verbatim - when the prophet saw some people planting the date (dabinu in Hausa) seeds in a way that they would separate the seeds from each other, he asked them to plant the seeds together and the people obeyed him. But when it was time for harvest, they went back to him and said: "O prophet of Allah, the dates you asked us to grow in that particular manner you mentioned did not grow at all" and he replied them saying: "I only advised you, you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life".
"أنتم أعلم بأمور دنياكم. "
This hadeeth is classified as saheeh by Al 'alaamah al-albaaniyy.


Take not of that remark " you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life". What was he trying to say? It was that Allah had not sent him to teach them how to plant dates, and on a bigger scale, how to attend to the pure issues of this worldy life, which include, but not restricted to : farming, engineering and medicine.

Understand this brother; when the prophet told them to plant in that manner, he didn't say Allah ordered them to. And wallahi, if he had said so, there'd be no doubt as to whether it was the best way of planting the seeds or not, because Allah knows everything but the prophet doesn't.

This issue, clearly, was not an issue of how to worship Allah, where one might say that he definitely was correct, without having to investigate. After all, when Allah said in the Quran that: " the prophet does not talk out of his desires, except that it was revealed to him by Allah. " [Chapter 53, verse 3], if Allah had meant that there was nothing the prophet said that he had not revealed to him, it would mean that in this issue of planting the dates as well, It had been revealed to him, and at the end of the day, he was wrong, which would imply that Allah too was wrong. It is clear from this verse that what Allah intended was issues of the deen; how to worship Allah and everything that relates to that.

This was however an issue of the worldly life. So I say - and I have my Salaf in this saying - that the prophet can make mistakes when it comes to worldly issues. This is also the response of the permanent committee for Islamic affairs in the KSA when they were asked if the Prophet ever made mistakes. Please check 'Islam q and a' for this issue.

The prophet was not a medical doctor. And as much as I love the prophetic medicine, I always say that if orthodox medicine scientifically faults anything in it, I would go for orthodox. Mind you, I said if it scientifically 'faults'. Do not compare the Prophet with orthodox doctors when it comes to medicine, or compare him with engineers when it comes to how to build a house. That is not the prophet's realm, his realm is basically how to teach us to earn Allah's pleasure in this world and the next.

All I've said does not mean that I do not believe in prophetic Medicine. I do, as long as orthodox medicine does not fault it. I repeat, the prophet wasn't a doctor or engineer. He did not come to teach us engineering or medicine. He came to teach us our deen.

Please understand this; As regards the issue of dipping flies in my food, I have done that so many times because I believe what the prophet said, and I have never researched this issue from the medical aspect. But if one day, I get convincing proof that it is medically wrong, I will drop it.

Up till now, I have not gotten that proof and I do not even believe the OP's claim. So dipping flies in my food remains as a sunnah, and I will continue doing it. And to you OP, I don't give a damn about how you feel about it.

One last thing, my brother, Empiree. I am not of those people who believe that the hadeeth should not be followed because it contradicts the Qur'an, or because it is not the direct words of Allah, and thus can not be given the same reverence as the Qur'an. I believe that the hadeeth explains the Qur-an and that no one can have full understanding of the Quran without understanding the hadeeth. I am a student of knowledge and know the importance of the hadeeth. I also believe that the authenticity or otherwise of a hadeeth should not be based on how we feel about the hadeeth, but rather, on it's classification, after looking at its matn and sanad.

بارك الله فيكم وجزاكم عني خيرا

[/b]

AlBaqir:
Interesting Topic? but Lies Ascribed to the holy Prophet[/size]


The following are scientific respond to the myth and claims of those ahadith:
http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Diseases_and_Cures_in_the_Wings_of_Houseflies

http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Camel_Urine_and_Islam

They ask you (O Muhammad) as to what is allowed to them (for eating and use). Say: The pure/good (toyib) things are allowed to you..." {al-Maidah:
4}

Salamm bro. Even though I agreed with the rest of your posts, but citing wikiislam (an anti-islam website) is not good enough.

AbuuUsaamah:



Thank you so much my brother, Empiree, for your observation. May Allah love you. By Allah, I do not give a damn about the OP's feeling! I am one of those who are soft and merciful towards my Muslim brothers and sisters, but hard on the infidels. I practise the sunnah; I grow my beards, I practice nisfussaq (hanging the hem of my trousers halfway between the knee and the ankle), and I even dip flies in my food whenever they fall in it. I love the Prophet and I'm proud of his sunnah! And let me repeat this: I am hard on the infidels!!!

Smh

AbuuUsaamah:


[b]
Thank you so much my brother, Empiree, for your observation. May Allah love you. By Allah, I do not give a damn about the OP's feeling! I am one of those who are soft and merciful towards my Muslim brothers and sisters, but hard on the infidels. I practise the sunnah; I grow my beards, I practice nisfussaq (hanging the hem of my trousers halfway between the knee and the ankle), and I even dip flies in my food whenever they fall in it. I love the Prophet and I'm proud of his sunnah! And let me repeat this: I am hard on the infidels!!!

So don't think I'm an apologetic Muslim. I did not say all that I said because I had a feeling of complex practising the sunnah, or because I felt the sunnah was not for the modern day Muslim. Rather, I said them because I knew what I was saying.

Now, the main issue: Is there wisdom in everything the prophet says? Wallahi, there is. But mind you, I say, if it is outside the realm of how to worship Allah, or issues which are solely of the deen, then it is investigable. I repeat, it is investigable. Whatever the prophet says outside 'how to worship Allah' is investigable, but valid till it is proven otherwise.

Let me bring this closer to you - Although, I can't remember the hadith verbatim - when the prophet saw some people planting the date (dabinu in Hausa) seeds in a way that they would separate the seeds from each other, he asked them to plant the seeds together and the people obeyed him. But when it was time for harvest, they went back to him and said: "O prophet of Allah, the dates you asked us to grow in that particular manner you mentioned did not grow at all" and he replied them saying: "I only advised you, you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life".
"أنتم أعلم بأمور دنياكم. "
This hadeeth is classified as saheeh by Al 'alaamah al-albaaniyy.


Take not of that remark " you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life". What was he trying to say? It was that Allah had not sent him to teach them how to plant dates, and on a bigger scale, how to attend to the pure issues of this worldy life, which include, but not restricted to : farming, engineering and medicine.

Understand this brother; when the prophet told them to plant in that manner, he didn't say Allah ordered them to. And wallahi, if he had said so, there'd be no doubt as to whether it was the best way of planting the seeds or not, because Allah knows everything but the prophet doesn't.

This issue, clearly, was not an issue of how to worship Allah, where one might say that he definitely was correct, without having to investigate. After all, when Allah said in the Quran that: " the prophet does not talk out of his desires, except that it was revealed to him by Allah. " [Chapter 53, verse 3], if Allah had meant that there was nothing the prophet said that he had not revealed to him, it would mean that in this issue of planting the dates as well, It had been revealed to him, and at the end of the day, he was wrong, which would imply that Allah too was wrong. It is clear from this verse that what Allah intended was issues of the deen; how to worship Allah and everything that relates to that.

This was however an issue of the worldly life. So I say - and I have my Salaf in this saying - that the prophet can make mistakes when it comes to worldly issues. This is also the response of the permanent committee for Islamic affairs in the KSA when they were asked if the Prophet ever made mistakes. Please check 'Islam q and a' for this issue.

The prophet was not a medical doctor. And as much as I love the prophetic medicine, I always say that if orthodox medicine scientifically faults anything in it, I would go for orthodox. Mind you, I said if it scientifically 'faults'. Do not compare the Prophet with orthodox doctors when it comes to medicine, or compare him with engineers when it comes to how to build a house. That is not the prophet's realm, his realm is basically how to teach us to earn Allah's pleasure in this world and the next.

All I've said does not mean that I do not believe in prophetic Medicine. I do, as long as orthodox medicine does not fault it. I repeat, the prophet wasn't a doctor or engineer. He did not come to teach us engineering or medicine. He came to teach us our deen.

Please understand this; As regards the issue of dipping flies in my food, I have done that so many times because I believe what the prophet said, and I have never researched this issue from the medical aspect. But if one day, I get convincing proof that it is medically wrong, I will drop it.

Up till now, I have not gotten that proof and I do not even believe the OP's claim. So dipping flies in my food remains as a sunnah, and I will continue doing it. And to you OP, I don't give a damn about how you feel about it.
[/b]

Trash!

From your statements, you must be a terrorist, who is so harsh on who you term infidels. People like you are not supposed to live among decent people in the city, you are supposed to be in sambisa forest with your co-terrorists. Merciless people serving merciless god. Smh!

Your lying and wicked allahh said you should obey him and his one and only prophet. You as a muslim is subjecting Muhammad's words to investigations, whether he was wrong or correct. What type of a muslim are you? When Muhammad speaks, faithful muslims believe it is inspired by allahh who is not expected to be fallible. Here you are querying the words of islam prophet, you are an infidel in the real sense of islam.

None of you can understand the true nature of allahh because he spoke to your prophet behind the veil. Why? Hidding himself to deceive. He would say white today and call it black tomorrow referring to the same object. This is exactly the nature of the devil to create confusion. For many of his words, he spoke the reverse.

On this thread, read through and see the way muslims have spoken expressing disagreement with one another: you said the hadith should be investigated, some said it is in order and would start eating flies, another said he would always dip flies into his drink and drink it (without knowing how long it will take for the fly to release the antidote if it has any), then another came saying the whole hadith is fabrication without letting us know who did the fabrication. Everyone of you came competing in who is the greatest in lying. That is islam for you.

talkingtruth:


Trash!

From your statements, you must be a terrorist, who is so harsh on who you term infidels. People like you are not supposed to live among decent people in the city, you are supposed to be in sambisa forest with your co-terrorists. Merciless people serving merciless god. Smh!

Your lying and wicked allahh said you should obey him and his one and only prophet. You as a muslim is subjecting Muhammad's words to investigations, whether he was wrong or correct. What type of a muslim are you? When Muhammad speaks, faithful muslims believe it is inspired by allahh who is not expected to be fallible. Here you are querying the words of islam prophet, you are an infidel in the real sense of islam.

None of you can understand the true nature of allahh because he spoke to your prophet behind the veil. Why? Hidding himself to deceive. He would say white today and call it black tomorrow referring to the same object. This is exactly the nature of the devil to create confusion. For many of his words, he spoke the reverse.

On this thread, read through and see the way muslims have spoken expressing disagreement with one another: you said the hadith should be investigated, some said it is in order and would start eating flies, another said he would always dip flies into his drink and drink it (without knowing how long it will take for the fly to release the antidote if it has any), then another came saying the whole hadith is fabrication without letting us know who did the fabrication. Everyone of you came competing in who is the greatest in lying. That is islam for you.

What do I say to you except that Allah guide you. People have said worse than you just said. I pray you don't realize it only after you'll have breathed your last.

talkingtruth:


Trash!

From your statements, you must be a terrorist, who is so harsh on who you term infidels. People like you are not supposed to live among decent people in the city, you are supposed to be in sambisa forest with your co-terrorists. Merciless people serving merciless god. Smh!

Your lying and wicked allahh said you should obey him and his one and only prophet. You as a muslim is subjecting Muhammad's words to investigations, whether he was wrong or correct. What type of a muslim are you? When Muhammad speaks, faithful muslims believe it is inspired by allahh who is not expected to be fallible. Here you are querying the words of islam prophet, you are an infidel in the real sense of islam.

None of you can understand the true nature of allahh because he spoke to your prophet behind the veil. Why? Hidding himself to deceive. He would say white today and call it black tomorrow referring to the same object. This is exactly the nature of the devil to create confusion. For many of his words, he spoke the reverse.

On this thread, read through and see the way muslims have spoken expressing disagreement with one another: you said the hadith should be investigated, some said it is in order and would start eating flies, another said he would always dip flies into his drink and drink it (without knowing how long it will take for the fly to release the antidote if it has any), then another came saying the whole hadith is fabrication without letting us know who did the fabrication. Everyone of you came competing in who is the greatest in lying. That is islam for you.

honestly, in Islam I don't think there is forgiveness for sinners, the muslim brother hatred for infidels is soo much, comperd to what Jesus say here;

Matthew 5:43-48
Love for Enemies

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love
your neighbor[a] and hate your enemy.’
44 But I tell you, love your enemies and
pray for those who persecute you, 45
that you may be children of your Father
in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on
the evil and the good, and sends rain on
the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 IF
YOU LOVE THOSE WHO LOVE YOU,WHAT
REWARD WILL YOU GET ?ARE NOT EVEN TAX COLLECTORS DOING THAT? 47 And if you greet
only your own people, what are you
doing more than others? Do not even
pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore,
as your heavenly Father is perfect.


AbuuUsaamah if you love thoes who love you, what is your reward? Are not the pagan doing that? The pagan even do more than that.if you see a pagan who is more merciful than you are, then you need to go back to your religious book and search for the problem of you hatred. The true God love sinners and want them to repent, but He hate sin.

AbuuUsaamah:


What do I say to you except that Allah guide you. People have said worse than you just said. I pray you don't realize it only after you'll have breathed your last.

You are pretending to be peaceful after you have borne your heart out that you are harsh on infidels. The bible says ''from the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks''.

Allahh is not the God of heaven, he is an arabian idol. Satan will make jest of you when you get to hell unless you desist following allahh. Satan came to change the truth left by Jesus, twisted the word of the true God, condemned some of His words and presented his own, quran but changed his name to allahh.

Now I'm confused.

The issue has turned from :if someone was right or wrong in a statement attributed to him to if the person did say those words.

Some feel the prophet did say those things about camel urine and fly wings and are desperately looking for medical and scientific proof to back it up, will they ever find it?

Some view he did not say it and those words are fabricated. The question now is where do they now classify the hadiths where those words are found , and do their classification meet general acceptable procedures?

Some now say the prophet said it but he might be wrong as he is not a medical expert, just as he was wrong on planting of seeds as he is not an agricultural expert. So do we have to investigate any natural human development endeavor that the prophet had made comments on to see if he was right or wrong.?

Ill implore non-muslims to refrain from categorization, making derogatory comments on these thread. There are enough muslims on this thread, let us wait till they reach a conclusion on what the truth is. If they do , then others can make comment , if they dnt then......

malvisguy212:
honestly, in Islam I don't think there is forgiveness for sinners, the muslim brother hatred for infidels is soo much, comperd to what Jesus say here;

Matthew 5:43-48
Love for Enemies

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love
your neighbor[a] and hate your enemy.’
44 But I tell you, love your enemies and
pray for those who persecute you, 45
that you may be children of your Father
in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on
the evil and the good, and sends rain on
the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 IF
YOU LOVE THOSE WHO LOVE YOU,WHAT
REWARD WILL YOU GET ?ARE NOT EVEN TAX COLLECTORS DOING THAT? 47 And if you greet
only your own people, what are you
doing more than others? Do not even
pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore,
as your heavenly Father is perfect.


AbuuUsaamah if you love thoes who love you, what is your reward? Are not the pagan doing that? The pagan even do more than that.if you see a pagan who is more merciful than you are, then you need to go back to your religious book and search for the problem of you hatred. The true God love sinners and want them to repent, but He hate sin.

Their god hates unbelievers and so they do too.

AbuuUsaamah:


[b]
Thank you so much my brother, Empiree, for your observation. May Allah love you. By Allah, I do not give a damn about the OP's feeling! I am one of those who are soft and merciful towards my Muslim brothers and sisters, but hard on the infidels. I practise the sunnah; I grow my beards, I practice nisfussaq (hanging the hem of my trousers halfway between the knee and the ankle), and I even dip flies in my food whenever they fall in it. I love the Prophet and I'm proud of his sunnah! And let me repeat this: I am hard on the infidels!!!

So don't think I'm an apologetic Muslim. I did not say all that I said because I had a feeling of complex practising the sunnah, or because I felt the sunnah was not for the modern day Muslim. Rather, I said them because I knew what I was saying.

Now, the main issue: Is there wisdom in everything the prophet says? Wallahi, there is. But mind you, I say, if it is outside the realm of how to worship Allah, or issues which are solely of the deen, then it is investigable. I repeat, it is investigable. Whatever the prophet says outside 'how to worship Allah' is investigable, but valid till it is proven otherwise.

Let me bring this closer to you - Although, I can't remember the hadith verbatim - when the prophet saw some people planting the date (dabinu in Hausa) seeds in a way that they would separate the seeds from each other, he asked them to plant the seeds together and the people obeyed him. But when it was time for harvest, they went back to him and said: "O prophet of Allah, the dates you asked us to grow in that particular manner you mentioned did not grow at all" and he replied them saying: "I only advised you, you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life".
"أنتم أعلم بأمور دنياكم. "
This hadeeth is classified as saheeh by Al 'alaamah al-albaaniyy.


Take not of that remark " you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life". What was he trying to say? It was that Allah had not sent him to teach them how to plant dates, and on a bigger scale, how to attend to the pure issues of this worldy life, which include, but not restricted to : farming, engineering and medicine.

Understand this brother; when the prophet told them to plant in that manner, he didn't say Allah ordered them to. And wallahi, if he had said so, there'd be no doubt as to whether it was the best way of planting the seeds or not, because Allah knows everything but the prophet doesn't.

This issue, clearly, was not an issue of how to worship Allah, where one might say that he definitely was correct, without having to investigate. After all, when Allah said in the Quran that: " the prophet does not talk out of his desires, except that it was revealed to him by Allah. " [Chapter 53, verse 3], if Allah had meant that there was nothing the prophet said that he had not revealed to him, it would mean that in this issue of planting the dates as well, It had been revealed to him, and at the end of the day, he was wrong, which would imply that Allah too was wrong. It is clear from this verse that what Allah intended was issues of the deen; how to worship Allah and everything that relates to that.

This was however an issue of the worldly life. So I say - and I have my Salaf in this saying - that the prophet can make mistakes when it comes to worldly issues. This is also the response of the permanent committee for Islamic affairs in the KSA when they were asked if the Prophet ever made mistakes. Please check 'Islam q and a' for this issue.

The prophet was not a medical doctor. And as much as I love the prophetic medicine, I always say that if orthodox medicine scientifically faults anything in it, I would go for orthodox. Mind you, I said if it scientifically 'faults'. Do not compare the Prophet with orthodox doctors when it comes to medicine, or compare him with engineers when it comes to how to build a house. That is not the prophet's realm, his realm is basically how to teach us to earn Allah's pleasure in this world and the next.

All I've said does not mean that I do not believe in prophetic Medicine. I do, as long as orthodox medicine does not fault it. I repeat, the prophet wasn't a doctor or engineer. He did not come to teach us engineering or medicine. He came to teach us our deen.

Please understand this; As regards the issue of dipping flies in my food, I have done that so many times because I believe what the prophet said, and I have never researched this issue from the medical aspect. But if one day, I get convincing proof that it is medically wrong, I will drop it.

Up till now, I have not gotten that proof and I do not even believe the OP's claim. So dipping flies in my food remains as a sunnah, and I will continue doing it. And to you OP, I don't give a damn about how you feel about it.

One last thing, my brother, Empiree. I am not of those people who believe that the hadeeth should not be followed because it contradicts the Qur'an, or because it is not the direct words of Allah, and thus can not be given the same reverence as the Qur'an. I believe that the hadeeth explains the Qur-an and that no one can have full understanding of the Quran without understanding the hadeeth. I am a student of knowledge and know the importance of the hadeeth. I also believe that the authenticity or otherwise of a hadeeth should not be based on how we feel about the hadeeth, but rather, on it's classification, after looking at its matn and sanad.

بارك الله فيكم وجزاكم عني خيرا

[/b]

Excessive brainwashing can cause madness, and I'm sorry you are going towards that route. So since your prophet asked you not to be a friend to christians and Jews you will obey blindly (quran 5:51). Since your prophet asked you to kill non-muslims wherever you find them you must do that (quran 9:5). Since your prophet asked you to collect jizya from non-muslims you must do that (quran 9:30).

And since your prophet asked you to be harsh to non-muslims you must foolishly obey (quran 48:29). Then you and your prophet are psycopaths and evil human beings.

As foolish as some muslims are, 90% of insfrastuctures in saudi arabia (mecca and medina inclusive) are built by infidels and infidels control over 95% of saudi arabia oil and gas. Why did saudi authorities invite infidels to explore their oil, build their refineries and develop mecca and medina while they asked you backward negroes (I am a black fya) to obey their evil and unholy quran where it has to do with violence against non-muslim?

Who is fooling you? Mohammed, the quran all your ignorance?

Oooh, i got you now. I understand your paragraphy 3 now. This post of your is beautiful. Forget about true2god. The guy dey mesmerize. I like the hadith you paraphrased about dates. Just learning about for the first time. That's nice one.Hadith about dates seems to be saying "use your intellect"

AbuuUsaamah:


[b]
Thank you so much my brother, Empiree, for your observation. May Allah love you. By Allah, I do not give a damn about the OP's feeling! I am one of those who are soft and merciful towards my Muslim brothers and sisters, but hard on the infidels. I practise the sunnah; I grow my beards, I practice nisfussaq (hanging the hem of my trousers halfway between the knee and the ankle), and I even dip flies in my food whenever they fall in it. I love the Prophet and I'm proud of his sunnah! And let me repeat this: I am hard on the infidels!!!

So don't think I'm an apologetic Muslim. I did not say all that I said because I had a feeling of complex practising the sunnah, or because I felt the sunnah was not for the modern day Muslim. Rather, I said them because I knew what I was saying.

Now, the main issue: Is there wisdom in everything the prophet says? Wallahi, there is. But mind you, I say, if it is outside the realm of how to worship Allah, or issues which are solely of the deen, then it is investigable. I repeat, it is investigable. Whatever the prophet says outside 'how to worship Allah' is investigable, but valid till it is proven otherwise.

Let me bring this closer to you - Although, I can't remember the hadith verbatim - when the prophet saw some people planting the date (dabinu in Hausa) seeds in a way that they would separate the seeds from each other, he asked them to plant the seeds together and the people obeyed him. But when it was time for harvest, they went back to him and said: "O prophet of Allah, the dates you asked us to grow in that particular manner you mentioned did not grow at all" and he replied them saying: "I only advised you, you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life".
"أنتم أعلم بأمور دنياكم. "
This hadeeth is classified as saheeh by Al 'alaamah al-albaaniyy.


Take not of that remark " you are more knowledgeable of the issues of your worldly life". What was he trying to say? It was that Allah had not sent him to teach them how to plant dates, and on a bigger scale, how to attend to the pure issues of this worldy life, which include, but not restricted to : farming, engineering and medicine.

Understand this brother; when the prophet told them to plant in that manner, he didn't say Allah ordered them to. And wallahi, if he had said so, there'd be no doubt as to whether it was the best way of planting the seeds or not, because Allah knows everything but the prophet doesn't.

This issue, clearly, was not an issue of how to worship Allah, where one might say that he definitely was correct, without having to investigate. After all, when Allah said in the Quran that: " the prophet does not talk out of his desires, except that it was revealed to him by Allah. " [Chapter 53, verse 3], if Allah had meant that there was nothing the prophet said that he had not revealed to him, it would mean that in this issue of planting the dates as well, It had been revealed to him, and at the end of the day, he was wrong, which would imply that Allah too was wrong. It is clear from this verse that what Allah intended was issues of the deen; how to worship Allah and everything that relates to that.

This was however an issue of the worldly life. So I say - and I have my Salaf in this saying - that the prophet can make mistakes when it comes to worldly issues. This is also the response of the permanent committee for Islamic affairs in the KSA when they were asked if the Prophet ever made mistakes. Please check 'Islam q and a' for this issue.

The prophet was not a medical doctor. And as much as I love the prophetic medicine, I always say that if orthodox medicine scientifically faults anything in it, I would go for orthodox. Mind you, I said if it scientifically 'faults'. Do not compare the Prophet with orthodox doctors when it comes to medicine, or compare him with engineers when it comes to how to build a house. That is not the prophet's realm, his realm is basically how to teach us to earn Allah's pleasure in this world and the next.

All I've said does not mean that I do not believe in prophetic Medicine. I do, as long as orthodox medicine does not fault it. I repeat, the prophet wasn't a doctor or engineer. He did not come to teach us engineering or medicine. He came to teach us our deen.

Please understand this; As regards the issue of dipping flies in my food, I have done that so many times because I believe what the prophet said, and I have never researched this issue from the medical aspect. But if one day, I get convincing proof that it is medically wrong, I will drop it.

Up till now, I have not gotten that proof and I do not even believe the OP's claim. So dipping flies in my food remains as a sunnah, and I will continue doing it. And to you OP, I don't give a damn about how you feel about it.

One last thing, my brother, Empiree. I am not of those people who believe that the hadeeth should not be followed because it contradicts the Qur'an, or because it is not the direct words of Allah, and thus can not be given the same reverence as the Qur'an. I believe that the hadeeth explains the Qur-an and that no one can have full understanding of the Quran without understanding the hadeeth. I am a student of knowledge and know the importance of the hadeeth. I also believe that the authenticity or otherwise of a hadeeth should not be based on how we feel about the hadeeth, but rather, on it's classification, after looking at its matn and sanad.

بارك الله فيكم وجزاكم عني خيرا

[/b]

Rilwayne001:


Salamm bro. Even though I agreed with the rest of your posts, but citing wikiislam (an anti-islam website) is not good enough.

Really I have no other choice for the website presented the scientific argument more precisely. I knew the website is anti-Islam but am more concern with their precise scientific argument than others have seen so far. This is the sole reason have used it.

O you who believe! Stand out firmly for Allah and be just witnesses and let not the enmity and hatred of others make you avoid justice. Be just: that is nearer to piety, and fear Allah. Verily, Allah is Well-Acquainted with what you do. {Maidah: 8}

Rilwayne001:


Salamm bro. Even though I agreed with the rest of your posts, but citing wikiislam (an anti-islam website) is not good enough.

You think he is like you twisting truth? Smh!

alBaqir is the only muslim I have seen so far very close to the truth.

talkingtruth:

You think he is like you twisting truth? Smh!
alBaqir is the only muslim I have seen so far very close to the truth.

lmao
You are OYO