dolphinheart:
The questions are an integral part of the post, you can't leave it out if you want to reply to my post. [size=14pt]If you are really interest in what I said in those post and you want to contribute to the discussion, you need to answer the questions in the post.[/size]

Getting bible based answers to those questions will help me, you and everyone reading this thread to have a better understanding of the issues under discussion . If you can answer them, pls share it with us.

Yes! , the "only" is my problem, dnt like it when people say or imply that I said or imply what I did not say or imply.

MizJanet:



Buhahaha , But both can be translated " brought forth" ,isnt it ? Thats the point.

That same psalm 90:2 proves you WRONG , " the earth and the world were 'brought forth' " that same exact hebrew word used in proverb 8:24 appears here






*Lols*

Emusan

Fourthly, so what does it mean to BROUGHT FOURTH in case of Prov 8:24? The Wisdom of God was brought fourth Adam Clake "I was brought forth] ytllwx cholalti, " [size=24] I was produced [/size] as by labouring throes.""

Very hilarious @ underlined , I was PRODUCED. Am sure you know what it means to be produced .


Honestly the way you religiotards think baffles me .

johnw74:


And yet again and again you do not know what you are talking about,
the Hebrew for "bought forth" in Proverbs 8 and Psalm 90 are different words with diffrent meanings..

Emusan:


The bold part shows that you need to go back to elementary school.

And I've told you that your questions didn't interest me, what else do you want?



Now you're talking but to say because I extracted a part of your post THEN I MUST ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS is nonsensical. but don't worry if it seems good to me to answer I will.

The truth is you're not seeking for the truth!



I can see your problem, whereas the use of my ONLY in that post is the reference I made to WHEN QUESTION IS BEING THROWN TO YOU which I take to mean you can dodge someone question BUT ALWAYS WANT YOUR OWN QUESTION TO BE ANSWERED. I didn't claim is your word!

Is it clear now?

Emusan:


You don't know JWs before

When their own Watchtower can discredit a whole one time respected Christian 'Justin Martyr' just because Justin Martyr preached that Jesus died on the CROSS not on the STAKE as they wrongly teach.

But in their one time booklet which was blindly distributed before they realized ALL THE LIES they put inside and quickly removed it their ONLINE library titled Should you believe in Trinity? in the booklet, OVER 5 BIBLE THRASHERS WERE quoted because those people spoke against Trinity BUT THEY FAILED TO TELL THEIR AUDIENCE that not do those people only speak against Trinity BUT THE BIBLE AS A WHOLE.

That's why you see them in support of someone who doesn't believe in Bible whereas when we examine the content of both Psalms 90:2 and Proverb 8:24 the table will finally turn against them.

Firstly, the phrase BROUGHT FOURTH was used in the Bible severally which to be understood with the text that surround it.

Secondly, the phrase brought fourth as we see in case of Psalms 90:2 implies that mountains that seems to appear from eternity was actually brought fourth at a particular time just as Adam Clake put it in his commentary "Verse 2. Before the mountains were brought forth: The mountains and hills appear to have been everlasting; but as they were brought forth out of the womb of eternity, there was a time when they were not:..."

Thirdly, we must know that Proverb 8 was actually talking about the WISDOM OF GOD (and Jesus is the Wisdom of God) so it is IMPOSSIBLE for God to create His OWN wisdom, the Wisdom of God must be eternal just as God is eternal. Had it been that the person who raised the issue of Prov 8:24 paid close attention s/he would've seen this in the very text before that verse: "23 I have been established from everlasting, From the beginning, before there was ever an earth." NKJV

Psalm 90:2 says "...Even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God" which means ONLY God is from everlasting. Surprisingly, the speaker here also said "I have been ESTABLISHED from everlasting."

Fourthly, so what does it mean to BROUGHT FOURTH in case of Prov 8:24? The Wisdom of God was brought fourth Adam Clake "I was brought forth] ytllwx cholalti, "I was produced as by labouring throes."" The Wisdom of God has been in action and in use from everlasting, this agree with the prophecy of prophet Micah about the Messiah "Whose goings forth are from of old, From EVERLASTING"

Fifthly, even Atheist will agree that every creature needs SPACE and PLACE to occupy and dwell, which leads to my unanswered question by any JWs ever If Jesus is a created being, which comes first Heaven or Jesus?

Lastly, I turn this against JWs Psalm 90:2 says "...Even from everlasting to everlasting, You are God", Prov 8:23 says "I have been ESTABLISHED from everlasting." and Micah 5:2 says "Whose goings forth are from of old, From EVERLASTING"

Why did your organization conclude that God is not created by using Psalm 90:2 as support and also concluded that Jesus was created by citing Micah 5:2 in their 'what does Bible really teach booklet pg. 41' when the same word was used in the two verses?

dolphinheart:
You can abuse or use derogatory words all day, I'm not going to go to that level with you. Was not raised in that format.

the issue is I Made a post in which I asked some questions . The questions are part of the post and I intend anybody replying that post to answer the questions that is part of that post. You now replied or rather jumped into the post and did not answer the questions. These I have issues with as such procedures could mean it is no longer a disscusion but an argument which I will not participate in. Thus I'm saying if you want to discuss the issues laid down in my post, pls answer t he questions asked if you know them. From there we can have a better understanding of each others views and move on from there. I dnt think I've asked for the impossible . Dnt want to go into throwing questions up and down with no one answering each other, let's do it one at a time . And pls no mumble jumble answers pls.

If my questions dnt interest you, then leave my post for those who have interest in the question na!

I dnt like people extracting part of a whole . Extracting parts does not give a whole, precise overview of what the person who posted the whole is trying to say. Extracting part shows there is something sinister in the extractors intent as might not be able to handle the whole message.

Its good you can now see my problem. Only that you have not acted on such knowledge as you have done it again! Pls stop the twisting!!

I'm not dodging ur questions! Ur questions will be answered or not answered , but the questions in the initial post must be answered and cleared away first before me move on to others.

There is no where I stated or implied that I always want my own question to be answered! You like twist twist! I asked questions in a post, its a major part of the post, if you want to discuss that posts, then you have to answer the questions, if you dnt want to answer leave the post and stop using questions to cover or answer initial questions posted.

Emusan:


You need it because to comprehend simple English is hard for which you still display here again.



And how many times am I going to you that my post WASN'T ABOUT YOUR OWN POST? get life.



Where is the rope I used to tie down your post or did I hold your post before?



Swear by Jehovah that you haven't done it before...



I should stop the twisting again; when you couldn't comprehend my statement in the first place and I took my time to open your brain to what I'm insinuating.



That's why I said you lack simple comprehension, when I posted my post I said I'M NOT SAYING YOU SHOULD ANSWER MY QUESTIONS.
So when I said you dodge question you should know I'm not talking about my post here rather somewhere else that's why I repeat myself that 'A REFERENCE'.



It's like you just learn the word twist.

Then where did I say "YOU SAID your questions must be answered"? this is my statement "BUT ALWAYS WANT YOUR OWN QUESTION TO BE ANSWERED"

If you ask question and I decided not to answer the question but only attend to the rest of your post, is there any crime about it?

or you want to tell me that you always answer EVERY QUESTION you see in a post.

OLAADEGBU:


Blank as usual.

johnw74:


There is quite a bit I can write on it, I may write more later giving more info if you want.


I was bought forth

Pro 8:24 When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.

Proverbs 8:24 is referring to the Word of God:

Pro 8:22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

We are also told that the Word is God:

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

God and the Word of God is two persons as Proverbs 8:22-30 and John 1:1 and many other verses show


Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

The Word of God referred to in Proverbs 8:24 is also God, as the scriptures show,
and verses show that God has always existed, not created.


Psa 90:2 Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.
Again showing the Word is God, and other verses show God was not created.

Pro 8:23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
The Hebrew word for "set up" means anointed as King.

Psa 93:2 Thy throne is established of old: thou art from everlasting.
The Kings Throne is established.

Proverbs 8:23 and 24 are saying the same thing, the Word of God was set up - bought forth as King.

Pro 8:22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
If the LORD created the Word, then that would be a work. The LORD posessed the Word before any works at all. The Word is, along with God, Eternal.

johnw74:


1Jn 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;

even the person you are quoting this long epistle for admit the bible jesus was also PRODUCED , stop wasting your time

johnw74:


1Jn 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;

even the person you are quoting this long epistle for admit the bible jesus was PRODUCED , stop wasting your time

johnw74:


1Jn 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;

johnw74:


1Jn 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;

MizJanet:


Very hilarious @ underlined , I was PRODUCED. Am sure you know what it means to be produced .

Honestly the way you religiotards think baffles me.

Emusan:


"I was produced [size=14pt]as by labouring[/size] throes"

[s]
one of my point: [b]Thirdly, we must know that Proverb 8 was actually talking about the WISDOM OF GOD (and Jesus is the Wisdom of God) so it is IMPOSSIBLE for God ,the Wisdom of God must be eternal just as God is eternal. [/s]

Had it been that the person who raised the issue of Prov 8:24 paid close attention she would've seen this in the very text before that verse:"23 I have been established from everlasting [/s]

Great0:

let me explain it to you well.
Noah died before Abraham. That will not make the place to Answer Noah bosom. The bosom is the name of the place not that Abraham is up then other people is beneath, no.
The name of the place all the dead saints await for rapture are called Abraham Bosom.

MizJanet:



Dont sell your indoctrinated falsehood here , its never called a place. Answer me: how could Noah die and go to the bossom/chest of his unborn son called Abraham ?

Great0:

i have answer this question before. google it madam

"WHEN THE SUPERIOR MAN POINTS AT THE MOON,
THE INFERIOR MAN LOOKS AT HIS FINGER!" - Confucius.

OLAADEGBU:
Did anyone ascend into heaven before Jesus or not?

Genesis 5:24; 2 Kings 2:11 and John 3:13

Yes:
"And Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him" (Genesis 5:24).

"Then it came about as they were going along and talking, that behold, there appeared a chariot of fire and horses of fire which separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind to heaven" (2 Kings 2:11).

"By faith Enoch was taken up so that he should not see death; and he was not found because God took him up; for he obtained the witness that before his being taken up he was pleasing to God" (Hebrews 11:5).

No:
"And no one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven, even the Son of Man" (John 3:13)

MizJanet:



Dont sell your indoctrinated falsehood here , its never called a place. Answer me: how could Noah die and go to the bossom/chest of his unborn son called Abraham ?

MizJanet:


Very Good , you have just proved that your Jesus Lied in john 3:13 .

Junia:


Jesus didnt lie
You must understand the context of the scripture
He was teaching Nichodemus earthly things and he was not believing.
So He drew the fact that if he is not believing earthly things .. then how will he believe heavenly things when He starts talking about them (verse 12)
So Jesus made him understand that none of the teachers have been to Heaven except Him

That was what Jesus meant
And not that nobody has gone to Heaven before

MizJanet:


But man, you can lie sha . " NO MAN has ever been to heaven " , how does that translate to NO teacher has been to heaven ?

Junia:


Yh .. you don't understand
If the Holy Spirit doesn't teach you, you wouldn't know

When Jesus said we should eat His body and drink His blood, does that mean we should go and look for His body and blood

MizJanet:


Abeg, its very clear NO man. , NO MAN , not just teacher, NO MAN has ever been to heaven except him. Thats what he says



You can as well tell me when he said Only the son of man came down from heaven in John 3:13 , he doesnt mean it shebi ?

OLAADEGBU:
Did anyone ascend into heaven before Jesus or not?

Genesis 5:24; 2 Kings 2:11 and John 3:13

Yes:
"And Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him" (Genesis 5:24).

"Then it came about as they were going along and talking, that behold, there appeared a chariot of fire and horses of fire which separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind to heaven" (2 Kings 2:11).

"By faith Enoch was taken up so that he should not see death; and he was not found because God took him up; for he obtained the witness that before his being taken up he was pleasing to God" (Hebrews 11:5).

No:
"And no one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven, even the Son of Man" (John 3:13)

obaobirin:
The bible doesn't contradict itself.
It has expressly stated that "And no one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven, even the Son of Man" (John 3:13)

Others that were taken to heaven by the agency of God's influence

While on the other hand

Jesus being God (John 1vs 1-end) (colossians 1 vs 11, Colossians 2 vs9) himself released the force of gravity holding him down--thereby the word ASCENDED (to mount, go upward -all by yourself..)