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Stats: 1208003 members, 1559678 topics. Date: Tuesday, 22 July 2014 at 12:24 PM
|Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by tnk24: 6:46pm On Mar 05, 2009|
I read through the reply by Chukwudi44 to the post of SirJohn on: A Question For Tithe Payers. Naturally, there were those 'for' and those 'against' but, Chukwudi44 wrote: JESUS AND THE APOSTLES NEVER PAID TITHE. He quoted Heb. 7:8 and Eph. 2:15. What do you say about this, if you can, pls support your view with bible quotes, thanks.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by chukwudi44(m): 3:10pm On Mar 06, 2009|
Tighting was never practised by the early church .The glorious apostle paul even while spreading the Gospel from country to country actually fended for himself(1 thes 2:9,2 thes 3:7-10),.
The earlly christians freely sold heir possesions and laid them at the Apostles feet,which they distributed to everyone as they has need for.
There is no record in the new testament where Jesus or any of the apostles paid tithes.I challenge anyone with any contrary opinion to quote any line of the NEW TESTAMENT TO PROVE THAT JESUS OR THE APOSTLES PAID TITHES
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by KunleOshob(m): 4:37pm On Mar 06, 2009|
Yeah, tithes was smuggled into christian doctrine after the council of macon in 586AD by the catholic church. Then the church was broke and they needed more money to fund their growth hence the ingenious way the twistedthe meaning of tithes and introduced it to christiandom. Having realized their folly tithing is nolonger compulsary in the catholic church but optional. Whilst the pentecostal churches who know less would swear and die by it. The reasons are quite obvious anyway.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by Image123(m): 3:10pm On Mar 07, 2009|
Did the apostles have their bath?prove it .
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by otokx(m): 3:46pm On Mar 07, 2009|
some people are going off the deep end?
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by tommyneo: 8:57pm On Mar 08, 2009|
i just started paying tithe after asking logical questions as to WHY?
and finally, in my opinion.
dealing deductively with Gospel masters does not help one's faith.
rather from a rather relativistic and inductive approach, i may say one should rather work with faith, without which no one can see God.
Pay Tithe not because its logical but with faith according to what God told his kids in Mal.3
do it with faith. walahi i was shocked by some results i cldnt explain but call luck (from faith)
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by blacksta(m): 9:47pm On Mar 08, 2009|
You cannot serve God or money. People who are complaining about the logical reason behind not paying tithes is simply dealing with a stronghold.
1. If God is your ultimate source - please honour him
2. You can never out give God
3.10% is good starting bench mark
4 Spreading the lovely gospel of christ requires funding
5 it is the job of the sower to find a good ground.
Remember what Jesus said - Pay Ceasar what is due and Give God what he also deserves
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by Bastage: 1:10am On Mar 09, 2009|
Remember what Jesus said - Pay Ceasar what is due and Give God what he also deserves
What this basically means is "You pay men the taxes that you owe, but you pay God with your worship".
Contrary to the context that you have used it in, it shows that tithes are not necessary nor expected.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by SirJohn(m): 6:59am On Mar 09, 2009|
There are a million ways to express your faith and submission to God, it does'nt necessarily have to be through tithing. Malachi 3 was not talking to you at all but its your choice if you want to 'pay' it.
There are some of us who have more mind blowing results and testimonies of breakthrough, financial increase, sound health, protection/deliverance etc but I cant say its because of my tithes because I dont 'pay' it.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by SirJohn(m): 7:02am On Mar 09, 2009|
So what does God deserve? my 10%, you gotta be kidding me
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by arramyjay: 7:33am On Mar 09, 2009|
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by sammyzacks(m): 5:36pm On Mar 09, 2009|
giving offerings is different from paying tithes
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by tnk24: 8:31pm On Mar 11, 2009|
Reading through people's views on this subject shows contrasting believes and opinions. After asking this question, I actually went back to the bible to do some research, surprisingly it was not recorded anywhere (or I could not find anywhere) that Jesus paid tithe, (So I am still asking, if anyone knows anywhere in the bible where it was recorded that Jesus paid tithe should please come and enlighten us). All the opinions expressed above are quite profound.
But because it was not recorded in the bible that Jesus and the Apostles paid tithe, does that make tithing irrelevant? As a Christian I will say NO. We have countless verses in the bible emphasising the importance of giving.
In Luke 20:19-26, where Jesus said GIVE TO CAESAR WHAT IS CAESAR AND TO GOD WHAT IS GOD can be given different meaning depending on your interpretation: But for me I think: Whatever percent government demands of your income (TAX) give to government and whatever percent the church demands of your income (TITHE) give to the church. But to the extent this is binding is a different discuss entirelly. We as Christians know that we do not use logic or common sense to interprete the word of God. We pray that the Spirit of God will always guide us.
Your views are still welcome!
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by KunleOshob(m): 12:13pm On Mar 12, 2009|
Tithing as no sound basis in christianity and it is totally different from the christian concept of free will giving. You can check out other threads on tithes on this forum were the topic as been exhaustively addressed.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by tnk24: 6:33pm On Mar 13, 2009|
KunleOshob, I did heed to your suggestion that I check other threads were the issue of tithing had been discussed extensively and whao, I wasn't surprised by the divergent views expressed by people, it only goes to show that this is an interesting and controversial topic.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by PastorAIO: 10:18pm On Mar 13, 2009|
If you are interested in a payment in monetary terms then yes, Jesus and his disciples paid money to the Temple. This wasn't Tithe, tithe was agricultural produce, but rather money. It was called the Disdrachma, or Temple tax.
But listen carefully to what Jesus had to say about it and the reasons why he paid it.
The Temple TaxMatthew 17,24
Now there are many who have said that tithing is only agricultural produce because they had no money in those days. Listen to this:
"When you take a census of the sons of Israel to number them, then each one of them shall give a ransom for himself to the LORD, when you number them, so that there will be no plague among them when you number them.Exodus 30
They did have money, and they did tax the people for the upkeep of the Tabernacle, and it wasn't a percentage tax but rather a fix rate tax whether you were poor or rich, you paid the same amount.
Tithing and paying money to God are two different things completely. I repeat, they are two different things completely.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by tnk24: 11:29pm On Mar 13, 2009|
Pastor AIO good talk, I will not agree or disagree with your views as the objective of this discourse is for us to learn one or two things from others views
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by KunleOshob(m): 1:23pm On Jun 10, 2009|
The above highlighted statement is very instructive scripturally that is in reality you can never pay any money to God neither can any man collect money for him onhis behalf. Any man that claims other wise is making God a lier and the truth is not in him.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by Horus(m): 1:33pm On Jun 10, 2009|
Jesus never took from his congregation. He never passed around a basket or tray to receive pledges and donations at the end of each sermon. He never asked for a payment. Nor did he ever tell his disciples to accept money for their assistance as found in Matthew 10:8-10:
“Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give. Provide neither gold, nor silver, nor brass in your purses, nor scrip for your journey, neither two coats, neither shoes, nor yet staves: for the workman is worthy of his meat.”
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by llonden: 12:32am On Jun 23, 2009|
Jesus NEVER paid tithes. In the Old Testament, there were 5 types of tithes God implemented
exclusively for the nation of Israel:
1. Crop tithe
2. Animal tithe
3. Levitical tithe
4. Poor tithe
5. Festival tithe
All 5 of these tithes were purely agricultural involving ONLY crops and animals, never money(gold, silver, shekels).
Therefore, GOD commanded only those Israelites who had land to grow crops and/or animals to herd to tithe(farmers,shepherds).
If you were an Israelite with any other occupation(maidservant, welder, etc, ), you were not required to tithe.
Jesus was a carpenter, not a farmer or herdsman, so he didn't tithe. If Jesus decided he wanted to grow a garden on the side, then yes, he would have had to tithe off that.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by chukwudi44(m): 6:07pm On Jun 23, 2009|
Please how come it is wrong to pray through Mary and other saints to Jesus but when tithes and offerings are involved it becomes alright to go through an intermediary to Jesus.I use to think that Jesus is the only intermediary between God and man
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by aksat(m): 2:16am On Jun 25, 2009|
Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe?
the question there is: was Jesus Christ and his apostle collecting salary?
why-when Jesus wanted to pay tax, He brought the money out of the mouth of a fish.
so the answer to the queation Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? is very clear
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by segyemaro(m): 8:27am On Jun 25, 2009|
Pastor AI,your contribution is well understood and that is the fact. Jesus and His disciples never encouraged the given of tithe, how can they now give what they dont believe in. Because you are a pastor does not mean you should not work. All what we have today are hungry pastors that could not get employment after their graduation will now take pastoring as the best alternative option, that is why they creat alot of offerings in their churches. Tithe and tax are two different things all together. The pastor always emphasize on mal3:8 as their reason why you must pay tithe, and when you read all the chapters you will discover that it was not referring to monetary term and this was washed away by the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Since the so called pastors succeeded in smuggling in tithe into this era, what about marry many wives and others that were fully practised in the old testament. I agree with kunle that alot has been said on tithes in other thread. Just be wise or else the jobless pastors will be oppressing you with the latest coat and shoes and including cars while you that is been brainwashed that is working is managing a torn collar shirt, So lets be wise,tithe collection is not biblical. Shikena
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by kolaoloye(m): 10:50am On Jun 25, 2009|
The answer to your question is NO
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by segyemaro(m): 1:41pm On Jun 25, 2009|
Oloye its obvious from my explanations that the answer is NO
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by SharonB2: 11:49am On Jul 16, 2009|
I have been tithing for a while and i believe it is the right thing to do, however, i realised that many people do not believe in it or are just have very different views from what the Bible advocates, so i thought i'd share this note on the topic based on a commentary on 1 cor 13: 3. i personally think this sums it all up and answers all questions about tithing, here goes,
Actions can be negated by motives. Motives of the heart are more important than actions. This is why many Christians have paid their tithes, and yet haven't seen the financial blessing that God's Word promises (Mr 10:29-30; Lu 6:38) come back to them. There is more to giving than just the action. The motive is very important.
Probably the most dominant motive for giving in the church today is that of debt or obligation. Ministers often use Malachi 3:8-10 to tell their congregations that they are robbing God if they don't tithe. They go on to say that God will curse them for not tithing. That motivates the people to give, but for the wrong reason, and makes their giving profit them nothing.
In the New Testament, Paul made it very clear that every person was to give "as he purposeth in his heart, not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver" (2Co 9:7). Giving because it's a debt, or we'll be cursed if we don't give, is definitely not consistent with the motivation Paul gave in 2 Corinthians 9:7. There is a difference between New Testament giving, and giving under the law, and that difference is the motive.
Tithing was in effect before the law of Moses (Ge 14:20), so tithing is a biblical principle that still applies to us New Testament believers who are not under the law . But the curse placed on those who do not tithe was a part of the Old Testament law and it doesn't apply to us today. "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:" (Ga 3:13). I am not cursed if I don't tithe. I'm silly if I don't, but I'm not cursed.
Those who want to cling to the curse of Malachi 3:9 need to read verse 8 more carefully. It says we have not only robbed God in tithes, but also in offerings. Some people have estimated that all the tithes and offerings prescribed in the Old Testament amounted to as much as 33%. So, to honestly use these scriptures in Malachi to motivate people to give, the preacher has to preach that any gift below 33% of one's income is just the payment of a debt and he is cursed if he doesn't give at least that much. I don't know anyone who believes that and yet that's what Malachi 3:8-10 says.
Giving, including tithing, should first and foremost be an act of worship and thanksgiving, an acknowledgement that it is God who gives us power to get wealth (De 8:18). It also is an act of faith. If there was no God, and if His promises were not true, it would be foolish to give our money away. Our resources would diminish, not increase. But because there is a God who honors faith, we can actually increase by giving (Pr 3:9-10; Pr 11:24-25).
It takes humility and faith to give. It is also smart. But if you don't tithe and give, God still loves you. You won't have a crop to harvest if you eat all your seed, but God will still love you.
When a person applies this New Testament attitude to his giving, then it becomes an acceptable offering to the Lord, and releases all the blessings that God has promised in His Word upon the cheerful giver (2Co 9:7-11). But those who give with the wrong motive will not be profited anything.
—Andrew Wommack's Living Commentary
I hope this bless you as much as it blessed me and i hope it has answered all questions regarding tithing once and for all!
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by Jagoon: 4:53pm On Jul 16, 2009|
Sharon B:Nope your write up didn't bless me at all, in fact it demonstrated to me that you know sooo little about tithes, have yu read how God said we should use our tithe in deuteronomy 14:22-29, have you also read were tithing was outlawed and condenm in hebrews 7:5-19? Aslo you tried to justify tithing after the law with Abraham's one off example of tithing war booty that was not even his own in the first instance. That apart there was no commandment in the bible to copy this abraham's traditional rite. Is it every thing abraham did that we do today? for instance sacrificial offering was before the law, do you offer burnt offerings today? The truth is that christians are under no obligation to tithe and it is very wrong and dubious of preachers to be preaching tithing today based on a law not applicable to christians. at best they should preach free will offerings as paul asked in 2 corinthians 9 but then greed won' allow.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by ZAINABABY: 6:10pm On Jul 16, 2009|
OH! CARNAL CHRISTIANS!!!!
THE ISSUES IN CHRISTIANITY ARE 100% SPIRITUAL, THEY DEFILE HUMAN WISDOM AND PHILOSOPHY. NO MATTER HOW EDUCATED YOU ARE WITHOUT BEING SPIRITUAL, IF YOU LIKE BE IN THE MOST SPIRITUAL CHURCH 24/7, YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND THE THINGS OF THE SPIRIT --- CHRISTIANITY.
SO THE WAY TO UNDERSTAND CHRISTIANITY AND ITS MAKE-UPS IS TO BECOME A BORN-AGAIN, WHEN YOU RECEIVE THAT SPIRIT OF SONSHIP, YOU WILL BEGIN TO SEE THE SPIRITUALITY OF CHRISTIANITY. I MEAN YOU BEGIN TO SEE THINGS "THE SPIRIT-WAY" AND NOT "THE CARNAL-WAY". JESUS CHRIST TOLD US THAT ONE OF THE DUTIES OF THE SPIRIT HE PROMISED US IS THAT " HE WILL TEACH US ALL THINGS" AND WILL BRING IN REMEMBRANCE ALL THAT HE TAUGHT US.
SO NO MATTER HOW YOU READ THE BIBLE WITHOUT THE SPIRIT TEACHING YOU, YOU WILL NEVER UNDERSTAND IT IN "THE SPIRIT-WAY"(if it were easy like that the ethiopian eunoch wouldnt have asked philip(who has the spirit ) to explain to him what he(the ethiopian eunoch) was reading)
SO BELOVED CHRISTIANS, INSTEAD OF RAISING CONTROVERSIAL ISSUES THAT CAN ONLY WEAKEN THE MINDS OF IMMATURE FELLOW CHRISTIANS, LET US ASPIRE TO GET THAT SPIRIT OF SONSHIP WHO IS ABLE TO "TEACH US ALL THINGS"
GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by Jagoon: 8:13pm On Jul 16, 2009|
The spirit of christ in me tells that he NEVER asked any preacher to collect tithes in his name and those doing it are the false prophets we were warned about throughout the new testament. The spirit of christ tells also tells me that he doesn't reside in the churches gagain as they since become a den of thieves were iniquity reigns and his name is being used to de-fraud his innocent children.
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by chukwudi44(m): 6:53pm On Jul 17, 2009|
My question remains How can pastors act as mediators between God and man only when tithes are involved and when it comes to prayers you must go through Jesus only.
What is the difference betwween veneration of pastors in tithing and veneration of saints in prayers ?
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by gen2genius(m): 7:05pm On Jul 17, 2009|
Chukwudi, you have come again with shameless display of ignorance. When Jesus paid Temple Tax, did he throw it to God in heaven? And does his giving it to the collectors mean he was "venerating" them? If you claim you are a CHRISTian, when Christ taught you how to pray, did he mention anything about "venerating saints"?
|Re: Did Jesus And The Apostles Paid Tithe? by chukwudi44(m): 7:20pm On Jul 17, 2009|
when christ paid the temple tax did he tell you anything about paying tithes?
when you pay your tithes to God through your pastors ,you are venerating them .
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