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"Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. - Politics - Nairaland

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Reverend Father Escapes Death In A Terrible Accident Along Nneobi/Onitsha Road(p / Distribution Of Capital Project In 2016 Budget, Omokri Reacts: A Rejoinder / Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah... (2) (3) (4)

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"Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by omenka(m): 2:44pm On Aug 16, 2015
Good afternoon.

Much as I don't fancy responding to bare-faced lies and overt distortion of facts, it has become absolutely necessary to every once in a while set records straight for posterity because it is said that evil thrives only when good men remain silent.

First off, Reverend Kukah said what he said in plain english and didn't need no one to translate or interpret his message, least of all, the op of the thread being referenced here. It is such a pity some people are totally given to spreading unadulterated falsehood regardless of its effect, just as long as like minds like themselves endorse such inordinate pursuits.

First, the op went:
1. Investigation Should Be Done First

What Kukah was saying is that there
should be investigation first!
Investigation simply means
approaching a matter with an open
heart with the sole aim of establishing
whether or not something has gone
amiss. This is what is expected in a
democracy

And then went on to say:
2. Probe becomes necessary after investigations

You only probe after investigation has
given a lead that an offense was
committed. Probe is to unravel more
facts that may be helpful during
prosecution.
These have gotta be the worst attempt at twisting established principles and lexicon I'd ever seen my entire life- all borne out of an undue penchant for opposing anything and everything not of one's political leanings.

First, regarding the first quote, at no point did the government say or give the impression it wasn't approaching the probes with "an open mind" as the op wants his readers to believe. It is a cheap blackmail using such innuendos in reference to the government's policy of bringing treasury looters to book. Unfortunately, there are lots of gullible and genuinely ignorant readers out there who would likely be sold to the op's antics.

That being said, the poster dove even further into the abyss by making the statement in "quote 2". I couldn't just believe what I was reading! What in God's gracious name is meant by "investigating before probing??

Dear readers, here are the definitions of both words (investigate & probe) as stated by the English dictionary as they relate to the subject matter:

Investigate
1. Carry out a systematic or formal
inquiry to discover and examine the facts of (an incident, allegation, etc.) so as to establish the truth.

2. To try to find out the facts about
(something, such as a crime or an
accident) in order to learn how it
happened, who did it, etc.

3. To try to get information about
someone who may have done
something illegal*.

Probe

1. An exploratory action or expedition, especially one designed to investigate and obtain information on a remote or unknown region.

2. . An investigation into unfamiliar matters or questionable activities* ; a penetrating inquiry.
The three words investigate, probe, and inquiry are all synonymous and can be used interchangeably in this regard.
Now, note the bolded and the "asterisked" in these definitions and tell me what the difference is. I'm pretty much sure the op of that thread knows this but deliberately made those remarks and endorsed Kukah's due to his fancy for the absurd.

That said, it is really unfortunate he tried to justify Kukah's statement as captured in the first quote in his original post, stating that probes have no place in a democracy such as ours. For the benefit of the ignorant, our Bicameral system of democracy is modeled after America's and I can't think of a democracy within which more "probes" have been conducted than America's: so I really have no idea where Kukah and the op are coming from.

Next, the op stated:
He was simply saying that rather than talking of probe by mere speculation he should do number 1 (above). It is a known fact that NOTHING will be
established from any ACTION where
the Investigator's sole aim is to see an
accused guilty and not really to solve a
problem.
First, the government isn't working on "mere speculation".

The op and the rest of us know less than a billionth of what is contained in the handover notes of the immediate past government, and there is no gainsaying they form the bulk of the reasons behind the ongoing probes. Even the ex-president himself admitted he was oblivious of the extent of sleaze that existed under his watch. Contracts running into billions were awarded, some contractors were paid, in some cases fully, yet projects weren't executed.

Just recently, news surfaced about a contractor in who rushed back to site out of fear of being captured in Buhari's anticorruption dragnet- dailyindependentnig.com/2015/08/buhari-phobia-n2-5b-adada-dam-contractor-rushes-back-site/ - and it is our belief a lot other such cases that eluded the eyes of the press exist.

The op was being rather tactless saying (agreeing) the probes are a distraction. First, Nigerians from all walks of life who long for a better country are on the same page with the government on this, especially judging from their reactions to Kukah's statements. That aside, the government's purse is thinning due to the crash in the global price of crude and she needs all the monies illegally acquired she can mop up from the past officials to finance developmental projects, as she seeks ways to reduce recurrent expenditure.

Furthermore, isn't it mischievous of the op to say the probes are a distraction when the same person holds the opinion they should be extended to cover regimes that precede Jonathan's? When that is done, does it mean they would no longer be "distractions"

On the "number 1" thingy, that has already been dealt with- there is no difference between a probe and an investigation.

Lastly, to crown his mischief, the op went:
Firstly, you should investigate to ascertain whether or not something has gone amiss. Then you subject the indictees to probe (thorough investigation).
This is just absolutely laughable! Here's the op saying Buhari should "investigate" them first, then "thoroughly investigate" them afterwards!! I really am at a loss of words to qualify this tomfoolery. smiley



Whatever it is, we know the antecedents of the poster and don't expect less from him- today he adorn's kukah with a robe of sainthood, we all know what he would say of the reverend should he make remarks critical of Jonathan's admin tomorrow, but it is incumbent on those with enlightened and discerning minds to speak up when logic and reason appear to be turned on their heads with its devastating consequences. The least we can do is what we do here when we find the time to- defuse and disarm PDP propaganda.


Thank you.

Cc: Seun, Lalasticlala.

40 Likes 6 Shares

Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by BIGERBOY1: 2:47pm On Aug 16, 2015
I swear immediately I saw were barcanista mentioned 'investigate before probe'. I was like . This guy is trying too hard to say nothing.
What sort of semantic gymnastics was that ?

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Ezenwammadu(m): 2:47pm On Aug 16, 2015

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Khaytunechi: 2:50pm On Aug 16, 2015
Nice analysis..

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by lurther: 2:52pm On Aug 16, 2015
I have observed something about APC!!!

Once you tell them the truth, they attack you using the media. This is very bad for Nigeria politics, because, it is a very crude way of oppressing the opposition.

Let a top and honourable man in Nigeria today tell Buhari to declare his assets as he promised, watch how APC starts to publish pictures of the man having phantom cars somewhere or phantom houses somewhere.

I wonder if Tinubu who is corruption-personified is immuned from all this corruption crusade.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by DickDastardly(m): 2:54pm On Aug 16, 2015
Now we know the true paid Laptop Dogs cheesy
No time cool

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by EdCure: 2:57pm On Aug 16, 2015
Good job.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Eshinwaju: 2:58pm On Aug 16, 2015
A truly unbiased ........and objective response to a despondent protection seeker..... cheesy

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by lordtech(m): 2:59pm On Aug 16, 2015
Ok
Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Eshinwaju: 3:01pm On Aug 16, 2015
BIGERBOY1:
I swear immediately I saw were barcanista mentioned 'investigate before probe'. I was like . This guy is trying too hard to say nothing.
What sort of semantic gymnastics was that ?


..... cheesy cheesy cheesy cheesy....thought it was me alone........ cheesy

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Nobody: 3:02pm On Aug 16, 2015
Assessing the rejoinder.....!!!
Comment to be made later!



Meanwhile, I've lost interest in any post(s) of Barcanista! In fact it has been long I open a thread created by him.
He's far from the truth when making points, only writing to please his like-minded fellows as well as those who don't want to see anything good comes from this present administration.
They will come to understand the "real" difference between GEJ and PMB soon, and the reason "change" is non-negotiable!

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by EdCure: 3:02pm On Aug 16, 2015
BIGERBOY1:
I swear immediately I saw were barcanista mentioned 'investigate before probe'. I was like . This guy is trying too hard to say nothing.
What sort of semantic gymnastics was that ?
Who is more dumber? The jester that created the thread solely for the consumption of his like-minds, or the moderator that sees it as a duty to always promote such mediocrity to the frontpage?
If you ask me, I'll say the problem of this forum lies squarely on this band of cheerleaders called moderators.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by dunkem21(m): 3:05pm On Aug 16, 2015

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by NgeneUkwenu(f): 3:05pm On Aug 16, 2015
EdCure:

Who is more dumber? The jester that created the thread solely for the consumption of his like-minds, or the moderator that sees it as a duty to always promote such mediocrity to the frontpage?

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Mynd44: 3:06pm On Aug 16, 2015
You know you could have just ignored and not bother to write this right?

I mean all that story just to prove that "Probing and investigating are the same"?

I understand that you people are trying hard to convince one other people that your side of the divide is the best but seriously is it working? Everyone out there who hates President Buhari still hates him whether he does well or not does not matter so why bother trying to change them?

You guys have a lot of energy stored up spent on writing articles and rejoiners but seriously, there are some things that ain't worth the time. If Barcanista feels the need to say that Prove and investigate are not the same, you should not bother educating him and the people who worship(?) him after all, President Jonathan said "Stealing is not corruption" and they not only accepted but defended him.

You should know when to look, hiss and walk away while smiling at the ignorance of others and not join in the fúck fess.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Firefire(m): 3:07pm On Aug 16, 2015
lurther:
I have observed something about APC!!!

Once you tell them the truth, they attack you using the media. This is very bad for Nigeria politics, because, it is a very crude way of oppressing the opposition.

Let a top and honourable man in Nigeria today tell Buhari to declare his assets as he promised, watch how APC starts to publish pictures of the man having phantom cars somewhere or phantom houses somewhere.

I wonder if Tinubu who is corruption-personified is immuned from all this corruption crusade.

God bless you.

APC hate hearing the truth.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Nobody: 3:07pm On Aug 16, 2015
To the average APC supporter, anyone with opposing view is either corrupt or has been settled with billions or trillions.


Bottomline, Buhari and his online attack dogs should learn to tolerate criticisms. We're all different and it's only natural that we see things from different perspective

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Iykopee(m): 3:08pm On Aug 16, 2015
Foolishness is peaking @ an unbelievable degree here on NL. Can the OP point out where Reverend Kukah compromised on the video before taking on barcanista's posts? Useless analysis anyway from some1 on APC's payroll.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Aminat508(f): 3:08pm On Aug 16, 2015
Hmmmmmm

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Firefire(m): 3:09pm On Aug 16, 2015
The hate sermons from brainless APC e-supporters will not last more than 4 - 8 Years.

Nigerians can not be fooled forever.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by ifelovemi: 3:10pm On Aug 16, 2015
Ezenwammadu:
Op go through this video and show us where kukuh said GEJ should not be probed


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUc27DlXuM0&feature=youtube_gdata_player


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wF5gtft-Sc0&feature=youtube_gdata_player


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVn0AvfMYj4&feature=youtube_gdata_player
But he said we should clap for GEJ for conceding to an election he lost gallantly and let him go even if he has stolen our money.
I am ashame to be call a Christian if a pastor could turn truth upside down like this. Kukah should be ashamed of him self .

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Nobody: 3:12pm On Aug 16, 2015
Op kudos to you. Truth must be said. When i saw Barcanista differentiating probe from investigation just because rev kukah erroneously made d mistake i felt like vomiting.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Firefire(m): 3:14pm On Aug 16, 2015
ifelovemi:

But he said we should clap for GEJ for conceding to an election he lost gallantly and let him go even if he has stolen our money.
I am ashame to be call a Christian if a pastor could turn truth upside down like this. Kukah should be ashamed of him self .

If you are ashamed of the truth, and being a Christian? It's not too late to renounce your faith.

1 Like

Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Realisticman: 3:14pm On Aug 16, 2015
I am just addicted to your posts . Keep it up!

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Happiness87(f): 3:14pm On Aug 16, 2015
NgeneUkwenu:
I Am on Joe Ibokwe's payroll sponsored by liar mohammed
Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Mynd44: 3:17pm On Aug 16, 2015
atbu1983:
Op kudos to you. Truth must be said. When i saw Barcanista differentiating probe from investigation just because rev kukah erroneously made d mistake i felt like vomiting.
You seem to forget that these same worshippers of President Jonathan fought tooth and nail to defend the statement their hero made about stealing not being corruption so why are you surprised?

You are just giving undue attention to someone who does not deserve it.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by midolian(m): 3:18pm On Aug 16, 2015
[b]"As much as I will admit that the p*ss committee is made up of some reputable members of the Nigerian society, and I also acknowledge the laudable role they played in peace-making during the uncertain moments of the last contentious national elections, I think their recent visit to President Buhari and his equally mercurial Vice President, Yemi Osinbajo was totally in bad fate. Catholic cleric, Mathew Kukah who spoke on behalf of the group was a shade disingenuous when he told State House press corp that all the committee was “worried about” was the process of Buhari’s campaign against corruption. He added: “It is no longer a military regime and, under our existing laws, everybody is innocent until proven guilt”. Did he need to say that? Not only was that totally uncalled for, that statement reeks of condescension.

He went further to say “Again, our own commitment is not to intimidate or fight anybody. The former President’s commitment and what he did still remains spectacular and I think that President Buhari himself appreciates that”. To many Nigerians at home and abroad, Kukah’s statement is outright balderdash. I respect Kukah and his often impassioned statements about Nigeria. However, he and the other members of the committee – if he is speaking for them – simply don’t get it."[/b]

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Mynd44: 3:20pm On Aug 16, 2015
ifelovemi:

But he said we should clap for GEJ for conceding to an election he lost gallantly and let him go even if he has stolen our money.
I am ashame to be call a Christian if a pastor could turn truth upside down like this. Kukah should be ashamed of him self .
You have to find it curious that Bishop Kaku is a Catholic. (except I miss my guess)

Just recently the Pope said "The corrupt should be tied to a stone and thrown into the sea".

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by hinwazaka: 3:21pm On Aug 16, 2015
The individual who you referred to in your writeup was actually more accurate than you. An investigation is done to uncover something not known, and not completely suspected. A probe on the other hand is an INVESTIGATION done with a suspicion of something having gone foul, backed by substantial evidence. An investigation is done out of protocol, while a probe is done out of necessity to reach a conclusion
The APC government has no evidence aside hearsay and unwarranted suspicion. What would suffice here is an investigation, not a probe. By issuing out the statement that a probe is been conducted on the past administration is to pass across to people that the government has substantial evidence of financial misappropriation indulged in by elements of the past administration
Though, it's government's responsibility to bring to book those who have flouted the law. It's not the only function of government. According to the understanding of public administration, government has three primary functions
* Defence
* Provision of public amenities
* Law
The government can not push it's other functions to the background, focusing on only one. One very important fact is that we are in perilious economic times. China just devalued their currency forcing pressure on developing nations like ours. This will start a currency war which coupled with hike in US interest rates will seriously affect our exporting market. Now is not the time for a wild goose chase which will gulp so much money, but produce little or nothing


PS: please refrain from putting as examples, the fictious story of a supposed foreigner rushing to a site because of PMB. Its bogus and unfounded. Let's be practical here

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by omenka(m): 3:23pm On Aug 16, 2015
Mynd44:
You know you could have just ignored and not bother to write this right?

I mean all that story just to prove that "Probing and investigating are the same"?


You should know when to look, hiss and walk away while smiling at the ignorance of others and not join in the fúck fess.
Like I said in the OP, there are some genuinely ignorant fellas, old and young, that visit this board for info and enlightenment. They tend to ingest and digest just about anything they read without recourse to verification- some because they are too lazy, others because they don't have the financial strength (data) to dig any further. What then happens to such category of people

It helps to put things here in an accurate perspective if you ask me.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by Firefire(m): 3:23pm On Aug 16, 2015
Sincere9gerian:
Bottomline, Buhari and his online attack dogs should learn to tolerate criticisms. We're all different and it's only natural that we see things from different perspective

The thugs attempt to twist Probe & Investigation will not attone for the wicked, malicious and baseless accusation of Revd. Father Kukah.

APC is in power today. One day history will recall their attitude, style of governance and they will be judge thereafter.

And for the warmongers, please continue.

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Re: "Before They Tarnish Reverend Father Matthew Hassan Kukah"- A Rejoinder. by dokiOloye(m): 3:27pm On Aug 16, 2015
lurther:
I have observed something about APC!!!

Once you tell them the truth, they attack you using the media. This is very bad for Nigeria politics, because, it is a very crude way of oppressing the opposition.

Let a top and honourable man in Nigeria today tell Buhari to declare his assets as he promised, watch how APC starts to publish pictures of the man having phantom cars somewhere or phantom houses somewhere.

I wonder if Tinubu who is corruption-personified is immuned from all this corruption crusade.
I have more respect for the prostitutes on d streets than Nigerian journalists.
In other parts of d world,ppl swear based on what they read on newspapers but in Nigeria,they easily turn white to black wt all boldness
I stopped believing everything I read in d papers during d Rivers state assembly fracas where they were feeding d public pictures of a calm Chidi Lloyd wtout any plaster or bandage on his body upon d fact that they have other pictures which showed he was actually d assailant.The only saving grace was d assembly workers who uploaded cellphone videos of d fracas.
Tinubu is truly a very dangerous man,if only for d way he has succeeded in buying over most mainstream press houses.

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