Mutteylaff

Just because you have a Greek word for a jewish word doesnt imply the Greek word is authentic in meaning or concept

Its not authentic , yet Greek scriptures writers use it as equivalent . You think you will find sheol in the greek septuagint .

Regarding this your Rev 20:13 quotation , I doubt you athave any understanding of the relationship between sea , death and sheol in that verse ?

Mr , Dont avoid that question : tell us why those in the Sea are not said to be in Sheol ? Rev 20:13

Jozzy4:
Its not authentic, yet Greek scriptures writers use it as equivalent . You think you will find sheol in the greek septuagint.

The meaning of Hades to a Jew is completely different to a Greek's meaning and understanding of Hades

The Jew have their own interpretation of what the Sheol section of which the Greek's Hades represent means
and the Greeks too have their own interpretation of what their original Hades means to them

Without bias, just try to respect and appreciate the Jewish concept of what the borrowed Hades word is and means
Try and familiarise yourself with how a Jew sees Sheol and Hades
Be faithful, without sentiments, to their viewpoint

Jozzy4:
Regarding this your Rev 20:13 quotation, I doubt you at all have any understanding of the relationship between sea, death and sheol in that verse ?

Mr, Dont avoid that question: tell us why those in the Sea are not said to be in Sheol? Rev 20:13

I am solemnly with the stance that those who perish in the sea are held up in Sheol
Those in the Sea are no different to those deposited into graves/tombs/sepulchres
- all end up in Sheol

It is you who says those in the Sea are not said to be in Sheol
Remember you asked:
Why are those in the sea not said to be in Sheol?

MuttleyLaff:
You obviously missed the memo I sent Jessicha on Hades.
Nothing spoilt, as though not trying to come across like a broken record, I'll repeat it here, all over again, just for you.

what is Hades? - Here we go again

Hades is the abode of the dead and it is located in Sheol
- it's like saying Lagos is in Naija

Hell which has become synonymous with Hades, is neither Hebrew or Greek in origin

Sheol is, what you'll find in the original Hebrew text for any word for Hell
In other places, Hades or Hell was the Greek substitution for the part of Sheol where the Rich man is from the Parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus

As a matter of fact, Hell actually finds it roots in the classic Greek mythology, Hades

where Hades interestingly and actually, was the ancient Greek god of the underworld.
This god's name (i.e. Hades) later turned to mean the place or abode of the dead, which actually is exactly what Sheol is, what is signifies or represents.

Talking about Gehenna, well it is a valley, a valley in Jerusalem, used as a dumping refuse site and so was used by Jesus to depict the Lake of fire
(i.e. it is a place of destruction, as in, via incineration, a place for destroying things)

As earlier mentioned, Gehenna was the incinerating refuse dump in Jerusalem
Hades however, historically and originally is the name of a Greek god until it got turned to meaning the place or abode of the dead
It later got interchanged with hell, which is from a German word root
It was bible translators who were substituing the original Hebrew word Sheol (i.e. the part where the dead of the Rich man sort are), with Greek counterparts Hades/Hell that made hell stick with us today

I can draw you further in with unadulterated info on Sheol,
but these small and sliced up bits, so far should suffice
else you'll throw up or choke on the chunkier others

Just because you have a Greek word for a Jewish word doesnt imply the Greek word is authentic in meaning or concept
- transliteration is not foolproof.

Regarding this your Rev 20:13 quotation, I doubt, you at all have any understanding of the relationship between sea, death and Sheol in that verse?

I hope you and EnigmAries who incidentally is equating graves/tombs/sepulchres with Sheol, will compare your verse with Matthew 27:52

And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
- Matthew 27:52

Did you just say hades is a part of sheol? I give up.

Ecclesiastes 9:10 states: “There is no work nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom in the Grave [Sheol], where you are going.” This doesn't mean that Sheol refers to a specific, or individual, grave site where we may have buried a loved one.

When the Bible refers to a specific burial place, or grave, it uses other Hebrew and Greek words, not sheohl and haides.( Genesis 23:7-9; Matthew 28:1) Also, the Bible does not use the word “Sheol” for a grave where several individuals are buried together, such as a family grave or a mass grave.— Genesis 49:30, 31.
Sheol has already swallowed, so to speak, countless dead people, it always seems to hunger for more. ( Proverbs 30:15, 16) Unlike any literal burial site, which can hold only a limited number of the dead, ‘the Grave is never satisfied.’ ( Proverbs 27:20) That is, Sheol never becomes full. It has no limits. Sheol, or Hades, is thus not a literal place in a specific location. Rather, it is the common grave of dead mankind, the figurative location where most of mankind sleep in death.

The Bible teaching of the resurrection helps us to gain further insight into the meaning of “Sheol” and “Hades.” The Bible associates Sheol and Hades with the sort of death from which there will be a resurrection. *( Job 14:13; Acts 2:31; Revelation 20:13) It also shows that those in Sheol, or Hades, include not only those who have served God but also many who have not served him. ( Genesis 37:35; Psalm 55:15) Therefore, the Bible teaches that there will be “a resurrection of both the righteous and
the unrighteous.”— Acts 24:15.

It will make much sense to you realise that Man does not have any soul/spirit that lives after him after death.
Soul in Hebrew is the word 'nephesh', which means "a living being
Soul in Greek is the word 'psyche', which means "a living being.
Spirit in Hebrew is the word 'ruwach', which means"breath, wind, air".
Spirit in Greek is the word 'pneuma', which can either mean "Holy Spirit" or "breath, wind, air"

So we can see from this that the words soul and spirit do not mean that we have our OWN spirit or soul, but rather we basically have the spirit of God in us keeping us alive, and with that spirit in us, we ARE LIVING SOULS. And we can see this clearly from the creation account
...Genesis 2:7 ...'And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.'...

Notice one very important point about the creation of Adam. When God breathed into him the breath of life, "Spirit", Adam BECAME a living "Soul". So if we reverse this process, God's Spirit (breath) is removed and Adam dies, he becomes dust again.
This is an important truth concerning death and what happens when we die. Remember that Adam wasn't given a soul, he BECAME a living soul with the breath of God inside him. We are but dust without the Spirit (breath) of God in us, as this following Bible verse confirms
...Genesis 3:19 ...'In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
So if the Bible doesn't support the teaching of a separate soul beyond human existence, I wonder those who are residents in that literal hades, which according to you, is a temporal abode of torment immediately after death. We all know judgement have not taken place, thus directly accusing God of jungle justice.

EnigmAries:
Did you just say hades is a part of sheol? I give up.

We've only scratched the tip of the ice berg and you're already giving up after reading that Sheol has a section similar a bit to Hades, the Greek's version of afterlife
What's going to happen if shown the size of the ice berg? You'll pass out?
What's going to happen if shared with you, that there is a part of Sheol, which is a bottomless pit cum gulf separating the two parts of Sheol from each other?
I've so far known you this much, to guess that you'll throw up your hands in horror at it.

EnigmAries:
Ecclesiastes 9:10 states: “There is no work nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom in the Grave [Sheol], where you are going.” This doesn't mean that Sheol refers to a specific, or individual, grave site where we may have buried a loved one.

You want find me anywhere, deliberately in a misleadingly way be equating Sheol as being a grave/tomb/sepulchre site where we may have buried a loved one
I have however emphasised that Sheol in an oversimplified or elementary manner can be grave or has been referred as grave

Grave/tomb/sepulchre sites are merely places of deposit for a corpse. Sheol is the realm of the dead or departed souls
- Souls do not linger in the air. Souls do not stay in limbo. Souls do not hang about. Souls do not make revisits

EnigmAries:
When the Bible refers to a specific burial place, or grave, it uses other Hebrew and Greek words, not sheohl and haides.( Genesis 23:7-9; Matthew 28:1) Also, the Bible does not use the word “Sheol” for a grave where several individuals are buried together, such as a family grave or a mass grave.— Genesis 49:30, 31.
Sheol has already swallowed, so to speak, countless dead people, it always seems to hunger for more. (Proverbs 30:15, 16) Unlike any literal burial site, which can hold only a limited number of the dead, ‘the Grave is never satisfied.’ ( Proverbs 27:20) That is, Sheol never becomes full. It has no limits. Sheol, or Hades, is thus not a literal place in a specific location. Rather, it is the common grave of dead mankind, the figurative location where most of mankind sleep in death.

The Bible teaching of the resurrection helps us to gain further insight into the meaning of “Sheol” and “Hades.” The Bible associates Sheol and Hades with the sort of death from which there will be a resurrection. *( Job 14:13; Acts 2:31; Revelation 20:13) It also shows that those in Sheol, or Hades, include not only those who have served God but also many who have not served him. ( Genesis 37:35; Psalm 55:15) Therefore, the Bible teaches that there will be “a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous.”— Acts 24:15

Until Jesus in the NT, Sheol in general, without necessarily distinguishing between righteous or unrighteous souls, has been the realm of the dead or abode of the dead

We have verses in OT (e.g. Psalm 9:17 etcetera) suggesting that the wicked go to Sheol but it was Jesus in the NT that brought things into perspective when he shared the hyperbolic illustration of Sheol with the story of the Rich Man being elsewhere and Abraham with the Poor Man being on a different side
- remember just because you're telling a joke, it doesnt necessarily mean the joke is devoid of some element of truth and reality

Sheol (i.e. the original Hebrew concept of afterlife) now has gray lines shared with Gehenna (i.e. the refuse dump in Jerusalem hyperbolically referred to by Jesus in Matthew 5:29 Matthew 18:9 and Mark 9:47) and Hell (i.e. a Greek mythology and Greek concept of afterlife) which arent really understood
The etymology of afterlife from a Jewish concept (i.e. Sheol, with 2 sections) has changed over time and Sheol, since, has being interchangeably replaced with Gehenna and Hell/Hades

EnigmAries:
It will make much sense to you realise that Man does not have any soul/spirit that lives after him after death.
Soul in Hebrew is the word 'nephesh', which means "a living being
Soul in Greek is the word 'psyche', which means "a living being.
Spirit in Hebrew is the word 'ruwach', which means"breath, wind, air".
Spirit in Greek is the word 'pneuma', which can either mean "Holy Spirit" or "breath, wind, air"

So we can see from this that the words soul and spirit do not mean that we have our OWN spirit or soul, but rather we basically have the spirit of God in us keeping us alive, and with that spirit in us, we ARE LIVING SOULS. And we can see this clearly from the creation account
...Genesis 2:7 ...'And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.'...

Notice one very important point about the creation of Adam. When God breathed into him the breath of life, "Spirit", Adam BECAME a living "Soul". So if we reverse this process, God's Spirit (breath) is removed and Adam dies, he becomes dust again.
This is an important truth concerning death and what happens when we die. Remember that Adam wasn't given a soul, he BECAME a living soul with the breath of God inside him. We are but dust without the Spirit (breath) of God in us, as this following Bible verse confirms
...Genesis 3:19 ...'In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Honestly with this your above, it is evident not everyone knows there are distinctions between spirit and soul

Luckily for us, Hebrews 4:12, hints at a barest minimum that, there is a distinction between soul and spirit, vis-à-vis that they can be separated

For the word of God is living and all-efficient,
and much sharper than a double edged sword,
and it pierces to the separation of soul and spirit and of joints, marrow and of bones,
and judges the reasoning and conscience of the heart.
- Hebrews 4:12

Now since you've veered off course and changed route to go on this choice journey of yours, shall we put things in their right or proper perspectives?

Remember the saying in Leviticus 17:11 and Deuteronomy 12:23 or Genesis 2:7, Job 33:4 and Job 27:3 that:
the LIFE of the FLESH is in the BLOOD
and the LIFE of the SOUL is in the breath/SPIRIT

The BLOOD makes the difference between the life and death of the BODY
(i.e. when blood stops, the SOUL departs/exits the body)
- a body without a soul becomes a corpse or dead body

The SPIRIT makes the difference between the life and death of the SOUL
(i.e. when spirit leaves, the SOUL is empty)
- a soul without spirit becomes a dead soul

The Spirit, Soul and Body have distinct and different roles to play
1 Thessalonians 5:23 hints about keeping the three aboveboard

The spirit, typifies what has to do with our relation to God or our consciousness of God (i.e. relation with what is more than ourselves)
the soul, typifies what has to do with our relation to ourselves or our self consciousness
the body, typifies what has to do with our relation to the physical and material world (i.e. relation with what is less than ourselves)

Now may the God of peace make you holy in every way,
and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless
until our Lord Jesus Christ comes again.
- 1 Thessalonians 5:23

EnigmAries:
So if the Bible doesn't support the teaching of a separate soul beyond human existence

SMH, the bible actually does support the teaching of a separate soul beyond human existence. Revelation 6:9 and Revelation 20:4 is suffice, without needing to produce other relevant verses about afterlife

Fast forwarding, depending at which stage or phase, souls will be purified by fire, and souls will be destroyed as in burnt for destruction (i.e. die) in the Lake of Fire

Then I saw thrones, and the people sitting on them had been given the authority to judge.
And I saw the SOULS of those who had been beheaded for their testimony about Jesus and for proclaiming the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his statue, nor accepted his mark on their forehead or their hands.
They all came to life again, and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
- Revelation 20:4

When the Lamb broke the fifth seal,
I saw under the altar the SOULS of all who had been martyred for the word of God
and for being faithful in their testimony
- Revelation 6:9

Have you ever thought why souls are important to God?

But God will redeem me from the realm of the dead; he will surely take me to himself
- Psalm 49:15 NIV

God will truly redeem me from the power of Sheol. He will surely receive me! Interlude
- Psalm 49:15 ISV

EnigmAries:
I wonder those who are residents in that literal hades, which according to you, is a temporal abode of torment immediately after death

SMH. You have become melodramatic about all this, misquoting me, making assumptions of what I've wrote and turned to doing conjectures

EnigmAries:
We all know judgement have not taken place, thus directly accusing God of jungle justice

Food for thought, items somehow end up in my kitchen trash can.
Judgement hasnt started, not until the decision is made to have the trash can emptied off ALL its contents, and be enroute to the refuse dump-yard

Finding oneself in whichever part of Sheol it may be, is not in itself judgement. It is not the end.
- Sheol, is just like an airport's departure hall, before boarding flight to a final destination, as I earlier insinuated.
You seem to have forgotten, we'll stand before a Judge and have a free service of an Advocate, for pleading individual case(s)

@ MuttleyLaff

For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead,
that they might be judged
according to men in the flesh,
but live according to God in the spirit. - 1 Peter 4:6

1 Therefore, since Christ
suffered in his body, arm
yourselves also with the same attitude, because whoever suffers in the body is done with sin. 2 As a result, they do not live the rest of their earthly lives for evil human desires, but rather for the will of God. 3 For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable
idolatry. 4 They are surprised
that you do not join them in
their reckless, wild living, and
they heap abuse on you. 5 But
they will have to give account
to him who is ready to judge
the living and the dead. 6 For
this is the reason the gospel
was preached even to those
who are now dead, so that
they might be judged
according to human standards
in regard to the body, but live according to God in regard to the spirit.

1. Does The verse say that jesus went to hades to preach to the dead . No!.

2 we cannot have a belief that jesus went to hades to preach to the dead unless we belief that their is a possibility of those in hades repenting and thus they can change their destination(following ur explanation). For what is the purpose of jesus preaching to them in the first place.

3 so what do we learn from those verses:
Peter called them dead because were ‘dead in trespasses and sins’ before hearing the gospel but would begin to ‘live’ spiritually because of faith in the good
news.

Eph 2:1-7;, you were dead in your transgressions and
sins, 2 in which you used to
live when you followed the
ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.
3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh a and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—
it is by grace you have been
saved.

compare Mt 8: 21,22;
21 Another of the disciples said to him, “Lord, let me first go and bury my father.” 22 And Jesus said to him, “Follow me, and leave the dead to bury their own dead.”

1Ti 5:6.;
6 but she who is self-indulgent is dead even while she lives..
So peter was not talking about the dead in hades cus
preaching would not have
benefited physically dead
humans because, as
Ecclesiastes 9:5 says, they
“are conscious of nothing at
all,”/ know nothing/ do not know anything.
Psalm 146:4 adds that at death a person’s “thoughts do perish.”

I am He who lived and died, and behold, I am alive to the eternity of eternities, amen,
and I have the key of Death and of Sheol. - Revelation 1:18

Bro, jesus has the key of death and of sheol. The verse did not say he got these key in hades or abrahams bosom or sheol or hell.

dolphinheart:
1. Does The verse say that Jesus went to hades to preach to the dead. No!.

Hold on to your knickers bro. Dont get too excited with that, No!, of yours
Let's first outline out how far we both agree
Do you agree or not that Jesus went down to Hades?
Do you agree or not that Jesus ''preached'' down there?

dolphinheart:
2 we cannot have a belief that Jesus went to Hades to preach to the dead

Let's start with showing show hands on how much of Hades there is to know:
What do you know about Hades (i.e. talk of its layout, give a description of it and its environ)
What do you think the alleged preach was all about?
Read the below for the other response to this

dolphinheart:
unless we belief that their is a possibility of those in Hades repenting and thus they can change their destination[/b] (following ur explanation)

Unlike you, the Rich man doesnt see his situation as hopeless.
He didnt easily give up and he had a different opinion to yours

His fighting spirit is evident and especially noticed reading the two efforts made by him in Luke 16:24 and Luke 16:27-28, 30

So he cried out,
'Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue.
For I am in agony in this fire.'
- Luke 16:24

²⁷“He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family,
²⁸for I have five brothers. Let him warn them,
so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’
³⁰“ ‘No, father Abraham,’ he said,
‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’
- Luke 16:27-28, 30

Classic example of an inverted ''be careful what you wish for'' (it might just happen, you just might get it!)

dolphinheart:
3 so what do we learn from those verses:
Peter called them dead because were ‘dead in trespasses and sins’ before hearing the gospel but would begin to ‘live’ spiritually because of faith in the good news.

Good try, good try brother, for the moment park 1 Peter 4:6
Instead gnaw on this ''bone''

And he preached to those souls who were held in Sheol,
- 1 Peter 3:19
Aramaic Bible in Plain English

dolphinheart:
Bro, Jesus has the key of death and of sheol

This is remarkable coming from someone that doesnt believe Hades is a part of Sheol, nor believes Sheol has parts, and believes all that is my view

dolphinheart:
The verse did not say he got these key in hades or abrahams bosom or sheol or hell

I know the verse did not say He got these keys in Hades or Abrahams bosom or Sheol or Hell, so the keys surely were obtained by means of abracadabra then pulled out of a Magician's hat or maybe plucked out of thin air
Clowning aside, please answer this question, how did Lazarus, as in, the Poor Man get over to Abraham's side?

@ muttleylaff

Hold on to your knickers bro. Dont get too excited with that, No!, of yours
Let's first outline out how far we both agree
Do you agree or not that Jesus
went down to Hades?

Yes, as said before, jesus went down to hades. He died.

Do you agree or not that Jesus
''preached'' down there?

As said earlier, I do not agree or belief that jesus preached their(in hades), and added scriptures to support my beliefs.

Let's start with showing show hands on how much of Hades there is to know:
What do you know about
Hades (i.e. talk of its layout,
give a description of it and its
environ)

Hades is the common
transliteration into English of the corresponding Greek word
haiʹdes. It perhaps means “the
unseen place.”
In all, the word “Hades” occurs ten times in the earliest manuscripts of the
Christian Greek Scriptures

The King James Version
translates haiʹdes as “hell” in
these texts, but the Revised
Standard Version renders it
“Hades,” with the exception of
Matthew 16:18, where “powers
of death” is used, though the
footnote reads “gates of Hades.”

“Hades” rather than “hell” is used in many modern translations.
The Greek Septuagint translation of the Hebrew Scriptures (from Genesis to Malachi) uses the word “Hades” 73 times, employing it 60 times to translate the Hebrew word sheʼohlʹ,
commonly rendered “Sheol.”

The writer of Acts, definitely showed Hades to be the Greek equivalent of Sheol when he translated Peter’s quotation from Psalm 16:10. (Ac 2:27)

In all but two cases in which the word Hades is used in the
Christian Greek Scriptures it is
related to death, either in the
verse itself or in the immediate
context.

Hades does not refer to a single grave (Gr., taʹphos),
or to a single tomb (Gr.,
mneʹma), or to a single memorial tomb (Gr., mne·meiʹon), but to the common grave of mankind,
where the dead and buried ones are unseen. It thus signifies the same as the corresponding word
“Sheol,” and an examination of
its use in all its ten occurrences bears out this fact. (go check the occurence of "hades" and "sheol".note: one is Greek and the other hebrew word)

The sea (which at times serves
as a watery grave for some) is
mentioned in addition to Hades
(the common earthen grave), for the purpose of stressing the inclusiveness of all such dead ones when Revelation 20:13, 14 says that the sea, death, and Hades are to give up or be emptied of the dead in them.( note, it said hades, if hades is a part of sheol, this verse does not include the other part their.)
Thereafter, death and Hades
(but not the sea) are cast into
“the lake of fire,” “the second
death.” They thereby figuratively ‘die out’ of existence, and this signifies the end of Hades (Sheol), the common grave of mankind, as well as of death inherited through Adam.

What do you think the alleged preach was all about?

there was/is no "preach in hades".

Unlike you, the Rich man doesnt see his situation as hopeless.
He didnt easily give up and he
had a different opinion to yours His fighting spirit is evident and especially noticed reading the two efforts made by him in Luke 16:24 and Luke 16:27-28, 30 So he cried out,
'Father Abraham, have mercy
on me and send Lazarus to dip
the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue.
For I am in agony in this fire.'
- Luke 16:24
27“He answered, ‘Then I beg
you, father, send Lazarus to my family,
28 for I have five brothers. Let
him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’
30 “ ‘No, father Abraham,’ he
said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will
repent .’
- Luke 16:27-28, 30
Classic example of an inverted
''be careful what you wish for'' (it might just happen, you just might get it!)

Using the rich mans quest to change his situation does not answer, solve or change my statement. My statement is "unless we belief that their is a
possibility of those in Hades
repenting and thus they can
change their destination".
Now is there a possibility for them to repent and change their condition in hades?, do you have a scriptural example of someone successfully achieving this?
That someone is said to try vigorously does not mean it is possible. And if its not possible to repent in hades and change ones flight plan, why the preaching then!

Good try, good try brother, for the moment park 1 Peter 4:6 Instead gnaw on this ''bone'' And he preached to those souls who were held in Sheol, - 1 Peter 3:19
Aramaic Bible in Plain English

1. Bro, I believe we are discussing and not trying to make a point by any means. the scripture you quoted does not negate my explanation on
1 peter 4 :6

2. Pls go read the scriptures again and tell us if the original word translated to "soul" is used there. Same with "sheol".

Below are some translations in which the words are different and contrary to the one you quoted above.

1.New International Version
After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits--

2.New Living Translation
So he went and preached to the spirits in prison--

3.English Standard Version
in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison,


4.New American Standard Bible
in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison,

5.King James Bible
By which also he went and
preached unto the spirits in
prison;

Since you quoted this verse, pls tell us which of these translations is correct and why, so we can fully understand the truth on what is being said in that verse.
A.Did the verse mention hell or hades or sheol.
B. Did the verse mention soul?
C. Did the verse(s)(before and after) indicate that this event happened when jesus was dead? Or after his resurrection.?

After you have checked this out(what the verse said), we can then "gnaw"(look) into what that verse is telling us.(understanding and meaning)

This remarkable coming from someone that doesnt believe hades is a part of sheol, nor believes sheol has parts, that it is my view

Since Hades refers to the
common grave of mankind, a
place rather than a condition,
Jesus entered within “the gates of Hades” when buried by Joseph of Arimathea. On
Pentecost of 33 C.E., Peter said of Christ: “Neither was he
forsaken in Hades nor did his
flesh see corruption. This Jesus God resurrected, of which fact we are all witnesses.” ( Ac 2:25-27, 29-32; Ps 16:10)
Whereas “the gates of
Hades” ( Mt 16:18) were still
holding David within their domain in Peter’s day ( Ac 2:29), they had swung open for Christ Jesus when his Father resurrected him out of Hades.
Thereafter, through the power of the resurrection given him ( Joh 5:21-30), Jesus is the Holder of “the keys of death and of Hades.”— Re 1:17, 18.

I know the verse did not say He got these keys in Hades or Abrahams bosom or Sheol or
Hell, so the keys surely were
obtained by means of
abracadabra then.

So as the verse did not say so, we should likewise not imply so.

They where not obtained by means of abracadabra.
They where obtained by the power of resurrection, the ability to bring one out(opening the gates for someone to come out) of hades.

Clowning aside, please answer this question, how did Lazarus, as in, the Poor Man get over to Abraham's side?

According to the illustration, he died.

dolphinheart:
Yes, as said before, Jesus went down to hades. He died.

Thank you but keep ''He died'' to yourself and next time dont give me unsolicited answers
Just answer questions directly without giving additional info not asked or be giving info, not relevant to question asked

dolphinheart:
As said earlier, I do not agree or belief that Jesus preached their (in hades), and added scriptures to support my beliefs.

Fair enough and thank you for your blunt and honest answer
OK, do you agree that, Jesus, when on Earth did teaching and preaching?
Now differentiate teach and preach - what is teaching and preaching?

Nota bene, after you, I too will give mine, about the latter (i.e. teach and preach)

dolphinheart:
Hades is the common transliteration into English of the corresponding Greek word haiʹdes. It perhaps means “the unseen place.”
In all, the word “Hades” occurs ten times in the earliest manuscripts of the Christian Greek Scriptures
The King James Version translates haiʹdes as “hell” in these texts, but the Revised Standard Version renders it “Hades,” with the exception of Matthew 16:18, where “powers of death” is used, though the footnote reads “gates of Hades. “Hades” rather than “hell” is used in many modern translations.

The Greek Septuagint translation of the Hebrew Scriptures (from Genesis to Malachi) uses the word “Hades” 73 times, employing it 60 times to translate the Hebrew word sheʼohlʹ, commonly rendered “Sheol.” The writer of Acts, definitely showed Hades to be the Greek equivalent of Sheol when he translated Peter’s quotation from Psalm 16:10. (Ac 2:27)

In all but two cases in which the word Hades is used in the Christian Greek Scriptures it is related to death, either in the verse itself or in the immediate context. Hades does not refer to a single grave (Gr., taʹphos), or to a single tomb (Gr., mneʹma), or toa single memorial tomb (Gr., mne·meiʹon), but to the common grave of mankind, where the dead and buried ones are unseen. It thus signifies the same as the corresponding word “Sheol,” and an examination of its use in all its ten occurrences bears out this fact. (go check the occurence of "hades" and "sheol".note: one is Greek and the other hebrew word)

The sea (which at times serves as a watery grave for some) is mentioned in addition to Hades (the common earthen grave), for the purpose of stressing the inclusiveness of all such dead ones when Revelation 20:13, 14 says that the sea, death, and Hades are to give up or be emptied of the dead in them.( note, it said hades, if hades is a part of sheol, this verse does not include the other part their.) Thereafter, death and Hades (but not the sea) are cast into “the lake of fire,” “the second death.” They thereby figuratively ‘die out’ of existence, and this signifies the end of Hades (Sheol), the common grave of mankind, as well as of death inherited through Adam.

Guess who the lame clapping is for, guess who the joker painted face is
Apart from the one or two edits, are you honestly, taking the credit for all this?
Ah, I now know what I am against, and know about your water hole too. No wonder.

dolphinheart:
there was/is no "preach in hades"

Why am I not surprised you say this
You've probably by now changed your tune about this after your describing teach and preach above

dolphinheart:
Using the rich mans quest to change his situation does not answer, solve or change my statement

I suggest you scrutinize the TEACHING given by Jesus in LUKE 24: 19-31 properly yourself, instead of studying the passage with those JW spectacles you have on

dolphinheart:
My statement is "unless we belief that their is a possibility of those in Hades repenting and thus they can change their destination".

At that time Jesus went down there, the Bible never says repentance is not possible for those down in Hades.

dolphinheart:
Now is there a possibility for them to repent and change their condition in hades?, do you have a scriptural example of someone successfully achieving this?

Answering this, depends on which timeframe you're asking this question about, besides time will tell

dolphinheart:
That someone is said to try vigorously does not mean it is possible

So you admit and agree there were attempts to change: one for him and the other when looking out for his five brothers

dolphinheart:
And if its not possible to repent in hades and change ones flight plan, why the preaching then!

This is why I earlier remarked: Classic example of an inverted
''be careful what you wish for'' (it might just happen, you just might get it!)

dolphinheart:
1. Bro, I believe we are discussing and not trying to make a point by any means. the scripture you quoted does not negate my explanation on 1 peter 4 :6

I said park 1 Peter 4 :6, it was premature pulling it out, besides it was out you badgering, I gave you it

dolphinheart:
After you have checked this out (what the verse said), we can then "gnaw"(look) into what that verse is telling us.(understanding and meaning)

I asked you to gnaw on it because it will be a springboard into more details about Sheol

dolphinheart:
Since Hades refers to the common grave of mankind, a place rather than a condition, Jesus entered within “the gates of Hades” when buried by Joseph of Arimathea. On Pentecost of 33 C.E., Peter said of Christ: “Neither was he forsaken in Hades nor did his flesh see corruption. This Jesus God resurrected, of which fact we are all witnesses.” ( Ac 2:25-27, 29-32; Ps 16:10) Whereas “the gates of Hades” ( Mt 16:18) were still holding David within their domain in Peter’s day ( Ac 2:29), they had swung open for Christ Jesus when his Father resurrected him out of Hades.
Thereafter, through the power of the resurrection given him (Joh 5:21-30), Jesus is the Holder of “the keys of death and of Hades.”— Re 1:17, 18.

You and I, both know, this piece from you, lacks originality
- it's another piece from that fav water hole of yours

Nonetheless read about the etymology of Hades I earlier shared and see how we diverge

---

---

what is Hades? - Here we go again

Hades is the abode of the dead and it is located in Sheol
- it's like saying Lagos is in Naija

Hell which has become synonymous with Hades, is neither Hebrew or Greek in origin

Sheol is, what you'll find in the original Hebrew text for any word for Hell
In other places, Hades or Hell was the Greek substitution for the part of Sheol where the Rich man is from the Parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus

As a matter of fact, Hell actually finds it roots in the classic Greek mythology, Hades

where Hades interestingly and actually, was the ancient Greek god of the underworld.
This god's name (i.e. Hades) later turned to mean the place or abode of the dead, which actually is exactly what Sheol is, what is signifies or represents.

Talking about Gehenna, well it is a valley, a valley in Jerusalem, used as a dumping refuse site and so was used by Jesus to depict the Lake of fire
(i.e. it is a place of destruction, as in, via incineration, a place for destroying things)

As earlier mentioned, Gehenna was the incinerating refuse dump in Jerusalem
Hades however, historically and originally is the name of a Greek god until it got turned to meaning the place or abode of the dead
It later got interchanged with hell, which is from a German word root
It was bible translators who were substituing the original Hebrew word Sheol (i.e. the part where the dead of the Rich man sort are), with Greek counterparts Hades/Hell that made hell stick with us today

I can draw you further in with unadulterated info on Sheol,
but these small and sliced up bits, so far should suffice
else you'll throw up or choke on the chunkier others

---

---

Reading the above and comparing it with your ''view'' on Hades, shows clearly how inadequate and whack your ''view'' is also shows you aren't totally familiar with this whole Sheol territory business

dolphinheart:
So as the verse did not say so

You do realise, I was serving back to you there with jest, your remark about the key

dolphinheart:
we should likewise not imply so

No one is doing an ''implying so'' anything anywhere.
Exercising deductive reasoning based on other scripture is what occurred there
So for your information, there are keys, but now dont start again, asking me for the scriptures about keys or about the key
For a change, do some proper and serious work yourself, not the JW type of work though, as I haven't the appetite now to spoon feed.

dolphinheart:
They were not obtained by means of abracadabra.

Make your mind up bro

dolphinheart:
They were obtained by the power of resurrection, the ability to bring one out (opening the gates for someone to come out) of hades.

Easy tiger! You're trying to go cerebral on me now but just made a right mess with a remark such as this

dolphinheart:
According to the illustration, he died.

This is a weak answer
I was expecting a robust answer. Something like, the bible states that the ANGELS CARRIED him over
An answer like that, would've then prompted me next asking you: How did the Rich Man then get to Hades?

Bro, the truth(s) in the Bible are like pearls mixed in with a lot of worthless pebbles.
so the onus rests on you to sift through a lot of stuff, pick things up, look at them and when you stumble on pearls, then dust them down, wipe and brush them until they bring out the shine, the luster, the sparkle and the light in them.

JEHOVAH speaking:
Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

Jesus Christ speaking:
Rev 1:8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord(kurios-God), which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.


Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Heb 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
Michael and the other Angels are told to worship Jesus the Christ,
jw falsely say against scripture that the Angel Michael is Jesus Christ

Heb 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
God said the angels are to worship Jesus Christ
jw falsely say, going against the Fathe, that Jesus Christ is not to be worshipped


1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

God was manifested in the flesh, and John tells us,
the Word was God and became flesh, John 1
jw falsely say changing scripture that God did not come in the flesh, he is "a god"

MuttleyLaff:
We've only scratched the tip of the ice berg and you're already giving up after reading that Sheol has a section similar a bit to Hades, the Greek's version of afterlife
What's going to happen if shown the size of the ice berg? You'll pass out?
What's going to happen if shared with you, that there is a part of Sheol, which is a bottomless pit cum gulf separating the two parts of Sheol from each other?

I don't know if I should laugh.
I just gave up on you for making up things that are not there in the first place

You want find me anywhere, deliberately in a misleadingly way be equating Sheol as being a grave/tomb/sepulchre site where we may have buried a loved one
I have however emphasised that Sheol in an oversimplified or elementary manner can be grave or has been referred as grave

Grave/tomb/sepulchre sites are merely places of deposit for a corpse. Sheol is the realm of the dead or departed souls
- Souls do not linger in the air. Souls do not stay in limbo. Souls do not hang about. Souls do not make revisits

Until Jesus in the NT, Sheol in general, without necessarily distinguishing between righteous or unrighteous souls, has been the realm of the dead or abode of the dead

We have verses in OT (e.g. Psalm 9:17 etcetera) suggesting that the wicked go to Sheol but it was Jesus in the NT that brought things into perspective when he shared the hyperbolic illustration of Sheol with the story of the Rich Man being elsewhere and Abraham with the Poor Man being on a different side
- remember just because you're telling a joke, it doesnt necessarily mean the joke is devoid of some element of truth and reality

Sheol (i.e. the original Hebrew concept of afterlife) now has gray lines shared with Gehenna (i.e. the refuse dump in Jerusalem hyperbolically referred to by Jesus in Matthew 5:29 Matthew 18:9 and Mark 9:47) and Hell (i.e. a Greek mythology and Greek concept of afterlife) which arent really understood
The etymology of afterlife from a Jewish concept (i.e. Sheol, with 2 sections) has changed over time and Sheol, since, has being interchangeably replaced with Gehenna and Hell/Hades

The Bible doesn't not have any afterlife concept than returning to dust lying in wait for resurrection. Resurrection makes no sense if immediately after death, an imaginary soul goes straight to an imaginary location called sheol.
I know with Jews romance with paganism, it's not out place if they believe in a conscious after life, but please, that's not what the Bible teaches.
As I've said before, sheol/hades as used in the Bible is a figurative term, not as grave for individuals, but a collective term to depict the final destination of man after death, which the Bible tells us it's the dust.
For example, we have a place called "Orun Oba Ado (heaven of the Kings of Edo)" in Ile-Ife, but the place is just a goddamn grave. Those who translated sheol into grave are not dumb. You have to study the literature of language before attempting to translate and I believe those translators did just that.
Gehanna is used to mean only the lake of fire. It didn't replace sheol.
Sheol is an OT term, not used in the NT. Hades was used instead. Both sheol and hades are translated as grave or hell.
As for the parable, it remains what it is, a parable and can not be taken literally. A look at other parable of Jesus will prove that. This can't be an exception.
See, Luke 16:22-23 ...'And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; and in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.'
Now this is where we start seeing the rich man and Lazarus parable for what it is. The mainstream teaching is that when we die, our bodies go back into the ground, and our "soul" floats off to either heaven or hell. But look carefully at what happens here in this parable. Lazarus is CARRIED to heaven, suggesting that he is taken BODILY to heaven. And the rich man is BURIED in the ground. And now notice what it says about the rich man. It says that he was "buried and being in HELL lifted up his eyes". Do you see the clear connection between buried and hell? Jesus is linking the two and saying that the rich man IN HIS GRAVE IS IN HELL. Because that is what the Greek word Hades is intended to mean, the grave!

Jesus finishes the parable by confirming that it is only through the Word of God laid out in scripture that will lead us to the truth of salvation. And confirms that if you don't accept the clear truths in the Bible, then even one being RAISED FROM THE DEAD (notice how Jesus links the "sending of Lazarus" in that parable to raising him from the DEAD?) would not convince the person who rejects the truths laid out in scripture. And did Jesus prove this with the Jewish nation? YES! A few weeks after He told this parable, He raised literal Lazarus from the dead, and STILL the Jews would not accept Christ for who He was! So Jesus here proved His point well.
This is the Bible truth about the rich man and Lazarus. This cannot be a literal event. Jesus is merely portraying an important lesson in this story.

Honestly with this your above, it is evident not everyone knows there are distinctions between spirit and soul

Luckily for us, Hebrews 4:12, hints at a barest minimum that, there is a distinction between soul and spirit, vis-à-vis that they can be separated

For the word of God is living and all-efficient,
and much sharper than a double edged sword,
and it pierces to the separation of soul and spirit and of joints, marrow and of bones,
and judges the reasoning and conscience of the heart.
- Hebrews 4:12

Of course, there is a distinction and I think I made that clear in my previous post. First, the hebrew and greek words translated to soul and spirit originally means "living being" and "breath/air" respectively. As you know, a sword can take the breath of life from a living being. Simple logic

Now since you've veered off course and changed route to go on this choice journey of yours, shall we put things in their right or proper perspectives?

I'm still on course, seeing that your belief in souls going to a literal location called sheol, is hinged on the belief of a souls that never dies with man.

Remember the saying in Leviticus 17:11 and Deuteronomy 12:23 or Genesis 2:7, Job 33:4 and Job 27:3 that:
the LIFE of the FLESH is in the BLOOD
and the LIFE of the SOUL is in the breath/SPIRIT

The BLOOD makes the difference between the life and death of the BODY
(i.e. when blood stops, the SOUL departs/exits the body)
- a body without a soul becomes a corpse or dead body

The SPIRIT makes the difference between the life and death of the SOUL
(i.e. when spirit leaves, the SOUL is empty)
- a soul without spirit becomes a dead soul

This is funny!
Gen 2:7 'and the LORD God formed man of the DUST of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the BREATH OF LIFE; and man became a LIVING SOUL'

Soul in Hebrew is the word 'nephesh', which means"a living being"
Soul in Greek is the word 'psyche', which means"a living being"
Spirit in Hebrew is the word 'ruwach', which means"breath, wind, air"
Spirit in Greek is the word 'pneuma', which can either mean"Holy Spirit"or"breath, wind, air"

Gen 2:7 has put everything to rest. Body (dust) + Breath of Life (spirit) = Living Soul.
Adam became a LIVING SOUL, not given a soul. A living man is a living soul. That's what this verse is saying. We're living souls with the help of the breath of God in us. It's the breath in us that is keeping us, and once the breath is gone, a living soul becomes just a corpse and to dust, he returns. From this verse, it should be clear to you that nothing survives the body after death.
Job 27:3 confirms this 'all the while my breath is in me, and the SPIRIT of God is in my nostrils'
Did you see this verse use "Spirit of God" instead of "breath of God" in Genesis? Spirit=breath and these two verses have proved that.
Job was a living soul because the Breath/spirit of God is in his nose. That's why we're dead the moment we stopped breathing- last breath. Nothing's left but a lifeless body, just like it was before God breathed into man. That's why all it takes to bring back the dead- to become a living soul again- is just to get him to breathe again. No magic.

The Spirit, Soul and Body have distinct and different roles to play
1 Thessalonians 5:23 hints about keeping the three aboveboard

The spirit, typifies what has to do with our relation to God or our consciousness of God (i.e. relation with what is more than ourselves)
the soul, typifies what has to do with our relation to ourselves or our self consciousness
the body, typifies what has to do with our relation to the physical and material world (i.e. relation with what is less than ourselves)

Now may the God of peace make you holy in every way,
and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless
until our Lord Jesus Christ comes again.
- 1 Thessalonians 5:23

Not to over-flog the point, the fussion of the body with the spirit (breath of God) makes up the soul (a living being). Your soul is just your being. This verse is just saying we should keep ourselves blameless before God- living an holy life.

SMH, the bible actually does support the teaching of a separate soul beyond human existence. Revelation 6:9 and Revelation 20:4 is suffice, without needing to produce other relevant verses about afterlife

Fast forwarding, depending at which stage or phase, souls will be purified by fire, and souls will be destroyed as in burnt for destruction (i.e. die) in the Lake of Fire

Then I saw thrones, and the people sitting on them had been given the authority to judge.
And I saw the SOULS of those who had been beheaded for their testimony about Jesus and for proclaiming the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his statue, nor accepted his mark on their forehead or their hands.
They all came to life again, and they reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
- Revelation 20:4

When the Lamb broke the fifth seal,
I saw under the altar the SOULS of all who had been martyred for the word of God
and for being faithful in their testimony
- Revelation 6:9

Have you ever thought why souls are important to God?

But God will redeem me from the realm of the dead; he will surely take me to himself
- Psalm 49:15 NIV

God will truly redeem me from the power of Sheol. He will surely receive me! Interlude
- Psalm 49:15 ISV

Much of Revelation is symbolic language and not literal. I hope you know? I hope you know that the horses that comes with the opening of the seals in the preceeding verses are symbolic too? So these are the people of God who have died for Christ and they are crying out to Him under the altar. first, where is the altar? The altar will be God's throne in Heaven, so could "under the altar" be on the earth or sheol? Take a look at this following Bible verse which reveals the truth about death and this issue of crying out to God under the altar:
Genesis 4:10 ...'And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.'
Do you see what is happening here? Abel has died at the hands of his brother Cain, and what is happening? His blood is "CRYING" out to God FROM THE GROUND, or THE EARTH. Now does blood cry? Of course not, this is just symbolic language for God knowing what Cain has done to Abel. So from this we can better understand the Bible verse about death in Revelation. They are not literal souls of people still living that are crying out to God, because they have turned back into dust. But their blood is a testimony to what they have had done to them, and it is their blood that "symbolically" cries out to God for justice, just as Abel's blood did.
And about Rev 20:4, has it not occurred to you that, that event will take place after resurrection?
At the second coming, the righteous dead will be resurrected with new bodies and together with living saints, they meet the Lord in the air. It's then, the 1000 year reign begins. This set of people no longer have their bones in the dust man, they are resurrected. They will reign bodily with Christ, not in ghost mode

SMH. You have become melodramatic about all this, misquoting me, making assumptions of what I've wrote and turned to doing conjectures

Food for thought, items somehow end up in my kitchen trash can.
Judgement hasnt started, not until the decision is made to have the trash can emptied off ALL its contents, and be enroute to the refuse dump-yard

Finding oneself in whichever part of Sheol it may be, is not in itself judgement. It is not the end.
- Sheol, is just like an airport's departure hall, before boarding flight to a final destination, as I earlier insinuated.
You seem to have forgotten, we'll stand before a Judge and have a free service of an Advocate, for pleading individual case(s)

We have one and only one destination when we die.
Eccles 12:7 'then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit (breath) shall return unto God who gave it'
This is consistent with the fact that we're made living souls with the breath in us. God only gave us His breath to make our body a living soul.

@ muttleylaff

Thank you but keep ''He died'' to yourself and next time don't give me unsolicited answers

Bro, jesus died, ill tell you or anyone else what I believe in not minding if its solicited or unsolicited.
Rom 4:25
If you dnt believe that, let's hear ur view.

Fair enough and thank you for your blunt and honest answer

Do you agree with my answers and the scriptures I quoted to support it?

OK, do you agree that Jesus when on Earth did teaching and preaching?
Now differentiate teach and
preach - what is teaching and
preaching?
Nota bene, after you, about the
latter, I too will give mine

I do not know or understand why you asked these question .

Guess who the lame clapping is for, guess who the joker painted face is
Apart from the one or two edits, are you honestly, taking the credit for all this?

You asked me about my view, about my beliefs and what I know about hades. What I posted to you Is what I believed in and it is supported by numerous scriptural passages. If you have contrary view , let us know. If you dnt agree with my explanations on the scriptures I quoted . Quote it and let's here ur views.
I'm not a scorlar, I'm still learning. And this is not a debate on who knows things or how to write things better. We are discussing using the scriptures as guide. If there is anything you feel is wrong about my post, let's here it. Never said the words in my post where entirely my creation, but they are words that I have total belief for in their arrangements.

Ah, I now know what I am against, and know about your water hole too. No wonder.

I'm not against you.
Its good you have some knowledge about My "water hole".

Why am I not surprised you say this
You've probably by now
changed your tune about this
after your describing teach and preach above

No changing of tune, if I'm wrong, let's hear you.

I suggest you scrutinize the TEACHING given by Jesus in LUKE 24: 19-31 properly
yourself, instead of studying the passage with those JW
spectacles you have on

pls quote the scripture and tell us how it proves my views and scripture I quoted Wrong.
How it answers, solves or change my statements.

At that time Jesus went down there, the Bible never says repentance is not possible for those down in Hades.

And did the bible ever made mention of repentance possible for those in hades before of after jesus went there?

Did the bible ever made mention of those in hades repenting before or after jesus went there?

Did the bible ever give us an example of just one person who repented in hades and changed his flight ticket?

What did the bible say about the condition or state of man in sheol.?

"And just as it is appointed for
man to die once, and after that
comes judgment,"
No chance for you to repent after you are dead. If that possibility is there. I bet you , no one will remain there for it to give up later.

Answering this, depends on which timeframe you're asking this question about, besides time will tell

Us any time frame you like to answer the, but also use the scriptures.

So you admit and agree there were attempts to change: one for him and the other when
looking out for his five brothers

My statement is plain and simple, "That someone is said to try vigorously does not mean it is possible."
If you think I'm wrong , let us know if you know it possible with scriptural proof added .

This is why I earlier remarked: Classic example of an inverted ''be careful what you wish for'' (it might just happen, you just
might get it!)

Bro, And if its not possible to
repent in hades and change
ones flight plan, why the
preaching then!

I said park 1 Peter 4 :6, it was premature pulling it out, besides it was out you badgering I gave you it

The scripture you quoted does not negate my explanation on 1 peter 4:6, if it does , let us hear ur explanation.

I asked you to gnaw on it because it will be a springboard into more details about Sheol

And I asked you to confirm some words in that verse so that we can "gnaw " on it.
Check the questions I asked again.

You and I, both know, this piece from you, lacks originality

What I stated/posted is the truth. It is surported with the scriptures.
If I'm wrong , tell us What ur view is and what you understand by the scriptures I mentioned.

Nonetheless read about the etymology of Hades I earlier shared a nd see how we
diverge what is Hades? - Here we go again
Hades is the abode of the dead
and it is located in Sheol
- it's like saying Lagos is in
Naija

Use the scriptures to surpport this view of urs. That hades is in sheol.

Hell which has become
synonymous with Hades, is
neither Hebrew or Greek in
origin Sheol is, what you'll find in the original Hebrew text for
any word for Hell In other places, Hades or Hell was the Greek substitution for the part of Sheol where the Rich man is from the Parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus

The original manuscripts made no mention of sheol in any relation to the rich man or lazarus.

As a matter of fact, Hell
actually finds it roots in the
classic Greek mythology,
Hades where Hades interestingly and actually, was the ancient Greek god of the underworld.
This god's name (i.e. Hades)
later turned to mean the place
or abode of the dead, which
actually is exactly what Sheol
is, what is signifies or
represents.

Good.

Talking about Gehenna, well it is a valley, a valley in
Jerusalem, used as a dumping
refuse site and so was used by
Jesus to depict the Lake of fire
(i.e. it is a place of destruction,
as in, via incineration, a place
for destroying things)
As earlier mentioned, Gehenna
was the incinerating refuse
dump in Jerusalem
Hades however, historically
and originally is the name of a
Greek god until it got turned
to meaning the place or
abode of the dead
It later got interchanged with
hell, which is from a German
word root

Good.

It was bible translators who were substituing the original Hebrew word Sheol (i.e. the part where the dead of the Rich man sort are), with Greek counterparts Hades/Hell that made hell stick with us today

Where is hades used to replace sheol? . Who did the replacement ? , and is he correct or right to do so.? Remember I told you what the writer of acts did with a hebrew text where sheol was mentioned.

I can draw you further in with unadulterated info on Sheol, but these small and sliced up bits, so far should suffice else you'll throw up or choke on the chunkier others

Thanks for caring about my welfare.

Your ''view'' on Hades is clearly whack and you aren't totally familiar with this whole Sheol territory business

It can be whack from human standpoint. But from the scritural standpoint , it is totally true. I follow scriptural explanation.

You do realise, I was serving
back to you there with jest, your remark about the key

No one is not imply anything
anywhere.
We are exercising deductive
reasoning based on other
scripture
So there are keys, but now dont
start again, asking me for the
scriptures about keys or about
the key
For a change, do some proper
and serious work yourself, as I
haven't the appetite now to
spoon feed.

Fact: jesus did not go to hades to collect any key from anyone .

I've done enough study to explain to you what "having the key of death and hades " means.

Make your mind up

I dnt think I've said something contrary to what I've been saying before .

Easy tiger! You're trying to go cerebral on me now but just made a right mess with a
remark such as this

The post is not primarily for you alone, its also for others to see, do personal study to confirm and then believe. Your personal view of the post is not important if not supported by the scriptures

This is a weak answer
I was expecting a robust
answer. Something like, the
bible states that the ANGELS
CARRIED him over
An answer like that, would've
then prompted me next asking
you: How did the Rich Man then get to Hades?
Bro, the truth(s) in the Bible are like pearls mixed in with a lot of worthless pebbles.
so the onus rests on you to sift
through a lot of stuff, pick things up, look at them and when you stumble on pearls, then dust them down, wipe and brush them until they bring out the shine, the luster, the sparkle and the light in them.

In ur eyes it can be weak, but in mine it is the truth!.
If you have a strong contrary answer, pls let's hear it.
Pls show us the pearls that you have found , the one the bible has mixed in with a lot of worthless pebbles!.

Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel(God with us).

Jesus said, you are the salt of the Earth, talking about believers being the cream of the crop so to speak
but there is another truth in what Jesus said

Our bodies are made up of sodium, potassium, calcium, magnesiun, iron etc
the same minerals that are in the soil.

Mat_5:13 Ye are the salt of the earth:....

Gen_2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,....

Op Your "Soul"



Was It Not Said That We Came From Him And Unto Him We Return?? Pls Always Reason Before Posting Nt Trying To Make FP