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Stats: 1061044 members, 1231076 topics. Date: Monday, 20 May 2013 at 07:23 AM
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Ikomi(m): 8:27pm On May 13, 2009|
Look young man. You are not the advocate of those women. When they think the time is right they would fight for there own rights.
Afterall in old Britain it was the same women that stood up for there own right to vote, when women were not allowed to vote. Until someday a woman became the Prime Minister. Nobody imposed it on good old Britain that they should allow women to vote.
In America Blacks did not count for anything, but today they have a black man as the President.
In France there was a time when there was a great difference between the rich and the poor. The poor never walks the streets of the rich, until the great revolution. It was carried out by the poor French men themselves.
I could go on and on and on.
So my dear friend Savannah all these great so called democracies evolved at their own pace.
I don't see why they think they have the right to evolve at there own pace and others should be fast forwarded.
So my dear Savannah everything works at its own time, when the women of Saudi need your help am sure they would consult you.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by savanaha: 8:36pm On May 13, 2009|
Am sure that women and girls who are killed for being Molested and burnt with acid for going to school will definitely stand up for their right very soon. Bout the help, don't worry yourself they already have asked for my help and I have helped them and are helping them the way I can. They will surely stand up when the indoctrinations of the Qu'ran, husband, father and Imam into docility end. I bet that will be very soon!!
No one is saying Saudi Arabia should be like France, Britain or whatever what we are saying is UAE and other Muslim countries realize that women are not sub humans, lest we forget. . .
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by RichyBlacK(m): 8:39pm On May 13, 2009|
Your good points are noted but don't you think comparing Britain, America and France to Saudi-Arabia is like comparing . . . you know what to put there.
The problem with your comparison is that you're not taking into consideration the power of religion in preventing change and keeping the status quo aka power structure in place.
Furthermore, no nation operates in isolation. Saudi Arabia is a member nation of the United Nations and is supposed to adhere to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which in Article 5 clearly states that: No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by RichyBlacK(m): 8:46pm On May 13, 2009|
What? Can you point me to another country in this world where a molestation victim is sentenced to 200 lashes and six months in prison?
Saudi Arabia, by virtue of her geographical importance to Muslims world-wide, must take the lead in tearing down outdated nonsensical laws that discriminate against women and foreigners. There is absolutely nothing good that can come from holding on to these barbaric laws!
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Ikomi(m): 9:02pm On May 13, 2009|
That is still where am taking you to, that time is the best teacher and not the forces of other nations. A good example is Africa and presently Iraq.
Do you remember when religion was not differentiated from state in old France and Britain, when the church invariably ruled the state. It led to the Crusade, when thousands of Muslims were murdered in Jerusalem just because the then pope in his move to expand the reach of the church, ordered soldires to join the crusade in other to wipe out there sins.
Today the recent pope is clamoring for the Palestinian state.
Look young man don't be deceived, by the propaganda of the west, I just have not got time to really go into this discussion. Forgive me for this.
All am trying to let you know is that experience is the best teacher, no matter what you sign on paper, if your not convinced in your heart that it is the right thing to do, but you put down your signature just to be in the league of friends, your signature amounts to nothing.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by RichyBlacK(m): 9:50pm On May 13, 2009|
1. But what about Saudi Arabia's obligation (legally binding?) to uphold the tenets of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights?
2. If Saudi-Arabia goes to war with a country and captures soldiers from the enemy, are they supposed to put them under their laws or respect the Geneva Convention?
No country operates in isolation except those ruled by tyrants!
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Ikomi(m): 10:04pm On May 13, 2009|
Then you have no case against Saudi Arabia.
Didn't the United States sign against toture? But D. Cheney is everywhere aguing how the end justifies the means.
And like I say dont try to rob peter to pay paul, Saudi Arabia is not toturing its own citizens. Its a law in Saudi Arabia, its people have choosen to abide by that law. I dont see how your argument of torture comes in.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by savanaha: 10:09pm On May 13, 2009|
How are you sure they have CHOSEN to abide? Do you know the consequences of accidentally not abiding much more knowingly going against a tyrannical law?
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Ikomi(m): 12:22am On May 14, 2009|
Savannaha I agree with you, the people of Saudi Arabia have consulted with you as you pointed out.
And from the way you feel I can deduce they are groaning in silence. I think you as the latest Moses should go and rescue them.
May Allah be with you.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by savanaha: 12:42am On May 14, 2009|
Well if going by what you say we should let the women suffer so as not to Frenchize or Britinize them. Allah or Baal or whatever can't help me because am not going to Saudi Arabia and I don't believe in him. Beg your Allah to change the Qu'ran and the perceptions Saudi Arabians have of women
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by yeswecan(m): 12:48am On May 14, 2009|
Saudi Arabia is a backward state just like most Islamic communities
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by $osisi(f): 12:51am On May 14, 2009|
You argue like a child.So all those unfortunate enough to be born Saudis, tough luck huh?
They are not free to wear the clothes they want,drive or even change their religion without fear of persecution or death?
The pressure is working.They have no choice but to change eventually.
If Saudis can leave free in other societies sotay the Saudi princes are photographed on their yatchts with their gay lovers and prostitutes,that should tell them that their idiotic rules don't have any effect whatsoever on morality.
There's some statistics to show that a high number of men from those Muslim countries are gay,higher than the Western countries so they might as well set their people free since the tight leash has made the men gay since they don't see the women,they burn with passion for one another just like prisoners.
You can't legislate morality.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by savanaha: 12:59am On May 14, 2009|
$osisi:Hahahahaha!! Most of these men are definitely gay to treat women like that.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by $osisi(f): 4:20am On May 14, 2009|
The largest worldwide gay organisation is called Al fatiha and it's for Muslim gays,go figure
In Kano and Kaduna and the rest of northern Nigeria, they had effeminate gay men called dan daudus servicing alhajis long before people knew what homosexuals were.
Since they have the women hidden behind bars,their men have started fancying their fellow men that's normal human tendency
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by SeanT21(f): 4:30am On May 14, 2009|
I feel sorry for these females. Its really sad knowing that they have no freedom whatsoever.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by biina: 8:39am On May 14, 2009|
RichyBlacK:Do not misrepresent the facts, as the woman was found guilty (not of molestation but ) of violating the law by not having a male guardian with her at the mall she was kidnapped from.The original punishment was 90 lashes, but was increased after she appealed and the court felt there was new evidence that supported that she was in a suspicious relationship.
I don't get what you feel gives you the right to call the laws of another country barbaric. After all it could be termed barbaric to grant legal protection to animals , or approve gay marriages.
You talk of Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and yet the developed countries violate various sections of it time and again. Where were the rights of the Iraqis when the US was invading their country on false grounds. Where were the human rights of oscar grant when he was shot in cold blood in California.
$osisi:At times it is better to argue like a child as ones view is less colored.
Saudi citizens are Saudi citizens, they take the pros and cons along with their citizenship. It is life and it has nothing to do with fairness. To say they are unfortunate to be born a Saudi is hilarious, as I could make the same argument for several other countries. You talk about them not being able to wear what they like, I ask if they have come to you to complain? or you are simply assuming everyone should think like you. BTW as much as you feel you have the right to wear what you want, almost every country has a law against indecent exposure. Who decides what is decent?
It has been shown time and again that forcing the way of life of one on the other, is never in the best interest of the latter. Each nation has its own laws, and I don't see what gives others the right to impose their own laws or way of life on another country. If you feel you care more about Saudi citizens than their fellow country men, you are quite mistaken. When enough Saudis have problems with their laws, they will make the needed change.
To assume your point of view is right, without any idea of the other side is simply being self righteous.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Ikomi(m): 10:22am On May 14, 2009|
The Saudis these our Nairaland Messiahs are talking about live a better life in all standard as long as they adhere to the rules.
1. The average Saudi man or woman don't come to the west looking for Jobs, when they leave Saudi Arabia they are out to shop.
2. It is only in Saudi Arabia that a desert was turned into an agricultural farmland for the benefit of its people to ensure it can feed itself.
3. They are currently building the largest petrochemical refinery in the world to ensure there future youths have a job and there technology keeps improving.
4. There health care is better than what you get even in America. If you are a doctor or nurse and you want a good reward for your profession Saudi Arabia is one good place to go, as long as you adhere to rules.
5. Teachers in Saudi Arabia are better paid than there counter parts in Britain.
All this done for the common good of its people, and these Messiahs - Osisi and Savannaha think they are wrong.
Look guys I believe charity begins at home.
Why don't you guys save Nigeria first.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by $osisi(f): 12:19am On May 15, 2009|
I am talking about the rights of a woman to express herself as she feels and you're talking rubbish.
It's not anyone forcing another,The laws are barabaric.
What laws say a woman can be beaten by her husband ?Doesn't common sense tell you that a man should not hit a woman yet you have a law in Islam where that is not a crime and here you are condoning it.
The same law says a 6 year old can be married and molested by a 47 year old.If you support this one,you need to go and check yourself.
You may be a craddle-robber.
A woman can be accused of witchraft and stoned to death in 2009
A woman is inferior to a man and men decide how she dresses and how she conducts her life.
I know the Koran says your women are devoid of intelligence but has anyone given these caged women of Saudi a chance to actually see how intelligent they could be.
Would you talk the same way if you were on the receiving end of these barabaric silly laws?
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by $osisi(f): 12:37am On May 15, 2009|
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by biina: 4:54am On May 15, 2009|
$osisi:Anywhere in the world, the rights of an individual are subject to the boundaries set by the society and the state. The fact that you agree/disagree with a law does not make it any more/less barbaric.
For your information, Nigeria itself does not have a legal lower age limit for marriage. Under civic law in Nigeria, marriage of a minor is permissible if the consent of the parents are granted. We have only started working towards defining the limit with the adoption of the Child Rights acts in 2003, and most states are yet to sign up.
Up until the 19th century women did not have property rights in most European countries, as opposed to same rights they had always enjoyed under the 'barbaric' sharia law.
But all that is irrelevant. The key point is that you have no rights to define what is barbaric for the Saudis. The fact that you disagree with them, does not grant you a license to ridicule their way of life. I am sure you will not take kindly to the Saudis trying to impose their ways on you under the guise of your way of life being barbaric. Do unto others as you have other do unto you, and leave the Saudis alone with Saudis.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Ikomi(m): 10:27am On May 15, 2009|
E don do, Noooo disgrace me again abeg. Upon all those things I try to make you understand when we are alone and together, u still come main square come show your yash.
Okay ooohhhhh if you feel really strong about the way of life of these Saudi people, it will be best if you could start packing a few things, the road to Mecca is not that far. Have you got a bible? Hold a crucifix, some holy water, a staff would be handy, go and tell them to repent for the kingdom of Allah is at hand.
When you get there tell them that the Lord of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Moses have sent you, to tell the Saudi king, to let the Saudi women go.
State all these facts you come up with, and dont forget to tell them that the heart and mind of a man called Ikomi is with you.
Victory will surely be yours.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by $osisi(f): 5:10pm On May 15, 2009|
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by $osisi(f): 5:11pm On May 15, 2009|
This is 2009 what is Saudi waiting for.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by biina: 5:58pm On May 15, 2009|
$osisi:They are waiting for their people. Let each nation evolve at their own pace.
The sad thing is that most western states care less about the saudi populace. All they are interested in is that their crude oil needs are met by the oil wells of Saudi.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by davidylan(m): 5:59pm On May 15, 2009|
And the Saudis care so much for the populace of western states? Every nation has its own national interest as top priority.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by Riskie(f): 6:03pm On May 15, 2009|
True talk. I would never choose to live there
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by davidylan(m): 9:12pm On May 15, 2009|
Huh? The very seat of islam? If a muslim wont live there who would?
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by MrCrackles(m): 9:15pm On May 15, 2009|
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by RichyBlacK(m): 9:17pm On May 15, 2009|
When it comes to human rights, national sovereignty has clear limits!
National sovereignty cannot be used to excuse laws that trample on the fundamental human rights of individuals. There are many examples where governments have been targeted and brought down by forces from without because the government overstepped their bounds. A good example is what the barbaric government in Sudan is doing to her citizens in Darfur. It is within the rights of the United Nations and the International Criminal Court to confront the tyrants in Khartoum and even force them to stop their senseless policies in Darfur. Part of the reason for toppling Saddam was the atrocities he allowed to be committed against some Shi'a groups in Iraq. The evil Nazis committed crimes against humanity when they murdered Jews who were German citizens. That those atrocities were legally backed by then German laws were and remain laughable excuses.
As far as I'm concerned, the fundamental rights of all humans, irrespective of geographical location, trumps any national laws. Hoodlums in power should not be made to think that their excesses will be ignored by other nations just because they're lording over humans who happen to be within their boarders.
The sad reality is that the United States government is guilty of this and also supports the misguided elements in Riyadh that use religion to terrorize ordinary Saudis. A close inspection of the laws in Saudi-Arabia and those adopted by the much-hated Taliban in Afghanistan would reveal very little differences, yet the United States is still mushy mushy with the Saudi monarchy.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by davidylan(m): 9:19pm On May 15, 2009|
why shld i? I'm not the one who decieves himself going on pilgrimage to a country he wont dare live in. You begin to understand the spirit behind islam when even its staunchest adherents prefer to live with the infidels.
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by MrCrackles(m): 9:21pm On May 15, 2009|
Drivel and gobblydygook!
|Re: Saudi Arabia ,the Seat Of Islam Is The Most Wicked Government On Earth by RichyBlacK(m): 9:38pm On May 15, 2009|
False. When laws go against the fundamental human rights of an individual, it is the moral responsibility of other nations to confront those tyrants who do not acknowledge the limits of national sovereignty. Reminders: Afghanistan under the Taliban, Germany under the Nazis, Italy under the Fascists, etc.
No news here. Even in the world's oldest democracy, marriage to a minor is permitted with parental consent. Go figure!
I concede. However, this was only true under a selective comparison.
Again, false. There is a limit to how far the Saudis can go with their laws.
Right now, the only reason Saudi Arabia still exists as a nation is because of Western backing. Their is a long history of instability in the Saudi peninsula and even as recently as the early 90s, the Iraqis would have successfully removed the outdated monarchy if the West had not come to the rescue of the House of Saud. The Saudi government, with all the pomp and pageantry they show is very weak and fragile. Al-Qaeda, an organization founded by a Saudi declared Saudi Arabia her No.1 enemy when it was initially formed. Without American backing, what do you think Al-Qaeda would have done to the Saudi government?
The Saudi legal system is a relic!
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