I was on the net 2day and met this atheist. I was really shocked at certain things she said.

She claimed first of all the Bible is a fiction. Mean a fiction like Harry Potter and that all the things in it has been fabricated.

She really have some interesting believes about Jesus Christ. For example, she claims Jesus Christ did not die but went into a coma. She believes when Jesus mixed saliva with sand to heal the blind, that was staged and not the truth. She likewise believe Jesus planned with so many people and making those claims of miracles.

I really talked to her much and most of the times, whatever she was saying happened for this world to become alive was by coincidence. She meant 'the evolution nonsense'.

My question therefore is 'Do we allow this people to pollute the minds of our growing young?'

Imagine this scenario whereby everyone believes there is no God. People will do things without their conscience again.

Its really sad!

The question is whether to tolerate religious people who think like you.From your post,you must have been inside the christian religion cocoon for far too long if you are just hearing that the bible is a book of fiction.
Here is another one to shock your pants off,"There were other saviour gods way before Jesus who did exactly what jesus did."
It is good you met that atheist(even if some his/her claims were wierd) who opened your mind to the real world as it is in the 21st century.

Poster what you gonna do?. . . . Kill us all?

The question is whether to tolerate religious people who think like you.From your post,you must have been inside the christian religion cocoon for far too long if you are just hearing that the bible is a book of fiction.
Here is another one to shock your pants off,"There were other saviour gods way before Jesus who did exactly what jesus did."
It is good you met that atheist(even if some his/her claims were wierd) who opened your mind to the real world as it is in the 21st century.

Am awed 2 b frank. R u kidding me? I thought this girl was been wierd but from this post Im rather being wierd. Jesus! is this how this world has gone?

Guess the order has changed then.

But please educate me. She was not able to convince me about how life began. Can u?

Akwasi,The real question should be, can you?

Tudor, to start with I believe there is a GOD that created this earth. I find it difficult to believe everything is a coincidence considering the perfect state and balance this world is (was?).
Who can tell me the Ecosystem happened by chance? There is a grand design and if u r not going to go beyond the by chance stuff I know most atheist talk about, forget it.
I think people try to dodge the issue when they say things like 'Its coincidence', 'Its by chance' and stuff. Can you explain why for example living things give birth and instantly their kids know we have to go for our mother's milk? Can that also be coincidenatal or a detailed plan by a Greater Being somewhere. It baffles me why people will want to believe there is no GOD. I think that believe is convenient but might be the costliest.

Akwasi:

Tudor, to start with I believe there is a GOD that created this earth. I find it difficult to believe everything is a coincidence considering the perfect state and balance this world is (was?).
Who can tell me the Ecosystem happened by chance? There is a grand design and if u r not going to go beyond the by chance stuff I know most atheist talk about, forget it.
I think people try to dodge the issue when they say things like 'Its coincidence', 'Its by chance' and stuff. Can you explain why for example living things give birth and instantly their kids know we have to go for our mother's milk? Can that also be coincidenatal or a detailed plan by a Greater Being somewhere. It baffles me why people will want to believe there is no GOD. I think that believe is convenient but might be the costliest.

Why would a grand designer include natural disaster, diseases, and other evils into his grand design? I just cannot believe that a grand designer would be so absentminded as to make so elementary design flaws.

huxley2:

Why would a grand designer include natural disaster, diseases, and other evils into his grand design? I just cannot believe that a grand designer would be so absentminded as to make so elementary design flaws.

I think it has to do with ur lack of capacity to understand.
God's presence has been repeatedly described as the fullness of joy, implying that He has made all things perfect in His own time.

The disasters u mentioned definitely reflect the absence of God. were they not foretold?

huxley2:

Why would a grand designer include natural disaster, diseases, and other evils into his grand design? I just cannot believe that a grand designer would be so absentminded as to make so elementary design flaws.

this is a flawed argument . . . many of you look too much at the negative side of creation as a sign that God shld not exist. But does it ever occur to you to look at the positives that far outweigh the negative? Ever wondered why the grand designer gave you a liver that can regenerate itself, two eyes instead of one, an intricately designed universe conducive to man's habitation, the gift of intelligence and memory that animals dont have?

The negatives you point out are not "evils" that God allowed into his grand design . . . they are consequences for sin and man's fall from grace. There was no HIV 500 yrs ago . . .

davidylan:

this is a flawed argument . . . many of you look too much at the negative side of creation as a sign that God shld not exist. But does it ever occur to you to look at the positives that far outweigh the negative? Ever wondered why the grand designer gave you a liver that can regenerate itself, two eyes instead of one, an intricately designed universe conducive to man's habitation, the gift of intelligence and memory that animals dont have?

The negatives you point out are not "evils" that God allowed into his grand design . . . they are consequences for sin and man's fall from grace. There was no HIV 500 yrs ago . . .

So were did HIV come from? Did the devil create it?

What about all the "evils" that happen waaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy before the fall of man?

huxley2:

So were did HIV come from? Did the devil create it?

What about all the "evils" that happen waaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy before the fall of man?

Same old broken record . . . and an exhibition of ignorance.

When did the fall of man occur? Do you know? what are the evils that happened "wayyyyyyy" before that fall?

Akwasi:

I was on the net 2day and met this atheist. I was really shocked at certain things she said.

She claimed first of all the Bible is a fiction. Mean a fiction like Harry Potter and that all the things in it has been fabricated.

She really have some interesting believes about Jesus Christ. For example, she claims Jesus Christ did not die but went into a coma. She believes when Jesus mixed saliva with sand to heal the blind, that was staged and not the truth. She likewise believe Jesus planned with so many people and making those claims of miracles.

I really talked to her much and most of the times, whatever she was saying happened for this world to become alive was by coincidence. She meant 'the evolution nonsense'.

My question therefore is 'Do we allow this people to pollute the minds of our growing young?'

Imagine this scenario whereby everyone believes there is no God. People will do things without their conscience again.

Its really sad!

When you talk about polluting the minds of the young ones, then that just depends on what you want to tag the pollutant. This atheist you talked I must admit had some pretty far fetched ideas of Jesus, but then its just as crazy as the stories of the bible.

Should Atheists be tolorated?! Wow! Whats next? Should Muslims, Scientologists, Buddists, Agnostics, e.t.c be tolorated?! In your mind, what do you think should be done to them?!

Akwasi:

Guess the order has changed then.

But please educate me. She was not able to convince me about how life began. Can u?

WHO KNOWS!!

Thats still a mystery that everybody is still trying to figure out!! If you believe that a supreme being created the world in 7 days, why not that we evolved from a single cell? Why not that we came about as a result of a big bang!! The creation theory is just as crazy and unfounded as any other theory out there.

Akwasi:

Tudor, to start with I believe there is a GOD that created this earth. I find it difficult to believe everything is a coincidence considering the perfect state and balance this world is (was?).
Who can tell me the Ecosystem happened by chance? There is a grand design and if u r not going to go beyond the by chance stuff I know most atheist talk about, forget it.
I think people try to dodge the issue when they say things like 'Its coincidence', 'Its by chance' and stuff. Can you explain why for example living things give birth and instantly their kids know we have to go for our mother's milk? Can that also be coincidenatal or a detailed plan by a Greater Being somewhere. It baffles me why people will want to believe there is no GOD. I think that believe is convenient but might be the costliest.

Perfect State?!! Please elaborate. And do include natural disasters, still births, evil, conjoined babies, malformed babies, retarded kids, diseases, famine, plagues, e.t.c into this explanation of yours. Also not forgetting the whole garden of Eden thing.



@ Poster

Open up your mind and start seeng things in 3-D. The world is more complex than the bible makes you beileve.

Akwasi:

I was on the net 2day and met this atheist. I was really shocked at certain things she said.

She claimed first of all the Bible is a fiction. Mean a fiction like Harry Potter and that all the things in it has been fabricated.

She really have some interesting believes about Jesus Christ. For example, she claims Jesus Christ did not die but went into a coma. She believes when Jesus mixed saliva with sand to heal the blind, that was staged and not the truth. She likewise believe Jesus planned with so many people and making those claims of miracles.

I really talked to her much and most of the times, whatever she was saying happened for this world to become alive was by coincidence. She meant 'the evolution nonsense'.

My question therefore is 'Do we allow this people to pollute the minds of our growing young?'

Imagine this scenario whereby everyone believes there is no God. People will do things without their conscience again.

Its really sad!

You are not above anybody and will never be. It's not your perogative to choose who speaks and who keeps quiet. You are like any other man and in no way more important. So all you can so is ignore.

davidylan:

this is a flawed argument . . . many of you look too much at the negative side of creation as a sign that God shld not exist. But does it ever occur to you to look at the positives that far outweigh the negative? Ever wondered why the grand designer gave you a liver that can regenerate itself, two eyes instead of one, an intricately designed universe conducive to man's habitation, the gift of intelligence and memory that animals dont have?

The negatives you point out are not "evils" that God allowed into his grand design . . . they are consequences for sin and man's fall from grace. There was no HIV 500 yrs ago . . .

The human body could be much better designed if it were ever designed by a grand designer, replaceable lung filters to prevent lung disease, teflon lined arteries to avoid arterial blockage, an improvement on our absurdly inefficient digestive system,is it the same designer that poorly designed our eyes?  Is it the same perfect or grand designer that designed the female reproductive system in a way that makes a lot of women to have miscarriages all the time? Spontaneous abortion is a very common experience for women. It is estimated that between 25-50% of conceptions spontaneously abort. Researchers do not have an exact figure due to the fact that when this occurs very early on, many women do not know that they were ever pregnant. More can be learnthere. is it the same perfect designer that designed the universe as it is the intelligent designer that placed a completely different sort of sweat gland in our armpits add proteins and fats to the salt and water of normal sweat that bacterias digest on which leads to body odur?

Is it the same designer that designed the human body in such a way that it cannot make on its own vitamins?  If you do not get enough vitamin D, you contract rickets, which causes soft bones and can lead to terrible deformity. If you do not get enough vitamin C you get scurvy. Dogs produce their own vitamin C internally, so they have no need to get it from outside sources. In fact, almost every animal on the planet makes vitamin C inside its own body. Humans are one of the very few animals (guinea pigs are another) that can't make their own vitamin C. Is it the same grand designer that designed the human body in this way?

Is it the same grand designer that made the human testicles tempreture sensitive? Why didn't he simply design the testicles so that they function at the normal body temperature?  If the testicles functioned at normal body temperature (instead of three degrees cooler) then the testicles could be inside the body like every other organ and be better protected like that of whales and dolphins.

Is it the same grand designer that designed the teeth in a way that it is constantly producing plaque and tarta gums, give us cavities in our teeth?Is it the grand designer that poorly designed our eyes so that SO MANY people are born with natural eye defect? Scientist have shown that our eyes are poorly designed to focus images on the retina which leads to so many people to be born with some form of natural eye defect. is it the grand designer that  designed the human reproductive system so that parents can pass diseases to the innocent offsprings? Is it the grand designer that designed the human reproductive system in such a poor way that leads to birth complications which kills a lot of women?

Why didn't the grand designer design the heart in a better so that heart disease is not one of the number one killer in the world?  Why didn't the grand designer design hair that works, so there is no such thing as male pattern baldness? Why didn't the grand designer design an immune system that works and protects people from diseases? All these flaws in design of the human body bring a lot of sufferings to humans. A grand designer will not design the human body in such a way. The human body is poorly designed. is it the grand designer that design the human body in such a way that babies are born with more than 4,000 different known birth defects that cause them untold pain and suffering?

The reason why the human body contains thousands of mistakes and problems is because there was no grand designer who created the human body. A grand designer would not make all these mistakes and create so much suffering. Nature is the designer. An imperfect and somewhat chaotic natural process has been designing all of the life on this planet, including the human body, for hundreds of millions of years. Every time you brush your teeth and put on your anti-perspirant, you will be reminded that a chaotic and natural process designed your body rather than a grand designer.

noetic2:

I think it has to do with ur lack of capacity to understand.
God's presence has been repeatedly described as the fullness of joy, implying that[b] He has made all things perfect in His own time[/b].

The disasters u mentioned definitely reflect the absence of God. were they not foretold?

Which joy?  Did your god make a perfect system that ensures that most animals feed by taking the lives of other animals? Was the small pox that killed about 400 million people part of your gods perfect creation? Are the over 4000 types of brith defect part of your god's perfect creation? Are tusnamis, hurricanes, mudslides all part of your god's perfect creation? What about Sudden infant death syndrome a syndrome marked by the sudden death of an infant that is unexpected by history and remains unexplained after a thorough forensic autopsy and a detailed death scene investigation which is responsible for the death of hundred of thousands of babies all over the world? is it part of your gods perfect creation too?

Over 70% of the Earth is covered in salt-water oceans that we cannot stand on, live in, or breathe or drink from. Of the remaining land, half of that is taken up by uninhabitable mountains, glaciers, deserts, or other unlivable terrain. On the tiny slice of land that is habitable, we are subject to the uncontrollable whims of nature, such as the vicious tsunami and diseases that are constantly out to kill us, are they also part of your god's perfect design? Scientist have said that over 95 percent of animals that once lived are now extinct is that part of your god's perfect creation?

The world looks indifferent, even hostile, to us does not look like the kind of world, in the kind of universe (99.99999999999999999999999999999999999% of the universe is basically off-limits to humans.), which was created and is watched over by an all-loving god for the benefit of his special creation.

deleted

bindex:


The human body could be much better designed if it were ever designed by a grand designer, replaceable lung filters to prevent lung disease, teflon lined arteries to avoid arterial blockage, an improvement on our absurdly inefficient digestive system,is it the same designer that poorly designed our eyes?  Is it the same perfect or grand designer that designed the female reproductive system in a way that makes a lot of women to have miscarriages all the time? Spontaneous abortion is a very common experience for women. It is estimated that between 25-50% of conceptions spontaneously abort. Researchers do not have an exact figure due to the fact that when this occurs very early on, many women do not know that they were ever pregnant. More can be learnthere. is it the same perfect designer that designed the universe as it is the intelligent designer that placed a completely different sort of sweat gland in our armpits add proteins and fats to the salt and water of normal sweat that bacterias digest on which leads to body odur?

Is it the same designer that designed the human body in such a way that it cannot make on its own vitamins?  If you do not get enough vitamin D, you contract rickets, which causes soft bones and can lead to terrible deformity. If you do not get enough vitamin C you get scurvy. Dogs produce their own vitamin C internally, so they have no need to get it from outside sources. In fact, almost every animal on the planet makes vitamin C inside its own body. Humans are one of the very few animals (guinea pigs are another) that can't make their own vitamin C. Is it the same grand designer that designed the human body in this way?

Is it the same grand designer that made the human testicles tempreture sensitive? Why didn't he simply design the testicles so that they function at the normal body temperature?  If the testicles functioned at normal body temperature (instead of three degrees cooler) then the testicles could be inside the body like every other organ and be better protected like that of whales and dolphins.

Is it the same grand designer that designed the teeth in a way that it is constantly producing plaque and tarta gums, give us cavities in our teeth?Is it the grand designer that poorly designed our eyes so that SO MANY people are born with natural eye defect? Scientist have shown that our eyes are poorly designed to focus images on the retina which leads to so many people to be born with some form of natural eye defect. is it the grand designer that  designed the human reproductive system so that parents can pass diseases to the innocent offsprings? Is it the grand designer that designed the human reproductive system in such a poor way that leads to birth complications which kills a lot of women?

Why didn't the grand designer design the heart in a better so that heart disease is not one of the number one killer in the world?  Why didn't the grand designer design hair that works, so there is no such thing as male pattern baldness? Why didn't the grand designer design an immune system that works and protects people from diseases? All these flaws in design of the human body bring a lot of sufferings to humans. A grand designer will not design the human body in such a way. The human body is poorly designed. is it the grand designer that design the human body in such a way that babies are born with more than 4,000 different known birth defects that cause them untold pain and suffering?

The reason why the human body contains thousands of mistakes and problems is because there was no grand designer who created the human body. A grand designer would not make all these mistakes and create so much suffering. Nature is the designer. An imperfect and somewhat chaotic natural process has been designing all of the life on this planet, including the human body, for hundreds of millions of years. Every time you brush your teeth and put on your anti-perspirant, you will be reminded that a chaotic and natural process designed your body rather than a grand designer.

Interesting

bindex:


The human body could be much better designed if it were ever designed by a grand designer, replaceable lung filters to prevent lung disease, teflon lined arteries to avoid arterial blockage, an improvement on our absurdly inefficient digestive system,is it the same designer that poorly designed our eyes?  Is it the same perfect or grand designer that designed the female reproductive system in a way that makes a lot of women to have miscarriages all the time? Spontaneous abortion is a very common experience for women. It is estimated that between 25-50% of conceptions spontaneously abort. Researchers do not have an exact figure due to the fact that when this occurs very early on, many women do not know that they were ever pregnant. More can be learnthere. is it the same perfect designer that designed the universe as it is the intelligent designer that placed a completely different sort of sweat gland in our armpits add proteins and fats to the salt and water of normal sweat that bacterias digest on which leads to body odur?

Is it the same designer that designed the human body in such a way that it cannot make on its own vitamins?  If you do not get enough vitamin D, you contract rickets, which causes soft bones and can lead to terrible deformity. If you do not get enough vitamin C you get scurvy. Dogs produce their own vitamin C internally, so they have no need to get it from outside sources. In fact, almost every animal on the planet makes vitamin C inside its own body. Humans are one of the very few animals (guinea pigs are another) that can't make their own vitamin C. Is it the same grand designer that designed the human body in this way?

Is it the same grand designer that made the human testicles tempreture sensitive? Why didn't he simply design the testicles so that they function at the normal body temperature?  If the testicles functioned at normal body temperature (instead of three degrees cooler) then the testicles could be inside the body like every other organ and be better protected like that of whales and dolphins.

Is it the same grand designer that designed the teeth in a way that it is constantly producing plaque and tarta gums, give us cavities in our teeth?Is it the grand designer that poorly designed our eyes so that SO MANY people are born with natural eye defect? Scientist have shown that our eyes are poorly designed to focus images on the retina which leads to so many people to be born with some form of natural eye defect. is it the grand designer that  designed the human reproductive system so that parents can pass diseases to the innocent offsprings? Is it the grand designer that designed the human reproductive system in such a poor way that leads to birth complications which kills a lot of women?

Why didn't the grand designer design the heart in a better so that heart disease is not one of the number one killer in the world?  Why didn't the grand designer design hair that works, so there is no such thing as male pattern baldness? Why didn't the grand designer design an immune system that works and protects people from diseases? All these flaws in design of the human body bring a lot of sufferings to humans. A grand designer will not design the human body in such a way. The human body is poorly designed. is it the grand designer that design the human body in such a way that babies are born with more than 4,000 different known birth defects that cause them untold pain and suffering?

The reason why the human body contains thousands of mistakes and problems is because there was no grand designer who created the human body. A grand designer would not make all these mistakes and create so much suffering. Nature is the designer. An imperfect and somewhat chaotic natural process has been designing all of the life on this planet, including the human body, for hundreds of millions of years. Every time you brush your teeth and put on your anti-perspirant, you will be reminded that a chaotic and natural process designed your body rather than a grand designer.

Have u ever wondered why I never respond to ur posts? u have NEVER made SENSE.

noetic2:

Have u ever wondered why I never respond to ur posts? u have NEVER made SENSE.

noetic2:

Have u ever wondered why I never respond to ur posts? u have NEVER made SENSE.

Is it that his post made no sense or that you dont have any?! Just asking o

Okija_juju:

Is it that his post made no sense or that you dont have any?! Just asking o

Ohhh. Don't you know noetic knows more?

michelin89:

Ohhh. Don't you know noetic knows more?

what do u expect?

noetic2:

Have u ever wondered why I never respond to ur posts? u have NEVER made SENSE.

He's one who never makes sense

so much beefing.


This thread now invites all those beefing Noetic , . . . .u are welcome to come and state ur case.

noetic2:

what do u expect?

I didn't expect anything different from you. Uhm, you are really predictable!

Yes! we av to tolerate Athiest, buddist, muslims, pagans and what av u?God made provision for every body, the lesbians, gays, heterosexuals, fools, scientologist, satanist. The earth,other planets, solar system, gravity,electromagnetism, floatation, aerodynamics etc.They all part of his GRAND plan and design. HE CREATED THEM ALL, SMALL AND GREAT, BEAUTIFUL AND UGLY, GOOD AND EVIL. Those who ask why some of the GRAND design has flaws do not understand the purpose of the design?can the pot ask the potter why he choose to make him so?can the C-Class benz ask Diamler-chrysler why its different from M-Class, A-Class or E-class?would M-Class ask D-B why it sometimes has suspension problems and was not made to self repair itself instead of going back to service station? U can't question the maker but wait, HE knows about you, before you were born, He knew you and knows u'll turn out this way and ask these puzzling questions. He knows you deny his existence but He is not moved because He has a good plan for u. He'll show HIMSELF to u when HE WILLS but HE surely loves U and ur opinion about HIM doesn't change him or HIS interest in U.

Antipastor:

Yes! we av to tolerate Athiest, buddist, muslims, pagans and what av u? God made provision for every body, the lesbians, gays, heterosexuals, fools, scientologist, satanist. The earth,other planets, solar system, gravity,electromagnetism, floatation, aerodynamics etc, They all part of his GRAND plan and design. HE CREATED THEM ALL, SMALL AND GREAT, BEAUTIFUL AND UGLY, GOOD AND EVIL.

Your god once told people to kill atheist and other unbelievers and sacrifice them unto him. Go read it up its all in your bible. He once told people to stone to death homosexuals. Errr but your god knows nothing about electromagnetism and how the solar system operates if he did he will not inspire people to write that he created the earth(with plants) days before creating the sun. By the way when exactly did you god create the plants in genesis? was it on the 3rd day as genesis 1 puts it or after the seventh day as genesis 2 puts it? I respect your sincerity because you are the only christian I know who admits that the biblegod created evil. other simply fail to admit they say their god is only the god of love, they say that satan created evil even though the biblegod said he created evil himself.

Those who ask why some of the GRAND design has flaws do not understand the purpose of the design?

How can a grand design have flaws? any design with so much flaws as the earth or the human body isn't a grand design at all. An engineer that designs the human eyes will be driven out of work, if it were a human project because so many people are born with natural eye defect due to the way the optic nerve has to create image by focusing light on the retina. The human eye is poorly designed humans will do a much better design.

can the pot ask the potter why he choose to make him so?can the C-Class benz ask Diamler-chrysler why its different from M-Class, A-Class or E-class?would M-Class ask D-B why it sometimes has suspension problems and was not made to self repair itself instead of going back to service station?

What is this?  . A pot can not talk the pot is not a living thing. A car is not a living thing and have no ability to reason and ask questions if they did they will question any bad car designer. Humans are better designer than the forces of nature that designed the human body. Lets assume that your god designed the human body. if he did then humans are better designers than he is, because humans are trying to perfect their designs. A car made in 1934 is nothing compared to a car made in 2009, Humans are always trying to have better designs to all the things they create if they notice that they have flaws in them. What kind of grand designer is it that designs the e genetic material of humans to carry cancer? Nearly all cancers are caused by abnormalities in the genetic material of the transformed cells and some are naturally occurring. Other cancer-promoting genetic abnormalities may be randomly acquired through errors in DNA replication, or are inherited, and thus present in all cells from birth. What kind of grand designer will design such a mess? As bindex has said the chaotic and imperfect forces of nature designed the human body this way not an invisible deity that ancient men said he "inspired" them to write that he created people from dust.

U can't question the maker but wait,  HE knows about you, before you were born, He knew you and knows u'll turn out this way and ask these puzzling questions. He knows you deny his existence but He is not moved because He has a good plan for u. He'll show HIMSELF to u when HE WILLS but HE surely loves U and ur opinion about HIM doesn't change him or HIS interest in U

Did any maker tell you this himself or are you still regurgitating the words of ancient men who believed that stripping sticks and putting them in front of mating goats will make them produce stripped offsprings? What are your gods plans? Are sudden infant death syndrome that kills millions of babies worldwide as bindex has pointed out also part of his plans? Does this planet with all its natural disasters, diseases, and natural evil looks like a planet that has a loving entity looking after it? What is your gods interest in humanity? Where was he when small pox killed over 300 million people in the world? All you have as an evidence for your god is a book that says stars fight along side humans when your god told his chosen men to go kill off the unbelievers because they worship other gods.

I read the drivel below and i had to laugh . . . do these fools have any shred of intelligence?

bindex:

The human body could be much better designed if it were ever designed by a grand designer, replaceable lung filters to prevent lung disease

Did the designer force a cigarette into your mouth to smoke? Why shld he design a filter so you can indulge in your own immorality and sin? Why are billions dying at 90 with NO lung disease?

By the way . . . how would replaceable lung filters work? Replaced by what? type II alveolar cells are designed to replace type I alveolar cells in the lungs when destroyed . . . however since they were designed to produce surfactant and not to act as a medium of gas exchange, they are less efficient.

bindex:

teflon lined arteries to avoid arterial blockage

That is purely stupid. The arteries ABSOLUTELY require endothelial cells that line them for important functions such as production of clotting factors and the generation of NO (via eNos and iNOS) which signals arterial smooth muscle to expand and increase blood flow. If Teflon lined the arteries viagra and other NO donor drugs used for patients with coronary heart disease wont work!

To avoid arterial blockage, watch your diet . . . do not smoke. Teflon is only used as a temporary surrogate in emergency situations.

bindex:

an improvement on our absurdly inefficient digestive system

How? What's wrong with yours? What would an "efficient" digestive system look like? Would it allow us to absorb 100% of all we eat?

bindex:

is it the same designer that poorly designed our eyes?

What's wrong with our eyes? What would the perfect set of eyes look like? Flashing camera lenses?

bindex:

Is it the same perfect or grand designer that designed the female reproductive system in a way that makes a lot of women to have miscarriages all the time? Spontaneous abortion is a very common experience for women. It is estimated that between 25-50% of conceptions spontaneously abort. Researchers do not have an exact figure due to the fact that when this occurs very early on, many women do not know that they were ever pregnant.

You posted a link and said "more can be learnt" there . . . in actual fact apart from the spurious piece of statistic quoted NOTHING COULD BE LEARNT THERE! For instance it said NOTHING about the etiology of spontaneous abortions that can range from immune abnormalities, uterine sepsis, chromosomal abnormalities or physical trauma . . .

Your link also said NOTHING on the important fact that the risk of spontaneous abortion goes up significantly for women older than 35 and or who have a history of prior miscarriages . . . significant clues as to the possible cause of spontaneous abortions.

The problem here is NOT the grand designer but normal human problems.

bindex:

is it the same perfect designer that designed the universe as it is the intelligent designer that placed a completely different sort of sweat gland in our armpits add proteins and fats to the salt and water of normal sweat that bacterias digest on which leads to body odur?

What's wrong with that? Did the designer also tell you not to observe good personal hygiene?

Apocrine glands are quite different from Eccrine glands in that the former is associated ONLY with hair follicles (which is why you find them on your scalp, armpits or pubis) while the former opens directly to the skin surface . . . i.e your forehead or palms. It is thus expected that both glands would excrete distinct types of molecules. The presence of fats and proteins at hair follicles is why you get pimples by the way.

bindex:

Is it the same designer that designed the human body in such a way that it cannot make on its own vitamins?

But that same grand designer gave us vitamin C in the form of oranges knowing we had the intelligence to pluck one and eat. What's the problem?

bindex:

If you do not get enough vitamin D, you contract rickets, which causes soft bones and can lead to terrible deformity.

could that be why the grand designer simply made sure that ordinary being outside in the morning sunlight is enough to provide you with the Vit D you need? I dont remember any of our ancestors complaining of rickets.

bindex:

Is it the same grand designer that made the human testicles tempreture sensitive? Why didn't he simply design the testicles so that they function at the normal body temperature? If the testicles functioned at normal body temperature (instead of three degrees cooler) then the testicles could be inside the body like every other organ and be better protected like that of whales and dolphins.

This again is more absurd thinking - not every cell in the body is the same. Efficient sperm production (spermatogenesis) requires a an optimum temperature than all other cells of the body which is why they hang out in the scrotal sac. One important thing to keep in mind is that sperm cells, unlike other cells of the body (somatic) are GERM CELLS, they carry only half the normal cellular chromosome and any heat-induced damage to chromosomes would lead to the transfer of possibly deleterious mutations to the offspring.

It is very amazing how the grand designer designed such an organ that can regulate its own core temperature. Have you noticed that the size of your scrotum changes automatically depending on your body temperature? If you havent ever noticed try taking a very cold shower outside during the winter or harmattan . . . notice how your scrotal sac tightens up and shifts upwards towards your body! Notice the difference in size and position when its extremely hot! All these happened without you thinking at all! Many men go through life without even noticing the phenomenon.

Perhaps you may be interested in reading up on the cremasteric reflex.

Now you raised the issue of whales and dolphins . . . but i'm not sure you even bothered to go read about the fact that both animals have specially designed vascular networks that keep their testes at temperatures lower than normal body temperature.

bindex:

Is it the same grand designer that designed the teeth in a way that it is constantly producing plaque and tarta gums, give us cavities in our teeth?

The grand designer gave you a brain to discern proper oral hygiene. Its not his fault if you have cavities in your teeth. That's why you have toothpaste. Use it!

bindex:

Is it the grand designer that poorly designed our eyes so that SO MANY people are born with natural eye defect?

what about those born WITHOUT natural eye defects? Do you still consider their eyes "poorly designed"?

bindex:

Scientist have shown that our eyes are poorly designed to focus images on the retina which leads to so many people to be born with some form of natural eye defect.

See question above.

bindex:

is it the grand designer that designed the human reproductive system so that parents can pass diseases to the innocent offsprings?

this is patently absurd . . .

Do you mean passing on genetic mutations to offspring? If one or both parents have dominant mutations in their genes OFF COURSE it would pass on to the offspring.

Do you mean diseases such as HIV? The offspring derives its source from the mother's blood . . . any organism carried by the mother would naturally pass on to the offspring. Its the same mechanism for all other organisms so how does this make sense?

bindex:

Is it the grand designer that designed the human reproductive system in such a poor way that leads to birth complications which kills a lot of women?

You mean the same human reproductive system that has produced shallow brains like you? If this system were so poor i wonder why our population keeps exploding. Beats me . . . i'd like to know what a perfect system would have been like.

bindex:

Why didn't the grand designer design the heart in a better so that heart disease is not one of the number one killer in the world?

Did you fool ask yourself why heart disease is the number one killer in the world? Obesity, poor dietary habits, smoking . . . are about the most powerful causes of heart disease worldwide . . . it is not the grand designers place to design a food chart for you.

bindex:

Why didn't the grand designer design hair that works, so there is no such thing as male pattern baldness?

He did design hair that works . . . high levels of DHT is the primary cause of MPB.

bindex:

Why didn't the grand designer design an immune system that works and protects people from diseases?

i didnt even bother to comment on this one. Even an atheist immunologist would think you were crazy.

Have you wondered why people who develop chicken pox never develop it later in life? Ever wondered how vaccinations work even 10 yrs after you got the last shot? That's the grand designer's immune system at work . . . go study before coming across as an illiterate.

bindex:

All these flaws in design of the human body bring a lot of sufferings to humans.

I havent seen any flaws . . . our bodies are simply a product of our environment, the foods we eat and the lifestyles we choose. Nothing to do with the grand designer.

bindex:

A grand designer will not design the human body in such a way.

How would you have designed yours?

bindex:

The human body is poorly designed.

Including your brain, vascular system, skeletal system, immune system, nervous system e.t.c.?

bindex:

is it the grand designer that design the human body in such a way that babies are born with more than 4,000 different known birth defects that cause them untold pain and suffering?

What are these birth defects and what are the "untold pain and suffering" they cause? Share them with us pls.

Chances are 99% of them are down to us!

bindex:

The reason why the human body contains thousands of mistakes and problems is because there was no grand designer who created the human body. A grand designer would not make all these mistakes and create so much suffering. Nature is the designer. An imperfect and somewhat chaotic natural process has been designing all of the life on this planet, including the human body, for hundreds of millions of years. Every time you brush your teeth and put on your anti-perspirant, you will be reminded that a chaotic and natural process designed your body rather than a grand designer.

You finally ended your unbelievably unintelligent and verbose piece with the most absurd coonclusions i have ever read.

How did nature design the human brain? how did nature construct the cell? How did nature generate chromosomes and why do we have a different number to that of the horse?

How did nature design us with the ability to adapt so quickly to adverse conditions? Why did nature endow us with two eyes instead of one? how did nature provide us with a liver that can process almost anything, is capable of regenerating itself from a tiny piece and is one of the most complex organs in the body?

Why did nature give us lungs instead of gills? How did nature design the spleen and why? Where did all the vastly different cells that make up the body come from and who programmed them?

Of course i dont expect an unlearned fool to be able to tackle his own vomit. You're more used to leaving us empty high-sounding drivel that your equally empty-headed atheist colleagues see and nod in uninformed agreement.

To you the length of a piece is equivalent to "knowledge". I weep for the schools that produced the likes of you.

davidylan:

I read the drivel below and i had to laugh . . . do these fools have any shred of intelligence?

And I read with absolute amazement the apologetics of this deluded fool who call himself a "scientist" but has keeps shwoing that he is am embarrassment to his peer.

Did the designer force a cigarette into your mouth to smoke? Why shld he design a filter so you can indulge in your own immorality and sin? Why are billions dying at 90 with NO lung disease?

Are you completely stupid? How on earth will some one that knows anything about lung disease talk life this According to theAmerican lung association Lung disease and other breathing problems constitute one of the[b] leading causes of death in babies younger than one year old[/b]. Do the babies smoke cigarette? What about chronic lung disease such as asthma, and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD) otherwise known as emphysema and chronic bronchitis are they caused by cigarette smoking too? You are a disgrace.

By the way . . . how would replaceable lung filters work? Replaced by what? type II alveolar cells are designed to replace type I alveolar cells in the lungs when destroyed . . . however since they were designed to produce surfactant and not to act as a medium of gas exchange, they are less efficient.

A perfect designer will make them to act as a medium of gas exchange so that they will be more efficient.

That is purely stupid. The arteries ABSOLUTELY require endothelial cells that line them for important functions such as production of clotting factors and the generation of NO (via eNos and iNOS) which signals arterial smooth muscle to expand and increase blood flow. If Teflon lined the arteries viagra and other NO donor drugs used for patients with coronary heart disease wont work!

To avoid arterial blockage, watch your diet . . . do not smoke. Teflon is only used as a temporary surrogate in emergency situations.

Are these the only causes of arterial blockage? What about Genetic or family history,Air pollution,Eating processed foods,Hydrogenated and partially hydrogenated oils,Diabetes etc. . Is it your grand designer that designed the arteries so that arterial blockage can be passed genetically? Why does teflon have to be used as a temporary surrogate in emergency situations in the first place? A grand designer will design the arteries with with a teflon like material so that there wont be arterial blockage in the first place.

How? What's wrong with yours? What would an "efficient" digestive system look like? Would it allow us to absorb 100% of all weeat?

A more efficient digestive system will function is such a way that it will not only absorb food but also prevent diseases of the digestive track like Cholera, Colorectal cancer and peptic ulcer.

What's wrong with our eyes? What would the perfect set of eyes look like? Flashing camera lenses?

So many things are wrong with our eyes it could be better designed to be as sharp as that of an eagle or a hawk. The process of image formation is so poor hence it leads to many people to be born with natural eye defects. Our eyes could be better designed like that of the octopus where the photoreceptor cells in the eye of the octopus point toward the incoming light unlike ours where our own rod cells and cone cells point backwards and absorb light reflecting from the back of the eye which causes a lot of problems because its not every bodies eyes that can do that hence the natural eye defects.

You posted a link and said "more can be learnt" there . . . in actual fact apart from the spurious piece of statistic quoted NOTHING COULD BE LEARNT THERE! For instance it said NOTHING about the etiology of spontaneous abortions that can range from immune abnormalities, uterine sepsis, chromosomal abnormalities or physical trauma . . .

And you believe you have made any point? What can be learnt from your own post? How have the nonsense you have written here negate the fact that 25-50 of conceptions spontaneously abort? Chromosomal abnormalities are found in more than half of embryos miscarried in the first 13 weeks. A pregnancy with a genetic problem has a 95% chance of ending in miscarriage.Most chromosomal problems happen by chance, have nothing to do with the parents Is it your grand designer that designed the female reproductive system with such vulnerabilities? Amongst the etiology of spontaneous abortions are certain viruses most notably cytomegalovirus, herpesvirus, parvovirus, and rubella virus—or from disorders that can cause sporadic or recurrent abortions (eg, chromosomal or mendelian abnormalities, luteal phase defects) is it your grand designer that designed all these too? Cause for spontaneous abortion is often unknown

Your link also said NOTHING on the important fact that the risk of spontaneous abortion goes up significantly for women older than 35 and or who have a history of prior miscarriages . . . significant clues as to the possible cause of spontaneous abortions.

Did you just type this because you wanted to say something or because you really wanted to present a case for your imaginary grand designer? So what if the risk of spontaneous abortion goes up significantly in older women? Why didn't your imaginary grand designer design a better reproductive system for women that will make sure that spontaneous abortion does not affect about 25-50% of conceptions?

The problem here is NOT the grand designer but normal human problems.

Are chromosomal problems which happen by chance and which have nothing to do with the parents normal human problems? .

What's wrong with that? Did the designer also tell you not to observe good personal hygiene?

Apocrine glands are quite different from Eccrine glands in that the former is associated ONLY with hair follicles (which is why you find them on your scalp, armpits or pubis) while the former opens directly to the skin surface . . . i.e your forehead or palms. It is thus expected that both glands would excrete distinct types of molecules. The presence of fats and proteins at hair follicles is why you get pimples by the way.

What is this nonsense? Are you hear to show your "knowledge" of biology or to make a case for your imaginary grand designer? Are pimples part of the grand design . Are body odour and pimples part of your grand designers design?

But that same grand designer gave us vitamin C in the form of oranges knowing we had the intelligence to pluck one and eat. What's the problem?

Yet scurvy still affects a lot of children no?

could that be why the grand designer simply made sure that ordinary being outside in the morning sunlight is enough to provide you with the Vit D you need? I dont remember any of our ancestors complaining of rickets.

. A grand designer will create a body that does NOT need to go out and get vitamin D. It will be naturally provided or manufactured in the system the way dogs produce vitamin C naturally.

This again is more absurd thinking - not every cell in the body is the same. Efficient sperm production (spermatogenesis) requires a an optimum temperature than all other cells of the body which is why they hang out in the scrotal sac. One important thing to keep in mind is that sperm cells, unlike other cells of the body (somatic) are GERM CELLS, they carry only half the normal cellular chromosome and any heat-induced damage to chromosomes would lead to the transfer of possibly deleterious mutations to the offspring.

What has this got to do with the fact that the male testicles are outside the body and not inside and better protected?

It is very amazing how the grand designer designed such an organ that can regulate its own core temperature. Have you noticed that the size of your scrotum changes automatically depending on your body temperature? If you havent ever noticed try taking a very cold shower outside during the winter or harmattan . . . notice how your scrotal sac tightens up and shifts upwards towards your body! Notice the difference in size and position when its extremely hot! All these happened without you thinking at all! Many men go through life without even noticing the phenomenon.

Perhaps you may be interested in reading up on the cremasteric reflex.

This has nothing to do with the fact that the human testis are located out side the body and less protected than other internal organs.

Now you raised the issue of whales and dolphins . . . but i'm not sure you even bothered to go read about the fact that both animals have specially designed vascular networks that keep their testes at temperatures lower than normal body temperature.

I am talking about location and the level of protection compared to other internal organs.

The grand designer gave you a brain to discern proper oral hygiene. Its not his fault if you have cavities in your teeth. That's why you have toothpaste. Use it!

What is this? Is it the grand designer that created the teeth to be constantly producing plaque and tarta which give us cavities in our teeth? A grand designer will do no such thing. A grand designer will not even design a teeth that needs toothpaste. Lions do not brush their teeth do they?

what about those born WITHOUT natural eye defects? Do you still consider their eyes "poorly designed"?

Sure a grand designer will design the human eyes to be as sharp as that of an eagle.

Do you mean passing on genetic mutations to offspring? If one or both parents have dominant mutations in their genes OFF COURSE it would pass on to the offspring.
Do you mean diseases such as HIV? The offspring derives its source from the mother's blood . . . any organism carried by the mother would naturally pass on to the offspring. Its the same mechanism for all other organisms so how does this make sense?

What kind of grand designer is that that designs such a poor system that that makes sure that parents pass on diseases like cancer and HIV to their offsprings? . Humans that devise ways to stop the transfer of diseases like HIV from parents to offsprings are far better designers and would have designed a better system.

You mean the same human reproductive system that has produced shallow brains like you? If this system were so poor i wonder why our population keeps exploding. Beats me . . . i'd like to know what a perfect system would have been like.

. No the reproductive system which produced fools like you who can not read simple sentences and understand. The world populations has been growing due to advancement in the field of medicine and reproductive sciences. Is it your grand designer that causes some babies to stay in breech positions and have their umbilical cord tied around their necks? What about the painful process it self that man has been able to ameliorate with the use of epidural?

Did you fool ask yourself why heart disease is the number one killer in the world? Obesity, poor dietary habits, smoking . . . are about the most powerful causes of heart disease worldwide . . . it is not the grand designers place to design a food chart for you.

Did you fool ever wonder why your imaginary grand designer did not design a human system that is not vulnerable to obesity in the first place. what about congenital heart defect that affects mostly new borns? did you grand designer design that too? What about coronary heart disease that people with menopause are vulnerable to or which is transferred genetically (heredity)? I asked why the grand designer did not design the heart so that heart diseases are not one of the number one killer and you come up with this nonsense?

He did design hair that works . . . high levels of DHT is the primary cause of MPB.

.

i didnt even bother to comment on this one. Even an atheist immunologist would think you were crazy.

Have you wondered why people who develop chicken pox never develop it later in life? Ever wondered how vaccinations work even 10 yrs after you got the last shot? That's the grand designer's immune system at work . . . go study before coming across as an illiterate.

If the immune system works people will not be infected with chicken pox in the first place. if the immune system works there will be no need for vaccinations in the first place. Is it your grand designer that designed an inefficient immune system such as hours that need the supports of vaccines and drugs? Learn to read and understand before ejaculating like a known nothing slowpoke.

I havent seen any flaws . . . our bodies are simply a product of our environment, the foods we eat and the lifestyles we choose. Nothing to do with the grand designer.

What about the genetic material of humans that carry cancer? natural birth defects and the inability of our immune system to fight off all kinds of germs and diseases?

How would you have designed yours?

Much MORE better than the way the human body is designed.

Including your brain, vascular system, skeletal system, immune system, nervous system e.t.c.?

Sure they all have their flaws they could have been far better designed.

What are these birth defects and what are the "untold pain and suffering" they cause? Share them with us pls.

I can't believe you are asking me these, i said that there are over 4000 known birth defects and you are asking me to tell you ? . Ok here are some. Limb reduction defects, Down syndrome, Autism, Polydactyly, preaxial, Indeterminate sex, Cleft lip with or without cleft palate, Transposition of great vessels, Hypoplastic left heart syndrome, Spina bifida, Transposition of great vessels, Albinism, Cystic kidney, Renal agenesis and Diaphragmatic hernia. Here are just a few of them. Did your grand designer design them too?

Chances are 99% of them are down to us!

You finally ended your unbelievably unintelligent and verbose piece with the most absurd coonclusions i have ever read.

How did nature design the human brain? how did nature construct the cell? How did nature generate chromosomes and why do we have a different number to that of the horse?

How did nature design us with the ability to adapt so quickly to adverse conditions? Why did nature endow us with two eyes instead of one? how did nature provide us with a liver that can process almost anything, is capable of regenerating itself from a tiny piece and is one of the most complex organs in the body?

Evolutions has provided satisfactory answers to all these. You can write a scientific paper and present it to the members of the national academy of sciences who all believe in it's explanations for all the things you have outlined and debunk its claims if you do not accept the explanation that evolution provides. I rather believe the explanations of real and accomplished(NAS members) scientist, than listen to the rants of a disgruntled jesus freak who keeps crying about evolution because it puts to shame his holy bible that says the earth was created before the sun and that humans were created from dust. As for the liver all i have to say is this,is the same liver that is plagued with so many disease?

Why did nature give us lungs instead of gills? How did nature design the spleen and why? Where did all the vastly different cells that make up the body come from and who programmed them?

Of course i dont expect an unlearned fool to be able to tackle his own vomit. You're more used to leaving us empty high-sounding drivel that your equally empty-headed atheist colleagues see and nod in uninformed agreement.

Evolution has explained all that again let me see your paper that disproves evolution after you must have presented it to the members of the NAS who happen to be accomplished scientist by the way not like you this deluded bible grabing goon who believes the words of equally deluded goons that the stars will fall from the sky on the day when jesus will come. What have your own imaginary designer got to say about science? Stripped goats can be produced by putting stripped sticks in front of mating goats. Very nice. Deluded goon.

To you the length of a piece is equivalent to "knowledge". I weep for the schools that produced the likes of you.

I on the other hand I weep for any organization that employees a scientist pseudo-scientist that makes comments such as these.

Did the designer force a cigarette into your mouth to smoke? Why shld he design a filter so you can indulge in your own immorality and sin?[/b] Why are billions dying at 90 with NO lung disease?

You are a disgrace to the science community.

How did nature this. . . . . How did nature that. . . .The real question should be how did god do it?. . . .oh, i know HE SPOKE IT INTO EXISTENCE. How daft and systematically stupid is that??

Talk about design flaws!!

How coukd anyone argue that the human body was a perfect design.

Tudór:

How did nature this. . . . . How did nature that. . . .The real question should be how did god do it?. . . .oh, i know HE SPOKE IT INTO EXISTENCE. How daft and systematically stupid is that??

Yahweh created man from dust because some unknown writers said he did, That explains everything so no question accept it because yahweh sopke it into existence. Go christians like good slaves and soldiers do not ask questions according to the late Jerry farwell. Just accept it because some one said god told him to tell you that he spoke eveything into existence except man whom he created from "dust".