Ibru has turned herself in

lets see if madam waziri go swallow her

http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssFinancialServicesAndRealEstateNews/idUSLQ29722220090826

I'll prefer to wait and see how the drama unfolds

Sanusi did what he had to do. If EFCC takes things overboard then its their problem. None of those bank CEOs deserve even a cleaners job in their banks for risking customers' moneys in risky loans!

only one thing will be achieved from this process

the image of our Financial Sector will be severely damaged and it will take another 5years to restore it at least to what it was before Sanusi came in.

this is the danger here

instead going to the next level we will be working to restore our image after all this brutal politics

MUZBO:

Sanusi did what he had to do. If EFCC takes things overboard then its their problem. None of those bank CEOs deserve even a cleaners job in their banks for risking customers' moneys in risky loans!

Banks make money by risking customers money. That's the practice the World over and it is 100% legal. How do you think they can pay you interest on your savings when they arent counterfeit printing industries?

Don't usually contribute on here but here's my own 2 pence;

Has an economic or financial crime been committed? If so, then the EFCC's actions are a no brainer.

As for Sanusi's action, having consulted for some Nigerian Banks and seen 1st hand, how they cook their books, I believe the extraordinary actions he's taken were necessary to address a rapidly deteriorating situation.

While I'm almost sure both organisations have flouted some "due process', I also believed that the people affected by Bank collapses in all over the world would have appreciated if their Central Banks had taken some drastic actions to save some of the collapsed banks and if more of the people responsible were made to account for their actions.

Is CBN not supposed to have some of its people on the board of these banks? I even heard they have computers in their offices through which they can monitor the affairs of the banks (I don't know how true that is).

If this is true then the CBN representatives at the banks will be privy to the goings on in there and they should be questioned too.

Also, if the CBN goes through the books of a bank and sees loopholes or anomalies, l think what they should have done is to notify the board of directors and they in turn will talk to the affected director and if they have to lay him/her off, they will do it in such a way that won't make the wrong headlines and create the wrong impressions in the minds of the people who have their monies in these banks either as shareholders or as depositors.


I have to state though that l thoroughly support any reform that will bring sanity into the economy, but it shouldn't be at the detriment of nobody and due process should be adhered to which l think wasn't in this case.

This man's action is a good example of a tyrant. For the avoidance of doubt, these banks (the now infamous) 5, had no liquidity problems. there ability to meet short & long term obligations are not in doubt. for some strange and inexplicable reason, we are being told that Unity bank is now better than Union bank; Sterling bank better than Oceanic bank. after having practiced banking for over 18 years, I am of the conclusion that this is a big lie; an action founded on a far deeper reason than we are told. The vanguard foretold this in march when they warned us that some cabal is planning d take over of 5 banks in Nigeria. These group, called the anti-consolidation cabal, will create panic in the sector thereby alarming depositors leading to Govt injection of funds into the banks. The govt will then later sell their stake to d cabal leading to a change of ownership. I am not convinced that Sanusi has good intentions when he came out a few days ago to say he wants to sell the banks. why and how?

As I understand it, the N420b were injected into tier 2 capital meaning reserve capital. if the banks had liquidity problems, the injection would have been to the trading capital: tier 1 NOT tier 2 which banks rarely touch. Why also audit 10 out of 24 banks b4 sacking d directors? why not finish the total audit first and disclose the result for the banks to react/explain/argue the report b4 forcing them out. Why intimidate them with detention from day 1 as if they had been found guilty already. This seems to me as if the banks were selected. For one, it takes an average of one month to do a proper audit of one bank. Sanusi has been around for 2 months and he would have us believe he has audited 10 banks so exhaustively to make this far reaching decsion Its clearly impossible. It also seems to me the arrested directors are being made not to talk since the continued detention. something is seriously nt right somehwere. Time will tell

Beaf:

Banks make money by risking customers money. That's the practice the World over and it is 100% legal. How do you think they can pay you interest on your savings when they arent counterfeit printing industries?

Well, how do they expect to get the loans paid if there were no collaterals involved?

MUZBO:

Well, how do they expect to get the loans paid if there were no collaterals involved?

There is no law that says loans must be secured with collateral. Loans can be given based on an individuals/firms worth or standing, loans can also be secured on business proposals/plans etc.

Beaf:

Is it even legal to publish debtor lists? We need to be clear on that. Does Nigeria have any confidentiality laws and have they been broken?

There is something called 'secrecy of banker-customer relationship' in Business law. It forbids a bank from disclosing the details of a customer's transactions with it to a third party.
However, the law gives three major exceptions to this law:
1, Written permission of the customer: If the customer, in writing, approves that his account/transaction details be given to the third party
2, Public Interest: If disclosing the customer's account details/transaction is in public interest or if not doing so will jeopardise public interest
3,Court Order: If the court orders it or if it is needed as an evidence in court of law.

CBN's action is covered by EXCEPTION 2-Public interest!!!!

Jarus:

There is something called 'secrecy of banker-customer relationship' in Business law. It forbids a bank from disclosing the details of a customer's transactions with it to a third party.
However, the law gives three major exceptions to this law:
1, Written permission of the customer: If the customer, in writing, approves that his account/transaction details be given to the third party
2, Public Interest: If disclosing the customer's account details/transaction is in public interest or if not doing so will jeopardise public interest
3,Court Order: If the court orders it or if it is needed as an evidence in court of law.

CBN's action is covered by EXCEPTION 2-Public interest!!!!

If CBN got its figures on debtors so badly wrong (God alone knows how much else it got wrong). CBN's actions were based on wrong figures. How can such be in the public interest? It just looks like the CBN is rushing around for figures to suit supposed "crimes".

QUSETIONS I HAVE FOR SANUSI

looking at the scenario I am tempted to ask questions on the sincerity of Sanusi , if his actions have been guided totally by professional expediency ,prejudice or " a special script".

1. If 5 banks accounted for 85% of the EDW , then why audit 10 and not just the 5 or the entire 24?. Ok if the results of the other 14 will be released soon then why the rush? May be 3 weeks pose much more danger than the 11 months that the CBN claim to have been experiencing this trend.

2.Are bad loans are common to these banks alone , is the CBN saying that the owners of bad loans in the banks that "passed" the "test" can walk free. Why not publish the bad loans in all the banks audited for us to know how good or bad things are?

3. When the CBN found this problems from its investigations did it refer to the banks officially for some clarification? Would the findings not pass for a an audit query which should graduate into a full audit report before actions like this are taken? I have seen cases where there is so much difference between an audit query and an audit report.

4. Is it true that when CAR drops below the expected level, the CBN is expected to inform the banks concerned and give them a time frame to balance things out before sanctions can be given?

4.Is it true that the CBN signed the annual report of the oceanic bank for the last financial year where 41 billion provision was made for bad loans and came a few days later to remove the management? would it not mean that it is either the findings are wrong or the report they signed was wrong? If so was the CBN in itself doing due dilligence in its oversight functions?

5. If the CBN acted on May data could it be that there have been substantial changes in the banks that would have changed the status of the data upon which the CBN's action is based?

6.If the CBN through the EFCC can go after the bad debtors in this jungle style, how is it differet from what intercontinental bank in an open letter was asking the president to do?

7. Why is the CBN/FG so hasty in getting buyers for this banks when a recovery to the tune of 30% would stabilise the banks?

8. Do we have any organisation(not just bank infact even church ) in this country where forensic audits of this magintude will be carried out without opening a can of worms. I mean why not threat all the banks same way instead of isolating a few? If in a class of 24 students a teacher gives 10 students a test, mark the scripts and release the results. Then come later to organise test of the other 14, will he set same question for the other 14 if yes will the 14 not have had undue advantage in preparing for the test?. If he sets a different question can we still say the test is a fair means of calibrating the students?

9. Is the CBN and EFCC feigning ignorance that the amount the debtors are paying back to the 5 banks are monies collected from other banks thereby transfering the liability and further weakening the system?

QUSETIONS I HAVE FOR SANUSI

looking at the scenario I am tempted to ask questions on the sincerity of Sanusi , if his actions have been guided totally by professional expediency ,prejudice or " a special script".

1. If 5 banks accounted for 85% of the EDW , then why audit 10 and not just the 5 or the entire 24?. Ok if the results of the other 14 will be released soon then why the rush? May be 3 weeks pose much more danger than the 11 months that the CBN claim to have been experiencing this trend.

2.Are bad loans are common to these banks alone , is the CBN saying that the owners of bad loans in the banks that "passed" the "test" can walk free. Why not publish the bad loans in all the banks audited for us to know how good or bad things are?

3. When the CBN found this problems from its investigations did it refer to the banks officially for some clarification? Would the findings not pass for a an audit query which should graduate into a full audit report before actions like this are taken? I have seen cases where there is so much difference between an audit query and an audit report.

4. Is it true that when CAR drops below the expected level, the CBN is expected to inform the banks concerned and give them a time frame to balance things out before sanctions can be given?

4.Is it true that the CBN signed the annual report of the oceanic bank for the last financial year where 41 billion provision was made for bad loans and came a few days later to remove the management? would it not mean that it is either the findings are wrong or the report they signed was wrong? If so was the CBN in itself doing due dilligence in its oversight functions?

5. If the CBN acted on May data could it be that there have been substantial changes in the banks that would have changed the status of the data upon which the CBN's action is based?

6.If the CBN through the EFCC can go after the bad debtors in this jungle style, how is it differet from what intercontinental bank in an open letter was asking the president to do?

7. Why is the CBN/FG so hasty in getting buyers for this banks when a recovery to the tune of 30% would stabilise the banks?

8. Do we have any organisation(not just bank infact even church ) in this country where forensic audits of this magintude will be carried out without opening a can of worms. I mean why not threat all the banks same way instead of isolating a few? If in a class of 24 students a teacher gives 10 students a test, mark the scripts and release the results. Then come later to organise test of the other 14, will he set same question for the other 14 if yes will the 14 not have had undue advantage in preparing for the test?. If he sets a different question can we still say the test is a fair means of calibrating the students?

9. Is the CBN and EFCC feigning ignorance that the amount the debtors are paying back to the 5 banks are monies collected from other banks thereby transfering the liability and further weakening the system?

Beaf:

There is no law that says loans must be secured with collateral. Loans can be given based on an individuals/firms worth or standing, loans can also be secured on business proposals/plans etc.

We are talking about billions here not thousands. How can you give somebody billions of Naira without securing it.
Ever heard of what is called Moral Hazard? If banks lend people money without security, there will be no incentive to repay. That is the whole essence of collateral.
This is the basic principle of banking these CEOs threw to the gutters.

Sanusi as the CBN governor might have acted intra-vires, that is within its powers as confined by BOFIA. Be that as it may, the CBN being the apex financial regulatory body has the right to curb the excesses of commercial banks. My only concern is the intrusion of EFCC in a matter that should not be their business. Another issue for consideration is the panic this will cause in our economy. Many customers of this affected banks are rushing to close their accounts with the banks giving other 'clean' banks undue advantage.

Sanusi as the CBN governor might have acted intra-vires, that is within its powers as confined by BOFIA. Be that as it may, the CBN being the apex financial regulatory body has the right to curb the excesses of commercial banks. My only concern is the intrusion of EFCC in a matter that should not be their business. Another issue for consideration is the panic this will cause in our economy. Many customers of this affected banks are rushing to close their accounts with the banks giving other 'clean' banks undue advantage.

QUSETIONS I HAVE FOR SANUSI

looking at the scenario I am tempted to ask questions on the sincerity of Sanusi , if his actions have been guided totally by professional expediency ,prejudice or " a special script".

1. If 5 banks accounted for 85% of the EDW , then why audit 10 and not just the 5 or the entire 24?. Ok if the results of the other 14 will be released soon then why the rush? May be 3 weeks pose much more danger than the 11 months that the CBN claim to have been experiencing this trend.

2.Are bad loans are common to these banks alone , is the CBN saying that the owners of bad loans in the banks that "passed" the "test" can walk free. Why not publish the bad loans in all the banks audited for us to know how good or bad things are?

3. When the CBN found this problems from its investigations did it refer to the banks officially for some clarification? Would the findings not pass for a an audit query which should graduate into a full audit report before actions like this are taken? I have seen cases where there is so much difference between an audit query and an audit report.

4. Is it true that when CAR drops below the expected level, the CBN is expected to inform the banks concerned and give them a time frame to balance things out before sanctions can be given?

4.Is it true that the CBN signed the annual report of the oceanic bank for the last financial year where 41 billion provision was made for bad loans and came a few days later to remove the management? would it not mean that it is either the findings are wrong or the report they signed was wrong? If so was the CBN in itself doing due dilligence in its oversight functions?

5. If the CBN acted on May data could it be that there have been substantial changes in the banks that would have changed the status of the data upon which the CBN's action is based?

6.If the CBN through the EFCC can go after the bad debtors in this jungle style, how is it differet from what intercontinental bank in an open letter was asking the president to do?

7. Why is the CBN/FG so hasty in getting buyers for this banks when a recovery to the tune of 30% would stabilise the banks?

8. Do we have any organisation(not just bank infact even church ) in this country where forensic audits of this magintude will be carried out without opening a can of worms. I mean why not threat all the banks same way instead of isolating a few? If in a class of 24 students a teacher gives 10 students a test, mark the scripts and release the results. Then come later to organise test of the other 14, will he set same question for the other 14 if yes will the 14 not have had undue advantage in preparing for the test?. If he sets a different question can we still say the test is a fair means of calibrating the students?

9. Is the CBN and EFCC feigning ignorance that the amount the debtors are paying back to the 5 banks are monies collected from other banks thereby transfering the liability and further weakening the system?

Beaf:

If CBN got its figures on debtors so badly wrong (God alone knows how much else it got wrong). CBN's actions were based on wrong figures. How can such be in the public interest? It just looks like the CBN is rushing around for figures to suit supposed "crimes".

I don't know how many times one can emphasize this argument

If CBN Governor could not get debtors list right, they don't at least have the capacity for now to audit anything.
How do we trust that the talk about Banks cooking up their books is not a MYTH when they the CBN are cooking up list of debtors.

And the latest revelations now is the 420billion which they injected was classified as Tier2 capital which means the whole talk of imminent collapse of the 5 banks could possibly have been made up like the list of debtors.

Sanusi should do us all a favour, call of the whole process and go back to the drawing board. The image of Nigerian Financial Sector has been damaged enough. Sanusi should go and formulate a Nigeria policy for the Nigerian people.

All this Tyranic and back-door takeover of Banks have failed.

Beaf:

There is no law that says loans must be secured with collateral. Loans can be given based on an individuals/firms worth or standing, loans can also be secured on business proposals/plans etc.

Oh great! Now I know why it is so hard for ordinary people to get loans. . . - its because they are worth nothing! What was the essence of re-capitalization? I believe it was partly to support small-scale businesses and other entrepreneurs who are essential to the growth of the economy through loans. Why is it the made-men who get all the loans and get to pay anytime? The banks will then withhold loans from ordinary people since they'd think if the big men are not paying then how would this pauper pay up? Its only logical to ask for collaterals.

I am really suprised at the way EFCC is handling this issue. Soon, different courts will embarrass them with one ruling or the other.

MUZBO:

Oh great! Now I know why it is so hard for ordinary people to get loans. . . - its because they are worth nothing! What was the essence of re-capitalization? I believe it was partly to support small-scale businesses and other entrepreneurs who are essential to the growth of the economy through loans. Why is it the made-men who get all the loans and get to pay anytime? The banks will then withhold loans from ordinary people since they'd think if the big men are not paying then how would this pauper pay up? Its only logical to ask for collaterals.

The questions you have raised are really pointers to the failure of government, not the banks.
It might be logical to ask for collateral, that does not make it a legal requirement.

Sanusi has a devious agenda and I'm afraid he also has the guts to execute it. He is an Abacha in pinstripe.

Beaf:

The questions you have raised are really pointers to the failure of government, not the banks.
It might be logical to ask for collateral, that does not make it a legal requirement.

Well the govt wouldn't expect the banks to cook the books in the first place so they failed to watch them and then the banks wouldn't have needed to con anyone with fictitious figures at all if they had not given risky loans or had atleast secured them with collaterals. Its that simple! The banks failed.

Do we have any organisation(not just bank infact even church ) in this country where forensic audits of this magintude will be carried out without

opening a can of worms. I mean why not threat all the banks same way instead of isolating a few? If in a class of 24 students a teacher gives 10 students a

test, mark the scripts and release the results. Then come later to organise test of the other 14, will he set same question for the other 14 if yes will the

14 not have had undue advantage in preparing for the test?. If he sets a different question can we still say the test is a fair means of calibrating the students?

MUZBO:

Well the govt wouldn't expect the banks to cook the books in the first place so they failed to watch them and then the banks wouldn't have needed to con anyone with fictitious figures at all if they had not given risky loans or had atleast secured them with collaterals. Its that simple! The banks failed.

CBN is not the government, it is a government instrument; lets straighten that first.
How can we believe that bank books were fixed when the figures the "proof" was based on have turned out to be false? I'm here scratching my head!

Beaf:

CBN is not the government, it is a government instrument; lets straighten that first.
How can we believe that bank books were fixed when the figures the "proof" was based on have turned out to be false? I'm here scratching my head!

Well, there is obviously more to it than meets the eye but you know what they say: No smoke without fire. The smoke here is from the fire that was used to cook the bank's books.
I heard it chokes too.

Beaf:

CBN is not the government, it is a government instrument; lets straighten that first.
How can we believe that bank books were fixed when the figures the "proof" was based on have turned out to be false? I'm here scratching my head!

Please clarify what you mean by the 'proof' is false.
Have the bank executives come out with 'proof' of their innocence, or the corrected figures posted by the CBN not still serve as proof?
Or a few typos and numerical errors should be sufficient to sweep the failings under the carpet?
Please provide/point out the false figures that show that 'the figures the "proof" was based on have turned out to be false'

biina:

Please clarify what you mean by the 'proof' is false.
Have the bank executives come out with 'proof' of their innocence, or the corrected figures posted by the CBN not still serve as proof?
Or a few typos and numerical errors should be sufficient to sweep the failings under the carpet?
Please provide/point out the false figures that show that 'the figures the "proof" was based on have turned out to be false'

The way things have gone, they do not have to prove their innocence to the CBN. What are courts for? They should have been charged ever since if any crimes were committed; not being chased by EFCC and other qwango's, but after all this time, wind and noise, not one of them has been charged. Shocking.

Beaf:

The way things have gone, they do not have to prove their innocence to the CBN. What are courts for? They should have been charged ever since if any crimes were committed; not being chased by EFCC and other qwango's, but after all this time, wind and noise, not one of them has been charged. Shocking.

You have failed to answer the question asked, which was for you to substantiate your claim that 'the figures the "proof" was based on have turned out to be false?'

i think we should let him be for now.

please can anyone help tell me how i can be able to open a US bank account as a Nigerian who live and do business in nigeria