I find the story of this lady amazing because she is intelligent, open-minded and was seeking to get answers.



God bless you as you watch.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk9BsCoPqeg

For someone who does not want there to be a God or who is angry with God, nothing can ever serve as proof.


For the lady in question. Her proof was common sense and the Bible.

winner01:
For someone who does not want there to be a God or who is angry with God, nothing can ever serve as proof.


For the lady in question. Her proof was common sense and the Bible.

The Source of morality is something NO SCIENTIST and NO ATHEIST can explain or prove because its not found in Genetics or even an Atom. Its not tangible. Its not practical.
IT JUST EXISTS! BUT HOW?

How is it possible that a human can tell right from wrong? How is it possible that we can even have emotions? Are they genetically encoded?

Therein is the dilemma and their nemesis.

Cc seun
Dalaman aka Jesusman

winner01:
For someone who does not want there to be a God or who is angry with God, nothing can ever serve as proof.

For the lady in question. Her proof was common sense and the Bible.

4everGod1:


The Source of morality is something NO SCIENTIST and NO ATHEIST can explain or prove because its not found in Genetics or even an Atom. Its not tangible. Its not practical.
IT JUST EXISTS! BUT HOW?

How is it possible that a human can tell right from wrong? How is it possible that we can even have emotions? Are they genetically encoded?

Therein is the dilemma and their nemesis.

Cc seun
Dalaman aka Jesusman

Nature and its constituents are designed ... simple !

Atheists need to take rancorous swipes at Christianity and God to be sure of his non existence - this gives a semblance of rationality .

4everGod1:


The Source of morality is something NO SCIENTIST and NO ATHEIST can explain or prove because its not found in Genetics or even an Atom. Its not tangible. Its not practical.
IT JUST EXISTS! BUT HOW?

How is it possible that a human can tell right from wrong? How is it possible that we can even have emotions? Are they genetically encoded?

Therein is the dilemma and their nemesis.

Cc seun
Dalaman aka Jesusman

Morality is a creation of man that is why it has always been evolving and varies from society to society. People didn't live the same way we are living 20,000 years ago for example. Back then, they lived like savages. Even during the time of Jesus people weren't living like the waty we are living today. Back then women had no rights for example. Study human anthropology and moral evolution. Necessity and the need to live in a less chaotic society is what necessitate the formulation of moral laws of conduct. If humans are born with any natural moral law in them, then parents won't spend a lot of their time teaching their kids the difference between right and wrong. But parents have to do that which shows that children aren't born with any sense of morality. They grow and are thought about what ever moral code of conduct their society accepts.

KingEbukaNaija:


Nature and its constituents are designed ... simple !

What are viruses designed for? What about earthquakes and hurricanes? What were they designed for?

dalaman:


What are viruses designed for? What about earthquakes and hurricanes? What were they designed for?

Oh so viruses were designed? By whom?

dalaman:


Morality is a creation of man that is why it has always been evolving and varows from society to society. People didn't live the same way we are living 20,000 years ago for examoke. Back then, they lived like savages. Even during the time of Jesus people weren't living like the wat we aRe living today. Back then women had no rights for example. Study human anthropology and moral evolution. Necessity and the need to live in a less chaotic society is what necessitate the formulation of moral laws of conduct. If humans are born with any natural moral law in them, then parents won't spend a lot of their time teaching their kids the difference between right and wrong. But parents have to do that which shows that children aren't born with any sense of morality. They grow and are thought about what ever moral code of conduct their society accepts.

So morality is evolving? Now this is an interesting one. Let me assume you just made sense which you know you didnt and go with your argument.

If morality is evolving and varies from generation to generation or geolocation to geolocation who in that generation or geolocation controls morality or proves it to be right for a certainty? If its still evolving it shows something is triggering the change which still boils down to an emotional attachment. So who then controls emotions?

If parents spend time to teach their kids right from wrong then who tought the parents in past generations? If emotions do not exist then humanity would still be in the stone age and behaving like animals ( assuming the stone age existed) but emotions triggered a change so where did this emotion come from and who controls it or did it alsl evolve as well?

I will advice you. stop creating thread on athiesm again. believe me. it doesn't help.

winner01:
I find the story of this lady amazing because she is intelligent, open-minded and was seeking to get answers.



God bless you as you watch.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk9BsCoPqeg

dalaman:


What are viruses designed for? What about earthquakes and hurricanes? What were they designed for?

I dont have time for another interminable argument . Here read : http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/natural_evil_theodicity.html

Again .

Can someone post the content of the essay?

Thank you in advance

KingEbukaNaija:


I dont have time for another interminable argument . Here read : http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/natural_evil_theodicity.html

Again .

He will not read. Neither will others who are the king kongs of Atheism here on nairaland.

hopefulLandlord:
Can someone post the content of the essay?

Thank you in advance

Dalaman can you post the content for your colleague? Thats assuming you even watched it before commenting.

hopefulLandlord:
Can someone post the content of the essay?

Thank you in advance

If you cannot watch the video then read the link by kingebukasblog. Some of what is in the video is also there.

Macelliot:
I will advice you. stop creating thread on athiesm again. believe me. it doesn't help.

The threads are not really targeted at the atheists per se . Its to show why someone should never consider atheism .

Atheists advocate for incestuous relationships , bestiality , pedophilia , homosexuality , and every sexual perversion ever known to man . History has shown that atheists have an insatiable thirst for the blood of religious people .

This was written by High Priest of atheism Richard Dawkins in 1995 :

The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won’t find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.


Atheists have no moral compass . They even advocate for abortion and subscribe to subjective morality .

Atheism is deleterious to a sane mind . It is always masqueraded as a logical or skeptical based proposition on God's existence - it has been proven time after time as a barefaced lie .

In fact , this bible verse delineates atheism for what it is

Romans 1:28

And so, since they did not see fit to acknowledge God or approve of Him or consider Him worth the knowing, God gave them over to a base and condemned mind to do things not proper or decent but loathsome .

Well , now we understand why they condone such depravities in the name of rationalism , subjective morality and ratiocination .

4everGod1:


He will not read. Neither will others who are the king kongs of Atheism here on nairaland.

Actually, dalaman 's question is rather shallow . The study of diseases , natural disasters has improved man's knowledge of nature .Breakthroughs in finding the cures of diseases and the detection of imminent earthquakes has been the apotheosis of these studies

It has been perspicuously written in the bible that we are in a transient world and the Christians, though they are in this world , they are not of it. The bible tells us again to be ready at all times because anyone could be a victim of natural disasters . But still God has always protected his people in these unpleasant situations .

dalaman:


Morality is a creation of man that is why it has always been evolving and varows from society to society. People didn't live the same way we are living 20,000 years ago for examoke. Back then, they lived like savages. Even during the time of Jesus people weren't living like the wat we aRe living today. Back then women had no rights for example. Study human anthropology and moral evolution. Necessity and the need to live in a less chaotic society is what necessitate the formulation of moral laws of conduct. If humans are born with any natural moral law in them, then parents won't spend a lot of their time teaching their kids the difference between right and wrong. But parents have to do that which shows that children aren't born with any sense of morality. They grow and are thought about what ever moral code of conduct their society accepts.

Why did man create morality ? Why did man decipher what is right or wrong ?

KingEbukaNaija:


Why did man create morality ? Why did man decipher what is right or wrong ?

To help him live in a less chaotic society. Remember we started out as savages before we go to where we are right now.

dalaman:


To help him live in a less chaotic society.

How was he able to decide what was right or wrong ? Or was it arbitrary ?

Remember we started out as savages before we go to where we are right now.

There is no proof to this . I do not remember starting as a savage . WTF . Are you ok at all ?

dalaman:


To help him live in a less chaotic society.

Please explain . How did this happen ? How kind of precepts were laid down at first ?

dalaman:


To help him live in a less chaotic society. Remember we started out as savages before we go to where we are right now.

So if we started as savages as you say this men we were once mindless and behaved like beasts right?

So how come the same beasts suddenly knew what chaos and order is and suddenly desired structure. How were they able to become rational and know right from wrong and good from bad?

What is the origin of these judgements? If you know pls share with us along with proof and not some random quote.

KingEbukaNaija:


How was he able to decide what is right or wrong ? Or was it arbitrary ?

Man has the ability to self reflect on his actions. Most times he chooses what benefits him and causes less harm as good and what causes pain and sorrow as bad.

There is no proof to this . I do not remember starting as a savage . WTF . Are you ok at all ?

We came from people that sacrificed and buried their kids alive to their various Gods for rain for example. Even the marriage institution developed over time. Back in the days living outside the walls of your city will get you killed of seen or found by the members of another tribe. People were so brutal back then that they lived in walled cities. You dear no go outside the city wall alone. Women had no rights at all. They were considered as chattel. The strong did what they could. Lands were invaded and people enslaved with impunity. Land grab wasn't considered a bad thing. Slavery wasn't considered a bad thing.

Killing people and sacrificing them to appease the God's was the order of the day. There was no education, those that were strong did what ever they wanted. But it came at a cost so people learned to refine their behavior and formulated moral codes of conduct through consensus. Some used their God's as enforcing mechanism etc.

Morality must be learned. People thought themselves that stealing and grabbing people's lands was wrong. Raping peoples children was wrong etc. If you read the bible you will see where Moses sent down the 10 commandents detailing the right and wrong things to do.

dalaman:


Man has the ability to self reflect on his actions. Most times he chooses what benefits him and causes less harm as good and what causes pain and sorrow as bad.




We came from people that sacrificed and buried their kids alive to their various Gods for rain for example. Even the marriage institution developed over time. Back in the days living outside the walls of your city will get you killed of seen or found by the members of another tribe. People were so brutal back then that they lived in walled cities. You dear no go outside the city wall alone. Women had no rights at all. They were considered as chattel. The strong did what they could. Lands were invaded and people enslaved with impunity. Land grab wasn't considered a bad thing. Slavery wasn't considered a bad thing.

Killing people and sacrificing them to appease the God's was the order of the day. There was no education, those that were strong did what ever they wanted. But it came at a cost so people learned to refine their behavior and formulated moral codes of conduct through consensus. Some used their God's as enforcing mechanism etc.

Morality must be learned. People thought themselves that stealing and grabbing people's lands was wrong. Raping peoples children was wrong etc. If you read the bible you will see where Moses sent down the 10 commandents detailing the right and wrong things to do.

You are missing the point entirely. According to your write up that was their morality right? Even then they had a system of right and wrong even though it is ar variance with ours today but they had their own system of right and wrong.

The question is how could savages reflect on anything or change from being savages if they enjoyed that order and were born into it? How did they do a u turn for something else?

They say lions are savage beasts and it is known that when a lion takes over the territory of another lion, it would eat the baby lions from the other king of the pride so it would start a fresh generation using its own genes. This has been hotwired into them and has never changed as they have no reason to see it as wrong since they cannot reason past that. So how could human savages reason past theirs if indeed we once were savages.

4everGod1:



So if we started as savages as you say this men we were once mindless and behaved like beasts right?

So how come the same beasts suddenly knew what chaos and order is and suddenly desired structure. How were they able to become rational and know right from wrong and good from bad?

What is the origin of these judgements? If you know pls share with us along with proof and not some random quote.

They used reason to fashion these things out. It's a fact that mean lived as savages before. During the time of Jesus Israel was under occupation by the Romans. They Romans could do anything they wanted. They can grab any land they want and kill off all the people if they fail to obey them with impunity. Now no country can do that. No country can invade another without cause or reason.

If you kill my own I will definitely want to revenge. If we go about killing each other we will both lose out. If I steal what is yours you will want to steal from another person or steal from me. If we continued like that our society will be in chaos.

People formulating moral.codes of conduct because they wanted to avoid chaos. Even in the bible you will see some moral evolution. Abraham the founder of the faith was an incestuous man. He married his sister. Besides that he could sleep with his female slaves. Child sacrifice was allowed because he wanted to sacrifice his son Issac. The people lived like savages, they could invade their neighbors because their neighbors worshiped other Gods. They stoned their disobedient children to death. They married many wives and had many concubines. They enslaved each other freely. They killed gays. An eye for an eye no forgiveness. They were very brutal but over time things kept changing. In Africa it was the same. The people that lived 3000 years ago were very brutal. They weren't like us. Just 400 years ago all the blacks living in the USA were slaves. But today a black man is the president of the USA.

dalaman:


Man has the ability to self reflect on his actions. Most times he chooses what benefits him and causes less harm as good and what causes pain and sorrow as bad.




We came from people that sacrificed and buried their kids alive to their various Gods for rain for example. Even the marriage institution developed over time. Back in the days living outside the walls of your city will get you killed of seen or found by the members of another tribe. People were so brutal back then that they lived in walled cities. You dear no go outside the city wall alone. Women had no rights at all. They were considered as chattel. The strong did what they could. Lands were invaded and people enslaved with impunity. Land grab wasn't considered a bad thing. Slavery wasn't considered a bad thing.

Killing people and sacrificing them to appease the God's was the order of the day. There was no education, those that were strong did what ever they wanted. But it came at a cost so people learned to refine their behavior and formulated moral codes of conduct through consensus. Some used their God's as enforcing mechanism etc.

Morality must be learned. People thought themselves that stealing and grabbing people's lands was wrong. Raping peoples children was wrong etc. If you read the bible you will see where Moses sent down the 10 commandents detailing the right and wrong things to do.

The ten commandments were given so we would see we could not be righteous enough for God and not as a guide to right or wrong. No man could keep the ten commandments because if you fail one you have failed all.

Human morality is different from Gods morality.
Before the ten commandments they had their own version of morality. At least they were not going around naked. And had human laws governing their wrong or right acts.

In one tongue u will mention man was a savage and rhe nexr thing u will say the ten commandments. Which even though it shows u are very confused still goes further to show that be us savages or followers of the ten commandments, human morality existed outside our control initially. How was this possible.

dalaman:

Man has the ability to self reflect on his actions. Most times he chooses what benefits him and causes less harm as good and what causes pain and sorrow as bad.

This is not true . Who told you corruption is not beneficial to some people ? Or lying or stealing ? Even probity has been proven not to be beneficial to some people . E.g In the Asian world of business , it is acceptable to lie , because of the high financial gain . People lie and steal to get what they want . Taking the lives of guilty rapists would bring pain and sorrow to the family of the deceased .

You are just making assumptions - there is nothing copacetic about this response .

[s]We came from people that sacrificed and buried their kids alive to their various Gods for rain for example. Even the marriage institution developed over time. Back in the days living outside the walls of your city will get you killed of seen or found by the members of another tribe. People were so brutal back then that they lived in walled cities. You dear no go outside the city wall alone. Women had no rights at all. They were considered as chattel. The strong did what they could. Lands were invaded and people enslaved with impunity. Land grab wasn't considered a bad thing. Slavery wasn't considered a bad thing.

Killing people and sacrificing them to appease the God's was the order of the day. There was no education, those that were strong did what ever they wanted. But it came at a cost so people learned to refine their behavior and formulated moral codes of conduct through consensus. Some used their God's as enforcing mechanism etc.

Morality must be learned. People thought themselves that stealing and grabbing people's lands was wrong. Raping peoples children was wrong etc. If you read the bible you will see where Moses sent down the 10 commandents detailing the right and wrong things to do.[/s]

This does not explain how man could decipher what's wrong or right . You are just stating reprehension acts done throughout history .

dalaman:


They used reason to fashion these things out. It's a fact that mean lived as savages before. During the time of Jesus Israel was under occupation by the Romans. They Romans could do anything they wanted. They can grab any land they want and kill off all the people of they fail to obey them with impunity. Now no country can do that. No country can invade another without cause or reason.

If you kill my own I will definitely want to revenge. If we go about killing each other we will both lose out. If I steal what is yours you will want to steal from another person or steal from me. If we continued like that our society will be in chaos.

People formulating moral.codes of conduct because they wanted to avoid chaos. Even in the bible you will see some moral evolution. Abraham the founder of the faith was an incestuous man. He married his sister. Besides that he could sleep with his female slaves. Child sacrifice was allowed because he wanted to sacrifice his son Issac. The people lived like savages, they could invade their neighbors because their neighbors worshiped other Gods. They stoned their disobedient children to death. They married many wives and had many concubines. They enslaved each other freely. They killed gays. An eye for an eye no forgiveness. They were very brutal but over time things kept changing. In Africa it was the same. The people that lived 3000 years ago were very brutal. They weren't like us. Just 400 years ago all the blacks living in the USA were slaves. But today a black man is the president of the USA.

Dalaman , people still live like this even now , in this time . Should we call them savages ?

4everGod1:



You are missing the point entirely. According to your write up that was their morality right? Even then they had a system of right and wrong even though it is ar variance with ours today but they had their own system of right and wrong.

The question is how could savages reflect on anything or change from being savages if they enjoyed that order and were born into it? How did they do a u turn for something else?

They say lions are savage beasts and it is known that when a lion takes over the territory of another lion, it would eat the baby lions from the other king of the pride so it would start a fresh generation using its own genes. This has been hotwired into them and has never changed as they have no reason to see it as wrong since they cannot reason past that. So how could human savages reason past theirs if indeed we once were savages.

Humans have the ability to self reflect on their actions. We have the ability to put ourselves in the shoes of others. Read the words of the abolitionist and the cases they made against slavery. Just 500 years ago people didn't see slavery as a bad thing. The few that dI'd were able to convince the majority that it was a bad thing. You don't even have to go far. We have taught ourselves to give our women the same right as we men over time because of our ability to reason and self reflect. We have moved past that now and in this modern times we are even talking of animal rights. Now in our world today most advanced society do not see homosexuality as wrong. We have now come to reason that people can chose to love who ever they want. Morality isn't set in stone. It must be learned and it is constantly evolving.

dalaman:


They used reason to fashion these things out. It's a fact that mean lived as savages before. During the time of Jesus Israel was under occupation by the Romans. They Romans could do anything they wanted. They can grab any land they want and kill off all the people of they fail to obey them with impunity. Now no country can do that. No country can invade another without cause or reason.

If you kill my own I will definitely want to revenge. If we go about killing each other we will both lose out. If I steal what is yours you will want to steal from another person or steal from me. If we continued like that our society will be in chaos.

People formulating moral.codes of conduct because they wanted to avoid chaos. Even in the bible you will see some moral evolution. Abraham the founder of the faith was an incestuous man. He married his sister. Besides that he could sleep with his female slaves. Child sacrifice was allowed because he wanted to sacrifice his son Issac. The people lived like savages, they could invade their neighbors because their neighbors worshiped other Gods. They stoned their disobedient children to death. They married many wives and had many concubines. They enslaved each other freely. They killed gays. An eye for an eye no forgiveness. They were very brutal but over time things kept changing. In Africa it was the same. The people that lived 3000 years ago were very brutal. They weren't like us. Just 400 years ago all the blacks living in the USA were slaves. But today a black man is the president of the USA.

You are just going round in circles. People formulated moral codes of conduct? How? Who showed them right morals from wrong? How did they even know where to start from?

KingEbukaNaija:


Dalaman , people still live like this even now , in this time . Should we call them savages ?

The difference between now and then is that we have criminalized most of these behaviors as bad. Back in the days they weren't criminal acts. Over time people learned to criminalize these acts and punish offenders because they needed to live in a stable and less chaotic society.