When you pray ‘Let Thy Will Be Done’, you recognize God’s sovereignty over every aspect of our daily lives. It is a way of saying that we will be in deep trouble if God gave us everything for which we asked? more

The prayer is for babies, It is not for a born again mature man. It was taught to jewish people who were not born again. So I can say to a great extent it is not a Christian prayer. Even though it containts great principles . Using the phrase let you will be done is like saying "What will be will be" But what will be will not be until you do something about your faith.  The will of God is not suppposed to be a mysterious thing to you. You have the holyghost and you are supposed to know his will, not only that , you are responsible to make his will come to pass in your life. The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God .

John 16:13
    Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

1 Cor. 2:16
    For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

Psalm 25:14
    The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant.


John 15:15
    Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

As much as there is place of submission to Gods will but it should not be misunderstood as submitting fate.We are supposed to know his will.

Col. 1:9
    For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that[b] ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding[/b];

For me that's just like the word of hope and fulfillment to yourself
You don't need to go screaming all over the whole compound or building
to prove that you're speaking with God all in the name of Prayer. . .
Just say a few words of fulfillment and you're done.

I just knew that the WoFers will yet again bring their heresies to this one.

Obviously WoFers do not believe in Jesus Christ and do not follow the example of Jesus Christ --- because Jesus Christ certainly taught and Himself prayed "thy will be done"!

@Joagbaje or "Pastor" Agbaje

With almost every post you make you spew forth heresy; it is easy to imagine that heresies emanate from every pore of your being. I would have liked to appeal to you to pull back from your "church" for a little while and take time to go back and learn the Bible from absolute basics but it seems that your case really requires "divine intervention".

However, at least go easy on "teaching" others heresy and "making them a child of hell . . .  " in the words of one wise person.

Also, you are adding a form of arrogance to the spreading of heresy which makes you particularly contemptible. If you do such and I am around here or notice it, I will not even make an attempt to be polite when exposing the bankruptcy of your heretical doctrine.

Joagbaje:

[size=15pt]The prayer is for babies, It is not for a born again mature man.[/size] It was taught to jewish people who were not born again. So I can say to a great extent[size=15pt] it is not a Christian prayer[/size]. Even though it containts great principles . [size=15pt]Using the phrase let you will be done is like saying "What will be will be" But what will be will not be until you do something about your faith.[/size]  The will of God is not suppposed to be a mysterious thing to you. You have the holyghost and you are supposed to know his will, not only that , [size=15pt]you are responsible to make his will come to pass in your life. The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God .[/size]

Where were you when His will was coming to pass before Adam was created?  

Joagbaje:

The prayer is for babies, It is not for a born again mature man. It was taught to jewish people who were not born again. So I can say to a great extent it is not a Christian prayer. Even though it containts great principles . Using the phrase let you will be done is like saying "What will be will be" But what will be will not be until you do something about your faith. The will of God is not suppposed to be a mysterious thing to you. You have the holyghost and you are supposed to know his will, not only that , you are responsible to make his will come to pass in your life. The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God .

@Joagbaje - you are a deceiver.
You have come again with your repulsive and repugnant heresies. Here is what is written in scripture:
Jesus taught his disciples (you are obviously not one of his disciples) to pray thus:

Mat 6:8-10 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him. Pray then like this: "Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.

And he practiced what he taught

1. Mat 26:39 And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, saying, "My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as you will."
2. Mat 26:42 Again, for the second time, he went away and prayed, "My Father, if this cannot pass unless I drink it, your will be done."
3. John 6:38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

1. So how come Jesus who is the only begotten Son, who has the Spirit without measure prayed that God's will be done? Was he an immature baby? Your words not mine.
2. You wrote: "The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God ". This statement is at the core of you heretical worldview which sees God as wimp who cannot act without your cooperation or consent.
Again for you edification, God is Sovereign and whether you cooperate or not, his will will come to pass.

Isa 55:8-11 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, declares the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts. "For as the rain and the snow come down from heaven and do not return there but water the earth, making it bring forth and sprout, giving seed to the sower and bread to the eater, so shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it.

3. Matt 6: 8-10 makes the following clear:
a. Our Father knows what we need before you ask him.
b. We are not God (He is our Father in heaven - Sovereign above all) - thus we are limited in our knowledge. We cannot know what we need before we even know that we need it.
c. Seeing that God knows best, we can only ask that His Will be done if we truly are walking by faith, as that is the best possible thing. (^{But I forget that you WoF crowd are "gods"})
4. You will be unable to refute this scriptures so you will retreat into bombast and start talking about "strong meat"

I leave you with this quiz:

Jas 4:13-15 Come now, you who say, "Today or tomorrow we will go into such and such a town and spend a year there and trade and make a profit"-- yet you do not know what tomorrow will bring. What is your life? For you are a mist that appears for a little time and then vanishes. Instead you ought to say, "If the Lord wills, we will live and do this or that."

Who was James talking to?

aletheia:

I leave you with this quiz:
Who was James talking to?

Certainly not Superman Joagbaje . . . he must have been talking to immature babies like us who can only manage milk.

Joagbaje:

The prayer is for babies, It is not for a born again mature man. It was taught to jewish people who were not born again. So I can say to a great extent it is not a Christian prayer. Even though it containts great principles . Using the phrase let you will be done is like saying "What will be will be" But what will be will not be until you do something about your faith.  The will of God is not suppposed to be a mysterious thing to you. You have the holyghost and you are supposed to know his will, not only that , you are responsible to make his will come to pass in your life. The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God .

John 16:13
    Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

1 Cor. 2:16
    For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

Psalm 25:14
    The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant.


John 15:15
    Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

As much as there is place of submission to Gods will but it should not be misunderstood as submitting fate.We are supposed to know his will.

Col. 1:9
    For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that[b] ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding[/b];

I am definitely not the only one who thinks the above is just RIDICULOUS.

Joagbaje:

The prayer is for babies, It is not for a born again mature man. It was taught to jewish people who were not born again. So I can say to a great extent it is not a Christian prayer. Even though it containts great principles . Using the phrase let you will be done is like saying "What will be will be" But what will be will not be until you do something about your faith.  The will of God is not suppposed to be a mysterious thing to you. You have the holyghost and you are supposed to know his will, not only that , you are responsible to make his will come to pass in your life. The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God .

Your statement is too arrogant. As God's children we are supposed to pray and do things according to His way, not ours. The Holy Spirit belongs to God, keep that in mind. We can't hi-jacked the 'holy ghost'   

It's better to pray like a child (kids are sincere in their prayers) than to pray like crook

So nice to see noetic again. Welcome back!

davidylan:

So nice to see noetic again. Welcome back!

thanks David. . .happy new year and congrats on ur award.

noetic16:

thanks David. . .happy new year and congrats on your award.

Same to you bro. Dont mind those awardees. . . they chose to have fun at my expense eh

The first thing you should realise is that there are different levels of spiritual maturity, and when you read a scripture you should be able to decode whom it is meant for. There are lesser light and greater lights , there are lesser truths and greater truths in God. There is a level of baby hood and at that point it was normal to talk as a child , God will answer. Your little chiild may say "tata" instead of "water" You will answer anyhow because as a child it is acceptable. If your prayer is the so called "the lords prayer" you are a baby. It can carry you for a while but not for too long. Jesus relaled with his disciples at different levels. And these different levels, there were different levels of truth he taught them. He called them children, servants , but before he left them , his teachings had to get deeper, he had to change their status spiritually so as to know deeper things.He stopped calling them servants in relationship.He called them friends

John 15:15
Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

You see God does not want his children to remain babies.
1[b] Cor. 13:11 [/b]
When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

I believe in the submission to the will of God, I shouldnt be misunderstood. If you read my post well ,you would see it. What is wrong is the idea of resigning to fate in the name of "let thy will be done" as though the will of God is one mysterious thing. Which the op was sugesting. You have people say may be the sickness in their body is his will, maybe it is not his will for them tto be healed , That is what im adressing.You should know the will of God. Nothing should take a spiritual man by suprise! Good or Bad!. You must know his will for you, and and take the responsibilty to make it come to pass. We came to do his will, we pray in line with his will. The best way to pray his will is to pray in tongues.
Romans 8:26-27
Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. [27] And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

The op is sugesting resigning to faith , that is what I am against and I saud it clearly that i believe in submission to Gods will. I will be mad to believe otherwise.

Joagbaje:

The first thing you should realise is that there are different levels of spiritual maturity, and when you read a scripture you should be able to decode whom it is meant for. There are lesser light and greater lights , there are lesser truths and greater truths in God. There is a level of baby hood and at that point it was normal to talk as a child , God will answer. Your little chiild may say "tata" instead of "water" You will answer anyhow because as a child it is acceptable. If your prayer is the so called "the lords prayer" you are a baby. It can carry you for a while but not for too long. Jesus relaled with his disciples at different levels. And these different levels, there were different levels of truth he taught them. He called them children, servants , but before he left them , his teachings had to get deeper, he had to change their status spiritually so as to know deeper things.He stopped calling them servants in relationship.He called them friends
I believe in the submission to the will of God, I shouldnt be misunderstood. If you read my post well ,you would see it. What is wrong is the idea of resigning to fate in the name of "let thy will be done" as though the will of God is one mysterious thing. Which the op was sugesting. You have people say may be the sickness in their body is his will, maybe it is not his will for them tto be healed , That is what im adressing.You should know the will of God. Nothing should take a spiritual man by suprise! Good or Bad!. You must know his will for you, and and take the responsibilty to make it come to pass. We came to do his will, we pray in line with his will. The best way to pray his will is to pray in tongues.
The op is sugesting resigning to faith , that is what I am against and I saud it clearly that i believe in submission to Gods will. I will be mad to believe otherwise.

1. You just don't get it do you? Your arrogance and pride and pride will not let you admit you are wrong. You are in a hole and you just won't stop digging. Instead you keep regurgitating your gnostic heresies. Where does the OP talk about resigning to fate. The problem with you little "gods" of WoF is that submitting to the will of the One True God is difficult for you since in your belief system you are also god, hence a simple prayer of faith such as "Your will be done becomes" a stumbling block for you.
Even Jesus prayed thus:

1. Mat 26:39 And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, saying, "My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as you will."
2. Mat 26:42 Again, for the second time, he went away and prayed, "My Father, if this cannot pass unless I drink it, your will be done."
3. John 6:38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

So by your teaching Jesus was an immature child who did not know the Will of God?
2. You couldn't refute the scriptures above so you obfuscate and lie. What scripture says: The best way to pray his will is to pray in tongues.

Joagbaje:

The first thing you should realise is that there are different levels of spiritual maturity, and when you read a scripture you should be able to decode whom it is meant for.

Nah, the first thing you should realise is that you are deeply ignorant and grossly misinformed about Christianity --- anyway you belong to WoF and not to Christianity. The second thing you should realise is that as long as you are that ignorant and continue to spout WoF heresies, you are a heretic and therefore anathema ---- unless you repent.

If your prayer is the so called "the lords prayer"  you are a baby. It can carry you for a while but not for too long. Jesus relaled with his disciples at different levels. And these different levels, there were different levels of truth he taught them. He called them children, servants , but before he left them , his teachings had to get deeper, he had to change their status spiritually so as to know deeper things.He stopped calling them servants in relationship.He called them friends

Part of being an ignorant and misinformed heretic is that you have been manipulated and conditioned to reject the teachings of Jesus Christ Himself and that of His apostles and instead to follow the corruptions of the minds of WoF leaders as planted there by satan; also to follow your own similarly corrupt mind.

The prayer that Jesus taught His own disciples (as pointed out and emphasised by aletheia) is to you "so-called". Let me spell it out again: The Lord's, the Lord's, the Lord's prayer is to you and your fellow heretics "so-called".

Christians of virtually every Western denomination have no problems to say the Lord's prayer ------ only you WoFers cannot say it because you are NOT Christians. As you are not believers or followers of Christ we are not surprised that you cannot say HIS prayer and you disparage it as "so-called".

@aletheia

aletheia:

@Joagbaje - you are a deceiver.
You have come again with your repulsive and repugnant heresies. Here is what is written in scripture:
Jesus taught his disciples (you are obviously not one of his disciples) to pray thus:And he practiced what he taught1. So how come Jesus who is the only begotten Son, who has the Spirit without measure prayed that God's will be done? Was he an immature baby? Your words not mine.
2. You wrote: "The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God ". This statement is at the core of you heretical worldview which sees God as wimp who cannot act without your cooperation or consent.
Again for you edification, God is Sovereign and whether you cooperate or not, his will will come to pass.3. Matt 6: 8-10 makes the following clear:


I leave you with this quiz:
Who was James talking to?

You have a habit of mis representing my posts. And you these insults of calling me deceiver , liar is uncalled for in a forum. It is a display of imaturity.

But hear this , the will of God will not come to pass , withouth your cooperation. And that cooperation is FAITH.
You must first know his will. Jesus knew his will. But we have the responsibility to allow it to happen or not. Jesus temptation was real , If he had failed, that would have been it for him as us probably. His obedience made him win , if he had not obeyed , he would have failed. How many people today have died without fulfiling Gods will.Where was God sovereignty? Was hell created for man ? "No" But men are going there, Where is Gods sovereignty?
We can get ourselves in the way of Gods plan. by our flesh and senses. Jesus was man and his flesh was getting in the way of Gods will. Jesus was not giving us an example of the idea of lords prayer, in his hour of temptation. His flesh was getting on the way , He was not ignorant of tommorow ,he knew the will of God but his flesh was not cooperating with the will , He asked if there were other options because he knew what he had to go through. It was like someone that is sick and he prefered drugs instead of injection, and hes asking the doctor ," cant i just take pills" if the doctor says this is the only way , then so be it, That was the situation with Christ. when he said let thy will be done , he was merely affirming the fact that this is the only way.

Matthew 26:42
He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done.

So what was he saying , " If this is the only way forward , Lets do it" He knew the future he knew the will .He had a choice for or against. But the person that is confused not knowing what tommorrow brings. , Not knowing if God wants him healed, not knowing if God wants him to prosper , is certainly not in faith.

Now you quoted james for my meditation

James 4:14
Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away. For that ye ought to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that.


my question to you is , Is your life a vapour. Jesus died only to make your life a vapour!. James walked in the lesser truth but Paul walked in greater truth than James. If you study their epistles well ,you would have observed that paul had enough trouble with James level of ignorance, even though he taught some things that were good. They had many disagreements. James was wrong there, because we have the holy spirit to reveal Gods mind to us.

John 16:13
Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

1 John 2:20
But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

Does that soun like your James? You ought to know his will an fulfill it. And when we use the word "will" it is only in generic terms, if we get deeper , there is more to it. There are different meanings but one major truth is that God does not want us to be ignorant of his will

Acts 22:14
And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.

And it is your responsibility to ensure it comes to pass.

Col. 4:17
And say to Archippus, Take heed to the ministry which thou hast received in the Lord, that thou fulfil it.

That was exactly what Jesus did , he ensured that he fulfilled it. It is not the responsibility of Gods sovereignty.

Joagbaje:

But hear this , the will of God will not come to pass , withouth your cooperation. And that cooperation is FAITH.

OK a simple exercise for you.

Jesus certainly taught His disciples to pray "Thy will be done"! We have clear evidence of that!

Where did Jesus ever teach that the will of God will not come to pass without your cooperation?

Further to above:

Jesus taught: Thy will be done on earth and in heaven.

Does God also need your cooperation before His will is done in heaven?

Joagbaje:

@aletheia
But hear this , the will of God will not come to pass , withouth your cooperation. And that cooperation is FAITH.
You must first know his will. Jesus knew his will. But we have the responsibility to allow it to happen or not. Jesus temptation was real , If he had failed, that would have been it for him as us probably. His obedience made him win , if he had not obeyed , he would have failed. How many people today have died without fulfiling Gods will.Where was God sovereignty? Was hell created for man ? "No" But men are going there, Where is Gods sovereignty?
We can get ourselves in the way of Gods plan. by our flesh and senses. Jesus was man and his flesh was getting in the way of Gods will. Jesus was not giving us an example of the idea of lords prayer, in his hour of temptation. His flesh was getting on the way , He was not ignorant of tommorow ,he knew the will of God but his flesh was not cooperating with the will , He asked if there were other options because he knew what he had to go through. It was like someone that is sick and he prefered drugs instead of injection, and hes asking the doctor ," cant i just take pills" if the doctor says this is the only way , then so be it, That was the situation with Christ. when he said let thy will be done , he was merely affirming the fact that this is the only way.
my question to you is , Is your life a vapour. Jesus died only to make your life a vapour!. James walked in the lesser truth but Paul walked in greater truth than James. If you study their epistles well ,you would have observed that paul had enough trouble with James level of ignorance, even though he taught some things that were good. They had many disagreements. James was wrong there, because we have the holy spirit to reveal Gods mind to us.

And it is your responsibility to ensure it comes to pass.

1. You know. . .the Word of God is truth and consistent. You only end up tying up yourself in illogicality and conundrums when you try to twist scripture. You cannot even give a clear and lucid answer based on scripture. You claimed that praying "Your will be done" was for immature, not born again Jews

Joagbaje:

The prayer is for babies, It is not for a born again mature man. It was taught to jewish people who were not born again. So I can say to a great extent it is not a Christian prayer.

And it was pointed out to you:

aletheia:

Jesus taught his disciples (you are obviously not one of his disciples) to pray thus:

Mat 6:8-10 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him. Pray then like this: "Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.

And he practiced what he taught

1. Mat 26:39 And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, saying, "My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as you will."
2. Mat 26:42 Again, for the second time, he went away and prayed, "My Father, if this cannot pass unless I drink it, your will be done."
3. John 6:38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

1. So how come Jesus who is the only begotten Son, who has the Spirit without measure prayed that God's will be done? Was he an immature baby? Your words not mine.
2. You wrote: "The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God ". This statement is at the core of you heretical worldview which sees God as wimp who cannot act without your cooperation or consent.
Again for you edification, God is Sovereign and whether you cooperate or not, his will will come to pass.3. Matt 6: 8-10 makes the following clear:
a. Our Father knows what we need before you ask him.
b. We are not God (He is our Father in heaven - Sovereign above all) - thus we are limited in our knowledge. We cannot know what we need before we even know that we need it.
c. Seeing that God knows best, we can only ask that His Will be done if we truly are walking by faith, as that is the best possible thing. (^{But I forget that you WoF crowd are "gods"})
4. You will be unable to refute this scriptures so you will retreat into bombast and start talking about "strong meat, lesser truth and greater truth"

You obviously have an unscriptural view of faith. The epistle by James is part of the canon, holy writ.

2 Pe 1:20-21 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

And that includes James the brother of our Lord! The same James acknowledged by Paul as one of the pillars of the church.

Gal 2:9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

Only a DECEIVER like you, one under a strong delusion will write this rubbish:

Joagbaje:
James walked in the lesser truth but Paul walked in greater truth than James. If you study their epistles well ,you would have observed that paul had enough trouble with James level of ignorance, even though he taught some things that were good. They had many disagreements. James was wrong there, because we have the holy spirit to reveal Gods mind to us.

This appeal to lesser truth, greater truth and degrees of revelation is the classic MO of you gnostics. You are a ravening wolf in sheep's clothing preying on the flock.

@ Enigma

Enigma:

OK a simple exercise for you.
Jesus certainly taught His disciples to pray "Thy will be done"! We have clear evidence of that!
Where did Jesus ever teach that the will of God will not come to pass without your cooperation?

You dont need Jesus to teach on that, it is a clear principle in the word. So where did Jesus teach you to go to Church on sundays? You answer me.
The issue about the will of God are based on spiritual principles. Let me give you few instances.
God told Moses to bring the people out of Egypt into the promised land. Did his will come to pass for Moses?


Exodus 3:10
Come now therefore, and I will send thee unto Pharaoh, that thou mayest bring forth my people the children of Israel out of Egypt.

Moses made an irreversable mistake and died in the wilderness. But he was the chosen person to bring them into the promised land. So what happened to God's sovereignty? what will be will be.

Another example , God told the israelites to go and posess the land, and that even though they have chariots of iron, they would fall before israel. But did the will of God come to pass?

Joshua 17:18
But the mountain shall be thine; for it is a wood, and thou shalt cut it down: and the outgoings of it shall be thine: for thou shalt drive out the Canaanites, though they have iron chariots, and though they be strong.

Judges 1:19
And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.

So what happened to God's sovereignty here. The will of God will only come to pass by your faith.

@aletheia

Your ignorace is appaling,

aletheia:

1. You know. . .the Word of God is truth and consistent. You only end up tying up yourself in illogicality and conundrums when you try to twist scripture. You cannot even give a clear and lucid answer based on scripture. You claimed that praying "Your will be done" was for immature, not born again JewsAnd it was pointed out to you:And he practiced what he taught
1. So how come Jesus who is the only begotten Son, who has the Spirit without measure prayed that God's will be done? Was he an immature baby? Your words not mine.
2. You wrote: "The will of God does not always come to pass until you cooperate with God ". This statement is at the core of you heretical worldview which sees God as wimp who cannot act without your cooperation or consent.
Again for you edification, God is Sovereign and whether you cooperate or not, his will will come to pass.3. Matt 6: 8-10 makes the following clear:
a. Our Father knows what we need before you ask him.
b. We are not God (He is our Father in heaven - Sovereign above all) - thus we are limited in our knowledge. We cannot know what we need before we even know that we need it.
c. Seeing that God knows best, we can only ask that His Will be done if we truly are walking by faith, as that is the best possible thing. (^{But I forget that you WoF crowd are "gods"})
4. You will be unable to refute this scriptures so you will retreat into bombast and start talking about "strong meat, lesser truth and greater truth"

You obviously have an unscriptural view of faith. The epistle by James is part of the canon, holy writ. And that includes James the brother of our Lord! The same James acknowledged by Paul as one of the pillars of the church.[i]Only a DECEIVER like you, one under a strong delusion will write this rubbish:[/i]This appeal to lesser truth, greater truth and degrees of revelation is the classic MO of you gnostics. You are a ravening wolf in sheep's clothing preying on the flock.

Point of correction, Jesus is not the only begotten , .Every christian is begooten by the word. Jesus is no longer only begotten but now he is first begotten.We are his brothers!

Your lack of understanding of the true message makes it hard for you to descern the difference between truth and lesser truths. The fact that James was brother of Jesus should not be an issue. There is a saying that "The age of Methuselah can not be compared to the wisdom of Solomon"  It is childish to use the relationship of Jesus with james as legality or endorsement for James teaching. We judge all things according to the whole body of truth.not with your miopic religious eyes.
James was not part of the 12 deciples of Christ, There is no record of his conversion before Jesus went to the cross. record we have was that he and his brother Jude i think did not believe in Jesus.

John 7:5
    For neither did his brethren believe in him.

James was one of the last  apostles to be converted, He was a kind of principality in the early church and he troubled the ministry of Paul a littlel, People feared him. James did not have deep knowledge of grace and justification  like Paul did.

James 2:21
    Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

Contrast it with Paul's teaching here

Romans 4:2-3
    For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. [3] For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Romans 3:28
    Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Who's teaching would you rather follow. I wont be suprised if you follow James here because he was "teacher of babe" but I will rather follow teaching of Paul. James still believed in the works of the law. he had good dctrines but he was religious like some nairalanders here. James still teach that a man must be circumcised according to the law to be saved.He terrorised the early church with his teachings in his ignorance that Peter the great apostle was afraid of him.

Galatians 2:11-16
    But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed. [12] For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. [13] And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation. [14] But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews? [15] We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, [16] Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

So if you are a follower of James, your life is a vapour!  according to his teachings. But if you believe in the message of Paul, we are growing up to the fullness of christ.

Ephes. 4:13
    Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

You said truth is contant .You are wrong there again. There are lesser truth and greater truths. That is why peter recomended milk and Paul recommended meat

1 Peter 2:2
As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

Hebrews 5:13
For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.

Alethia:

God's will is for all men to be saved, yes?

If so, why are some saved and some damned?

Clearly because some rejected God's will for their lives and other's co-operated with God's will for their lives, no?

Can you tell me if God's will for the Life of Hitler, Mobutu or Idi-Amin was realized?

There's nothing difficult in what Joagbaje is trying to pass across: namely that each person must key-into or sync with God's will, for such to be made manifest in their lives.

The very definition of "sin" proves this point - sin is a missing of the mark: basically a deviation from God's will.

WOW! This WOF dirty well is deeper than I ever imagined!! So now you can subvert God's will since you are on his level abi?

Joagbaje:

@aletheia

Your ignorace is appaling,

Point of correction, Jesus is not the only begotten , .Every christian is begooten by the word. Jesus is no longer only begotten but now he is first begotten.We are his brothers!

Your lack of understanding of the true message makes it hard for you to descern the difference between truth and lesser truths. The fact that James was brother of Jesus should not be an issue. There is a saying that "The age of Methuselah can not be compared to the wisdom of Solomon"  It is childish to use the relationship of Jesus with james as legality or endorsement for James teaching. We judge all things according to the whole body of truth.not with your miopic religious eyes.
James was not part of the 12 deciples of Christ, There is no record of his conversion before Jesus went to the cross. record we have was that he and his brother Jude i think did not believe in Jesus.

John 7:5
    For neither did his brethren believe in him.

James was one of the last  apostles to be converted, He was a kind of principality in the early church and he troubled the ministry of Paul a littlel, People feared him. James did not have deep knowledge of grace and justification  like Paul did.

James 2:21
    Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

Contrast it with Paul's teaching here

Romans 4:2-3
    For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. [3] For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Romans 3:28
    Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Who's teaching would you rather follow. I wont be suprised if you follow James here because he was "teacher of babe" but I will rather follow teaching of Paul. James still believed in the works of the law. he had good dctrines but he was religious like some nairalanders here. James still teach that a man must be circumcised according to the law to be saved.He terrorised the early church with his teachings in his ignorance that Peter the great apostle was afraid of him.

Galatians 2:11-16
    But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed. [12] For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. [13] And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation. [14] But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews? [15] We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, [16] Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

So if you are a follower of James, your life is a vapour!  according to his teachings. But if you believe in the message of Paul, we are growing up to the fullness of christ.

Ephes. 4:13
    Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

You said truth is contant .You are wrong there again. There are lesser truth and greater truths. That is why peter recomended milk and Paul recommended meat

1 Peter 2:2
    As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

Hebrews 5:13
    For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.

Joeagbaje,

you always will keep on showing how poorly you handle the word of God. Everything you wrote here is just a repetition of what your "father";
Chris has been teaching you.
Your programmed mode is described thus: "Since Pastor Chris said it is this way, it has to be true because Pastor Chris cannot be wrong."

Foolish! Very Foolish! !

Please go through this verses from James carefully in the Amplified version of the bible and tell us truthfully if what he is saying contrasts with what Paul said in Romans 4 :

Jas 2:14-26
(14)  What is the use (profit), my brethren, for anyone to profess to have faith if he has no [good] works [to show for it]? Can [such] faith save [his soul]?
(15)  If a brother or sister is poorly clad and lacks food for each day,
(16)  And one of you says to him, Good-bye! Keep [yourself] warm and well fed, without giving him the necessities for the body, what good does that do?
(17)  So also faith, if it does not have works (deeds and actions of obedience to back it up), by itself is destitute of power (inoperative, dead).
(18)  But someone will say [to you then], You [say you] have faith, and I have [good] works. Now you show me your [alleged] faith apart from any [good] works [if you can], and I by [good] works [of obedience] will show you my faith.
(19)  You believe that God is one; you do well. So do the demons believe and shudder [in terror and horror such as make a man's hair stand on end and contract the surface of his skin]!
(20)  Are you willing to be shown [proof], you foolish (unproductive, spiritually deficient) fellow, that faith apart from [good] works is inactive and ineffective and worthless?
(21)  Was not our forefather Abraham [shown to be] justified (made acceptable to God) by [his] works when he brought to the altar as an offering his [own] son Isaac? [Gen. 22:1-14.]
(22)  You see that [his] faith was cooperating with his works, and [his] faith was completed and reached its supreme expression [when he implemented it] by [good] works.
(23)  And [so] the Scripture was fulfilled that says, Abraham believed in (adhered to, trusted in, and relied on) God, and this was accounted to him as righteousness (as conformity to God's will in thought and deed), and he was called God's friend. [Gen. 15:6; II Chron. 20:7; Isa. 41:8.]
(24)  You see that a man is justified (pronounced righteous before God) through what he does and not alone through faith [through works of obedience as well as by what he believes].
(25)  So also with Rahab the harlot--was she not shown to be justified (pronounced righteous before God) by [good] deeds when she took in the scouts (spies) and sent them away by a different route? [Josh. 2:1-21.]
(26)  For as the human body apart from the spirit is lifeless, so faith apart from [its] works of obedience is also dead.


It is becoming very clear that the use of English Language is a heavy problem for you.
Any clear brained person will see that James was referring to the fruit or proof of one's faith in terms of visible acts or activities done and not works of the law.

Remember Christ's words: "By their fruit you shall know them, " ?

That is very well connected to this. Without fruit/proof to show that you are of faith or have faith, your faith is very well dead.

Joagbaje:
James still believed in the works of the law. he had good dctrines but he was religious like some nairalanders here. James still teach that a man must be circumcised according to the law to be saved.

Are you sure you are not lying against James? Did you not read his position on this circumcision issue in Acts 15? 

Joagbaje:

Point of correction, Jesus is not the only begotten , .Every christian is begooten by the word. Jesus is no longer only begotten but now he is first begotten.We are his brothers!

@Joabgaje, a few questions:

(a)     what is the meaning of "only begotten" in reference to Jesus Christ?

(b)     what is the meaning of "firstbegotten" in reference to Jesus Christ?

(c)     do you find anyone else described as "only begotten" in the same way as Jesus is?

(d)    do the terms "only begotten" and "firstbegotten" mean the same things to you?

(e)    when was Jesus Christ called "the only begotten" - before or after His resurrection?

If you can answer these simple questions, then your problem will come to light. If you cannot, then perhaps your choice is to remain in your dark arguments.

James was one of the last  apostles to be converted, He was a kind of principality in the early church and he troubled the ministry of Paul a littlel, People feared him.

Where did you read these from the Bible?

James still teach that a man must be circumcised according to the law to be saved.

Where in the Bible did you read that?

He terrorised the early church with his teachings in his ignorance that Peter the great apostle was afraid of him.

Where in the Bible did you read such things?

^^^
The only bible Joagbaje reads is called "Rhaposdy of Realities". He exhibits all the hallmarks of a brain-washed cult follower---regurgitating pre-programmed unscriptural rote responses. Not even afraid, in his arrogance at believing he is a spiritual authority---a god, he even slanders James the brother of the Lord, described as one of the pillars of the early church by none other than Paul himself.

Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
[center]-----[/center]
Jud 1:8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.
[center]-----[/center]
Jud 1:10-19 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves. Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core. These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots; Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever. And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage. But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ; How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

InesQor:

WOW! This WOF dirty well is deeper than I ever imagined!! So now you can subvert God's will since you are on his level abi?

ha! is it the word of God you refer to as dirty!?!

InesQor:

WOW! This WOF dirty well is deeper than I ever imagined!! So now you can subvert God's will since you are on his level abi?

mabell:

ha! is it the word of God you refer to as dirty!?!

The WOF is not the Word of God. The Word of God does not deny the holiness of God, the kadesh of his excellence, the unmoveable and inexplicable being of his person which does not SWAY to the will of men. I and WOF adherents do not worship the same God, because they have created all forms of idols fashioned after the likeness of God. Simple and straightforward. Cheers.

viaro:

@Joabgaje, a few questions:

(a) what is the meaning of "only begotten" in reference to Jesus Christ?

(b) what is the meaning of "firstbegotten" in reference to Jesus Christ?

(c) do you find anyone else described as "only begotten" in the same way as Jesus is?

(d) do the terms "only begotten" and "firstbegotten" mean the same things to you?

(e) when was Jesus Christ called "the only begotten" - before or after His resurrection?

If you can answer these simple questions, then your problem will come to light. If you cannot, then perhaps your choice is to remain in your dark arguments.

Where did you read these from the Bible?

Where in the Bible did you read that?

Where in the Bible did you read such things?

Childish babyish questions as usual, Well I wouldnt mind answering to help you anyway if your questions were honest and sincere but the maggots you stored inside of you are already spilling out and giving you away.

2 Tim. 2:23
But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

InesQor:

The WOF is not the Word of God. The Word of God does not deny the holiness of God, the kadesh of his excellence, the unmoveable and inexplicable being of his person which does not SWAY to the will of men. I and WOF adherents do not worship the same God, because they have created all forms of idols fashioned after the likeness of God. Simple and straightforward. Cheers.

how can you say the word of faith is not the word of God, is it the word of fear that is the word of God.

But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach
Romans 10:8 (KJV)

mabell:

how can you say the word of faith is not the word of God, is it the word of fear that is the word of God.

But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach
Romans 10:8 (KJV)

Abegi WOF is not the Word of Faith delivered to us by the Gospel of Christ. I can call any dog Barack Obama, it doesn't make it the president of the United States.