salvation101 post=63395627
Acts 20:28
NWT: Pay attention to yourselves and to all the flock, among which the holy spirit has appointed YOU overseers, to shepherd the congregation of God, which he purchased with the blood of his own [Son:
.

NIV: Keep watch over yourselves and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers. Be shepherds of the church of God, which he bought with his own blood.

NASB: Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

KJV: Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

DISCUSSION: Some more grammatical games and bracket inclusions combine to once again pervert Holy Scripture in order to deny the deity of Jesus Christ. Going through my collection of legitimate Bible translations (and some not-so good translations), I find the NWT stands alone in their mistranslation of this verse. The verse speaks of God purchasing the church “with His own blood”. This is obviously a reference to God the Son, Jesus Christ. What a powerful biblical testimony to the deity of Christ, and what an anathema to the neo-Arian doctrines of the Jehovah’s Witnesses! In order to overcome this, a little mistranslation is made to completely change the meaning and deceive their followers. Not a single extant Greek manuscript contains the word “son”.

Well, let us see if we are alone.

Revised Standard Version (RSV) Acts 20:28 Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God[b]which he obtained with the blood of his own Son

What would you also call your fellow Trinitarians Bible above? Heresy?
You find us alone indeed. What a surprise for you.

New Revised Standard Version (NRSV) Acts 20:28 Keep watch over yourselves and over all the flock, of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God[d]that he obtained with the blood of his own Son

Take note of these Bible translations. Deal with your fellow Trinitarians before seeking the JW

New Jerusalem Bible NJB Acts 20:28 'Be on your guard for yourselves and for all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you the guardians, to feed the Church of God which he bought with the blood of his own Son.

http://www.catholic.org/bible/book.php?id=51&bible_chapter=20
You will be so surprised that I found this on a Catholic website. The New Jerusalem Bible (NJB) is a Catholic translation of the Bible published in 1985.

Surprise! You must be rolling and turning right now.
Would you want to call the Catholics Heretics. Are you bold enough to do that? I will stop here now but there are many more translations that support our NWT.

Will you be woman enough to tender a public apology to the JW right now?

salvation101 post=63395627
Colossians 1:16,17
NWT: because by means of him all [other:
things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All [other] things have been created through him and for him. Also, he is before all [other] things and by means of him all [other] things were made to exist,

NIV: For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

NASB: For by Him all things were created, {both} in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things have been created through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.

KJV: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

DISCUSSION: This is one of those passages that speak clearly toward the deity of Jesus Christ and His role as the Creator of all things. It’s also one of those passages where the Watchtower Society is powerless to form an argument from the Greek, so they play the brackets game. In order to deny the deity of Jesus Christ and to buttress their argument that Jesus was simply the first of God’s creations, they insert the word “other”. The NWT reads that Jesus, as the first created being, created all “other” things. Since the Greek word for “other” is not found in the Greek manuscripts, they bracket the word to indicate that they’re inserting a word that does not belong. This additional word does not help the flow or clarity of the text, but is instead designed to attack the explicit biblical teaching of Christ’s deity and role as Creator. Greek scholar and theologian Robert Reymond referred to the addition of “other” as “sheer theological perversity…”[2] As an example of the deceptive practices of the Watchtower Society, the 1950 version of the NWT did not bracket the word “other,” making it appear that it was part of the Greek Text. Only since 1961, when pressured to do so by Bible scholars, did they add the brackets.

Why should we be powerless to this verse? We do not give a hoof to anyone wise in the knowledge of this world. Be it a scholar or sage, we have seen them come and go making huge blunders in your Bible. We do not invite your endorsement to worship our God. These verses corroborate 1 Corinthians 8:6 and other verses in Bible and when you read further to the 19th verse you will understand the message better that God gave his fullness to Jesus so that through him, he accomplishes his will. I am glad 'other' was put in bracket to indicate amplification of the sense in the verses.

salvation101 post=63395627
Titus 2:13
NWT: while we wait for the happy hope and glorious manifestation of the great God and of [the:
Savior of us, Christ Jesus

NIV: while we wait for the blessed hope—the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ

NASB: looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus

KJV: Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

DISCUSSION: This verse identifies our great God and our Savior Jesus Christ as being one and the same. While an argument can be made that the KJV separates the two much like the NWT (by placing the Greek pronoun hemon, meaning “our,” in an improper location), the wording of the NWT and the additional bracketed definite article go beyond a disputed positioning of the Greek, and presents an inferior and erroneous translation that once again separates Jesus Christ from His deity.

American Standard Version (ASV) Titus 2:13 13 looking for the blessed hope and appearing of the glory [a]of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Titus 2:13 lokinge for that blessed hope and glorious apperenge of ye myghty god and of oure savioure Iesu Christ.
The above verse is from the Bible that the KJB was copied from. Can you spot the difference? Why was the preposition taken out by the 55 man committee of puritans? These men were ordered to copy from Tyndale and not manipulate his work isn’t it? If they had to manipulate why didn’t they translate from the Greek manuscript directly? Now, Jehovah’s witnesses are bad to you but the original work from which KJB was copied is in accordance with the NWT. Who is now a heretic? Who should feel uncomfortable?

salvation101 post=63395627
Legitimate scholars in the Biblical languages and manuscripts don’t think much of the NWT. Dr. Bruce Metzger is a well-known scholar whose works are seminary standards. He used the following adjectives when describing the NWT: “a frightful mistranslation,” “erroneous,” “pernicious,” and “reprehensible.”[3:
British Bible scholar H.H. Rowley stated that the NWT is “a shining example of how the Bible should not be translated.”[4] He also referred to the NWT as “an insult to the Word of God.”[5] While this list could go on, let me conclude with the words of Dr. William Barclay who stated, “It is abundantly clear that a sect which can translate the New Testament like that is intellectually dishonest.”

We are not seeking praises from men. Those men should concentrate on cleansing the heretic texts they inserted in you KJB. Why is the name of God missing in your Bible? Why is it present in the 2011 KJB and not yours? Discrepancies, heresy and bloodstain.

You did not strike a single cord here.
You are trying to sly away from my question by convoluting. I am asking you of the men who perform the said miracle. You cannot give me straight answers but your destination is vividly clear to me. You believe in Miracles and you say that my God is dead because i told you that I do not believe in magic. But I am asking for people who have the powers to perform such miracles today. Is that something too big to ask? Give me 3 names of people who possibly could have the power to perform signs.
You claimed to use many Bible and yet you are still cleaning the stain of blood in your KJB. You said that my religion is dark-age, so provide a religion for me. You cannot rule mine out without presenting an option.

salvation101:
wow i see i struck a cord nd made u very mad , dats wat d truth does to heretic, it makes dem very mad. It happened in Jesus days, it happened to Stephen nd dey gnashed their teeth at him.
U asked me about 3 ppl who have the power to perform miracle in Nigeria? Why are u more concerned about men than about what the word says? U see dat the very Holy Spirit u claim to inspire ur false doctrine is even absent in ur means hence you can't even trust God for a miracle tru d prayer of even d least among u. Well am not surprised, since you succeeded in removing the Holy Spirit from ur doctrine how den would u expect to have Him working signs and wonders in ur means and since he is absent and u know it, u now try to convince ursef dat miracles has stopped. Well all tru the Bible age, the period where God didn't perform any wonder or speak tru any prophet is wat is known as the dark ages, u r in ur own doctrine-forced dark age... I may not sound nice but i just told u the truth ur society wont te u

salvation101:

It is clear that many are unaware of the dangerous differences found in the New World Translation. We’ve received several emails from people who were confused by a verse shown to them by a Jehovah’s Witness. Often the confusion results from the fact that the verse was like one of those in this article, and when we directed the person to a legitimate translation of that verse, their confusion lifted. When conversing with a Jehovah’s Witness, never let them read a verse from the NWT without verifying the wording in a legitimate translation. As Christians, our faith is supported by the God-breathed Scriptures. We must be on guard against translations that attack our faith through corruption of God’s Word.

What, then, is the legitimate translation? You told me that you use 3 translations but you did not list them up there to compare the Jehovah’s witnesses’ NWT. You are so scared to boldly say that you use the KJB because deep within you know that there are scums under the carpet that you cannot prove.
You may think that you are exposing us but you ended up exposing yourself. It is a boomerang. The world can at least see your toxic move to smear us. You copied this comments from a blog online and am sure you will get more. They will run out of the lies soon. If I bring out pages of the KJB like this you will run.
First answer my previous questions and the ones above and explain.
What is the true church in Nigeria?

salvation101:

Mathew 14:33 (among others)
NWT: Then those in the boat did obeisance to him, saying: “You are really God’s Son.”

NIV: Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, "Truly you are the Son of God."

NASB: And those who were in the boat worshiped Him, saying, "You are certainly God's Son!"

KJV: Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

DISCUSSION: Throughout the New Testament we find people who worshiped Jesus. Since worship is an action that should be reserved for God, and the Jehovah’s Witnesses deny the deity of Jesus Christ, the NWT had to rectify these verses. The Greek word here is proskuneo. While this word can be translated as doing obeisance (which is defined as giving reverence or homage), the giveaway is the Watchtower’s inconsistency in translating this word. In every instance in the New Testament were proskuneo is given to Jesus Christ, it is translated as doing “obeisance.” Where proskuneo is directed to the Father (“Jehovah” in the NWT), they rightly translate it as “worship” (as in John 4:20).

Have you looked the word up in the dictionary? Try it and you will see worship as a synonym. More or less, he was addressed as God’s son isn’t it? But you address him as Jehovah God which is contrasting. The name Jehovah is so heavy on your fingers and you do not just know where to and how to use it.
Can you show me where the KJV got “proskuneo” as you mentioned in Romans 1:25?

salvation101:

It is clear that many are unaware of the dangerous differences found in the New World Translation. We’ve received several emails from people who were confused by a verse shown to them by a Jehovah’s Witness. Often the confusion results from the fact that the verse was like one of those in this article, and when we directed the person to a legitimate translation of that verse, their confusion lifted. When conversing with a Jehovah’s Witness, never let them read a verse from the NWT without verifying the wording in a legitimate translation. As Christians, our faith is supported by the God-breathed Scriptures. We must be on guard against translations that attack our faith through corruption of God’s Word.

What, then, is the legitimate translation? You told me that you use 3 translations but you did not list them up there to compare the Jehovah’s witnesses’ NWT. You are so scared to boldly say that you use the KJB because deep within you know that there are scums under the carpet that you cannot prove.
You may think that you are exposing us but you ended up exposing yourself. It is a boomerang. The world can at least see your toxic move to smear us. You copied this comments from a blog online and am sure you will get more. They will run out of the lies soon. If I bring out pages of the KJB like this you will run.
First answer my previous questions and the ones above and explain.
What is the true church in Nigeria?

salvation101:

John 8:58
NWT: Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to YOU, Before Abraham came into existence, I have been.”

NIV: “I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

NASB: Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."

KJV: Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

DISCUSSION: There are deep doctrinal implications in the words of Jesus here. “I am” speaks to his eternality. It is also a name of God that He divulged to Moses. Exodus 3:14 says, God said to Moses, “I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.' " The Greek in John 8:58 is ego eimi, where ego means “I” and eimi is a first person singular present indicative, to “exist”. The Septuagint provides ego eimi as the Greek words in Exodus 3:14. The Hebrew word is hayah, which is derived from the same root as Yahweh. The NWT seeks to distance Jesus’ claims to eternality or deity. Thus, it stands alone in its gross mistranslation of this verse.

What is the origin of the word, I AM?
One thing that you are ignorant of is the meaning of the name of God. Jehovah wrote his name down on the tablet that he gave to Moses just in case you forget. That name is what your Bible, the KJB has tussled with for hundreds of years. The 55 man committee gifted us a valid point in King James Bible Psalm 83:18 That men may know that thou, whose name alone is JEHOVAH, art the most high over all the earth.

YHWH as the Tetragrammaton is translated Jehovah in English and that is the divine name of God. Some translations render it Yahweh. Now, those four letters are translated “I shall become what I chose to become”. It is not “I am that I am”. An intensive research will open your eyes. Search beyond the crumbs of Wikipedia.

Moreover, since you insist that there are deep implication in the words 'I am', I will also draw your attention to King James Bible 1 Corinthians 15:10 But by the grace of God "I am" what "I am": and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

In this verse, can we also say that Apostle Paul can rightfully be called “I am” as well?

Fruthermore, here is Moses being called out by God in Exodus 3:4 and I will copy from one of the translations that you used above to checkmate ours. You will see the discrepancy or eerie motive in the KJB translation. You may compare this verse to the Hebrew and let us see where the knowledge of the heretical 55 men came to play. How they twisted the word of God

New International Version Exodus 3:4 When the LORD saw that he had gone over to look, God called to him from within the bush, "Moses! Moses!" And Moses said, "Here[b] I am[/b]."

In the above, why did your 55 men change the meaning of the sentence? Match your translation with the Hebrew translation and you will see your falsehood. Why has your Bible suddenly disagreed with some other translations of the Bible? Can Paul and Moses also be called your God (I AM)?

removetheturban:


You must be so ashamed to read your comment above. Spirit OF God and then suddenly it changed to a triune God and automatically a coequal. Firstly, try to find out the function of the preposition ‘OF’ to the Noun.
We have never rejected the idea that the active force is the Holy Spirit. What are we forcing into the scripture? Some Bible translations use wind in place of spirit etc and they have some justification for that. If you believe that Ruwach Elohim means spirit of God, then what does ‘God the spirit’ mean in Hebrew as regard your belief?


Very pathetic! I see nothing to talk about here. You are beating a dead horse. There is no point made. Your comment is shaky and uncoordinated.

Rauch Elohim is Spirit of God. Same word was used in Gen41:8 wen the spirit of Pharoah was troubled. As for God the spirit in Hebrew, i do not know but i have an Hebrew dictionary here, just give me d word nd ill tell you wat it means.

Why did u shy away from responding to the other text i highlighted or u couldn't find an answer in d material wit u? Ok i give u as an assignment

removetheturban:

I will expose your double standard. First we are not the only Bible translation to use “a god”.
King James Bible: Exodus 7:1 And the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
Elohim was used in this Hebrew scripture to refer to a ‘single person’, Moses.

You claim that Elohim means 3-in 1 or Gods (not singular). In this verse, the KJV stands alone in translating Elohim as “a god”. You may check your Bible right now and compare this same verse with other Bible translations that you listed above as references to malign us.

The Hebrew word mentioned in the Bible is Elohim

Fact: You have failed your own rule. Two points just got shattered. The implication of the nature of Elohim (1 person and not 3) and the translation of Elohim (a god and not God).

Would you choose to proceed with the KJB or withdraw? If yes, then do not use this as a barometer to denigrate my bible.

In John 1:1 The Greek words Theon and theos was used. Theon was translated God in all translations but Theos was translated as “a god” in mine and then you called me dark-age for it.

Now, if your argument is that Theos should have been translated as God, let us fact-check other verses in the KJB to see if they themselves are guilty of the same ‘crime’.

King James Bible 2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the “god” of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

voila! the Greek translation of this title here is Theos. But you just judged me for translating Theos as 'god'.

For the second time, the KJB is guilty of the same crime for which you are reviling the JW.

Hypocrisy! Blasphemy. Jehovah’s witnesses are false because they changed Theos to god in John 1:1 but how can you explain 2 Corinthians 4:4 to a neutral person?

Would you accept to call yourself the same names that you call us?
Would you want to make a public apology?

according to the Hebrew version it was elohim wch was actually referring to God not god. The king james version made d mistake of putting god in place of God, and that is why u av to compare with other versions. I made it clear to u from the beginning dat kjv isn't even my primary version as i use Erv but i understand dat u av been trained to spot d loopholes in the Kjv version hence u av to tag me with it. Please go for more training and spot the loopholes in Erv. And because kjv did dat, u av to do d same thing even wen u keep editing ur bibles u still don't deem it fit to change it? Isn't it also funny that in a single sentence, made by the same person, Theos was mentioned twice but u decided to make one God and the other 'a god'? Dat is called manipulation, dat single letter a change the meaning of everything. U aren't supposed to manipulate the word to suit ur doctrine, its satanic

removetheturban:

Well, let us see if we are alone.

Revised Standard Version (RSV) Acts 20:28 Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God[b]which he obtained with the blood of his own Son

What would you also call your fellow Trinitarians Bible above? Heresy?
You find us alone indeed. What a surprise for you.

New Revised Standard Version (NRSV) Acts 20:28 Keep watch over yourselves and over all the flock, of which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God[d]that he obtained with the blood of his own Son

Take note of these Bible translations. Deal with your fellow Trinitarians before seeking the JW

New Jerusalem Bible NJB Acts 20:28 'Be on your guard for yourselves and for all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has made you the guardians, to feed the Church of God which he bought with the blood of his own Son.

http://www.catholic.org/bible/book.php?id=51&bible_chapter=20
You will be so surprised that I found this on a Catholic website. The New Jerusalem Bible (NJB) is a Catholic translation of the Bible published in 1985.

Surprise! You must be rolling and turning right now.
Would you want to call the Catholics Heretics. Are you bold enough to do that? I will stop here now but there are many more translations that support our NWT.

Will you be woman enough to tender a public apology to the JW right now?


Why should we be powerless to this verse? We do not give a hoof to anyone wise in the knowledge of this world. Be it a scholar or sage, we have seen them come and go making huge blunders in your Bible. We do not invite your endorsement to worship our God. These verses corroborate 1 Corinthians 8:6 and other verses in Bible and when you read further to the 19th verse you will understand the message better that God gave his fullness to Jesus so that through him, he accomplishes his will. I am glad 'other' was put in bracket to indicate amplification of the sense in the verses.


American Standard Version (ASV) Titus 2:13 13 looking for the blessed hope and appearing of the glory [a]of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Titus 2:13 lokinge for that blessed hope and glorious apperenge of ye myghty god and of oure savioure Iesu Christ.
The above verse is from the Bible that the KJB was copied from. Can you spot the difference? Why was the preposition taken out by the 55 man committee of puritans? These men were ordered to copy from Tyndale and not manipulate his work isn’t it? If they had to manipulate why didn’t they translate from the Greek manuscript directly? Now, Jehovah’s witnesses are bad to you but the original work from which KJB was copied is in accordance with the NWT. Who is now a heretic? Who should feel uncomfortable?

We are not seeking praises from men. Those men should concentrate on cleansing the heretic texts they inserted in you KJB. Why is the name of God missing in your Bible? Why is it present in the 2011 KJB and not yours? Discrepancies, heresy and bloodstain.

yeah u av no idea, i would call it as it is. If the catholics weren't heretic there wouldn't av been need for the protestants to break out nd there probably won't av been jws. Lets go back to the original greek now. The word translated as own is krios and u can do a quick Google search on wat it means.it is stated here in my dictionary dat it means "pertaining to one's self". So where did u get the "his son" u juxtaposed into it? If the scribes of Israel had handled the word of God d way u do, they will av watered down d word of God to suit their lifestyle. Dey wouldn't av elevated scholarship but give the copying and recopying of the word to novice. Or dey would av been re editing it frequently

removetheturban:
You did not strike a single cord here.
You are trying to sly away from my question by convoluting. I am asking you of the men who perform the said miracle. You cannot give me straight answers but your destination is vividly clear to me. You believe in Miracles and you say that my God is dead because i told you that I do not believe in magic. But I am asking for people who have the powers to perform such miracles today. Is that something too big to ask? Give me 3 names of people who possibly could have the power to perform signs.
You claimed to use many Bible and yet you are still cleaning the stain of blood in your KJB. You said that my religion is dark-age, so provide a religion for me. You cannot rule mine out without presenting an option.

it obvious i did.you are bent on knowing three ppl whose prayers God answers, well i am one. My friend is another den another of my friend is the third... We pray and God answers our prayer cos the God we serve is a living God not a dead or impotent one. We hold strongly the word of our savior Jesus Christ dat says if two of us shall agree as touching anything and pray to God, it will be answered.. I hope dat settles ur curiosity.
I use many Bible versions but disagree with ur reasoning dat d kjb should be thrown away just cos it copied a lot of tyndales work who a previous king killed. Yeah it is illogical.

removetheturban:

What, then, is the legitimate translation? You told me that you use 3 translations but you did not list them up there to compare the Jehovah’s witnesses’ NWT. You are so scared to boldly say that you use the KJB because deep within you know that there are scums under the carpet that you cannot prove.
You may think that you are exposing us but you ended up exposing yourself. It is a boomerang. The world can at least see your toxic move to smear us. You copied this comments from a blog online and am sure you will get more. They will run out of the lies soon. If I bring out pages of the KJB like this you will run.
First answer my previous questions and the ones above and explain.
What is the true church in Nigeria?

i am not scared of the truth, u are. The mere fact that i agreed to used other versions and sometimes av to check the original text should show u dat i am d most openminded Christian u ever met. Unlike u dat is trying to protect ur 5 illiterate men committee bible. U don't believe that the Holy spirit does miracle today but u believe he inspired ur 5 illeterate members. Pathetic
Open any things u know about Kjv, i am ready to learn nd dats y am still on dis thread
I didn't hide d fact dat i copied d post from a website.. Unlike ursef going to ur jw materials ever now and then nd wont admit it

salvation101:
according to the Hebrew version it was elohim wch was actually referring to God not god. The king james version made d mistake of putting god in place of God, and that is why u av to compare with other versions. I made it clear to u from the beginning dat kjv isn't even my primary version as i use Erv but i understand dat u av been trained to spot d loopholes in the Kjv version hence u av to tag me with it. Please go for more training and spot the loopholes in Erv. And because kjv did dat, u av to do d same thing even wen u keep editing ur bibles u still don't deem it fit to change it? Isn't it also funny that in a single sentence, made by the same person, Theos was mentioned twice but u decided to make one God and the other 'a god'? Dat is called manipulation, dat single letter a change the meaning of everything. U aren't supposed to manipulate the word to suit ur doctrine, its satanic

I think u are fighting a lost battle. let me ask

Is it wrong to translate Theo's as " a god " ?

solite3:
the word 'Ruach' can take different meaning depending on the contextual meaning.
In verse 21 it mean Spirit because that verse is talking of what goes on after death but verse 19 is talking physical events

The Ruach therefore has different meant in each verse



Ecclesiastes 3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.

3:21 Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?

I don't know your problem, Ruach means spirit . Ruach appeared in verse 19 and 21 . it reads man and animal have same Ruach .


so its clear , if your ENGLISH translator like they should change it to whatever they like . it still remains man and animal have same Ruach ( Spirit) .


so you make no reasonable point . using the work of English translator to confuse yourself .

Animals have spirit according to verse 21 , So its obvious verse 19 can read Sprit too ( Check the footnote of NIV Bible , it was indicated there )

so upgrade and learn

Hahaha. Many anti-JW find it hard to tell me the Bible that they approve of, the church that they represent and the names of people that they revere (Puritans).
The reason is that they have absolute knowledge concerning the shreds of evidence surrounding their possible answers. They prefer to convolute and leave their answers as the decision of the mind. You are not proud enough of a religion that you claim to defend. I am a Jehovah's Witness. And we cannot hide it because everyone sees us out in the street preaching. I take bullets in form of questions even in people's very own comfort zones. If you come to my house, you will be bamboozled with facts and books that you probably have never heard or read before. But Jehovah's Witnesses will never denigrate you. We will not call you negative names. We will rather try to help you achieve the knowledge that you need to gain salvation. You have made blasphemous claims about the JW and you provided details. Do the same when referring to your religion. What Church or religion in Nigeria can you recommend to me since you have condemned mine?
Which pastor or Puritan can you recommend to me since you have condemned my brothers?
Who appointed you and your friends for that special encounter with God? Are you Puritans? What is the difference between you and a Puritan? If God answers your prayers, why is the mortality rate in Nigeria so high and still rising?
Let me set the record straight, Jehovah's Witnesses have never and will never canvas for the KJB to be thrown away. As I told you many of us own and use it even in our preaching in the street. I use the KJB almost every day. There are certain verses in the KJB that we do not agree with and that is all. We do not condemn the way you condemn our and publicly sent a message out there to malign us.
Like I said, this issue would not have come up if you did not come up strong to flatly condemn my Bible. I only wanted to draw your attention to the fact that looking for the killer, there is a visible evidence of bloodstain on you. To the extent that you dwell on this case, you will only end up coming out as complicit in the killing of Tyndale and soaked with blood.
We still encourage people to read their Bibles and not use it as pillows in their homes.

salvation101:
it obvious i did.you are bent on knowing three ppl whose prayers God answers, well i am one. My friend is another den another of my friend is the third... We pray and God answers our prayer cos the God we serve is a living God not a dead or impotent one. We hold strongly the word of our savior Jesus Christ dat says if two of us shall agree as touching anything and pray to God, it will be answered.. I hope dat settles ur curiosity.
I use many Bible versions but disagree with ur reasoning dat d kjb should be thrown away just cos it copied a lot of tyndales work who a previous king killed. Yeah it is illogical.

She is so stupefied already. She is led by anti-JW bloggers on a smear campaign but was not supplied enough armoury. Let her answer and she sinks even deeper into the mud. She told me Elohim means GodS in one. Keep asking her. The truth must be revealed.
She might end up changing her Moniker from Salvation to something else.

Peacefullove:


I think u are fighting a lost battle. let me ask

Is it wrong to translate Theo's as " a god " ?

Well, something that you fail to understand is that we go face to face with people in our preaching work. When we stand before you preaching, there is no JW website. It is us and the promise that Jesus gave us "look, I am with you until the conclusion of the system of things" Matthew 28:20. JW are even more interested in person-to-person meetups. I do not copy answers from JW materials because JW are taught to read and prepare for our ministry. We hold 2 meetings weekly and we do not just go there to sleep or clap. We actually dig for spiritual gems in the Bible. We are taught by Jehovah. We all participate in our meetings and I am sure that you know it. Even a teen JW is known to have answers from the Bible that some adults might find difficult to answer.
I do not wait for your questions to go through our materials. We digest them before giving them out. I use JW.ORG very frequently. Even when I am not here, I read the unbiased spiritual foods that my loving brothers took time to prepare for me. I also do my personal research. And I am privileged to have paid attention during my school days to remember what I was taught. Do not feel bad that I said that, though.
I knew you copied because I also read the same things that you read online. My neighbour is an anti-jw blogger and we talk about the Bible and I hear his arguments face to face. So, when I come across any works that look familiar, I can tell. I know when a material is original.
How do you think that people exposed the 55 man committee that you revere? They stole a man's work and called it theirs after they have murdered him. We did not murder anyone. In fact, we went ahead of KJB. Give us some credit.

salvation101:
i am not scared of the truth, u are. The mere fact that i agreed to used other versions and sometimes av to check the original text should show u dat i am d most openminded Christian u ever met. Unlike u dat is trying to protect ur 5 illiterate men committee bible. U don't believe that the Holy spirit does miracle today but u believe he inspired ur 5 illeterate members. Pathetic
Open any things u know about Kjv, i am ready to learn nd dats y am still on dis thread
I didn't hide d fact dat i copied d post from a website.. Unlike ursef going to ur jw materials ever now and then nd wont admit it

Wow! At this point, I would like to invite the Catholics to feast on you LOL.
Who are the Protestants? Why did they break out of Catholicism?
Can we also use this same argument on 1 John 5:7?
Why are you so scared to address 1 John 5:7??
Let us give it a little thought, just a little.

salvation101:
yeah u av no idea, i would call it as it is. If the catholics weren't heretic there wouldn't av been need for the protestants to break out nd there probably won't av been jws. Lets go back to the original greek now. The word translated as own is krios and u can do a quick Google search on wat it means.it is stated here in my dictionary dat it means "pertaining to one's self". So where did u get the "his son" u juxtaposed into it? If the scribes of Israel had handled the word of God d way u do, they will av watered down d word of God to suit their lifestyle. Dey wouldn't av elevated scholarship but give the copying and recopying of the word to novice. Or dey would av been re editing it frequently

If something so important to your doctrine has no Hebrew name or translation, what evinces you of its existence as God?
I have asked many questions that you slyly ignore and I just let them slide so as not to torture you. Like I said, you are flogging a dead horse. Jehovah’s witnesses believe in the Holy Spirit, so what’s the fuss about this stretch?

salvation101:
Rauch Elohim is Spirit of God. Same word was used in Gen41:8 wen the spirit of Pharoah was troubled. As for God the spirit in Hebrew, i do not know but i have an Hebrew dictionary here, just give me d word nd ill tell you wat it means.

Why did u shy away from responding to the other text i highlighted or u couldn't find an answer in d material wit u? Ok i give u as an assignment

removetheturban:
If something so important to your doctrine has no Hebrew name or translation, what evinces you of its existence as God?
I have asked many questions that you slyly ignore and I just let them slide so as not to torture you. Like I said, you are flogging a dead horse. Jehovah’s witnesses believe in the Holy Spirit, so what’s the fuss about this stretch?

how does me not knowing translate to the Bible not having? Are u telling me if u should ask someone with the proper knowledge (not like ur 5 men committee oo) there isn't a Hebrew word for it?

removetheturban:
Wow! At this point, I would like to invite the Catholics to feast on you LOL.
Who are the Protestants? Why did they break out of Catholicism?
Can we also use this same argument on 1 John 5:7?
Why are you so scared to address 1 John 5:7??
Let us give it a little thought, just a little.

i make bold to call dem heretic. Dat dey still bow down to graven images gives dem away and wat gave u d impression dat i was scared to say the truth
Wats in 1john5:7 dat is scary to admit? Y don't u tell me?

removetheturban:
Well, something that you fail to understand is that we go face to face with people in our preaching work. When we stand before you preaching, there is no JW website. It is us and the promise that Jesus gave us "look, I am with you until the conclusion of the system of things" Matthew 28:20. JW are even more interested in person-to-person meetups. I do not copy answers from JW materials because JW are taught to read and prepare for our ministry. We hold 2 meetings weekly and we do not just go there to sleep or clap. We actually dig for spiritual gems in the Bible. We are taught by Jehovah. We all participate in our meetings and I am sure that you know it. Even a teen JW is known to have answers from the Bible that some adults might find difficult to answer.
I do not wait for your questions to go through our materials. We digest them before giving them out. I use JW.ORG very frequently. Even when I am not here, I read the unbiased spiritual foods that my loving brothers took time to prepare for me. I also do my personal research. And I am privileged to have paid attention during my school days to remember what I was taught. Do not feel bad that I said that, though.
I knew you copied because I also read the same things that you read online. My neighbour is an anti-jw blogger and we talk about the Bible and I hear his arguments face to face. So, when I come across any works that look familiar, I can tell. I know when a material is original.
How do you think that people exposed the 55 man committee that you revere? They stole a man's work and called it theirs after they have murdered him. We did not murder anyone. In fact, we went ahead of KJB. Give us some credit.

jw is not new to me, i av known u guys since i was a kid nd av friends among u. Even wen u go out to preach, its not just the Bible u hold, u av smaller books u read from on almost any topic. Yep i know ur society does alot of job to indoctrinate u folks and u guys are really committed (so are the Muslims).. Even a lie wen it is told repeatedly begins t9 sound like d truth. Even if the kjv isn't perfect, I'd still trust it over ur nwt.

Peacefullove:


I think u are fighting a lost battle. let me ask

Is it wrong to translate Theo's as " a god " ?

in the beginning was the word and the word was with Theos a d the word was Theos, why do u change one Theos to mean God and the other to a god? Where is the article a coming from? U see dat alone gives it an entirely different meaning. The greek used the word Theos to refer to gods and goddesses. In d new testament, theos can be God or god, but where did ur article "a" come from? A dot or comma can entirely change the meaning of a sentence nd dat is wat u folks intended to achieve wen u added "a"

removetheturban:
Hahaha. Many anti-JW find it hard to tell me the Bible that they approve of, the church that they represent and the names of people that they revere (Puritans).
The reason is that they have absolute knowledge concerning the shreds of evidence surrounding their possible answers. They prefer to convolute and leave their answers as the decision of the mind. You are not proud enough of a religion that you claim to defend. I am a Jehovah's Witness. And we cannot hide it because everyone sees us out in the street preaching. I take bullets in form of questions even in people's very own comfort zones. If you come to my house, you will be bamboozled with facts and books that you probably have never heard or read before. But Jehovah's Witnesses will never denigrate you. We will not call you negative names. We will rather try to help you achieve the knowledge that you need to gain salvation. You have made blasphemous claims about the JW and you provided details. Do the same when referring to your religion. What Church or religion in Nigeria can you recommend to me since you have condemned mine?
Which pastor or Puritan can you recommend to me since you have condemned my brothers?
Who appointed you and your friends for that special encounter with God? Are you Puritans? What is the difference between you and a Puritan? If God answers your prayers, why is the mortality rate in Nigeria so high and still rising?
Let me set the record straight, Jehovah's Witnesses have never and will never canvas for the KJB to be thrown away. As I told you many of us own and use it even in our preaching in the street. I use the KJB almost every day. There are certain verses in the KJB that we do not agree with and that is all. We do not condemn the way you condemn our and publicly sent a message out there to malign us.
Like I said, this issue would not have come up if you did not come up strong to flatly condemn my Bible. I only wanted to draw your attention to the fact that looking for the killer, there is a visible evidence of bloodstain on you. To the extent that you dwell on this case, you will only end up coming out as complicit in the killing of Tyndale and soaked with blood.
We still encourage people to read their Bibles and not use it as pillows in their homes.

i am a pentecostal Christian and can never be ashamed of who i am. I believe in the full gospel of Christ and will recommend dat u attend any church dat believes in the full word of God and not look for excuses why d word shouldn't work for them. The mortality rate in Nigeria is high, is Nigeria even a Christian nation? Wat is the percentage of the population of the Christian community in d country. Wen evil prevail in the land, death wont be uncommon but those who are God's children can still hold on to d word of God in psalm 91.. Don't tell me u don't even believe God's promise in psalm 91.i believe it, claim it and its working for me and my household

I am stunned that you do not feel embarrassed to ask me such questions. You have been parsing the verses in JW's NWT and yet the log imported from Lebanon that you have in your eye does not ache you. Are you presenting yourself as ignorant of the insertions of heretical texts in your KJB?

I saw how you smartly wanted to disassociate yourself with the KJB when the heat got a little tough earlier on. You quickly shifted to ERV. That is how you will keep on until you disassociate yourself from the entire Bible versions. Loyalty is a virtue.

If you are not scared, why aren't you a forerunner in exposing the heresy in the KJB before smearing the JW? Why can't you present the name of the Church that you represent? Why can't you mention the name of your pastor or people with miraculous powers to heal?

I am glad that your voice has suddenly become subtle. You have finally unleashed your arsenal in the forum. Like I always say, you recycle the same questions when you meet a JW. You have mastered the art over time and you feel pumped to decimate any JW. It always begins with some bait questions to reel them into a trap and then you unleash your missile.

I usually meet your type face to face and we seldom have calm discussions from the Bible but the majority of them end up in aggressive speeches and insults when the heat becomes intense.
\

I will replay some of the questions that you think you escaped. You said that Jesus came to the earth leaving his Godship and took up flesh. You said that at his baptism the three Gods assembled to form the Trinity. You said that the Holy Spirit descended on him in the form of a dove (flesh).
So my questions are:

If 3 Gods assembled at his baptism, did he leave his Godship in heaven?
When the Holy Spirit descended in the form of a dove, did it leave its Godship in heaven?
What is the form of the Holy Spirit?
When Stephen looked up into the heaven before his death, how many persons did he see?
Did he say that they are the same person?
Jesus said that he would send the Holy Spirit and he did, has the Holy Spirit returned to heaven since then?


If you call the Catholics Heretics, why would you excuse the 55 man Committee?
Talking about idols, how about the pictures of your pastors on your walls and signboards?
How about the cross that you carry, what is it?


I will stop here for now.

salvation101:
i make bold to call dem heretic. Dat dey still bow down to graven images gives dem away and wat gave u d impression dat i was scared to say the truth
Wats in 1john5:7 dat is scary to admit? Y don't u tell me?

Ok. If the Bible has it why not show me?

salvation101:
how does me not knowing translate to the Bible not having? Are u telling me if u should ask someone with the proper knowledge (not like ur 5 men committee oo) there isn't a Hebrew word for it?

Oh, Pentecostal! The story is getting more interesting. What movement or genre of Pentecostalism are you?
Jehovah's Witnesses believe in the Bible, but does your full gospel include 1 John 5:7 in your Bible? We respect the Bible as the word of God and take time to read it and share the message in it.
You keep referring me to a Church, why not mention names of the particular Church. Mention names and I will make inquiry and return to you with answers if it is worth it.

If you are worried about the percentage, what is the cause of evil in the country?

salvation101:
i am a Pentecostal Christian and can never be ashamed of who i am. I believe in the full gospel of Christ and will recommend dat u attend any church dat believes in the full word of God and not look for excuses why d word shouldn't work for them. The mortality rate in Nigeria is high, is Nigeria even a Christian nation? Wat is the percentage of the population of the Christian community in d country. Wen evil prevail in the land, death wont be uncommon but those who are God's children can still hold on to d word of God in psalm 91.. Don't tell me u don't even believe God's promise in psalm 91.i believe it, claim it and its working for me and my household

salvation101:
in the beginning was the word and the word was with Theos a d the word was Theos, why do u change one Theos to mean God and the other to a god? Where is the article a coming from? U see dat alone gives it an entirely different meaning. The greek used the word Theos to refer to gods and goddesses. In d new testament, theos can be God or god,

this is why I said you are fighting a lost battle, at bold .

Theo's can mean god , so why the fuse are u angry with them , And besides they are not the only one who says the word was god , some other Bible versions also do that .


Now my question to you is , Why do u think its right to translate Theo's as god for we humans, but not for Jesus ?

(My Question 1 )

but where did ur article "a" come from? A dot or comma can entirely change the meaning of a sentence nd dat is wat u folks intended to achieve wen u added "a"

U only displayed ignorance here , sorry ... I want to ask you , if inserting the article " a " is so wrong , Why did many bible versions translate Theo's in Act 28 vs 6 saying Paul was " A god " ? including the KJV ? are they all wrong ?


( My question 2 )

The one that should be embarrassed here is you cos i revealed the identity of the folks ur society tried so much to conceal. Can u quote where i specifically associated with Kjv. U brot it up cos dats wat u av been trained to attack in ur ususal meetings u call Bible study. Wats d different between jws and mormons . Why are u more concerned about seeing a man who has been working miracle than u r about applying wat the scripture says about praying and receiving answers? Well for ur information, salvation101 believes the word of Jesus on asking and receiving and so i pray to God and av answers to my prayers. U seem to believe in magic but disbelieve miracles. To u, the power of the devil is more potent today than the power of God, u should go on ur knees right now and beg God for forgiveness. U av a form of godliness but deny the power, u will hold on to ur doctrine than wat d word of God says. Its evident that you do not av the person of the Holy spirit in ur midst as we know wat dat presence did in scriptures, and u will rather sit back to criticise those who believe the word and the word is working in them. Dis is the same word pentecostals believed few years ago and today u all are jealous of the growth rate. We Jesus is lifed up, He draws men unto himselt. For ur questions, u just want me to keep repeating myself huh?
In d case of john baptism, u er, not knowing d scripture nor the power of God. Do u believe in omni presence of God? Do u believe the same Holy Spirit that was working wit peter at Jerusalem was also working with paul in asia minor?

removetheturban:
I am stunned that you do not feel embarrassed to ask me such questions. You have been parsing the verses in JW's NWT and yet the log imported from Lebanon that you have in your eye does not ache you. Are you presenting yourself as ignorant of the insertions of heretical texts in your KJB?

I saw how you smartly wanted to disassociate yourself with the KJB when the heat got a little tough earlier on. You quickly shifted to ERV. That is how you will keep on until you disassociate yourself from the entire Bible versions. Loyalty is a virtue.

If you are not scared, why aren't you a forerunner in exposing the heresy in the KJB before smearing the JW? Why can't you present the name of the Church that you represent? Why can't you mention the name of your pastor or people with miraculous powers to heal?

I am glad that your voice has suddenly become subtle. You have finally unleashed your arsenal in the forum. Like I always say, you recycle the same questions when you meet a JW. You have mastered the art over time and you feel pumped to decimate any JW. It always begins with some bait questions to reel them into a trap and then you unleash your missile.

I usually meet your type face to face and we seldom have calm discussions from the Bible but the majority of them end up in aggressive speeches and insults when the heat becomes intense.
\

I will replay some of the questions that you think you escaped. You said that Jesus came to the earth leaving his Godship and took up flesh. You said that at his baptism the three Gods assembled to form the Trinity. You said that the Holy Spirit descended on him in the form of a dove (flesh).
So my questions are:

If 3 Gods assembled at his baptism, did he leave his Godship in heaven?
When the Holy Spirit descended in the form of a dove, did it leave its Godship in heaven?
What is the form of the Holy Spirit?
When Stephen looked up into the heaven before his death, how many persons did he see?
Did he say that they are the same person?
Jesus said that he would send the Holy Spirit and he did, has the Holy Spirit returned to heaven since then?


If you call the Catholics Heretics, why would you excuse the 55 man Committee?
Talking about idols, how about the pictures of your pastors on your walls and signboards?
How about the cross that you carry, what is it?


I will stop here for now.

removetheturban:
Ok. If the Bible has it why not show me?

u r very subtle my friend. U asked for the Hebrew word of God the Holy Spirit. U didn't ask me to show u from the bible did you? Dat was why u where saying the the word Rapture, trinity are wrong cos u can't find it in the Bible. Is the word choir or pulpit found in d Bible? Can u also tell me the Hebrew word for watch tower society or president?

Peacefullove:


this is why I said you are fighting a lost battle, at bold .

Theo's can mean god , so why the fuse are u angry with them , And besides they are not the only one who says the word was god , some other Bible versions also do that .


Now my question to you is , Why do u think its right to translate Theo's as god for we humans, but not for Jesus ?

(My Question 1 )




U only displayed ignorance here , sorry ... I want to ask you , if inserting the article " a " is so wrong , Why did many bible versions translate Theo's in Act 28 vs 6 saying Paul was " A god " ? including the KJV ? are they all wrong ?


( My question 2 )

good, let me assume u are right calling Jesus a god, den why do u refute the presence of Jesus in Gen 1? Why did u argue against the plurality of the God there? Cos according to this book of john, without Jesus was nothing anything made dat was made. Do u agree dat Jesus was present there with God in Gen 1? Do u also agree that the Holy Spirit was present?

In d book of acts u quoted, did paul agree that he was a god? Wat was is reaction after the ignorance displayed by the ppl in calling him a god?

Nothing about us is secret. We are out there on the open street. If you demand, you may even receive that particular book that you think is a secret. The book is called 'reasoning from the scriptures'. It contains a resume of many topics. It helps us to gain an introduction when we go out to preach. Not all JW have it or use it when they go out to preach. It aids to Bible verses and helps us remember some presentations. It also assists some persons who are nervous or shy to build a good presentation. For example, how to greet and 'introduce' a subject. There are different topics in it we are not forced to use it in when we preach. I used to use it years ago when I do personal research at home but since the internet came, I have been doing most of my researches online.
We give everything out for consumption. Jehovah's Witnesses' publications are all for public consumption.
We will get down to the T subsequently.

The other time, you chagrinned and then denied calling heresy what it is. You said that the 55 man committee of puritans made a "mistake". The mistake that the original copy did not have. The mistake that took 7 years to fabricate. The mistake that 55 'educated' Puritans did not spot out in 7 years. Those 55 men could have been drinking red wine all along those 7 years. My dear, we both know that wasn't a mistake. Just say the word. They tried to twist the Bible. If the mistake appeared in the original written by Tyndale, it would have been conceivable to a certain pedigree. Nevertheless, this is a concrete proof that your revered 55 Puritans are misleading. You could be making the same mistake as the 55 puritans today but if you give it an open thought, you might see where you are getting it wrong.

Jehovah's Witnesses endeavour to follow the steps of Jesus and the words in the Bible. We are not enemies or threats to anyone but the attacks and hate we get are just outstanding to imagine.

salvation101:
jw is not new to me, i av known u guys since i was a kid nd av friends among u. Even wen u go out to preach, its not just the Bible u hold, u av smaller books u read from on almost any topic. Yep i know ur society does alot of job to indoctrinate u folks and u guys are really committed (so are the Muslims).. Even a lie wen it is told repeatedly begins t9 sound like d truth. Even if the kjv isn't perfect, I'd still trust it over ur nwt.

removetheturban:
Nothing about us is secret. We are out there on the open street. If you demand, you may even receive that particular book that you think is a secret. The book is called 'reasoning from the scriptures'. It contains a resume of many topics. It helps us to gain an introduction when we go out to preach. Not all JW have it or use it when they go out to preach. It aids to Bible verses and helps us remember some presentations. It also assists some persons who are nervous or shy to build a good presentation. For example, how to greet and 'introduce' a subject. There are different topics in it we are not forced to use it in when we preach. I used to use it years ago when I do personal research at home but since the internet came, I have been doing most of my researches online.
We give everything out for consumption. Jehovah's Witnesses' publications are all for public consumption.
We will get down to the T subsequently.

The other time, you chagrinned and then denied calling heresy what it is. You said that the 55 man committee of puritans made a "mistake". The mistake that the original copy did not have. The mistake that took 7 years to fabricate. The mistake that 55 'educated' Puritans did not spot out in 7 years. Those 55 men could have been drinking red wine all along those 7 years. My dear, we both know that wasn't a mistake. Just say the word. They tried to twist the Bible. If the mistake appeared in the original written by Tyndale, it would have been conceivable to a certain pedigree. Nevertheless, this is a concrete proof that your revered 55 Puritans are misleading. You could be making the same mistake as the 55 puritans today but if you give it an open thought, you might see where you are getting it wrong.

Jehovah's Witnesses endeavour to follow the steps of Jesus and the words in the Bible. We are not enemies or threats to anyone but the attacks and hate we get are just outstanding to imagine.

very interesting, the reference materials u use, were dey not written by ppl or ur 5 man committee Bible? Why den do u av a problem with 55 puritans u keep repeating? Av u done ur researches on the errors in my Erv version bible? Am patiently waiting for it. Why u come dey attach kjv to me na? Wen u asked me a question i answered directly but u still look for a way to attach kjv to me(or maybe watchtower society hasn't published an article spotting the errors in Erv yet, ill waait patiently for it)..