Salam dear brothers and sisters in Islam,

i found this forum and i was disgusted to read the rude posts made against islam and our beloeved Prophet (sa) in the other religion forum.i therefore joined to defend islam and the Prophet (sa) against the rude talk and baseless lies.

in this regards of bringing the fact to light,i am also aware that there is alot of misinformation among sunni muslims regarding their shia muslim brothers.as sunnis,i would like to know from you what you know about shia islam,the Ahlul-Bayt (as),Imam Hussain(as) and the battle of karbala,or what would you like to know?

if there is any shia in the forum,it would also be a pleasure to have him contribute.

Bi Amanillah!!!

Hello brother in Islam.I'm not a Shia But a muslim.So i just wanna make 2 correction to what u have just said here.Is it Only Shia that can defend Islam or prophet Muhammed when it comes to things like this? or Sunni can also contribute?
This has always been the misconception by some muslim worldwide.Why can't we just agreed we re all the same nd leave the discrimination out of this kind of issues.
Secondly :I would advise u to always work or preaching Islam to our people and not to compete or contend with them whenever they post ,With aim of changing their mind.No that doesn't work here .otherwise u ll have the Moderator banning you everytime.
It's Fi Amanillah!!!

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran   Irak  Bahrain  and  Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities  in  India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya  and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis  and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered  Muslims by Sunni  Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the  celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

D-sense:

Hello brother in Islam.I'm not a Shia But a muslim.So i just wanna make 2 correction to what u have just said here.Is it Only Shia that can defend Islam or prophet Muhammed when it comes to things like this? or Sunni can also contribute?
This has always been the misconception by some muslim worldwide.Why can't we just agreed we re all the same nd leave the discrimination out of this kind of issues.
Secondly :I would advise u to always work or preaching Islam to our people and not to compete or contend with them whenever they post ,With aim of changing their mind.No that doesn't work here .otherwise u ll have the Moderator banning you everytime.
It's Fi Amanillah!!!

ofcourse,i'm not saying only shia can defend the religion.it is the responsibility and duty of every muslim,sunni and shia,to defend the religion.take for example when the cartoons of the Prophet (sa) were published the denmark.both the shia and sunni were united and stood firm to condemn and defend the Prophet (sa).


am not seeking the moderator to ban me.but if he does,i think he must first do the same to those who mock and laugh with the nonsense and lies they post against islam.if he wants to target me for doing the right thing,replying,then in the first place i dont need to be here.when we are talkin about falsehood and lies,we must be fair enough and tolerant to face the reality to discover and read where the lies are.you cannot preach islam first when there are people who make it their job to ensure that they tarnish the image of the religion and its Prophet.no matter how good your religion is,you cannot win anyone if there are bad things which are left unanswered.the lies and misconceptions must be cleared.also if you cannot convince them that the lies and falsehood lie on their own side,then they would not see the need to change and appreciate islam.

FIRST OF ALL PLEASE WATCH THIS VERY IMPORTANT VIDEO ON YOUTUBE TITLED "WHO ARE THE RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHS":


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77A8g8hXCFU

zubeyr:

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran Irak Bahrain and Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities in India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

[population of shia muslims in the world[/b]

shia muslims are a majority in iran,iraq,bahrain and azerbaijan and the largest community making about 40% of lebanon's population.saudi arabia,kuwait,pakistan,turkey,syria,afghanistan and india have siginificant minorities.
In yemen,the zaidis who make up about half the population are an off-shoot of shia islam just like the ahmadiyya or wahhabis are to sunni islam.
The shia branch of islam itself,is one of two branches of the religion.as a muslim,you either fall under the sunni branch of islam or under the shia branch of islam.there maybe exceptions like the ibadis of oman who fall on neither side of the two branches.

WHO ARE THE 12 SHIA IMAMS

Note:the term “Ahlul-bayt” means “the people of the household of the Prophet Muhammad”.




The shia venerate 12 Imams from the decendants of the Prophet.the first is Ali Ibn Abi Taleb,husband of Fatima,the Prophet’s daughter and the second is Hassan,the grandson of the Prophet and the son of Ali and Fatima.the third is HUSSAIN,the brother of Hassan.

The remaining nine are decendants of Hussain.they are:
4.) Ali son of Hussain (known as Zaynul-abideen)
5.)Muhammad son Ali-Zaynul abideen (known as al-baqir)
6.) Ja’far son of al-Baqir (known as al-sadeq)
7.) Musa son of al-sadeq (known as al-kazem)
8.) Ali son of all-kazem (known as al-rida)
9.) Muhammad son of al-rida (known as al-jawad)
10) Ali son of al-jawad (known as al-hadi)
11.) Hassan son of al-hadi (known as al-askariy)
12.) Muhammad son of al-askariy (known as al-Mahdi).he is the 12th and final imam for humanity and he is the awaited imam,whose reapperance is awaited.ever since his birth he has being in ghaibah (not present public) out of persecution as all his forefathers were either killed or poisoned.both sunnis and shia believe that the Mahdi would be a decendant of the Prophet Muhammad and that he will come shortly before Jesus returns.the sunnis however do not believe he has being born while the shia believe he is the 12 imam.

The Prophet Muhammad is believed to have prophesied that 12 khalifa (sucessors) will rule the muslim ummah.the hadith is present in the sahih books of sunnis:

Sahih Bukhari89.329:
Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."
Sahih Muslim : Book 020: Number 4477, 4478, 4480, 4481, 4482, 4483:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "The (Islamic) religion will continue until the Hour (day of resurrection), having twelve Caliphs for you, all of them will be from Quraysh.”

Sunan Abu Dawood : Book 36: Number 4266


The Prophet said: "This religion remains standing until there are twelve vicegerents over you, all of them agreeable to the nation, all of them from Quraysh."

Sunan al-Tirmidhi (Arabic) Chapter of Fitan,
2:45 (India) and 4:501 Tradition # 2225 (Egypt)
Hadith #2149 (numbering of al-'Alamiyyah)
The Prophet said: "There will be after me twelve Amir (Prince/Ruler), all of them from Quraysh."

Musnad-e-Ahmad, vol 1, pg 398

Masrooq relates that someone asked Abdullah Ibn Masood, "O Abaa Abd al-Rahmaan, did you ask the Messenger of Allah how many caliphs will rule this nation?". Abdullah Ibn Masood replied, "Yes, we did ask the Messenger of Allah and he replied, "Twelve, like the number of chiefs (nuqabaa) of Bani Israel"" [


Brother zubeyr says:

we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders

DOES THE SUCCESSION OF 12 IMAMS THE SAME THING AS HEREDITARY RULE?AND CAN IT HAVE A BASIS IN THE QURAN?

it is suprising to hear the above words coming out from a muslim who is believed to have read the holy Quran!

Lo! Allah preferred Adam and Noah and the Family of Abraham and the Family of 'Imran above (all His) creatures. (33) They were descendants one of another. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (34)(Holy Quran 3:33-34)

When Allah (swt) has chosen a people for the delieverance and protection of His message and exalting them above others,that is not the same thing as hereditary rule based on blood line or racial superiority.Allah cleanse a people and give them knowledge and purity.it also really amazing to see that it is the sunni countries where monarchy and emirs prevail.when the shia follow the imams of Ahlul-Bayt,they believe that they do so because Allah has ordered them to do so and the Prophet declared Ali as the khalifa (not abu bakr).therefore the shia do no see it as upholding hereditary rule but rather following divine sucession.


Brother Zubeyr says:

Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

When one referes to the word shia,he is more often than not talking about the Twelvers or those who believe in 12 imams.when one uses the term sunni,he is more often than not refering to the followers of the shafi,maliki,hanbali and hanafi jurisprudence.these are already four schools of thought within sunni islam.if one comes and ask you,which sect of sunni islam do you follow that is not real.the ahmadiyya, and wahhabis/salafis do exist but that does not make them prevail over others.

The word “shia” means partisan.the full word is shiat Ali or the party of Ali as opposed to sunnis,the followers of abu bakr and co.the fundamental of the shia that makes it distinct from any sect is the imamat.the zaydis for example have lost touch with shiism because imamat does not play a role as an institution.to them,they recognize the first 4 imams listed above and then what: anyone who is a decendant of Ali can be imam.that should not be so.only a select by God and the Prophet can be imam.so zaydis do have an attachment to shiism but do not represent mainstream shiism.you’d find that over centuries of poor scholarship and bad living conditions,they today are getting nearer to shia fiqh practiced by the followers of 12 imams.

As for the ismailis and nusayris one cannot disregard them as non-muslims.we shia (followers of twelve imams) do admit that the ismailis are misguided and father from the truth.we cannot disregard them and consider them as non-muslim like sunnis do because anyone who says the two testimonies of faith (there is no go but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah) is muslim.ofcourse ismailis do not pray,fast and practice as the shia and sunnis do.

As for the nusayris,one can hardly know their beliefs.it is hard to say.some people have said they perform shirk by considering Ali as a “god” like the christians consider Jesus.they sometimes deny that.i can say their beliefs are kept secret and therefore no need to even bother because the truth is clear.

As for me,I am shia and I do recognize 12 imams and I do believe Ali is the first of them the Prophet declared and he is the immediate successor of the Prophet by diivine order as witnessed in the farewell sermon of the Prophet when he was returning from the last/farewell pilgrimage at a place called ghadir-khum in present day saudi arabia.


Also in the above,you said the shia imams attempt to convert sunnis to their school of thought.our imams are not present to day except for the 12th who is in ghaibah and is expected to return as the Mahdi,who however sunnis believe in him too.our imams guided the ummah from the knowledge given to them by Allah and what they inherited from Ali and the Prophet Muhammad (sa).your statement is therefore not rightly stated.

As for abu bakr and aisha,we do have our position on them.but we are not expected to deleve into what will create disunity between muslims.i will not curse or insult them for the greater good of islam.however when it comes to beliefs we do believe that abu bakr usurped the caliphate.we also do not like aisha because of her jealous to the family of the Prophet Muhammad.for example the Prophet had warned her about the battle of Jamal but she still sent ahead and rode a mule to fight against Ali.she prevented Hassan,the grandson of the Propher,from being buried close to his grandfather,the Prophet Muhammad.

I will contain myself with these.any further question will be answered.

FIRST PLEASE WATCH THIS VERY IMPORTANT VIDEO ON YOUTUBE TITLES "WHO ARE THE RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHS":


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LClhbzuhvdo&playnext=1&list=PLA1055483335A4460&index=31

zubeyr:

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran Irak Bahrain and Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities in India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

population of shia muslims in the world

shia muslims are a majority in iran,iraq,bahrain and azerbaijan and the largest community making about 40% of lebanon's population.saudi arabia,kuwait,pakistan,turkey,syria,afghanistan and india have siginificant minorities.
In yemen,the zaidis who make up about half the population are an off-shoot of shia islam just like the ahmadiyya or wahhabis are to sunni islam.
The shia branch of islam itself,is one of two branches of the religion.as a muslim,you either fall under the sunni branch of islam or under the shia branch of islam.there maybe exceptions like the ibadis of oman who fall on neither side of the two branches.

WHO ARE THE 12 SHIA IMAMS

Note:the term “Ahlul-bayt” means “the people of the household of the Prophet Muhammad”.




The shia venerate 12 Imams from the decendants of the Prophet.the first is Ali Ibn Abi Taleb,husband of Fatima,the Prophet’s daughter and the second is Hassan,the grandson of the Prophet and the son of Ali and Fatima.the third is HUSSAIN,the brother of Hassan.

The remaining nine are decendants of Hussain.they are:
4.) Ali son of Hussain (known as Zaynul-abideen)
5.)Muhammad son Ali-Zaynul abideen (known as al-baqir)
6.) Ja’far son of al-Baqir (known as al-sadeq)
7.) Musa son of al-sadeq (known as al-kazem)
8.) Ali son of all-kazem (known as al-rida)
9.) Muhammad son of al-rida (known as al-jawad)
10) Ali son of al-jawad (known as al-hadi)
11.) Hassan son of al-hadi (known as al-askariy)
12.) Muhammad son of al-askariy (known as al-Mahdi).he is the 12th and final imam for humanity and he is the awaited imam,whose reapperance is awaited.ever since his birth he has being in ghaibah (not present public) out of persecution as all his forefathers were either killed or poisoned.both sunnis and shia believe that the Mahdi would be a decendant of the Prophet Muhammad and that he will come shortly before Jesus returns.the sunnis however do not believe he has being born while the shia believe he is the 12 imam.

The Prophet Muhammad is believed to have prophesied that 12 khalifa (sucessors) will rule the muslim ummah.the hadith is present in the sahih books of sunnis:

Sahih Bukhari89.329:
Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."
Sahih Muslim : Book 020: Number 4477, 4478, 4480, 4481, 4482, 4483:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "The (Islamic) religion will continue until the Hour (day of resurrection), having twelve Caliphs for you, all of them will be from Quraysh.”

Sunan Abu Dawood : Book 36: Number 4266


The Prophet said: "This religion remains standing until there are twelve vicegerents over you, all of them agreeable to the nation, all of them from Quraysh."

Sunan al-Tirmidhi (Arabic) Chapter of Fitan,
2:45 (India) and 4:501 Tradition # 2225 (Egypt)
Hadith #2149 (numbering of al-'Alamiyyah)
The Prophet said: "There will be after me twelve Amir (Prince/Ruler), all of them from Quraysh."

Musnad-e-Ahmad, vol 1, pg 398

Masrooq relates that someone asked Abdullah Ibn Masood, "O Abaa Abd al-Rahmaan, did you ask the Messenger of Allah how many caliphs will rule this nation?". Abdullah Ibn Masood replied, "Yes, we did ask the Messenger of Allah and he replied, "Twelve, like the number of chiefs (nuqabaa) of Bani Israel"" [


Brother zubeyr says:

we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders

DOES THE SUCCESSION OF 12 IMAMS THE SAME THING AS HEREDITARY RULE?AND CAN IT HAVE A BASIS IN THE QURAN?

it is suprising to hear the above words coming out from a muslim who is believed to have read the holy Quran!

Lo! Allah preferred Adam and Noah and the Family of Abraham and the Family of 'Imran above (all His) creatures. (33) They were descendants one of another. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (34)(Holy Quran 3:33-34)

When Allah (swt) has chosen a people for the delieverance and protection of His message and exalting them above others,that is not the same thing as hereditary rule based on blood line or racial superiority.Allah cleanse a people and give them knowledge and purity.it also really amazing to see that it is the sunni countries where monarchy and emirs prevail.when the shia follow the imams of Ahlul-Bayt,they believe that they do so because Allah has ordered them to do so and the Prophet declared Ali as the khalifa (not abu bakr).therefore the shia do no see it as upholding hereditary rule but rather following divine sucession.


Brother Zubeyr says:

Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

When one referes to the word shia,he is more often than not talking about the Twelvers or those who believe in 12 imams.when one uses the term sunni,he is more often than not refering to the followers of the shafi,maliki,hanbali and hanafi jurisprudence.these are already four schools of thought within sunni islam.if one comes and ask you,which sect of sunni islam do you follow that is not real.the ahmadiyya, and wahhabis/salafis do exist but that does not make them prevail over others.

The word “shia” means partisan.the full word is shiat Ali or the party of Ali as opposed to sunnis,the followers of abu bakr and co.the fundamental of the shia that makes it distinct from any sect is the imamat.the zaydis for example have lost touch with shiism because imamat does not play a role as an institution.to them,they recognize the first 4 imams listed above and then what: anyone who is a decendant of Ali can be imam.that should not be so.only a select by God and the Prophet can be imam.so zaydis do have an attachment to shiism but do not represent mainstream shiism.you’d find that over centuries of poor scholarship and bad living conditions,they today are getting nearer to shia fiqh practiced by the followers of 12 imams.

As for the ismailis and nusayris one cannot disregard them as non-muslims.we shia (followers of twelve imams) do admit that the ismailis are misguided and father from the truth.we cannot disregard them and consider them as non-muslim like sunnis do because anyone who says the two testimonies of faith (there is no go but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah) is muslim.ofcourse ismailis do not pray,fast and practice as the shia and sunnis do.

As for the nusayris,one can hardly know their beliefs.it is hard to say.some people have said they perform shirk by considering Ali as a “god” like the christians consider Jesus.they sometimes deny that.i can say their beliefs are kept secret and therefore no need to even bother because the truth is clear.

As for me,I am shia and I do recognize 12 imams and I do believe Ali is the first of them the Prophet declared and he is the immediate successor of the Prophet by diivine order as witnessed in the farewell sermon of the Prophet when he was returning from the last/farewell pilgrimage at a place called ghadir-khum in present day saudi arabia.


Also in the above,you said the shia imams attempt to convert sunnis to their school of thought.our imams are not present to day except for the 12th who is in ghaibah and is expected to return as the Mahdi,who however sunnis believe in him too.our imams guided the ummah from the knowledge given to them by Allah and what they inherited from Ali and the Prophet Muhammad (sa).your statement is therefore not rightly stated.

As for abu bakr and aisha,we do have our position on them.but we are not expected to deleve into what will create disunity between muslims.i will not curse or insult them for the greater good of islam.however when it comes to beliefs we do believe that abu bakr usurped the caliphate.we also do not like aisha because of her jealous to the family of the Prophet Muhammad.for example the Prophet had warned her about the battle of Jamal but she still sent ahead and rode a mule to fight against Ali.she prevented Hassan,the grandson of the Propher,from being buried close to his grandfather,the Prophet Muhammad.

I will contain myself with these.any further question will be answered.

FIRST PLEASE WATCH THIS IMPORTANT VIDEO TITLED "WHO ARE THE RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHS":


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LClhbzuhvdo&playnext=1&list=PLA1055483335A4460&index=31

zubeyr:

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran Irak Bahrain and Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities in India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

population of shia muslims in the world

shia muslims are a majority in iran,iraq,bahrain and azerbaijan and the largest community making about 40% of lebanon's population.saudi arabia,kuwait,pakistan,turkey,syria,afghanistan and india have siginificant minorities.
In yemen,the zaidis who make up about half the population are an off-shoot of shia islam just like the ahmadiyya or wahhabis are to sunni islam.
The shia branch of islam itself,is one of two branches of the religion.as a muslim,you either fall under the sunni branch of islam or under the shia branch of islam.there maybe exceptions like the ibadis of oman who fall on neither side of the two branches.

WHO ARE THE 12 SHIA IMAMS

Note:the term “Ahlul-bayt” means “the people of the household of the Prophet Muhammad”.




The shia venerate 12 Imams from the decendants of the Prophet.the first is Ali Ibn Abi Taleb,husband of Fatima,the Prophet’s daughter and the second is Hassan,the grandson of the Prophet and the son of Ali and Fatima.the third is HUSSAIN,the brother of Hassan.

The remaining nine are decendants of Hussain.they are:
4.) Ali son of Hussain (known as Zaynul-abideen)
5.)Muhammad son Ali-Zaynul abideen (known as al-baqir)
6.) Ja’far son of al-Baqir (known as al-sadeq)
7.) Musa son of al-sadeq (known as al-kazem)
8.) Ali son of all-kazem (known as al-rida)
9.) Muhammad son of al-rida (known as al-jawad)
10) Ali son of al-jawad (known as al-hadi)
11.) Hassan son of al-hadi (known as al-askariy)
12.) Muhammad son of al-askariy (known as al-Mahdi).he is the 12th and final imam for humanity and he is the awaited imam,whose reapperance is awaited.ever since his birth he has being in ghaibah (not present public) out of persecution as all his forefathers were either killed or poisoned.both sunnis and shia believe that the Mahdi would be a decendant of the Prophet Muhammad and that he will come shortly before Jesus returns.the sunnis however do not believe he has being born while the shia believe he is the 12 imam.

The Prophet Muhammad is believed to have prophesied that 12 khalifa (sucessors) will rule the muslim ummah.the hadith is present in the sahih books of sunnis:

Sahih Bukhari89.329:
Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."
Sahih Muslim : Book 020: Number 4477, 4478, 4480, 4481, 4482, 4483:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "The (Islamic) religion will continue until the Hour (day of resurrection), having twelve Caliphs for you, all of them will be from Quraysh.”

Sunan Abu Dawood : Book 36: Number 4266


The Prophet said: "This religion remains standing until there are twelve vicegerents over you, all of them agreeable to the nation, all of them from Quraysh."

Sunan al-Tirmidhi (Arabic) Chapter of Fitan,
2:45 (India) and 4:501 Tradition # 2225 (Egypt)
Hadith #2149 (numbering of al-'Alamiyyah)
The Prophet said: "There will be after me twelve Amir (Prince/Ruler), all of them from Quraysh."

Musnad-e-Ahmad, vol 1, pg 398

Masrooq relates that someone asked Abdullah Ibn Masood, "O Abaa Abd al-Rahmaan, did you ask the Messenger of Allah how many caliphs will rule this nation?". Abdullah Ibn Masood replied, "Yes, we did ask the Messenger of Allah and he replied, "Twelve, like the number of chiefs (nuqabaa) of Bani Israel"" [


Brother zubeyr says:

we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders

DOES THE SUCCESSION OF 12 IMAMS THE SAME THING AS HEREDITARY RULE?AND CAN IT HAVE A BASIS IN THE QURAN?

it is suprising to hear the above words coming out from a muslim who is believed to have read the holy Quran!

Lo! Allah preferred Adam and Noah and the Family of Abraham and the Family of 'Imran above (all His) creatures. (33) They were descendants one of another. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (34)(Holy Quran 3:33-34)

When Allah (swt) has chosen a people for the delieverance and protection of His message and exalting them above others,that is not the same thing as hereditary rule based on blood line or racial superiority.Allah cleanse a people and give them knowledge and purity.it also really amazing to see that it is the sunni countries where monarchy and emirs prevail.when the shia follow the imams of Ahlul-Bayt,they believe that they do so because Allah has ordered them to do so and the Prophet declared Ali as the khalifa (not abu bakr).therefore the shia do no see it as upholding hereditary rule but rather following divine sucession.


Brother Zubeyr says:

Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

When one referes to the word shia,he is more often than not talking about the Twelvers or those who believe in 12 imams.when one uses the term sunni,he is more often than not refering to the followers of the shafi,maliki,hanbali and hanafi jurisprudence.these are already four schools of thought within sunni islam.if one comes and ask you,which sect of sunni islam do you follow that is not real.the ahmadiyya, and wahhabis/salafis do exist but that does not make them prevail over others.

The word “shia” means partisan.the full word is shiat Ali or the party of Ali as opposed to sunnis,the followers of abu bakr and co.the fundamental of the shia that makes it distinct from any sect is the imamat.the zaydis for example have lost touch with shiism because imamat does not play a role as an institution.to them,they recognize the first 4 imams listed above and then what: anyone who is a decendant of Ali can be imam.that should not be so.only a select by God and the Prophet can be imam.so zaydis do have an attachment to shiism but do not represent mainstream shiism.you’d find that over centuries of poor scholarship and bad living conditions,they today are getting nearer to shia fiqh practiced by the followers of 12 imams.

As for the ismailis and nusayris one cannot disregard them as non-muslims.we shia (followers of twelve imams) do admit that the ismailis are misguided and father from the truth.we cannot disregard them and consider them as non-muslim like sunnis do because anyone who says the two testimonies of faith (there is no go but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah) is muslim.ofcourse ismailis do not pray,fast and practice as the shia and sunnis do.

As for the nusayris,one can hardly know their beliefs.it is hard to say.some people have said they perform shirk by considering Ali as a “god” like the christians consider Jesus.they sometimes deny that.i can say their beliefs are kept secret and therefore no need to even bother because the truth is clear.

As for me,I am shia and I do recognize 12 imams and I do believe Ali is the first of them the Prophet declared and he is the immediate successor of the Prophet by diivine order as witnessed in the farewell sermon of the Prophet when he was returning from the last/farewell pilgrimage at a place called ghadir-khum in present day saudi arabia.


Also in the above,you said the shia imams attempt to convert sunnis to their school of thought.our imams are not present to day except for the 12th who is in ghaibah and is expected to return as the Mahdi,who however sunnis believe in him too.our imams guided the ummah from the knowledge given to them by Allah and what they inherited from Ali and the Prophet Muhammad (sa).your statement is therefore not rightly stated.

As for abu bakr and aisha,we do have our position on them.but we are not expected to deleve into what will create disunity between muslims.i will not curse or insult them for the greater good of islam.however when it comes to beliefs we do believe that abu bakr usurped the caliphate.we also do not like aisha because of her jealous to the family of the Prophet Muhammad.for example the Prophet had warned her about the battle of Jamal but she still sent ahead and rode a mule to fight against Ali.she prevented Hassan,the grandson of the Propher,from being buried close to his grandfather,the Prophet Muhammad.

I will contain myself with these.any further question will be answered.

Why and who is deleting my post? my reply to brother Zubeyr was deleted 3 times!!!

PLEASE FIRST WATCH THIS VERY IMPORTANT VIDEO TITLED: “WHO ARE THE RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHS”:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LClhbzuhvdo&playnext=1&list=PLA1055483335A4460&index=31

zubeyr:

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran Irak Bahrain and Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities in India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

population of shia muslims in the world

shia muslims are a majority in iran,iraq,bahrain and azerbaijan and the largest community making about 40% of lebanon's population.saudi arabia,kuwait,pakistan,turkey,syria,afghanistan and india have siginificant minorities.
In yemen,the zaidis who make up about half the population are an off-shoot of shia islam just like the ahmadiyya or wahhabis are to sunni islam.
The shia branch of islam itself,is one of two branches of the religion.as a muslim,you either fall under the sunni branch of islam or under the shia branch of islam.there maybe exceptions like the ibadis of oman who fall on neither side of the two branches.

WHO ARE THE 12 SHIA IMAMS

Note:the term “Ahlul-bayt” means “the people of the household of the Prophet Muhammad”.




The shia venerate 12 Imams from the decendants of the Prophet.the first is Ali Ibn Abi Taleb,husband of Fatima,the Prophet’s daughter and the second is Hassan,the grandson of the Prophet and the son of Ali and Fatima.the third is HUSSAIN,the brother of Hassan.

The remaining nine are decendants of Hussain.they are:
4.) Ali son of Hussain (known as Zaynul-abideen)
5.)Muhammad son Ali-Zaynul abideen (known as al-baqir)
6.) Ja’far son of al-Baqir (known as al-sadeq)
7.) Musa son of al-sadeq (known as al-kazem)
8.) Ali son of all-kazem (known as al-rida)
9.) Muhammad son of al-rida (known as al-jawad)
10) Ali son of al-jawad (known as al-hadi)
11.) Hassan son of al-hadi (known as al-askariy)
12.) Muhammad son of al-askariy (known as al-Mahdi).he is the 12th and final imam for humanity and he is the awaited imam,whose reapperance is awaited.ever since his birth he has being in ghaibah (not present public) out of persecution as all his forefathers were either killed or poisoned.both sunnis and shia believe that the Mahdi would be a decendant of the Prophet Muhammad and that he will come shortly before Jesus returns.the sunnis however do not believe he has being born while the shia believe he is the 12 imam.

The Prophet Muhammad is believed to have prophesied that 12 khalifa (sucessors) will rule the muslim ummah.the hadith is present in the sahih books of sunnis:

Sahih Bukhari89.329:
Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."
Sahih Muslim : Book 020: Number 4477, 4478, 4480, 4481, 4482, 4483:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "The (Islamic) religion will continue until the Hour (day of resurrection), having twelve Caliphs for you, all of them will be from Quraysh.”

Sunan Abu Dawood : Book 36: Number 4266


The Prophet said: "This religion remains standing until there are twelve vicegerents over you, all of them agreeable to the nation, all of them from Quraysh."

Sunan al-Tirmidhi (Arabic) Chapter of Fitan,
2:45 (India) and 4:501 Tradition # 2225 (Egypt)
Hadith #2149 (numbering of al-'Alamiyyah)
The Prophet said: "There will be after me twelve Amir (Prince/Ruler), all of them from Quraysh."

Musnad-e-Ahmad, vol 1, pg 398

Masrooq relates that someone asked Abdullah Ibn Masood, "O Abaa Abd al-Rahmaan, did you ask the Messenger of Allah how many caliphs will rule this nation?". Abdullah Ibn Masood replied, "Yes, we did ask the Messenger of Allah and he replied, "Twelve, like the number of chiefs (nuqabaa) of Bani Israel"" [


Brother zubeyr says:

we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders

DOES THE SUCCESSION OF 12 IMAMS THE SAME THING AS HEREDITARY RULE?AND CAN IT HAVE A BASIS IN THE QURAN?

it is suprising to hear the above words coming out from a muslim who is believed to have read the holy Quran!

Lo! Allah preferred Adam and Noah and the Family of Abraham and the Family of 'Imran above (all His) creatures. (33) They were descendants one of another. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (34)(Holy Quran 3:33-34)

When Allah (swt) has chosen a people for the delieverance and protection of His message and exalting them above others,that is not the same thing as hereditary rule based on blood line or racial superiority.Allah cleanse a people and give them knowledge and purity.it also really amazing to see that it is the sunni countries where monarchy and emirs prevail.when the shia follow the imams of Ahlul-Bayt,they believe that they do so because Allah has ordered them to do so and the Prophet declared Ali as the khalifa (not abu bakr).therefore the shia do no see it as upholding hereditary rule but rather following divine sucession.


Brother Zubeyr says:

Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

When one referes to the word shia,he is more often than not talking about the Twelvers or those who believe in 12 imams.when one uses the term sunni,he is more often than not refering to the followers of the shafi,maliki,hanbali and hanafi jurisprudence.these are already four schools of thought within sunni islam.if one comes and ask you,which sect of sunni islam do you follow that is not real.the ahmadiyya, and wahhabis/salafis do exist but that does not make them prevail over others.

The word “shia” means partisan.the full word is shiat Ali or the party of Ali as opposed to sunnis,the followers of abu bakr and co.the fundamental of the shia that makes it distinct from any sect is the imamat.the zaydis for example have lost touch with shiism because imamat does not play a role as an institution.to them,they recognize the first 4 imams listed above and then what: anyone who is a decendant of Ali can be imam.that should not be so.only a select by God and the Prophet can be imam.so zaydis do have an attachment to shiism but do not represent mainstream shiism.you’d find that over centuries of poor scholarship and bad living conditions,they today are getting nearer to shia fiqh practiced by the followers of 12 imams.

As for the ismailis and nusayris one cannot disregard them as non-muslims.we shia (followers of twelve imams) do admit that the ismailis are misguided and father from the truth.we cannot disregard them and consider them as non-muslim like sunnis do because anyone who says the two testimonies of faith (there is no go but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah) is muslim.ofcourse ismailis do not pray,fast and practice as the shia and sunnis do.

As for the nusayris,one can hardly know their beliefs.it is hard to say.some people have said they perform shirk by considering Ali as a “god” like the christians consider Jesus.they sometimes deny that.i can say their beliefs are kept secret and therefore no need to even bother because the truth is clear.

As for me,I am shia and I do recognize 12 imams and I do believe Ali is the first of them the Prophet declared and he is the immediate successor of the Prophet by diivine order as witnessed in the farewell sermon of the Prophet when he was returning from the last/farewell pilgrimage at a place called ghadir-khum in present day saudi arabia.


Also in the above,you said the shia imams attempt to convert sunnis to their school of thought.our imams are not present to day except for the 12th who is in ghaibah and is expected to return as the Mahdi,who however sunnis believe in him too.our imams guided the ummah from the knowledge given to them by Allah and what they inherited from Ali and the Prophet Muhammad (sa).your statement is therefore not rightly stated.

As for abu bakr and aisha,we do have our position on them.but we are not expected to deleve into what will create disunity between muslims.i will not curse or insult them for the greater good of islam.however when it comes to beliefs we do believe that abu bakr usurped the caliphate.we also do not like aisha because of her jealous to the family of the Prophet Muhammad.for example the Prophet had warned her about the battle of Jamal but she still sent ahead and rode a mule to fight against Ali.she prevented Hassan,the grandson of the Propher,from being buried close to his grandfather,the Prophet Muhammad.

I will contain myself with these.any further question will be answered.

PLEASE FIRST WATCH THIS VERY IMPORTANT VIDEO TITLED: “WHO ARE THE RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHS”:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LClhbzuhvdo&playnext=1&list=PLA1055483335A4460&index=31

zubeyr:

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran Irak Bahrain and Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities in India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

population of shia muslims in the world

shia muslims are a majority in iran,iraq,bahrain and azerbaijan and the largest community making about 40% of lebanon's population.saudi arabia,kuwait,pakistan,turkey,syria,afghanistan and india have siginificant minorities.
In yemen,the zaidis who make up about half the population are an off-shoot of shia islam just like the ahmadiyya or wahhabis are to sunni islam.
The shia branch of islam itself,is one of two branches of the religion.as a muslim,you either fall under the sunni branch of islam or under the shia branch of islam.there maybe exceptions like the ibadis of oman who fall on neither side of the two branches.

WHO ARE THE 12 SHIA IMAMS

Note:the term “Ahlul-bayt” means “the people of the household of the Prophet Muhammad”.




The shia venerate 12 Imams from the decendants of the Prophet.the first is Ali Ibn Abi Taleb,husband of Fatima,the Prophet’s daughter and the second is Hassan,the grandson of the Prophet and the son of Ali and Fatima.the third is HUSSAIN,the brother of Hassan.

The remaining nine are decendants of Hussain.they are:
4.) Ali son of Hussain (known as Zaynul-abideen)
5.)Muhammad son Ali-Zaynul abideen (known as al-baqir)
6.) Ja’far son of al-Baqir (known as al-sadeq)
7.) Musa son of al-sadeq (known as al-kazem)
8.) Ali son of all-kazem (known as al-rida)
9.) Muhammad son of al-rida (known as al-jawad)
10) Ali son of al-jawad (known as al-hadi)
11.) Hassan son of al-hadi (known as al-askariy)
12.) Muhammad son of al-askariy (known as al-Mahdi).he is the 12th and final imam for humanity and he is the awaited imam,whose reapperance is awaited.ever since his birth he has being in ghaibah (not present public) out of persecution as all his forefathers were either killed or poisoned.both sunnis and shia believe that the Mahdi would be a decendant of the Prophet Muhammad and that he will come shortly before Jesus returns.the sunnis however do not believe he has being born while the shia believe he is the 12 imam.

The Prophet Muhammad is believed to have prophesied that 12 khalifa (sucessors) will rule the muslim ummah.the hadith is present in the sahih books of sunnis:

Sahih Bukhari89.329:
Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."
Sahih Muslim : Book 020: Number 4477, 4478, 4480, 4481, 4482, 4483:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "The (Islamic) religion will continue until the Hour (day of resurrection), having twelve Caliphs for you, all of them will be from Quraysh.”

Sunan Abu Dawood : Book 36: Number 4266


The Prophet said: "This religion remains standing until there are twelve vicegerents over you, all of them agreeable to the nation, all of them from Quraysh."

Sunan al-Tirmidhi (Arabic) Chapter of Fitan,
2:45 (India) and 4:501 Tradition # 2225 (Egypt)
Hadith #2149 (numbering of al-'Alamiyyah)
The Prophet said: "There will be after me twelve Amir (Prince/Ruler), all of them from Quraysh."

Musnad-e-Ahmad, vol 1, pg 398

Masrooq relates that someone asked Abdullah Ibn Masood, "O Abaa Abd al-Rahmaan, did you ask the Messenger of Allah how many caliphs will rule this nation?". Abdullah Ibn Masood replied, "Yes, we did ask the Messenger of Allah and he replied, "Twelve, like the number of chiefs (nuqabaa) of Bani Israel"" [


Brother zubeyr says:

we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders

DOES THE SUCCESSION OF 12 IMAMS THE SAME THING AS HEREDITARY RULE?AND CAN IT HAVE A BASIS IN THE QURAN?

it is suprising to hear the above words coming out from a muslim who is believed to have read the holy Quran!

Lo! Allah preferred Adam and Noah and the Family of Abraham and the Family of 'Imran above (all His) creatures. (33) They were descendants one of another. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (34)(Holy Quran 3:33-34)

When Allah (swt) has chosen a people for the delieverance and protection of His message and exalting them above others,that is not the same thing as hereditary rule based on blood line or racial superiority.Allah cleanse a people and give them knowledge and purity.it also really amazing to see that it is the sunni countries where monarchy and emirs prevail.when the shia follow the imams of Ahlul-Bayt,they believe that they do so because Allah has ordered them to do so and the Prophet declared Ali as the khalifa (not abu bakr).therefore the shia do no see it as upholding hereditary rule but rather following divine sucession.


Brother Zubeyr says:

Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

When one referes to the word shia,he is more often than not talking about the Twelvers or those who believe in 12 imams.when one uses the term sunni,he is more often than not refering to the followers of the shafi,maliki,hanbali and hanafi jurisprudence.these are already four schools of thought within sunni islam.if one comes and ask you,which sect of sunni islam do you follow that is not real.the ahmadiyya, and wahhabis/salafis do exist but that does not make them prevail over others.

The word “shia” means partisan.the full word is shiat Ali or the party of Ali as opposed to sunnis,the followers of abu bakr and co.the fundamental of the shia that makes it distinct from any sect is the imamat.the zaydis for example have lost touch with shiism because imamat does not play a role as an institution.to them,they recognize the first 4 imams listed above and then what: anyone who is a decendant of Ali can be imam.that should not be so.only a select by God and the Prophet can be imam.so zaydis do have an attachment to shiism but do not represent mainstream shiism.you’d find that over centuries of poor scholarship and bad living conditions,they today are getting nearer to shia fiqh practiced by the followers of 12 imams.

As for the ismailis and nusayris one cannot disregard them as non-muslims.we shia (followers of twelve imams) do admit that the ismailis are misguided and father from the truth.we cannot disregard them and consider them as non-muslim like sunnis do because anyone who says the two testimonies of faith (there is no go but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah) is muslim.ofcourse ismailis do not pray,fast and practice as the shia and sunnis do.

As for the nusayris,one can hardly know their beliefs.it is hard to say.some people have said they perform shirk by considering Ali as a “god” like the christians consider Jesus.they sometimes deny that.i can say their beliefs are kept secret and therefore no need to even bother because the truth is clear.

As for me,I am shia and I do recognize 12 imams and I do believe Ali is the first of them the Prophet declared and he is the immediate successor of the Prophet by diivine order as witnessed in the farewell sermon of the Prophet when he was returning from the last/farewell pilgrimage at a place called ghadir-khum in present day saudi arabia.


Also in the above,you said the shia imams attempt to convert sunnis to their school of thought.our imams are not present to day except for the 12th who is in ghaibah and is expected to return as the Mahdi,who however sunnis believe in him too.our imams guided the ummah from the knowledge given to them by Allah and what they inherited from Ali and the Prophet Muhammad (sa).your statement is therefore not rightly stated.

As for abu bakr and aisha,we do have our position on them.but we are not expected to deleve into what will create disunity between muslims.i will not curse or insult them for the greater good of islam.however when it comes to beliefs we do believe that abu bakr usurped the caliphate.we also do not like aisha because of her jealous to the family of the Prophet Muhammad.for example the Prophet had warned her about the battle of Jamal but she still sent ahead and rode a mule to fight against Ali.she prevented Hassan,the grandson of the Propher,from being buried close to his grandfather,the Prophet Muhammad.

I will contain myself with these.any further question will be answered.

PLEASE FIRST WATCH THIS VERY IMPORTANT VIDEO TITLED: “WHO ARE THE RIGHTLY GUIDED CALIPHS”:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LClhbzuhvdo&playnext=1&list=PLA1055483335A4460&index=31

zubeyr:

Salam
To answer your question I would say :
I know Shia represents 15% of the Muslim population significant populations of Shia can be found in Iran Irak Bahrain and Azerbedjan large minorities in Lebanon Yemen Kuwait Syria and smaller minorities in India Pakistan Afghanistan Turkey Kenya and Nigeria
Shia believe that the Imam is sinless by nature and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God Shia venerate their Imams as saints and perform pilgrimage to their tombs and shrines
we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders
Shia also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH Abu Bakr Omar and Seyida Aisha wife of the Prophet PBUH
Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

population of shia muslims in the world

shia muslims are a majority in iran,iraq,bahrain and azerbaijan and the largest community making about 40% of lebanon's population.saudi arabia,kuwait,pakistan,turkey,syria,afghanistan and india have siginificant minorities.
In yemen,the zaidis who make up about half the population are an off-shoot of shia islam just like the ahmadiyya or wahhabis are to sunni islam.
The shia branch of islam itself,is one of two branches of the religion.as a muslim,you either fall under the sunni branch of islam or under the shia branch of islam.there maybe exceptions like the ibadis of oman who fall on neither side of the two branches.

WHO ARE THE 12 SHIA IMAMS

Note:the term “Ahlul-bayt” means “the people of the household of the Prophet Muhammad”.




The shia venerate 12 Imams from the decendants of the Prophet.the first is Ali Ibn Abi Taleb,husband of Fatima,the Prophet’s daughter and the second is Hassan,the grandson of the Prophet and the son of Ali and Fatima.the third is HUSSAIN,the brother of Hassan.

The remaining nine are decendants of Hussain.they are:
4.) Ali son of Hussain (known as Zaynul-abideen)
5.)Muhammad son Ali-Zaynul abideen (known as al-baqir)
6.) Ja’far son of al-Baqir (known as al-sadeq)
7.) Musa son of al-sadeq (known as al-kazem)
8.) Ali son of all-kazem (known as al-rida)
9.) Muhammad son of al-rida (known as al-jawad)
10) Ali son of al-jawad (known as al-hadi)
11.) Hassan son of al-hadi (known as al-askariy)
12.) Muhammad son of al-askariy (known as al-Mahdi).he is the 12th and final imam for humanity and he is the awaited imam,whose reapperance is awaited.ever since his birth he has being in ghaibah (not present public) out of persecution as all his forefathers were either killed or poisoned.both sunnis and shia believe that the Mahdi would be a decendant of the Prophet Muhammad and that he will come shortly before Jesus returns.the sunnis however do not believe he has being born while the shia believe he is the 12 imam.

The Prophet Muhammad is believed to have prophesied that 12 khalifa (sucessors) will rule the muslim ummah.the hadith is present in the sahih books of sunnis:

Sahih Bukhari89.329:
Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."
Sahih Muslim : Book 020: Number 4477, 4478, 4480, 4481, 4482, 4483:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "The (Islamic) religion will continue until the Hour (day of resurrection), having twelve Caliphs for you, all of them will be from Quraysh.”

Sunan Abu Dawood : Book 36: Number 4266


The Prophet said: "This religion remains standing until there are twelve vicegerents over you, all of them agreeable to the nation, all of them from Quraysh."

Sunan al-Tirmidhi (Arabic) Chapter of Fitan,
2:45 (India) and 4:501 Tradition # 2225 (Egypt)
Hadith #2149 (numbering of al-'Alamiyyah)
The Prophet said: "There will be after me twelve Amir (Prince/Ruler), all of them from Quraysh."

Musnad-e-Ahmad, vol 1, pg 398

Masrooq relates that someone asked Abdullah Ibn Masood, "O Abaa Abd al-Rahmaan, did you ask the Messenger of Allah how many caliphs will rule this nation?". Abdullah Ibn Masood replied, "Yes, we did ask the Messenger of Allah and he replied, "Twelve, like the number of chiefs (nuqabaa) of Bani Israel"" [


Brother zubeyr says:

we Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders

DOES THE SUCCESSION OF 12 IMAMS THE SAME THING AS HEREDITARY RULE?AND CAN IT HAVE A BASIS IN THE QURAN?

it is suprising to hear the above words coming out from a muslim who is believed to have read the holy Quran!

Lo! Allah preferred Adam and Noah and the Family of Abraham and the Family of 'Imran above (all His) creatures. (33) They were descendants one of another. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (34)(Holy Quran 3:33-34)

When Allah (swt) has chosen a people for the delieverance and protection of His message and exalting them above others,that is not the same thing as hereditary rule based on blood line or racial superiority.Allah cleanse a people and give them knowledge and purity.it also really amazing to see that it is the sunni countries where monarchy and emirs prevail.when the shia follow the imams of Ahlul-Bayt,they believe that they do so because Allah has ordered them to do so and the Prophet declared Ali as the khalifa (not abu bakr).therefore the shia do no see it as upholding hereditary rule but rather following divine sucession.


Brother Zubeyr says:

Sunni Muslims classified Zaydis and Twelvers as the closest to the Sunnis Ismailis and Nusairi are not considered Muslims by Sunni Scholars
Some others Sunni Scholars accused Shia of some heresies such as the celebration of Anniversary martyrdom of Imam Hussein and infallibility of
Shia Imams and their attempts to convert Sunni Muslims to their school of thought So I would like to know what is your Shia sect ? and what are your views about Abu bakr and Seyida Aisha ? do you believe Shia Imams are infallible ?

When one referes to the word shia,he is more often than not talking about the Twelvers or those who believe in 12 imams.when one uses the term sunni,he is more often than not refering to the followers of the shafi,maliki,hanbali and hanafi jurisprudence.these are already four schools of thought within sunni islam.if one comes and ask you,which sect of sunni islam do you follow that is not real.the ahmadiyya, and wahhabis/salafis do exist but that does not make them prevail over others.

The word “shia” means partisan.the full word is shiat Ali or the party of Ali as opposed to sunnis,the followers of abu bakr and co.the fundamental of the shia that makes it distinct from any sect is the imamat.the zaydis for example have lost touch with shiism because imamat does not play a role as an institution.to them,they recognize the first 4 imams listed above and then what: anyone who is a decendant of Ali can be imam.that should not be so.only a select by God and the Prophet can be imam.so zaydis do have an attachment to shiism but do not represent mainstream shiism.you’d find that over centuries of poor scholarship and bad living conditions,they today are getting nearer to shia fiqh practiced by the followers of 12 imams.

As for the ismailis and nusayris one cannot disregard them as non-muslims.we shia (followers of twelve imams) do admit that the ismailis are misguided and father from the truth.we cannot disregard them and consider them as non-muslim like sunnis do because anyone who says the two testimonies of faith (there is no go but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of Allah) is muslim.ofcourse ismailis do not pray,fast and practice as the shia and sunnis do.

As for the nusayris,one can hardly know their beliefs.it is hard to say.some people have said they perform shirk by considering Ali as a “god” like the christians consider Jesus.they sometimes deny that.i can say their beliefs are kept secret and therefore no need to even bother because the truth is clear.

As for me,I am shia and I do recognize 12 imams and I do believe Ali is the first of them the Prophet declared and he is the immediate successor of the Prophet by diivine order as witnessed in the farewell sermon of the Prophet when he was returning from the last/farewell pilgrimage at a place called ghadir-khum in present day saudi arabia.


Also in the above,you said the shia imams attempt to convert sunnis to their school of thought.our imams are not present to day except for the 12th who is in ghaibah and is expected to return as the Mahdi,who however sunnis believe in him too.our imams guided the ummah from the knowledge given to them by Allah and what they inherited from Ali and the Prophet Muhammad (sa).your statement is therefore not rightly stated.

As for abu bakr and aisha,we do have our position on them.but we are not expected to deleve into what will create disunity between muslims.i will not curse or insult them for the greater good of islam.however when it comes to beliefs we do believe that abu bakr usurped the caliphate.we also do not like aisha because of her jealous to the family of the Prophet Muhammad.for example the Prophet had warned her about the battle of Jamal but she still sent ahead and rode a mule to fight against Ali.she prevented Hassan,the grandson of the Propher,from being buried close to his grandfather,the Prophet Muhammad.

I will contain myself with these.any further question will be answered.

@ShiaMuslim: [Quote]i would like to know from you what you know about shia islam,the Ahlul-Bayt (as),Imam Hussain(as) and the battle of karbala,or what would you like to know?[/Quote]For me, nothing on the three issues you listed above, siply because none of the is the proprietary and exclusive property of ShiaIsm, over other Muslims, especially the group called Sunni.

All Ahlul Bayt (RA), Imam Hussayn (RA) and the Battle of Karbala are acknowledged and beloved, well familiar to all muslims. The day of Ashurra is an event during the time of Seyiddina Musa (AS) of Bani Israil. The Messenger (AS) told us to fast, and we do not have to beat ourselves up, getting blood from our body for this. There is no self beat up in Islam. It is haram and just because this is the same day that the grandson of the messenger died, as the messenger himself had stated, including about sayiddina Ali death, we should not let us forget what ashurra is; Musa, a messenger of Allah.

When the son of the prophet (AS) died, the people saw an eclipse of the sun and declared that heaven is mourning, too. The prophet (AS) stopped them from such utterance.

I wonder what the prophet will say about the death of his grandson being made to overshadow the event on Prophet Musa (AS) who is in 6th heaven and dubbed Qalamullahu Taala? How do people beat them up and go revere the grave, supplicating to him, begging him, when Allah Alone is to be supplicated and begged?

Sweetnecta:

@ShiaMuslim: For me, nothing on the three issues you listed above, siply because none of the is the proprietary and exclusive property of ShiaIsm, over other Muslims, especially the group called Sunni.

that is our sincere wish.but when people try to push these 3 issues under the carpet and still hope everyone will forget about them,indeed the group that remembers those 3 and commemorate and honor those 3 becomes the group with exclusive right over them.its the fact!!!

All Ahlul Bayt (RA), Imam Hussayn (RA) and the Battle of Karbala are acknowledged and beloved, well familiar to all muslims. The day of Ashurra is an event during the time of Seyiddina Musa (AS) of Bani Israil. The Messenger (AS) told us to fast, and we do not have to beat ourselves up, getting blood from our body for this. There is no self beat up in Islam. It is haram and just because this is the same day that the grandson of the messenger died, as the messenger himself had stated, including about sayiddina Ali death, we should not let us forget what ashurra is; Musa, a messenger of Allah.

how are they acknowledged?with empty words?you cannot acknowledge them if you do not accept their superior status over the ret of the sahaba.here by mentioning the sahaba i mean the most pious sahaba like ammar and bilal,may Allah bless them.you must obey the messenger of Allah and accept the fact that he left behind the Quran and the Ahlul-Bayt for us to follow.if you follow anyone else,you are going contrary to the messenger's admonition.

When the son of the prophet (AS) died, the people saw an eclipse of the sun and declared that heaven is mourning, too. The prophet (AS) stopped them from such utterance.

can you prove that?

I wonder what the prophet will say about the death of his grandson being made to overshadow the event on Prophet Musa (AS) who is in 6th heaven and dubbed Qalamullahu Taala? How do people beat them up and go revere the grave, supplicating to him, begging him, when Allah Alone is to be supplicated and begged?

to muslims and to God Muhammad (sa) is the sayyidul-mursaleen or the master of the messengers.i am the one that should wonder what would Prophet Musa (as) do on ashura day:celebrate or mourn for the grandson of Muhammad (sa)?


my friend you got things wrong.it is unfortunate that the muslims have being veiled from the most basic facts about their religion.there is nothing in islam that prevents anyone from visiting a grave to honor someone especially the good and obedient servant of Allah.honoring these men is being subservient to Allah.doing tawassul too is not haram.it is only wahhabism that have infected islam with bid'a and tried to twist the facts for what they truly stand for.

as for your fasting and ashura understanding that its a joyous day when Musa (as) was saved from the pharoah,you need to re-think.those are part of the hadiths manufactured by the ummayads to lessen the significance of ashura and its relevance to imam Hussain and karbala.

the hadith fabricated where the messenger of AAllah is portrayed as commanding fasting on ashura day is fabricated and a shame.how can the messenger of Allah copy the jews?infact,copy or no copy that hadith has being refuted by calculations.the hadith says that the messenger of Allah was in medinah upon his hijra and met the jews fasting.it is a fact based on calculations that the messenger was not in medinah on the month of muharram during that year.the date clear shows that the hadith is made up for a purpose.the Prophet arrived medinah after muharram in the first year of hijra.

secondly,note that no jewish day of fast in the first or second year of hijrah coincided with the 10th of muharram.
so how could the Prophet declared the 10th of muharram a day of fast connected to the jews when that day never coincided with a jewish day of fast nor the fast of yom kippur or the fast of the day of atonement the jews commemorate?


if you are interested you can read more why the fast on ashura is a lie and fabricated.see the article link below:

http://www.muharram.shiasisters.net/articles/the_fast_of_ashura.html

and:

http://www.al-islam.org/al-tawhid/ashura/

main source:
http://www.al-islam.org/search.php?selected_tab=&having=939561&cat=0&sid=380638106

The basis of Shee'ism is in these Hadeeths:

Imaam Muslim records in his Saheeh 4/1873 (Daar al-Fikr, Baab Fadaail ‘Alee bin Abee Taalib) that Zaid bin Arqam (رضي الله عنه) said:

قام رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم يوماً فينا خطيباً بماءٍ يدعى خمّاً بين مكة والمدينة فحمد الله وأثنى عليه، ووعظ وذكر. ثم قال: أما بعد، ألا أيها الناس فإنّما أنا بشر يوشك أنْ يأتي رسول ربي فأجيب، وأنا تارك فيكم ثقلين: أولهما كتاب الله فيه الهدى والنور، فخذوا بكتاب الله واستمسكوا به» فحثّ على كتاب الله ورغّب فيه، ثم قال: وأهل بيتي، أذكركم الله في أهل بيتي، أذكركم الله في أهل بيتي، أذكركم الله في أهل بيتي

One day Allaah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) stood up to deliver sermon at a watering place known as (Ghadeer) Khumm situated between Makkah and Madeenah. He praised Allaah, and delivered the sermon and. exhorted (us) and said: Now to our purpose. O people, I am a human being. I am about to receive a messenger (the angel of death) from my Lord and I, in response to Allaah's call, (would bid good-bye to you), but I am forever leaving among you Two Weighty Things: one of them both is the Book of Allaah in which there is right guidance and light, so hold fast to the Book of Allaah and adhere to it. He exhorted (us) (to hold fast) to the Book of Allaah and then said: The second are my Ahl al-Bait. I remind you, by Allaah, of my Ahl al-Bait. I remind you, by Allaah, of my Ahl al-Bait. I remind you, by Allaah, of my Ahl al-Bait.

There is no doubt about the authenticity of this report, and its message is very clear.

Shaikh Muhammad Naasir ad-Deen al-Albaanee also records this Hadeeth in his Saheeh Sunan at-Tirmidhee, Volume 3, page 543, Number 3788 (Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: Maktabah al-Ma’arif; first edition, 1420 H):

حدثنا علي بن المنذر كوفي ، حدثنا محمد بن فضيل ، حدثنا الأعمش عن عطية عن أبي سعيد ، والأعمش عن حبيب بن أبي ثابت ، عن زيد بن أرقم – رضي الله عنهما – قالا : قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم : إني تارك فيكم ما إن تمسكتم به لن تضلوا بعدي ؛ أحدهما عظم من الآخر : كتاب الله حبل ممدود من السماء إلى الأرض وعترتي أهل بيتي ، ولن يفترقا حتى يردا علي الحوض ، فانظروا كيف تخلفوني فيهما

Narrated Aboo Sa’eed (al-Khudree) and Zaid bin Arqam, may Allaah be pleased with them both:

Allaah’s Apostle, peace be upon him, said:

“I am forever leaving among you that which if you adhere to you will never go astray after my death. One of them both is greater than the other: they are the Book of Allaah, a rope stretching from the heaven to the earth, and my nearest kin, my Ahl al-Bait. Both (the Qur’aan and the Ahl al-Bait) shall never separate from each other until they meet me at the Lake-Font. Therefore, watch carefully how you treat them both after my death.”

[/b]Commenting upon its authenticity, Shaikh al-Albaanee says: صحيح <<Saheeh>>

The contemporary Sunnee hadithist, al-‘Allaamah Hasan bin ‘Alee as-Saqqaaf in his Saheeh Sifat as-Salaat an-Nabeey, page 29 (Imaam an-Nawaawee Centre, Jordan), has documented the same hadith. As regards its authenticity, he states:

وهو صحيح

[b]And it is saheeh

Shaikh al-Albaanee again records in his Saheeh al-Jaami’ as-Sagheer, Volume 1, p. 482 (Al-Maktab al-Islaamee) that Zaid bin Thaabit (رضي الله عنه) said:

قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم: إني تارك فيكم خليفتين: كتاب الله حبل ممدود ما بين السماء والأرض أو ما بين السماء إلى الأرض وعترتي أهل بيتي وأنهما لن يفترقا حتى يردا عليّ الحوض

Allaah’s Apostle, peace be upon him, said: I am forever leaving among you TWO SUCCESSORS: the Book of Allaah, which is a rope stretching between the heavens and the earth, and my nearest kin, my Ahl al-Bait. The two of them will never separate till they meet me at the Lake-Font.”

Commenting upon its authenticity, Shaikh al-Albaanee says: صحيح <<Saheeh>>

Al-Haafiz Ibn Katheer records in his al-Bidaayah wa an-Nihaayah, Volume 5, p. 228 (Muasassat at-Taareekh al-‘Arabee) that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) said at Ghadeer Khumm:

كأني قد دعيت فأجبت إني قد تركت فيكم الثقلين أحدهما أكبر من الآخر كتاب الله وعترتي أهل بيتي فانظروا كيف تخلفوني فيهما فإنهما لن يتفرقا حتى يردا عليّ الحوض، ثم قال: إن الله مولاي وأنا ولي كل مؤمن ثم أخذ بيد علي فقال: من كنت وليّه فهذا وليّه، اللهم وال من والاه وعاد من عاداه

It seems I have been called (to the presence of Allaah) and I have accepted the invitation. I have left behind among you the Two Weighty Things. One of them is greater than the other: the Book of Allaah and my nearest kin, my Ahl al-Bait. Watch carefully how you treat them both after my death because both will never separate until they meet me at the Lake-Font. Allaah is my Master, and I am the master of all believers. (Then he held the hand of ‘Alee and said) Whomsoever I am his master, this (‘Alee) too is his master. O Allaah, love those who love him and hate those who hate him.

Commenting upon its authenticity, al-Haafiz Ibn Katheer says:

قال شيخنا أبوعبد الله الذهبي وهذا حديث صحيح

Our Shaikh, Aboo ‘Abdullaah adh-Dhahabee said: This Hadeeth is saheeh.

Al-Haafiz Ibn Katheer again in his Tafseer, Volume 4, page 122 (Beirut, Lebanon: Daar al-Fikr, 1401 H) states:

وقد ثبت في الصحيح أن رسول الله قال في خطبته بغدير خم إني تارك فيكم الثقلين ، كتاب الله وعترتي وأنهما لن يفترقا حتى يردا عليّ الحوض

It has been firmly established in the Saheeh (Hadeeth) that Allaah’s Apostle said in his sermon at Ghadeer Khumm: “I am forever leaving among you the Two Weighty Things: the Book of Allaah and my nearest kin. Both shall never separate until they meet me at the Lake-Font.”

Shaikh al-Albaanee again in his in his Saheeh Sunan at-Tirmidhee, Volume 3, page 542, Number 3787 (Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: Maktabah al-Ma’arif; first edition, 1420 H):

حدثنا نصر بن عبد الرحمن الكوفي حدثنا زيد بن الحسن – الأنماطي –عن جعفر بن محمد ، عن أبيه ، عن جابر بن عبد الله قال : رأيت رسول الله في حجته يوم عرفة وهو على ناقته القصواء يخطب ، فسمعته يقول : يا أيها الناس إني قد تركت فيكم ما إن أخذتم به لن تضلوا كتاب الله وعترتي أهل بيتي

Narrated Jabir ibn ‘Abdullah al-Ansaree, may Allaah be pleased with him:

"I saw the Messenger of Allaah, peace be upon him, during his hajj pilgrimage on the day of `Arafah. He was seated on his camel, al¬-Qaswa, and was delivering a sermon. I heard him say: 'O mankind, verily, I have left among you that which if you hold fast to you shall never go astray: the Book of Allaah and my nearest kin, my Ahl al-Bait."

Commenting upon its authenticity, Shaikh al-Albaanee says: صحيح <<Saheeh>>

This last Hadeeth reveals to us that the Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) repeated Hadeeth ath-Thaqalain on many occasions. It was part of his Farewell Sermon at Arafah, long before Ghadeer Khumm. However, when you see texts of the Prophet’s (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) Farewell Sermon today, the above part has been expunged!

Al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar al-Asqalaanee in his al-Mataalib al-‘Aaliyah bi Zawaa-id al-Masaaneed ath-Thamaaniyyah, Volume 4, page 65, Number 3972 (Saudi Arabia: Daar al-Ghaith, first edition, 1419 H, edited by Dr. Sa’d bin Naasir bin ‘Abd al-’Azeez ash-Shatree) records as well:

إن النبي حضرالشجرة بخم ، ثم خرج آخذاً بيد علي فقال: ألستم تشهدون أن الله ربكم ؟ قالوا : بلى ، قال فمن كان الله ورسوله مولاه فإن هذا مولاه ، وقد تركت فيكم ما إن أخذتم به لن تضلوا كتاب الله سببه بيده وسببه بأيديكم وأهل بيتي

The Prophet was in the presence of a tree at (Ghadeer) Khumm. Then he came out (to the people), holding ‘Alee’s hand, and saying: “Do you not testify that Allaah is your Rabb?” The people said, “We do.” Then the Prophet said, “Whomsoever Allaah and His Messenger are his Master, this (‘Alee) too is his master. And I have left among you that which if you hold fast to you will never go astray: the Book of Allaah, one end of which is in His Hand and the other end in yours, and my Ahl al-Bait.

Commenting upon its authenticity, al-Haafiz al-Asqalaanee says:

وهذا إسناد صحيح

And this chain is saheeh

Shaikh Abu al-‘Abbaas Ahmad bin Muhammad bin ‘Alee ibn Hajar al-Haitamee, the supreme Shaafi’i jurist and Hadithist during his time, states in his as-Sawaa-‘iq al-Muhriqah, Volume 2, page 428 (Lebanon: Muasassat ar-Risaalah, first edition, 1417 H, edited by ‘Abdur-Rahmaan bin ‘Abdullaah at-Turkee and Kaamil Muhammad al-Khuraat):

وفي رواية صحيحة : إني تارك فيكم أمرين لن تضلوا إن اتبعتموهما ، وهما كتاب الله وأهل بيتي عترتي

And in the Saheeh report (the Prophet is reported to have said): I am forever leaving among you Two Commands. You will never go astray if you follow them both. Both are the Book of Allaah and my Ahl al-Bait.

In the same book, Volume 2, page 440, al-Haitamee states about the Hadeeth:

ثم اعلم أن لحديث التمسك بذلك طرقاً كثيرة وردت عن نيف وعشرين صحابياً

Then know that the Hadeeth of Adherence (to the Qur’aan and the Ahl al-Bait) has come through a large number of chains, and has been narrated by more than twenty of the Sahaabah.

Thus, the Hadeeth is both saheeh and mutawaatir. It is an absolute Hujjah upon the whole Ummah.

It's not proper to start a thread just to cause confussion here in our religion. It think the best is to make contributions and express your view on issues. Or form thread to educate us on our religion but not to divide us.
If you are trying to convert people to shai islam here, forget it you are just wasting your time. This is not a forum for that.
Open your eyes man, what we need is unity but not to be divided. What is the gain of shai-sunni problem in Iraq, Pakistan and others?

Salaam brothers.
I do not think this is the right forum and the right time we Muslims try to fight the faults in our various creeds.
I wish the dear brother that started this thread should try and change the topic because we have more greater challenges facing we Muslims in this era than all these. I belief that irrespective of our sect, there is something binding us together. And that is the Belief in Allaah as our God and Muhammad as the final messenger. This is the basic thing a Muslim needs to be called a believer.
Though as Muslims, we do not fold our arms and watch some people going around spreading an improper version of the deen. But everything has got a proper time and a proper way of doing it.
Don't you also know that the bastard enemies of Islaam are taking a great opportunity of our exposed and applauded divisions to cause a more greater havoc to innocent Muslim souls?
So the issue of Sunni or Shi'a shouldn't be proudly flaunted in a non-secluded form like Nairaland coz we've gotten enough enemies watching.
Fi Amaanillaah

juman:

It's not proper to start a thread just to cause confussion here in our religion. It think the best is to make contributions and express your view on issues. Or form thread to educate us on our religion but not to divide us.
If you are trying to convert people to shai islam here, forget it you are just wasting your time. This is not a forum for that.
Open your eyes man, what we need is unity but not to be divided. What is the gain of shai-sunni problem in Iraq, Pakistan and others?

i think you guys should be fair enough over here.the only one who is causing confusion from my observation and is actually hijacking this thread is "sweetnecta".he is doing "i too know" and throwing attacks."sweetnecta" did not post with an intention of enquiring or holding a dialogue.the thread starter opened the thread to inform us about the other branch of islam.i can see that even when he gives replies,"sweetnecta" did not take them into consideration.


i think as they say "no knowledge is lost".we should sit back and lets hear from the horses' mouth.let those who belong to the shia branch of islam tell us what they believe and why.let us learn to listen for once.

ShiaMuslim:

Why and who is deleting my post? my reply to brother Zubeyr was deleted 3 times!!!

Hope you are getting used to the system here my dear Brother in Islam.

ShiaMuslim:

Salam dear brothers and sisters in Islam,

i found this forum and i was disgusted to read the rude posts made against islam and our beloeved Prophet (sa) in the other religion forum.i therefore joined to defend islam and the Prophet (sa) against the rude talk and baseless lies.

U're welcome.But, as u must have seen, so many others have been defending Islam on this forum and yours is just an added advantage.

ShiaMuslim:


in this regards of bringing the fact to light,i am also aware that there is alot of misinformation among sunni muslims regarding their shia muslim brothers.as sunnis,i would like to know from you what you know about shia islam,the Ahlul-Bayt (as),Imam Hussain(as) and the battle of karbala,or what would you like to know?

if there is any shia in the forum,it would also be a pleasure to have him contribute.

Bi Amanillah!!!

Islam is One and anyone calling towards sectarianism is just a trouble maker to me. Why dont you just open threads discussing this issues, rather than attaching unnecessary importance to say, Imam Hussain and the battle of Karbala. Is Imam Hussain the 1st Imam in Islam, or is the battle the only one fought in Islam or the most important?

If you really as a starter wants to educate us about Islam, u can start with tawheed, explaining its forms and importance to us as Muslims and not about some infamous battle or a particular Imam

Law prince:

Salaam brothers.
I do not think this is the right forum and the right time we Muslims try to fight the faults in our various creeds.
I wish the dear brother that started this thread should try and change the topic because we have more greater challenges facing we Muslims in this era than all these. I belief that irrespective of our sect, there is something binding us together. And that is the Belief in Allaah as our God and Muhammad as the final messenger. This is the basic thing a Muslim needs to be called a believer.
Though as Muslims, we do not fold our arms and watch some people going around spreading an improper version of the deen. But everything has got a proper time and a proper way of doing it.
Don't you also know that the naughty person enemies of Islaam are taking a great opportunity of our exposed and applauded divisions to cause a more greater havoc to innocent Muslim souls?
So the issue of Sunni or Shi'a shouldn't be proudly flaunted in a non-secluded form like Nairaland coz we've gotten enough enemies watching.
Fi Amaanillaah

With this, i rest my case.It is obvious they joined nairaland only to cause chaos. It is better not to have their time.

deols:

Islam is One and anyone calling towards sectarianism is just a trouble maker to me. Why dont you just open threads discussing this issues, rather than attaching unnecessary importance to say, Imam Hussain and the battle of Karbala. Is Imam Hussain the1st Imam in Islam,or is the battle the only one fought in Islam or the most important?

If you really as a starter wants to educate us about Islam, u can start with tawheed, explaining its forms and importance to us as Muslims and not about some infamous battle or a particular Imam

your post really demonstrates the urge and the need for such threads to be made and for people to be educated.are you really a muslim?you are calling the battle of karbala "infamous"? astaghfirullah!!!

you suppose to give chance for these things to be explained.you are belittling the third Imam and grandson of the Prophet Muhammad,Imam Hussain,the master of the youths of paradise and the master of the matyrs.do you know that the Prophet said:"Hussain is from me and i am from Hussain,may Allah loves him who loves al-Hussain"?

the battle of karbala was the most crucial battle for the survival of islam that was fought against injustice,tyranny and for the sake of islam to be preserved.Imam Hussain refused to pay allegiance to the caliph yazeed ibn muawiya because yazeed was un-islamic and a man unfit to rule.even when Imam Hussain was tyrannized and surrounded in the open desert of karbala,present-day iraq,the imam refused to pay allegiance.he paid with his life and the life of those his loyal companions and family members so that islam will survive for me and you to worship Almighty Allah.

the day of karbala,also known as the day of ashura,saw Imam Hussain the grandson of Muhammad butchered and beheaded by a tyrant who wanted to kill islam with his bad morals and un-islamic ways.that tyrant was taking the ummah to the days of jahiliyya,making the haram halal.here we have another muslim trying to behead the grandson of Muhammad again by calling his struggle "infamous" and talking as if the Prophet's grandson is one kind of a criminal.the day of ashura is by far the most pitiful day the ummah saw.it is the saddest day for islam.the Imam sacrificed his blood so islam will live.and truly bloood triumphed over the sword.

just as a reminder the Prophet has already foretold the ordeal his grandson would face in karbala.there is a saying that "islam is muhammedan in its presence and hussaini in its survival".

my advice to everyone,even if you are not from one sect or the other,sit back and ask questions and learn rather than criticize for the sake of it and throwing baseless attacks.you are doig the opposite of what you claim to want when you yourself is adding to confusion.

SAYINGS OF IMAM HUSSAIN ON THE IMMINENT BATTLE OF KARBALA AND HIS STAND AGAINST INJUTICE AND TYRANNY:

"Behold; the illegitimate, son of the illegitimate [by birth], has settled between two, between unsheathing [the sword] and humiliation, and how impossible is humiliation from us! Allah refuses that for us, and his messenger, and the believers, and laps chastified and purified, and zealous noses [expression: heads that do not bow in humiliation], and repudiating souls [who repudiate/refuse oppression], that we desire obedience to the mean ones, than the killings of the honourable [martyrdom]. Behold that I move slowly with this family, despite the little number and deserting of helpers."



I Swear by God , I did not rise against the tyrannical rule of Bani Omayah out of selfishness or with the aim of oppression or corruption. My revolt only aimed at reviving the religion of my grandfather , the holy Mohammad and the traditions of my father Ali ibn-Abi Talib , to enjoy good and forbid evil. So, whoever accepts me by accepting the truth , surely God rewards him for supporting the truth. And whoever rejects me , I will be patient until God judges between me and these people justly. Surely , tHE Almighty is the Best Judge of the judges. (Bihar al- Anwar Vol. 44 ", P 329)


",  Don't you see that the truth is not put into action and the false is not prohibited? The believer should desire to meet his Lord while he is right. Thus I do not see death but as happiness, and living with tyrants but as sorrow." -Husayn ibn Ali

Somebody deleted my post. Why please?

Kwara Shia:

Somebody deleted my post. Why please?

brother,did you not read what brother D-sense said? you should get used to the system!!!

D-sense:

Hope you are getting used to the system here my dear Brother in Islam.

@LagosShia; « #27 on: Today at 11:16:28 AM »

Quote from: deols on Today at 08:59:54 AM
Islam is One and anyone calling towards sectarianism is just a trouble maker to me. Why dont you just open threads discussing this issues, rather than attaching unnecessary importance to say, Imam Hussain and the battle of Karbala. Is Imam Hussain the1st Imam in Islam,or is the battle the only one fought in Islam or the most important?

If you really as a starter wants to educate us about Islam, u can start with tawheed, explaining its forms and importance to us as Muslims and not about some infamous battle or a particular Imam

your post really demonstrates the urge and the need for such threads to be made and for people to be educated.are you really a muslim?you are calling the battle of karbala "infamous"? astaghfirullah!!![quote][/Quote]She didnt say so. Read her post again. There is no one in Islam that is higher or as high in loftiness, in the Sight of Allah, His Angels, believers among mankind, jinn, and indeed all creation, as Muhammad (AS), the Only one send to all mankind, as a group, and ending and sealing forever messenger and or prophet (AS). No battle that he did not lead will be equal to any that he led.



[Quote]you suppose to give chance for these things to be explained.you are belittling the third Imam and grandson of the Prophet Muhammad,Imam Hussain,the master of the youths of paradise and the master of the matyrs.do you know that the Prophet said:"Hussain is from me and i am from Hussain,may Allah loves him who loves al-Hussain"?[/Quote]The bold belongs to Hamzah bin Abi Mutalib (RA),the beloved uncle of the prophet who lost his life in Gazzwah Huud. This statement is from the mouth of the prophet (AS), who when he was told that his beloved Uncle died through the spear of Waashi (ra), wanted to curse Waashi because of his sorrow. Allah sent Jibril to stop him. Short time, later, Waashi became Muslim in the lifetime of the Prophet



[Quote]the battle of karbala was the most crucial battle for the survival of islam that was fought against injustice,tyranny and for the sake of islam to be preserved.[/b]Imam Hussain refused to pay allegiance to the caliph yazeed ibn muawiya because yazeed was un-islamic and a man unfit to rule.even when Imam Hussain was tyrannized and surrounded in the open desert of karbala,present-day iraq,the imam refused to pay allegiance.he paid with his life and the life of those his loyal companions and family members so that islam will survive for me and you to worship Almighty Allah.[/Quote]The honor of the bold belongs to, if we are to choose a single battle, The Battle of Badr. Read it in your Quran.



[Quote]the day of karbala,also known as [b]the day of ashura,saw Imam Hussain the grandson of Muhammad butchered and beheaded by a tyrant who wanted to kill islam with his bad morals and un-islamic ways.that tyrant was taking the ummah to the days of jahiliyya,making the haram halal.here we have another muslim trying to behead the grandson of Muhammad again by calling his struggle "infamous" and talking as if the Prophet's grandson is one kind of a criminal.the day of ashura is by far the most pitiful day the ummah saw.it is the saddest day for islam.the Imam sacrificed his blood so islam will live.and truly bloood triumphed over the sword.[/Quote]We should speak the truth, always as it concerns our deen. Is there any sadder say than when the prophet [AS] passed? I am a father of children, and I know that my children are more beloved to me than my grandchildren will ever be. Granted the grandchildren will be beloved to me, as well, but not as my children. Kassim and Ibrahim (RA) died in the lifetime of the messenger (AS).

Indeed all his children, except Fatima (RA) died in his lifetime. Fatima died 6 months later as predicted. Ali, Hussayne (RA), both died as the prophet predicted. You cant claim that a sister who is telling you that Karbala could not be higher than Huud and definitely Badr, therefore say what is not correct about her. Ashurra to us is the 10th day of Muharram, a day that Musa (AS), a Messenger and prophet of Allah, who Muhammad (AS) on Miraj part of Isra wa Miraj met and dialogued with on the matters of the number of Salah for this Ummah.

It was by the Mercy of Allah, through Musa, as a sign that we now make 5 instead of 50 everyday, while most of us are lazy about it. It is therefore a thing unutterable for any muslim to think that Musa is not important, since the whole Quran is about 50% at least about him and the event surrounding him. A prophet lodged in the 6th heaven, above Isa bin Maryam, and others, except Ibrahim in the 7th.



[Quote]just as a reminder the Prophet has already foretold the ordeal his grandson would face in karbala.there is a saying that "islam is muhammedan in its presence and hussaini in its survival".

my advice to everyone,even if you are not from one sect or the other,sit back and ask questions and learn rather than criticize for the sake of it and throwing baseless attacks.you are doig the opposite of what you claim to want when you yourself is adding to confusion.[/Quote]The only one that one cant question in Islam, is Muhammad (AS). If we do not ask questions, we may just be induced to abandoning Salah or always combine Dhur and Asr together, and Magrib and Isha together, as a norm. That is purely baseless. Many groups have returned to Jahalliyah, at least one claiming prophethood,if not almost all of them have a prophet, after the Messenger (AS). Some go to the graves of past pious people to beg them, when Allah is the Only One that must be begged.



[Quote]SAYINGS OF IMAM HUSSAIN ON THE IMMINENT BATTLE OF KARBALA AND HIS STAND AGAINST INJUTICE AND TYRANNY:

"Behold; the illegitimate, son of the illegitimate [by birth], has settled between two, between unsheathing [the sword] and humiliation, and how impossible is humiliation from us! Allah refuses that for us, and his messenger, and the believers, and laps chastified and purified, and zealous noses [expression: heads that do not bow in humiliation], and repudiating souls [who repudiate/refuse oppression], that we desire obedience to the mean ones, than the killings of the honourable [martyrdom]. Behold that I move slowly with this family, despite the little number and deserting of helpers."

I Swear by God , I did not rise against the tyrannical rule of Bani Omayah out of selfishness or with the aim of oppression or corruption. My revolt only aimed at reviving the religion of my grandfather , the holy Mohammad and the traditions of my father Ali ibn-Abi Talib , to enjoy good and forbid evil. So, whoever accepts me by accepting the truth , surely God rewards him for supporting the truth. And whoever rejects me , I will be patient until God judges between me and these people justly. Surely , tHE Almighty is the Best Judge of the judges. (Bihar al- Anwar Vol. 44 ", P 329)

",  Don't you see that the truth is not put into action and the false is not prohibited? The believer should desire to meet his Lord while he is right. Thus I do not see death but as happiness, and living with tyrants but as sorrow." -Husayn ibn Ali[/Quote]RA.

Sweetnecta:

@LagosShia; « #27 on: Today at 11:16:28 AM »
She didnt say so. Read her post again.

here is her post.let us read together:

deols:

If you really as a starter wants to educate us about Islam, u can start with tawheed, explaining its forms and importance to us as Muslims and not about some infamous battle or a particular Imam

when we are talking about the battle of karbala,we can never appreciate the meaning of what happened if we do not know the significance of what happened and how the Prophet himself viewd karbala.the event happened after the Prophet's demise but nontheless,the Prophet himself shed tears for Hussain and took the time to explain the meaning of karbala.your attempt to bring other very important events in islam,does not lessen/diminish the importance of karbala.what happened in the instance of badr and uhud were defensive battles fought and won successfully by the muslims under the leadership of the holy Prophet and guidance from almighty Allah with the promise of victory to establish the deen.

we should be able to differeniate between karabla and all other wars that were fought before.all the other wars were fought to establish the deen under the leadership of the Prophet.karbala on the other hand is an individual battle that was imposed by the tyrant from within the ummah.karabla signifies the battle to preserve what was accomplished in badr and uhud etc.if karbala did not take place,the memery of the previous struggles will be invain.

also while we see that the previous battles were defensive and sucessful against outside enemies,karbala was a fight against oppression and victory of blood over sword.thus karbala has a particular significance:the refusal of man to bow to evil even when threatened with the sword.the victory of karbala was not to establish islam but preserve it from within.if not for karbala the effort of the past would have being lost.we see a special struggle that took place.if the Prophet would have being killed,islam would not have been established.Allah granted him victory.in karbala it was blood that triumphed against the sword.it was the victory of matyrdom in islam and for islam.have you ever heard of the winners becoming the losers?that is the power behind the struggle in karbala.when you tell me that "master of matyrs" was a reference to Hamza (may peace be upon him),would i also be wrong to say the same title can be addressed for Hussain?no!both are masters.but when Hussain's struggle has a special significance,then we have to understand it from that angle,without trying to make it look as if there is a conflict of interests between the battle of karbala and the previous battles fought for islam.karbala immortalized those battles fought for islam and all the efforts of the Prophet.without support,you have one man who saved islam through his blood.also,the castastrophic event of karbala has its impact on the muslims.it awakened them from slumber.the battle was within the ummah and the impact the beheading of Hussain brough and the barbaric actions taken within the ummah against the grandson of their own very prophet was outragious.it shook the minds.there is a divine plan behind karbala as even the Prophet knew before time.it was an awakening call for the muslims to wake up against injustice and oppression and tyranny.the view of seeing the Prophet grandson's head apart from its body was a shock to revive the spirit of the ummah.

of all i have said,believe is just a liittle of what i understand about karbala and its special significance and symbol in the struggle for islam.there is more to explore of its significance and what it represent.the argument and logic you posed to me on karbala can be likened to a christian condemning a muslim for celebrating eid-al-adha because so many other prophets apart from Prophet Ibrahim faced trials.why dont we celebrate an eid for prophet ayoob or prophet Isa?why prophet Ibrahim?because as muslims we know the significance of eid-al-adha and the significance of the covenant of Ibrahim with God.there are events that are important,no doubt!but there are events with special significance,not only on its own but becomes the zenith or culmination of man's struggle.if we do not know the significance and reasons behind commemorating an event,then there are so many events in islam,that we should be having public holidays everyday to commemorate them.but we pay special heed to the ones that have special significance and symbol representing the rest.

i would have posted some important videos about karbala and the battle,but i am afraid if i do,my post would be deleted.if i am granted assurance of free speech,then i'd give necessary information needed to back up my explanations and enable more understanding of what i have stated.

to conclude,commemorating the battle of karbala,is like testifying to the prophethood of Muhammad because he is the last prophet.when you testify of Muhammad's prophethood you have already testified of the prophethood of the rest of the prophets because Muhammad has confirmed the other prophets and you are confirming Muhammad.Muhammad is the culmination of prophethood and revelation.likewise,when you testify of karbala,which is the struggle that immortalized islam,and made the efforts of the previous battles not go invain,you have testified of all the battles previously.karbala is the last battle fought for the existence of the religion itself.and blood triumphed over the sword and the impact was huge that the muslims were awaken from slumber (ghafla) and will never allow again for us to be in the state Imam Hussain found himself and the threats posed to uproot the deen.

Alhamdulillah!