[flash=400,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgXAHno7U9k?version=3&hl=en[/flash]

Catholic worship of corpses, skulls and bones has its origin in the crypt in St. Peters Basilica in the Vatican.

A total of 91 popes are buried in crypts in the grotto in St. Peters Basilica in Rome. This including popes like Innocent IX, Benedicts XII and XV, Pius XI and Paul VI.

But not all the Popes are buried and kept for display inside the Vatican. Pope Celestino is kept in the open of St. Maria of Collemaggio Church in L’Aquila in central Italy. The roof this Church came down during the earthquake on April 6th 2009.



[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope11.jpg?w=450&h=337[/img]

A dead Pope, denied a place to rest in a tomb of silence. Kept for adoration and worship.




[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope101.jpg?w=450&h=337[/img]

The Incorrupt Relics of St. Athanasios the Great, in the Church of S. Zaccaria, in Venice, Italy.




[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope9.jpg?w=450&h=337[/img]

Pope burried like a King, and kept like an Egyptian mummie in a Catholic Church.




[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope7.jpg?w=450&h=337[/img]

This dead Pope is put for display on the wall of a Church in Italy.


[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope6.jpg?w=400&h=300[/img]

A Catholic mass is offerd, with a corpse of a dead Pope inside the altar.





http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope4.jpg?w=450&h=337

The corpse of pope Paul XXIII looks a litle bit like Santa Claus.




[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope2.jpg?w=450&h=300[/img]

The Pope pray in front of the corpse of a Pope, who died 700 years ago.



[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/10/pope12.jpg?w=442&h=307[/img]

The Pope visits the corpse of Pope Calestio V, that is kept in a Church in Central Italy.






[img]http://2.bp..com/_JRkgseRT7NY/TBHWLK6qKJI/AAAAAAAACGo/onJhbutuV_A/s1600/Jean-Marie_Vianney+John+Mary+body+preserved+wax+catholic+hoax+saints+relics+money+hypocrisy+disrepect+for+the+dead.jpg[/img]


[img]http://goshareyourfaith.files./2008/05/relicskull.jpg[/img]



[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2011/01/maria1.jpg?w=450&h=306[/img]

The absolute nadir of spiritual perversion. Disgracing the name of Mary from Magdala.




[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2011/01/maria81.jpg?w=450&h=311[/img]

French Roman Catholics parade this golden statue on their shoulders.



[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2011/01/maria6.jpg?w=372&h=599[/img]

The skull is covered by a golden mask, when this abomination is paraded through the streets.


[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2011/01/maria31.jpg?w=400&h=621[/img]

The golden mask is removed, when the golden idol is displayed inside this Vatican approved and blessed "Church".


[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2011/01/maria2.jpg?w=443&h=295[/img]

A "Church" that would fit perfectly in a horror movie. The golden statue is placed at the center of the room meant for prayer and worship.


[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2011/01/4403_mysteries_of_mary_magdalene-08_04700300.jpg?w=450&h=287[/img]

The walking dead among us, on their way to the everlasting fire of Hell

[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/12/skull1b.jpg?w=450&h=365[/img]

A horrible display of paganism, presented as "Christianity" by wicked people



[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/12/skull3.jpg?w=400&h=300[/img]

Skeletons presented as "Holy bones". The Pope call his faithful to adore them.


[img]http://ivarfjeld.files./2010/12/skull5.jpg?w=450&h=270[/img]

Catholic nuns bow before the box with bony remains of claimed saint Theresa






There seems to be no limits of Roman Catholic filth and rubbish presented as the truth. The story behind this claimed “sainthood” is so baloney, that I hope that some Papist’s reading this message, will be able to escape their house of demons.

@Frosbel: The commentator blames the catholics because the are the "seeing" to believe people.


listen to it.

Is it not the same with the hypocritical protestants who are "seeing" God before the can believe? What is your Jesus then from the Bible?



Birds of the same feathers.

@poster, you need a clear enlightenment as regards certain religious rites and norms. Your views (if at all they are original to u)as expressed here in are stretched across a lame and subliminal view point. Do a google search on Catholican rites, tradition(much emphasis on this) and history. All three are interwoven as there can't be rites without a tradition; so also can there not be proper traditions without an accentuation to the course of history. Free your mind and listen to the dictates of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.tes of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.

^^^ IDOLATORY, reason or no reason.

I'm just seeing this. My God!! This is some scary ish!

Amazing misconception

Mcleo007:

@poster, you need a clear enlightenment as regards certain religious rites and norms. Your views (if at all they are original to u)as expressed here in are stretched across a lame and subliminal view point. Do a google search on Catholican rites, tradition(much emphasis on this) and history. All three are interwoven as there can't be rites without a tradition; so also can there not be proper traditions without an accentuation to the course of history. Free your mind and listen to the dictates of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.tes of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.

I am sorry but anything added to the worship of GOD except Jesus Christ is PAGAN and IDOL Worship.

Islam , Hinduism, Buddhism and Catholicism immediately come to mind.

God Bless

Mcleo007:

@poster, you need a clear enlightenment as regards certain religious rites and norms. Your views (if at all they are original to u)as expressed here in are stretched across a lame and subliminal view point. Do a google search on Catholican rites, tradition(much emphasis on this) and history. All three are interwoven as there can't be rites without a tradition; so also can there not be proper traditions without an accentuation to the course of history. Free your mind and listen to the dictates of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.tes of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.

WTF are you talking about?


@ Topic
Sickening.

this is a clear evidence that the true religion in this world is ISLAM

every denomination has it's mess , if ANGLICAN ARE NOT DOING GAY MARRAIGE
METHODIST WILL BE DOING CULTISM , JEHOVA WITNESS WILL BE DOING THAT.

ONE THING I WANT US TO UNDERSTAND WHICH IM NOT FORCING DOWN ON
ANYBODY'S THROAT . THE WORD CHRISTAINITY IS A WAY OF LIFE NOT A RELIGION

AS WE "NIGERIANS" ARE TAKING IT WE TEND TO WORSHIP HUMAN RATHER THAN GOD
THE WHITE THAT BROUGHT THIS RELIGION TO THIS COAST TEND TO TAKE US FOR A FOOL
GO DOWN TO THEIR END THEY DONT TAKE THIS AS WE TOOK IT DOWN HERE BUT THEY ARE
MORE SINCERE AND THEY ARE GROWING EVERYDAY


SO FELLAS IS BETA YOU TAKE THE GOLD WITH THE SHIT
because YOU CANT SEPERATE THEM OR LEAVE THEIR SHIT

AND ACCEPT ISLAM OR OGUN OR OBATALA
BUT THE BEST OF ALL IS THE RELIGION OF
LIGHT AND PEACE because THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN IN
STONE OR DARK AGE

THAT IS WHY THE WEST AND THE AMERICANS KEPT ON
BLACKMAILING THEM AS TERRORIST AND CALLED THEIR
OWN VERSION CRUSADE RUBBISH AND NONSENSE

IF YOU THINK I HAVE WRITTEN NON- SENSE PLEASE REMOVE
THE NON- AND TAKE THE SENSE OUT OF IT

ACCEPT ISLAM TODAY TODAY TODAY, THE DOOR IS STILL OPEN

I'm not surprised at the unchristian traditions, rites and rituals of the "mother" church. . . seeing these images however, is sickening

This is not surprising.

@ Doyean

this is a clear evidence that the true religion in this world is ISLAM

Is this a joke or what !!!!


Islam is as bad, let me show some Islamic rituals which are also pagan and demonic.

Black Stone:
About 60 BC, the Roman historian Diodorus Siculus commented that there was in Arabia a temple 'greatly revered by the Arabs.'

Ptolemy, the geographer, mentions it in his work, calling it the 'macoraba.'

Muhammad incorporated the Kabah's pagan roots into Islam to give the Muslims a sense of identity, legitimacy, and uniqueness. He also wanted to ease the Arabs' strain of moving from paganism to Islam, by continuing the practices of their fathers.

New twist: The Ka'bah of Mecca was built not to honour the black meteorite but Abraham himself, who supposedly built a shrine on the same spot – (Sura 3:97)



Allah’s Daughters:

When facing resistance from the polytheistic Quraysh tribe Muhammad appears to have wavered in his monotheism. At one stage he commanded his followers to offer prayers to 'Allah's three daughters' – al-Lat, al-Uzza, and Manat, each of which had a shrine near Mecca.

"These are the exalted cranes Whose intercession is to be hoped for." (Surah 53:19-22)

He later retracted that particular 'revelation' and blamed it on a trick by the Devil – hence, the 'Satanic Verses.'

Muhammad keenly recognized the religious and economic importance of retaining the pilgrimage to Mecca.

There were 360 idols around the Kabah (a connection with the celestial orb seems clear). Paintings of Jesus and Mary were said to have been on the inner wall of the Kabah.




The black stone of Mecca.





The goddess Manat ('Fate') seemingly has a ghostly presence in Islamic 'fatalism' – the perception that everything is under God's control




Sacred black stone, this one the goddess Aphrodite from Paphos, Cyprus. Worshiped as early as the 12th century BC.

every denomination has it's mess , if ANGLICAN ARE NOT DOING man-lover MARRAIGE
METHODIST WILL BE DOING CULTISM , JEHOVA WITNESS WILL BE DOING THAT

.


I totally agree with you here, religion is a major problem but Jesus Christ did not come to start a religion, he came to seek and save that which was lost.

He then started to build his invisible church through the Holy Spirit, a process which is still ongoing until the end of age.

The wicked are becoming more wicked as God said they would and the righteous getting purer.

"Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand." = Daniel 12:10

"And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed." - Daniel 11:35


But I am tempted to also agree that the west started religion, in the name of the catholic church ( pagan roman church ) and the church of England founded on Adultery.

On the contrary, the main church Jesus started ( invisible ) consisted of Jews , people of dark skin in Asia and North Africa. This was the time of the Roman Empire. These noble ones were persecuted, given to the lions and hunted down.

After Constantine became Emperor the persecution stopped, and he made Christianity so called the state religion, albeit with all the pagan attribute of roman temple and Babylonian worship.

But we should be aware that many western Christians were also reformers and real Christians who died trying to defend the faith.

ONE THING I WANT US TO UNDERSTAND WHICH IM NOT FORCING DOWN ON
ANYBODY'S THROAT . THE WORD CHRISTAINITY IS A WAY OF LIFE NOT A RELIGION

For sure

ACCEPT ISLAM TODAY TODAY TODAY, THE DOOR IS STILL OPEN

God forbid. You are actually telling people to go and worship idols ??

^^^^^^^^^^ frosbel is forgetting that 'stone' was anointed in the Bible.

Abraham brought a stone and made it a marking for the house of God. That house and that stone in particularly you have shown up in its casing in Makka.

who is truly following Abraham; muslims or christians who even abandoned his progeniy; some you hate; Ishmael and Muhammad {AS}, some you call male prostitutes and idol worshipers and killers; Moses, David, Solomon the wise and Muhammad {AS}. Other you made sandal carrier; John son of Zacharias, who you said actually dipped Jesus into water to make him a man. i ask you; who is more spiritual; your pastor who baptized you or the little boy full of ignorance who he baptized? and another you made into god without any proof that he was orshipped hen he was on earth; Jesus.

Some of you ignorantly say that some people worshiped him and thats enough. but he worshiped God. did Jesus and those who worshiped God in the bibles only do it sometimes or they are regularly and consistently worshiping God?

i remember a younger sibling kneeling down for me. i even remember my niece calling me dad. i stopped the one who knelt as it is inappropriate and so it was repeated. i am sure my niece knows that i am not her father but an uncle. i am not the husband of her mother who is either my sister or my sister in law. Jesus knew his position the reason he worshiped God without getting tired. His mother knows who she was a wife to; no one.


Quran Chapter 2 is very clear about your hatred:
1:109: Many of the People of the Scripture wish they could turn you back to disbelief after you have believed, out of envy from themselves [even] after the truth has become clear to them. So pardon and overlook until Allah delivers His command. Indeed, Allah is over all things competent.

2:110: And establish prayer and give zakah, and whatever good you put forward for yourselves - you will find it with Allah. Indeed, Allah of what you do, is Seeing.

Sweetnecta:

^^^^^^^^^^ frosbel is forgetting that 'stone' was anointed in the Bible.

Abraham brought a stone and made it a marking for the house of God. That house and that stone in particularly you have shown up in its casing in Makka.

who is truly following Abraham; muslims or christians who even abandoned his progeniy; some you hate; Ishmael and Muhammad {AS}, some you call male LovePeddlers and idol worshipers and killers; Moses, David, Solomon the wise and Muhammad {AS}. Other you made sandal carrier; John son of Zacharias, who you said actually dipped Jesus into water to make him a man. i ask you; who is more spiritual; your pastor who baptized you or the little boy full of ignorance who he baptized? and another you made into god without any proof that he was orshipped hen he was on earth; Jesus.

Some of you ignorantly say that some people worshiped him and thats enough. but he worshiped God. did Jesus and those who worshiped God in the bibles only do it sometimes or they are regularly and consistently worshiping God?

i remember a younger sibling kneeling down for me. i even remember my niece calling me dad. i stopped the one who knelt as it is inappropriate and so it was repeated. i am sure my niece knows that i am not her father but an uncle. i am not the husband of her mother who is either my sister or my sister in law. Jesus knew his position the reason he worshiped God without getting tired. His mother knows who she was a wife to; no one.


Quran Chapter 2 is very clear about your hatred:
1:109: Many of the People of the Scripture wish they could turn you back to disbelief after you have believed, out of envy from themselves [even] after the truth has become clear to them. So pardon and overlook until Allah delivers His command. Indeed, Allah is over all things competent.

2:110: And establish prayer and give zakah, and whatever good you put forward for yourselves - you will find it with Allah. Indeed, Allah of what you do, is Seeing.

Show me where in the bible? plssssssss

@post

Mcleo007:

@poster, you need a clear enlightenment as regards certain religious rites and norms. Your views (if at all they are original to u)as expressed here in are stretched across a lame and subliminal view point. Do a google search on Catholican rites, tradition(much emphasis on this) and history. All three are interwoven as there can't be rites without a tradition; so also can there not be proper traditions without an accentuation to the course of history. Free your mind and listen to the dictates of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.tes of pure reason. There is more to Christianity than meets the eye (bible). And mind u, the bible though inspired by God was written by men- the writers had their motives and target audience, which is why the Roman Catholic church took its time to evolve through the course of history.

You lack spiritual insight into the secret things of God. u really do

what an irony!! The christian bible was compiled by a group of pagans in the fourth century.There is nothiong wrong with the images as most of them are simple incorruptibles placed at strategic pilgrimage sites.if you dont know what incorruptibles stand for simply google it and stop making a fool of yourself.

There is nothing wrong in praying @pilgrimage sites period.

chukwudi44:

There is nothing wrong in praying @pilgrimage sites period.

So you say 

I remain a proud catholic

Little wonder

frosbel:

I am sorry but anything added to the worship of GOD except Jesus Christ is PAGAN and IDOL Worship.

Islam , Hinduism, Buddhism and Catholicism immediately come to mind.

God Bless

Why should there be an 'except' when it comes to the worship of God? Can't God be worshipped in His purest form without any intermediary? You've portrayed the Catholics and Muslims as idol worshippers but what of those who say that Jesus is indeed God? What would you call that? Strip your mind of any prejudice and try to come up with clear, objective and logical answers and not some sort of 'my religion is superior to yours' attitude.

On another note, worshipping or venerating physical objects is one thing, how about Christians who venerate their general overseers, crucifixes, tithes and private jets?

@frosbel

You need to open your mind and heart that Islam is not condeming the word " CHRITAINITY"
called them the poeple of the book.

God in is his infinite mercy knows that man will always refuse to face the fact that is why
he sent down different revelations which the Muslims categorises into FIVE. the Jews the jews (old testement)
Xtain both the new &old testement

God made it mandatory that all the books should be accepted by the Muslims and they should not
talk bad about other religion as it will also not be acceptable to them if others talk bad about theirs.

JESUS ,MOSES , MOHAMMED ,ABRAHAM, DAUDA (DAVID), JOSEPH (YUSUF) E.T.C WERE ALL MARKETERS FOR GOD ALMIGHTY
THEY WERE SENT TO ENLIGHTEN MEN FROM IDOL WORSHIPING. ALL THESE PEOPLE WERE MESSAGE CARRIER FOR
GOD.

HISTORY HAS IT THAT THERE IS NO GENERATION THAT ACTUALLY ACCEPTED THESE NOBLE MEN OF GOD 100%
THAT IS WHY WE HAVE THE JEWS. CHRISTANS, MUSLIMS AND NOT FORGETING OTHER RELIGION FROM ASIA IF
WE WANT TO BE OBJECTIVE ABOUT THIS ISSUE.

THE BEST IS TO HOLD ON TO WHAT YOU BELEIVE WILL SAVE BUT IF YOU CAN WIN OTHERS TO UR SIDE GOODLUCK

GOD'S PURPOSE OF SENDING US TO THIS WORLD IS TO WORSHIP HIM AND HE SENT ALL THESE PROPHETS FROM THE DAYS OF NOAH

WE CONTINUE TO DEFY GOD,

FOR ME NOBODY GAVE BIRTH TO GOD
NEITHER DID HE HAVE ANY SON OR CHILD

NEVER MIND MY INITIAL POST I TAKE THESE TOPIC AS A JOKE
COS LOOK @ PEOPLE THAT ARGUE ON RELIGION AS SENSELESS
HUMAN BEIGNS.
Because the world can never have one religion. if this happen that means it is THE END OF THE WORLD.

@frosbel,

I think you misunderstand the Catholic understanding of veneration of the saints, who you call the dead.  We Catholics do not worship the saints or think of them as gods. Instead, we see them as champions/heroes of the faith and look to them as individuals to emulate (in addition to our Lord Jesus Christ).

Here is a youtube link that kind of explains the Catholic understanding of the saints:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxvX4ljuBKQ.

In addition, here is a short response to the question, "Do Catholics Worship Saints?"

NO!

Adoration is the worship and homage that is due to God alone. The Saints are human like you and I.  They are not divine. Adoration of the saints has never been nor will ever be part of Catholic teaching or prayer. We venerate the saints.

Veneration is the honor due to the excellence or achievement of a created person.

The Olympics give us an example of veneration.  An Olympic gold medal for excellence in athletics is a form of veneration.  Honor given for the achievement of an athlete takes nothing away from the glory of God. We pay many honors to Olympic Champions; like putting their picture on a box of Wheaties and giving them many apparel endorsements. We are not scandalized by this because no one thinks we worship them as a god. We venerate the Saints in heaven because of the excellence they attained in living a life in imitation of Christ.  The Saints are like God's champion athletes.  It is pleasing to God and gives Him glory when we honor those who excelled in love for Him.

It is necessary to remember that the love and honor a person gives to God's Saints does not end with the Saints themselves but rather it reaches ultimately to God through the Saints. In honoring a beautiful work of art we are truly honoring the artist. It is only by God's grace that the Saints reached the heights of holiness. In a very real sense they are His works of art. Therefore, nothing is taken away from the glory and honor of God through veneration of the Saints, in fact we truly honor God when we venerate those who excelled in love for Him.

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resource.php?n=742

so venerating dead bones and a skull is fine with you

ITISTRUE:

so venerating dead bones and a skull is fine with you 

Although it may not appeal to my sensibilities to venerate dead bones of saints, I do not see anything wrong with it as along as it ultimately leads people to Christ. Similarly, the way Yoruba people prostrate and bow to their elders does not appeal to my sensibilities (I'm Igbo and we do not bow or prostrate to anybody), I see nothing wrong with it because I know its a sign of respect.

@Omenuko,

I can understand where you're coming from, and it's nice to read your calm response to the issue at hand. However, I don't agree with your explanations and analogies for Catholic veneration of saints - it goes deeper than what you're saying. A small example, quite often when the question is asked: "do Catholics pray to dead saints?", many adherents of the Catholic faith would vehemently deny that they do. Yet, we know that it is Catholic tenet to pray to dead saints, whether Catholics know this or explain it away. To honour the dead is a radically different thing from praying to them - both of which are bedrock beliefs in Catholicism.

This is not to put you or your beliefs on spotlight; rather, I think your answers are quite different from reality.

Worship and veneration of the dead. Isn't that what all christians do? You even drink and bathe with the blood of the long dead Jesus. Stop accusing others of what you are also guilty of, frosbel you hypocritical bigot.

^^

Jesus Christ is not DEAD, he is ALIVE forever more ,after offering himself for the sins of mankind ONCE and forever and for those who come to GOD through HIM.


" How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!" - Hebrews 9:14


But to be honest, what you need is salvation from sins through Christ Jesus , but it is your choice. Like countless millions you can mock Christ all the way to eternal damnation.

"Don't waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Don't throw your pearls to pigs! They will trample the pearls, then turn and attack you." - Matthew 7:6


ISLAM However , not only venerate the dead , such as Muhammad etc, but they delight in making the living more dead than alive and shedding blood as a means to appease the thirst of their beloved deity ALLAH.

@frosbel; « #26 on: Today at 08:34:18 PM »
[Quote]^^
Jesus Christ is not DEAD, he is ALIVE forever more ,after offering himself for the sins of mankind ONCE and forever and for those who come to GOD through HIM.[/Quote]the bold took you out of christianity. a man who was beat down to pulps by a big bad bully, can't be assumed that he offered himself up to be beat down. when we watch the whole thing developed as the wimp was cornered in the alley way and has no room to run and zero chance to escape. he was caught by his neck, taken to the park and got whooping. he yelled and cried for help until he collapsed.

it was when he wasn't moving that the beating stop and the bully went away. some scared spectators rushed the man to the hospital, where he was admitted given a bed instead of body bag in the morgue. after less than 3 days, his family got him back. some periods after, his friends were saying in the neighborhood that he offered to be beating so that others may not get beaten, while we see from time to time people in town still get beat up.

shall we say the man volunteered and his volunteering benefited the town in any way since the beating never stopped, or that those who take it that he volunteered himself to be beaten so that others don't get beat needs their heads examined?



[Quote]" How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!" - Hebrews 9:14[/Quote]this is garbage because it never came from Jesus. Paul who wrote this not part of the 12 who should take precedence over him on Jesus. either he was the another comforter because he seems to be leading you to all truth, correcting your way of religion, teaching you new things and glorifying Jesus. or paul is lying and definitely the another comforter must be against pauline doctrine and he must the one telling the truth?



[Quote]But to be honest, what you need is salvation from sins through Christ Jesus , but it is your choice. Like countless millions you can mock Christ all the way to eternal damnation.[/Quote]why trough Jesus when you can approach the One Who can give you salvation, directly? after Adam and Eve approached Him directly and not through Jesus and they got their salvation. why create a road block for yourself adding a useless layer since Adam and Eve whose sin you are laden with got salvation. their method is better, because that how each prophet approached God. even Jesus approached Him the same and not through himself.



[Quote]"Don't waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Don't throw your pearls to pigs! They will trample the pearls, then turn and attack you." - Matthew 7:6[/Quote]and Juses loved everyone so much he called them unholy and likened them to pigs. some real love there, especially coming from man god who is not satisfied being God and just had to come to be a prophet like others by getting his own mother pregnant, etc.



[Quote]ISLAM However , not only venerate the dead , such as Muhammad etc, but they delight in making the living more dead than alive and shedding blood as a means to appease the thirst of their beloved deity ALLAH.[/Quote]muslims make prayers to Allah, after they give salaam to the messenger [as] at his grave. you do make prayers for the dead and not to the dead? this act of muslims is ibadat commanded by Allah in the Quran in surah Azhab. the christians, all of you go to a cave which you call a tomb. such a cave is in american baseball field. it is called dug out and that is where the players sit. dug out or cave is not the belly of the earth.

who is the one that instructs you to go to the fake belly of the earth?

if we agree that Jesus is alive ,why then do we refer t those who die in Jesus as dead?

There is nothing like dead saints since the saints are alive in heaven.Even Jesus alluded to that in his response to the pharisees who asked him about the widow who married brothers.He told them God is God of the living and not of the dead.

Also saints are not just open to public veneration without investigation.There has to be 2 posthumous miracles b4 one is declared a saint.

There is nothing wrong in asking a saint 2 pray for u as the bible itself encourages us to pray 4 one another

There is something in the bible about removing the log from your eyes before trying to remove one from another person's eyes.
The poster is effectively accusing catholics of being superstitious.
It is a pity that frosbel does not apply the same standards by which he judges the catholics to himself.
Here is a person who believes that the earth and contents were created by god in six days, that the same god destroyed the earth in a world-wide flood save for eight individuals and a few animals, that god's son was born of a virgin, that the said son was executed and rose from the dead three days later, that the said dead son of of god will return soon to judge all mankind and so on and so forth.
If these beliefs are not as crazy as the catholic veneration of the dead, what is?
Echoes of the pot calling the kettle black and so on.

@chukwudi44

if we agree that Jesus is alive ,why then do we refer t those who die in Jesus as dead?

Because their bodies are still in the grave, and they are awaiting the day of resurrection, on the contrary JESUS CHRIST is RISEN and there is no body, bones or skeleton in the grave.

Muhammad has a tomb that contains his bones in Saudi and so do all the so called saints that the catholic church venrate.

There is nothing like dead saints since the saints are alive in heaven.Even Jesus alluded to that in his response to the pharisees who asked him about the widow who married brothers.He told them God is God of the living  and not of the dead.

God is the GOD of the present living not of the past DEAD.

Also saints are not just open to public veneration without investigation.There has to be 2 posthumous miracles b4 one is declared a saint.

In your opinion a saint is a peculiar person exalted to that position by the pope,. but in the bible ALL BELIEVERS who are born again are SAINTS, anyone who accepts JESUS, repents of their sins and lives a righteous life is a SAINT in God's sight.

A few examples :

"Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:" - Ephesians 1:1

"Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons" - Philppians 1:1

"For we have great joy and consolation in thy love, because the bowels of the saints are refreshed by thee, brother." - Philemon 1:7

"All the saints salute you." - 2 Corinthians 13:13


So you see a SAINT  is any CHILD of GOD who has been spiritually converted into the body of Christ by the HOLY SPIRIT.

There is nothing wrong in asking a saint 2 pray for u as the bible itself encourages us to pray 4 one another

You are right, but it depends on 2 things :

1. What your definition of a saint is as many catholic saints had questionable life styles.

2. The state of the saints , ie. are they dead or alive.

We are to pray for each other , those who are alive , not pray to each other.

We pray for each other through the mediator Jesus Christ and definitely not through MARY.

Zodiac61

There is something in the bible about removing the log from your eyes before trying to remove one from another person's eyes.

In relation to sin

The poster is effectively accusing catholics of being superstitious.

Well if you believe in Mary apparitions, rosary prayer, mass, venerating dead people then you sure are superstitious, because you see , the bible never mentioned any of these things.

It is a pity that frosbel does not apply the same standards by which he judges the catholics to himself.

I do, I examine myself DAILY to see whether I am still in the faith.

But I believe in the simplistic faith which is ME, MY SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST and FATHER GOD, not me MY BIBLE, MY SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST ,  MARY, CANDLES, DEAD SAINTS , HOLY WATER etc etc .

Here is a person who believes that the earth and contents were created by god in six days, that the same god destroyed the earth in a world-wide flood save for eight individuals and a few animals, that god's son was born of a virgin, that the said son was executed and rose from the dead three days later, that the said dead son of of god will return soon to judge all mankind and so on and so forth.
If these beliefs are not as crazy as the catholic veneration of the dead, what is?

These are Biblical truths all stated in the Bible.

But you continue making the same mistake by calling JESUS CHRIST DEAD, no he is not DEAD, he WAS DEAD, but it RISEN and sits down on the right hand of FATHER GOD until he makes his enemies his FOOTSTOOL.

DEAD means STONE DEAD, with skeletons and a grave as evidence.

Echoes of the pot calling the kettle black and so on

.

Not sure what you are implying.


But I suspect that you are atheist and therefore no further comments other than the bible calls the one who does not believe in at least GOD, as  a FOOL !!

"For ever since the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky. Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God.Yes, they knew God, but they wouldn't worship him as God or even give him thanks. And they began to think up foolish ideas of what God was like. As a result, their minds became dark and confused.Claiming to be wise, they instead became utter fools.And instead of worshiping the glorious, ever-living God, they worshiped idols made to look like mere people and birds and animals and reptiles.So God abandoned them to do whatever shameful things their hearts desired. As a result, they did vile and degrading things with each other's bodies." - Romans 1:20-24