| Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 7:15pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
THE DEATH OF MUHAMMAD INTRODUCTION
Muhammad died in 632 A.D. He died as a result of being poisoned following his attack upon and conquest of the Jewish settlement of Khaibar. About 2 month before his attack on Khaibar Muhammad failed in an attempt to go to Mecca. This failure resulted in the Treaty of Hudaybiyya with the Meccans. He returned humiliated in the eyes of the Meccans and in the minds of his people. To lift their defeated spirit, Muhammad told his followers that the events at Hudaybiyya were really a victory. In fact, another convenient "revelation" was given to Muhammad as proof that it really was a victory (Sura 48:1). However, Allah was not able to deliver the Meccan's goods as booty, so Muhammad told his followers that they were going to attack and plunder the weaker Jewish settlement of Khaibar.
About 6 weeks later Muhammad led his army and attacked the Jews while they were on their way to work on their date palms. Khaibar was a settlement defended by a number of forts spread apart from each other. One by one Muhammad's army took the forts. Finally, the last few surrendered to him. Muhammad had several of the leaders of the Jewish settlement beheaded, one leader (Kinana) was tortured to reveal where buried treasure was hidden. Then when Kinana was near death, Muhammad commanded that he be beheaded. Many of the women and children were enslaved. Muhammad even took the most beautiful woman for himself and married her (Safiyah).
Some of Khaibar's residents made a deal with Muhammad. Instead of enslaving them, which would leave the rich orchards of Khaibar to go untended and unproductive, the Jews would give Muhammad and the Muslims 1/2 of all of what they produced. Muhammad accepted the deal, with the stipulation that they could be expelled at his slightest whim. Years later, Umar expelled the last remaining Jews from Khaibar.
Immediately following the conquest of Khaibar, a Jewish woman prepared a dinner for Muhammad and some of his men. Unknown to the Muslims was that she had put a poison into the lamb (some say goat) that was served at dinner. Muhammad ate some of the poisoned lamb and died as a result three years later.[b] PRESENTATION OF ISLAMIC SOURCES PART A - THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD PART B - PREMONITIONS OF HIS DEATH PART C - MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING PART D - THE ADVENT OF MUHAMMAD'S DEATH I will use quotes from 4 highly respected Islamic writings: 1) "Sahih Bukhari”. This Hadith is considered to be the most important Islamic book, after the Quran. 2) Ibn Ishaq's biography, the "Sirat Rasul Allah", (THE LIFE OF THE PROPHET), translated by A. Guillaume as "The Life of Muhammad", is the most authentic Sirat (biographical) literature recognized in Islam. 3) Ibn Sa'd biography, the "Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir" (Book of the Major Classes), Volume 2. Of the three, Ibn Sa'd's Sirat contains the most information relative to Muhammad's death. I will not attempt to cover the spectrum of subjects Ibn Sa'd addresses in his. However, I will cover and present his relevant material. 4) Tabari's "History". Tabari is one of the most highly respected authors in Islamic writings. His "History" is 39 volumes. 5) “Sahih Muslim”. This collection of Hadith is considered to be equal to, or slightly below Bukhari’s collection of Hadith. NOTE: I have quoted quite a bit of material. Some of it is redundant, but I feel that each quote I present provides an important detail concerning Muhammad's poisoning and death. Please forgive the tedious nature of the quotes; it is essential that I present the source material as accurately as possible. NOTE: My comments appear in [ ] type brackets. Frequently the authors themselves enclose comments in ( ) type brackets. I will copy them as they appear in the text. NOTE: In some cases I will leave out the chain of narrators because they are quite long, and not necessary for the context of the story. Also, I will present quotes from the sources in as much of a chronological sequence as possible. [/b] PART A - THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD
A1
From Bukhari's Hadith 3.786:
Narrated Anas bin Malik: A Jewess brought a poisoned (cooked) sheep for the Prophet who ate from it. She was brought to the Prophet and he was asked, "Shall we kill her?" He said, "No." I continued to see the effect of the poison on the palate of the mouth of Allah's Apostle.
A2
From Bukhari's Hadith 4.394: Narrated Abu Huraira: When Khaibar was conquered, a roasted poisoned sheep was presented to the Prophet as a gift (by the Jews). The Prophet ordered, "Let all the Jews who have been here, be assembled before me." The Jews were collected and the Prophet said (to them), "I am going to ask you a question. Will you tell the truth?" They said, "Yes." The Prophet asked, "Who is your father?" They replied, "So-and-so." He said, "You have told a lie; your father is so-and-so." They said, "You are right." He said, "Will you now tell me the truth, if I ask you about something?" They replied, "Yes, O Abu Al-Qasim; and if we should tell a lie, you can realize our lie as you have done regarding our father." On that he asked, "Who are the people of the (Hell) Fire?" They said, "We shall remain in the (Hell) Fire for a short period, and after that you will replace us." The Prophet said, "You may be cursed and humiliated in it! By Allah, we shall never replace you in it." Then he asked, "Will you now tell me the truth if I ask you a question?" They said, "Yes, O Abu Al-Qasim." He asked, "Have you poisoned this sheep?" They said, "Yes." He asked, "What made you do so?" They said, "We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you."
A3
From Ibn Sa'd page 249:
Verily a Jewish woman presented poisoned (meat of) a she goat to the apostle of Allah. He took a piece form it, put it into his mouth, chewed it and threw it away. Then he said to the Companions: "Halt! Verily, its leg tells me that it is poisoned." Then he sent for the Jewish woman and asked her; "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I wanted to know if you are true; in that case Allah will surely inform you, and if you are a liar I shall relieve the people of you."
A4
From Ibn Sa'd page 249: [different narrator]
The apostle of Allah and his companions ate from it. It (goat) said: "I am poisoned." He [Muhammad] said to his Companions, "Hold you hands! because it has informed me that it is poisoned!" They withdrew their hands, but Bishr Ibn al-Bara expired. The apostle of Allah sent for her (Jewess) and asked her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I wanted to know if you are a prophet, in that case it will not harm you and if you are a king, I shall relieve the people of you. He gave orders and she was put to death. [SEE NOTE 1]
A5
From Ibn Sa'd page 250: [different narrator]
Verily a woman of the Jews of Khaibar presented poisoned (meat of) goat to the apostle of Allah. The he recognized that it was poisoned, so he sent for her and asked her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I thought if you are a prophet, Allah will inform you, and if you are a pretender, I shall relieve people of you. When the apostle of Allah felt sick, he got himself "cupped". [SEE NOTE 2]
A6
From Ibn Sa'd pages 251, 252: [different narrator]
, When the apostle of Allah conquered Khaibar and he had peace of mind, Zaynab Bint al-Harith the brother of Marhab, who was the spouse of Sallam Ibn Mishkam, inquired, "Which part of the goat is liked by Muhammad?" They said, "The foreleg." Then she slaughtered one from her goats and roasted it (the meat). Then she wanted a poison which could not fail. , The apostle of Allah took the foreleg, a piece of which he put into his mouth. Bishr took another bone and put it into his mouth. When the apostle of Allah ate one morsel of it Bishr ate his and other people also ate from it. Then the apostle of Allah said, "Hold back your hands! because this foreleg; , informed me that it is poisoned. Thereupon Bishr said, "By Him who has made you great! I discovered it from the morsel I took. Nothing prevented me from emitting it out, but the idea that I did not like to make your food unrelishing. When you had eaten what was in your mouth I did not like to save my life after yours, and I also thought you would not have eaten it if there was something wrong.
Bishr did not rise form his seat but his color changed to that of "taylsan" (a green cloth), The apostle of Allah sent for Zaynab and said to her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "You have done to my people what you have done. You have killed my father, my uncle and my husband, so I said to myself, "If you are a prophet, the foreleg will inform you; and others have said, "If you are a king we will get rid of you."",
The apostle of Allah lived after this three years till in consequence of his pain he passed away. During his illness he used to say, "I did not cease to find the effect of the (poisoned) morsel, I took at Khaibar and I suffered several times (from its effect) but now I feel the hour has come of the cutting of my jugular vein."
A7
From Tabari Volume 8, page 123, 124:
When the messenger of God rested from his labor, Zaynab bt. al-Harith, the wife of Sallam b. Mishkam, served him a roast sheep. She had asked what part of the sheep the messenger of God liked best and was told that it was the foreleg. So she loaded that part with poison, and she poisoned the rest of the sheep too. Then she brought it. When she set it before the messenger of God, he took the foreleg and chewed a bit of it, but he did not swallow it. With him was Bishr b. al-Bara b. Marur, who, like the messenger of God, took some of it; Bishr, however, swallowed it, while the messenger of God spat it out saying, "This bone informs me that it has been poisoned." He asked, "What led you to do this?" She said: "How you have afflicted my people is not hidden from you. So I said, "If he is a prophet, he will be informed; but if he is a king, I shall be rid of him"". The prophet forgave her. Bishr died of the food he had eaten.
A8
From Tabari Volume 8, page 124: [different narrator]
The messenger of God said during the illness from which he died - the mother of Bishr had come in to visit him - "Umm Bishr, at this very moment I feel my aorta being severed because of the food I ate with your son at Khaybar." [See NOTE 3]
NOTE 1: There is disagreement over whether of not Muhammad had the women who poisoned him put to death. In short, he had her put to death for the death of the other Muslim - Bishr, who quickly died from the poisoning. See the reports by Ibn Sa'd, p. 250.
NOTE 2: Cupping is essentially drawing a small amount of blood from your body. Muhammad believed that bleeding oneself was "the best of medicines".
NOTE 3: The note on quote A8 states that the expression, "it severed his aorta" need not be taken literally; it is used metaphorically for extreme pain.
[b]PART B - PREMONITIONS OF HIS DEATH B1 From Bukhari's Hadith 5.713: Narrated Ibn Abbas: 'Umar bin Al-Khattab used to let Ibn Abbas sit beside him, so 'AbdurRahman bin 'Auf said to 'Umar, "We have sons similar to him." 'Umar replied, "(I respect him) because of his status that you know." 'Umar then asked Ibn 'Abbas about the meaning of this Holy Verse:-- "When comes the help of Allah and the conquest of Mecca . . ." (110.1) Ibn 'Abbas replied, "That indicated the death of Allah's Apostle which Allah informed him of." 'Umar said, "I do not understand of it except what you understand." Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O 'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison." B2 From Ibn Sa'd page 244: , and there has been no prophet but he has lived half the life of the prophet preceding him. Jesus the son of Mary lived for one hundred and twenty five years, and this is the sixty second year of my life. He (prophet) died half the year after this. B3 From Ibn Sa'd page 239: The appointed hour (of death) of the apostle of Allah came near and he was ordered to recite repeatedly "tasbih" (lit. glorification) and ask for His forgiveness. B4 From Ibn Sa'd page 240: When (the Surah) Allah's succor and the triumph comes; was revealed he (prophet) said: (It signifies) call from Allah and departure from the world. B5 From Tabari Volume 9 page 108: When the prophet returned to Medina after performing the Pilgrimage of Completion, he began to have a complaint of illness. As travel was allowed (after the pilgrimage), the news of the prophet's illness spread, Then in Muharram the prophet complained of the pain from which he died. PART C - MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING NOTE: It was already quoted from Ibn Sa'd above (page 250 that Muhammad tried to get himself healed of the poisoning. C1 From Ibn Sa'd page 263 Verily during his illness the prophet recited "al-Mu'awwadhatayn" [Sura 113, and 114], and blow his breath upon his body while rubbing his face. [This was done in an effort to be healed]. C2 From Sahih Muslim volume 3, # 5440 Aisha reported that when Allah’s Messenger fell ill, he recited over his body Mu’awwidhatan and blew over him and when his sickness was aggravated I used to recite over him and rub him with his hand with the hope that it was more blessed. Also ref. Hadith # 5441. C2 From Ibn Sa'd page 265 The apostle of Allah fell ill and he i.e. Gabriel, chanted on him, saying, "In the name of Allah I chant on to ward off from you every thing that harms you and (to ward off you) against every envier and from every evil eye and Allah will heal you." C3 From Ibn Sa'd page 265 [Different narrator] Aisha, the wife of the prophet used to say, "When the apostle of Allah fell ill, Gabriel chanted on him saying, "In the name of Allah Who will cure you and Who will heal you from every malady (and will ward off) the evil of envier who envies and from smite of the evil eye."" C4 From Ibn Sa'd page 322 Verily, whenever the apostle of Allah fell ill, he asked for recovery, from Allah. But in the illness as a result of which he died, he did not pray for recovery; he used to say, "O soul! What has happened to thee that thou are seeking refuge in every place of refuge?" [/b] PART D - THE ADVENT OF MUHAMMAD'S DEATH
D1 [again quoting from Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:]
Narrated 'Aisha:
The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O 'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."
D2
From Ibn Hisham page 678:
While matters were thus the apostle began to suffer from the illness by which God took him to what honor and compassion He intended for him shortly before the end of Safar or in the beginning of Rabi'ul-awwal. It began, so I have been told, when he went to Baqi'u'l-Gharqad in the middle of the night and prayed for the dead. Then he returned to his family and in the morning his sufferings began.
D3
From Ibn Hisham page 679:
Then the apostle's illness worsened and he suffered much pain. He said, "Pour seven skins of water from different wells over me so that I may go out to the men and instruct them." We made him sit down in a tub belonging to Hafsa d. Umar and we poured water over him until he cried, "Enough, enough!"
, then he [Muhammad] said, "God has given one of his servants the choice between this world and that which is with God and he has chosen the latter."
D4
From Ibn Hisham page 680:
Then some of his wives gathered to him, while his uncle Abbas was with him, and they agreed to force him to take medicine. Abbas said, "Let me force him," but they did it. When he recovered he asked who had treated him thus. When they told him it was his uncle he said, "This is a medicine which women have brought from that country," and he pointed in the direction of Abyssinia [Ethiopia]. When he asked why they had done that his uncle said, "We were afraid that you would get pleurisy;" he replied, "That is a disease which God would not afflict me with. Let no one stop in the house until they have been forced to take this medicine, except my uncle." Maymuna [one of Muhammad's wives] was forced to take it although she was fasting because of the apostle's oath, as a punishment for what they had done to him.
D5
From Ibn Sa'd page 294
Umm Bishr [the mother of the Muslim man who also died eating poison], came to the prophet during his illness and said, "O apostle of Allah! I never saw fever like it in any one." The prophet said to her, "Our trial is double and so our reward [in heaven], is double. What do the people say about it [his illness]?" She said, "They say it is pleurisy." Thereupon the apostle said, "Allah will not like to make His apostle suffer from it (pleurisy) because it indicates the possession of Satan, but (my disease is the result of) the morsel that I had taken along your son. It has cut my jugular vein."
SEE NOTE 3
D6
From Ibn Hisham page 682:
, that he heard Aisha [one of Muhammad's wives] say: "The apostle died in my bosom during my turn: [the night Muhammad was to spend sleeping with her] I had wronged none in regard to him. It was due to my ignorance and extreme youth that the apostle died in my arms."
D7
From Ibn Sa'd page 322:
When the last moment of the prophet was near, he used to draw a sheet over his face; but when he felt uneasy, he removed it from his face and said: "Allah's damnation be on the Jews and the Christians who made the graves of their prophets objects of worship."
NOTE 3: Pleurisy is an infection of a lung membrane. It is painful. I don't know why Muhammad considered this infection to be from Satan, but poisoning would not be from Satan.
SUMMARY OF THE SOURCES
Muhammad attacked Khaibar. He destroyed, tortured, murdered, plundered, and enslaved many people (ref Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, volume 2, page 134, 136, 137). They were not preparing to attack him. A Jewish woman, whose family had been wiped out by Muhammad, put poison into a lamb and fed it to Muhammad and the other Muslims. Muhammad ingested some of the poisoned lamb and began to feel it's effects. He died three years later as a result of the poisoning.
DISCUSSION
What needs to be investigated here are the circumstances of Muhammad's death. The Jews were planning to murder him. The Jews believed that a real prophet would be forewarned of their deed but an impostor wouldn't be warned by God. The Muslims also believed this; the other Muslim who died said that he didn't think Muhammad would eat of something that was poisoned (see quote in A6).
The Jews were right, Muhammad did eat of the poison, and did die from it. They proved, according to their test, that Muhammad was not a prophet. As they said (quote A2):
"We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you."
These Jews were convinced that a real prophet would know what was going on. In this case Muhammad didn't know. Only after Muhammad ate from the lamb did the lamb "talk to him". I don't think that that was anything miraculous in itself; even the other Muslim knew it was bad before Muhammad ate from it. Most adults know when they are eating something that is bad. So for Muhammad to say the sheep "talked" to him is not prophetic at all. Even a child spits out bad tasting food.
Many times previously, Muhammad claimed to have had "revelations" that warned him of danger. He even used one of these convenient "revelations" as grounds to attack the Jewish settlement of Banu Nadhir. Yet at Khaibar the revelation came too late: too late to save his own life, too late to save Bishr's life.
As his illness wore on, Muhammad began to pray for healing – he even rubbed his “healing” hand upon himself. Gabriel also got into the act and prayed for his healing (see quotes C2 & C3). Muhammad even got himself "cupped" (the best of all medicines!), (quote A5). Obviously, at this point in time, Muhammad wanted to be healed.
But it didn't help. As it progressively got worse, Muhammad realized that he was dying, ceased praying for healing (quote C4), and claimed that Allah had given him a choice to going to Paradise, or living on earth. Muhammad said he then wanted to go to Paradise. Knowing the game was up, he made the best out of a failed situation.
Muhammad's earlier premonitions of his deaths read more like the cosmic words of a mystic. Nothing definite is ever said about them until after his approaching death. Perhaps he had seen this type of death before and knew the outcome. It doesn't take a prophet or a "revelation" to know that death is near.
My basic point is this: the Jews proved that Muhammad was not a real prophet. He ingested the poison, so did at least one of his followers. He attempted to be healed, he tried his medicine, and his form of “laying on of hands”, his prayer, Aisha’s prayer, and even Gabriel’s prayer, but in the end, he died from the poison.
QUESTIONS
1) If Muhammad were a real prophet of God, why didn't he catch the poison before he ate it?
2) If you believe that it was God's will for Muhammad to have eaten the poison, along with Bishr, why then did Muhammad try to get well? Even Gabriel prayed for Muhammad to get better, but Allah didn't answer that prayer either.
3) Why did Gabriel not know the will of Allah? Why would Gabriel pray if Allah had decided death?
4) Why did Muhammad force the other Muslims to drink the medicine he was given? One of them was one of his wives, and she was fasting. He forced her to break her fast and drink the medicine as well. Doesn't this sound vindictive and petty?
5) Why, when just before his death, did Muhammad have to utter a curse upon the Christians and the Jews? Wouldn't it have been better for Muhammad to pray for guidance for them? This also sounds like a jealous, bitter prayer to Allah. Muhammad prayed for and uttered curses instead of asking Allah to guide people.
6) Why would pleurisy, which is a normal infection of the lung membrane, be considered to be from Satan, but being poisoned would not be from Satan?
CONCLUSION
Muhammad was not a real prophet, he was a false prophet. He died as a result of eating poison that he didn't know about. The poisoned lamb "spoke" to him too late. Only when he realized he was dying did Muhammad "spiritualize" his suffering and coming death. Prior to that he tried to get well.
Moses knew about his coming death (Deut 34:1-5). Jesus also knew of His future death (Mark 8:32, 32). Yet Muhammad was in the dark until he himself realized he was going to die.
Paul the apostle was bitten by a poisonous snake (Acts 28:1-6), but Paul suffered no ill effects from the bite. God had his hand of protection on Paul, to finish the work laid out for him. Muhammad died so suddenly that there was confusion as to would be the next ruler of the Islamic state. To this day, part of that confusion remains. The Islamic world is divided in part because of this issue (Shia vs. Sunni). Wouldn't Allah, who abhors division within the Ummah have protected Muhammad long enough to insure that his state remain unified, and a clearly defined successor be named?
Jesus predicted false prophets would come into the world and mislead many (Matthew 24:24). Muhammad was such a false prophet. Both Jesus and Moses knew God face to face, Muhammad only had a spirit or angel he called "Gabriel" speaking to him. In the end, even this angel's prayers were not answered by Allah. Could it be that this "Gabriel" was preaching a false religion (Galatians 1: to Muhammad? Could Gabriel have been a deceptive demon or Satan himself?http://answering-islam.org/Silas/mo-death.htm 1 Like |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 7:22pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
The Jews were right, Muhammad did eat of the poison, and did die from it. They proved, according to their test, that Muhammad was not a prophet. As they said (quote A2):
"We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you." This is a good way to prove him false, but i will also say that, As a prophet, he is surposed to get the vision of this event, Why the usual angel didn't reveal that he should not eat or even stop him from the event that leads to his death? or did the quran predicted he will die of poison as a fulfillment? |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 7:44pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
"Plappville",you could be of great help if you can tell us the following for a start and then even you will not believe your missionary liars anymore!!!:
1.) when (what year) was the poison of Khaibar administered?
2.) did the Prophet (sa) actually eat the poison?
3.) when (what year) did the Prophet (sa) died? |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 7:48pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
U should asked the Islamic holy books. or did the Quran gave a different story as usual? |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 7:54pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
plappville:
U should asked the Islamic holy books. or did the Quran gave a different story as usual?
the Quran is not a biography of Muhammad (s) as the new testament's "four gospels" are biographies of Jesus. so the Quran does not mention about the incident at hand (that is the poisoning) at all. so please,since you have presented a bundle of information quoting from here and there,just give us the dates of when the Prophet (sa) allegedly ate poisoned meat and when did he pass away? and then tell us,did he actually eat poisoned meat? or according to the information and hadiths quoted,the incident at Khaybay when a jewess tried to poison the Prophet (sa),it was a miraculous event where Muhammad (sa) proved to be a true prophet of God? please tell us!dont just quote tonnes of info and remarks of christian missionaries that you cannot defend.now answer my questions!pretty please!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by Nobody: 7:57pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
plappville:
This is a good way to prove him false, but i will also say that, As a prophet, he is surposed to get the vision of this event, Why the usual angel didn't reveal that he should not eat or even stop him from the event that leads to his death? or did the quran predicted he will die of poison as a fulfillment?
Have you administered the same test of faith on yourself? Since this was a good way to prove Mohammed and Islam false, why don't we see what your "saviour" said. Mark 15 He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.” Ive seen some fundies handle poisonless snakes. The esteemed MOGs of Nigeria lay hands on the sick all the time and they can give Johns Hopkins a run for their money when it comes to healing. Hell, Joagbaje can raise the dead. Oyedepo is famous for slapping the demons out of girls. He keeps his p!mp hand strong. These are the signs of the followers of jesus. But I've yet to see you people swallow cyanide, rat poison and the likes. I would love to see you try. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 8:03pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
LagosShia:
the Quran is not a biography of Muhammad (s) as the new testament's "four gospels" are biographies of Jesus.
so the Quran does not mention about the incident at hand (that is the poisoning) at all.
so please,since you have presented a bundle of information quoting from here and there,just give us the dates of when the Prophet (sa) allegedly ate poisoned meat and when did he pass away? and then tell us,did he actually eat poisoned meat? or according to the information and hadiths quoted,the incident at Khaybay when a jewess tried to poison the Prophet (sa),it was a miraculous event where Muhammad (sa) proved to be a true prophet of God?
please tell us!dont just quote tonnes of info and remarks of christian missionaries that you cannot defend.now answer my questions!pretty please!!!
U are dinying the written of Islamic books. If u want to have date etc u still ve to go and get that from the Books that presented his death. U must ve some fabricated lies outside the truth as usual. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by Sweetnecta: 8:06pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
I will watch the "lion" of Islam tear up the she lamb without any defense.
Like Sunny Ade said ati apa and ati ekun eron jije ala egi sunny.
We in Islam know. We are happy about the life of the messenger [as]. No messenger [as] of Allah was killed by the enemies. It is only made to appear so. And all doubt are in conjecture.
Plappville, its your turn. Call all your supporters. Lagosshia will make a mince meat of them. And they will not be fit for meatballs on any pasta. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 8:07pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
Martian:
Have you administered the same test of faith on yourself? Since this was a good way to prove Mohammed and Islam false, why don't we see what your "saviour" said.
Mark
15 He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.”
Ive seen some fundies handle poisonless snakes.
The esteemed MOGs of Nigeria lay hands on the sick all the time and they can give Johns Hopkins a run for their money when it comes to healing. Hell, Joagbaje can raise the dead.
Oyedepo is famous for slapping the demons out of girls. He keeps his p!mp hand strong.
These are the signs of the followers of jesus. But I've yet to see you people swallow cyanide, rat poison and the likes.
I would love to see you try.
Mr u don't know me, i am not here to publish the sort of Gift i obtained since i became born again. As far as i am concern, I ve several proof. It mustn't be same as others. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by Sweetnecta: 8:07pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
Aja instead of apa. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 8:09pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
plappville:
U are dinying the written of Islamic books. If u want to have date etc u still ve to go and get that from the Books that presented his death. U must ve some fabricated lies outside the truth as usual.
i am not denying anything! there is no where in the accounts you gave that say that Muhammad's (sa) death was the result of poisoning by a jew.the accounts from hadiths presented some report that he did not simply eat the meat because he knew it was poisoned,while others say as he put the meat into his mouth he knew the meat was poisoned and ordered everyone else to stop eating.and he too did.he then questioned the woman why she poisoned the meat and she told him because she wanted to see if he would know as a "prophet of God".so that was the test for his prophethood and he passed it.then there is an isolated report attributed to Aisha that says that he felt the effect of the poison (not that it killed him) when he was getting ill and close to his death. now,i want to test you: tell us the year when Muhammad (sa) was at Khaybar and the alleged incident of poisoning took place and the year he died.how many years went away after that incident after which Muhammad (sa) died? i want to see if it was poison that really killed him!!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 8:11pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
Sweetnecta:
I will watch the "lion" of Islam tear up the she lamb without any defense.
Like Sunny Ade said ati apa and ati ekun eron jije ala egi sunny.
We in Islam know. We are happy about the life of the messenger [as]. No messenger [as] of Allah was killed by the enemies. It is only made to appear so. And all doubt are in conjecture.
Plappville, its your turn. Call all your supporters. Lagosshia will make a mince meat of them. And they will not be fit for meatballs on any pasta.
Hey, whats the crying for? these facts are not from the bible but ur own books. Whats not true is not Islam isn't that the quote of Muslim? So why now the fact on the prophet's death that was recordrd in the Islamic book has suddenly be a different case? |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 8:15pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
[size=14pt]PLEASE CAN SOMEONE WITH COMMON SENSE TELL US WHEN DID THE ALLEGED INCIDENT OF POISONING AT KHAYBAR TOOK PLACE AND WHEN DID MUHAMMAD,PROPHET OF GOD,PASSED AWAY?[/size]
I dont know why Plappville is avoiding my question!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 8:17pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
LagosShia:
i am not denying anything!
there is no where in the accounts you gave that say that Muhammad's (sa) death was the result of poisoning by a jew.the accounts from hadiths presented some report that he did not simply eat the meat because he knew it was poisoned,while others say as he put the meat into his mouth he knew the meat was poisoned and ordered everyone else to stop eating.and he too did.he then questioned the woman why she poisoned the meat and she told him because she wanted to see if he would know as a "prophet of God".so that was the test for his prophethood and he passed it.then there is an isolated report attributed to Aisha that says that he felt the effect of the poison (not that it killed him) when he was getting ill and close to his death.
now,i want to test you:
tell us the year when Muhammad (sa) was at Khaybar and the alleged incident of poisoning took place and the year he died.how many years went away after that incident after which Muhammad (sa) died? i want to see if it was poison that really killed him!!!!
U cannot test me, i did not write the hadith or so, if they state the date then i will get it for u, if not, i am not a fabrication to history. Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O
'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this
time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison." Aisha is surposed to be the last to lie about this event, if she stated it as above, so what ve u to say otherwise! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 8:20pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
[size=16pt]Must u deny everything? U are dinying Islamic history of its prophets death, waooohh!![/size]
I must leave u now, join u morrow by Gods grace happy new year broda! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 8:24pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
plappville:
U cannot test me, i did not write the hadith or so, if they state the date then i will get it for u, if not, i am not a fabrication to history.
Aisha is surposed to be the last to lie about this event, if she stated it as above, so what ve u to say otherwise!
my friend,i am not accusing Aisha at all of lying.i am not even accusing anyone of lying.the reports are there to speak for themselves. there is not one among those reports that casts doubt on the validity and veracity of the prophethood of Muhammad (sa).there is not one that says Muhammad (sa) actually died of poisoning.the poisoning whether he actually swallowed it or not is not clear.but the reports both the ones that make it look he could have and the ones that say did not,state explicitly that he miraculous detected that the food was poisoned.that is the first thing for you to know. now if he swallowed it and he felt the effect,he did not die! finally,the last thing which i still insist you answer me so that you will not again shamelessly go around on the net to copy/paste nonsense to this forum,is to tell us the year the alleged poisoning incident at Khaybar took place and the year Muhammad (sa),the Prophet of God,regarded by you as a "fake prophet",died?!!!how many years did Muhammad (sa) lived after the incident at Khaybay?!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 8:27pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
plappville:
[size=16pt]Must u deny everything? U are dinying Islamic history of its prophets death, waooohh!![/size]
I must leave u now, join u morrow by Gods grace happy new year broda!
a liar is not my brother! so hold your thick mouth and dont repeat that rubbish again!!! you have lied once by claiming that Muhammad (sa) died as a result of poisoning by a jew.this is the topic of this thread started by you: "Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved" now you are again lying that i am denying islamic history,when i did not deny anything. to answer me a simple question,you have refused.now you are running away as christians are fond of doing in every thread.dont start what you cannot finish.dont reply tomorrow.reply today and answer my simple question.i beg of you!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by hercules07: 9:05pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
@OP
Please answer the questions asked by LagosShia. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 9:09pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
hercules07:
@OP
Please answer the questions asked by LagosShia.
thank you! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by Nobody: 10:02pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
[/quote][quote author=Martian link=topic=836687.msg9875978#msg9875978 date=1325444244]
Have you administered the same test of faith on yourself? Since this was a good way to prove Mohammed and Islam false, why don't we see what your "saviour" said.
Mark
15 He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.”
Ive seen some fundies handle poisonless snakes.
The esteemed MOGs of Nigeria lay hands on the sick all the time and they can give Johns Hopkins a run for their money when it comes to healing. Hell, Joagbaje can raise the dead.
Oyedepo is famous for slapping the demons out of girls. He keeps his p!mp hand strong.
These are the signs of the followers of jesus. But I've yet to see you people swallow cyanide, rat poison and the likes.
I would love to see you try.
Martin, go and continue your fight for gay rights , leave us to keep following our religion blindly  You really take the lead in trolling on this forum ! Wait ! the Islamists will soon be in Power, let's see how well you get on , lol. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by vedaxcool(m): 11:27pm On Jan 01, 2012 |
Martian:
Have you administered the same test of faith on yourself? Since this was a good way to prove Mohammed and Islam false, why don't we see what your "saviour" said.
Mark
15 He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.”
Ive seen some fundies handle poisonless snakes.
The esteemed MOGs of Nigeria lay hands on the sick all the time and they can give Johns Hopkins a run for their money when it comes to healing. Hell, Joagbaje can raise the dead.
Oyedepo is famous for slapping the demons out of girls. He keeps his p!mp hand strong.
These are the signs of the followers of jesus. But I've yet to see you people swallow cyanide, rat poison and the likes.
I would love to see you try.
[size=18pt]This remains a challenge to all the Christians with weak faith[/size] |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by ivoice247: 1:27am On Jan 02, 2012 |
plappville:
THE DEATH OF MUHAMMAD
INTRODUCTION
Muhammad died in 632 A.D. He died as a result of being poisoned following his attack upon and conquest of the Jewish settlement of Khaibar. About 2 month before his attack on Khaibar Muhammad failed in an attempt to go to Mecca. This failure resulted in the Treaty of Hudaybiyya with the Meccans. He returned humiliated in the eyes of the Meccans and in the minds of his people. To lift their defeated spirit, Muhammad told his followers that the events at Hudaybiyya were really a victory. In fact, another convenient "revelation" was given to Muhammad as proof that it really was a victory (Sura 48:1). However, Allah was not able to deliver the Meccan's goods as booty, so Muhammad told his followers that they were going to attack and plunder the weaker Jewish settlement of Khaibar.
The treaty of Hudaybiyya which took place in the year 6 A.H or around 629A.D was actually a victory for the prophet(saw) and the Muslims. And what a great victory; the following year the muslims along with the prophet performed hajj in mecca and within 2 years the prophet Muhammad returned to Makkah, with 10,000 Muslim men, and took Makkah over with ease. The Quraysh gave up without a fight, and most of them accepted Islam.
About 6 weeks later Muhammad led his army and attacked the Jews while they were on their way to work on their date palms. Khaibar was a settlement defended by a number of forts spread apart from each other. One by one Muhammad's army took the forts. Finally, the last few surrendered to him. Muhammad had several of the leaders of the Jewish settlement beheaded, one leader (Kinana) was tortured to reveal where buried treasure was hidden. Then when Kinana was near death, Muhammad commanded that he be beheaded. Many of the women and children were enslaved. Muhammad even took the most beautiful woman for himself and married her (Safiyah).
The whole truth in the story is that Kinana was put to death. But it was not for his refusal to give a clue to the hidden treasure. He was put to death because he had killed Mahmud Ibn Maslama (also Muslima). Tabari had reported it in unambiguous words: " Then the Holy Prophet (Peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) gave Kinana to Muhammad Ibn Maslama (Muslima), " and he put him to death in retaliation of the murder of his own brother, Mahmud Ibn Maslama (Muslima)." To learn more on this story pls read (Allama Shibli Nu'Mani, Sirat-Un-Nabi, volume II, p 173-174)
Some of Khaibar's residents made a deal with Muhammad. Instead of enslaving them, which would leave the rich orchards of Khaibar to go untended and unproductive, the Jews would give Muhammad and the Muslims 1/2 of all of what they produced. Muhammad accepted the deal, with the stipulation that they could be expelled at his slightest whim. Years later, Umar expelled the last remaining Jews from Khaibar.
Immediately following the conquest of Khaibar, a Jewish woman prepared a dinner for Muhammad and some of his men. Unknown to the Muslims was that she had put a poison into the lamb (some say goat) that was served at dinner. Muhammad ate some of the poisoned lamb and died as a result three years later.
Dear Plappville, Tell me, which poison takes THREE (3) YEARS to kill someone. More on that below as i reply your article. [b]
PRESENTATION OF ISLAMIC SOURCES
PART A - THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD
PART B - PREMONITIONS OF HIS DEATH
PART C - MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING
PART D - THE ADVENT OF MUHAMMAD'S DEATH
I will use quotes from 4 highly respected Islamic writings:
1) "Sahih Bukhari”. This Hadith is considered to be the most important Islamic book, after the Quran.
2) Ibn Ishaq's biography, the "Sirat Rasul Allah", (THE LIFE OF THE PROPHET), translated by A. Guillaume as "The Life of Muhammad", is the most authentic Sirat (biographical) literature recognized in Islam.
3) Ibn Sa'd biography, the "Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir" (Book of the Major Classes), Volume 2. Of the three, Ibn Sa'd's Sirat contains the most information relative to Muhammad's death. I will not attempt to cover the spectrum of subjects Ibn Sa'd addresses in his. However, I will cover and present his relevant material.
4) Tabari's "History". Tabari is one of the most highly respected authors in Islamic writings. His "History" is 39 volumes.
5) “Sahih Muslim”. This collection of Hadith is considered to be equal to, or slightly below Bukhari’s collection of Hadith.
@plappville, what you've done is to quote Islamic sources and make conclusions not found in these texts. Don't worry i'll answer all your questions below and prove to you that all your conclusions cannot be found in the hadith you quoted.
NOTE: I have quoted quite a bit of material. Some of it is redundant, but I feel that each quote I present provides an important detail concerning Muhammad's poisoning and death. Please forgive the tedious nature of the quotes; it is essential that I present the source material as accurately as possible.
NOTE: My comments appear in [ ] type brackets. Frequently the authors themselves enclose comments in ( ) type brackets. I will copy them as they appear in the text.
NOTE: In some cases I will leave out the chain of narrators because they are quite long, and not necessary for the context of the story.
Also, I will present quotes from the sources in as much of a chronological sequence as possible.
[/b]
PART A - THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD
A1
From Bukhari's Hadith 3.786:
Narrated Anas bin Malik: A Jewess brought a poisoned (cooked) sheep for the Prophet who ate from it. She was brought to the Prophet and he was asked, "Shall we kill her?" He said, "No." I continued to see the effect of the poison on the palate of the mouth of Allah's Apostle.
A2
From Bukhari's Hadith 4.394: Narrated Abu Huraira: When Khaibar was conquered, a roasted poisoned sheep was presented to the Prophet as a gift (by the Jews). The Prophet ordered, "Let all the Jews who have been here, be assembled before me." The Jews were collected and the Prophet said (to them), "I am going to ask you a question. Will you tell the truth?" They said, "Yes." The Prophet asked, "Who is your father?" They replied, "So-and-so." He said, "You have told a lie; your father is so-and-so." They said, "You are right." He said, "Will you now tell me the truth, if I ask you about something?" They replied, "Yes, O Abu Al-Qasim; and if we should tell a lie, you can realize our lie as you have done regarding our father." On that he asked, "Who are the people of the (Hell) Fire?" They said, "We shall remain in the (Hell) Fire for a short period, and after that you will replace us." The Prophet said, "You may be cursed and humiliated in it! By Allah, we shall never replace you in it." Then he asked, "Will you now tell me the truth if I ask you a question?" They said, "Yes, O Abu Al-Qasim." He asked, "Have you poisoned this sheep?" They said, "Yes." He asked, "What made you do so?" They said, "We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you."
A3
From Ibn Sa'd page 249:
Verily a Jewish woman presented poisoned (meat of) a she goat to the apostle of Allah. He took a piece form it, put it into his mouth, chewed it and threw it away. Then he said to the Companions: "Halt! Verily, its leg tells me that it is poisoned." Then he sent for the Jewish woman and asked her; "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I wanted to know if you are true; in that case Allah will surely inform you, and if you are a liar I shall relieve the people of you."
A4
From Ibn Sa'd page 249: [different narrator]
The apostle of Allah and his companions ate from it. It (goat) said: "I am poisoned." He [Muhammad] said to his Companions, "Hold you hands! because it has informed me that it is poisoned!" They withdrew their hands, but Bishr Ibn al-Bara expired. The apostle of Allah sent for her (Jewess) and asked her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I wanted to know if you are a prophet, in that case it will not harm you and if you are a king, I shall relieve the people of you. He gave orders and she was put to death. [SEE NOTE 1]
A5
From Ibn Sa'd page 250: [different narrator]
Verily a woman of the Jews of Khaibar presented poisoned (meat of) goat to the apostle of Allah. The he recognized that it was poisoned, so he sent for her and asked her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I thought if you are a prophet, Allah will inform you, and if you are a pretender, I shall relieve people of you. When the apostle of Allah felt sick, he got himself "cupped". [SEE NOTE 2]
A6
From Ibn Sa'd pages 251, 252: [different narrator]
, When the apostle of Allah conquered Khaibar and he had peace of mind, Zaynab Bint al-Harith the brother of Marhab, who was the spouse of Sallam Ibn Mishkam, inquired, "Which part of the goat is liked by Muhammad?" They said, "The foreleg." Then she slaughtered one from her goats and roasted it (the meat). Then she wanted a poison which could not fail. , The apostle of Allah took the foreleg, a piece of which he put into his mouth. Bishr took another bone and put it into his mouth. When the apostle of Allah ate one morsel of it Bishr ate his and other people also ate from it. Then the apostle of Allah said, "Hold back your hands! because this foreleg; , informed me that it is poisoned. Thereupon Bishr said, "By Him who has made you great! I discovered it from the morsel I took. Nothing prevented me from emitting it out, but the idea that I did not like to make your food unrelishing. When you had eaten what was in your mouth I did not like to save my life after yours, and I also thought you would not have eaten it if there was something wrong.
Bishr did not rise form his seat but his color changed to that of "taylsan" (a green cloth), The apostle of Allah sent for Zaynab and said to her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "You have done to my people what you have done. You have killed my father, my uncle and my husband, so I said to myself, "If you are a prophet, the foreleg will inform you; and others have said, "If you are a king we will get rid of you."",
The apostle of Allah lived after this three years till in consequence of his pain he passed away. During his illness he used to say, "I did not cease to find the effect of the (poisoned) morsel, I took at Khaibar and I suffered several times (from its effect) but now I feel the hour has come of the cutting of my jugular vein."
A7
From Tabari Volume 8, page 123, 124:
When the messenger of God rested from his labor, Zaynab bt. al-Harith, the wife of Sallam b. Mishkam, served him a roast sheep. She had asked what part of the sheep the messenger of God liked best and was told that it was the foreleg. So she loaded that part with poison, and she poisoned the rest of the sheep too. Then she brought it. When she set it before the messenger of God, he took the foreleg and chewed a bit of it, but he did not swallow it. With him was Bishr b. al-Bara b. Marur, who, like the messenger of God, took some of it; Bishr, however, swallowed it, while the messenger of God spat it out saying, "This bone informs me that it has been poisoned." He asked, "What led you to do this?" She said: "How you have afflicted my people is not hidden from you. So I said, "If he is a prophet, he will be informed; but if he is a king, I shall be rid of him"". The prophet forgave her. Bishr died of the food he had eaten.
A8
From Tabari Volume 8, page 124: [different narrator]
The messenger of God said during the illness from which he died - the mother of Bishr had come in to visit him - "Umm Bishr, at this very moment I feel my aorta being severed because of the food I ate with your son at Khaybar." [See NOTE 3]
NOTE 1: There is disagreement over whether of not Muhammad had the women who poisoned him put to death. In short, he had her put to death for the death of the other Muslim - Bishr, who quickly died from the poisoning. See the reports by Ibn Sa'd, p. 250.
NOTE 2: Cupping is essentially drawing a small amount of blood from your body. Muhammad believed that bleeding oneself was "the best of medicines".
NOTE 3: The note on quote A8 states that the expression, "it severed his aorta" need not be taken literally; it is used metaphorically for extreme pain.
[b]PART B - PREMONITIONS OF HIS DEATH
B1
From Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:
Narrated Ibn Abbas:
'Umar bin Al-Khattab used to let Ibn Abbas sit beside him, so 'AbdurRahman bin 'Auf said to 'Umar, "We have sons similar to him." 'Umar replied, "(I respect him) because of his status that you know." 'Umar then asked Ibn 'Abbas about the meaning of this Holy Verse:-- "When comes the help of Allah and the conquest of Mecca . . ." (110.1)
Ibn 'Abbas replied, "That indicated the death of Allah's Apostle which Allah informed him of." 'Umar said, "I do not understand of it except what you understand."
Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O
'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this
time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."
Yes, he felt still felt the effects of the pain caused by the food poisoning, but the hadith does not say that's what killed him. The poison was meant to kill him immediately like it did Bishr, but this is 3years later. B2
From Ibn Sa'd page 244:
, and there has been no prophet but he has lived half the life of the prophet preceding him. Jesus the son of Mary lived for one hundred and twenty five years, and this is the sixty second year of my life. He (prophet) died half the year after this.
You quoted yourself below, that the prophet(saw) was giving a choice to stay on earth or to to paradise, So let me ask you a question, why would you stay on earth to reach 125yrs old if the Lord offered you a chance to come enjoy in paradise when you attain the age of 62yrs? B3
From Ibn Sa'd page 239:
The appointed hour (of death) of the apostle of Allah came near and he was ordered to recite repeatedly "tasbih" (lit. glorification) and ask for His forgiveness.
Your quote above defeats your own argument that moses(as) and jesus(as) knew their appointed time of death and muhammed(saw) did not. If muhammed(saw) did not know his time, then why was he ordered to repeat the tasbih?
B4
From Ibn Sa'd page 240:
When (the Surah) Allah's succor and the triumph comes; was revealed he (prophet) said: (It signifies) call from Allah and departure from the world.
B5
From Tabari Volume 9 page 108:
When the prophet returned to Medina after performing the Pilgrimage of Completion, he began to have a complaint of illness. As travel was allowed (after the pilgrimage), the news of the prophet's illness spread, Then in Muharram the prophet complained of the pain from which he died.
The pain of illness here does not refer to the poison. Yes, it's true that the prophet(saw) felt the agonies of pain or illness when he was about to die but no where in the hadith does it infer that the pain is from the poisoning.
PART C - MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING
NOTE: It was already quoted from Ibn Sa'd above (page 250 that Muhammad tried to get himself healed of the poisoning.
C1
From Ibn Sa'd page 263
Verily during his illness the prophet recited "al-Mu'awwadhatayn" [Sura 113, and 114], and blow his breath upon his body while rubbing his face. [This was done in an effort to be healed].
C2
From Sahih Muslim volume 3, # 5440
Aisha reported that when Allah’s Messenger fell ill, he recited over his body Mu’awwidhatan and blew over him and when his sickness was aggravated I used to recite over him and rub him with his hand with the hope that it was more blessed. Also ref. Hadith # 5441.
C2
From Ibn Sa'd page 265
The apostle of Allah fell ill and he i.e. Gabriel, chanted on him, saying, "In the name of Allah I chant on to ward off from you every thing that harms you and (to ward off you) against every envier and from every evil eye and Allah will heal you."
C3
From Ibn Sa'd page 265 [Different narrator]
Aisha, the wife of the prophet used to say, "When the apostle of Allah fell ill, Gabriel chanted on him saying, "In the name of Allah Who will cure you and Who will heal you from every malady (and will ward off) the evil of envier who envies and from smite of the evil eye.""
C4
From Ibn Sa'd page 322
Verily, whenever the apostle of Allah fell ill, he asked for recovery, from Allah. But in the illness as a result of which he died, he did not pray for recovery; he used to say, "O soul! What has happened to thee that thou are seeking refuge in every place of refuge?"
[/b]
All these references above, does not show that this particular illness that led to his death was a result of the poisoning. @Plappville, You or whoever the writer of this article was just picking different hadith from different scenarios that happened at different times and trying to lump them together to buttress your false claim
PART D - THE ADVENT OF MUHAMMAD'S DEATH
D1 [again quoting from Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:]
Narrated 'Aisha:
The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O 'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."
He felt the pain, doesn't mean that's what killed him, "My dad got shot on the leg when he was young and used to feel the pains when he was getting old and on his death bed, does that mean it was the gun shot that killed him?"
D2
From Ibn Hisham page 678:
While matters were thus the apostle began to suffer from the illness by which God took him to what honor and compassion He intended for him shortly before the end of Safar or in the beginning of Rabi'ul-awwal. It began, so I have been told, when he went to Baqi'u'l-Gharqad in the middle of the night and prayed for the dead. Then he returned to his family and in the morning his sufferings began.
D3
From Ibn Hisham page 679:
Then the apostle's illness worsened and he suffered much pain. He said, "Pour seven skins of water from different wells over me so that I may go out to the men and instruct them." We made him sit down in a tub belonging to Hafsa d. Umar and we poured water over him until he cried, "Enough, enough!"
, then he [Muhammad] said, "God has given one of his servants the choice between this world and that which is with God and he has chosen the latter."
This quote above again defeats your claim that prophet muhammed (saw) unlike moses(as) and jesus (as) did not know when he was going to die D4
From Ibn Hisham page 680:
Then some of his wives gathered to him, while his uncle Abbas was with him, and they agreed to force him to take medicine. Abbas said, "Let me force him," but they did it. When he recovered he asked who had treated him thus. When they told him it was his uncle he said, "This is a medicine which women have brought from that country," and he pointed in the direction of Abyssinia [Ethiopia]. When he asked why they had done that his uncle said, "We were afraid that you would get pleurisy;" he replied, "That is a disease which God would not afflict me with. Let no one stop in the house until they have been forced to take this medicine, except my uncle." Maymuna [one of Muhammad's wives] was forced to take it although she was fasting because of the apostle's oath, as a punishment for what they had done to him.
This was a voluntary fast which can be broken anytime. It was a fast to expatiate an oath, so that makes it a voluntary fast. And in Islam, a husband can command the wife to break her voluntary fast
D5
From Ibn Sa'd page 294
Umm Bishr [the mother of the Muslim man who also died eating poison], came to the prophet during his illness and said, "O apostle of Allah! I never saw fever like it in any one." The prophet said to her, "Our trial is double and so our reward [in heaven], is double. What do the people say about it [his illness]?" She said, "They say it is pleurisy." Thereupon the apostle said, "Allah will not like to make His apostle suffer from it (pleurisy) because it indicates the possession of Satan, but (my disease is the result of) the morsel that I had taken along your son. It has cut my jugular vein."
SEE NOTE 3
D6
From Ibn Hisham page 682:
, that he heard Aisha [one of Muhammad's wives] say: "The apostle died in my bosom during my turn: [the night Muhammad was to spend sleeping with her] I had wronged none in regard to him. It was due to my ignorance and extreme youth that the apostle died in my arms."
D7
From Ibn Sa'd page 322:
When the last moment of the prophet was near, he used to draw a sheet over his face; but when he felt uneasy, he removed it from his face and said: "Allah's damnation be on the Jews and the Christians who made the graves of their prophets objects of worship."
NOTE 3: Pleurisy is an infection of a lung membrane. It is painful. I don't know why Muhammad considered this infection to be from Satan, but poisoning would not be from Satan.
SUMMARY OF THE SOURCES
Muhammad attacked Khaibar. He destroyed, tortured, murdered, plundered, and enslaved many people (ref Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, volume 2, page 134, 136, 137). They were not preparing to attack him. A Jewish woman, whose family had been wiped out by Muhammad, put poison into a lamb and fed it to Muhammad and the other Muslims. Muhammad ingested some of the poisoned lamb and began to feel it's effects. He died three years later as a result of the poisoning.
DISCUSSION
What needs to be investigated here are the circumstances of Muhammad's death. The Jews were planning to murder him. The Jews believed that a real prophet would be forewarned of their deed but an impostor wouldn't be warned by God. The Muslims also believed this; the other Muslim who died said that he didn't think Muhammad would eat of something that was poisoned (see quote in A6).
The Jews were right, Muhammad did eat of the poison, and did die from it. They proved, according to their test, that Muhammad was not a prophet. As they said (quote A2):
"We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you."
These Jews were convinced that a real prophet would know what was going on. In this case Muhammad didn't know. Only after Muhammad ate from the lamb did the lamb "talk to him". I don't think that that was anything miraculous in itself; even the other Muslim knew it was bad before Muhammad ate from it. Most adults know when they are eating something that is bad. So for Muhammad to say the sheep "talked" to him is not prophetic at all. Even a child spits out bad tasting food.
Does the food talk to the child?
Many times previously, Muhammad claimed to have had "revelations" that warned him of danger. He even used one of these convenient "revelations" as grounds to attack the Jewish settlement of Banu Nadhir. Yet at Khaibar the revelation came too late: too late to save his own life, too late to save Bishr's life.
This quote lets us know the poison was to kill the prophet (saw) immediately as it did to Bishr. The poison did not kill the muhammed(saw) because he is a prophet.
As his illness wore on, Muhammad began to pray for healing – he even rubbed his “healing” hand upon himself. Gabriel also got into the act and prayed for his healing (see quotes C2 & C3). Muhammad even got himself "cupped" (the best of all medicines!), (quote A5). Obviously, at this point in time, Muhammad wanted to be healed.
All prophets are human beings, they fall sick and feel hunger, so what's wrong with a prophet seeking to be healed when sick or seeking food when hungry?
But it didn't help. As it progressively got worse, Muhammad realized that he was dying, ceased praying for healing (quote C4), and claimed that Allah had given him a choice to going to Paradise, or living on earth. Muhammad said he then wanted to go to Paradise. Knowing the game was up, he made the best out of a failed situation.
why are you stating "and claimed that allah had given him a choice , " this 'claim' as you put it is well recorded in many authentic books including sahih bukhari that you claim to derive these hadith you are quoting; so its an authentic recorded fact that GOD gave him a choice to go to paradise or stay on earth? and he chose PARADISE
Muhammad's earlier premonitions of his deaths read more like the cosmic words of a mystic. Nothing definite is ever said about them until after his approaching death. Perhaps he had seen this type of death before and knew the outcome. It doesn't take a prophet or a "revelation" to know that death is near. Let's stick to the facts, please
My basic point is this: the Jews proved that Muhammad was not a real prophet. He ingested the poison, so did at least one of his followers. He attempted to be healed, he tried his medicine, and his form of “laying on of hands”, his prayer, Aisha’s prayer, and even Gabriel’s prayer, but in the end, he died from the poison.
Whao! you compiled many hadith spanning three (3) years and lumped everything into one incident just to buttress your point, you're a real genius.
QUESTIONS
1) If Muhammad were a real prophet of God, why didn't he catch the poison before he ate it?
According to the hadith you quoted, the poison was meant to kill him instantly just as it did Bishr.
Secondly, there's even no basis to base the prophethood of muhammed(saw) on the presumptions of the jews. As a christian, if you do so, then you are saying the jews were also right about Jesus (as), According to the book of mathew, the Jews claim that jesus(as) is an imposter, a false messiah, which is why he was killed and could not save himself, as the Bible says:
Matthew 27:33-50
33 And when they were come unto a place called Golgotha, that is to say, a place of a skull, 34 They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink. 35 And they crucified him, and parted his garments, casting lots: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots. 36 And sitting down they watched him there; 37 And set up over his head his accusation written, THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS. 38 Then were there two thieves crucified with him, one on the right hand, and another on the left. 39 And they that passed by reviled him, wagging their heads, 40 And saying, Thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days, save thyself. If thou be the Son of God, come down from the cross. 41 Likewise also the chief priests mocking him, with the scribes and elders, said, 42 He saved others; himself he cannot save. If he be the King of Israel, let him now come down from the cross, and we will believe him. 43 He trusted in God; let him deliver him now, if he will have him: for he said, I am the Son of God. 44 The thieves also, which were crucified with him, cast the same in his teeth. 45 Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour. 46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? 47 Some of them that stood there, when they heard that, said, This man calleth for Elias. 48 And straightway one of them ran, and took a spunge, and filled it with vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink. 49 The rest said, Let be, let us see whether Elias will come to save him.
50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
2) If you believe that it was God's will for Muhammad to have eaten the poison, along with Bishr, why then did Muhammad try to get well? Even Gabriel prayed for Muhammad to get better, but Allah didn't answer that prayer either.
Again, you've lumped up the incident of eating the poison with the time when prophet muhammed(saw) fell ill and passed away. This was three (3) yrs apart and many great incidents happened in between those time and the prophet was very healthy and hearty within those 3yrs. Also remember, the prophet (as) led a 10,000 men- strong army to Mecca which the inhabitants(quraysh) gave up without a fight. Also remember, the prophet performed the rigorous acts of hajj after this so called poisoning and he even slaughtered about 62camels alone. So how could he have done all this if the so called poisoning you claimed led him to his immediate death.
Man proposes, God opposes! Angel Gabriel(as) is not God, so if God decides to take muhammed(saw)'s life, who is gabriel(as) or muhammed(as) to disapprove.
3) Why did Gabriel not know the will of Allah? Why would Gabriel pray if Allah had decided death?
@plappville, you make me laugh at your questions, No one knows what tomorrow will bring except Allah, not even Muhammed(saw), Jesus(as) nor angel Gabriel(as)
4) Why did Muhammad force the other Muslims to drink the medicine he was given? One of them was one of his wives, and she was fasting. He forced her to break her fast and drink the medicine as well. Doesn't this sound vindictive and petty?
Medicine is a cure, why shouldn't they drink it? His wife was offering a voluntary fast, so it's not a sin to break voluntary fast. Tell me something, if your whole family eat rice and you suddenly heard there was rice poisoning and you were giving medicine to take as precautionary measure, wouldn't you force your whole family to take it even if your wife was fasting?
5) Why, when just before his death, did Muhammad have to utter a curse upon the Christians and the Jews? Wouldn't it have been better for Muhammad to pray for guidance for them? This also sounds like a jealous, bitter prayer to Allah. Muhammad prayed for and uttered curses instead of asking Allah to guide people.
Read the hadith well, the curse is not on every jew/xtian but the ones that turned their prophet's graveyard into shrines (idol worshipping), "Allah's damnation be on the Jews and the Christians who made the graves of their prophets objects of worship." By the way , Moses(as) and Jesus(as) too cursed their people
6) Why would pleurisy, which is a normal infection of the lung membrane, be considered to be from Satan, but being poisoned would not be from Satan?
And your point is?
CONCLUSION
Muhammad was not a real prophet, he was a false prophet. He died as a result of eating poison that he didn't know about. The poisoned lamb "spoke" to him too late. Only when he realized he was dying did Muhammad "spiritualize" his suffering and coming death. Prior to that he tried to get well.
Already answered this above, he was warned by the poisoned lamb and the poison did not kill the prophet muhammed(saw) unlike Bishr which the poison killed immediately. There's no hadith that links the illness he suffered three(3) yrs later to the poisoning he ate. He only used to feels pains from the poisoning, which does not portend to it killing him.
Moses knew about his coming death (Deut 34:1-5). Jesus also knew of His future death (Mark 8:32, 32). Yet Muhammad was in the dark until he himself realized he was going to die.
You quoted yourself (see above) from the book of sahih bukhari he was asked to chose paradise or remain on earth, and he chose paradise. Even reading through deutronomy, moses(as) only knew the land he would die and not the exact time.Nor did jesus him self know the exact time of his death s in the bk of mathew 27:36, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
Paul the apostle was bitten by a poisonous snake (Acts 28:1-6), but Paul suffered no ill effects from the bite. God had his hand of protection on Paul, to finish the work laid out for him. Muhammad died so suddenly that there was confusion as to would be the next ruler of the Islamic state. To this day, part of that confusion remains. The Islamic world is divided in part because of this issue (Shia vs. Sunni). Wouldn't Allah, who abhors division within the Ummah have protected Muhammad long enough to insure that his state remain unified, and a clearly defined successor be named?
This is really not an intelligent assumption, It's just like saying, since God disapproves of evil deeds or evil doers why does he keep satan alive.
Jesus predicted false prophets would come into the world and mislead many (Matthew 24:24). Muhammad was such a false prophet. Both Jesus and Moses knew God face to face, Muhammad only had a spirit or angel he called "Gabriel" speaking to him. In the end, even this angel's prayers were not answered by Allah. Could it be that this "Gabriel" was preaching a false religion (Galatians 1: to Muhammad? Could Gabriel have been a deceptive demon or Satan himself?
Okay for argument sake, let me even accept that muhammed(saw) was killed by the female jew, but does that prove he was a fake prophet. Afterall, many prophets were killed by jews, according to the bk of mathew 23:37, O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, [thou] that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under [her] wings, and ye would not!
http://answering-islam.org/Silas/mo-death.htm
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| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by proo212(m): 10:24am On Jan 02, 2012 |
ivoice247, i assume this means islamic voice 24/7, whilst you were trying to refute plappville as to which poison takes three years to kill someone, as i read from the write up, it says your prophet did not ingest the meat so we see that even a bit of the meat that touch his mouth was enough to make him ill. Bashir did instantly because he swallowed the meat. The meat must have been deadly if he complained afterwards that what he ate was killing him. You can try and spin this all you want but he himself admitted from different narrations. Moving on, another lie your prophet told in all of this debacle B2
From Ibn Sa'd page 244:
, and there has been no prophet but he has lived half the life of the prophet preceding him. Jesus the son of Mary lived for one hundred and twenty five years, and this is the sixty second year of my life. He (prophet) died half the year after this.
Quote
You quoted yourself below, that the prophet(saw) was giving a choice to stay on earth or to to paradise, So let me ask you a question, why would you stay on earth to reach 125yrs old if the Lord offered you a chance to come enjoy in paradise when you attain the age of 62yrs? Now where in history did Jesus Christ whilst he was man on earth live till 125years? All sources show that he lived on earth for 33-33.5 years If your sources cannot get that right oh boy!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 10:49am On Jan 02, 2012 |
proo212:
ivoice247, i assume this means islamic voice 24/7, whilst you were trying to refute plappville as to which poison takes three years to kill someone, as i read from the write up, it says your prophet did not ingest the meat so we see that even a bit of the meat that touch his mouth was enough to make him ill.
so there is a poison that you can touch that can still make you ill after 3 years? can you tell us what is the name of that poison?
Bashir did instantly because he swallowed the meat. The meat must have been deadly if he complained afterwards that what he ate was killing him. You can try and spin this all you want but he himself admitted from different narrations.
so what you are saying here is that the Prophet (sa) did not swallow the meat because he miraculously knew it was poisoned?why didnt you tell us that?
Moving on, another lie your prophet told in all of this debacle
we keep telling you that not all hadith is taken at face value.we examine the hadith individually to know what is correct and what is not very correct and what is false.the hadith books are just like the bible that has passed through the hands,narration,reporting,editing,addition and subtraction of fallible men.only the Quran is 100% authentic because of divine promise for its preservation and the effort muslims put to have it unblemished.
Now where in history did Jesus Christ whilst he was man on earth live till 125years? All sources show that he lived on earth for 33-33.5 years If your sources cannot get that right oh boy!!!
which history? are you taking your confused new testament books that cannot give consistent reports on Jesus' life for history? even if i am to accept that the hadith is correct on the age of Jesus and believe in it 100%,you have nothing to prove otherwise than to quote your new testament.so it is your word against my word.and then what?nothing!!!shi-shi!!! |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by proo212(m): 11:11am On Jan 02, 2012 |
If he knew the meat was poisoned why did he not get one of his "revelations" that the meat was poisoned? If he was so inspired he shouldn't even have asked the Jewish woman to cook for him after killing her family. That is more like tempting fate.
These pick and mix hadiths sef. Anyone that doesn't say what you like then they are not authentic. So which hadiths are to be believed? Or are hadiths to be believed but not all contents of all hadiths are to be believed? Please educate me and i mean no offence by that. Because I see that Sahih Muslim and Sahih Buhkari were also quoted and these are supposed to be the most authentic ones.
Contrary to your mindset, the new testament has one thing going for it, the Lordship of Jesus Christ, the essence that he came as a man and was divine, was revealed to be divine. The apostles believed he is God in the flesh, some people believed even demons and centurions as well as some Pharisees. Because of that belief, the apostles preached the death and resurrection and forgiveness of sins and salvation. (There is no ambiguity about that).
If this is so, how are they inconsistent?
If we look at even secular sources, they agree on the dates of 30-36AD. The difference between 36 AD and 125AD is wide, I am sure you agree with me. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 12:06pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
proo212:
If he knew the meat was poisoned why did he not get one of his "revelations" that the meat was poisoned? If he was so inspired he shouldn't even have asked the Jewish woman to cook for him after killing her family. That is more like tempting fate.
spare us your would've,could've,should've!we dont deal with assumptions. the jewess wanted to test him and he certainly passed the test.whatever would,could and should you have,save it in your imagination.no one killed her family.her presence is evidence to that.her male relatives were warriors who wanted to kill or be killed and they were killed.also,she set the trap to get him poisoned.you think she would be shouting that her brother or father had being killed,so she wanted to poison him? she pretended to be showing a "kind gesture".there was nothing personal against the woman and nothing at all against her tribe or the the jews.the Prophet (sa) himself to show reconciliation,later married a jewess from the defeated tribes.that is the forgiving spirit of Islam against the members of the tribes that allied with the pagans and plotted to eliminate islam and muslims.
These pick and mix hadiths sef. Anyone that doesn't say what you like then they are not authentic. So which hadiths are to be believed? Or are hadiths to be believed but not all contents of all hadiths are to be believed? Please educate me and i mean no offence by that. Because I see that Sahih Muslim and Sahih Buhkari were also quoted and these are supposed to be the most authentic ones.
to me as a shia,i do not use sahih bukhari or sahih muslim at all.i only quote them when we hold dialogue with our sunni brothers and sisters.these are the most reliable sources (not most authentic) to sunnis. however to explain to you,the first test we are told to use for any hadith is that the hadith must [b]NOT[/b]contradict the Quran.then any detail the hadith present such as narrating events,can be cmpared with other hadiths.then there is also the chain of narrations and the men who narrated the hadith.they are also examined.there are grades for hadith.there are hadith that are widely reported.the science of hadith is a field on its own.
Contrary to your mindset, the new testament has one thing going for it, the Lordship of Jesus Christ, the essence that he came as a man and was divine, was revealed to be divine. The apostles believed he is God in the flesh, some people believed even demons and centurions as well as some Pharisees. Because of that belief, the apostles preached the death and resurrection and forgiveness of sins and salvation. (There is no ambiguity about that).
If this is so, how are they inconsistent?
you are even inserting your words and beliefs into the new testament.if the apostles believed Jesus was divine or in other words a "god" why did it take councils centuries after to make that a christian doctrine?how can you even base any belief on books that give different,inconsistent and contradictory accounts on the most fundamental beliefs in your religion? when we muslims identify that in the hadiths,we put them to check.but you preach,believe and hope for salvation while the facts are glaring that you are deceiving yourself.take for instance Jesus' statements that he was only sent to the children of israel and then the contradictory account in mark 16:9-20 that he ordered his followers to preach to the world.even bible scholars admit that verses 9-20 are not authentic and have relegated them to a footnote.but the deceit is in still having them contained in the bible and used as source of information you christians place your preaching,faith and belief on!
If we look at even secular sources, they agree on the dates of 30-36AD. The difference between 36 AD and 125AD is wide, I am sure you agree with me.
secular sources? i have never heard of them because as far as i know on the age of Jesus,there are people today who also use so called "secular sources" to support their denial of the existence of Jesus.they believe Jesus never existed and he is an imaginary figure.and to be honest as you must definitely agree,the primary sources of the life of Jesus are taken to be the four "gospels" of the new testament.so there is really little substantial evidence to back up many things on Jesus since those four books are not in comformity with themselves. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 3:51pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
LagosShia:
a liar is not my brother! so hold your thick mouth and dont repeat that rubbish again!!!
you have lied once by claiming that Muhammad (sa) died as a result of poisoning by a jew.this is the topic of this thread started by you:
"Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved"
now you are again lying that i am denying islamic history,when i did not deny anything.
to answer me a simple question,you have refused.now you are running away as christians are fond of doing in every thread.dont start what you cannot finish.dont reply tomorrow.reply today and answer my simple question.i beg of you!!!
But i told u i will join u today, i ve life outside NL ok! each time has his duties |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 3:53pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
ivoice247:
About 6 weeks later Muhammad led his army and attacked the Jews while they were on their way to work on their date palms. Khaibar was a settlement defended by a number of forts spread apart from each other. One by one Muhammad's army took the forts. Finally, the last few surrendered to him. Muhammad had several of the leaders of the Jewish settlement beheaded, one leader (Kinana) was tortured to reveal where buried treasure was hidden. Then when Kinana was near death, Muhammad commanded that he be beheaded. Many of the women and children were enslaved. Muhammad even took the most beautiful woman for himself and married her (Safiyah).
Some of Khaibar's residents made a deal with Muhammad. Instead of enslaving them, which would leave the rich orchards of Khaibar to go untended and unproductive, the Jews would give Muhammad and the Muslims 1/2 of all of what they produced. Muhammad accepted the deal, with the stipulation that they could be expelled at his slightest whim. Years later, Umar expelled the last remaining Jews from Khaibar.
Immediately following the conquest of Khaibar, a Jewish woman prepared a dinner for Muhammad and some of his men. Unknown to the Muslims was that she had put a poison into the lamb (some say goat) that was served at dinner. Muhammad ate some of the poisoned lamb and died as a result three years later.[/size]
[b]
PRESENTATION OF ISLAMIC SOURCES
PART A - THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD
PART B - PREMONITIONS OF HIS DEATH
PART C - MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING
PART D - THE ADVENT OF MUHAMMAD'S DEATH
I will use quotes from 4 highly respected Islamic writings:
1) "Sahih Bukhari”. This Hadith is considered to be the most important Islamic book, after the Quran.
2) Ibn Ishaq's biography, the "Sirat Rasul Allah", (THE LIFE OF THE PROPHET), translated by A. Guillaume as "The Life of Muhammad", is the most authentic Sirat (biographical) literature recognized in Islam.
3) Ibn Sa'd biography, the "Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir" (Book of the Major Classes), Volume 2. Of the three, Ibn Sa'd's Sirat contains the most information relative to Muhammad's death. I will not attempt to cover the spectrum of subjects Ibn Sa'd addresses in his. However, I will cover and present his relevant material.
4) Tabari's "History". Tabari is one of the most highly respected authors in Islamic writings. His "History" is 39 volumes.
5) “Sahih Muslim”. This collection of Hadith is considered to be equal to, or slightly below Bukhari’s collection of Hadith.
NOTE: I have quoted quite a bit of material. Some of it is redundant, but I feel that each quote I present provides an important detail concerning Muhammad's poisoning and death. Please forgive the tedious nature of the quotes; it is essential that I present the source material as accurately as possible.
NOTE: My comments appear in [ ] type brackets. Frequently the authors themselves enclose comments in ( ) type brackets. I will copy them as they appear in the text.
NOTE: In some cases I will leave out the chain of narrators because they are quite long, and not necessary for the context of the story.
Also, I will present quotes from the sources in as much of a chronological sequence as possible.
[/b]
PART A - THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD
A1
From Bukhari's Hadith 3.786:
Narrated Anas bin Malik: A Jewess brought a poisoned (cooked) sheep for the Prophet who ate from it. She was brought to the Prophet and he was asked, "Shall we kill her?" He said, "No." I continued to see the effect of the poison on the palate of the mouth of Allah's Apostle.
A2
From Bukhari's Hadith 4.394: Narrated Abu Huraira: When Khaibar was conquered, a roasted poisoned sheep was presented to the Prophet as a gift (by the Jews). The Prophet ordered, "Let all the Jews who have been here, be assembled before me." The Jews were collected and the Prophet said (to them), "I am going to ask you a question. Will you tell the truth?" They said, "Yes." The Prophet asked, "Who is your father?" They replied, "So-and-so." He said, "You have told a lie; your father is so-and-so." They said, "You are right." He said, "Will you now tell me the truth, if I ask you about something?" They replied, "Yes, O Abu Al-Qasim; and if we should tell a lie, you can realize our lie as you have done regarding our father." On that he asked, "Who are the people of the (Hell) Fire?" They said, "We shall remain in the (Hell) Fire for a short period, and after that you will replace us." The Prophet said, "You may be cursed and humiliated in it! By Allah, we shall never replace you in it." Then he asked, "Will you now tell me the truth if I ask you a question?" They said, "Yes, O Abu Al-Qasim." He asked, "Have you poisoned this sheep?" They said, "Yes." He asked, "What made you do so?" They said, "We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you."
A3
From Ibn Sa'd page 249:
Verily a Jewish woman presented poisoned (meat of) a she goat to the apostle of Allah. He took a piece form it, put it into his mouth, chewed it and threw it away. Then he said to the Companions: "Halt! Verily, its leg tells me that it is poisoned." Then he sent for the Jewish woman and asked her; "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I wanted to know if you are true; in that case Allah will surely inform you, and if you are a liar I shall relieve the people of you."
A4
From Ibn Sa'd page 249: [different narrator]
The apostle of Allah and his companions ate from it. It (goat) said: "I am poisoned." He [Muhammad] said to his Companions, "Hold you hands! because it has informed me that it is poisoned!" They withdrew their hands, but Bishr Ibn al-Bara expired. The apostle of Allah sent for her (Jewess) and asked her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I wanted to know if you are a prophet, in that case it will not harm you and if you are a king, I shall relieve the people of you. He gave orders and she was put to death. [SEE NOTE 1]
A5
From Ibn Sa'd page 250: [different narrator]
Verily a woman of the Jews of Khaibar presented poisoned (meat of) goat to the apostle of Allah. The he recognized that it was poisoned, so he sent for her and asked her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "I thought if you are a prophet, Allah will inform you, and if you are a pretender, I shall relieve people of you. When the apostle of Allah felt sick, he got himself "cupped". [SEE NOTE 2]
A6
From Ibn Sa'd pages 251, 252: [different narrator]
, When the apostle of Allah conquered Khaibar and he had peace of mind, Zaynab Bint al-Harith the brother of Marhab, who was the spouse of Sallam Ibn Mishkam, inquired, "Which part of the goat is liked by Muhammad?" They said, "The foreleg." Then she slaughtered one from her goats and roasted it (the meat). Then she wanted a poison which could not fail. , The apostle of Allah took the foreleg, a piece of which he put into his mouth. Bishr took another bone and put it into his mouth. When the apostle of Allah ate one morsel of it Bishr ate his and other people also ate from it. Then the apostle of Allah said, "Hold back your hands! because this foreleg; , informed me that it is poisoned. Thereupon Bishr said, "By Him who has made you great! I discovered it from the morsel I took. Nothing prevented me from emitting it out, but the idea that I did not like to make your food unrelishing. When you had eaten what was in your mouth I did not like to save my life after yours, and I also thought you would not have eaten it if there was something wrong.
Bishr did not rise form his seat but his color changed to that of "taylsan" (a green cloth), The apostle of Allah sent for Zaynab and said to her, "What induced you to do what you have done?" She replied, "You have done to my people what you have done. You have killed my father, my uncle and my husband, so I said to myself, "If you are a prophet, the foreleg will inform you; and others have said, "If you are a king we will get rid of you."",
The apostle of Allah lived after this three years till in consequence of his pain he passed away. During his illness he used to say, "I did not cease to find the effect of the (poisoned) morsel, I took at Khaibar and I suffered several times (from its effect) but now I feel the hour has come of the cutting of my jugular vein."
A7
From Tabari Volume 8, page 123, 124:
When the messenger of God rested from his labor, Zaynab bt. al-Harith, the wife of Sallam b. Mishkam, served him a roast sheep. She had asked what part of the sheep the messenger of God liked best and was told that it was the foreleg. So she loaded that part with poison, and she poisoned the rest of the sheep too. Then she brought it. When she set it before the messenger of God, he took the foreleg and chewed a bit of it, but he did not swallow it. With him was Bishr b. al-Bara b. Marur, who, like the messenger of God, took some of it; Bishr, however, swallowed it, while the messenger of God spat it out saying, "This bone informs me that it has been poisoned." He asked, "What led you to do this?" She said: "How you have afflicted my people is not hidden from you. So I said, "If he is a prophet, he will be informed; but if he is a king, I shall be rid of him"". The prophet forgave her. Bishr died of the food he had eaten.
A8
From Tabari Volume 8, page 124: [different narrator]
The messenger of God said during the illness from which he died - the mother of Bishr had come in to visit him - "Umm Bishr, at this very moment I feel my aorta being severed because of the food I ate with your son at Khaybar." [See NOTE 3]
NOTE 1: There is disagreement over whether of not Muhammad had the women who poisoned him put to death. In short, he had her put to death for the death of the other Muslim - Bishr, who quickly died from the poisoning. See the reports by Ibn Sa'd, p. 250.
NOTE 2: Cupping is essentially drawing a small amount of blood from your body. Muhammad believed that bleeding oneself was "the best of medicines".
NOTE 3: The note on quote A8 states that the expression, "it severed his aorta" need not be taken literally; it is used metaphorically for extreme pain.
[b]PART B - PREMONITIONS OF HIS DEATH
B1
From Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:
Narrated Ibn Abbas:
'Umar bin Al-Khattab used to let Ibn Abbas sit beside him, so 'AbdurRahman bin 'Auf said to 'Umar, "We have sons similar to him." 'Umar replied, "(I respect him) because of his status that you know." 'Umar then asked Ibn 'Abbas about the meaning of this Holy Verse:-- "When comes the help of Allah and the conquest of Mecca . . ." (110.1)
Ibn 'Abbas replied, "That indicated the death of Allah's Apostle which Allah informed him of." 'Umar said, "I do not understand of it except what you understand."
Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O
'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this
time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."
B2
From Ibn Sa'd page 244:
, and there has been no prophet but he has lived half the life of the prophet preceding him. Jesus the son of Mary lived for one hundred and twenty five years, and this is the sixty second year of my life. He (prophet) died half the year after this.
B3
From Ibn Sa'd page 239:
The appointed hour (of death) of the apostle of Allah came near and he was ordered to recite repeatedly "tasbih" (lit. glorification) and ask for His forgiveness.
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B4
From Ibn Sa'd page 240:
When (the Surah) Allah's succor and the triumph comes; was revealed he (prophet) said: (It signifies) call from Allah and departure from the world.
B5
From Tabari Volume 9 page 108:
When the prophet returned to Medina after performing the Pilgrimage of Completion, he began to have a complaint of illness. As travel was allowed (after the pilgrimage), the news of the prophet's illness spread, Then in Muharram the prophet complained of the pain from which he died.
PART C - MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING
NOTE: It was already quoted from Ibn Sa'd above (page 250 that Muhammad tried to get himself healed of the poisoning.
C1
From Ibn Sa'd page 263
Verily during his illness the prophet recited "al-Mu'awwadhatayn" [Sura 113, and 114], and blow his breath upon his body while rubbing his face. [This was done in an effort to be healed].
C2
From Sahih Muslim volume 3, # 5440
Aisha reported that when Allah’s Messenger fell ill, he recited over his body Mu’awwidhatan and blew over him and when his sickness was aggravated I used to recite over him and rub him with his hand with the hope that it was more blessed. Also ref. Hadith # 5441.
C2
From Ibn Sa'd page 265
The apostle of Allah fell ill and he i.e. Gabriel, chanted on him, saying, "In the name of Allah I chant on to ward off from you every thing that harms you and (to ward off you) against every envier and from every evil eye and Allah will heal you."
C3
From Ibn Sa'd page 265 [Different narrator]
Aisha, the wife of the prophet used to say, "When the apostle of Allah fell ill, Gabriel chanted on him saying, "In the name of Allah Who will cure you and Who will heal you from every malady (and will ward off) the evil of envier who envies and from smite of the evil eye.""
C4
From Ibn Sa'd page 322
Verily, whenever the apostle of Allah fell ill, he asked for recovery, from Allah. But in the illness as a result of which he died, he did not pray for recovery; he used to say, "O soul! What has happened to thee that thou are seeking refuge in every place of refuge?"
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PART D - THE ADVENT OF MUHAMMAD'S DEATH
D1 [again quoting from Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:]
Narrated 'Aisha:
The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O 'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."
D2
From Ibn Hisham page 678:
While matters were thus the apostle began to suffer from the illness by which God took him to what honor and compassion He intended for him shortly before the end of Safar or in the beginning of Rabi'ul-awwal. It began, so I have been told, when he went to Baqi'u'l-Gharqad in the middle of the night and prayed for the dead. Then he returned to his family and in the morning his sufferings began.
D3
From Ibn Hisham page 679:
Then the apostle's illness worsened and he suffered much pain. He said, "Pour seven skins of water from different wells over me so that I may go out to the men and instruct them." We made him sit down in a tub belonging to Hafsa d. Umar and we poured water over him until he cried, "Enough, enough!"
, then he [Muhammad] said, "God has given one of his servants the choice between this world and that which is with God and he has chosen the latter."
D4
From Ibn Hisham page 680:
Then some of his wives gathered to him, while his uncle Abbas was with him, and they agreed to force him to take medicine. Abbas said, "Let me force him," but they did it. When he recovered he asked who had treated him thus. When they told him it was his uncle he said, "This is a medicine which women have brought from that country," and he pointed in the direction of Abyssinia [Ethiopia]. When he asked why they had done that his uncle said, "We were afraid that you would get pleurisy;" he replied, "That is a disease which God would not afflict me with. Let no one stop in the house until they have been forced to take this medicine, except my uncle." Maymuna [one of Muhammad's wives] was forced to take it although she was fasting because of the apostle's oath, as a punishment for what they had done to him.
D5
From Ibn Sa'd page 294
Umm Bishr [the mother of the Muslim man who also died eating poison], came to the prophet during his illness and said, "O apostle of Allah! I never saw fever like it in any one." The prophet said to her, "Our trial is double and so our reward [in heaven], is double. What do the people say about it [his illness]?" She said, "They say it is pleurisy." Thereupon the apostle said, "Allah will not like to make His apostle suffer from it (pleurisy) because it indicates the possession of Satan, but (my disease is the result of) the morsel that I had taken along your son. It has cut my jugular vein."
SEE NOTE 3
D6
From Ibn Hisham page 682:
, that he heard Aisha [one of Muhammad's wives] say: "The apostle died in my bosom during my turn: [the night Muhammad was to spend sleeping with her] I had wronged none in regard to him. It was due to my ignorance and extreme youth that the apostle died in my arms."
D7
From Ibn Sa'd page 322:
When the last moment of the prophet was near, he used to draw a sheet over his face; but when he felt uneasy, he removed it from his face and said: "Allah's damnation be on the Jews and the Christians who made the graves of their prophets objects of worship."
NOTE 3: Pleurisy is an infection of a lung membrane. It is painful. I don't know why Muhammad considered this infection to be from Satan, but poisoning would not be from Satan.
SUMMARY OF THE SOURCES
Muhammad attacked Khaibar. He destroyed, tortured, murdered, plundered, and enslaved many people (ref Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, volume 2, page 134, 136, 137). They were not preparing to attack him. A Jewish woman, whose family had been wiped out by Muhammad, put poison into a lamb and fed it to Muhammad and the other Muslims. Muhammad ingested some of the poisoned lamb and began to feel it's effects. He died three years later as a result of the poisoning.
DISCUSSION
What needs to be investigated here are the circumstances of Muhammad's death. The Jews were planning to murder him. The Jews believed that a real prophet would be forewarned of their deed but an impostor wouldn't be warned by God. The Muslims also believed this; the other Muslim who died said that he didn't think Muhammad would eat of something that was poisoned (see quote in A6).
The Jews were right, Muhammad did eat of the poison, and did die from it. They proved, according to their test, that Muhammad was not a prophet. As they said (quote A2):
"We wanted to know if you were a liar in which case we would get rid of you, and if you are a prophet then the poison would not harm you."
These Jews were convinced that a real prophet would know what was going on. In this case Muhammad didn't know. Only after Muhammad ate from the lamb did the lamb "talk to him". I don't think that that was anything miraculous in itself; even the other Muslim knew it was bad before Muhammad ate from it. Most adults know when they are eating something that is bad. So for Muhammad to say the sheep "talked" to him is not prophetic at all. Even a child spits out bad tasting food.
Many times previously, Muhammad claimed to have had "revelations" that warned him of danger. He even used one of these convenient "revelations" as grounds to attack the Jewish settlement of Banu Nadhir. Yet at Khaibar the revelation came too late: too late to save his own life, too late to save Bishr's life.
As his illness wore on, Muhammad began to pray for healing – he even rubbed his “healing” hand upon himself. Gabriel also got into the act and prayed for his healing (see quotes C2 & C3). Muhammad even got himself "cupped" (the best of all medicines!), (quote A5). Obviously, at this point in time, Muhammad wanted to be healed.
But it didn't help. As it progressively got worse, Muhammad realized that he was dying, ceased praying for healing (quote C4), and claimed that Allah had given him a choice to going to Paradise, or living on earth. Muhammad said he then wanted to go to Paradise. Knowing the game was up, he made the best out of a failed situation.
Muhammad's earlier premonitions of his deaths read more like the cosmic words of a mystic. Nothing definite is ever said about them until after his approaching death. Perhaps he had seen this type of death before and knew the outcome. It doesn't take a prophet or a "revelation" to know that death is near. [color=#990000]Let's stick to the facts, please
My basic point is this: the Jews proved that Muhammad was not a real prophet. He ingested the poison, so did at least one of his followers. He attempted to be healed, he tried his medicine, and his form of “laying on of hands”, his prayer, Aisha’s prayer, and even Gabriel’s prayer, but in the end, he died from the poison.
QUESTIONS
1) If Muhammad were a real prophet of God, why didn't he catch the poison before he ate it?
2) If you believe that it was God's will for Muhammad to have eaten the poison, along with Bishr, why then did Muhammad try to get well? Even Gabriel prayed for Muhammad to get better, but Allah didn't answer that prayer either.
3) Why did Gabriel not know the will of Allah? Why would Gabriel pray if Allah had decided death?
4) Why did Muhammad force the other Muslims to drink the medicine he was given? One of them was one of his wives, and she was fasting. He forced her to break her fast and drink the medicine as well. Doesn't this sound vindictive and petty?
5) Why, when just before his death, did Muhammad have to utter a curse upon the Christians and the Jews? Wouldn't it have been better for Muhammad to pray for guidance for them? This also sounds like a jealous, bitter prayer to Allah. Muhammad prayed for and uttered curses instead of asking Allah to guide people.
6) Why would pleurisy, which is a normal infection of the lung membrane, be considered to be from Satan, but being poisoned would not be from Satan?
CONCLUSION
Muhammad was not a real prophet, he was a false prophet. He died as a result of eating poison that he didn't know about. The poisoned lamb "spoke" to him too late. Only when he realized he was dying did Muhammad "spiritualize" his suffering and coming death. Prior to that he tried to get well.
Moses knew about his coming death (Deut 34:1-5). Jesus also knew of His future death (Mark 8:32, 32). Yet Muhammad was in the dark until he himself realized he was going to die.
Paul the apostle was bitten by a poisonous snake (Acts 28:1-6), but Paul suffered no ill effects from the bite. God had his hand of protection on Paul, to finish the work laid out for him. Muhammad died so suddenly that there was confusion as to would be the next ruler of the Islamic state. To this day, part of that confusion remains. The Islamic world is divided in part because of this issue (Shia vs. Sunni). Wouldn't Allah, who abhors division within the Ummah have protected Muhammad long enough to insure that his state remain unified, and a clearly defined successor be named?
Jesus predicted false prophets would come into the world and mislead many (Matthew 24:24). Muhammad was such a false prophet. Both Jesus and Moses knew God face to face, Muhammad only had a spirit or angel he called "Gabriel" speaking to him. In the end, even this angel's prayers were not answered by Allah. Could it be that this "Gabriel" was preaching a false religion (Galatians 1: to Muhammad? Could Gabriel have been a deceptive demon or Satan himself?
http://answering-islam.org/Silas/mo-death.htm
All this just to deny the truth in your book? well i will answer @lagoshia, he its same answer for u, i guess. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 4:04pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
@LagosShia and others, U are insisting of the date of his death? U will agree that both u and i will come up with what History told us about his death, the cause and when he died.
I present to u a AL-BAYDAWI.
Writing about Muhammad's death, Al-Baidawi, the great expositor of the Quran, said:
"If he should die or be slain, will you then turn back on your heels?" (refers to the incident in which) Abdallah Ibn Qami'a al-Harithi threw a rock at Allah's Messenger that broke four of his front teeth and gashed his face. Mus'ab Ibn Umair, who was the standard-bearer defended (Muhammad). So Ibn Qami'a killed (Mus'ab), assuming that he killed the Prophet. Then, as it is reported, he said "I killed Muhammad." Someone cried out, "Behold, Muhammad has been killed," and the people turned on their heels. Then the Messenger cried out, "Come to me, servants of Allah," Thirty of his followers joined him and protected him until they scattered the unbelievers. Some hypocrites said, "Had he been a prophet, he would not have been killed." Anas Ibn Nadr, the uncle of Anas Ibn Malak, said, "O, people, if Muhammad is slain, Muhammad's Lord is alive, and dies not; what shall you do if you live after him? So fight for what he fought for," and added "O Allah, I acquit myself of what they say and exonerate myself from it." He then clasped his sword firmly and fought till he was killed, and the verse was revealed.
When Khaybar was conquered, and the people felt secure, Zainab Bint al-Harith, Salam Ibn Mishkam's wife, went about asking which part of the lamb was Muhammad's favorite to eat. People told her, "It is the front leg, for it is the best part and the farthest from harm." So she took a lamb, slaughtered it, and cut it up. Then she took a deadly poison that kills instantly and poisoned the lamb, putting more poison in the leg and shoulder. When the sun set, Muhammad led the people in the evening prayer. When he finished he wanted to go, but she was sitting at his feet. He asked her, and she said, "O Abu al-Qasim, here is a gift I have for you." Muhammad ordered some of his friends to take it from her, and it was put before him in the presence of his friends, among whom was Bishr Ibn al-Bara' Ibn Ma'rur. Muhammad said, "Come near and be seated." Muhammad took the leg and ate, too. When Muhammad had swallowed his bite, Bishr swallowed his, and the rest of the people ate of it. Muhammad said, "Raise your hands; this leg and this shoulder tell me they are poisoned." Bishr said, "By the One who honored you, I found the same in my morsel, but nothing kept me from spitting it out except that I would spoil the pleasure of your food. When you ate that which was in your mouth, I did not desire my own soul more than yours, and wished that you had not swallowed it." (One opinion has it that) Bishr died then and there. A part of the lamb was thrown to a dog, and the dog died. Another opinion says that (Bishr's) color turned black and his pain lasted two years, after which he died. It was also said that Muhammad took a bite of the lamb, chewed it, and spit it out, whereas Bihr swallowed his morsel. Then Muhammad sent for this Jewess and asked her, "Have you poisoned this lamb?" She said, "You have acquired certain powers with which you judge those who are not loyal to you. You killed my father, my uncle and my brother. . . So I said, "If he is a king, then I would be relieving us of him, and if he is a prophet, he will be able to perceive.'" It was said that he pardoned her, while others say he commanded her to be put to death and crucified. When Muhammad fell ill just before his death, he said to Aisha, "Aisha, I still feel the effect of the poisoned food I ate; this is the time of my demise by that poison." When Bishr's sister entered his room during the time of his last sickness, he said to her, "This is the time of my demise by the meal I ate with your brother in Khaybar." (The above quotation is from the book Is The Quran Infallible by Abdallah Abd al-Fadi, pages 378- 381).
Muslims are ashame to agree that thier prophet died of this poison? BUT WITH THE RECORDS? It does shows that he died of the poison. Befor he ate the meat, he hard no health weakness. THERE IS NO AUGUEMENT ABOUT IT. |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by plappville(f): 4:07pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
proo212:
If he knew the meat was poisoned why did he not get one of his "revelations" that the meat was poisoned? If he was so inspired he shouldn't even have asked the Jewish woman to cook for him after killing her family. That is more like tempting fate.
These pick and mix hadiths sef. Anyone that doesn't say what you like then they are not authentic. So which hadiths are to be believed? Or are hadiths to be believed but not all contents of all hadiths are to be believed? Please educate me and i mean no offence by that. Because I see that Sahih Muslim and Sahih Buhkari were also quoted and these are supposed to be the most authentic ones.
Contrary to your mindset, the new testament has one thing going for it, the Lordship of Jesus Christ, the essence that he came as a man and was divine, was revealed to be divine. The apostles believed he is God in the flesh, some people believed even demons and centurions as well as some Pharisees. Because of that belief, the apostles preached the death and resurrection and forgiveness of sins and salvation. (There is no ambiguity about that).
If this is so, how are they inconsistent?
If we look at even secular sources, they agree on the dates of 30-36AD. The difference between 36 AD and 125AD is wide, I am sure you agree with me.
The qouted hadiths are the authentic ones, the two u mentioned. But when it exposes certain truth, Muslim go against it still |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by ivoice247: 4:17pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
proo212:
ivoice247, i assume this means islamic voice 24/7, whilst you were trying to refute plappville as to which poison takes three years to kill someone, as i read from the write up, it says your prophet did not ingest the meat so we see that even a bit of the meat that touch his mouth was enough to make him ill. Bashir did instantly because he swallowed the meat. The meat must have been deadly if he complained afterwards that what he ate was killing him. You can try and spin this all you want but he himself admitted from different narrations.
Moving on, another lie your prophet told in all of this debacle
Now where in history did Jesus Christ whilst he was man on earth live till 125years? All sources show that he lived on earth for 33-33.5 years If your sources cannot get that right oh boy!!!
It's from plappville's quote that stated christ lived on earth till 125yrs. I believe it was a mistake because we muslims believe he ascended to heaven at a young age around 33yrs old and he's not dead. Anyways, i guess the quote was meant to be for Moses who according to bk of deut 34:7, moses(as) died at 120 yrs old |
| Re: Muhammad Poisoned By A Jew, Why Must He Die Poisoned, After All He Is A Beloved by LagosShia: 4:21pm On Jan 02, 2012 |
@Plappville
the first part of the copy/paste you presented deals with the battle of Uhud were it was rumored that Muhammad (sa) had being killed.
what you attribute to al-Baidawi (another sunni scholar) is not referenced.show us the name of the book,page number and hadith or narration code where Baidawi allegedly said what you are quoting and smuggling as his words.
when i read the entire post,here is the main reference given which has to do with repeating and formatting the same thing we've heard from your initial copy/paste:
"The above quotation is from the book Is The Quran Infallible by Abdallah Abd al-Fadi, pages 378- 381"
NOW THE CHALLENGE STILL STANDS,TELL US WHEN MUHAMMAD (sa) IS SAID TO HAVE CONSUMED POISONED MEAT AND WHEN DID HE PASS AWAY?
THEN TELL US WHICH POISON WILL KILL SOMEONE AFTER ABOUT 3 YEARS HAS ELAPSED!!!
FOR YOU TO CLAIM THAT IT WAS THE POISONED THAT KILLED HIM AND THE CAUSE OF HIS DEATH IS POISONING,YOU MUST SHOW US HOW HE SUFFERED AND STRUGGLE FROM THE POISONING ALL ALONG CLOSE TO 36 MONTHS BEFORE HE DIED FROM IT.SOMEONE CANNOT BE POSIONED TODAY TO FEEL THE EFFECT THREE YEARS LATER WHEN HE IS JUST ABOUT TO DIE!!!HE MUST HAVE SUFFERED ALL ALONG.SO PRESENT YOUR EVIDENCE. |
