i am allow to suggest i will like us to have a country of igbo's ss people remain our good brothers but they need to form their own nation so that we will not walk out of trouble and fall into another deep trouble.

Your opinion is appreciated.

for those clamoring for southern Nigeria i will like to say sorry it can't work.core igbo and Yoruba's will outline other minorities then it will turn to be a violent or bloody southern Nigeria so please don't try to make that mistake

Executives should be in Enugu chai!

Any suggestions as to that?

Lets watch and see

For such union to survive, its got to be purely based on federating units, where the individual state provides and manages its on God's given resources.

There will be a weak center, if there will be any at all. You don't have to use oil and resources in areas as Rivers, Bayelsa, Delta, Anambra, Akwa Ibom, Abia for instance, and services some 'executives' sitting somewhere in the name of representing or ruling us.

Each state or region should be able to develop their own state capital in accordance with their own resources. Just like you have in South Africa, where almost all their cities are developed. It won't be the same situation we have now, where oil money in other regions are used in developing Abuja.

In a nutshell individual state should be in charge of their resources, strictly resources control mechanism.

The problem the SS has with the nation Nigeria is the fact that all other regions are parasites.Any break away country from Nigeria including the SS with any of the parasites will not change this fact and consequently there will never be peace.

I believe mots groups in the south can survive without oil, even though there's also oil in non "South South" communities.

I wont mind Biafra. I love Igbos

ezeagu, Nairaland has its advantages and disadvantages. You have identified the advantages, but I would say that one of the disadvantages is that any person can claim to be from anywhere in Nigeria and be making statements purporting to be from that area.
Take this GeneralGEJ for example, the dude can be even from Sokoto! lol
He hates GEJ with a passion, yet he claims to be from "Niger delta". I'm laughing.

To be honest, I believe that how the country will be divided is not knowable by ordinary folks on Nairaland. It is not even a subject for public discussion because it would attract a lot of irrational and mentally disturbed folks.
It is really an intelligence thing, and I hope that MASSOB or other groups are doing some work now to identify groups in Eastern Nigeria that want to form a nation together. By groups, I even include Igbo groups. lol

So, but if I'm to put down my two cents, I would say that the whole Eastern region can form a nation together.
There is a difference between what is happening in Nigeria now, and what would inevitably stare folks in the face when the actual negotiations begin.

In as much as i would want the old eastern region to come under one umbrella, i think a referendum should be conducted by the minorities in the east to determine whether or not they want to go with their eastern cousins. If the poll says no, then so be it. Infact forcing them to join an Igbo union is tantamount to an Ijaw bokoharam. But need i say that no Igboid group(Ikwerre, Ndoni, Opobo, Ekpeye etc) will be left behind.

Thanks, onlytruth.

I know that nairaland can never be where any serious issues are resolved in Nigeria, I was trying to put out a message out there for any group that may actually have an influence when the time comes. I already know that half the people on this thread have never even been to the East, so they can continue on with frustration, with claims of being from the Niger Delta at the same time mocking their supposed brother.

I want to ask who the Eastern region is though, because no one seems to have a clear plan of what this country would look like.

afam4eva:

In as much as i would want the old eastern region to come under one umbrella, i think a referendum should be conducted by the minorities in the east to determine whether or not they want to go with their eastern cousins. If the poll says no, then so be it. Infact forcing them to join an Igbo union is tantamount to an Ijaw bokoharam. But need i say that no Igboid group(Ikwerre, Ndoni, Opobo, Ekpeye etc) will be left behind.

I actually prefer an Igbo-speaking country(just so people know, I do not mean a country that will hold only Igbo people, but will comprise of Igbo-speaking communities), but this is why I opened this thread. But if there's a referendum and an Igboid group, like Ikwere chooses to leave, shouldn't they be respected for the benefit of both sides?

If Ikwerres choose to go their seperate ways then it's ok by me. If Ngwa people wants to join so be it.

ezeagu:

Thanks, onlytruth.

I know that nairaland can never be where any serious issues are resolved in Nigeria, I was trying to put out a message out there for any group that may actually have an influence when the time comes. I already know that half the people on this thread have never even been to the East, so they can continue on with frustration, with claims of being from the Niger Delta at the same time mocking their supposed brother.

I want to ask who the Eastern region is though, because no one seems to have a clear plan of what this country would look like.

My own definition of Eastern region is old Eastern region plus Anioma. Simple and Short.

However, in forming a nation out of it, groups can opt in, and groups can also opt out. I know that because I've seen people from outside of these two zones wanting to join Igbos in forming a nation. I've also seen groups even from core parts of the East wanting out. That is how complex the situation is. That is why it would not be done in public because there would be a need for harmonization and "normalization" of positions.

hey eze, use the Yoruba model to build your new country.  You need a commonwealth. You need diversity or your tribe will die off!

Negro_Ntns:

hey eze, use the Yoruba model to build your new country.  You need a commonwealth. You need diversity or your tribe will die off!

What model and diversity are you talking about because Yorubaland and/or western region is nearly homogeneous or perhaps you can educate us more.

Negro_Ntns:

hey eze, use the Yoruba model to build your new country.  You need a commonwealth. You need diversity or your tribe will die off!

I personally think that Eastern Nigeria is the most diversified, peacefu and politically stable region in Nigeria. Don't let Nairaland deceive you. When I look at the East, I see a region at peace with itself. The only time we had killings was during the war when foreigners (Hausa/Fulani, Yorubas and others from outside the region) invaded and occupied the region. During that time, they instigated fear and division among our peoples. You can still read some of those fears by some people from the region. That is why I said that the negotiation cannot be in public.
Before the coming of the British, we had a highly decentralized "commonwealth" (if you like), and we lived and traded with one another peacefully. We even traded slaves together without counting tribe. So that is the model I am using.

So, in essence, we have nothing really to learn from Yoruba. Trust me on that.  

u are confused. . . dont know who you are anymore. Read the following account given by some Dr Ojukwu to a foreign correspondent. This was in 2008. You dont know if you should be jews, nigerians, biafrans, or ibos. Your doctor below has hijacked a motif that the Yorubas and Hausas have used for thousands of years and adopted it as an igbo standard symbol. read on as your countryman makes a fool of himself in his desperation to make ibo and jew one family.

Among the Ibo traditions is one which claims that the original nomadic herdsmen were exposed to Jewish culture and traditions by Jews traveling south from Timbuktu through the Tibesti range and down to eastern abd central Nigeria, where they traded in ivory and some agricultural products. Timbuktu was a major center of medieval Jewish culture as the climate was much different during this period then at present, being more savanna then desert. In fact, there is allegedly a large library of Jewish manuscripts in Timbuktu which have been preserved virtually intact by the desert climate but which the Malian government, which is rather militantly Muslim, refuses to allow anyone to even examine, much less remove.

In any event, according to a friend, the green six-pointed star, which except for its color closely resembles the Magen David, is a major symbol of Ibo culture; it figures prominently as a motif on the regalia of clan and even tribal chiefs, among others. He therefore wishes to know who actually designed the badge of British Nigeria, and if he (for we can assume that at that date the designer would most probably have been a man) was familiar with the significance of the green six pointed star to the Ibo people. It apparently plays no role in the traditions and cultures of other Nigerian peoples such as the Yoruba, Hausa, etc. He thinks, and on the basis of what he has told me, that the use of this design was therefore more than coincidental.

He says that there is a real problem with Lord Lugard's description. The design may well have been on a 'handsome goblet of brass and copper covered with designs, which was captured by the troops when the Emir of Kantagora, the principle [sic] slave-raider in Northern Nigeria, was captured,' but Dr Ojukwu says that the object which Lord Lugard described was actually a ceremonial vessel for anointing a Paramount Chief of the Ibo upon his accession to a position of authority and actually had no connection either with Islam or with the Hausa. The anointing was in two parts, and there should have been two goblets; one would contain water which had been filtered through silk or gauze so as to make it as clear as possible, while the second goblet would contained palm oil, which would have been used for the actual anointing of the Chief. The designs could very probably have actually been an attempt to write Hebrew script. The knowledge of how to write such script would have been lost by the midst of the 18th Century, but designs which vaguely suggest such script can be found on Ibo metalwork and even pottery as late as the early 1920s. The object which Lord Lugard describes was very probably an Ibo ritual object which had been taken as booty by the Emir or one of his predecessors and had belonged to an important Ibo leader. The Ibo term for the emblem roughly translates as 'Seal of Majesty' or some similar synonym, and ritual objects of this type could have been found in many museums in eastern Nigeria before the Biafra War. This ritual of anointing of a senior chief is one of the features of Ibo culture which they claim links them to Judaic influences in the past if not to an actual connection with Judaism.

There is every likelihood that the goblet was originally booty taken from a slaving raid on an Ibo settlement and which had originally belonged to a senior Ibo Chief. Dr Ojukwu says that his particular clan of the Ibo have a proverb which roughly translated is more or less 'Those who came from the North found us a People and left us a Nation. They brought with them the Wisdom of the Great God who is above all, and charged us with the task of remembering Him in all that we do.' Many Ibo rituals, such as anointing, circumcision of males after eight days (but no female circumcision, which is unusual for Africa), the wearing of fringed garments on ceremonial occasions, etc, have strong similarities to Jewish customs. It is generally believed that the Jewish traders first csme to the Ibo lands sometime around the early 13th Century and ceased their visits sometime after the mid-15th Century when the climate of the Sahel changed radically from savanna to arid desert. As for the Magen David emerging as a Jewish symbol in Eastern Europe, we have been unable to find any information as to the origins of this symbol in North and West Africa and when it became identified as an Ibo if not a specifically Jewish symbol. The Ibo remain firmly convinced that it testifies to the Judaic links to their culture.

Thanks for at least partially corroborating the information from my Ibo contact concerning the origin of the Six-Pointed Star as a traditional Ibo/Igbo symbol. I think that we may safely say that Lord Lugard, for all his estimable work as the Colonial Governor of Nigeria, may possibly have jumped to a hasty conclusion regarding the origin of the emblem which he incorporated into the Badge of the colony. Obviously further research needs to be done on this point, which is probably not flag related but certainly is anthropological. Lord Lugard's asctription of the six pointed star to a Hausa Emir might have been somewhat hastily made. He may well have lacked the more detailed knowledge that we have now, and I think that without definitely ascribing the emblem to the Ibo some mention should be made of the fact that it is more an Ibo rather than a Hausa symbol.


Ron Lahav, 3-4 November 2008

^^
Completely irrelevant and off point.

if you are returning to your root to form a new country you dont think that article is relevant in the things to consider? How you going to form a new country without considering roots as factor? You should invite only people of jewish blood to be members of this new ibo (ibow; ibrow; ibrew) nation. Its the only way to find peace.

I believe that that Cross River, Akwa Ibom and Ogoni in Rivers can form a country of their own. They have many similarities.
Ijaw can be on their own
Igbo(SE and SS) can be on their own
If you come from a boarder community along the Igbo/Akwa Ibom and Igbo Cross River boarders, you will know how explosive land matters are in those areas.

Unlike the above states, as far as I know, there have been no land disputes between Imo and River States (Ohaji versus Ikwerre) (Ngor Okpala versus Etche) Neither between Abia and Rivers (Ukwa versus Etche or Oyigbo).

Therefore, the Igbo-speaking people of Rivers State are naturally going to have no problem belonging to an Igbo-only country as long as every one is guaranteed equal representation at the highest levels of governance (read rotational presidency).


With Akwa Ibom and Cross Rivers and even Ijaw, despite any differences, I bet you that the boarders between them and us will be so porous that you can literally walk across them. We just would do better and respect each other better in different countries. Having them with us will be a regrettable action in the end unless they come to us willingly.

My worry will be Opobo because though it is Igbo-speaking, it is completely enclosed by Ijaw and Akwa Ibo lands.

Once we get some access to sea via Ikwerre (PH), ONNELGA and/or Ahoada (all Igbo areas), then I guarantee us becoming one the best countries in no distant time.

Negro_Ntns:

if you are returning to your root to form a new country you dont think that article is relevant in the things to consider?  How you going to form a new country without considering roots as factor?  You should invite only people of jewish blood to be members of this new ibo (ibow; ibrow; ibrew) nation.  Its the only way to find peace.

I don't see how the article you posted is related to this thread.
I can wake up and say that I am from Mars; does that change the fact that I am in Eastern Nigeria?
No group is even sure of its origin in Nigeria.
I really think that you are mischievously derailing this thread; but then again, do I expect anything less? lol
That is why I told ezeagu that this thread may not give him any reasonable answers because we have enemies lurking around, causing as much confusion as possible. The real negotiations and agreements will happen secretly. FACT.  

GeneralGEJ can you shut up? Separate what SS from SE. Are we in the SS one? No. You are Ijaw or whatever and I am Igbo. The only people talking about some nonsense SS/niger delta republic is the Ijaw. Get it right.

Another Important proposal we need is to plan how to help Igbos in Lagos/SW devise a strategy of convincing their hosts, Yorubas, to be ready to secede and form their own country when other southerners are doing so. After staying this long in their land and hobnobbing with them at all levels, Igbos of SW should be able to accomplish this with minimal effort, hopefully. We do not want any traitors snitching with the North to try to repeat history.. Once they align with the North again, Igbos will have a hard time getting their own country.

Why are people interested in bulkanization of Eastern Nigeria. I can authoritatively tell you that Igbos have majority hardworking middle class that are not interested in what government can give them but rather let government have minimum or no interferance in their lives. We don't need Government Aided Social Security but rather a well oriented Extende family system where the Father trains the Children and in turn the Children take care of their aged parents. Let any Country that Igbos find themselves be in charge of Security, infrastructural development and an independent Judiciary where everybody is equal before the law not forgetten a small Government preferably Unicameral or at worst Bi-Cameral Parliamentary System of Government.

Nchara:

I believe that that Cross River, Akwa Ibom and Ogoni in Rivers can form a country of their own. They have many similarities.
Ijaw can be on their own
Igbo(SE and SS) can be on their own
If you come from a boarder community along the Igbo/Akwa Ibom and Igbo Cross River boarders, you will know how explosive land matters are in those areas.

Unlike the above states, as far as I know, there has been no land disputes between Imo and River States (Ohaji versus Ikwerre) (Ngor Okpala versus Etche) Neither between Abia and Rivers (Ukwa versus Etche or Oyigbo).

Therefore, the Igbo-speaking people of Rivers State are naturally going to have no problem belonging to an Igbo-only country as long as every one is guaranteed equal representation at the highest levels of governance (read rotational presidency).


With Akwa Ibom and Cross Rivers and even Ijaw, despite any differences, I bet you that the boarders between them and us will be so porous that you can literally walk across them. We just would do better and respect each other better in different countries. Having them with us will be a regrettable action in the end unless they come to us willingly.

My worry will be Opobo because though it is Igbo-speaking, it is completely enclosed by Ijaw and Akwa Ibo lands.

Once we get some access to sea via Ikwerre (PH), ONNELGA and/or Ahoada (all Igbo areas), then I guarantee us becoming one the best countries in no distant time.

You made some point about some issues in Eastern Nigeria, but I doubt that anyone would ever divide it up that way.

I personally believe that the only reason Nigeria is not working is because of the born to rule mentality of the Hausa/Fulani, which they occasionally enforce violently. If not, I would be a die hard one Nigerianist.
Much as I may love to have an Igbo only country, I also believe that diversity is not the problem we are having in Nigeria. If nobody is busy hacking innocent people to death in any part of Nigeria, I would never advocate that Nigeria divides. I believe that the international community would NEVER accept a Nigeria divided into more than 3 countries (just my view). I say that because Nigeria's division would likely be a litmus test for how other dysfunctional African countries would be divided. I cannot envision how the world (UN) would have to welcome thousands of countries from Africa alone.

Ngwakwe:

[b]Why are people interested in balkanization of Eastern Nigeria. [/b]I can authoritatively tell you that  Igbos have majority hardworking middle class that are not interested in what government can give them but rather let government have minimum or no interferance in their lives. We don't need Government Aided Social Security but rather a well oriented Extende family system where the Father trains the Children and in turn the Children take care of their aged parents. Let any Country that Igbos find themselves be in charge of Security, infrastructural development and an independent Judiciary where everybody is equal before the law not forgetten a small Government preferably Unicameral or at worst Bi-Cameral Parliamentary System of Government.

Beats me too.

I know that diversity is not our problem. Hausa/Fulani born to rule is, which is why we are having problems in Nigeria.
The average Igbo man don't even care about presidency or whatever political position is under the auction block.
Provided we have peace to thrive in our chosen careers, we are happy.

I would support any arrangement that guarantee peace and security to every group in it.
If Hausa/Fulani is reformed,  and somehow drop their born to rule mentality, I would stay in Nigeria as is.
If not, then Biafra. 

Onlytruth:

You made some point about some issues in Eastern Nigeria, but I doubt that anyone would ever divide it up that way.

I personally believe that the only reason Nigeria is not working is because of the born to rule mentality of the Hausa/Fulani, which they occasionally enforce violently. If not, I would be a die hard one Nigerianist.
Much as I may love to have an Igbo only country, I also believe that diversity is not the problem we are having in Nigeria. If nobody is busy hacking innocent people to death in any part of Nigeria, I would never advocate that Nigeria divides. I believe that the international community would NEVER accept a Nigeria divided into more than 3 countries (just my view). I say that because Nigeria's division would likely be a litmus test for how other dysfunctional African countries would be divided. I cannot envision how the would world have to welcome thousands of countries from Africa alone.

You do not need the world to divide Nigeria for you. Nigerians can do so themselves just like Russia did. That said, I love the idea of diversity. Personally I actually have few Igbo friends in real life compared to other Nigerian/African, or Asian/American/European friends. I have a very broad outlook in life because I have lived in many different continents. But this is about preserving what is left of peace and learning from the experience of Nigeria. We will have long term peace and stability being on our own. There is no guarantee that the issue of domination will not crop up with its devastating consequences. We are better of having them as friendly neighbouring countries with no visa issues between us.

Nchara:

You do not need the world to divide Nigeria for you. Nigerians can do so themselves just like Russia did. That said, I love the idea of diversity. Personally I actually have few Igbo friends in real life compared to other Nigerian/African, or Asian/American/European friends. I have a very broad outlook in life because I have lived in many different continents. But this is about preserving what is left of peace and learning from the experience of Nigeria. We will have long term peace and stability being on our own. There is no guarantee that the issue of domination will not crop up with its devastating consequences. We are better of having them as friendly neighbouring countries with no visa issues between us.

My opposition to the idea of dividing Eastern Nigeria comes from a lesson I learned about how Zik treated the issue of Western Cameroon. Zik chose your model for dealing with them, today, they are in Cameroun, with a large Igbo population and a STRONG regret and desire to leave Cameroun. It is too late for them now. Simple leadership on the part of Zik could have kept them in Nigeria : Eastern Nigeria. These things are supposed to be treated with deep reflection and thought, not just based on what irritant folks from that part says. I know you may say that it does not concern us what happened to Western Cameroon, but if we had secured them in Eastern Nigeria, our history would have been dramatically different from what it was. Biafra would probably never have happened.
That is why I would never accept another attempt to balkanize Eastern Nigeria.