truthislight:
@cyrexx
bro
i wander if u saw my write up or even red it,
u have been so busy with the born again.

actually i saw your write up but i am still having a hard time understanding what you meant.

1. are you saying the only prayer that god can answer is prayer for god's kingdom to come?

2. are you saying that he cant answer other prayers too for the benefit of humans now now, or he is just in the futuristic coming kingdom?

kay17, on the bible's authority.
When taking oath people swear to greater entities as a guaranty that they are saying the truth,
in the case of God since he says he is almighty he can not swear to smaller entities that he has once taken a challange to and destroy to show that there is no other greater than he is,
as such he usually swear by himself or to hlmself.
since he said that the bible is his word
who does he need to attest to lt to varify what he says?
However, Jesus christ is called the faithfull witness.
Do u want to stand on his way to default him on

You haven't provided any ground to believe the bible is the word of God, other than assume its God's word and then find a reason on God's discretion not to show it.

That is not still helpful.

@cyrexx
exactly, thats the point the bible give,
the prayer has to be in ternets (agree) with Gods master plan,
even the apostles work was same with Jesus work as an example written for our own benefit, with wish to build our faith for the future. Meant for all mankind to read and know God.
but people will not want to take that, cus, all they want is "let it be now now" 4geting issues that are at stake that made the messiah to come at the first place.
(to show the way and reconcile)

but for those that are ready to look to the new system of things the advice u where quoting does apply, while preaching to others about it and there primary interest is the coming of Gods kingdom they are urge not to be anxious.

Bro, viewing matters from this wrong teaching from christiandom u where absolutely correct.

Christiandom has left the hope of the coming kingdom and teach the faleshood that the kingdom is hear and humans are still suffering and dying,
just as they have done with many other doctrine, leaving the truth for dogmas.
The coming of Gods kingdom means a restauration or a paradise hear on earth literally, cus the bible shows that the time pass has been for satan to prove his challange in eden that Adam will be better of on his own deciding for himself what is good and what is bad.
Since human lot has worsen it shows that satan challange was wrong, that human would have been better of remaining with God who had given them all the good they know at the first place, justifying Gods intervention in humans affairs that he had had hands off.

I wish u did read the bible parts i cited so that u can access the refferences for urself.
Daniel 2:44
Revelation 21:1to5

A look at christiandom shows how greedy they are, a complete contrast with the life of christian the bible paints.
By there fruit u shall know them.
And u were just showing how shallow they have become.
Peace

You have still not answered my question.
Is there a god who answers prayers in this present physical world according to the promises in the bible?
You dont need to give more than a simple yes or no.
Your previous explanations have not addressed my questions.

Kay 17:

You haven't provided any ground to believe the bible is the word of God, other than assume its God's word and then find a reason on God's discretion not to show it.

That is not still helpful.

If i am to agree with u, i will then have to assume that the bible is not Gods word, then i have to accept also the following:

A jew leaving in tent 3500yrs ago stood up, look at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth is hanging on nothing And got it perfectly right. Abi?

That a jew leaving in a tenth 3000yrs ago also stood up and looked at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth with its oceans is like a ball And got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs ago looked at the skies and knew that there are galaxies and got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs a go (without microbscope) look at his environ and saw bacterials and gave laws on it prevention from infections, also knew that the diseases thereoff are contagiouse and listed out it preventions and maintenance/diagnoses, and got it right, abi?

that a Jew 3000yrs ago, look at the skies and saw the water vepour going up to the skies to come back as rain, and listed the water circle perfectly, and got it right, abi? etc

that a jew look at his mothers womb and knew that when he was form there was a written code that guirded the process, and got it perfectly right, (DNA) abi?

Why is it that it is only the jews that have this nag for getting it right spot on? But when other well educated men like aristotle attemted it they got it all wrong?(phylosophers)

That so many Jews without the assist from any God foretold there history in advance and that of other nations including the extinction of the nation of babylon of which it ruines is still with us just 50miles from Iran?

Etc, etc etc
kay17
Honestly tell me which i should accept that i will not look or rather fail? Should i conclude they just got lucky? Those are men natural way of being perfectly insightful?

cyrexx: You have still not answered my question.
Is there a god who answers prayers in this present physical world according to the promises in the bible?
You dont need to give more than a simple yes or no.
Your previous explanations have not addressed my questions.

ma man cyrexx.
By now i believe u should have known that i am not a member of cristiandom.
By now u should have known that i absolutely believe 100 and 1% convince that God exist,
why do u want me to take panadol for other people christiandom people haedech?
i am not a greedy person, and what God empower men to do as to form the bible suffices for me,
i dont look for miracle. When I red in the bible that satan empowers people to perform miracle as to lead people astray, 2thessalonian 2:9to12 i concluded that if satan has gone into that it means that Almighty God will no longer make use of it as not to create confussion. It ends with the apostles. 1corintians13:1to10

SO, ALMIGHTY GOD IS NOT INTO MIRACLE TODAY.
But, he has interest in the preachihing of the message about his kingdom that is to come. MTT28:18to20

note, here, christ says that he will be with those preaching the massage of the kingdom till the end. Makes sense, everlasting life is more important.
Peace

truthislight:

If i am to agree with u, i will then assume that the bible is not Gods word, then i have to accept also the following:

a jew leaving in tent 3500yrs ago stood up, look at the sky and came up with the conlcussion that the earth is hanging on nothing And got it perfectly. Abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs ago also stood up and look at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth with its oceans is like a ball And got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs ago looked at the skies and knew that there are galaxies and got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs a go (without microbscop) look at his environ and saw bacterials and gave laws on it prevention from infections, also knew that the diseases thereoff are contagiouse and listed out it preventions and maintenance/diagnoses,

that a Jew 3000yrs ago, look at the skies and saw the water vepour going up to come back as rain, and listed the water cicle perfectly, abi? etc

that a jew look at his mothers womb and knew that when he was form there was a written code that guirded the proces, and got it perfectly right, (DNA) abi?

Why is it that it is only the jew that have this nag for getting it right spot on? But when other well educated men like aristotle attemted it they got it all wrong?(phylosophers)

That so many Jews without the assist from any God foretold the history in advance and that of other nations including the extinction of the nation of babylon of which it ruines is still with us just 50miles from Iran?

Etc, etc etc
kay17
Honestly tell me which i should accept that i will not look or rather fail?

You are making such conclusion, on a premise that knowledge is divine??

If so, Socrates, Platos, Parmenides and co were voices of God??

I don't think knowledge is divine, humans are ordinarily capable of perceiving and understanding the world around. I don't think its God that told em.

Kay 17:

You are making such conclusion, on a premise that knowledge is divine??

If so, Socrates, Platos, Parmenides and co were voices of God??

I don't think knowledge is divine, humans are ordinarily capable of perceiving and understanding the world around. I don't think its God that told em.

are u aware that some of the names u just mention at one time or the other did attempted refuting what the bible said as not being rational only to be prove otherwise later on?
That the catholic church errorniouesly kill Galileo by following the views of those individuals? While Galileo stuck with the bible?
did u just mention names and said " i dont think knowledge is divine?
I thought u will have Quoted what they did and let it be extra ordinary, o! Dont 4get that they have to humble themself and say it was anothers idea (God's)

are u telling me that this ur knowledge u are shearing with me i can take it and make a hip about it and it will stick just because u sheard ur knowledge? O! It will remain as the inthing and upto date for the next 3000yrs.

(Note, bible writers were not career men and have no ego to feed.
They were shepherd, kings, farmers, fisher men, doctors, servants.
Most had no formal training at all they. They were honest men, so, when they said God ask them to write i then have every reason to believe them. As the evidence show)

Men, does the world celebrate midiocrity?

If u are a science oriented individual u will agree with me that certain constants use therein are just out of this world and if u should attempt the proving u will know it just not that possible, if u ignore it ur mathematical solution becomes impossible, we accept inspiration from certain souces, but u will not just want to concede as long u have held to ur idear of no God.
u want to stay put, wont even appeal to reason.
By the way, if it was religion, we would have called that "dogma".

I had ask u to advice me on what my conclussion should be after examining those info contain in the bible, unfortunately u 4got? Or, Is it that u avoided giving ur honest advise, less i know how honest ur mind is.

I appreciate the fact u are an intelligent fellow, but ur intelligent will serve more use if it gives credit to the designer then give such beaautifull credite to rude chance
peace

truthislight:

are u aware that some of the names u just mention at one time or the other did attempted refuting what the bible said as not being rational only to be prove otherwise later on?
That the catholic church errorniouesly kill Galileo by following the views of those individuals? While Galileo stuck with the bible?
did u just mention names and said " i dont think knowledge is divine?
I thought u will have Quoted what they did and let it be extra ordinary, o! Dont 4get that they have to humble themself and say it was anothers idea (God's)

are u telling me that this ur knowledge u are shearing with me i can take it and make a hip about it and it will stick just because u sheard ur knowledge? O! It will remain as the inthing and upto date for the next 3000yrs.

(Note, bible writers were not career men and have no ego to feed.
They were shepherd, kings, farmers, fisher men, doctors, servants.
Most had no formal training at all they. They were honest men, so, when they said God ask them to write i then have every reason to believe them. As the evidence show)

Men, does the world celebrate midiocrity?

If u are a science oriented individual u will agree with me that certain constants use therein are just out of this world and if u should attempt the proving u will know it just not that possible, if u ignore it ur mathematical solution becomes impossible, we accept inspiration from certain souces, but u will not just want to concede as long u have held to ur idear of no God.
u want to stay put, wont even appeal to reason.
By the way, if it was religion, we would have called that dogma.

I had ask u to advice me on what my conclussion should be after examining those info contain in the bible, unfortunately u 4got? Or, Is it that u avoided giving ur honest advise, less i know how honest ur mind is.

I appreciate the fact u are an intelligent fellow, but ur intelligent will serve more use if it gives credit to the designer then give such beaautifull credite to rude chance
peace

Socrates and co died long before Jesus came to the scene not to talk of the Bible, therefore its impossible for em to criticise what didn't exist.

Galileo was persecuted for going Church sanctioned Dogma. His appeal wasn't to the bible (cos then only the Church could interpret the bible) but to naturalism and the Obvious. His persecution is similar to resistance Darwin faced.

Science isn't built on random, absolutely intuitive premises and principles. Check out the philosophy of science. It has few similarities with religion.

Kay 17:

Socrates and co died long before Jesus came to the scene not to talk of the Bible, therefore its impossible for em to criticise what didn't exist.

Galileo was persecuted for going Church sanctioned Dogma. His appeal wasn't to the bible (cos then only the Church could interpret the bible) but to naturalism and the Obvious. His persecution is similar to resistance Darwin faced.

Science isn't built on random, absolutely intuitive premises and principles. Check out the philosophy of science. It has few similarities with religion.

The bible like we have it today is over 3500years.
So, if we remove the NT, some part of the OT still be 1kplus years older than Jesus.
Jesus christ lived in the first century CE. = 3500 - 2012years = 1400plus years.
Parmenides, philosopher/metaphysicist live 500BCE,
Socrates,philosopher lived 470-399BCE,
Plato, founder of platonic/platonism philosopher, 4th century BCE.

Since the OT is about 1500 BCE old, befor Jesus came in the 1st century CE, and those philosophers lived 5th and 4th BCE. Its obvious that THEy met the Torah(OT BIBLE)
They where active on other issues, they formulated the teaching of the Immortal soul.
the OT says the soul dies.
However, there contemporary.
Aristotle lived 384-322BCE. His views influence by that of Pythagoras he formulated the theory of geocentric earth (earth being at the center of the univers, like in the center of the onions)
This was Aristotle's view while the bible in the OT CENTURIES back has said that the earth is a circlic and hanging on nothing.
Aristotle theory was a child of philosophy not science.
his reason being that a moving earth would encounter friction and grind to a halt.

In the 13th century CE.
The Roman catholic church haven adopted Aristotle view led to the confrontation Galileo.
Galileo promoted the Heliocentric concept and asserted that it HARMONIZES WITH THE SCRIPTURES.
His trial and death in 1633. Because he rejected the interpretation of scriptures base on greek philosophies he was condemned.

However, in 1992 the catholic church with it nag to follow greek philosophy accepted error in the dead of Galileo.

Can this greek philosophers be equated to bible writters?

That's part of the bible not the bible.

Neither did the philosophers come across the bible or torah or the Jewish ppl

Neither can you provide a valid/justified date or writers of the OT/Torah!

The Church adopted aristotle's thought as official dogma because they believed it conformed the divine truth.

Galileo did not consult the bible, only the Church at that time was known to be the arbiter of biblical interpretations.

Kay17
its like my own version of history is different from urs, or is it that u just want to present it as to make ur case.
U ask for a valide date for torah, if i got u correctly,

Note, moses wrote the first 4 books of the Torah, how long do u think the history of the nation of Israel is?

the bible is very well dated,

most Jews studied in greek as it was the official language spoken as of the time the NT was writen,
i said that those philosophers propounded teachings that were different from what the bible says, eg, an immortal soul that exist after the dead of the body precisely(less i miss up issues), while the Torah Ezikiel 18:4 says otherwise.
Like there contemporary Aristotle that live at about same period.
He got the issue of the shape of the earth wrong and it led to the dead of Galileo, again, the catholic church has accepted Darwinian Evolutionary theory irrespective of what the bible says and u are defending it just like the catholics of old not withstanding the bible tract record.
evolutionary theory is express as though it is a fect even though it is a theory.

U dont even have the benefit of doubt for such??

U can do well to secularly confirm the date ascribe to being the date of the start of writing of torah.
With my precise date quoted above u should at list concede to the point that am sure of the date of the torah.

But like kay17 i have come to understand, U NEVER SAY DIE.
Peace

Note, moses wrote the first 4 books of the Torah, how long do u think the history of the nation of Israel is?

the bible is very well dated,

Moses obviously didn't, as he was he refered to in third party, and the comment "up until this day" was frequently used, meaning a writer recollecting history and making reference to his time. Besides Moses' death and burial were recorded. Internal evidence clearly states it isn't Moses that wrote those books.

Like there contemporary Aristotle that live at about same period.
He got the issue of the shape of the earth wrong and it led to the dead of Galileo,

Its wasn't the shape of the earth that was in question, but whether the Sun revolved round the Earth.

Galileo vs Church is science vs religious dogma.

Kay17
bro, at this point i dont think we still have much bone to grind about the bible( argue about)

meanwhile, ur reference to the third person in the writing of the first four books of the bible does tell me that u do read the bible, that is highly commendable. Though i cant really say what ur mind set is while reading the bible(motives)

however. That a book is assign to an individual as the writer in the bible does not mean he held the ink and scroll, most write through secretaries, eg Jeremiah = Baruch, but the book is of Jeremiah.
So, when the subject dies, the secretary can give his burial details.
I believe the human mine has an infinite capacity to learn new things, so my suggestion is that u examine the bible without carrying the error of man to access it. There are lot of good that can come out of it.
Peace

Why do you believe Moses wrote the first four books of Torah??

Kay17
it all depends on were one interest lies in this matter.
Most of the bible writers did write about things that the human eyes can not see.
Eg, the bible writer of the book of Job mention satan entering into heaven where other angels where gethered.
This write up in job does not appeal to rationality since we will not accept that statement on that ground,
but if u ignor it u make a very big mistake,
since the same writer in this Job 26:7 said that God hangs the planet earth on nothing.

So, here a measure of faith is necesary, the one that is varifiable compels u to accept the one u cannot proved.

The book of Job is also assign to moses.

Moses have the privilage of talking to angels all the time,

God said that he talks to his servant moses face to face.

Most of what is contain in the torah was open to the public in the temple in Jeruselam befor the Romans destroyed the temple and burn it down, and so went most of the info, but for copies that where with christians outside, or copies kept in synagogue outside the rest where destroyed.
Geneses and the book of Job are similar.
If i believe there is God, i have to believe in his ability for him to protect his word,
afteral, it is this word that Jesus said that all man are to read to have knowladge for everlasting life. John 17:3.

Additionaly,
see Exod17:14, 34:27
Luke24:27, 44
Josh8:31
moses learn how to read and write in the house hold of pharoe where he he was adopted.
Peace

It is pertinent to note that: its Faith that separateds us at this point.

I would want to assert the Bible supremacy over himan knowledge, pathway to God, hidden knowledge. However the bible does not to me have a special warrant over other books.

Kay17
that is a rational conclussion that u have arrive at.
Again, faith grows gradually, and it is a function of bible knowledge though.
It will be wrong to blame u for not having faith on the bible right now,
that comes as we individually prove with bible knowledge what was, what is and what is to come.

I added some bible quotation on my last write up that add evidence to moses writing of the torah.
Peace

cyrexx:

actually i saw your write up but i am still having a hard time understanding what you meant.

1. are you saying the only prayer that god can answer is prayer for god's kingdom to come?

2. are you saying that he cant answer other prayers too for the benefit of humans now now, or he is just in the futuristic coming kingdom?

Bro,
I have not heard from u for some times now. Hope all is well?
I and kay17 have been having hearthy discussions all this while i did not even hear from u.
Peace.

truthislight:

Bro,
I have not heard from u for some times now. Hope all is well?
I and kay17 have been having hearthy discussions all this while i did not even hear from u.
Peace.

i have been around listening to your discussions

its just that i do not share the same conviction with you that the bible is the word of god or that the bible is infallible.

so i will rather just watch and see what you have to say from the bible and pick any sensible statements and discard the remaining superstitious aspects.

cyrexx:

i have been around listening to your discussions

its just that i do not share the same conviction with you that the bible is the word of god or that the bible is infallible.

so i will rather just watch and see what you have to say from the bible and pick any sensible statements and discard the remaining superstitious aspects.

Bro, good to hear from u.
Bro, U said some aspect i present are superstition. Well, thats seems an unjust statement given to me since i dont believe in superstition neither will i accept it.
The bible is a vary rational book when viewed from the right perspective or angle.
I did even considered what my options will be if i am to accept the no God option in my earlier post. Let me shear it with u.

Will u consider this as superstition?
I posted this earlier.

"If i am to agree with u, i will then have to assume that the bible is not Gods word, then i have to accept also the following:

A jew leaving in tent 3500yrs ago stood up, look at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth is hanging on nothing And got it perfectly right. Abi?

That a jew leaving in a tenth 3000yrs ago also stood up and looked at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth with its oceans is like a ball And got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs ago looked at the skies and knew that there are galaxies and got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs a go (without microbscope) look at his environ and saw bacterials and gave laws on it prevention from infections, also knew that the diseases thereoff are contagiouse and listed out it preventions and maintenance/diagnoses, and got it right, abi?

that a Jew 3000yrs ago, look at the skies and saw the water vepour going up to the skies to come back as rain, and listed the water circle perfectly, and got it right, abi? etc

that a jew look at his mothers womb and knew that when he was form there was a written code that guirded the process, and got it perfectly right, (DNA) abi?

Why is it that it is only the jews that have this nag for getting it right spot on? But when other well educated men like aristotle attemted it they got it all wrong?(philosophers)

That so many Jews without the assist from any God foretold there history in advance and that of other nations including the extinction of the nation of babylon of which it ruines is still with us just 50miles from Iran?"

Etc, etc etc
Cyrexx
Honestly, tell me which i should accept that i will not look or rather fail? Should i conclude they just got lucky? Those are men natural way of being perfectly insightful?

Will u consider this question superstition?

Bro, there are so much facts from the bible that i get puzzle, and amaze.
from what i read from this site
I some time wander how i wish i have a better avenue to consider this stuff with you.

^^^^
a muslim can look at his quran and do exactly what you are doing and claim that his holy book is the word of god.
he can purposely read some meaning that the author did not mean into his quran. e.g.jew looking at and describing galaxies, seeing microscopic organisms, describing DNA etc etc.

any religious person will do this and "prove" that his god is the true creator. and there are so many gods who all claim to be the true creator. but that is no proof.

so, i'm not impressed, sorry dear.

pls dont be offended, i'm an atheist and atheists dont follow religion but real concrete testable and reasonable evidence.

@cyrexx
did u just say that atheist dont follow rationality or that atheist dont follow reason? Then, i am putting it to u that there are atheist that are very honest people.

Cause the question i just presented are not religiouse doctrine but are factual guestion.

Is it that u are forming ignorant that in every issues there are cases against and cases for?

That U decide to close ur eyes to an issue does not necessarily mean it is a no issue.
That i decide to stand on a rail road and said nothing will happen does not mean that something will not happen.
That u avoided given me an honest answer does not mean that other readers will not see through ur self denial.

Are u remotely aware that the bible correctly foretold the appearance of the world powers?

Are u aware that the life and activities of Jesus were all foretold befor he was born?

Are u aware that the date of Jesus birth was foretold in advance?

Are u aware that the city and place of birth was also foretold?

Are u aware that the destruction of the city of Jerusalem was foretold befor it was destroyed in 70CE by the roman army?

I told u that u quote the bible out of contest and u thought i was lying, now u just said that the muslim can give similar prove like the one's i just cited from the koran.
Pls. Can u prove that?
That the Quaran is both scientifically accurate?
Prophetically accurate?

My friend, Without an honest mind it is impossible to read the bible and get the sense of it, so, i am afraid for ur sake.

How can u pick false teaching that is being spread by religion and start going in circle and think it is the basis to access the bible?

All that this religions are doing is it all that u think the bible accept?
But those are the same things u will later use to criticise the bible and justify urself that u have done the right thing.

The bible give health and moral laws that are perfect and that is why it will ever remain relevant,

Pls. Show me what u said the koran contain that are similar to that i just presented from the bible.
If u cant, then i suggest u dont make such sweeping statement that is aim at misdirecting people.
The aim of this forum i believe is to shear what knowledge is available and not just to feed our ego.
I will site some of the references and let other readers access ur claim that the writer did not say it.
Isaiah 40:22
Job 26:7
Psalm 139:13 to 16
Peace.

@cyrexx

1. are you saying the only prayer that god can answer is prayer for god's kingdom to come?

not only that,but he can answer meaningfull prayers if he chooses to do so,expecially if it works with his purpose

2. are you saying that he cant answer other prayers too for the benefit of humans now now, or he is just in the futuristic coming kingdom?

he can answer the prayer of the righteous ones by providing for their basic needs.

so,there is Actually an awesome God, a hearer of prayer.

truthislight:

Bro, good to hear from u.
Bro, U said some aspect i present are superstition. Well, thats seems an unjust statement given to me since i dont believe in superstition neither will i accept it.
The bible is a vary rational book when viewed from the right perspective or angle.
I did even considered what my options will be if i am to accept the no God option in my earlier post. Let me shear it with u.

Will u consider this as superstition?
I posted this earlier.

"If i am to agree with u, i will then have to assume that the bible is not Gods word, then i have to accept also the following:

A jew leaving in tent 3500yrs ago stood up, look at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth is hanging on nothing And got it perfectly right. Abi?

That a jew leaving in a tenth 3000yrs ago also stood up and looked at the sky and came up with the conclussion that the earth with its oceans is like a ball And got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs ago looked at the skies and knew that there are galaxies and got it perfectly right, abi?

That a jew leaving 3000yrs a go (without microbscope) look at his environ and saw bacterials and gave laws on it prevention from infections, also knew that the diseases thereoff are contagiouse and listed out it preventions and maintenance/diagnoses, and got it right, abi?

that a Jew 3000yrs ago, look at the skies and saw the water vepour going up to the skies to come back as rain, and listed the water circle perfectly, and got it right, abi? etc

that a jew look at his mothers womb and knew that when he was form there was a written code that guirded the process, and got it perfectly right, (DNA) abi?

Why is it that it is only the jews that have this nag for getting it right spot on? But when other well educated men like aristotle attemted it they got it all wrong?(philosophers)

That so many Jews without the assist from any God foretold there history in advance and that of other nations including the extinction of the nation of babylon of which it ruines is still with us just 50miles from Iran?"

Etc, etc etc
Cyrexx
Honestly, tell me which i should accept that i will not look or rather fail? Should i conclude they just got lucky? Those are men natural way of being perfectly insightful?

Will u consider this question superstition?

Bro, there are so much facts from the bible that i get puzzle, and amaze.
from what i read from this site
I some time wander how i wish i have a better avenue to consider this stuff with you.

T®ue sight please let's discuss......

U can email me on wagskehinde@yahoo.com

@ truthislight

for muslims claims similar to yours, see this threads

https://www.nairaland.com/421464/show-me-autheticity-bible
https://www.nairaland.com/69318/scientist-proof-support-holy-quran
https://www.nairaland.com/108142/scientific-miracles-glorious-quran


you purposefully misquote me with your statement: "did u just say that atheist dont follow rationality or that atheist dont follow reason? "
what i said was: atheists dont follow religion but real concrete testable and reasonable evidence.

and when i say evidence, i mean real evidence, not some "miracles" or "prophecies" of the pasts that cannot be demonstrated here and now in this modern age. this is because every ancient culture and religions, including our african forefathers, has "miracle" stories too. and i cant follow all of them. you understand me now?

@cyrexx
Men, what i presented to u where scientific facts and not miracle of any sort.
What i quoted are facts.
I had ask u to present on this thread evidence that the koran contain scientific facts and not miracles.
Pls. Site the koran evidence in black and white so that those reading can relate to it and benefit, not all readers will want to go to the thread u quoted. And NOTE, NOT MIRACLES BUT SCIENTIFIC FACTS.
Or verifiable prophesies. Note, eg. the extinction of Babylon = 50miles from Iran. Site ur reference clearly.

I know u are circumcise, but u will never ask how come human just decided to cut off the foreskin of there manhood to get the real head?
It was this God that u said never existed that told Abraham to do that so that the whole world will know that he created man and that he is God.
So, meaning that in the womb he covered the head of ur manhood to prevent fluid from entering it, but once u came out the head can be expose. Circumcise.

Then, U will tell me that the gods of other nations knew that,
and let there people go with the head of there manhood covered.

Am waiting to see u cite what other Gods have to offer.
If u cant.
Then u know what to do.
Cyrexx, u are not imaginary and the evidence i cited are as real as u.
Am even wandering if u red my post befor replying.
Infact Ijawkid reproduce it for all to see.
Peace.

truthislight: @cyrexx
Men, what i presented to u where scientific facts and not miracle of any sort.
What i quoted are facts.
I had ask u to present on this thread evidence that the koran contain scientific facts and not miracles.
Pls. Site the koran evidence in black and white so that those reading can relate to it and benefit, not all readers will want to go to the thread u quoted. And NOTE, NOT MIRACLES BUT SCIENTIFIC FACTS.
Or verifiable prophesies. Note, eg. the extinction of Babylon = 50miles from Iran. Site ur reference clearly.

I know u are circumcise, but u will never ask how come human just decided to cut off the foreskin of there manhood to get the real head?
It was this God that u said never existed that told Abraham to do that so that the whole world will know that he created man and that he is God.
So, meaning that in the womb he covered the head of ur manhood to prevent fluid from entering it, but once u came out the head can be expose. Circumcise.

Then, U will tell me that the gods of other nations knew that,
and let there people go with the head of there manhood covered.

Am waiting to see u cite what other Gods have to offer.
If u cant.
Then u know what to do.
Cyrexx, u are not imaginary and the evidence i cited are as real as u.
Am even wandering if u red my post befor replying.
Infact Ijawkid reproduce it for all to see.
Peace.

U said it all bro.....

Perfect......

How else would job had known that d earth was hanging on nothing if not through inspiriation.......

@cyrexx,
your claim below shows that you are so sure of what quaran contains(bolded),

[size=14pt]a muslim can look at his quran and do exactly what you are doing and claim that his holy book is the word of god.[/size]
he can purposely read some meaning that the author did not mean into his quran. e.g.jew looking at and describing galaxies, seeing microscopic organisms, describing DNA etc etc.

now, the onus of proof now lies on you to proove [size=14pt]'in your own words pls not sites'[/size] how genuine your claims are about 'accuracy of events contained in the bible compared to quaran' (note bolded words in blue expecially,and site a corresponding pls,and failure to do that,ah,may expose something anyway) answer below questions to clarify your assertion;

present on this thread evidence that the koran contain scientific facts and not miracles.
Pls. Site the koran evidence in black and white so that those reading can relate to it and benefit, not all readers will want to go to the thread u quoted. And NOTE, NOT MIRACLES BUT SCIENTIFIC FACTS.
Or[size=14pt] verifiable prophesies. Note, eg. the extinction of Babylon = 50miles from Iran. Site ur reference clearly[/size].

we onlookers on the tread are following claims and counter claims if they are genuine.thanks,waiting pls.

the onus of proof lies on the claimant, not the doubter

you are the one who claim bible is the only authentic word of god. so you are the one who has to prove that it is the word of god and dispel all reasonable doubts

about the muslim's beliefs that quran is the word of god, i'm not a muslim, so i dont have to prove anything islamic for you or quote any quranic verses. some muslims have done that. if you cant isit those links i posted earlier, there is nothing i can do further about. it is the muslims who have to convince you, not me.

about the scientific claims that brother truthislight is talking about, they are not specific enough, they are too general and anybody can read any meaning into it. besides, he has not fully quoted the verses for all to see and examine. let him state the verses that express his biblical scientific findings and we can continue from there

thanks.

@cyrexx
Bro, now, which of what i have said do u think i have not provided biblical back up?
Cause on this thread i have been quoting scriptures as i speak.
However, if there are specifics u wish i should show where it is found in the bible i will be very glad to do that.
Peace.

ok lets start with one about DNA