Nairaland Forum

likeme: So Nigeria's Trade Minister, Olusegun Aganga has signed an MOU with a certain Vulcan Petroleum to build 6 new modular refineries worth $4.5 billion... & I laugh in Swahili!

Well, in the first place no western investor will commit to building a new refinery in Nigeria just now. The Chinese state companies can build refineries but they would have bargained for other things.

It's just a total mess that Aganga is working just for the sake of getting activities on & not necessarily to achieve real change. I'm sure the way Aganga is discharging his duties to Nigeria is not the same way he managed his portfolio while at Goldman Sachs!

Sadly, the same Vulcan Energy signing this refinery deal is a subsidiary of Vulcan Capital who have a history of contract breaches & controversies.

The promoters of Vulcan Energy signed a contract with Sokoto state government in 2008 to build independent power plants in 6 months. Well after the exchange of millions of dollars & 4 years down the line, the IPP project is yet to see the light of the day!

Another Vulcan Capital's subsidiary was awarded a power plant contract in Iraq in 2004 and this was also marred with accusations of bribery & lawsuits on breach of contract.

Various cases of contract breaches have been filed & won against Vulcan in the US and oddly in some instances, some of the lawyers of Vulcan have withdrawn their legal services from Vulcan due to unpaid legal bills.

Well, Mr Aganga in his wisdom deems it fit to sign a refinery deal with an investment company (not even a refinery operator) with a chequered history. The question is how many refineries do Vulcan operate in the world currently?

Meanwhile it is obvious Nigeria does NOT need new refineries at the moment when it will be more cost effective & scalable to put our current refineries to work optimally.

Recently a refinery expert in the UK, who has consulted for various government & private owned refineries, including NNPC told me that, "Nigeria does not need new refineries just now. No serious investor will build new refineries in Nigeria. What Nigeria needs to do is to ensure the existing refineries are made fully functional & effective. But that might never happen!"

So the final question is why are top refinery operators in the world & major international oil companies not building refineries in Nigeria? Why is Aganga signing an MOU with "a certain" Vulcan Energy all in the bid to show that government is doing something? Well, do the maths! ...Tope

I think you have made a valid point in bringing to fore many controversies surrounding this company and its alleged parent company. We will continue to monitor things as they unfold.

However, to your question, please refer to Nigeria pre-MTN/Econet's adventure in 2001. Many people raised similar questions why the Oranges, the AT&Ts of this world did not show interest. Why some third rate telcos from Zimbabwe and South Africa? They asked. However, we have seen what their risk-averse, ask-questions-do-nothing, it-will-never-work, corruption-rife mentality has caused them. A life-time miss in opportunity to invest in a volatile but promising market.

frond:

FDI should be brought by investor with a genuine registered company. Nigeria should not be exception to this case. The technical you are talking about should either come from a consultant company or experienced company in the field. Because of the magnitude of this amount, this company should be known internationally either in Nigeria or otherwise. How can a reputable company would not have website either in Africa or in any other countries. This can be true.

The money doesnt come from your government per sae, at least not much. The money comes from the 3 investors. You need to do the Bloomberg link I sent you for details. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-01-30/vulcan-energy-plans-to-invest-620-billion-naira-in-nigeria-1-.html Vulcan plan to invest...does it say Nigeria government plan to invest ? Gosh..

Billyonaire: Its even on Bloomberg website, wow, its real deal.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-01-30/vulcan-energy-plans-to-invest-620-billion-naira-in-nigeria-1-.html

The story was written by a Nigerian for Bloomberg. It is not the duty of bloomberg to verify the authencity of any company.

johnnyemman: How can you sign such a contract with a company that does not have a website?..........Nigeria we keep fooling ourselves, this is another way of taking funds out of Nigeria, OBJ did the same with a chiness comapny abt rail road. How can you sign 4.5 Billion dollar with a company that does not have a website.

The bold refers.

No sir, Obj's contract with the Chinese on rail-road was terminated by Yaradua to the laughable applause of many Nigerians at that time.

Nigeria forfeited more than $500million on penalty though.

Indeed!

Mtcheeu

Hmmmmmm,since 2011 it has been from one partnership to build to foreign investors to invest in...........,from china to india to russia to iran,now USA,na wa o,i dont want to be pessimistic but i think this govt is another scam.I'm yet to see one promise in progress or fulfilled.They have left d nepa scam,now they have entered refinery,ok o.God pass una.

Billyonaire: The money doesnt come from your government per sae, at least not much. The money comes from the 3 investors. You need to do the Bloomberg link I sent you for details. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-01-30/vulcan-energy-plans-to-invest-620-billion-naira-in-nigeria-1-.html Vulcan plan to invest...does it say Nigeria government plan to invest ? Gosh..

Broda, this is said to be joint venture. Nigeria government has history of this shady deal. Check previous Nigeria government joint venture. Is either the company is owned by one of them and divert the federal money to the project and at the end of the day there would not be completion. Bicourtney and Nitel deal are typical example.

I Thought they said refineries are not profitable? why waste money then invest in a non profitable market? Nigeria Government self una tire

likeme: So Nigeria's Trade Minister, Olusegun Aganga has signed an MOU with a certain Vulcan Petroleum to build 6 new modular refineries worth $4.5 billion... & I laugh in Swahili!

Well, in the first place no western investor will commit to building a new refinery in Nigeria just now. The Chinese state companies can build refineries but they would have bargained for other things.

It's just a total mess that Aganga is working just for the sake of getting activities on & not necessarily to achieve real change. I'm sure the way Aganga is discharging his duties to Nigeria is not the same way he managed his portfolio while at Goldman Sachs!

Sadly, the same Vulcan Energy signing this refinery deal is a subsidiary of Vulcan Capital who have a history of contract breaches & controversies.

The promoters of Vulcan Energy signed a contract with Sokoto state government in 2008 to build independent power plants in 6 months. Well after the exchange of millions of dollars & 4 years down the line, the IPP project is yet to see the light of the day!

Another Vulcan Capital's subsidiary was awarded a power plant contract in Iraq in 2004 and this was also marred with accusations of bribery & lawsuits on breach of contract.

Various cases of contract breaches have been filed & won against Vulcan in the US and oddly in some instances, some of the lawyers of Vulcan have withdrawn their legal services from Vulcan due to unpaid legal bills.

Well, Mr Aganga in his wisdom deems it fit to sign a refinery deal with an investment company (not even a refinery operator) with a chequered history. The question is how many refineries do Vulcan operate in the world currently?

Meanwhile it is obvious Nigeria does NOT need new refineries at the moment when it will be more cost effective & scalable to put our current refineries to work optimally.

Recently a refinery expert in the UK, who has consulted for various government & private owned refineries, including NNPC told me that, "Nigeria does not need new refineries just now. No serious investor will build new refineries in Nigeria. What Nigeria needs to do is to ensure the existing refineries are made fully functional & effective. But that might never happen!"

So the final question is why are top refinery operators in the world & major international oil companies not building refineries in Nigeria? Why is Aganga signing an MOU with "a certain" Vulcan Energy all in the bid to show that government is doing something? Well, do the maths! ...Tope

Can someone please respond to this post? This guy raised some good issues here about the company.

frond:

Broda, this is said to be joint venture. Nigeria government has history of this shady deal. Check previous Nigeria government joint venture. Is either the company is owned by one of them and divert the federal money to the project and at the end of the day there would not be completion. Bicourtney and Nitel deal are typical example.

I am tired of your pessimism, so what do you wanna do now, why dont you contest election and change things, am tired of pessimism.

frond:

The story was written by a Nigerian for Bloomberg. It is not the duty of bloomberg to verify the authencity of any company.

What are you talking about, so if a Nigerian journalist wrote the news, does it change the fact the Vulcan is bringing money to invest ? Or will you refuse investment because the company does not build a 100 thousand naira website ? So many companies dont even run websites.

aminu150: another dumb idea from the useles 9ja govt. Why cant we build our own refineries or allow Nigerian business men do it? Must we wait for US for everything?. Since Nigeria is a good place for investment why cant they (US) bring some of their manufacturing companies here to contribute to economic development.

Thank you o !!!

Piddo: It is not yet Uhuru for Nigerians. At face value, this appears a laudable project but has anyone bothered to think how the investors will make their money back? You and I will pay for it for over many decades to come. Upon completion, the FG will ban importation of petroleum products and Nigerians will have to pay the rate dictated by the "investors" for their product. If only the FG was honest about fighting corruption, fixing the nations 4 refineries would have been best for Nigerians but now we have invited people in with billions of dollars and surely, its no charity!! Nigerians will pay dearly for it in the end.
Source

I agree with you here
What are the terms of the MOU?
PHCN is ineffective yet govt keeps jacking up the tariff for the investors to come.
What is the cost benefit analysis to the communities the refineries will be located in particular and the Nigerian nation in general?
Will it be the master servant oil majors relationship with their hosts we see in the ND?
I recall the govt was vehemently opposed to building refineries during the fuel subsidy debates, so who are this Vulcan peeps fronting for?
Check the link below for their last project milestone was in 2007 [5 whooping years ago]
http://www.vulcancapital.com/sel_timeline.html
Even at that a company that wants to invest 4.5 billion dollars [720 billion naira] cant build/have a website worth 500,000 naira?
Aganga should not think because we saw an oyinbo man on the screen, we will swallow every thing hook, line and sinker
This Vulcan seems to be a 'Wash' jo!

Billyonaire: What are you talking about, so if a Nigerian journalist wrote the news, does it change the fact the Vulcan is bringing money to invest ? Or will you refuse investment because the company does not build a 100 thousand naira website ? So many companies dont even run websites.

Yes, so many companies don't run websites but serious companies should run websites. That's the first public interface.

aminu150: another dumb idea from the useles 9ja govt. Why cant we build our own refineries or allow Nigerian business men do it? Must we wait for US for everything?. Since Nigeria is a good place for investment why cant they (US) bring some of their manufacturing companies here to contribute to economic development.

I agree. This cannot be good for Nigeria at all. In other to bring the american investors to nigeria, the federal government would have to make a lot of concessions. Why can't we build our own refineries? Why are we sooooo dependent in 2012 on foreigners?

So the final question is why are top refinery operators in the world & major international oil companies not building refineries in Nigeria? Why is Aganga signing an MOU with "a certain" Vulcan Energy all in the bid to show that government is doing something? Well, do the maths! ...Tope

Ozonna:

Can someone please respond to this post? This guy raised some good issues here about the company.

Its because the above question is silly. Top refinery operators dont risk their money where there is kidnapping, terrorism and standard economic principles. The second question is also silly, because the best thing to do is, go to America's BBB online (Business Bureau) to check the profile of the company, the history and case studies. I think the main problem with us in the country is graduating from Universities and thinking we are educated and intelligent. It takes more than paper certificates to be successful. Vulcan Energy if you check with the US bureau has excellent track records.

porka:

Yes, so many companies don't run websites but serious companies should run websites. That's the first public interface.

Seriously are you saying you can do business with company simply because you see website ? Jesus...go to better business bureau website to look legitimacy of companies in USA Better www.bbb.org

ogbonoeba:

I agree. This cannot be good for Nigeria at all. In other to bring the american investors to nigeria, the federal government would have to make a lot of concessions. Why can't we build our own refineries? Why are we sooooo dependent in 2012 on foreigners?

You can not build your refinery because you do not even have the expertise, simple. And public private partnership is what every successful country does, Government has no business in business, so you need to go back to your Economics 101.

Ozonna:

Can someone please respond to this post? This guy raised some good issues here about the company.

What makes this whole thing even more suspect is the name of the Nigerian company that Vulcan is working with. "Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited". This company has no website and for all you know, could be just a few months old. We all know the only company that has been refining crude in Nigeria for decades is NNPC. The architects of this deal now chose to use a company name that would appear a perfect fit. Can anyone in government please tell us what Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited has been involved in prior to now?

US to... Fg to..sss to... Boko haram to... This 'to' don suffer.

Piddo: It is not yet Uhuru for Nigerians. At face value, this appears a laudable project but has anyone bothered to think how the investors will make their money back? You and I will pay for it for over many decades to come. Upon completion, the FG will ban importation of petroleum products and Nigerians will have to pay the rate dictated by the "investors" for their product. If only the FG was honest about fighting corruption, fixing the nations 4 refineries would have been best for Nigerians but now we have invited people in with billions of dollars and surely, its no charity!! Nigerians will pay dearly for it in the end.


Source

What makes this whole thing even more suspect is the name of the Nigerian company that Vulcan is working with. "Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited". This company has no website and for all you know, could be just a few months old. We all know the only company that has been refining crude in Nigeria for decades is NNPC. The architects of this deal now chose to use a company name that would appear a perfect fit. Can anyone in government please tell us what Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited has been involved in prior to now? I know this smacks of paranoia but no one can blame us Nigerians for trying to read between the lines. We have been taken for far too many rides!

Piddo:

What makes this whole thing even more suspect is the name of the Nigerian company that Vulcan is working with. "Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited". This company has no website and for all you know, could be just a few months old. We all know the only company that has been refining crude in Nigeria for decades is NNPC. The architects of this deal now chose to use a company name that would appear a perfect fit. Can anyone in government please tell us what Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited has been involved in prior to now?

So a comppany has to be as old as me to do business. Let me come in here. Lets say I own a product oil firm, and I have made billions, and I see my friend that is worth billions and I decide we need to do business. We got to register new firm and have stakes/shares in it based on our investment portfolio, then seek for foreign partner that will bring in remaining balance based on our Business plan and also. Investment such as petroleum needs government stake so it can influence decision in favor of citizens. Thats standard business practice worldwide. Why am upset is, that I discover you guys have not even done business worth 1 billion and you sound conviction on things you dont know, you cant judge a company by website and not even CAC registration cos fraudulent companies even use better websites and register fake data on CAC. Authenticity of company is verified via Consulates and Departments of Commerce of industries of country and certified by respective embassies. Some of you guy lack this knowledge cos you have the "Employ me" mentality and not the "I wanna hire" mentality. Tell your neighbor.

Billyonaire: Seriously are you saying you can do business with company simply because you see website ? Jesus...go to better business bureau website to look legitimacy of companies in USA Better www.bbb.org

No, you won't hear me say that.

Serious companies should show-case their achievements transparently on their internet.

It's not that websites are anti serious business are they?

There's no serious business done without due diligence carried-out.

The link you just posted is a website isn't it?

Imagine you referring me to physically travel to the US in order to verify their claim.

porka:

No, you won't hear me say that.

Serious companies should show-case their achievements transparently on their internet.

It's not that websites are anti serious business are they?

There's no serious business done without due diligence carried-out.

The link you just posted is a website isn't it?

Imagine you referring me to physically travel to the US in order to verify their claim.

Are you for real ? So you dont know about Better Business Bureau and you dont watch Bloomberg news on satellite TV, I weep for Nigeria. Go to the website and type "Vulcan" on the search bar.

Vulcan Oil & Chemical Products aka The Cincinnati Vulcan Company Inc.

5353 Spring Grove Ave
Cincinnati, OH 45217

BBB Review |



BBB Accredited Business since 4/25/2005
The Cincinnati Vulcan Company Inc.

Phone: (513) 242-2672 5353 Spring Grove Ave, Cincinnati, OH 45217 customerservice@vulcanoil.com
WEBSITE: http://www.vulcanoil.com

6 refineries at once by one company at a time when USA itself is reducing its oil importation from Nigeria. Fraud and Scam.

Billyonaire: So a comppany has to be as old as me to do business. Let me come in here. Lets say I own a product oil firm, and I have made billions, and I see my friend that is worth billions and I decide we need to do business. We got to register new firm and have stakes/shares in it based on our investment portfolio, then seek for foreign partner that will bring in remaining balance based on our Business plan and also. Investment such as petroleum needs government stake so it can influence decision in favor of citizens. Thats standard business practice worldwide. Why am upset is, that I discover you guys have not even done business worth 1 billion and you sound conviction on things you dont know, you cant judge a company by website and not even CAC registration cos fraudulent companies even use better websites and register fake data on CAC. Authenticity of company is verified via Consulates and Departments of Commerce of industries of country and certified by respective embassies. Some of you guy lack this knowledge cos you have the "Employ me" mentality and not the "I wanna hire" mentality. Tell your neighbor.

No need to get rude here. I mentioned in the last update to my post that we cannot be blamed for trying so hard to read between the lines because we have been taken for far too many rides. All we are asking for is transparency and there was none in this deal. A project of such magnitude should have been much more transparent especially since Nigerians will be ones to pay for this in the end. You think it is right to come from no where because you have a reputation and bags of money to invest and shove an idea down the throats of Nigerians? It is an "investment" and they will make their profit from each and everyone of us whether we like it or not. So don't come here and insult anyone with your employ me/ I wanna hire analogy. You may be one not to object when asked to bend over and get rammed up your behind but some of us will.

maasoap: 6 refineries at once by one company at a time when USA itself is reducing its oil importation from Nigeria. Fraud and Scam.

So are you saying the Nigerian company and the Federal Government wants to defraud the USA company ?

Piddo:

No need to get rude here. I mentioned in the last update to my post that we cannot be blamed for trying so hard to read between the lines because we have been taken for far too many rides. All we are asking for is transparency and there was none in this deal. A project of such magnitude should have been much more transparent especially since Nigerians will be ones to pay for this in the end. You think it is right to come from no where because you have a reputation and bags of money to invest and shove an idea down the throats of Nigerians? It is an "investment" and they will make their profit from each and everyone of us whether we like it or not. So don't come here and insult anyone with your employ me/ I wanna hire analogy. You may be one not to object when asked to bend over and get rammed up your behind but some of us will.

APOLOGIES IF YOU FELT INSULTED BUT I CANT EXCUSE SOME LEVEL OF IGNORANCE WITHOUT LASHING OUT.

Vulcan Oil & Chemical Products aka The Cincinnati Vulcan Company Inc.

5353 Spring Grove Ave
Cincinnati, OH 45217

BBB Review |

BBB Accredited Business since 4/25/2005
The Cincinnati Vulcan Company Inc.

Phone: (513) 242-2672 5353 Spring Grove Ave, Cincinnati, OH 45217 customerservice@vulcanoil.com
WEBSITE: http://www.vulcanoil.com

Billyonaire: Are you for real ? So you dont know about Better Business Bureau and you dont watch Bloomberg news on satellite TV, I weep for Nigeria. Go to the website and type "Vulcan" on the search bar.

You are mixing things up.

Slow down and read my replies.

It's not everyone here that is after your life, ok.

Some of us are for the projects.

You keep asking me to visit one website or another yet you said websites for firms are not necessary.

I asked you if the BBB stuff were not online, how then would I have checked it?

That means I have to physically travel to the US to get what I need.

Now that you have supplied it online, I don't have to.

Same way a firm's website would have solved so many questions.

For instance, serious firms would list their achievements and their directors details.

Which can then be verified elsewhere; from your almighty BBB etc.

Billyonaire: Vulcan Oil & Chemical Products aka The Cincinnati Vulcan Company Inc.

5353 Spring Grove Ave
Cincinnati, OH 45217

BBB Review |



BBB Accredited Business since 4/25/2005
The Cincinnati Vulcan Company Inc.



Phone: (513) 242-2672 5353 Spring Grove Ave, Cincinnati, OH 45217 customerservice@vulcanoil.com
WEBSITE: http://www.vulcanoil.com

Can you please do thesame for Petroleum Refining and Strategic Reserve Limited? For someone who claims to have the "hiring mentality", it is sad to see you exhibit such ignorance. Did you check out the link you posted before making it public? Maybe you did but it just didn't click for you. The Vulcan Oil company in Ohio is nothing but a glorified oil blending/delivery company. They even deliver 100 gallons free of charge The Vulcan in question is a Houston based corporation owned by Paul Allen of Microsoft! Change web browsers if the current one you are using is causing you to goof!

porka:

You are mixing things up.

Slow down and read my replies.

It's not everyone here that is after your life, ok.

Some of us are for the projects.

You keep asking me to visit one website or another yet you said websites for firms are not necessary.

I asked you if the BBB stuff were not online, how then would I have checked it?

That means I have to physically travel to the US to get what I need.

Now that you have supplied it online, I don't have to.

Same way a firm's website would have solved so many questions.

For instance, serious firms would list their achievements and their directors details.

Which can then be verified elsewhere; from your almighty BBB etc.

It is not necessary to criticize without first making efforts to research. Why do I have the courage to research and you just criticize without making efforts ? Its the difference between you and me. I find facts. Cos I am interested in the opportunities that might come.