Defend Your Programming Language

so where does it lie, what are those things u are able to do in java that makes you feel it's so powerful.
maybe i may be able to achieve the same feat in my language with less coding.

I am yet to see things java will do in server side development that php is lacking.
why dont we talk about what we can do in one language and cant do in others.

to me, all these languages are pretty much the same thing, just that some can be noticably slow compared to others

well, you can fork out child processes that can run independently using php's pcntl_fork()
the child process can outlive the script that created it
how you design the logic depends on you. you have what it takes.


http://uk.php.net/manual/en/ref.pcntl.php

java applets? i will rather use flash. it's faster and does not need to spare 5 minutes to load the JVM

well, i guess it calls some underlying system's functions.

am not totally sure i know what you understand by asynchronous messaging, but once you can create a process that can run independently
definitely, it's left to you to build the logic. you can bind the process(now a daemon) to a port number on your server and you can comunicate with the process.

(same process used by hackers to start a process on a victim machine, then use netcat or other port listeners to comunicate with the attacked system)

@webdezzi

Check here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Message-oriented_middleware

Apparently, you don't know what a century is, or you are one of those whose MO is unnecessary exaggerations. Either way, it's not worth it joining issues with you.

The focus should solutions derived from programming languages and not bragging about programming languages.

You may know everything about a programming knowledge without being able to use that programming knowledge to develop anything useful.

And this is where we fail. All theory and no practical solutions. Technology in itself can't do much, it is what you make out of it that matters.

Its is more complicated than that. Both java applets and activex were a conduit for security problems, so they fell out of favour. That left desktop java to compete with other technologies; java products turned out to be slow and ugly (a no-no for users), so java was ditched as a desktop technology. That leaves the internet; in the beginning, there was j this and j that, but all quickly lost out to ease of use, security and performance etc of ASP.NET (to all who could afford steep MS lisences). Finally leaving java to exist primarily on linux servers, where it has the advantage of being free. . . But Mono is gaining useful market share here as well.

All the above is not to say java doesn't have its strengths, the latest incarnation seems to have caught up with C#'s performance in some areas, but its too little, too late. It has a mountain to climb in functionality; perhaps java can still make a place for itself in poorer countries where no one can argue with the price of free; but for quality? Its been left behind.

See, the problem is you don't know enough about Java. Applets were considered safe because of the sandbox model, but fell out of favor because they were what you would consider fat clients (and of course with all the attendant draw-backs). ActiveX clients were usually avoided like the plague back in the day because of the security concerns, but not applets.

Yes, signed applets CAN be as dangerous as ActiveX, but the signature is about trust. If you do not trust the author of the applet, you have the option of not allowing the applet to load. I don't know how ActiveX security is being handled now, but back then it was a nightmare as there was no comparable security model to the signature/sandbox model used by applets.

are u talking about desktop gui. if you are then i will be the first to say java sucks in destop gui. If you are developing windows desktop gui. The undisputed champion is .NET

but if you are talking about a web gui while java might not be the most ideal. there are some pretty cool java tech that will make it very easy to develop.

But like i have said Java is most powerful in the server side so if you think PHP can match it. Lets discuss.



I get it .Net is like a better clone of Java and while .Net simplified a lot of language features. Java is catching up very fast. For example .Net introduced a pretty solid Threading package but Java caught up in Java 1.6 and is set to surpass it in 1.7 with a package for Parallel programming.

From an architectural standpoint Java has an edge because you have many target platform deployment options- (most medium to large companies run a unix type platform on the server side). Also there are many more very good Java Developers (and many more interesting Projects)and from my experience some of the better .Net developers were actually previously Java guys.

And the Java open source community is in a different league  when compared to what is available in .NET.

since u, a java fan, admits java sucks in the gui environment, I think java has lost in my main point of argument, which is, java (not java gui) sucks in terms of speed. same goes with applet. the time it takes an applet to load can cook beans, even when on local host.


in this age when, a british guy could hack into us nava computers  and retrieve top secret information without nasa knowing.
there are many security issues about applets in the security world.

let me give you en example.
since java is able to access your desktop only after taking permission from the user, then imagine the possibility, what if that trusted site using applets  had it's file swapped with a modified version by a system administrator.

whatabout a disgruntled sacked developer who remembered to leave a backdoor behind.

what about the bank who hosted its insurance website on same server he hosted his online banking, an attacker who is able to penetrate through the insurance site may not be able to access the bank's database but can replace the password encryptor applet with a modified version that does the intended task and steals login as well, or even access users computers to gather more info.

to me, java failed in the desktop environment (u admited this), also failed in the web arena.

.NET 3.5 already allows for parallel computing. The current capabilities are getting seriously  expanded in .NET 4 with official support for concepts like Software Transactional memory http://channel9.msdn.com/shows/Going%20Deep/Software-Transactional-Memory-The-Current-State-of-the-Art/
See also http://channel9.msdn.com/tags/concurrency/

Thats awesome !! never knew that was already in .Net 3.5.

This still doesn't mean i will use .Net though 

@Beaf

Most of the innovation in Java actually comes from the Open source Community. Sun hasn't done a good job in improving Java in recent years i was actually one of those people happy that about the recent takeover