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Rubbermaid (f)
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I see things like this 'Umu Igbo Unite' http://www.umuigbounite.com/They seem to fish out themselves whereever they for friendhsips, business, marriage etc Especially marriage - they tend to focus on other Igbos (ibos) in their search for marriage. Makes me wonder - are Igbos the most united Nigerian tribe?  |
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debosky (m)
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united? definitely not, I think the correct term would be most inward looking or 'tribal-centric'
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ZuluNation (m)
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In my opinion I think we Igbos need to be more united when it comes to Nigerian polities. If we Igbos are a little more united in Nigeria I don't think the Northerners would have a say in Nigeria.
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Rubbermaid (f)
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In my opinion I think we Igbos need to be more united when it comes to Nigerian polities. If we Igbos are a little more united in Nigeria I don't think the Northerners would have a say in Nigeria.
interesting that you see yourselves as divided when it comes to politics. I always felt u guys stuck together. So what are your dividing factors? Is it based on state of origin Anambra vs Imo? Outcaste vs non Outcaste? I hear you guys are big on that. |
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debosky (m)
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I don't know too much but i think its based on the original way igbo society was formed: very republican, each small group had its own igwe/obi ( i don't know which is correct) so because of those antecedents its not as easy for them to easily coem together as one, the independent streak is very strong, unlike maybe the yorubas or the hausas who more or less had an oba or emir that was the overall head.
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Idekeson (m)
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Outcaste vs non Outcaste? I hear you guys are big on that.
Did they teach you that in your high school African history class in Cali? The Igboman is independent minded and do not believe in monarchy. This tend to work against them in the African setting where most tribes tow the line of select few that lord and rule over them. |
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zebudaya (m)
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I don't know too much but i think its based on the original way igbo society was formed: very republican, each small group had its own igwe/obi ( i don't know which is correct) so because of those antecedents its not as easy for them to easily come together as one, the independent streak is very strong, unlike maybe the yorubas or the hausas who more or less had an oba or emir that was the overall head.
Debosky you are wrong, earlier on Most Igbo societies did not have any central leaders. They were governed by a group of elders. One person did not have final say, infact the whiteman was suprised to find out that some villages lacked a central ruler because he's used to having King/queen of England. some exceptions are places like Onitsha which had an obi. I guess thats why we are encouraged to make quick and reasonable decisions independently. By yourself Also what makes you think we don't come together as one. We go home every christmas regardless of where you are in the country Just for that reason " To come together as one ". No other ethnic group does that on a larger scale than we do. We even united and fought a civil war when we thought we were mistreated. @rubbermaid. Every society has people who they discriminate against, White people have white trash, its not right but it doesn't warrant your derision "I hear you guys are big on that" crap. As per being united, you can't fight and loose a civil war and expect all to be gravy and dandy so igbo's and the south-south are still suffering from all that stuff. I hope you realize that after the civil war everybody was reduced to 20 Nigerian pounds I think, so if you were a millionaire in Biafran currency you have been reduced to a pauper. So for them to mount an economic and political comeback is highly impressive.
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Rubbermaid (f)
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@rubbermaid. Every society has people who they discriminate against, White people have white trash, its not right but it doesn't warrant your derision "I hear you guys are big on that" crap. As per being united, you can't fight and loose a civil war and expect all to be gravy and dandy so igbo's and the south-south are still suffering from all that stuff. I hope you realize that after the civil war everybody was reduced to 20 Nigerian pounds I think, so if you were a millionaire in Biafran currency you have been reduced to a pauper. So for them to mount an economic and political comeback is highly impressive.
My intent was definitely not derision. My secondary school (all 6 years of it) was acutally in iboland and the issue of one's caste came up quite frequently - although mostly in quarrels. Back then it was explained to me that it was a very serious matter for one to be considered an outcaste. Noone really explained the traditional reasons behind it they just said it was. Actually, there was an episode where one girls parents came to school and made a big scene because someone had (maliciously) called their daughter an osu. So, I am guessing from your response that an Osu equates to white trash in the white american society? Also guessing that being an Osu is not a dividing issue in the Igbo community. So, what are the dividing political factors that ZuluNation refers to? Like I said in my previous post, I was under the impression that Igbos are a very united people. Mais non? |
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zebudaya (m)
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Osu is not equivalent to white trash. I believe they are discriminated against unfairly. But I thought you were coming at it with a superior attitude when You said "I heard you guys are big on that statement"
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Rubbermaid (f)
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No, that's not it at all.
I speak from an outsider perspective since I am not Igbo but I am intrigued by the culture. I have no superiority or other hidden motives other than to get some insights.
As a matter of fact, my mother was born and raised through adulthood in Aba and speaks Ibo better than her own language. Ironically, her family lost all in the Biafran war, and had to flee to Lagos. Plus, I am not as naiive about the culture too since I spent 6 years there and made life long friends. So no, I am not looking down on any aspect of your culture. I 'm just trying to get a broader perspective on certain things.
PS - And this is a little off point but oh well: one city I visited with a friend a couple years ago (for an Igbo cultural day) has an afterschool cultural immersion program for Igbo children. It teaches them the language, and helps them socialize in, and understand their culture better. I thought it was pretty cool acutally.
They pick them up by vans everyday after school and watch and teach them until their parents get off work. I have never heard of this with any other nigerian group and these are the general things that give me the impression that you guys are united and tightly organized. But looks like that may not really be the case?
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WesleyanA (f)
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true. I hear "Igbo's unite" more than any other tribe. I think the hausa's are united too only i haven't really met much (i had one as a best friend when i was younger and she's probably the only hausa person i really know) PS - And this is a little off point but oh well: one city I visited with a friend a couple years ago (for an Igbo cultural day) has an afterschool cultural immersion program for Igbo children. It teaches them the language, and helps them socialize in, and understand their culture better. I thought it was pretty cool acutally.
They pick them up by vans everyday after school and watch and teach them until their parents get off work. I have never heard of this with any other nigerian group and these are the general things that give me the impression that you guys are united and tightly organized. But looks like that may not really be the case? cool. most yorubas wouldn't need this though. lol. you get your culture immersion from your home. most parents speak yoruba 24/7 + you have to know most of the things you need to know anyways. (some kids choose not to be immersed but you'll see it in them anyways). but if it was for other things,with yorubas, i'm sure there would be a few fights or so between iya lagbaja and some one else. lol (it's in our nature i guess) so it's cool that igbos are united like that. |
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debosky (m)
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sorry for the incorrections in my post zeb, but the essence still remains, each village/community was governed independently of others, hence the fragmented nature of overall leadership in the traditional igbo community. by the way y'all go home and all that, that simply shows a loyalty to your roots (which i agree the igbos are the top) not unity as in the ability to work together as a group. since biafra the igbo's have become quite fragmented, you have groups such as the kwale delta ibo, ikwerre and co trying to prove that they are different from the 'core igbo'. that does not strike me as too united. whereas, compared to say the yorubas, though they may be egba, ondo, ekiti, etc, they all still bear yoruba, the other terms are just internal differentiations, and as a group the yoruba will almost always present a common front. the average igbo man has a strong independent streak which does not foster real unity to a large extent.
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WesleyanA (f)
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hey! we're loyal to our roots too!!!  we might not go home every christmas (some rich ones do though), but we go home when there's a big party. doesn't that count?  I'll be honest. probably the reason yorubas don't go home more often is because people at home expect money from you (all your family. all 2000 of them!). You have to be rich or have saved tons to go home. and you can't go home and tell only a few people. there's what you call "yoruba gossip" and you'll make enemies 'cause you didn't visit so and so's house or didn't give so and so this amount of money. how do one measure what tribe is most loyal to their roots anyways? how about every nigerian tribe is equally united/ loyal to their tribe because it's true! |
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Rubbermaid (f)
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hey! we're loyal to our roots too!!! we might not go home every christmas (some rich ones do though), but we go home when there's a big party. doesn't that count? Hey, I hear that. Once there's gbadun everyone will show up  |
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Rubbermaid (f)
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Actually, I should change my question to "Are Igbos the Most United of the Major tribes in Nigeria?"
This is because little is known about the dynamics in many of the smaller tribes. That and their voices are not readily heard. So we end up not giving them due consideration in such.
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hot-angel (f)
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I seriously think the answer to thsi question is NO.
Igbo people aren't the most united . . .
Why? Well it mite look like it, but i don't think so. Especially from the friends i have here, and the igbo people i see arround. I mean it's just not a 'united thingy' going on much arround here.
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Seun (m)
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The Igbos are the ones who feel the need to make noise about their ethnicity the most. I've met lovely Igbo ladies that have never been to Nigeria but are more ethnocentric than I am. Thanks to the civil war, the entire Igbo (sorry, is it "Ibo"?) tribe (sorry, is it "nation"?) suffers from a massive persecution complex. Retired General Ojukwu, this is all your fault. You've messed them up badly.  |
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Hotstepper (f)
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@debosky , the issue of igwe/obi, I get you though. Like in my town of Nnewi in Anambra State ehhhh, we have an IGWE who is the ruler of the whole town but also we have OBIS who rule their individual regions I did say. Like Nnewi is made up of four quarters (UMUMDIM, OTOLO, URUAGU AND NNEWIICHI). So you will have IGWE of Nnewi and den have Obi Uruagu ( sum guy named OBI), Obi Umudim etc  |
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zebudaya (m)
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@hotstepper What you said about igwe/obi like i told debosky mostly happened in present day Anambra.(i believe Nnewi is in Anambra), the rest/most of us didn't have one Ruler.
Seun what do you mean by persecution complex, You are yoruba and live in ogun state everything is fine and dandy, what about Igbo people who live in ogun. You think they get the same benefits as you do, They are strangers in your land , and would forever be. Yoruba Muslims can move to the North as since they share the same Religion they are accepted readily. Igbos are predominantly Christian thus they would never be accepted that's why they are the first to be killed during any Religious crisis.
You need to take a trip round the country see how many toll gates we have from Asaba to Aba, and see the Horrible quality of the roads. Then compare Rivers, Akwa Ibom, Calabar to states in the South like osun, ogun, oyo who don't produce any oil. Then you would understand when people say they are being persecuted by the majority. The North doesn't even have as many toll gates as we have Yet our roads are horrible. Nigeria doesn't care about the East and the South South.
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debosky (m)
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The Igbos are the ones who feel the need to make noise about their ethnicity the most. I've met lovely Igbo ladies that have never been to Nigeria but are more ethnocentric than I am.
that was the word i was looking for, i think they are the most ethnocentric. I don't however agree with the civil war assertion that 'blames' ojukwu for the issues. its a far more complicated issue than that, i'll not comment further back to the nigeria doesn't love the east/south south i don't fully agree, while there has been significant neglect of these areas by successive govts, the issues are much more than these. the southwest road network arises primarily because it has always been the most urbanised area of nigeria, even as far back as colonial times before oil the north however doesnt experience anything close to the type of rainstorms that happen in the south which leads to them lasting longer, besides, due to the dispersed population their roads don't have anything close to the pressure roads encounter down south. besides the s/east is naturally prone to serious gully erosion and the like which further worsens the problem, coupled with the acknowledged difficult terrain in the s/south, all these factors promote the appearance of neglect, while in actual fact if u spend the same amount on a road in s/west or north and s/east and s/south, the west and north roads will last longer. thats an aside anywayz, i still feel the igbos have a strong self identity which doesnt promote unity |
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Hotstepper (f)
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@zebudaya, yeah, Nnewi is in Anambra state and I think itz da only town with such thing, Haven't heard anyother person mention it.
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zebudaya (m)
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@hotstepper that's my point exactly @debosky Roads can be maintained, gully erosion can be prevented by planting trees. The Federal government does not Repair Federal Roads in the East and South South. Calabar was as urbanized if not more than places in the southwest look at it now! "Due to her early role in international trade and colonial administration, Calabar hosts the earliest Military barracks, the first presbyterian church (Church of Scotland Mission) in 1846, the first monorail and the first modern road network in Nigeria. The city also boasts of the first public (General) Hospital in Nigeria – St. Margaret Hospital, the oldest post office and one of the first two botanical gardens in the country. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CalabarBBC reported that Mrs Okonjo-Iweala former finance minister "saved - rather than squandered - the government's profits from oil revenues". She got us debt relief something that other finance Ministers could not do, what did Obasanjo do to pay her in return? switch her to foriegn minstry "so that business can continue as usual for him and his cronies". She resigned today http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/5243538.stm. Would he have done that if she were hausa/Yoruba. Give me an honest answer? If you say yes Why is Babangida still free? |
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Hotstepper (f)
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so Nigeria can use igbos brain and hardworking skills and den garbage us when they want to?
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debosky (m)
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zeb don't be deceived, her treatment has absolutely nothing to do with the fact thatt she's igbo, was bola ige not yoruba, wasn't he kille din obj's regime? were his killers ever found?? wasn't tafa balogun yoruba? isnt he in jail now? I fyou want more i can thnk of dozens of other yoruba/hausas that OBJ's govt has maltreated. he does it to everyone, not igbos only. I agree the govts have neglected the s/south and s/east, all i said was that there are some additional factors making the problems worse.
Is Chris Uba not free? isn't his brother OBJ's tight friend?
look, these guys at the top don't really care about igbo/yoruba/hausa/ijaw and the like, they only care about their interests and their friends, they use the tribal things to deceive everyone else and continue to keep us fighting each other.
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zebudaya (m)
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Bola ige was a politician- You can't play succesful politics in Naija and not cheat. He's not innocent
Tafa Balogun is a crook- He's not innocent
Chris Uba is a crook and ObJ's friend- Not Innocent
Mrs Okonjo-Iweala Innocent and hardworking, Watch Nigeria go back into debt in a couple of months.
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debosky (m)
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yeah but isnt dora honest and hardworking? how come she is still OBJ's friend??
bola ige was also hardworking and honest, probably one of the best presidents we never had.
the reason she had to go was probably OBJ was worried she was getting a higher profile than him in the intl community, which is really what he's interested in. i don't think we'll go back into the debt (I pray not). nenadi usman isn;t bad either i think she has the guts to do the job, afterall she wasnt afraid to take on state guvs a few years back.
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zebudaya (m)
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Who's dora?
As per Bola Ige I repeat you can't play Nigerian Politics on a National Level without bring somebody else down, His nickname was Cicero. If bola Ige is as hardworking as you said How come when we had him as our Minister of Power we didn't have steady power. And as attorney general our legal system was still in shambles. Where is this Hardwork?
What does Having a higer profile matter. He comes to the West so much that the President Bush doesn't even greet him at the Airport.
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debosky (m)
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how long was he minister for? was he allowed to operate freely? do you think 6 months (the period he was power minister for) is enough to correct all our power problems? or the less than 1 year he spent in the justice ministry? he was killed, stopped from fufilling his vision.
FYI ige was called cicero cuzz he knew how to give good speeches - oratorial skills, not for any trickery, he was a simple man. lets even drop that subject
having a high profile matters to OBJ, thats why he flies to all the foreighn capitals one after the other. he prefers praise from the outside world than from nigerians, this fact should be clear to you. its because of the third term thing that he got the cold shoulder, before then, he had been going to g8 summits for the past 3 or 4 years running.
so you don't know dora akunyili? NAFDAC dg.
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naija_diva (f)
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united? definitely not, I think the correct term would be most inward looking or 'tribal-centric' what do you mean by that statement? |
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