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Telly B (m)
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hEy, What do you think you are, a muslim or a pegan? we all believe this is not Islam. How fool are you for introducing the sixth pillar of Islam? Heard It from the Prophet, or a great Islamist? Be careful My dear.  You just proved the Sixth Deadly Pillar of Islam!  How I wish you are online now, or i was online when you posted this. Wetin for happen? You go add another one to make am the 7th Pillar? |
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I-man (m)
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hEy, What do you think you are, a muslim or a pegan? we all believe this is not Islam. How fool are you for introducing the sixth pillar of Islam? Heard It from the Prophet, or a great Islamist? Be careful My dear. How I wish you are online now, or i was online when you posted this. Calm down . . .religion of peace . . .remember? |
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mukina2 (f)
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i only know the 5 pillars of Islam sixth , seventh and 20th are of the posters imagination  @ Iman |
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Telly B (m)
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mukina2, Although you succeeded in suspending me from the other thread to allow those who are possessed to manifest, I am still here. sixth , seventh and 20th are of the posters imagination Well, I don't know of the 7th and 20th; but we are witnessing the 6th pillar clearly demonstrated outside of our imagination. |
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davidylan (m)
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hEy, What do you think you are, a muslim or a pegan? we all believe this is not Islam. How fool are you for introducing the sixth pillar of Islam? Heard It from the Prophet, or a great Islamist? Be careful My dear. How I wish you are online now, or i was online when you posted this. What a "peaceful" response. Full of love, tolerance and the very embodiment of tranquility. Surely Jihad can only mean a struggle for internal righteousness. It has NOTHING to do with violence. |
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Telly B (m)
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What a "peaceful" response. Full of love, tolerance and the very embodiment of tranquility. Surely Jihad can only mean a struggle for internal righteousness. It has NOTHING to do with violence. Wey that emoticon for " laughing-out-so-bad-that-I-got-a-heart-attack??  |
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Telly B (m)
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We've got no choice. The sword, fatwa, jihad, and Ansary's rhetoric are all peaceful vocabs! |
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davidylan (m)
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Jihad is simply the quran's way of enforcing a state of peaceful coexistence and Ansary is merely advocating peace by force.
Whether by burning flags, suicide bombers, threats, religious riots e.t.c. all serve one major goal, ensuring we all live in peace with one another.
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mukina2 (f)
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@ telly B i still say i have never heard of 6 pillars of Islam ionly know of 5 pillars  @ I-man |
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mukina2 (f)
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Wetin?  Peace! keep your peace me and you na today |
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abujal (m)
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people keep tokin about muslims been violent and hustle, but nobody ever tok about what is happening in palastine and other arabian countries that are be terrorised by the the so called world power. i am not justifing the killing of innocent souls but what is good for the gooses is good for the gender. i think nossycheck, babyosisi and Gwaine shld be resonable and answer qustn by Babs and no be insultive. u have quoted from the quran so has Babs quoted from the bible same kind of verse asking belivers to fight those idolators and enemies of our faith. Babs well done  |
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davidylan (m)
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people keep tokin about muslims been violent and hustle, but nobody ever tok about what is happening in palastine and other arabian countries that are be terrorised by the the so called world power. i am not justifing the killing of innocent souls but what is good for the gooses is good for the gender. i think nossycheck, babyosisi and Gwaine shld be resonable and answer qustn by Babs and no be insultive. u have quoted from the quran so has Babs quoted from the bible same kind of verse asking belivers to fight those idolators and enemies of our faith. Babs well done Which world power is involved the present crisis between the Lebanese army and the islamic Jihad in Beirut? |
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I-man (m)
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people keep tokin about muslims been violent and hustle, but nobody ever tok about what is happening in palastine and other arabian countries that are be terrorised by the the so called world power. i am not justifing the killing of innocent souls but what is good for the gooses is good for the gender. i think nossycheck, babyosisi and Gwaine shld be resonable and answer qustn by Babs and no be insultive. u have quoted from the quran so has Babs quoted from the bible same kind of verse asking belivers to fight those idolators and enemies of our faith. Babs well done Isn't that what they call "the law of the jungle" ? Isn't Islam supposed to a "religion of peace"? As adherents of the religion of peace,one would think that you would strive to lead by the force of your example instead of saying "what is good for the gooses is good for the gender" |
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Telly B (m)
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Another one just come O! @abujal, abeg no follow the trail of your friends like nyanbinghi O! them go just waste your posts! |
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nossycheek (f)
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people keep tokin about muslims been violent and hustle, but nobody ever tok about what is happening in palastine and other arabian countries that are be terrorised by the the so called world power. i am not justifing the killing of innocent souls but what is good for the gooses is good for the gender. i think nossycheck, babyosisi and Gwaine shld be resonable and answer qustn by Babs and no be insultive. u have quoted from the quran so has Babs quoted from the bible same kind of verse asking belivers to fight those idolators and enemies of our faith. Babs well done I wonder who is not being reasonable here. Babs had his questions answered and talking about being insultive, I believe that you should know whom to direct that to. raheem,babs787, in case you pretend not to know. As for your warrior, we have not seen much of him in recent times, but in case you want to replace him, you are welcome on board, anyday any time. No shaking It is a pity that you don't know what is happening in your sister countries hence you are misguided. Cheerio |
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Telly B (m)
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As for your warrior, we have not seen much of him in recent times, but in case you want to replace him, you are welcome on board, anyday any time. Una no go kill person with laughter! |
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babs787 (m)
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@stimulus The facts boil down to one thing and one thing only: there's no jihad in the career of Jesus Christ, regardless your sweated and pained effort to interpret Biblical verses as such.
Ok, we shall see as we proceed. # Did Jesus Christ go out to attack cities or promise damsels and booties for those who take up a jihad in His name? Are you referring to God of the Ot or NT? In case you missed it, read below please. 2 Chronicles 15:13: All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman. Can you please explain the reason behind the killing? Numbers 31:7,17-18: "" They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man, Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. What is the reason behind the killing? Numbers 25 v 17: Treat the Midianites as enemies and kill them,18 because they treated you as enemies when they deceived you in the affair of Peor and their sister Cozbi, the daughter of a Midianite leader, the woman who was killed when the plague came as a result of Peor." Can you please explain the above too? Numbers 31 v 7-12: 7 And they warred against the Midianites, as the LORD commanded Moses; and they slew all the males. 8 And they slew the kings of Midian, beside the rest of them that were slain; namely, Evi, and Rekem, and Zur, and Hur, and Reba, five kings of Midian: Balaam also the son of Beor they slew with the sword. 9 And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods. 10 And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire. 11 And they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts. 12 And they brought the captives, and the prey, and the spoil, unto Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and unto the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the camp at the plains of Moab, which are by Jordan near Jericho. Explain the above please. # Is there any Hadith or even verse in the Qur'an that teaches that Jesus Christ went to war against people in just the same way that Muhammad did?
In case you missed the verses above, here is another verses for you. Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2) Why the killing and sharing of spoils?N ow therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18) Can you explain the reason for the above killing? Even Muslims, (in comparing the careers of Moses, Jesus and Muhammad based on Deut. 18:15 & 18 for 'the Prophet'), usually state that Muhammad was a military leader, while Jesus Christ was not! Grin Take a look at the table of comparison in the following link, where Muhammad is clearly said to have gone after his enemies in hot pursuit with battles; while Jesus Christ did no such: 2. A Prophet Like Moses Encounters with enemies: Moses - Hot Pursuit Muhammad - Hot pursuit w/ battles Jesus - n/a Source: http://www.bilderberg.org/crusade/Islam.htmNo matter how you argue this topic, you can't evade the fact that Muhammad was a warmonger who predicated paradise on warfare for Muslims. Brother, you claimed that Muhammed was a warmonger, please explain the below verses and the reason for killing by your God Jesus of the OT. Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18) He even ordered the killing of womenNow therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18) Now Muhammed fought the pagans to repel oppression and never transgressed limit, but here God Jesus of the OT, ordering the killing of men, women, children and everything that breathes Deuteronomy 20:16: However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.
Can you tell me why he ordered the killing of living things, even animals? 1 Samuel 15:2-4 2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt. 3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. 4 And Saul gathered the people together, and numbered them in Telaim, two hundred thousand footmen, and ten thousand men of Judah. Why did they kill woman, infant, sucking, oxen, sheep, camel and ass, please for what purpose and did those animals and the innocent children offend God? By lumping up every Christian that way, you've displayed your seething bias and prejudice. The same arguments applies to your Muslim apologists who have jumped into threads and sought to ridicule Christianity. Go ask babs787 who has a second-to-none reputation for that on this Forum. He often advanced the excuse that he was only 'retaliating' until he was exposed for who he really was - his "tit-for-tat" games could not compare with his infelicity of referring to your own Muslim translators as "deluded authors that lied in order to deceive"!! I haven't seen any Muslim reaction to that on this Forum, other than the joke you guys often come with as highlighted in your quote above. It is not my problem, you may shout from now till tomorrow for all I care. You keep mentioning babs as being the one that has been deriding your faith, give me just a verse where I have done that and I will back it with verses from both the bible and the Quran. I learnt that when you post anything about muslims, nobody cautions you nor do muslims accuse you of 'deriding' but when muslims ask any questions, you quickly conclude that they are deriding your faith. Babs has not been around now and you have not stopped you mischief, but trust me, when I am back, I will be back for good. @noisycheek I wonder who is not being reasonable here. Babs had his questions answered and talking about being insultive, I believe that you should know whom to direct that to. raheem,babs787, in case you pretend not to know.
Never mind, I have been trying to put things in order but when I am back, I will make this nairaland hot for you. . You are here accusing me of insulting you, let me have the posts and I will bring out those you have started. As for your warrior, we have not seen much of him in recent times, but in case you want to replace him, you are welcome on board, anyday any time.
No shaking Cool
Like I told you, babs will soon be here for all of you. Keep sending your posts till I come your way. |
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davidylan (m)
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oga blabs! Welcome o, long time no see! We are happy to read from you today sir, God bless you sir! |
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babs787 (m)
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@david oga blabs! Welcome o, long time no see! Grin Grin Grin We are happy to read from you today sir, God bless you sir! Never mind, I am not back yet, but will soon be back. I just breezed in to see how nairaland is doing but noticed that you haven't changed. Very soon, babs will be back |
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bari_kade
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@babs787, Even though we all get busy and we're not always on the Forum, I'D like to respond to your resuming post before I get busy again. Are you referring to God of the Ot or NT? In case you missed it, read below please. Are your arguments against Jews or Christians, babs787? 2 Chronicles 15:13:All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman.
Can you please explain the reason behind the killing? That verse did not state that God ordered a jihad there, please. It was rather pointing to the covenant that the Jews made among themselves, if you read it in its context: (12) And they entered into a covenant to seek the LORD God of their fathers with all their heart and with all their soul; (13) That whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (14) And they sware unto the LORD with a loud voice, and with shouting, and with trumpets, and with cornets. As you can see, there were no killings in the verse you quoted. Numbers 31:7,17-18: ""They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man, Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
What is the reason behind the killing? Read from verse 1: Numbers 31: (1) The LORD spoke to Moses, saying, (2) " Avenge the people of Israel on the Midianites. Afterward you shall be gathered to your people." (3) So Moses spoke to the people, saying, "Arm men from among you for the war, that they may go against Midian to execute the LORD's vengeance on Midian. Now, it may be asked: what was Midian's fault? Were they entirely blameless as to have invited unprovoked attack upon themselves? On the contrary, we find the reason for this engagement given earlier in Numbers 25. The Midianites were the principal instigators of idolatory and lewdness - two very serious issues that were deliberately forged against Israel to weaken them spiritually: (16) And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, (17) "Harass the Midianites and strike them down, (18) for they have harassed you with their wiles, with which they beguiled you in the matter of Peor, and in the matter of Cozbi, the daughter of the chief of Midian, their sister, who was killed on the day of the plague on account of Peor." The Israelites did not just get up and go after the Midianites in order to 'prove' that Moses engaged in jihad. The verses you quote should be read in their contexts. Numbers 25 v 17: Treat the Midianites as enemies and kill them,
18 because they treated you as enemies when they deceived you in the affair of Peor and their sister Cozbi, the daughter of a Midianite leader, the woman who was killed when the plague came as a result of Peor."
Can you please explain the above too? Refer just above. Numbers 31 v 7-12: 7 And they warred against the Midianites, as the LORD commanded Moses; and they slew all the males.
8 And they slew the kings of Midian, beside the rest of them that were slain; namely, Evi, and Rekem, and Zur, and Hur, and Reba, five kings of Midian: Balaam also the son of Beor they slew with the sword.
9 And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods.
10 And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire. 11 And they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts.
12 And they brought the captives, and the prey, and the spoil, unto Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and unto the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the camp at the plains of Moab, which are by Jordan near Jericho.
Explain the above please. As above. # Is there any Hadith or even verse in the Qur'an that teaches that Jesus Christ went to war against people in just the same way that Muhammad did? In case you missed the verses above, here is another verses for you. Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2) Since when did Zechariah 14:1-2 become a part of the Hadith or Qur'an? Do you mind taking a second look at his question inserted in your quote, please? Did Jesus go out to war against people in just the way that Muhammad did? Why the killing and sharing of spoils? Zechariah 14:1-2 does not rpove Jihad; if it does, then you have clearly made the case that the fundamental meaning of Jihad is warfare; since you're using those verses in the Bible to suppose the meaning of Jihad. Meanwhile, Zechariah 14:1-2 declares what the hostile nations will do against Jerusalem: they shall besiege the city and take it captive as they had always wanted to do (cf. Psa. ) - so God gathers them against Jerusalem to do just as they had always wished: (1) Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. (2) For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. But when you read on through verse 3, you will find what happens next: the LORD visits those hostile nations who came against Jerusalem, and He judges them for their plunders against the city and its inhabitants: (3) Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. (4) And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. (5) And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. Compare this with Joel 3:1-3 -- (1) For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem, (2) I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my
heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land. (3) And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold a girl for wine, that they might drink. So, if you take time to read the verses you quoted, they do not have the meaning of the Islamic Jihad you're trying to cop out from the Bible. |
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bari_kade
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@babs787, Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18)
Can you explain the reason for the above killing? Needless repetition - dealt with above. Brother, you claimed that Muhammed was a warmonger, please explain the below verses and the reason for killing by your God Jesus of the OT. Is this merely for the sake of argument; or you actually believe that Jesus Christ is the God of the OT? Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18)
He even ordered the killing of women
Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18) Another needless repetition: refer above. Now Muhammed fought the pagans to repel oppression and never transgressed limit, but here God Jesus of the OT, ordering the killing of men, women, children and everything that breathes The case you're bringing up for Muhammad as never transgressing limits is not supported by Muslim sources; neither does Muhammad's adventures square with what Moses did. By making reference to "God Jesus of the OT", it would mean that you see Him as the God of the OT, yes or no? Deuteronomy 20:16: However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.
Can you tell me why he ordered the killing of living things, even animals? Deuteronomy 20:17 & 18"But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee: That they teach you not to do after all their abominations, which they have done unto their gods; so should ye sin against the LORD your God." 1 Samuel 15:2-4
2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
4 And Saul gathered the people together, and numbered them in Telaim, two hundred thousand footmen, and ten thousand men of Judah.
Why did they kill woman, infant, sucking, oxen, sheep, camel and ass, please for what purpose and did those animals and the innocent children offend God? So, they offended God - which would mean that Islam teaches precisely the same thing, NO? It is not my problem, you may shout from now till tomorrow for all I care. You keep mentioning babs as being the one that has been deriding your faith, give me just a verse where I have done that and I will back it with verses from both the bible and the Quran. I learnt that when you post anything about muslims, nobody cautions you nor do muslims accuse you of 'deriding' but when muslims ask any questions, you quickly conclude that they are deriding your faith. Babs has not been around now and you have not stopped you mischief, but trust me, when I am back, I will be back for good. When you go through the threads, you will find that you're clearly mixing up issues. I simply want to know just one thing, babs787: what is the basis of your deriding Jesus Christ, regardless of whatever anyone does or says? I just simply want to know what is informing your attitude so that I know how next to relate with you. |
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babs787 (m)
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@Barikade
Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Are you referring to God of the Ot or NT? In case you missed it, read below please.
Are your arguments against Jews or Christians, babs787?
Is God of the OT different from NT? Do Jews and Christians serve different God? Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
2 Chronicles 15:13:All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman.
Can you please explain the reason behind the killing?
That verse did not state that God ordered a jihad there, please. It was rather pointing to the covenant that the Jews made among themselves, if you read it in its context:
(12) And they entered into a covenant to seek the LORD God of their fathers with all their heart
and with all their soul; (13) That whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put
to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (14) And they sware unto the LORD
with a loud voice, and with shouting, and with trumpets, and with cornets.
As you can see, there were no killings in the verse you quoted. Brother, I want you to know that we are not kids here, so please let us be honest when attending to issues here. Now you claimed that there was no killing but this is part of the verse ' that whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put
to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman', meaning that whoever does not seek him would be killed. Anybody that did not seek him would be killed. And if I may ask you, why did God want to kill anybody that would not seek his face? What do you call that? Is that not killing in his cause? Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM Numbers 31:7,17-18: ""They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man, Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. What is the reason behind the killing? Read from verse 1:
Numbers 31: (1) The LORD spoke to Moses, saying, (2) "Avenge the people of Israel on the Midianites. Afterward you shall be gathered to your people." (3) So Moses spoke to the people, saying, "Arm men from among you for the war, that they may go against Midian to execute the LORD's vengeance on Midian. I thought God is of peace, must he avenge the death of the people of Israel? Now, it may be asked: what was Midian's fault? Were they entirely blameless as to have invited unprovoked attack upon themselves?
On the contrary, we find the reason for this engagement given earlier in Numbers 25. The Midianites were the principal instigators of idolatory and lewdness - two very serious issues that were deliberately forged against Israel to weaken them spiritually: Brother, but you blame muslims for fighting the pagans in Mecca when they oppressed muslims and never allowed them to practice their faith. (16) And the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, (17) "Harass the Midianites and strike them down,
(18) for they have harassed you with their wiles, with which they beguiled you in the matter of Peor,
and in the matter of Cozbi, the daughter of the chief of Midian, their sister, who was killed on
the day of the plague on account of Peor."
The Israelites did not just get up and go after the Midianites in order to 'prove' that Moses engaged in jihad. The verses you quote should be read in their contexts. The same goes for Muslims too. Muslim did not just wake up and started fighting the pagans, the pagans caused it and Muslims had to repel aggression. Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Numbers 25 v 17: Treat the Midianites as enemies and kill them,
18 because they treated you as enemies when they deceived you in the affair of Peor and their sister Cozbi, the daughter of a Midianite leader, the woman who was killed when the plague came as a result of Peor."
Can you please explain the above too?
Refer just above. Brother just like the war fought by the prophet against the pagans. Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Numbers 31 v 7-12: 7 And they warred against the Midianites, as the LORD commanded Moses; and they slew all the males.
8 And they slew the kings of Midian, beside the rest of them that were slain; namely, Evi, and Rekem, and Zur, and Hur, and Reba, five kings of Midian: Balaam also the son of Beor they slew with the sword.
9 And the children of Israel took all the women of Midian captives, and their little ones, and took the spoil of all their cattle, and all their flocks, and all their goods.
10 And they burnt all their cities wherein they dwelt, and all their goodly castles, with fire. 11 And they took all the spoil, and all the prey, both of men and of beasts.
12 And they brought the captives, and the prey, and the spoil, unto Moses, and Eleazar the priest, and unto the congregation of the children of Israel, unto the camp at the plains of Moab, which are by Jordan near Jericho.
Explain the above please.
As above. Can you compare the above to that of the prophet? You do accuse Muhammed of fighting but here we read that God commanded Moses to kill them. Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Quote
# Is there any Hadith or even verse in the Qur'an that teaches that Jesus Christ went to war against people in just the same way that Muhammad did?
In case you missed the verses above, here is another verses for you.
Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2)
Since when did Zechariah 14:1-2 become a part of the Hadith or Qur'an? Do you mind taking a second look at his question inserted in your quote, please? Did Jesus go out to war against people in just the way that Muhammad did? Brother, this is part of the question ' has Jesus Christ went to war against people in just the same way that Muhammad did?' He was trying to say that Jesus never went to war and I decided to give him verse where such happened. Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Why the killing and sharing of spoils?
Zechariah 14:1-2 does not rpove Jihad; if it does, then you have clearly made the case that the fundamental meaning of Jihad is warfare; since you're using those verses in the Bible to suppose the meaning of Jihad. Is Jihad not fighting in the cause of God? Please brother, why did God want to fight them and what is the reason for his fighting and killing them? Meanwhile, Zechariah 14:1-2 declares what the hostile nations will do against Jerusalem: they shall besiege the city and take it captive as they had always wanted to do (cf. Psa. ) - so God gathers them against Jerusalem to do just as they had always wished:
(1) Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
(2) For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and
the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity,
and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
But when you read on through verse 3, you will find what happens next: the LORD visits those hostile nations who came against Jerusalem, and He judges them for their plunders against the city and its inhabitants:
(3) Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought
in the day of battle. (4) And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives,
which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst
thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and
half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
(5) And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall
reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days
of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
My question again, why did God fight? Is the killing not for his cause? Compare this with Joel 3:1-3 --
(1) For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity
of Judah and Jerusalem, (2) I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into
the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my
heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.
(3) And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold
a girl for wine, that they might drink.
So, if you take time to read the verses you quoted, they do not have the meaning of the Islamic Jihad you're trying to cop out from the Bible. What do you understand by Jihad, is it not striving in God's cause? Why did the above happened and why did God intervene?
Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Brother, you claimed that Muhammed was a warmonger, please explain the below verses and the reason for killing by your God Jesus of the OT.
Is this merely for the sake of argument; or you actually believe that Jesus Christ is the God of the OT?
I didnt believe and you should please tell if the God of Peace in the NT is the same as that of the OT
Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18)
Brother, how will they know a virgin? Why the killing of innocent women and kids? He even ordered the killing of women
Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. (Numbers 31:17-18)
Another needless repetition: refer above. No brother, must you kill women and innocent kids because you are fighting for GOD? Is Jihad not the same as fighting for God in HIS CAUSE)
Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Now Muhammed fought the pagans to repel oppression and never transgressed limit, but here God Jesus of the OT, ordering the killing of men, women, children and everything that breathes
The case you're bringing up for Muhammad as never transgressing limits is not supported by Muslim sources; neither does Muhammad's adventures square with what Moses did. By making reference to "God Jesus of the OT", it would mean that you see Him as the God of the OT, yes or no?
Let me have the sources please. Is God of the OT same as NT?
Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
Deuteronomy 20:16: However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.
Can you tell me why he ordered the killing of living things, even animals?
Deuteronomy 20:17 & 18
"But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee: That they teach you not to do after all their abominations, which they have done unto their gods; so should ye sin against the LORD your God."
So brother, is that not killing in his cause? Quote from: babs787 on Today at 04:42:53 PM
1 Samuel 15:2-4
2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
4 And Saul gathered the people together, and numbered them in Telaim, two hundred thousand footmen, and ten thousand men of Judah.
Why did they kill woman, infant, sucking, oxen, sheep, camel and ass, please for what purpose and did those animals and the innocent children offend God?
So, they offended God - which would mean that Islam teaches precisely the same thing, NO? So animals too offended God!!!!!!!!!!!
When you go through the threads, you will find that you're clearly mixing up issues. I simply want to know just one thing, babs787: what is the basis of your deriding Jesus Christ, regardless of whatever anyone does or says? I just simply want to know what is informing your attitude so that I know how next to relate with you.
I am not mixing up issues. christians have been saying that muhammed was a warrior forgetting to go through their bible too. Brother, you are also of those that says I have been deriding him, please let me have a post, verse or anything in which I have derided him and I will back it up with verses from the two books. I am not here to deride him because he is one of the prophets muslims believe in. so if you think I have done that, please supply me and I will respond. Lastly, it is not what you may be thinking, babs is not here to condemn any prophet but to let you know that most of what christians have been attributing to jesus are false. I will be looking forward to reading just one of what you called 'deriding jesus' Thanks |
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bari_kade
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@babs787, Is God of the OT different from NT?
Do Jews and Christians serve different God? My questions are quite simple, babs787. Perhaps, dribbling is not a very good way to resume after a long break. Are your arguments against Jews or Christians, babs787? Brother, I want you to know that we are not kids here, so please let us be honest when attending to issues here. Now you claimed that there was no killing but this is part of the verse 'that whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put
to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman', meaning that whoever does not seek him would be killed. Anybody that did not seek him would be killed. And if I may ask you, why did God want to kill anybody that would not seek his face? What do you call that? Is that not killing in his cause? Even in your reply, you emphatically came round to state my point: the verse did not say they WERE killed; as you have hinted - WOULD be killed. These are two very different things. As for the answers you're seeking, please refer to where I offered them. I thought God is of peace, must he avenge the death of the people of Israel? I hope you're not trying to be deliberately mischievous here? I gave answers to what you asked; and if you don't want to discuss them, no worries. Brother, but you blame muslims for fighting the pagans in Mecca when they oppressed muslims and never allowed them to practice their faith. Where did I do that, please? The same goes for Muslims too. Muslim did not just wake up and started fighting the pagans, the pagans caused it and Muslims had to repel aggression. Right; so you take your vexations about Islam from the OT? Can you compare the above to that of the prophet? You do accuse Muhammed of fighting but here we read that God commanded Moses to kill them. And I gave the referral verses to the antecedents of your complaints. Brother, this is part of the question 'has Jesus Christ went to war against people in just the same way that Muhammad did?' He was trying to say that Jesus never went to war and I decided to give him verse where such happened. If you gave him verses where Jesus went out to war as Muhammad did, then are you not saying that Jesus is actually God? Yes or NO? Is Jihad not fighting in the cause of God? Please brother, why did God want to fight them and what is the reason for his fighting and killing them? Did you read Jihad in the Bible, babs787? Is the Jihad that Muslims have explicated the same thing as what you read in the Bible? What do you understand by Jihad, is it not striving in God's cause? Why did the above happened and why did God intervene? This is the thread on Jihad where I'm still examining that issue with you: http://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-57531.0.html#msg1196310 I didnt believe and you should please tell if the God of Peace in the NT is the same as that of the OT
Brother, how will they know a virgin? Why the killing of innocent women and kids? Can you please go through the answers outline in my rejoinders once again, in reference to the case of the Midianites and on from there? And when you do, take the time to reflect on this simple issue: what are you trying to prove in Muhammad's Jihad by seeking to focus on what Moses did? No brother, must you kill women and innocent kids because you are fighting for GOD? Is Jihad not the same as fighting for God in HIS CAUSE) As a Christian, I'm not asked to do so. As a Jew, I could see your point. The Qur'an clearly distinguishes between Jews and Christians: Am I wrong? Let me have the sources please. Is God of the OT same as NT? In due course I'll proffer them. So brother, is that not killing in his cause? In order to establish Jihad, is that? I am not mixing up issues. christians have been saying that muhammed was a warrior forgetting to go through their bible too. Muhammad was a warrior; Moses also was. What Muslims have tried to do is make Jesus look like a warrior in the same way that Muhammad engage in Jihad. The Son of God is nowhere recorded in the Qur'an as having done that; so what is your point here, babs787? Brother, you are also of those that says I have been deriding him, please let me have a post, verse or anything in which I have derided him and I will back it up with verses from the two books. Why did you refer to jesus as an impotent man who did not impregnat any women at the age of 30; and then you called that a "tit-for-tat" when Telly B (if I remember clearly) called your attention to that? Was it really necessary for your to go that far? When I have the time, I'll post the link; but I think it is a bit childish to try and deny what you have done. I am not here to deride him because he is one of the prophets muslims believe in. so if you think I have done that, please supply me and I will respond. Lastly, it is not what you may be thinking, babs is not here to condemn any prophet but to let you know that most of what christians have been attributing to jesus are false. Please babs787, you're making matters worse by pretending to forget what you stated previously about Jesus. Referring to Jesus Christ in such derogatory terms is not the same thing as respecting Him. |
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nossycheek (f)
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Please babs787, you're making matters worse by pretending to forget what you stated previously about Jesus. Referring to Jesus Christ in such derogatory terms is not the same thing as respecting Him.
THAT is his own manner of respect. QED |
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nossycheek (f)
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@noisycheek Never mind, I have been trying to put things in order but when I am back, I will make this nairaland hot for you. . You are here accusing me of insulting you, let me have the posts and I will bring out those you have started. Hotter than the hell whom all the muslims are doomed for? I won't be deaf and mute when you come back |
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I-man (m)
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Two Muslim mothers are sitting in the cafe chatting over a
> pint of goat's milk.
>
>The older of the moms pulls out her bag and starts flipping
>through pictures and reminiscing.
>
>"This is my oldest son, Mohamed. He would be 24 now."
>
>The other mom replies, "I remember him as a baby."
>
>Mom says, "He's a martyr now."
>"Oh, so sad, my dear."
>
>Mom flips to another picture. "And this is my second son,
> Kali. He would be 21."
>
>"Oh I remember him. He had such curly hair when he was born."
>Mom sighs, "He's a martyr, too."
>
>"Oh gracious me" says the second mother.
>
>"And this is my third son. My beautiful Ahmed.! He would be
>18" Mom whispers.
>
>"Yes" says her friend enthusiastically, "I remember when he
>first started school."
>
>"He's a martyr also" Mom says, with tears in her eyes.
>
>After a pause and a deep sigh, the second Muslim mother
>looks wistfully at the photos and says:
>
>"They blow up so fast, don't they?"
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cuju (f)
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@ babs Is your brain box empty? You guys are so dumb and will never sit back to think. Have you ever asked questions why some things are the way they are in your sect? Christians do that. "God wants you as a slave and not His son" Gush  . I know muslims, even an Imam, that have left Islam and they will tell you that there are lots of loop holes and unanswered questions. Why are muslims are so violent and intolerant? |
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stimulus (m)
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@bari_kade, Bo my bros, I appreciate your replies to babs' noise. If I were around when he popped his usual drivel online, I would not have bothered responding; but you did well all the same, especially because in the Muslim mindset a Jew is a Christian. @oyb, How bodi? I hope you still dey look for more hints in the encyclopedia to make Jesus a jihadist! And oh, between. . . I forgot to remind you: as has already been said, pope Urban was a latecomer by 460 years after the Muslim invasion!! |
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babyosisi (f)
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Two Muslim mothers are sitting in the cafe chatting over a
> pint of goat's milk.
>
>The older of the moms pulls out her bag and starts flipping
>through pictures and reminiscing.
>
>"This is my oldest son, Mohamed. He would be 24 now."
>
>The other mom replies, "I remember him as a baby."
>
>Mom says, "He's a martyr now."
>"Oh, so sad, my dear."
>
>Mom flips to another picture. "And this is my second son,
> Kali. He would be 21."
>
>"Oh I remember him. He had such curly hair when he was born."
>Mom sighs, "He's a martyr, too."
>
>"Oh gracious me" says the second mother.
>
>"And this is my third son. My beautiful Ahmed.! He would be
>18" Mom whispers.
>
>"Yes" says her friend enthusiastically, "I remember when he
>first started school."
>
>"He's a martyr also" Mom says, with tears in her eyes.
>
>After a pause and a deep sigh, the second Muslim mother
>looks wistfully at the photos and says:
>
>"They blow up so fast, don't they?"
allahu akhbar!! |
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