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I-man (m)
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@Debo Import substition has been tried unsuccesfully before. . way before you were born.What makes you think it will work this time?Presumably,if we keep repeating old failed policieswe will eventually get it right!
Did you say that "industry players" support such measures?So local manufacturers of cement want restrictions placed on importationwhat a surprise!
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debosky (m)
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the locals are not saying there should be a ban, they are saying to import, have a stake in local manufacturing, so you have a real interest not just to continue importation but to eventually switch to local production! that is not too much to ask is it?
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I-man (m)
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It is.It limits importation to encourage local production.Problem is. .Nigeria is no way near having a cost competitive manufacturing sector due to our poor infastructure.The result is that local cement will continue to be dearer than imported cement.This acts as a tax on the construction industry as they buy cement at a premium.
You know what happens when competition is restricted.Prices never really come down.The only people who will benefit are the local manufacturers,"the industry players".Strange thing is. .because the locals benefit from import restrictions,they won't be as efficient as they would have been in a highly competitive market.So in the long run,nobody actually benefits.
History tells us that import substition rarely works.Its been proven time and again in different countries across different eras.It is probably wise to learn from history
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Donzman (m)
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@Debosky
You're seriously missing the point, whether we will meet capacity tomorrow or in 2010 isn't the point, the point is that there is no need to make me and millions of other Nigerians pay higher price for cement just because it is made in Nigeria. I want to pay the lowest price possible for cement so I can allocate my money to other activities and if that cheap quality cement comes Afghanistan, so be it.
What exactly is the value to me for the cement being made in Nigeria?. . .What is the value to those who work for Ibeto Group who were laid off? What is the value for builders who pay outrageous prices for cement? What is the value to construction workers who those builders are going to employ? What is the value to the people who would have worked to maintain new construction projects by these builders?
The problem with you is that you're extremely short sighted, import industries can and does provide as much employment as local inefficient one. If the importation is even cheaper as in cement, there is then extra money to allocate to other projects to create more employment in other sectors. Cement is a good used to produce other goods, the lower the price of cement, the more of the secondary goods will be produced.
Protectionist policies are rarely in the national interest but in the interest of a few like Dangote. If you start protecting now, when will the protection stop?. . .We both know producers certain countries will always produce cement cheaper than whatever Dangote can do in Nigeria. Protectionism is neccessary because we have people who feel like shielding an inefficient industry will somehow make it more competitive. I beg to differ, shielding an inefficient industry will only make it more inefficient, where is the incentive to innovate when you're guaranteed the market anyway?
Nobody is hung up on Dangote, Donzman is only hung up on senseless policies that I cannot find any economic rationale for. It's the same you that was defending Lagos State Government's policy to levy generator owners!
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Donzman (m)
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@Debosky
1 more point I forgot to make:
In every enterprise, you're almost guaranteed to make losses as a beginner and the profits begin to stream in as time goes on and you learn by doing. If you, Dangote and the FG truly believe that Nigeria over time will have a competitivecement industry, it does not make much sense to ban imports. Like every business which has future profitablity, investors should not mind investing in it now, bear current losses and reap future profits as time goes on.
Truth of the matter is that Nigeria does not have a competitive cement industry which is why Dangote and co. have lobbied for protection. Hopefully they can sex-attack the citizenry over the time of the protection until someone sensible sees that this is a waste of time and open up the industry to both internal and external competition to relieve price pressure on ordinary people like me.
You're basically asking me to bear the losses that investors are supossed to bear in your "in the future profitable cement industry" by paying more for cement now than I'll pay if I imported from another country. How is this fair to me and millions of other Nigerians? If I import cement at a cheaper price, I can create more benefit to the nation than a monopolist can with the outrageous prices.
Glad to see you've ran away from your "national security" argument, nonsense!
This is simple secondary school economics, give market power to 3 or 4 firms and watch prices go through the roof.
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debosky (m)
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One comment, the national security thing was ill advised - a result of trying to do too many things at the same time, please pardon the slip of hand  Granted there are inefficiencies in the system, in the long run, with cheap raw material costs balancing the above average infrastructure costs, I believe local cement prices will be just as competitive as foreign ones, but for the government to have set forth a policy that has brought in over $1 billion in investment to suddenly go against that will not make sense in my view. Full blown importation will not help I insist, some restrictions are necessary to pursue the greater national interest which goes beyond the increased prices currently being faced. what about the ~$650 million spent importing cement annually? Is that a viable and efficient use of scarce foreign exchange? Donzman I want you to respond to this specifically, you keep mentioning we should 'efficiently' allocate resources. does this fall under that category? secondly I-man, granted we have an infrastructural inhibition that reduces competitiveness of locally made goods,not as a result of inefficiency on the part of the local producers, and it is only right that they lobby government to do improve infrastructure to make them more competitive, afterall their tax revenues and so on go into the government. Since we are sub-optimal in production cost, why not just shut down all local production of anything except crude oil extraction since it can all be made cheaper elsewhere? Final price, I accept, is a major and important determinant of policies due to its effects on people's pockets, but it cannot be the only input to a government policy. Cement is not that difficult to produce locally, the only issue is the lag in investment in the sector due to unfavorable policies/conditions, which is now picking up rapidly, we should not forfeit that benefit because of an immediate price reduction. that does not strike me as short sighted. Concerning the losses you mentioned, no one is asking the public to bear the cost of the early stages of business, the companies insist that the cement costs 1,100 ex factory, it is the transportation inefficiencies that result in the 300-700 price increment per bag which is simply unacceptable and is wholly beyond the manufacturers purview. the companies are investing, and taking into account the long term nature of their commitments, but those were made with the consideration that there will be incentives to support their businesses and encourage them to invest, this is why the tie of importation to local manufacturing was made, and not for any sectional interest as you allude. There is a lot of competition coming up in the market, but you need to put in some temporary measures to ensure investment locally, some of these chinese firms that we import cement from are beginning to set up plants in the country in Cross River and elsewhere because of the drive to support local manufacturing, the costs will come down in the near future - 2010 is not too far for long term planning purposes. Finally, there is no way anyone will be projecting cement exports if we they do not see the industry arriving at a stage of cost competitiveness in the near future, if its so expensive that its above import cost in Nigeria, it will not be cheaper if the same cement is sold elsewhere either.
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Donzman (m)
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Debosky, If cement production is going to be domestically viable in the long run, why don't the $1 billion investors invest in it anyway and reap the long run benefits?. . .They're only investing not because it will be viable in the long run in an open market but because they know they have protection which will protect their interests and ensure there will be little competition. Remove the protectionist measures and watch the investors pack up and leave. It is not in the national interest to support a weak inefficient industry, it is in the interest of Dangote and the few cement manufacturers left who pose little threat. Stop parading protectionism as being in the national interest, there are many losers in the equation and they are the consumers and importers of cement. The benefactors are those running the inefficient "domestic" cement industry. Why should there interest topple ours? what about the ~$650 million spent importing cement annually? Is that a viable and efficient use of scarce foreign exchange? Donzman I want you to respond to this specifically, you keep mentioning we should 'efficiently' allocate resources. does this fall under that category?
I don't exactly understand this question. I assume $650 million is what NIGERIANS spend importing cement, obviously these economic entities see it as an efficient use of their funds and a better alternative to purchasing local cement. I do not make value calls as to how individuals spend their money since it's different stroke for different folks. I'm interested and will air my opinions on how the Government spend our money and how their policies affect and alter the ways we spend our money. Foreign exhange sitting in a vault is almsot worthless in today's flexible foreign exchange market. In case you didn't know, $1 trillion worth of forex is traded on a daily basis worldwide, $650 million is nothing in the grand scheme of things, sorry to say. You can praise Dangote for being a good businessman/lobbyist, you cannot tell me his actions have helped Nigerians as a whole.
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TCUBE (m)
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how can a business man compare himself to ophra? , doesnt sound right, he should compare himself with fellow businesss men, that to me sounds more reasonable
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Iyke-D (m)
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how can a business man compare himself to ophra? , doesnt sound right, he should compare himself with fellow businesss men, that to me sounds more reasonable
What do you think Oprah is? You don't think she is producing and selling anything? You think those cars and other gifts she splashes on her viewers are really really free, not that she can't afford them? So that you know: Oprah represents a well calculated and orchestrated marketing machine. In other words, she is a sales woman!
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MP007 (m)
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thanks, sale women , u should have just said that instead of rapping 
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ng_blazer (m)
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1. femi otedola wouldn't be that rich if his dad was never a governor of lagos state, do you people really know what it means ( the gains) to be the governor of lagos state? Go and ask TINUBU, marwa.
2. dangote wouldn"t be rich if ihe wasn't given much pay by his uncle to do business in 1977. he would even open his mouth if he wasn't importing rice, floor, salt, etc. After all banks were using our hard earned money we kept with them to finance hismany businesses, same way he was getting favours from govt. at will because he is on of the so called stakeholder in the govt. after all the vaswani brother were accused of same thing the obj boys were doing and shown the way out, because they wanted to give Dangote and co., a run for their money. Is dangote even richer than TONIMAS. make him no let me begin mention names. These two guys are just fronts for the big boys. Adenuga wanted to be independent , and they shaked him.
3. Mohammed babangida is already making waves, with billions of dollars in his control. make una wait when he go come out like hiroshima, he will surely dwarf this two big boys everybody is shouting about.
4. no body for now is hearing about moh'd abacha, obj has gone out, wait fand see you we see those boys too comiing out to do wonders.
5. As for kola abila . Him don use him popsi pay maintain his bigboyism. All ill gotten money goes Ill ways.
SO if dangota feels he has money than some of these persons, i challenge him to atleast maintain afleet of private jets, no be all thase forteen sitter planes, some body should please give him Abramovics number so that he should ask for the prices of private customised-jets we are talking about cool $200 million, and boats too. How many af them acclaimed billionaires even has fleets as mentioned above.
After killing our nepa they now want to use Dangote to generate 5000 mega watts. our money don they come out. Remember Dangote is just the president of his group, have you people ever bothered to know who the board of directors are ? MAKE I HEAR WORD ABEG
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ktmadu (m)
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I think very seriously that someone like Dangote should be paid less attention. Firstly, I don't think he is as he claims richer than Oprah. How many Nigerians know their financial worth? How many nigerians have come to declare their worth. How so we know what he really has??? I'm sure if he was asked to define riches he'd go on listin various assets - which I'm very sure we know how he came bout them.
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tkb417 (m)
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dangote wouldn"t be rich if ihe wasn't given much pay by his uncle to do business in 1977 And where is the Uncle today? He wont be in top20. So give him some credits
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honeric01 (m)
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story story story, your stories wont make them poor or miss one kobo from their daily earnings, go find a better way of making yours so people won't spend their useful time saying shit and unmoving words about your money, as far as i am concerned, i am working towards mine, going there, and then people will start talking too, i love it when people waste their time talking about other people's issue, especially money, bill gate makes $$$$ every seconds, thats why he's getting richer because he is managing his time, i rather play like him
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akym (m)
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ACCORDING TO THE YORUBA PROVERB THAT SAYS;
UR MONEY IS THE VALUE You MAKES INTO PEOPLES LIVE.
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slim49z (m)
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Who cares how much Dangote and Oprah is worth huh? Am worth more than $5k as of last week  and the money keeps coming. Good luck to us all, slim 
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hbrednic
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this one na 100% yeye topic. wetin concern agbero with overload?
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honeric01 (m)
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when will this people stop talking other people's biz?
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slim49z (m)
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Ya that 's all they do discuss other people's biz and money while they ravish in poverty themselves. One never achieves anything in life unless he/she steps out of his comfort zone  Dangote and Oprah 're what they 're today because they stepped out of their comfort zone which always leads to their success. I already stepped out of my comfort zone and the success is coming my way gradually  Good luck to us all, slim 
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sylvao2000 (m)
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100% Worth Much More Than Oprah Winfrey
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9ja4eva (m)
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Dis thread still dey alive?
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neksummi (m)
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Whoever is richer has got nothing to do with me. What concerns me is how to build my own business to reckoning
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synderella
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Who gives a shit?  ? 
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Ibime (m)
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Eh - well done to him - Nouveau riche always boast about how much money they have.
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maryray
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@ Deboski, why waste your time, u should have known by now that Nigerians don't want anything good in their country. They are so used to whining that they would rather things remain bad, instead of supporting a solution that will provide jobs, improve our exchange rate, increase our standard of living, etc, that they would rather things remain the way they are so they would have something to whine about .
@ Donzman, go 2 sleep. its people like u who make shortsighted plans that will take Nigeria no where and then run to other country while complaining that AFRICA is doomed . Dont run 4 election abeg, we have too many taiwan made govt officials as it is .
@ MC USMAN: u are blessed my BROTHER. Tell d mumus .
@ NG Blazer and d rest, u guys are not worth my wasting my time. If i say u be olodo that will be an understatement, AFO ME TONO pEOPLE LIKE You ARE SO HOPELESS AND WORTHLESS . I'D BETTER LEAVE B4 I GET INFESTED WITH NTONONINESS .
@ Ibime, i'm sure u probably don't even know d meaning of the word u just used, it means newly rich, and if i remember correctly Dangote was here before i was born. Meaning he has been here 4 a long time. Dangote made that statement because people where acting as if oprah is too much. so he corrected them. Do u want to tell me that if u are d son of d president and u are in school, and in that same school u see people treating the son of a common minister as if he is the coolest guy because of is money, u will not say AH I AM D SON OF THE PRESIDENT MYSELF . The main thing that is killing AFrica is not just their leaders, it is people that have mentalities like u and Donzman. You guys need 2 sit down and ask Deboski 2 give u some of his good ideas, it is obvious u guys are all NTONS . I'm off till i bother 2 check in next time, i have better things to do than bother with ISHIS'. 
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