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~Lady~ (f)
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All of your assumption of sonship is based on a virgin girl having a child without a husband. While this method of creation simple difficult for you to swallow, compare it to the creation of Adam. A creation of a creature that there was no prior example before it. But that creature, Adam was created fully grown. Capable of eating, and all that grown ups do.
No sir. Not just that. It was mentioned in the Old Testament even before it came to be. A Son already existed. Considering them to be in their mid twenties for example? After the immediate shock, they should settle down to reality of the new condition; they are now the Adam and eve to populate the earth. God who is capable to bring about these many ways of creation of man, you are saying that in the creation of Jesus, He has to sleep with Mary, otherwise, you should know that what you have said about fathering Jesus is a complete fallacy. If God did not have sex with Mary, but just commanded the bringing about of the birth of Jesus in a fatherless process, then Jesus can not be son of God.
My friend when will you stop thinking in the physical. Why is Adam the Son of God id God didn't sleep with someone? Why is my father my father if he didn't sleep with my mother to create me? I call a particular man my father even though his blood I do not share The Son of God is not the Son of God with sperm. That is why he is so different. That is why he is Sinless. That is why only he could die and raise from the dead. He need to be born not of man but of God. Man is sinful, God is not. That is why there is no separation between him and God. There is a separation between God and man because of sin. But without sin there is no separation. No one in the past, today, or the future can be that. spoke about any real son of God to come According to the Qu'ran or the Torah or the Bible? Which one? But Jesus, while on this earth never at one time claimed that he was the exclusive son of God; begotten or otherwise So I've been showing you scriptures for nothing. It came from his mouth himself, but you want to claim that he didn't say that. I submit to you that it was those who wrote the Bible who are making unfounded claims about jesus and God.
So did God write the Qu'ran and dropped it from heaven? None of these noble prophet told us that there will be a songod coming because God needed to provide a gruesome closing process for full blanket forgiveness Genesis: I will put enmity between you and the woman and her offspring. You shall bruise his heel and he shall crush your head. It was there in the beginning. But Jesus truth as you understood it, ended up with the beginning of the prophethood/ministry/messengership of Mu/ha/mmad. For those who rejected him, in reality rejected Jesus as well. Jesus was just the truth, as a prophet for those short centuaries; less than six in all.
Really 500+ years after his death. It breaks a pattern here dear. All the prophets were continuous with no gap in time. and all of a sudden here comes this huge gap. after christianity had spread far and wide. Whats the spirit name The Spirit of God. It was spoken of by the Prophets and God and no the Spirit is not Muhaaamad. People already experienced it centuries before Muhaaamad came. Am sure if I yell holy spirit, he will not answer me What answer are you looking for, a voice? I'm sure if you yell A'llah he won't answer you. You won't hear a voice. If I were in the time of jesus and i yell Jesus (Esau) No he won't, he would answer to Yahshua. Esau means hairy in hebrew. But God said in the Qu/r'an that it does not befit the majesty of god to have a son You've still got to prove this is God. You call the Supreme Yahweh like the Jews. You call the Supreme Jehovah and say alleluiyah like (who call Him that, the Jews also?
Nah I call him OSANOBUA Didn't you know the official language of God is Bini? You seem to think you know what the truth is. And that is why you are overtly confident. Are you sure you want to walk down that line with me? You're looking for human logic to answer spiritual questions? Good, because you then have to apply that same logic to the Qu'ran. You also have to battle the history of Jews, Christians, and Romans and some more to prove that they are all lying. I will also put a twist to it and have you battle the history of the Arabs. You want to use human logic to discredit the Bible, then use it to prove the Qu'ran. |
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cgift (m)
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1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
There is just no point explaining what the Bible itself calls a mystery to minds not renewed by the blood.
1Ti 3:16 says , And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
To all who have tried to give a valid explanations, well, you have tried but these guys will never understand it. It has not being given to them.
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OlowoTee (f)
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Thanks @Lady for taking time to explain to our brother Olabowale.  But, it's just a pity that he knows some of these things, but just wouldn't admit. The doctrines are too comprehensive for him to understand!! he needs spiritual awakening. I pray God opens his eyes. Amen
There is just no point explaining what the Bible itself calls a mystery to minds not renewed by the blood.
1Ti 3:16 says , And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. To all who have tried to give a valid explanations, well, you have tried but these guys will never understand it. It has not being given to them.
Exactly my point. . . . . .I just read through this. |
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OLAADEGBU (m)
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@olaadegbu
Like lord sent a false spirit to deceive the king in the OT.
The false spirit is now being worshipped. The people will believe only lies from hell.
This is the days false worship of the great snake.
God bless you bro. Hold fast, hold firm until you receive your crown. These are the perilous times prophesied in 1Tim.4:1-7 which is the mystery of iniquity. 1. Departing from the faith or apostacy. We are warned to take heed, lest our hearts become evil and unbelieving which causes us to depart from God Heb.3:122. Giving heed to seducing spirits. These are seducing demons that entice to surrender chastity. Demons are charged with carrying out the programme of enticement to forfeit virtues. 3. Giving heed to doctrines of devils. These demons seduce people to depart from holy living and to accept doctrines that will damn their souls in hell. Men and women who pretend inspiration and revelation and false teachers of all kinds of religion are the agents of demons. 2Cor.11:14-15 4. Speaking lies in hypocrisy. These are speakers of lies in pretended revelations, and acting self denials and mortification of the flesh in order to prove their false doctrines to be truth. 5. Having the conscience seared with a hot iron. Their hearts are callous, withered and hardened, and are insensible to right and wrong. It has been seared by their false doctrine. 6. Forbidding to marry. There are some religions that forbid or discourage marriage to anyone among their laymen or clergy. The Lord says marriage is honourable to all and the bed undefiled Heb.13:4; 1Cor.7 . 7. Commanding to abstain from meats. Such unscriptural commanding in some so called churches of certain food and meats under the new covenant is initiated by demons. Gen.9:1-7; Rom.14:1-6. |
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babs787 (m)
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@Cgit 1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. The above is in King James Version authorised in 1611 and formed the strongest evidence for the Doctrine of the Trinity. But now this part, 'the father, the word and the holy ghost; and these three are one' has been expunged in the Revised Standard Version of 1952 and 1971 and in many other bibles as it was a gloss that had encroached on the Greek test. I john 5 v 7 and 8 in the New American Standard Bible read as follows; 'and it is the spirit who bears witness because the spirit is truth. For there are three that bear witness, the spirit, and the water and the blood and the three are in agreement. Also in the New World Translation of Holy Scriptures used by Jehovah Witness, you will find 'for there are three witness bearers, the spirit and the water and the blood and the three are in agreement'. Trinity is not biblical, it is not even in the bible, not in bible dictionaries, Jesus never taught trinity nor mentioned same. There is no basis or proof in the bible for the acceptance of trinity. Lastly, i you still do not agree to my posts on trinity, let me know then I give you some verses from your bible going against trinity and you provide explanation on same |
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cgift (m)
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@Cgit
The above is in King James Version authorised in 1611 and formed the strongest evidence for the Doctrine of the Trinity. But now this part, 'the father, the word and the holy ghost; and these three are one' has been expunged in the Revised Standard Version of 1952 and 1971 and in many other bibles as it was a gloss that had encroached on the Greek test.
I john 5 v 7 and 8 in the New American Standard Bible read as follows; 'and it is the spirit who bears witness because the spirit is truth. For there are three that bear witness, the spirit, and the water and the blood and the three are in agreement.
Also in the New World Translation of Holy Scriptures used by Jehovah Witness, you will find 'for there are three witness bearers, the spirit and the water and the blood and the three are in agreement'.
Trinity is not biblical, it is not even in the bible, not in bible dictionaries, Jesus never taught trinity nor mentioned same. There is no basis or proof in the bible for the acceptance of trinity.
Lastly, i you still do not agree to my posts on trinity, let me know then I give you some verses from your bible going against trinity and you provide explanation on same
We know the people behind the various confusing translations of the bible. We know their attempt to create divisions and confusion in the church of Christ. You will not know all these or perhaps you know but will deliberately conceal it and use it to advance your own argument. To anyone who is interested in knowing Christ through his words, the KJV is the way to go. So, start and end with the KJV that is my own base for a debate. |
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OLAADEGBU (m)
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@OlowoTee,
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ continue to multiply in your life as His fruit manifests in your ministration. The Lord will bless you with the spirit of prayer and supplication in Jesus' name.
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olabowale (m)
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Olowo Tee; Thanks @Lady for taking time to explain to our brother Olabowale. But, it's just a pity that he knows some of these things, but just wouldn't admit. The doctrines are too comprehensive for him to understand!! he needs spiritual awakening. I pray God opens his eyes. Amen Only doctrine, and no reality. @~Lady~ :There is just no point explaining what the Bible itself calls a mystery to minds not renewed by the blood. Mystery to mind not renewed by the blood you said? Is this not the same blood letting that you complain about the Jewss? While their God demanded blood of animals, your demanded blood of human. AAnd yet, in both cases no one can guarantee that all Jews or christians will be spared of the fire of hell! No one, and that included Jesus., can make the guaranty. 1Ti 3:16 says , And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. To all who have tried to give a valid explanations, well, you have tried but these guys will never understand it. It has not being given to them. Arbitrary statement that has no proof or foundation. Its ironic that you quoted Timothy to explain Jesus. Is it because Jesus could not explain himself? Or did he tell Timothy about all of these? You are right. Your explanation is very weak because your hypothesis is very weak. I wonder if you actually believe that M.us.lims need to listen to you, especially considering that we have the Glorious Q.u.r'an with us? Its you who should now move to taste the sweet nectar of I.sla.m and shed off your burden. Exactly my point. . . . . .I just read through this. |
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OLAADEGBU (m)
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1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
There is just no point explaining what the Bible itself calls a mystery to minds not renewed by the blood.
1Ti 3:16 says , And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
To all who have tried to give a valid explanations, well, you have tried but these guys will never understand it. It has not being given to them.
I praise the Lord for you brother, for that powerful verse in 1Tim.3:16 which confirms the Tri-une God. This is the mystery of godliness that the world cannot see but it has been revealed to us that believe in the Holy scriptures authored by the Holy Spirit. The following divine phases of the mystery of godliness have all been made clear by many scriptures so it is pertinent on us to read them prayerfully and carefully and to meditate on them for them to be revealed to us. The mystery of godliness 1Timothy 3:161. Great divine fulness. John 1:16-17; Eph.3:19; Col.1:19; 2:9. 2. God was manifest in the flesh. This is talking of the incarnation of God the Son. Isaiah7:14; 9:6-7; Matt.1:18-25; Lk.1:26-56; 2:1-39; John 1:14; Rom.8:3; Gal.4:4; Heb 1:5-6; 2:6-18; 3. Justified in the Spirit, divine vindication Acts 2:22-28,36; 3:14-18; Rom.1:3-4; Eph.1:20-23; Phil.2:5-11; Col.1:15-24; 2:14-17; Heb.1:3-9; 2:5-18; 1Pet.3:22. 4. Seen of angels, divine revelation. 1Cor.4:9; Eph.3:9-10; 1Pet.1:10-12; The angels had little knowledge of the reason and nature of human salvation 1Pet.1:10-12 It has now been revealed to both angels and people. 5. Preached unto the Gentiles, divine inclusion 1Cor.12:13; Gal.3:28; Eph.2:11-18; 3:1-6; Col.3:11. 6. Believed on in the world, divine propagation. Matt.4:23-24; 9:35; Luke 4:16-19; Eph.2:17. 7. Received up into glory, divine ascension and exaltation Luke 24:51; Eph.1:20-23; Phil.2:9-11; Mk.16:19; Lk.9:51; Acts 10:16; 1;2,11,22; 7:43; 20:13-14; 23:31; Eph 6:13,16; 2Tim.4:11. The same human body and nature God was revealed in was resurrected and received up to glory. |
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OLAADEGBU (m)
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@Olabowale, God loves you and He wants the best for you. You will be doing yourself a good favour if you can discover what the Lord has already revealed in His Word. No man is above mistakes, it will be better for you to sincerely search for the truth. Jesus said " I am the way the truth and the life no man cometh unto Father, but by me" John 14:6 If truly you believe Him as a Prophet you will prove this by believing His claim. I will ask you to visit the weblink below if you really want to know what the Lord has revealed about His divine nature. Visit: http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t002.html |
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Backslider (m)
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For this reason he gave them over to satan. Because they say we have no need of the Christ the son of The Most high
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olabowale (m)
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@Olaadegbu: It is the mercy of God Himself that led me to and keep me still in I.s.lam. I will not turn back from it, InshaAll.ah. I am very satisfied, and do not intend to worship a multi headed god.
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OlowoTee (f)
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@OlowoTee,
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ continue to multiply in your life as His fruit manifests in your ministration. The Lord will bless you with the spirit of prayer and supplication in Jesus' name.
Thanks for these timely words of prayer. May His blessings be upon your life too. Amen. I appreciate. |
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m_nwankwo (m)
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@It is not possible for any creature to describe Trinity, explain Trinity since its origin lies in the Godhead. Since it is imposssible for a creature to explain or describe God, it is impossible to describe Trinity. Both words cannot be separated from each other. Man can only know as far as his origin which lies in the spiritual. Therefore information about Trinity can only be brought to Man if God choose to reveal it. But to have the information is not the same as an explanation of it. That is why all atempts to describe or explain Trinity is a waste of time in my view. What is however possible is to get an information about it. A person who deeply looks at the information with his soul may a see a gate open. I believe in Trinity and I believe that Jesus Christ is part of the Trinity. However in our attempt to explain Trinity, we present a concept of Trinity that seem to contradict the oneness of God. This has often generated legitimate concerns on those who believe that Trinity contradicts the oneness of God. I will attempt to adress those concerns as much as I can. The information I give below is drawn from my experiencing of the work "In The Light of Truth-The Grail Message"
1. There is only one God. Trinity of the Godhead states that you have God-the Father, God the son, and God the Holy Spirit. Does it mean that there are three Gods? The answer is no. There is only one God, one creator. Both the son of God Jesus and the Holy Spirit are begotten of the Father. That means that it is God the father that is Jesus and still the same God the father that is the Holyspirit. Therefore Trinity does not mean three persons in one God but rather one God in three persons. Thus that "essence" that makes Jesus God and the Holyspirit God came from the Father, is of the Father and one with the Father. Therefore one can say that it is only God the father that works three fold as the father, the son and the Holyspirit.
2.The Holyspirit and Jesus are one with the Father but the Father is greater than either Jesus or the Holyspirit. That is the point which many a believer in Trinity often fail to see. Therefore due to limitation of language, one can say that a "small" essence of God the father is Jesus and another "small" essence of God the Father is the Holy Spirit. Just like a bucket of water from atlantic ocean has the same nature as the whole ocean but it is not the whole ocean. That is why Jesus once said that his Father is greater than him. That is also why he prayed to his Father, that is why he was sent by his Father, that is why he came to fufill the WILL of his Father, that is also why he is called the son of God. A son of God in a spiritual sense means a "part of God" That is also why he is the way to the father since he carries within him the nature or essence of the father. Althogh the essence of the Father that is Jesus and the the essence of the Father that is the Holy Spirit are one with the Father, they are personal in their working. Thus even after reuniting with his Father, Jesus remained personal.
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olabowale (m)
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@M_nwankwo: You see why education does not necessarily translate to good and accurate practice of true religion. You and many are struggling explain 3 to mean1 without any success. Its like me trying to pass up triangle for a straight line, or someting that it is not.
I wonder what happens to the God Who is not the Author of Confusion?
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cgift (m)
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m_nwakwo, you know what, you have finally succeeded in making the esoteric relationship more enigmatic  Thank you One point you made which i buy into is this : Therefore information about Trinity can only be brought to Man if God choose to reveal it. |
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m_nwankwo (m)
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@Cgift
I am sorry if it has become more enigmatic. It may be so on first reading but it will become clearer as you examine what was said. Stay blessed.
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justcool (m)
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@M_nwankwo: You see why education does not necessarily translate to good and accurate practice of true religion. You and many are struggling explain 3 to mean1 without any success. Its like me trying to pass up triangle for a straight line, or someting that it is not.
I wonder what happens to the God Who is not the Author of Confusion?
There so many examples in nature where many things are added to become one. A ray of light passes through a triangular prism it separates to seven different rays (The spectrum), which when passed through another triangular but inverted prism becomes one again. Here we see Seven different rays, wave lenghts or colors combine to form one ray, wave-lenghts or color. You and many are struggling explain 3 to mean1 without any success. Its like me trying to pass up triangle for a straight line, or someting that it is not.
Here your analogy is wrong because the trinity doesn't mean 3 different gods. Rather it is one God that expressed Himself through 3. Therefore if you seek to solve it mathematically, you must understand the neither one of the parties should be ascribed to 1. The correct way is to divide 1 by three. You get 1/3 for each. God the son = 1/3 Holy Spirit = 1/3 God the father = 1/3 Now add them. 1/3 +1/3 +1/3 = 1Therefor God is one. LOL Although the above is a very very crude analogy because God cannot be subtracted or added but I only did it because you and babs 787 keep bringing mathematics into what is spiritual. Now on a more serious note. God is one. We only use the expression "son" of God because of the deficiency in our language. Besides, even if our language is perfect, it can never truly and completely convey the meaning of trinity because Trinity is an ability that lies beyond the human spirit. Languages are only for earthly things, it cannot truly convey the nature of anything that lies far above the earth, thus anything spiritual and above spiritual. You can replace the word "son" with "part". Thus "the son of God" is a part of God. The son of God is not an entirely different person from God. It is not like when a human being has a son, humans sons are completely different persons and not one with their father. The human father is complete even without the son, and the human son is complete even without his father. But in the case of Jesus, HE is a part of God and God is not complete without Him neither is HE complete without God. Hence: "I and My Father are One." The same is the case with the Holy spirit. Like the seven colours that make up the color white. Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and God the father represent three colours that make up God. You can also subsitute the word "son" with "characteristic" or "ability". God as a whole has infinite ability, and this infinite nature of Him cannot be contained by creation which is a finite work of God. When God created, He created with His creating characteristic or creative ability. A part of this creative ability of God has to move away from God in-other to become finite and create. This is the hand through which God created. This is the Holy Spirit. This is the Spirit that moved upon the face of the waters during creation in Genesis. Later when man failed, and due to man's sins subsequent creation was about to fall into ruins. God out of His great love came to save mankind. But this love of God is an ability of God or a characteristic of God and thus infinite. In-other for this love to descent into creation which is a finite work, a part of this ability or characteristic of God has to move away from God, it had to be made finite -- enveloped by a body. Only this way can God in his love descend into His work (creation). Thus one can also say that Jesus is the love of God enveloped in a physical body in-other to save man. Jesus being a finite part of an infinte God, thus Jesus is in a way dependant on the infinite God which He is a part of. That's why acording to the bible He said that His father is greater than Him. The same is applicable to the Holy Spirit. I conclude with these points: 1.) God is one, He is infinitely love, Justice, and Purity. These three characteristics are one. They represent the pure white light of God, which beyound creation and anything created. 2.) God in His infintness and invinsible white light cannot descend into creation and because in his devine presence, (which carries infinte might and energy), creation and creatures cannot exsist. His power is too much that no creature can bear his direct presence. Hence: "The eye that sees God shall die." Due to this, during creation, With the words "Let there be Light." He let a part of His creative ability to move away from him and this creative part of God or son of God was cloacked and made finite so that He can create and so that the creatures can see Him. This part of God remained in paradise which came about out of His direct power and radiation. 3.) When a part of creation, especially the earth was about to fall into ruins due to the sins of man. God out of his love helped. But His love like His creative ability is infinite and cannot be contained wholy in a finite work. A part of this love had to seperate from God and be cloacked in a physical body(made finite) so that man can see and hear Him. This Love of God that incarnated on earth was Jesus Christ. Therefore in Jesus and through Jesus God walked on earth and delivered His love personally to man. Man has to remain eternally thankful to God for this great and inconcivable gift of Love. But God remains eternally one. Jesus(HIS Love) and the Holy Sprit(HIS creative will) are parts of one God, caracheristics of one God or abilities of one God. We cannot see colors in white light but when this light passes through a prism, we see different colors in it. God is like the white light, we can never see Him except when he cloacks Himself and comes into creation then we see him as two. Jesus and the Holy Sprit. |
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olabowale (m)
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@Justcool: The son of God is not an entirely different person from God. It is not like when a human being has a son, humans sons are completely different persons and not one with their father. The human father is complete even without the son, and the human son is complete even without his father. But in the case of Jesus, HE is a part of God and God is not complete without Him neither is HE complete without God. Hence: "I and My Father are One." The same is the case with the Holy spirit. Like the seven colours that make up the color white. Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and God the father represent three colours that make up God. I was going to laugh at your light specrum analogy, and simply give you a response about if a condition is developed where a sprectrum is obstructed from the seven, what would the outcome be when you invert a prizm to converge them a single sprectrum of light, Would you get a pure white or something ooff white? But you already see your own follow with your seven smileys that ended the second absurd 1/3 3 sections that make up 1 whole. See what you reduce your god to? But as i read your thesis of your god's inability to be independently complete except he has son god and holy ghost god with him, I have to cringe about how your mind works. You cheapened your god so much that the hindus and all the others have more trust in their god than you have on yours. There god only manifested in many things, but no manifestation form needs another before it can completely function. Unlike you, your father god need son god to talk to and save mankind, and your holy spirit god is the one that created. Shameful thoughts by you and it is only for your type of mindset that can accept it. Ironically, you forgot that your god only commanded that light should exist when he decided to create light. That same god who created mankind by simple pronouncement of the commandment, is now incapable of forgiveness of humanbeings, his priced creating, which he made in his own image? He did not know that man are imperfect before he created it, even he had already hellfire and paradise, for rewards of evil and goods respectively? Is your good an all knower or lacks some knowledge still, and this is why he had to send himself, or his son, or his third to be killed for saving mankind? Again, yet before he jhad created hellfire to punish? Are these two ideas not opposing each other with complete strength? Your god is not my God, for sure. My God is complete. He lays down the laws and commandments. He supports His creations with mercy and allows them the freedom to choose. Yet He is full of mercy and accepts rependance again and again, until just before death. And throughout the period that humans are alive the door of mercy is never closed. My God is indepently capable of doing all things. |
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olabowale (m)
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@~lady~: So did God write the Qu'ran and dropped it from heaven? Thats not the way it happened. In a period of 23 years, 13 in Makka and the last 10 in Hijra (the Madina period), the verses of the Qu.r'a.n were revealed to M.uha.mmad via Angel Gabreil. Except the last 4 verse of Chapter 2, Surah baqarah, which he received in heavens on the Night Journey known as Isra wa Miraj, all were through Angel Gabreil. Where are you woman, I have been trying to reach you on the thread you promised. Enjoy the Special occasion. Keep in touch. |
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justcool (m)
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@Justcool: I was going to laugh at your light specrum analogy, and simply give you a response about if a condition is developed where a sprectrum is obstructed from the seven, what would the outcome be when you invert a prizm to converge them a single sprectrum of light, Would you get a pure white or something ooff white? But you already see your own follow with your seven smileys that ended the second absurd 1/3 3 sections that make up 1 whole. See what you reduce your god to?
@ olabowale Despite your insults. I thank you for reading and replying to my submission, and although I disagree with you, I still respect your opinion and I will never condescend to insulting you. I never said anything about the spectrum being obstructed. I don't know what you mean by that. The spectrum analogy is to show you that many things can add up to one, even within the physical realms which science can investigate. You called the 1/3 analogy absurd but it was you who kept posting that 1 + 1 +1 cannot equal 3. Even within your own mathematical analogy I proved you wrong because the Trinity means one God in three persons thus each person of the Trinity is 1/3. Then when you add the three persons you get ONE. Show show me whats wrong with this calculation. But as i read your thesis of your god's inability to be independently complete except he has son god and holy ghost god with him, I have to cringe about how your mind works. You cheapened your god so much that the hindus and all the others have more trust in their god than you have on yours. There god only manifested in many things, but no manifestation form needs another before it can completely function. Unlike you, your father god need son god to talk to and save mankind, and your holy spirit god is the one that created. Shameful thoughts by you and it is only for your type of mindset that can accept it.
The above is completely yours and not drawn from my submission. I never said that God cannot independently be complete except he has son and Holy ghost with him. In reality God has no son. Jesus is a part of God. He is the love of God. Please tell me how God can be God without love which is an indispensable part of God. God can only save man by giving man His words. The man who lives according to the words of God shall be saved. He gave us his word during creation, when He created us He hardwired His laws and the ability to recognise His will in our spirits, He sent us so many prophets yet we refused to listen to them and submite to his laws. Infact we statred killing the prophets and due to our sins, the earth was speedily heading towards distruction. God did the ultimate by sending us a part of Himself-- His Living Love. In Jesus, God vissited the earth to give us His words or laws (the laws of His father) personally. It is unfortunate that we refused this help and had the audacity to destroy the vehicle(the Body of Jesus) through which God walked on earth. Ironically, you forgot that your god only commanded that light should exist when he decided to create light. That same god who created mankind by simple pronouncement of the commandment, is now incapable of forgiveness of humanbeings, his priced creating, which he made in his own image? He did not know that man are imperfect before he created it, even he had already hellfire and paradise, for rewards of evil and goods respectively? Is your good an all knower or lacks some knowledge still, and this is why he had to send himself, or his son, or his third to be killed for saving mankind? Again, yet before he jhad created hellfire to punish?
God's words "let there be lights" are not words like human words. Every word of God is an act which is living. Let there be light is an act of God's creation. God did not send Jesus to be killed for mankind. Like I said earlier Jesus came to deliver the word of God personally to mankind and only by living according to the words of Jesus will man be saved. His death is a murder that mankind committed. God did not create hellfire. Hellfire developed due to man's misuse of his free will. One of the laws of creation is that "whatsoever you sow, that you shall reap." Doing good deeds is tantamount to sowing good fruits which will only bring good to the sower. But instead of doing good man did so many evil. This is like sowing evil. These evil done by man are waiting for man in a part of the beyond. This part of the beyond is hell. it wouldn't have come about if man had not turned away from God. Therefor, my brother our Good God did not create hell. Hell is the work of man. Are these two ideas not opposing each other with complete strength? Your god is not my God, for sure. My God is complete. He lays down the laws and commandments. He supports His creations with mercy and allows them the freedom to choose. Yet He is full of mercy and accepts rependance again and again, until just before death. And throughout the period that humans are alive the door of mercy is never closed. My God is indepently capable of doing all things.
God can do all things but God cannot do evil, sin or go against His holy laws. The laws of creation which are part of the Holy laws of God makes impossible for God in all his MAJESTY, PURITY, MIGHT, AND POWER to descend into this little earth. The earth cannot carry HIM but must incinerate at His presence. The only way he could come to the earth was by letting a part of him to enveloped (and the word was made flesh)in a physical body. Through an act of His love, He cloaked a part of Himself. This part of God that walked on earth was Jesus Christ. If your god can do all things, including sins and injustice, then he definitely is not my God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Jesus was, is, and will forever remain a part of God. My dear olabowale remain blessed. I wish you well. |
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Backslider (m)
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@justcool
There is the tendency to err from scripture but i hope you will take my correction in Good Faith.
God is not a deceiver or a pretender. he doenst act plays like some think.
God is three seperate different persons in one Godhead. God did not Manifest as jesus and God did not manifest as the father or holy Ghost.
God was not lying when Jesus was baptized and he said this is my beloved son in whom i am well pleased and at the same time the Holy Ghost come upon Jesus.
The thing is to think that God was trying to play with our minds but NO God was showing that there is three person and they agree so beautiful in service and love.
There is no Fraud in God or deception there are three person and they are very different.
The Holy Ghost Commander in Chief of the heavenly Host
The son Jesus The solicitor, the law giver, the lamb, the High priest, The saviour and prince of peace
The father The Judge of all. The only being that is called Love
Note the difference
Jesus will judge Church
The father will Judge Satan and all his followers
Read from the scripture that is qouted to you when explaining any doctrine so that you are don't go into Heresy. No one is above natural mistakes but the sin is to continue therein.
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olabowale (m)
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@Backslider: Okare. The below that you have written as advise to Justcool is a load of crock. God is three seperate different persons in one Godhead. God did not Manifest as jesus and God did not manifest as the father or holy Ghost. Persons will mean humans. Not animals like lions, etc or trees like mahogany or spruce, etc. So from the above, we read that you have different gods which make up your one god. Think about it can this ever make sense? How is it that your god give you a thing that can not make sense to you here, the most central to his decision and yet give you ideas that make sense in other things? It is very easy to know that there is hellfire and its a place of punishment because we see that the fire we use for a load of benefits can also be a thing of pain. We see that we are in enjoyment when we are in a felicious setting. But to give you a three for one concept, yet one dies off, the remaining 2 are still one without missing a beat is cowhide. I just don't know how to help you because your heart and soul are not spiritually acute, right now. Hopefully our dialogue on this board will benefit somebody to know the truth about the Creator of all. The three in one racket will not save you. O repeat, it will not benefit you no how. God was not lying when Jesus was baptized and he said this is my beloved son in whom i am well pleased and at the same time the Holy Ghost come upon Jesus. Let me start from the last: the ghost that could not be seen now suddenly became visible? And ordinary folks who were standing around heard the voice of God Almighty and they all lived, even though they were not prophets? How is greter, the one who Baptised or the one who was baptised? And I have not used the Q.u.r'an here, at all. I will leave you to debate your statement about God and His prophet, Jesus in your heart. The thing is to think that God was trying to play with our minds but NO God was showing that there is three person and they agree so beautiful in service and love. God serves you, you said? God will only love you up to the time of death, except that you do His will as per knowing who He is, One indivisible God, worship Him alone as He should be worshipped without any mediator between you and Him, and put your trust and direct your request to Him alone. In the day of Judgement, those who see Him as multiple person, godheads, setting up rivals, associates, partners, etc with Him will definitely be hated as the other idol worshippers. There is no Fraud in God or deception there are three person and they are very different. You are now showing your understanding of your god! Tell me, what is the definition of different, other than indicating a condition where there is more than one? It is true that there is no fraud in God. But you have been very fraudulent in describing more than one god to us and passing that up to us as One Supreme Lord God. Could there be more than One Supreme Lord God? Never! The Holy Ghost Commander in Chief of the heavenly Host Heavenly host means angel(s), doesn't it? Is there any host in the heavens except the angels? Who could be the head of the Angels except Angel Gabreil? And we have been telling you all along that the Holy spirit is nothing more than an Angel; Gabreil, whom is known in the Q.u.r'an among many great noble names as Ruuh Qudus! The son Jesus The solicitor, the law giver, the lamb, the High priest, The saviour and prince of peace I used to call a cousin of mine Dad after the passing of my father many a decade ago. I also called my older brothers who were olde than him dad, also. So were my Uncles from my father and mother sides. I had so many fathers more than youcan shake a stake at. Was anyone of them my true father? It is obvious that it was my way of respecting each of them. They knew who my father was. They knew that they were not my father, because they did not sire me. They did not mount my mother Mariam and therefore did not beget me. Now tell me how did Jesus become God son again? Am listening and don't side step the issue as I believe you will. Surprise me, because i like to be surprise here and now. Solicitor, Law giver, the lamb, the high priest, savior and prince of peace: Did he do more than Moses in any of these quality? No. Moses solicited for the children of Isreal before the Black King Tyrant of Egypt; Pharaoh. Moses said let my people go from the burden of slavery in order to serve and worship God their creator. Moses gave the children of Israel the laws, the tablets containing the commandments which Jesus himself obeyed! Is there anyone a higher priest than Moses among the Children of Israel; aand it is stated that there was never appeared among the Israelites any prophet that is up to Moses. Was Jesus not a prophet, considering that he called himself and his disciples called him a prophet after he had been lifted to heaven? Moses saved the Israelite sfrom the calamity that they were suffering and the certain destruction they would have suffered from Pharaoh. Moses saved them and suffered so much as the lamb in the hand of pharaoh. Moses brought peace into their hearts at least after Pharaoh army perished. Imagine what Moses went through pleading the case(s) of the israelite with God, since they are stffnecked people? Can there be a children of israel higher than Moses? The father The Judge of all. The only being that is called Love Note that I used to call many of mymale relative dad? But finally many call me dad now. And not all of them are my children. And in the Judgement and Love we see that Jesus is conspicuously absent, as you put "father god' in charge here. But where is holyspirit god in any of the after life events? Note the difference The difference is that you are completely off the chart, since you are very wrong in your exposition of what god is. You provide a gubbly gook at best. I will just take it that you were sleep writing. Thats my defense of the nonsensical that you wrote. Jesus will judge Church The church he did not build now suggest that it should be built. Before you try to say that he did mention anything about church, be assure that I will ask you to show me where the word "church" ever existed in the lexicon of the Children of israel, before you christians go to Greek on a Jewish message from a jewish messenger for a jewish pwople. It sounds like democracy, don it? Finally who will judge the son? Who will Judge Adam, Noah, Ibrahim the friend of God, Isiaq, Yaqub, Yusus, Moses, Yahya who performed the rites of Bermitva on Jesus, etc? And who will Judge Mary the mother of Jesus, who will Judge david and his wise son (with his wisdom, was it likely to commit any sin, yet you people said that he worshipped idols?), who will Judge Zachariah, and who will Judge the Apostles/or the twelve disciples which does not include Paul, who will Judge Paul? Who will judge the holy spirit? Who will Judge the Angels? Who will Judge the Jinns? The father will Judge Satan and all his followers The son is left with the easy task, right? But will any in the church be found to err by Jesus? Be very careful as you know that being in the church is to accept the lordship of Jesus, so that should qualify them to go to christian heaven. Whatever heaven means, you know it already. But did all who were in the church do 100% good? What happens to those who are less than 100%, eg Mussollini, etc? I see that you hate the catholics, what happenes to them? What happens to the jehovah witnesses? What happens to the Jesuit? What happens to the cleargy homosexuals? What happens to all the deviants and then what happens to you in the hand of Jesus? Will he say that he did not know you as he will say to many? You know i set the scenrio of jesus as the judge up since you brought it up to go against the "ge away from me, I do not know you" future statement from him. The reason is that that statement shows that he is not the one judging the people he is saying this to. It is very clear that they went to him seeking his protection to act as savior or intercessor. But he did not even want to plead their cases before the judge. Obviously, the judge is not him and those who went to him are not muslims, but christians. Yet he failed them. Now you have to excplain to me, how can this scenario above happen, if he was the one to judge the church? How is it possible that your god is now refusing your pleading with him to intercede on your behalf when you already billed him up as a judge in the first place? Ae you in the church now asking him to intercede on your behalf with himself as your judge? Would it not have been prudent for you to wait your turn when you appear for his judgement to now plead that he simply have mercy on you, but not as intercessor? How can he judge you when he is not even allowing you to come to him to intercede for you as your savior with himself as your judge? If you and me had wagered, by A.ll.ah I would have won, and your ransome for freedom whould have been Laa ilaha ilallah, M.uhamm.adanr Rasulullah (as), Isa bin Mariam Rasulullah. (as). Read from the scripture that is qouted to you when explaining any doctrine so that you are don't go into Heresy. No one is above natural mistakes but the sin is to continue therein. I have no comment. But Justcool, not all that glitter are gold. |
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m_nwankwo (m)
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The nature of God, of which Trinity is a part of cannot be explained but it is very possible that information about it can be mediated to man by God. There are those who inspite of information given will still not accept the doctrine of Trinity. Those are entiltled to their own conviction. I wish to give a more detailed information about Trinity as follows
1. Opponents of the doctrine Trinity often claim that Trinity cannot be reconciled with the concept of one God. Trinity does not say that there are three gods but that there is one God in three persons. In reality, it is only God the Father that works in threefold as the Father, the son and the Holyspirit. Just an earthly crude analogy to paint a picture that may help some have a glimpse of the truth in this matter. You can liken God the Father to be the whole human body and this body has the left and right arm. You can assume the right arm to be the living Love of God and the left arm to be the Living Justice or creative WILL of God. Before creation came into existence it was only God as one whole body (analogy). When God decided to bring forth creation, a part of this left arm became personal in the activity of creation. That is, the process of bringing creation into existence makes this part of the left hand to become personal. In being personal, this part of the living Will of God is separate and yet one with the whole body. This living WILL of God is called the Holyspirit. He is also called the Living Law of God. When mankind sinned, God sent his prophets who are creatures to help man retrace his steps. Mankind ignored the warnings and admonistions of these servants of God. Darkness and evil was taken over the earth. The power which God bestowed on his various servants or prophets were not enough to prevent the darkness or evil from completely taken over the earth. In all spheres of existence (both physically visible and invisible), all creatures of God who still stand in his service besieged God to intervene to save humankind from untimely spiritual death. There is only one option left and that isthat God should intervene. Out of Love, God severed a part of his living LOVE and incarnated this part of HIMSELF in a male sex, Jesus Christ. Therefore with the sendforth of a part of his "right arm", God became a Trinity. Only God is the Truth and since Jesus is the begotten inborn son of God, he carries this Truth within himself. Since Jesus carried the Truth, and is indeed the Truth, he is the way, the truth and the life. That means that the words of Jesus is the truth, following the words of Jesus will lead to resurrection above matter into paradise or heaven (where life is). That is why Jesus once said "I am the WAY, THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE, NOBODY COMETH TO THE FATHER BUT BY ME" Therefore Jesus is not just a prophet but the son of God, a part of the Living God. The incarnation of God on earth (Jesus Christ) saved the visible and invisible earth including the human beings inhabiting them from premature spiritual death. Later when we human beings are more spiritually matured, we will recogonise the inconcievable grace of God, the inconcievable love of God that permitted his own son to walk the surface of the earth. Then, only gratitude to the ALMIGHTY GOD will resound in our souls. At that time, there will not be an iorta of doubt that Jesus Christ is the son of the living God.
2. Therefore it is futile to compare Jesus Christ with sevants or prophets of God. All prophets or servants of God are creatures but Jesus Christ is not a creature but part of the creator. Part of the recognition required to enter the kingdom of heaven is that Jesus is truely the son of God. That recognition will either come here on earth on hereafter for all those who genuinely seek to serve God no matter the religion they presently profess. Because Jesus is a part of God, the living love of God, his name carries the magnetic radiance, the unsubstantiate power of God and that is why when that name is mentioned in purity and conviction, the omnipotent power of God is made manifest. Every prophet or servant of God know that Jesus is the son of God even if there multitude of followers still lack that recognition.
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justcool (m)
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There is the tendency to err from scripture but i hope you will take my correction in Good Faith.
@Backslider Thanks for your reply, and be rest assured that I take your views in good faith. But I must tell you that I completely disagree with you. First of all, you take the scriptures so literilly. The expression "son of God" is a figurative expression that doesn't mean "son" as in the case with humans "son." A human son is a completely different entity from his father. A human son is not perpetually connected to his father. The only thing they share is that the son inherited half of his genetic makeup from his father. Thier spirits are completely different entities that may or may not be of homogenenous species ie have the same talents. Therefore "son" or "sonship" is only connected with the physical body which is earthbound. In other words, having sons, daughters, etc are only earthly things. A physical body is need to have sons. Spirits in paradise do not even have sons because spirits have spiritual bodies and not physical bodies. God Himself is Divine and does not have a physical body(infact no physical body can exist in his immediate vicinity) therefore God cannot have a son like humans on earth do. If you think that the relationship between God and Jesus is the same with a man and his son, then Jesus erred when according to the bible He said: "Truly, truly I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner." Please tell me, if you have a son 1.) Can your son do something of himself without you? The answer is yes. Because you don't even know what your son is doing most of the time. When he goes to school he could be doing something that don't know and don't approve. 2.) Does your son do whatever you do? The answer is no because you could be a Christian and your son may decide to be Great One. 3.) When your son is working, is it you that is working through him? The answer is no because your limitation as a human would not let you work through another person. You see! your relationship with your son is entirely different from the relationship between Jesus and God. When Jesus was working on earth, it was God the father that was working through him. Thus Jesus could be likened as an expression of God the father. God was in Jesus but one human spirit cannot be in a human father and at the same time in the son. We use the expression "son of God" to describe Jesus because thats the best our language can do. The relationship between Jesus and God is divine and no human word or language canever truly convey a divine happening. You also forgot that Jesus never used the English word "son". Jesus spoke Aramaic, and the English translation of the Aramaic expresion can only render an approximate meaning. Just for your enlightenment, read this: "In Hebrew and Aramaic 'son of' is commonly used to mean 'member of the class of'; hence, 'the sons of god' is a regular way of saying 'the gods,' just as 'the sons of men' (commonly translated 'the children of men') is a regular way of saying 'men'." - Morton Smith, Jesus the Magician: Charlatan or Son of God? (1978) p. 133 "Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them." - Job 1:6 If you take the above literally, so God has many sons and not Just Jesus and the Holy spirit. So you see, the sexpressin "son of God", "sons of God", "children of God" is also sometimes used to describe angels and righteous people. But Jesus is different. In the case of Jesus, you can substitute the word "son" with "part." God is three seperate different persons in one Godhead. God did not Manifest as jesus and God did not manifest as the father or holy Ghost.
First, my I remind you to always capitalize "J" in Jesus. You and I are not even worthy to speak His name yet He allows us. We should, at least always remember to offer Him respect. There are no three different persons in one God. Rather there is One God in three persons. This He did for the sake of His creation. He created in the person of His Holy Spirit, and He redeemed us in the person of Jesus. If he had never created, he would have remained in only one expression or person--God. But trinity came about for the sake of His creation. There is no Fraud in God or deception there are three person and they are very different.
Here you contradict the biblical word that It is the father that works through the son. You also contradict: "I and My Father are one" They are not very different because they all have the same essence and the same nature which is Divine. This is in no way a fraud or deception. God decieves no one. The Holy Ghost Commander in Chief of the heavenly Host
The son Jesus The solicitor, the law giver, the lamb, the High priest, The saviour and prince of peace
The father The Judge of all. The only being that is called Love
Note the difference
Jesus will judge Church
The father will Judge Satan and all his followers
In Jesus God gave man His love, Jesus's mission was to deliver the word of God and not to judge. God judges the world through the Holy spirit, the hand through which He created the world. This Holy spirit is the Spirit of Truth or the comforter which Jesus promised His disciples. It is also through him that God judges Satan. It is this Spirit of Truth that will bind satan for a thousand years as the Revalation said. Read from the scripture that is qouted to you when explaining any doctrine so that you are don't go into Heresy. No one is above natural mistakes but the sin is to continue therein.
The idea that sin is to continue is an evil Principle perpetuated in Christian churches by fake pastors. God dos not condone sin and will not let sin contine. According to the Bible God told us through Jesus: "Be yea righteous for your Father in heaven is righteous" In another verse He said "For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven" (MATTHEW 5:20) Righteousness in living without sin, thus living in the laws of God. Jesus commended and demanded righteousness. It is unfortunate that some Christians today teach that sin is inevitable and must continue and that only accepting that Jesus died for you will save you. This is the lie that they tell in churches. Only righteousness(living in the word of God) can save man. Sin cannot enter the kingdom of God. The man with sin cannever enter paradise, even if he believes the lie that the murder of Jesus was a ransom for his sins. |
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babs787 (m)
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@Cgift We know the people behind the various confusing translations of the bible. We know their attempt to create divisions and confusion in the church of Christ. You will not know all these or perhaps you know but will deliberately conceal it and use it to advance your own argument. To anyone who is interested in knowing Christ through his words, the KJV is the way to go. So, start and end with the KJV that is my own base for a debate. Hope you are not trying to deceive yourself by preferring KJV to other versions? So if your KJV happens to be the best, what happened to missing verses in other versions but present in KJV an funny enough, these verses present in KJV version cannot be found in original manuscript? What happened to versions before KJV and please do you want me to take you to the preface of your KJV and its defect? |
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cgift (m)
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@Cgift
Hope you are not trying to deceive yourself by preferring KJV to other versions?
So if your KJV happens to be the best, what happened to missing verses in other versions but present in KJV an funny enough, these verses present in KJV version cannot be found in original manuscript?
What happened to versions before KJV and please do you want me to take you to the preface of your KJV and its defect?
see who is talking You probably seem to have forgotten the sayins of MO that were written on leaves and tree barks only for goats to cart them away or the ones written on bones and walls that rain swept away? So much for a complete book in the qurian. By the way, you point fingers at one book claiming its missing and refuse to acknowledge that your MO even gave way to Shaitan to allow Shaitan speak and document through him in the Satanic verses. Have you forgotten the three daughters of all'ah or simply playing oblivion? Your hide and seek game cannot work with me gentleman. Nevertheless, let me address your worries: Be gentlemanly enough to allow sleeping dogs lie. When i say i use the KJV, i mean every word of it because i know the extent to which detractors went with sponsoring other variant versions and doctoring it to suite their purpose. NWT (New World transltion) for instance was sponsored and being used by the Jehovah Witnesses (we have a pile of issues against them because were not in agreement). RSV and some others apart from the KJV have Catholic Stunts in them. So, some of us know what is happening and have decided to stay put with the KJV regardless of any human or typographical errors you might spot there in. Al the best my guy |
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olabowale (m)
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@ Justcool: Despite your insults. I thank you for reading and replying to my submission, and although I disagree with you, I still respect your opinion and I will never condescend to insulting you. I never said anything about the spectrum being obstructed. I don't know what you mean by that. The spectrum analogy is to show you that many things can add up to one, even within the physical realms which science can investigate. You called the 1/3 analogy absurd but it was you who kept posting that 1 + 1 +1 cannot equal 3. Even within your own mathematical analogy I proved you wrong because the Trinity means one God in three persons thus each person of the Trinity is 1/3. Then when you add the three persons you get ONE. Show show me whats wrong with this calculation. You can not eat your cake and have it, too. It just does not happen. You can not have a portion off or cut off from a whole and continue to hold fast that what remain is still a comple entity, undisturbed. Thats excatly what you are putting forward when you claim that Jesus was part of a whole, but when he is cut down by crucifixion, what remain was still a complete whole. In addition thats what i was proving to you in my obstructing just 1 spectrum and allowing the remaining 6 to go through your inverted prizm and see if you will get a pure white light which was what you should have gotten if all went through . But then, you have cheapened your god to common light, etc. The above is completely yours and not drawn from my submission. I never said that God cannot independently be complete except he has son and Holy ghost with him. In reality God has no son. Jesus is a part of God. He is the love of God. Please tell me how God can be God without love which is an indispensable part of God. God can only save man by giving man His words. The man who lives according to the words of God shall be saved. He gave us his word during creation, when He created us He hardwired His laws and the ability to recognise His will in our spirits, He sent us so many prophets yet we refused to listen to them and submite to his laws. Infact we statred killing the prophets and due to our sins, the earth was speedily heading towards distruction. God did the ultimate by sending us a part of Himself-- His Living Love. In Jesus, God vissited the earth to give us His words or laws (the laws of His father) personally. It is unfortunate that we refused this help and had the audacity to destroy the vehicle(the Body of Jesus) through which God walked on earth. I know you will put the blame on me, somehow. thats okay because God sees all. Hear yourself talk about the fact that God must have son and holy ghost with Him. And then you turn to God not having son and that Jesus is part of God and His love. So without Jesus God has no love or loveless and unable to love and without Jesus God is complete, since Jesus is part of Him? What happened when Jesus died, did part of God died, hence incomplete and had no love? I see you saying that Jesus is the "words" of God that He gave us to live by at the time of creation, which is the only way we can be saved. So what was the need for the prophets of old, before Jesus? And what role did jesus played as the 'words' to live by before he came as his mother's son and before he began to preach his 'gospel?' You spoke about hardwiring us with ability to understand God's laws and will in our spirit, but then, it seems as if you are all over the map without connecting jesus to any of mankind and prophethood before he was born. I guess I was not connected to anybody bfore i was born, too. Whats special about Jesus which ordinary humans don't have, before either was born? You sping on the bandwagon again of saying we, instead of the Jews who received so many prophets and killed a good number of them as they refused to obey the laws and commandments of the god who sent the prophets. I will not accept blames for what the Jews did. And there was no single prophet was sent to the Africans and all mankind, up to and until M.u.h.ammad. The Jews were sent Moses and there is no way that you will deny that Jesus was sent to the Children of israel, alone. Afterall, he said that in your Bible, please read it! I was right to have stated that you called Jesus "part of God, and His living love." And now you add that God visited the earth through Jesus? I wonder what Jesus did to make you made that kind of leap of faith? Jesus was never more revered by the Jews more than Moses, since both were sent to them alone. There is nothing you can say about him that a prophet before him did not have a presentation of something similar. Adam was born by no vessel at all, yet he came alive as a grown man. His wife Eve was born through him, a small part of him, anfully grown, also. These were remarkable being and process of creation. And by the way it is the jews who killed Jesus. There is no single Yoruba man that participated. And jesus was not sent to the yorubas. Check out his own words in the Bible. I was just wondering if the term "words' means more than speech, that is if I use your definitions, then Jesus 'words' will be what exactly? God's words "let there be lights" are not words like human words. Every word of God is an act which is living. Let there be light is an act of God's creation. And when i apply this concept to Jesus as the words, what i get is that J | | |
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