Joagbaje:

There are different temptations.

The temptation of Abraham simply means a test. Nothing evil . But the temptation James talks about has to do ith problems. They are not the same

LagosShia:

thank you sir for your kind explanation.i just need you to further answer my question:

so how do you explain the other verses that God deceives his own prophets and God deliberately preventing people from believing so that they would not be healed?

Knight1:

since point/question 1 has been tackled, i'll move to number 2. _{(even though i know you will still return to it when you no longer have any point and just want to raise dust)}

i have asked you to always read the chapter at least of the bible verse you want to 'query'.

since you have been known to change words in scripture to suit your position and so i can't trust you, please allow me to post from the KJV the scripture accurately

2Th 2:5  Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
2Th 2:6  And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
2Th 2:8  And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
2Th 2:9  Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:10  And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11  And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th 2:12  That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Ordinarily, just quoting the passage in context will be sufficient for the objective mind, but i will humour you a little.


GOD HAS PRESENTED UNTO ALL MANKIND THE WAY OF TRUTH AND LOVE, HOWEVER MANY HAVE REFUSED THAT WAY,NOT ONLY DO THEY REFUSE IT, THEY GO TOTALLY THE OTHER WAY OF SIN, WICKEDNESS, FRAUD AND WORST OF ALL, THEY FLAUNT IT!
THIS SCRIPTURE ASSURES US THAT GOD WILL DESTROY THIS SATANIC POWER
Their sin is this: They believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness: they did not love the truth, and therefore they did not believe it; and, because they did not believe the truth, therefore they had pleasure in unrighteousness, or in wicked actions, and were pleased with false notions. Note, An erroneous mind and vicious life often go together and help forward one another. (2.) Their ruin is thus expressed: God shall send them strong delusions, to believe a lie. Thus he will punish men for their unbelief, and for their dislike of the truth and love to sin and wickedness; not that God is the author of sin, but in righteousness he sometimes withdraws his grace from such sinners as are here mentioned; he gives them over to Satan, or leaves them to be deluded by his instruments; he gives them up to their own hearts' lusts, and leaves them to themselves, and then sin will follow of course, yea, the worst of wickedness, that shall end at last in eternal damnation. God is just when he inflicts spiritual judgments here, and eternal punishments hereafter, upon those who have no love to the truths of the gospel, who will not believe them, nor live suitably to them, but indulge false doctrines in their minds, and wicked practices in their lives and conversations.


I WANT TO KNOW IF YOU ARE OKAY WITH THIS SO I CAN MOVE TO THE NEXT "QUERY". wouldn't like to be repeatedly drawn back on what i have clearly explained.

plappville:

@LAGOSIA, u should know that, the Kuran copied the bible, all these things u ve posted here make no sense in explaining them. Even in the koran, it says that Allah deliberately puts obstacles in the way of unbelievers to keep them from accepting the truth. If Allah wished, he could provide "the way" to every soul.

[size=14pt]If We had so willed, We could certainly have brought every soul its true guidance (32:13)[/size]

But, instead he sets a veil over the hearts and coverings over their ears:

[size=14pt]Verily We have set veils over their hearts lest they should understand this, and over their ears, deafness, if thou callest them to guidance, even then will they never accept guidance. (18:57) See also (17:46) & (45:23)[/size]

I ve discussed this with u before, u must know that the kuran had copied the bible partially, all is to make a self claimed book. If u must accused the bible, u are even accusing the kuran.

The Kuran went as far as saying that Allah even uses chains and barriers to prevent unbelievers from believing:

[size=14pt]Certainly the word has proved true of most of them, so they do not believe.  Surely We have placed chains on their necks, and these reach up to their chins, so they have their heads raised aloft. And We have made before them a barrier and a barrier behind them, then We have covered them over so that they do not see. And it is alike to them whether you warn them or warn them not: they do not believe. (36:7-10)[/size]

For the same purpose, He also sink the hearts of unbelievers with doubt:

[size=14pt]No soul can believe, except by the will of Allah, and He will place doubt (or obscurity) on those who will not understand (10:100)[/size]

Do we ve to start refuting your accusations when your book carries more deadly text?
Jesus is lord.

plappville:

But really @LagosShian,.what sense does it makes? kuran says that allah deliberately plant obstacles in the way of unbelievers to keep them from accepting the truth:

If allah wished, he could provide guidance to every soul:

If We had so willed, We could certainly have brought every soul its true guidance (32:13)

And again, he had sets a veil over the hearts and coverings over their ears: why is allah delibrately preventing people from his truth?

[b]Verily We have set veils over their hearts lest they should understand this, and over their ears, deafness, if thou callest them to guidance, even then will they never accept guidance. (18:57) and 17:46 & 45:23

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-817518.160.html#msg9783293

plappville:

Well explained to sir, i wouldn't do better. But mr LagosShia will as usual never fancy the truth.

LagosShia:

thank you sir for your kind explanation.i just need you to further answer my question:

so how do you explain the other verses that God deceives his own prophets and God deliberately preventing people from believing so that they would not be healed?

Joagbaje:

God does not deceive his prophets. Can you quote such passages ?

if you want to know more about the Quran say so.do not distort the meanings of those verses.

LagosShia:

@Knight1

i am not okay with the explanation.as in what is "repentance" for sinners and all the talk about forgiveness about?

so what i understand from your explanation is that God might be so annoyed to revenge and send me astray with His own hands preventing me from believing.in the Quran for exmaple,if we show willingness to turn back to God and seek taubah (repentance) God will unconditionally forgive us and show us mercy.but in the bible,he is very angry.at least he should wait till judgement day.why is He judging people on earth and punishing them by leading them deliberately astray?

okay,if you talk about people,you may want to find excuses.but what happens to his prophets.he even mislead His prophets.isn't that cruel?


Ezekiel 14:9
9And if the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the LORD have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel.

plappville:

@goggs, see reason with knight1. I think its better to creat a tread on quran contraditions, like this u can handle @lagosShia one on one.

LagosShia:

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

you woke up obviously from a nightmare and think posting your ignorance here would annoy muslims especially those who do not have time to respond to you or you would force them to reply and waste their time instead of staying on the topic of this thread.

really,you should have made a quick search on nairaland and you can find existing threads where these claims of Quranic contradictions have being answered.or you could have better still opened a new thread.dont spill the frustration here too by showing your ignorance and exposing your thick skull as your fellow christians already have done.

let me be of asistance to you and others who may be anticipating a muslim reply,to check the thread below.your usual claims are now like an old song to the muslim ears.you will find much muslim answers in the below thread on your hallucinations that the Holy Quran have contradictions:

"A Christian's Perspective Of Contradictions In The Qur'an"

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-820495.0.html

Knight1:

@goggs.
permit me to request that you suspend your queries for now. the reason is LagosShia will use it as a means of escape from the main issues of the thread. after all questions are done with, you can then give him yours. or instead open a thread.
i have interacted with him for a while now albeit short, but i know his tactics. thanks .

Knight1:

LETS FINISH THIS BEFORE WE MOVE TO EZEKIEL14:9

GOD IS NOT REVENGING. LEMME PUT IT MORE SIMPLY THAN BEFORE

1. HE HAS OFFERED A MAN THE RIGHT WAY OF LOVE AND RIGHTEOUSNESS.
2. THE MAN HAS REFUSED THE WAY OF RIGHTEOUSNESS
3. HE NOT ONLY REFUSED RIGHTEOUSNESS, HE IMBIBED EVIL AND FALSEHOOD RELENTLESSLY
4. THEREFORE GOD ALLOWS HIM TO THINK HE IS 'ENJOYING LIFE'- THIS IS THE DELUSION
5. GOD WILL NOT FORGIVE A MAN THAT DOES NOT REPENT
6. THEREFORE AS LONG AS THEY REMAIN IN THAT CORRUPTION, THEY WILL BE SET FOR DAMNATION


Can we go on to Ezekiel now?

plappville:

No response is given, u ve to refute them each one after the other, are u tired of typing? I tought is was fun for u creating uncalled for arguements? your link contain nothing, oya start all over again, This time, u must make sense.

Knight1:

@goggs.
permit me to request that you suspend your queries for now. the reason is LagosShia will use it as a means of escape from the main issues of the thread. after all questions are done with, you can then give him yours. or instead open a thread.
i have interacted with him for a while now albeit short, but i know his tactics. thanks .

plappville:

@goggs, see reason with knight1. I think its better to creat a tread on quran contraditions, like this u can handle @lagosShia one on one.

Knight1:

LagosShia, it really takes a lot of will power to respond to you because your reasoning doesn't follow logic.
What did plappville say to warrant such an insult from you? and yet you consider yourself a genuine muslim and speak so terribly of others.

this thing is quite simple, you have listed a number of queries. the first responder took the first point up and 'you let it go by'. (even though i rightly predicted you sould return to it)
i took the second point only so that we could tackle it and finish it before moving on to the next, that way there would be no confusion or communication gap.

you claim other people distract you, deviate from the topic of discussion, yet instead of replying to what i answered, you quoted it, and wrote something absolutely different, talking about a post you had 'let go by'. if you still have queries on that you should have asked decently.
IT SEEMS TO ME THAT YOU COULDN'T THINK OF A REPLY AND SO YOU RETURNED TO THE FIRST POST.

please clarify your issues on the 'delusion' and please read all responses on that topic before you comment so you don't daw us back, dont let it go by, if you still have issues with understanding it, raise them so we can move on to your third query.

LagosShia:

i really dont know why it is too hard for you sir to reply the verses one by one,rather than telling me stories and narrating summaries of how you see it.

i am tackling the ideas presented and the topic.i am not here to argue with you.i dont know you.so you either stick to the topic or you shut up and stop wasting cyber space here and the time of others.

LagosShia:

i really dont know why it is too hard for you sir to reply the verses one by one

Knight1 link=topic=833213.msg9848671#msg9848671 date=1325067243:

LagosShia, it really takes a lot of will power to respond to you because your reasoning doesn't follow logic.
What did plappville say to warrant such an insult from you? and yet you consider yourself a genuine muslim and speak so terribly of others.

this thing is quite simple, you have listed a number of queries. the first responder took the first point up and 'you let it go by'. (even though i rightly predicted you would return to it)
[b]i took the second point only so that we could tackle it and finish it before moving on to the next, that way there would be no confusion or communication gap.[/b]you claim other people distract you, deviate from the topic of discussion, yet instead of replying to what i answered, you quoted it, and wrote something absolutely different, talking about a post you had 'let go by'. if you still have queries on that you should have asked decently.
IT SEEMS TO ME THAT YOU COULDN'T THINK OF A REPLY AND SO YOU RETURNED TO THE FIRST POST.

please clarify your issues on the 'delusion' and please read all responses on that topic before you comment so you don't daw us back, dont let it go by, if you still have issues with understanding it, raise them so we can move on to your third query.

,rather than telling me stories and narrating summaries of how you see it.

i am tackling the ideas presented and the topic.i am not here to argue with you.i dont know you.so you either stick to the topic or you shut up and stop wasting cyber space here and the time of others.

frosbel:

Hey Shia Kafir , a guy who has no respect for women, calling a lady a b***** , I pity your wife when you do get married.

Go to extremist forums , your ideas and opinions will fit better there.

Knight1:

CAN YOU SEE YOU DON'T MAKE SENSE? I WILL ASSUME THAT YOU ARE REFUSING OBVIOUS DEFEAT ON THAT POINT, HENCE I WILL MOVE TO THE NEXT POINT/VERSE YOU RAISED