Mohammed, Plagiarism And Other Stories.

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Nairaland Forum  |  General Discussion  |  Religion (Moderators: mukina2, A_K_O)  |  Mohammed, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
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Author Topic: Mohammed, Plagiarism And Other Stories.  (Read 1481 views)
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #32 on: December 11, 2007, 07:38 PM »

Divine inspiration came to Muhammad only when he slept with Aisha, 5.57.119

 

Volume 5, Book 57, Number 119:

Narrated Hisham's father:

The people used to send presents to the Prophet on the day of 'Aisha's turn. 'Aisha said, "My companions (i.e. the other wives of the Prophet) gathered in the house of Um Salama and said, "0 Um Salama! By Allah, the people choose to send presents on the day of 'Aisha's turn and we too, love the good (i.e. presents etc.) as 'Aisha does. You should tell Allah's Apostle to tell the people to send their presents to him wherever he may be, or wherever his turn may be." Um Salama said that to the Prophet and he turned away from her, and when the Prophet returned to her (i.e. Um Salama), she repeated the same, and the Prophet again turned away, and when she told him the same for the third time, the Prophet said, "O Um Salama! Don't trouble me by harming 'Aisha, for by Allah, the Divine Inspiration never came to me while I was under the blanket of any woman amongst you except her."
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #33 on: December 11, 2007, 07:41 PM »

Volume 5, Book 59, Number 379:

Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:

When we wrote the Holy Quran, I missed one of the Verses of Surat-al-Ahzab which I used to hear Allah's Apostle reciting. Then we searched for it and found it with Khuzaima bin Thabit Al-Ansari. The Verse was:--

'Among the Believers are men Who have been true to Their Covenant with Allah, Of them, some have fulfilled Their obligations to Allah (i.e. they have been Killed in Allah's Cause), And some of them are (still) waiting" (33.23) So we wrote this in its place in the Quran.

For a more detailed reading see http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/kasem/quran_origin.htm
especially part 4 and 5.
No be today we sabi Mo and his deceptions.
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #34 on: December 11, 2007, 07:46 PM »

a little about the author of the link above.

read on

A few years later, I started to ponder deeply on the Qur’an. Using the works of other translators, as well as the Tafsirs (explanation), I read and re-read the Holy Scripture--several times to make sure that what they translated and explained were absolutely correct. The more I learned about the Qur’an the more I became distraught, disturbed and angry—angry because I felt that I was utterly let down by a killer religion which was imposed on me due to my birth. The stuff I read in the Qur’an jolted me so much that I wanted to find the answer to my perennial question—who really authored the Qur’an? It took me a long time and many years of painstaking work to arrive at the answer of that question. This article tries to answer that question. I had been planning this essay for a long time, and now, after writing it I feel it is for you to ponder too—‘Who authored the Qur’an?’

 

During my investigative phase I found that a lot of people were involved in the compilation and the construction of the Qur’an. Unknown to the vast majority of Muslims, and buried deep inside the Qur’an, Ahadith and Sirah there are copious evidence to reject, out of hand, the contention that the Qur’an is the creation of Allah. Making Allah the author of the Quran, I think, is the prime lie perpetrated on mankind for more than a millennium. We can, with certainty, say that it was not even Muhammad alone who authored the Qur’an.In fact, the major part of the Qur’an was actually either composed by or inspired and written by a few other individuals.

Most notable among them were:

Imrul Qays—an ancient poet of Arabia who died a few decades before Muhammad’s birth

Zayd b. Amr b. Naufal—an ‘apostate’ of his time who preached and propagated Hanifism

Labid—another poet

Hasan b. Thabit—the official poet of Muhammad

Salman, the Persian—Muhammad’s confidante’ and an advisor

Bahira—a Nestoraian Christian monk of the Syrian church

Jabr—a Christian neighbour of Muhammad

Ibn Qumta—a Christian slave

Khadijah—Muhammad’s first wife

Waraqa—Khadijah’s cousin brother

Ubay b. Ka’b—Muhammad’s secretary and a Qur’an scribe

Muhammad himself

 

There were other parties involved too. They were:

 

The Sabeans

Aisha—Muhammad’s child bride

Abdallah b. Salam b. al-Harith—a Jewish convert to Islam

Mukhyariq—a Rabbi and another Jewish convert to Islam

 
babs787 (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #35 on: December 11, 2007, 07:59 PM »

Tayo-D (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #36 on: December 11, 2007, 08:00 PM »

@Davidylan,

Quote
we simply ask a question . . . WHY did mohammed have to plagiarise the bible?
Because a lie must rest on the crutches of truth in order to appear more as a realistic piece of fakery.
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #37 on: December 11, 2007, 08:05 PM »

All I can say was that Mohammed was one bad agbero.
gathered from here and there and gbowai,a Koran was born
The boy was good
oluwolexy (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #38 on: December 11, 2007, 08:09 PM »

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, OLABOWALE I DON'T UNDERSTAND YOU B'because THE 1ST TIME I WAS OPPORTUNED TO READ TRANSLATED ENGLISH QURAN I WAS SURPRISED THAT IT IS MORE OR LESS BIBLICAL MESSAGES WRITTEN IN ANOTHER LANGUAGE BESIDES THAT MOHAMMED WAS A KNOWN SMUGGLER BEFORE HE WAS CONVERTED. THE ONLY BIBLE RECORDED REVELATION PROPHET IS JOHN THAT LED HIM INTO WRITTEN OR HAVING A WAY OF DOCUMENTING MESSAGES HE RECEIVED FROM ABOVE WHEREAS B'because JESUS CHRIST HAS SUPERIOR POWER OVER ANY HUMAN BEINGS THAT HAVE LIVE TO DATE, INSPIRATIONS AND REVELATION FLOW FROM HIM NATURALLY. NO NEED TO ARGUE THIS EVEN OF RECENT MUSLIMS ARE NOW USING JESUS NAME "PROPHET ISAH" TO PRAY IN THEIR MOSQUE. SO LET'S LEAVE EVERYTHING TO GOD ALMIGHTY TO JUDGE
babs787 (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #39 on: December 11, 2007, 09:34 PM »

@oluwolexy

Your name shows that there is a relationship between ROF and christianity. Grin

You may read more on the relationship here

http://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-17450.64.html




Quote
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, OLABOWALE I DON'T UNDERSTAND YOU B'because THE 1ST TIME I WAS OPPORTUNED TO READ TRANSLATED ENGLISH QURAN I WAS SURPRISED THAT IT IS MORE OR LESS BIBLICAL MESSAGES WRITTEN IN ANOTHER LANGUAGE BESIDES THAT MOHAMMED WAS A KNOWN SMUGGLER BEFORE HE WAS CONVERTED.



Can I have the verses please. How come he was a smuggler when you all know that he was an illiterate?


Quote
THE ONLY BIBLE RECORDED REVELATION PROPHET IS JOHN THAT LED HIM INTO WRITTEN OR HAVING A WAY OF DOCUMENTING MESSAGES HE RECEIVED FROM ABOVE WHEREAS B'because JESUS CHRIST HAS SUPERIOR POWER OVER ANY HUMAN BEINGS THAT HAVE LIVE TO DATE, INSPIRATIONS AND REVELATION FLOW FROM HIM NATURALLY.



Brother, calm down, you don't have to shout in order to get noticed Grin. Let us take is softly.


Please did John actually wrote the Gospel of John based on the below verses?


"And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou?  (From the King James Version Bible, John 1:19)"

"John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;  (From the King James Version Bible, John 1:26)"

"For John was not yet cast into prison.  (From the King James Version Bible, John 3:24)"

Let us go further into the book of revelation and the commentary on same:

"Four times the author identifies himself as John (1:1,4,9; 22:Cool, In the third century, however, an African bishop named Dionysius compared the language, style and thought of the Apocalypse (Revelation) with that of the other writings of John and decided that the book could not been written by the apostle of JohnHe suggested that the author was a certain John the Presbyter, whose name appears elsewhere in ancient writings.  Although many today follow Dionysius in his view of authorship, the external evidence seems overwhelmingly supportive of the traditional view.  (From the NIV Bible Commentary, page 1922)"



Quote
NO NEED TO ARGUE THIS EVEN OF RECENT MUSLIMS ARE NOW USING JESUS NAME "PROPHET ISAH" TO PRAY IN THEIR MOSQUE. SO LET'S LEAVE EVERYTHING TO GOD ALMIGHTY TO JUDGE


Can you please provide how they have been using same?




@Nwando

I provided you a link to the compilation of the Holy Quran but you ignored same. I have helped you by bringing it out for you to read.


The Holy Quran

The Holy Quran is a book revealed from Allah (swt) to his messenger, Prophet Muhammed (saw) when he was forty years of age. First verses were revealed on the 610 A.D. equivalent to 27th Ramadhan.

First five verses revealed on the 27th of Ramadhan were the part of Suratul-alaq

Quran 96v1-5:
1. Read in the name of your Lord, who created
2. He created man from a clot
3. Read and your Lord is Most Honourable
4. Who taught (to write) with pen.
5. Taught man wha he knew not

Quran after the death of the Prophet (saw)

Quran was not in a book form in the lifetime of Prophet Muhammed (saw) because:

1. All the Sahaba (Companions) memorised it and they thought that every muslim must  memorise it like them.

2. There are 9 days interval between the last verse of the Quran and the death of the receiver (Prophet Muhammed saw)

3. The scrolls of the Quran were not in the same place because the chapters were not revealed at the same time.

Quran in the time of Abubakr

After the death of the Prophet (saw), Abu Bakr became the successor and became the leader and commander of the muslim world. He reigned for 2 years (632 A.D-634 A.D). During his time, Umar advised him to make the Quran in a book form because a large number of men who knew the Quran by heart had fallen as matyrs in the Battle of Yamama.  This was fought against Musaylma al-Kazzab, who had denounced Islam and claimed to be a prophet after Prophet Muhammed (saw).

So, Umar went to see Abu Bakr and they both agreed and called Zayd bin Thabit who used to write the revelations down for the prophet (saw).

Zayd first disagreed but later agreed later and Abu Bakr called all memorizers (Huffaz) of the Quran to come and read by heart and at the same time, he sent for the materials (skin, slabs of stones etc) on which Qurian verses were written.

For those who had memorised it, they tried to write the Quran down by heart, out of fifteen of them, Abdullahi bin Mash'ud's own was ost perfect, others had forgotten parts of the Quran.

A panel was set up with Abu Bakr himself as the chairman and the writers were

1. Zayd bin Thabit (Leader)
2. Abdul-Rahamn bin Harith
3. Saad bin Al-as
4. Abdullahi bin Zubayr

When the finished, they called the best reader and memorizer of the Quran, Abdullahi Mash'uud to come and recite the Quran while the remaining writers and memorizers looked through the one they wrote. Suprisingly, nothing was different.

This is how the Quran was collected in one place without any mistake.

The exit of the Holy Quran to other lands

In the lifetime of Abu Bakr, the Quran was collected and kept with Hafsah. Whoever feel like benefitting from the reading of the Quran from the compiled copy must come to the Sahaba in Mecca, but in the time of another Caliph of Islam, things changed for the better.

Quran in the time of Uthman (R.A.T)

Uthman was the successor to Umar.He became the commander after the death of Umar who reigned after Abu Bakr. His tenure of office was 644 A.D-656 A.D.

During his time, differences in reading the Quran became obvious, because ISLAM had spread to many states.

Then Uthman called for the copy of the original Quran collected at the time of Abu Bakr and ordered
1. Zayd bin Thabit
2. Abdullahi bin Zubair
3. Sa'ad bin Al'aas
4. Abdul Rahman bin Harith bin Hishaam
to re-write the manuscripts of the Quran in a very neat, decent and readable way. The writers did their work perfectly and successfully without a single error.

They wrote five copies of the Quran and Uthman sent a copy each to Islamic States namely:

One copy to Damascus.
One to Kuffa
One to Basra
One to Medina (Yathrib)
last copy remained in Mecca including the former one.

Journey of the Quran to the press

Quran was forst printed in Block print form, that was around the tenth century (1,000A.D). The system was to make the wooden blocks, then stamp it on materials like paper.

In 1143 A.D, the holy Quran was first translated from Arabic to Latin by the instructions of a man called PETER THE VENERABLE in Europe and that was the first translation of the Quran from Arabic to any other language.

With that translation, bothj muslims and non-muslims especially those Latin speakers startd to know the words of the Quran, they (christians among them) even knew the facts about the many doubts that they discovered from the bible and they tried using the Quran in correcting them.

System of printing press with movable type started in many parts of the world and that was around sixteenth century (1,600 A.D)

In Hamburg (Germany), the Quran was printed in 1694. The Quran was printed by Christians but carefully monitored by the muslims.

Malay Uthman edition of the Quran was published  in Petersburg (Russia) in 1787 A.D.

1828 A.D., Kazan printed the Quran
1833 A.D, Persia also printed the Quran
1877 A.D., Istanbul joined them in the printing of the Quran
1858 A.D, The so-called "Fluegel edition" of the Quran was printed by the German Orientalist
1925 A.D, The so-called 'Egyptian edition' of the Quran was printed in Cairo with the financial aid of King Fa'ad of Saudi Arabia and it was distributed free of charge.

Evidence that the Quran is a complete book of Allah

Quran 41v42: No falsehood can approach it from before or behind it, it is sent down by one full of wisdom, worthy of all praise

Quran 15v9: We have sent dwn the message without doubt, and we will surely guard it  (from corruption)

Also read Quran 10v37-38, 2v23-24

More evidence that all the parts of the Quran were collected completely

1. The written down was during the time of the Prophet
2. The collection was in the presence of Hiffaz.
3.All parts of the revelation are available in written form.
4. The material on which the revelation was written were loose writing materials, making it easy to arrange them in good order.
5. Quran was revealed in simple and pure Arabic Language and it is very understandable to all companions of the prophet (saw).
6.Allah (swt) himself sent Jubril (Angel Gabriel) to go through all the revelation with prophet Muhammed (saw) in Ramadhan. This was done twice in the year the prophet died.
7. The Quran was well guarded by the Sahaba ,they did not betray what they loved.

Based on the above, if you still say, its not complete, I will advise you give me a verse in a quran that is not present in another just like the bible.

Nothing as simple as that.



Let me serve just a tip on plagiarism from your holy book


1

"I am the goal of life, the LORD and support of all, the inner witness, the abode of all. I am the only refuge, the ONE true friend; I am the beginning, the staying, and the end of creation; I am the womb and the eternal seed. I am heat; I give and withhold the rain. I am immortality and I am death; I am what is and what is not" [Bhagavad Gita 9:18-19]

 
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. (Revelations 1:Cool

 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. (Revelations 22:13)

 

(2)

He walks upon the water without parting it, as if on solid ground. ANGUTTARA NIKAYA 3.60 , " (Buddha)

And in the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea. (Mark 14:25, John 6:19)

 
(3)

 "In everything do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the law and the prophets." (Matthew 7:12)

 “What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow man: this is the whole law, the rest is commentary”. (Hyam Maccoby quotes Hillel in Revolution in Judea: p266)

4

But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold. They said to you, "In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires." These are the men who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit. (Jude 1:17-19)

First of all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires. (2 Peter 2:3)

 
I still have more for you
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #40 on: December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM »

Give a proof from the Torah or Talmud. (The first Commandment, itself proves that Christians are Idol worshippers! lol.

not hear say (Alot of Jews say that Christians are idol worshippers, taking a mere human being as their God or 1/3 God. Either way, it is BAD!

Or forever hold your peace
I'm getting rather disgusted with all your lies.

It must be an act of "jihad" for a grown man to tell blatant lies. (I restrain myself. To do what is right, always. It is my Jihad. A big struggle.

The main difference between Jews and Christians and is that Jews believe Christ was just a teacher not the promised messiah. (No practicing Jew reckon with him. Jesus son of Mary, that is.

They are still waiting for a MessiahBut we know that Christ fulfilled all those prophecies by Isaiah,Jeremiah,Amos and Ezekiel. (Christians did not know when their comforter/the spirit of truth arrived. Muhammad fulfilled every last details: He reminded all which are true about Jesus, denied the falsehood about him and his mother Mary. He praised Jesus as one prophet should praise another. He taught what Jesus did not teach. lol.

A lot of Jews have also turned to Christ by those same prophecies,they are called Messianic Jews,Jews for Christ ETC.
Use your google my dear. (Jewish people take up many crazy religions. Many of them are Buddhists, and others. Christianity does not have exclusivity about this strange phenomenon. I have many friends who are Jewish and Muslims.
 
 
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I'm a lover not a fighter. (I am the President of Nigeria. My case is more believeable.
 
 
nwando
USA - God's own country
Posts: 1088

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  Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #17 on: Today at 05:25:26 PM »  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And this is the clincher.
Thousands of Jews have believed in Christ by this singular passage in the Torah.


Isaiah 53
 1 Who has believed our message (Our means many, aint? Who are the speakers? Look fishy to me. There is no clarity of anything. No name, no nothing.
      
 and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed? (No name. It could anybody. After Isiah onward. That is if it is a true statement in the first place.

 2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot, (Whats the meaning of all of this? You guess it, no name and no one is referred to particularly. Make your own interpretation.
      
 and like a root out of dry ground. (The same condition applies!
      
 He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, (Jesus son of Mary is described to be handsome. If that is true, this clearly does not apply to him.
      
 nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. (Unless anyone can prove that Jesus was ugly, this does not apply to him.

 3 He was despised and rejected by men, (Most of Jesus close associates are men. Look at the 12 apostles. All are men, literarily. lol.
      
a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. (Jesus never suffered any distress in his entire life until the Christians said he was arrested and crucified. How can we ascribe suffering to him, who was pamperred/ Having the luxury of a young and devoted mother and a hardworking stepfather?
      
 Like one from whom men hide their faces (Did not fit a very handsome man

       he was despised, and we esteemed him not. (Not Jesus. He was handsome.

 4 Surely he took up our infirmities
       and carried our sorrows, (At the end of Tauba, we read about the concern of Muhammad for the believers and people in general.
      
 yet we considered him stricken by God, (I see something that even the Christians of NL can't deny. Many of them have said bad things about Muhammad. If this is the test of it all, then Muhammad won hands down!
    
 smitten by him, and afflicted. (same condition.

 5 But he was pierced for our transgressions, (Didn't Muhammad suffer some wounds in battles, and even in Taif?
       he was crushed for our iniquities;
       the punishment that brought us peace was upon him,
       and by his wounds we are healed. (All of these above fit MyMuhammadore than any human that ever walked the surface of the earth!

 6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray, (The  Arabs were gathered together for the very first time in their history
    
  each of us has turned to his own way; (They had 360 idols in Ka aba lone. Yet other tribes had, Al Uzza, Al lait, etc. The famous 3 daughters? lol
       and the LORD has laid on him
      
 the iniquity of us all. (Yet Jesus could not cover even those who believed his demise. But in Muhammad, the access to God Almighty is direct connection. One on one without intermediary. The process of intermediary is paganic. Without any doubt.

 7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
       yet he did not open his mouth;
       he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
       and as a sheep before her shearers is silent,
       so he did not open his mouth. (Was this not the condition of Muhammad and his followers for 13 years in Makka? Was this not the reason they emigrated?

 8 By oppression [a] and judgment he was taken away.
       And who can speak of his descendants? (Surah Azhab: Muhammad is a father of any of you men! That answers the question.
      
 For he was cut off from the land of the living; (Muhammad died and his grave is known to BILLIONS!
      
 for the transgression of my people he was stricken. [b] (Just to amuse the amuser; Didn't the Christins say that he was popoisonWhy? Was it not because he brought a religion/a way that is direct to God, without Crookedness and Ethnicity?

 9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
       and with the rich in his death,
       though he had done no violence,
       nor was any deceit in his mouth. (Muhammad was buried next to Abu Bakr and Umar, on opposite sides. Umar was leading a reckless life until he accepted Islam at the age of 26. Islam brought brotherhood and sense of purpose and a focus to One God, instead of 360!

 10 Yet it was the LORD's will to crush him and cause him to suffer, (But the Christians say that Jesus is God!
      
and though the LORD makes [c] his life a guilt offering, (How can God make another God a guilty offering? It does not fit Jesus!
      
he will see his offspring and prolong his days, (How? Jesus never was a 40 year old man. He was not matured and never married! Not Jesus.
      
and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand. (Your Lord God is One: Laa ilaha ilallah. Thats Islamic. Christianity is 3 in 1 deal.

 11 After the suffering of his soul,
       he will see the light of life [d] and be satisfied [e] ;
       by his knowledge [f] my righteous servant will justify many,
       and he will bear their iniquities. (Muhammad is given the right of intercession to all believers, when no prophet can take up that responsibility.

 12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great, [g]
       and he will divide the spoils with the strong, [h]
       because he poured out his life unto death,
       and was numbered with the transgressors.
       For he bore the sin of many,
       and made intercession for the transgressors. (How can God occupy any of this? Unless he is not God, but a servant. Muhammad is that servant.
 
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davidylan (m)
Rochester, NY
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  Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #18 on: Today at 05:29:26 PM »  

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Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
In Surah Safaat, Isa bin Mariam's roles, included the announcement of the prophet
who's name is Ahmad. Your accusation of plagiarism, is unfounded, in a spiritual
sense. Afterall, we acknowledge Jesus son of Mary as a Prophet of his LORD God.


BUT in the same vein you accuse the bible of being unreliably corrupted. How then can the words of a "corrupt" bible be part of the "Revelations" from allaAllah (In the Bible there are some truth. The Qur'an and Hadith support them. These are the verses we believe. The rest we have no opinion, unless the they are the 3 in 1 deal, etc, which Islam opposes.


Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
The people of Torah say the same thing about you. They call you idol worshippers.


the torah says no such thing neither do the Jews. They may be doing so in the deluded minds of muslMuslims The Jews have said it many times. The first few commandments from the 10 commandments are proofs that Christianity is Idol worshipping.


Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
I believe that they are correct. Further, you relegate a giant prophet, in the
personality of Moses, the one who his Lord spoke to, many times, without an Angel.


why then could allaAllah speak to mohaMohammadHOUT an angel? (In the journey of Muhammad to heavens and returning the same night, Muhammad had a one on one with God. In this occasion he received the last 4 verses of Surah baqarah and he was also given the complete prosess of Salah. He did not see God physically, but heard His voice. This is the same situation that happened with Moses.


Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
to a mere Biblical Patriarch. You did the same to Ibrahim, the father of pure faith, who
his Lord called His personal friend!

1. Your description of abraIbrahimthe father of faith is not to be found anywhere in your quran but is merely a plagiarism of the book of Genesis and Hebrews . . . a book written by the same Paul you accuse of destroying chriChristianityurah An Am, towards the end of it, Ibrahim, praised Alla and said that he was the first to be Muslim, bowing his will to Allah.

What "faith" do the lMuslims k about when they refer to Ibrahim the father of pure faith? (That God is One. God accepts everyone. There is no superiority by tribe, or a three godhead(s) passing up for One True God!

2. Allah must be confused . . . how could he call abraIbrahim "personal friend" when even Mohammad but a slave to the same Allahere IN THE QURAN did Allah to Ibrahim his "personal friend"? Copying Hebrews again alhaji? (Ibrahim Kalillah. I will get the verse and the Surah for the benefit of the NLanders. Its Surah Nisaa verse 125. It is a comprehensive verse and everyone should read it. Ibrahim was upright.


Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
Allah says in the Qur'an that the earlier prophets served as examples to Muhammad;


1. We know that the biblical prophets were not examples to Mohammad (People have the right to judge. But the Judgement of God is final.

2. Whenever the biblical men of God used words from other prophets, they made sure to credit the source by clearly stating . . . "it is written". Even Jesus Christ credited Isaiah with his own words. (Muhammad is in a higher class. He was told by God to say whatever came out of him mouth. It started  with Recite/Proclaim; Iqra! Allah does not play defense with any of His Creations.

Muhammad on the other hand simply copied these tales he heard from the likes of waraqa and dressed them up as "revelations" from Allah (Waraqa must have forgotten to tell him about the apple that Adam and his wife eat. He must not have told Muhammad that it was a serpent that made them eat the apple. Waraqa must have known about Surah Abasa, Iklas, Falaq, Nas, Fatiha, Fajir, Fath, Lahab and many many more.


Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
Why ask why? They were both slaves of Allah,


but abraham was allaAllah'srsonal friend"? Are you this confused? (A slave can be a friend of the  Master. Ask the House n, !


Quote from: olabowale on Today at 02:08:20 PM
holding prophetic and messengership
offices, as leaders succeeding after each other. Links in the long chain of prophethood.


and you think this is  valid excuse for mohaMohammad'seit?  (If there was a deceit, Allah said He would have cut him off, seize him by the jugular and his punishment would have been the double of anyone ever to be punished. If there was a deceit, he would never have told anyone about Surah Abasa. If there is any deceit he would never have told anyone about the issue of Zaid and Zainab!

There is no god but Allah the Almighty God the Creator alone. And Muhammad is is Prophet and the final Messenger!
 
 
 
focused (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #41 on: December 11, 2007, 10:25 PM »

@Olabowale :

How are you sure this revelation Muhammed (pbuh or sws) got was from God and not from the devil ? It doesn't matter if it took him 23 years for him to comply this satanic verses.  What proof do you have to show that it is truly from God?

The bible says do not believe all spirits but test it and know if they are from God or not. The devil can transform into an angel of light just to deceive people.

I don't think the revelation Muhammed (pbuh or sws ) got is from God because ever since Islamic religion has been founded, Arab muslims and other muslims (wannabe arabs) acts like psychotic donkeys. By their fruit we shall know them.

All muslims are called to carried to carry out Jihad. So any muslim who don't have an urge to kill people or any muslim who is not blood thirsty is not a true muslim.

So you can see the reason why the Northern Nigeria muslims don't regard Yoruba muslims as true muslims, because the Yoruba muslims are very liberal with the religion while the Hausa muslims acts exactly like psychotic donkeys.
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #42 on: December 11, 2007, 10:27 PM »

@Oluwolexy: I will simply say; Come again to your entry. It just did not make any sense.
But of course, the Christians are going to call one another and pile up to defend the
indefensible. You read translated Qur'an, then it sounded as if it is Bible written in another language. Okay.
Then tell me what language is your Bible written in? Rather what language is the Bible that you have that the
English translated Qur'an sounded so similar, but only in a foreign language?

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, OLABOWALE I DON'T UNDERSTAND YOU B'because THE 1ST TIME I WAS OPPORTUNED TO READ TRANSLATED ENGLISH QURAN I WAS SURPRISED THAT IT IS MORE OR LESS BIBLICAL MESSAGES WRITTEN IN ANOTHER LANGUAGE BESIDES THAT MOHAMMED WAS A KNOWN SMUGGLER BEFORE HE WAS CONVERTED. THE ONLY BIBLE RECORDED REVELATION PROPHET IS JOHN THAT LED HIM INTO WRITTEN OR HAVING A WAY OF DOCUMENTING MESSAGES HE RECEIVED FROM ABOVE WHEREAS B'because JESUS CHRIST HAS SUPERIOR POWER OVER ANY HUMAN BEINGS THAT HAVE LIVE TO DATE, INSPIRATIONS AND REVELATION FLOW FROM HIM NATURALLY. NO NEED TO ARGUE THIS EVEN OF RECENT MUSLIMS ARE NOW USING JESUS NAME "PROPHET ISAH" TO PRAY IN THEIR MOSQUE. SO LET'S LEAVE EVERYTHING TO GOD ALMIGHTY TO JUDGE
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #43 on: December 11, 2007, 10:36 PM »

@Focused: All that the Christians have is srength in large number! You will see how
everybody will be vcoming out of the woodwork, but not to dialogue but to attack.

@Olabowale :

How are you sure this revelation Muhammed (pbuh or sws) got is from God and not from the devil ? It doesn't matter if he got it for 23 years or not. What proof do you have to show that it is truly from God. (The same could be said about the New Testament. Afterall the jews discounted Jesus! I do not have to proof anything to you. The burden of proof is upon the accuser(s)!

The bible says do not believe all spirits but test it and know if they are from God or not. The devil can transform into an angel of light just to deceive people. (Only if I believe the Bible at all. The Jews never believed it. Thats a good proof that you got nothing.

I don't think the revelation Muhammed (pbuh or sws ) got is from God because ever since Islamic religion has been founded, Arab muslims and other muslims (wannabe arabs) acts like psychotic donkeys. By their fruit we shall know them. (Operative word; Think. You do not think. That is your statement. But the Christians are Jews wanabes or Roman/ greek wanabes? take your pick.

All muslims are called to carried to carry out Jihad. So any muslim who don't have an urge to kill people or Any muslim who is not blood thirsty is not a true muslim. (You sound like a person who needs to put a thinking cap on,
davidylan (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #44 on: December 11, 2007, 11:52 PM »

Quote from: babs787 on December 11, 2007, 09:34 PM
Please did John actually wrote the Gospel of John based on the below verses?


"And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou? (From the King James Version Bible, John 1:19)"

"John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (From the King James Version Bible, John 1:26)"

"For John was not yet cast into prison. (From the King James Version Bible, John 3:24)"

Just a sample of your duplicity. . . the john being refered to in those 3 quotations was John the Baptist. The gospel of John was written by John the beloved (an apostle of Jesus Christ).
davidylan (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #45 on: December 11, 2007, 11:56 PM »

hmmm the usual islamic tactic, they paste rambling and often times meaningless long monologues in order to drown out their ignorance. Of course since no one is bothered to read through their entire pile of piffle the thread most often times dies a natural death. Its a tactic that has worked several times over.

People who indeed know who they are and what they believe would reply succintly. Not so for the slaves of the idol of the kaaba. Perhaps they think by their much speaking they will be heard.
davidylan (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #46 on: December 12, 2007, 12:56 AM »

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
Isaiah 53
  3 He was despised and rejected by men, (Most of Jesus close associates are men. Look at the 12 apostles. All are men, literarily. lol.
 
     

and the pharisees, saducees, scribes, priests were all women i suppose?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. (Jesus never suffered any distress in his entire life until the Christians said he was arrested and crucified. How can we ascribe suffering to him, who was pamperred/ Having the luxury of a young and devoted mother and a hardworking stepfather?
 
   

1. i suppose your own idea of "luxury" is to be born in a manger among cows and donkeys.
2. Mathew 8:20 And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.
3. He had to create coins in the mouth of a fish to pay his taxes.
4. he needed to borrow a colt to ride into Jerusalem . . .

Sir alhaji, Jesus was not dirt poor but to LIE that He was pampered and born into a life of luxury is to deny Him just as the anti-christ spirit behind islam has done for 1400 years.

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
Like one from whom men hide their faces (Did not fit a very handsome man

       he was despised, and we esteemed him not. (Not Jesus. He was handsome.

who told you?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
4 Surely he took up our infirmities
       and carried our sorrows, (At the end of Tauba, we read about the concern of Muhammad for the believers and people in general.
     

Verse 4 is talking about a much deeper spiritual experience than merely "showing concern".
perhaps Sura 17:91 is allah's idea of "showing concern".

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
yet we considered him stricken by God, (I see something that even the Christians of Nairaland can't deny. Many of them have said bad things about Muhammad. If this is the test of it all, then Muhammad won hands down!
     

If Isaiah 53 is speaking about mohammed then based on some of your earlier responses, the question arises . . . was mohammed ugly?
According to the hadith: He was fair of complexion and altogether was so handsome that Abu Bakr composed this couplet on him:
"as there is no darkness in the moonlit night so is Mustafa, the well-wisher, bright."


How then has mohammed "won hands down"? Is it not a shame and proof that islam is false that you would struggle so hard to force mohammed into the very pages of a book you told us is corrupted?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions, (Didn't Muhammad suffer some wounds in battles, and even in Taif?
       he was crushed for our iniquities;
       the punishment that brought us peace was upon him,
       and by his wounds we are healed. (All of these above fit MyMuhammadore than any human that ever walked the surface of the earth!

1. mohammed indeed suffered wounds in battle but NONE of them was suffered on your behalf.
2. If indeed all the above "fit mohammed" then answer the following questions:
 a. was mohammed crushed for YOUR sins?
 b. was mohammed punnished for YOUR peace?
 c. Did mohammed EVER heal you, himself or ANY of his companions who fell in battle with him? How then could the wounds he suffered in battle avail for your healing?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray, (The  Arabs were gathered together for the very first time in their history
 
   

If the term "we all" here refers ONLY to arabs then what is your position as a non-arab muslim?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
  the iniquity of us all. (Yet Jesus could not cover even those who believed his demise. But in Muhammad, the access to God Almighty is direct connection. One on one without intermediary. The process of intermediary is paganic. Without any doubt.

But dear old mohammed required an intermediary to recieve "revelations" from allah eh?  Shocked

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
For he was cut off from the land of the living; (Muhammad died and his grave is known to BILLIONS!
     

Mohammed died and perished forever . . . Christ conquered the grave! Amen!

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
1. Your description of abraIbrahimthe father of faith is not to be found anywhere in your quran but is merely a plagiarism of the book of Genesis and Hebrews . . . a book written by the same Paul you accuse of destroying chriChristianity
urah An Am, towards the end of it, Ibrahim, praised Alla and said that he was the first to be Muslim, bowing his will to Allah.

don't try to wriggle out of your dishonest piffle. You claimed earlier that Ibrahim was regarded as the friend of allah, i ask that you show us in the quran and this is all you can come up with in response? Is this not a direct proof that you were merely copying the biblical description of Abraham in Genesis and Hebrews while trying to smuggle it into your quran?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
What "faith" do the lMuslims k about when they refer to Ibrahim the father of pure faith? (That God is One. God accepts everyone. There is no superiority by tribe, or a three godhead(s) passing up for One True God!

this is your definition of "faith"? Based on this the islamic Adam had more of a claim to being the "father of faith" than Ibrahim.

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
2. Allah must be confused . . . how could he call abraIbrahim "personal friend" when even Mohammad but a slave to the same Allahere IN THE QURAN did Allah to Ibrahim his "personal friend"? Copying Hebrews again alhaji? (Ibrahim Kalillah. I will get the verse and the Surah for the benefit of the NLanders. Its Surah Nisaa verse 125. It is a comprehensive verse and everyone should read it. Ibrahim was upright.

Allah The Most High said “And who can be better in religion than one who SUBMITS his face (himself) to Allah (follows Allah’s religion of montheism) and he is a muhsin.” Surah An-Nisaa, verse 125.

Alhaji, where in that verse did allah call ibrahim his best friend?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
2. Whenever the biblical men of God used words from other prophets, they made sure to credit the source by clearly stating . . . "it is written". Even Jesus Christ credited Isaiah with his own words. (Muhammad is in a higher class. He was told by God to say whatever came out of him mouth. It started  with Recite/Proclaim; Iqra! Allah does not play defense with any of His Creations.

again, mohammed is in a higher class? From the same liars who tell us they make NO distinction among prophets?  Shocked
mohammed was in a "higher class" so he had every right to plagiarise the bible and decieve millions?

How could mohammed claim to be in a "higher class" when he did not have the priviledge to speak face to face with "god", the priviledge the likes of Abraham and Moses enjoyed?

Quote from: olabowale on December 11, 2007, 10:05 PM
but abraham was allaAllah'srsonal friend"? Are you this confused? (A slave can be a friend of the  Master. Ask the House n, !

where did allah categorically say so IN THE QURAN? We've had enough of you dishonest charlatans just plucking anything from the air to support your falsehood.
There is no where that a slave is the friend of the master, else he ceases to be a slave.
Kobojunkie
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #47 on: December 12, 2007, 02:04 AM »

You said you wished you had patience as this dude does. I will say this, @Davidlyan, you seem to have just as much patience as he does. I mean I see the way you go at it with him most everyday in here on different threads. After about a week reading his reponses tp posts, I got tired of the way he constantly avoids the main topic and goes in the same old rant fests. You and Nwando seem to be a relentless duo in here.  Shocked

GOOD LUCK!!
davidylan (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #48 on: December 12, 2007, 02:12 AM »

Quote from: Kobojunkie on December 12, 2007, 02:04 AM
You said you wished you had patience as this dude does. I will say this, @Davidlyan, you seem to have just as much patience as he does. I mean I see the way you go at it with him most everyday in here on different threads. After about a week reading his reponses tp posts, I got tired of the way he constantly avoids the main topic and goes in the same old rant fests. You and Nwando seem to be a relentless duo in here. Shocked

GOOD LUCK!!

my brother, its so difficult to sit by and watch these grown men attempt to hoodwink us with that false cult called islam. Even me sef my patience has a limit.  Grin
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #49 on: December 12, 2007, 02:20 AM »

The madness of people who called a mere servant of God his son, Him, 1/3 of Him!

You will see them tripping over one another. The best way we should conduct
this conversation however, is that we keep every entry short, if you intend a honest
dialogue. First, I believe there some truth in the Bible. Whatever the Qur'an substantiates
from the Bible is true, in a general sense. Whatever Qur'an is against is false. Whatever
Qur'an has no opinion on, it is neither here nor there for me.

Since the topic is about Muhammad (as), and the Qur'an being somewhat a carbon copy of
what is in the Bible, then the Christians must have to law out their argument for it. The
burden of proof is always on the one who makes the accusation.

@Davidylan,

Quote
we simply ask a question . . . WHY did mohammed have to plagiarise the bible? (There are 114 Chapters in the Qur'an, which chapter(s) would you point out that is plagiarised from either the OT or NT? List your chapters and lets take them one at a time. By the way, the OT clearly disagree with the NT! The Jews do not have anything to do with NT, in their Taurah. Talmud is another story, a document that was not revealed to Moses. It is the Christians who want to associate themselves with the Jews, at all cost.

Because a lie must rest on the crutches of truth in order to appear more as a realistic piece of fakery. (The NT is borrowing heavily from the OT. It is the Christians who are guilty of what they are accusing the Muslims. Now, law out your proof, that is if you have anything to say?

Suratul Fatiha is a very good beginning. How is this from the Bible? Or do you prefer to start from Suratul Nas? Or just name what your Surah is and let us discuss it!
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #50 on: December 12, 2007, 02:36 AM »

1. i suppose your own idea of "luxury" is to be born in a manger among cows and donkeys. (Muhammad's Father died before he was born. So he hit the ground running as a fatherless Child, in a Patriarchal society!

2. Mathew 8:20 And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head. (With all the creme de la creme of his followership, it is ironic that he did not have a place to lay his head! Most prophet sufferred the same condition!

3. He had to create coins in the mouth of a fish to pay his taxes. (Muhammad had to tie 2 stones to his own stomach so that  he may looked full. He sometimes had to eat rough bread and water, with salt. He eat one date for a whole day, sometimes. These were the days of opulence. What about many days in a roll that there was nothing to eat at all?

4. he needed to borrow a colt to ride into Jerusalem . . . (Muhammad's debt was paid off by his companion, several times. He became poor as he entered the office of Prophethood. He died very poor, even though, he used to be a successful business man/trader.

Sir alhaji, Jesus was not dirt poor but to LIE that He was pampered and born into a life of luxury is to deny Him just as the anti-Christ spirit behind Islam has done for 1400 years. (At least he was from a more affluenced background than his Successor, Muhammad (as)! He was never referred to as an unlettered!
Kobojunkie
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #51 on: December 12, 2007, 02:40 AM »

LMAO!!!!!!  Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Cheesy Grin
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #52 on: December 12, 2007, 02:51 AM »

If Isaiah 53 is speaking about mohammed then based on some of your earlier responses, the question arises . . . was mohammed ugly? (I only disproved you weak assertion that Isiah was talking about Jesus! It is not clear who he was referring to. However, from the Qur'an, the hadith and Sirah, I am very satisfied that Muhammad is the Prophet and Messenger of God. And Muhammad was the natural successor to Jesus son of Mary.

According to the hadith: He was fair of complexion and altogether was so handsome that Abu Bakr composed this couplet on him:
"as there is no darkness in the moonlit night so is Mustafa, the well-wisher, bright." (Alhamdulillah. Was Jesus Ugly then? If you can say for sure, since there is no picture of him, your argument will be not hold. Infact, the Christians represent Jesus, always by a very handsome man. Why if he was so ugly?

How then has mohammed "won hands down"? Is it not a shame and proof that islam is false that you would struggle so hard to force mohammed into the very pages of a book you told us is corrupted? (Whatever Qur'an certified about the Bible is true. We say your Bible is corrupt/watered down, yet we can see something from it, because Qur'an corroborate whatever is true in it.
Kobojunkie
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #53 on: December 12, 2007, 03:04 AM »

LMAO!!!!!!  Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Cheesy Grin

See what I mean?? It is like arguing with a senile old man??Smiley) LMAO!!! God forgive me !!!! You just wonder what the heck he is going on and on about !!!
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #54 on: December 12, 2007, 03:18 AM »

1. mohammed indeed suffered wounds in battle but NONE of them was suffered on your behalf.  (Am old enough to be your father. My bloodline is filled with Islam. If Muhammad did not suffered for me, Jesus never existed. And you know thats very untrue.

2. If indeed all the above "fit mohammed" then answer the following questions:
 a. was mohammed crushed for YOUR sins? (Muhammad left an unchanging Blueprint of how to connect directly to God. Without the usual middle man. Was Jesus crushed for your sins and yet you are not guaranteed Paradise, if you die performing adultery, or fornication,etc! His death therefore, if he was crushed is 100% in vain!

 b. was mohammed punnished for YOUR peace? (The disbelievers abused him and his followers for 13 years in Makka. That prompted some to leave Makka for Ethiopia, twice, then the last major Migration to Madina! Then the first 2 years in Medina was almost the same. Until the end of his life, there was always some group or individual eager to seek destructions of the young community.

 c. Did mohammed EVER heal you, himself or ANY of his companions who fell in battle with him? How then could the wounds he suffered in battle avail for your healing? (Surah Fatiha is healing in totality. In surah Nisaa, he revived a dying man so that the revelation on theman could be told to the man. There are other parts of Qur'an which are used for healing and protections for all kind of conditions. Indeed every part of Qur'an helps the heart,body and indeed the SOUL! Part of Surah Mariam, if recited, with other parts and with a great faith, a barren woman will get pregnant. InshaAllah.

As for me, I have always have whatever I asked for!

@Kobojunkie: With a name like yours no wonder, your comments deserves no real answer! Your problem is that  I must capitulate for you to know that I have any sense. I will be okay the way I am. It is you in your pump and pageantry who should be ready for the fire of Hell. The means which God Almighty will punish arrogant people like you, full of empty pride. See, I will not speak to you in Yoruba because you will not understand. I will be talking to a concrete wall.
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #55 on: December 12, 2007, 03:29 AM »

Allah The Most High said “And who can be better in religion than one who SUBMITS his face (himself) to Allah (follows Allah’s religion of montheism) and he is a muhsin.” Surah An-Nisaa, verse 125. (Dishonest is your middle name. You gave part of the verse. Can not be male enough to speak the truth for change?
Below is the whole verse: This is why I dislike these people's mannerism. They are never honest. They are naked in their lies. But they forget that Allah is capable to reveal their dishonest tricks! (Open any Qur'an, you will know the truth!) By this alone, we have been made victorious over you!

Who can be better in religion than one who submits his whole self to Allah, does good, and follows the way of Abraham the true in Faith? For Allah did take Abraham for a friend.
Kobojunkie
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #56 on: December 12, 2007, 03:31 AM »

Quote from: Kobojunkie on December 12, 2007, 03:04 AM
LMAO!!!!!! Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Grin Cheesy Cheesy Grin

See what I mean?? It is like arguing with a senile old man??Smiley) LMAO!!! God forgive me !!!! You just wonder what the heck he is going on and on about !!!
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #57 on: December 12, 2007, 03:42 AM »

again, mohammed is in a higher class? From the same liars who tell us they make NO distinction among prophets?   
mohammed was in a "higher class" so he had every right to plagiarise the bible and decieve millions?

How could mohammed claim to be in a "higher class" when he did not have the priviledge to speak face to face with "god", the priviledge the likes of Abraham and Moses enjoyed? (If I pick up talking drum and beat it till next week, whoever will not get it, will not get it! We explain a 1000time about Isra Miraj. It is as if we speak to a column of bricks.


Quote from: olabowale on Yesterday at 10:05:49 PM
but abraham was allaAllah'srsonal friend"? Are you this confused? (A slave can be a friend of the  Master. Ask the House n, !


where did allah categorically say so IN THE QURAN? We've had enough of you dishonest charlatans just plucking anything from the air to support your falsehood.
There is no where that a slave is the friend of the master, else he ceases to be a slave. (Ask the house Niggas. Friends and slave at the same time. Well, in the case of Ibrahim, he was a friend of Allah, because Allah says it is so. We also know in Surah An Am, verses 162 and 163, we see where he says he bows his will to his Lord, as a Muslim. I hope that honesty will prevail now that the cat is out of the bag.
olabowale (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #58 on: December 12, 2007, 03:51 AM »

Bahira—a Nestoraian Christian monk of the Syrian church (Nestorian/nestorite, sounds familiar?

Bahira was met in one single afternoon, when Muhammad was a little boy, under the custody
of his Uncle Abi Talib! So this little boy of less than 10 years old, was able to remember everything  30 years later! His
His plagiarised product is better than the Origin. We see that the Original never stops shifting position as
in revisions, editions, products of splinter  groups, eg the Mormons, the 7 days adventists, the orthodox groups,
the Jehovah witnesses, etc, etc. When do we expect to see a stable master piece? Never will it happen.

davidylan (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #59 on: December 12, 2007, 03:51 AM »

Quote from: olabowale on December 12, 2007, 02:20 AM
First, I believe there some truth in the Bible. Whatever the Qur'an substantiates
from the Bible is true, in a general sense. Whatever Qur'an is against is false. Whatever
Qur'an has no opinion on, it is neither here nor there for me.

huh? So the only parts of the bible that is true are the parts mohammad smuggled into his quran?  Shocked What sort of logic is the above?

Quote from: olabowale on December 12, 2007, 02:20 AM
There are 114 Chapters in the Qur'an, which chapter(s) would you point out that is plagiarised from either the OT or NT? List your chapters and lets take them one at a time.

There are TWO (2) glaring examples i pointed out with references on the very first page of this thread which you dishonestly skirted. Start from there!

Quote from: olabowale on December 12, 2007, 02:20 AM
By the way, the OT clearly disagree with the NT! The Jews do not have anything to do with NT, in their Taurah. Talmud is another story, a document that was not revealed to Moses. It is the Christians who want to associate themselves with the Jews, at all cost.

while the muslims struggle desperately to smuggle mohammed into the torah?
Where does the OT disagree with the NT? How many times do we see the book of psalms, Deuteronomy, Genesis, Exodus, Jonah e.t.c. quoted in the NT? Several times alhaji!
The christians don't associate themselves with the jews because they necessarily MUST as a crutch to support their faith, they do so because the God we serve brought forth His will through the people of the jews.

Quote from: olabowale on December 12, 2007, 02:20 AM
The NT is borrowing heavily from the OT. It is the Christians who are guilty of what they are accusing the Muslims. Now, law out your proof, that is if you have anything to say?

The NT and OT are bound within the very same book called the bible? How then can a book borrow from within itself? Baba, are you drinking this night?  Grin

Quote from: olabowale on December 12, 2007, 02:20 AM
Suratul Fatiha is a very good beginning. How is this from the Bible? Or do you prefer to start from Suratul Nas? Or just name what your Surah is and let us discuss it!

Start from the first example i gave you on page 1
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #60 on: December 12, 2007, 03:52 AM »

David please don't let Olabowole derail this thread.
That is his tactics.
I have given hard core evidence from the hadiths that several people helped write the Koran including friends,associates and christian neighbors.
They are devciating from the topic to save face.
Don't help them,
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #61 on: December 12, 2007, 03:55 AM »

like this one.

Volume 4, Book 56, Number 814:

Narrated Anas:

There was a Christian who embraced Islam and read Surat-al-Baqara and Al-Imran, and he used to write (the revelations) for the Prophet. Later on he returned to Christianity again and he used to say: "Muhammad knows nothing but what I have written for him." 
 
 
nwando
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #62 on: December 12, 2007, 03:56 AM »

The rest of the hadith shows Mohammed later had the man killed
davidylan (m)
Re: Muhammad, Plagiarism And Other Stories.
« #63 on: December 12, 2007, 03:57 AM »

Quote from: nwando on December 12, 2007, 03:52 AM
David please don't let Olabowole derail this thread.
That is his tactics.
I have given hard core evidence from the hadiths that several people helped write the Koran including friends,associates and christian neighbors.
They are devciating from the topic to save face.
Don't help them,


thank you my sister. I shall be on the sidelines awaiting alhaji's response.  Tongue