hdior:
The high septon dealt Cercie a big blow. No more trial by combat so that giant is as good as useless to her. She is on her own while Jamie is busy wasting time in Riverrun. Payback is a bitch Cercei.

lolz.....and cercei will now be like in ur face hdior..... hehehe....

Littlefinger as a younger chap..
Boy be pretty... Lol

Cersei Lannister certified this movie as what it really is Game of Thrones™ with the intro scenes. It's outstanding.

Just a wild thought....in that Cercei terrorist bombing wild fire scene...Margery martell actually saw the danger they were in....and even gave the high sparrow enuf reasons...and he obviously saw some sense in what she told him from his somewhat confused expression...he had een portrayed as a smart guy....how then did he end up so stupid and slow at that crucial time...thereby stopping everybody from trying to escape...PS...i know even if they ran d wild fire could've caught up with them but at least they would have tried nah....

Nihilist:


My point is actually not based on hindsight at all.

The Lords of the North had the foresight to realise that Jon Snow was going to lose to the Boltons, and decide to preserve the lives of their men by abstaining.

Sansa had the foresight to know that Jon would lose, and deliberately refused to enlist her forces under his leadership.

The only person to keep faith with him was a child who naturally isn't mature enough to fully understand the consequences of enlisting her men in a war they couldn't win.


This bit is particularly crucial because they all knew that this guy didn't have the men, the parentage or the acumen to take on the warden of thr north(by royal decree no less)

So what happened?

They fought, Jon lost, and was rescued by forces who he had neither summoned, nor had under control.

Does it sound logical that when he was shouting 'we fought, we won etc', that not a single person there would point out that he actually had to be rescued from his folly?

So Baelish just sat down there and let Jon share the credit, especially when littlefinger didn't even come to the battle for Jon?

my point has been simple, Jon has been making some pretty bad decisions, and his only backer up until ep 10 was a child....so why has no one called them out on this?

You seem to forget that other houses backed their claim, it wasn't only house mormont.

Asimiju:


One bottle of multi for you.

At the red wedding when the stack and their loyal men where slaughtered by (I have forgotten their names maybe I go rewatch the movie later) tywin lannister came to kingslanding shouting we won the battle as if he was at the red wedding. So you expect Jon to be shouting the knight of the val won when he was the one leading the battle or you think the knight of the val would have defeated Ramsey Bolton alone if not for Jon and his men who attack first living Ramsey with little men.

Lets say for example you got a contract and you paid 5 helpers for the job , when the job is done all credit will goes to the contractor not the helpers because if it wasn't for him the helpers won't be working in the site.

Jon may not be a good tactics but he is good at leading if na lie ask tormund.

You said Jon killed many of his men in the battle, didn't Ramsey kill more of his men than Jon. Even if Ramsey wins he Will not be able to defend winterfell from other enemies because he has little men, that why the knight of the val can easily defeat Ramsey.

Abeg I don tire to write.

My bro you try jare. Stop typing ....

semitunde:
For you guys questioning nihilist's prognosis; can any of you picture lady Mormon and battle of widlfire? Will she be with the imp motivating people ( and ultimately fighting), or with her mother, couched up under her, right before tywin opened the palace doors?

Would she even be allowed to go negotiations ala battle of bastereds ( she wasn't in the real fight).

What role would she have played had she been a queen in westeros during the battle of wildfire?

Also, consider the situation when tywin held a meeting of the small council in his office instead of the council chamber and didn't invite joffery the king; in spite of joffery's protestations and weyrey; he was still made to understand- in more eaye than one that he's also just the grandson, and probably a foolish one at that.

If Lady Mormont was in this situation, what would have happened differently?

Cc.blackjack21, gbola5

I didn't want to pitch in at first but y not...

When Robb went to war, who was lord of winterfell? Bran right? Was he not a kid?

The truth is that leadership is learned. She was probably groomed into the position from a very young age and also she had 2 men beside her to make up for what she lacked in maturity and experience. There is nothing wrong with her ruling.

JhyMedex:

Hahaha.. Endy abt D chics part.. U can only speak 4 ursef...
Meanwhile u cld b gud enof 2 explain y u tink it's nt luv... Instead of blatantly stating it...

I think it was a look of reverence. If you read meaning to their conversation, you'd see that his look was that of awe towards her. He even admitted that he didn't believe in anything before because of what he thought it did to people, but couldn't help believing in her. He BELIEVES in her. He wants to serve her. He wants to make sure her reign is long. This is the first time Tyrion has thrown his weight behind anyone for the throne. He doesn't love her.

Graviton2:


I wanted to argue about only humans being able to become white walkers but I remembered those zombie horses the Night King and his guys were riding! If one dragon turns into a white walker - Game over!

What will it be spitting out? Ice flame?

siempere:
Just a wild thought....in that Cercei terrorist bombing wild fire scene...Margery martell actually saw the danger they were in....and even gave the high sparrow enuf reasons...and he obviously saw some sense in what she told him from his somewhat confused expression...he had een portrayed as a smart guy....how then did he end up so stupid and slow at that crucial time...thereby stopping everybody from trying to escape...PS...i know even if they ran d wild fire could've caught up with them but at least they would have tried nah....

I had a little problem with that scee too, why weren't people allowed to go out? Wasn't attendance of that session voluntary for a lot of people there? Unless it was cercei that owned the soldiers that prevented people from going out.

I mean, if you want to take a piss, will you stand there and do it?

Winter is here!!!
The white walkers are coming with the storm.
Will khalessi's dragons be able to conquer?

semitunde:


I had a little problem with that scee too, why weren't people allowed to go out? Wasn't attendance of that session voluntary for a lot of people there? Unless it was cercei that owned the soldiers that prevented people from going out.

I mean, if you want to take a piss, will you stand there and do it?

The high Sparrow got too cocky. He was already feeling like some false king with all the control. For him, Cercei can't disobey the gods and others can't just walk out in that fashion during a trial. If only he was humble enough to listen to Margery.

losprince:


Battles Have Been Won Against Greater Odds!

Nobody knew jon would let his emotions get the best of him, If they stuck to their plan there was hope of victory for them.

Exactly... the original plan was never to get Surrounded or 'enveloped' (as Jon put it). They were meant to face their opponents head on but like we already know emotions got the best of Jon.

"and JON SNOW wept"

Had to watch episode 9 for the third time this morning. Kit and Iwan are such good actors, their facial expressions from 35:50-36:12...was just epic. Jon was like..' Unbelievable!! Seriously Ramsey? Can you be this heartless?? YOURE SO DEAD!!!"

Ramsey: You've seen nothing yet...this is just an introduction, bring it on!!


Miguel Sapochnik will be one sort after director, all the GOT episodes he's handled so far have been hits

semitunde:


I had a little problem with that scee too, why weren't people allowed to go out? Wasn't attendance of that session voluntary for a lot of people there? Unless it was cercei that owned the soldiers that prevented people from going out.

I mean, if you want to take a piss, will you stand there and do it?

Yeah.....something was amiss in that scene for sure.... I hope d show directors explain it someday...

oyetpel:

Was frustrated when the guy said should they write 3 months later like naija movies, and another one saying some people want GoT to be showing them when Dany wakes in the morning, eat breakfast and other sh!t to i got to replied that in their face. But my point is even if there is no dialog during road travel or characters going to other places, they should just depict it somehow. Can you imagine someone here even said the Iron Island (Pyke) is not far from Meeren, and that's how Yara and Theon got to Meeren so fast. Another thing is if you watch closely lack of reportage in time travel started in season 6. So maybe its because they didn't have G.R.R.M book 6 and they were also twisting and doing hollywood on characters

Oga, there is no time travel in the show. It has already been talked about here that the timeliness are not concurrent. They don't happen at the same exact moment in spacetime. It has nothing to do with GRRM. It's just budget issues most likely. People have been complaining about it even from the beginning so, your GRRM point is invalid. How do you want them to show it? They are practically squeezing in months of real time into 45 mins.


The timelines are not concurrent, plain and simple.

semitunde:


Good points. But you also have to admit that was the direction of the writters. Margery probably had a better plan than Jon but we'll never know...

The writer hinged Jon's win of the bastard battle on one thing, luck.

That wasn't really luck. We knew right from time that Sansa might summon the Knights. They were always going to come so far Sansa asked. It's not like they just showed up uninvited

Gbola5:


Joffrey didn't attend council meetings because he never felt the need too. If he wanted no one would stop him. Well she's to young to be in the real fight, but that doesn't equal crouching behind her mother's
skirts. If you can come up with a scenerio in which she was queen, would there be a Battle of Blackwater ? The events that lead up to it would be changed in that scenrio.

Couldn't agree more. I don't really get the guy's argument. We have already seen that she is capable of ruling. She is wise. She was obligated to answer the call and gave only 62 men. If it were Ramsay, he would have murdered the other lords for not answering.

Nihilist:


Jon didnt win the battle, Vale knights did.
Jon has no men, the Vale boys do.

It makes no sense that the lords of the north would trust their men to a reckless commander who had to be rescued by another house.

I mean, if even Sansa can't trust the dullard, how on earth are the nothern lords so eager to trust him...especially after a disastrous battle?


Surely, this point I'm making is pretty obvious no?

It's not, because you are talking in hindsight and you know what they say about hindsight

oyetpel:

"Like seriously, some people want all scene to be shown,
like what Danny ate in the morning, who prepared the
breakfast, how the went to market and bought things.
What ship lord Vary traveling in, who was the captain,
did vary eat in his cabin or on deck? if thing went that
way, will still be in S01E01 :\
na waw for some feefu."
Si i put it in your fu¢king face.

What is insulting there?

Gbola5:


Cersei was wrong. Power is not power

She was right from a philosophical stand point. Power is power. Knowledge might be powerful but it isn't power. Power is power.

Something is what it is, no other thing than what it is.

blackjack21:


I honestly don't know, and neither do you. i can only assume so can you, and our assumption might be right or wrong. since we can't be sure then, we can't use our assumption to judge the situations.

all the questions you asked there are paradoxes.
we cant know for sure what, but certainly lady Mormont isn't of military age for her to be able to lead her forces into battles, but certainly she can lead them in battles just like the way little finger, who can barely wield a sword led the Vale' knights.

Aye, wars are won by fighting men, but they need the leadership, they need that speech that will give them a tumncent glow: and they have lady Mormont.

And she also has aides to guide her until she is of age

Gbola5:


Yes, its an illusion. So how can power be power. What is power in the first place ?

Power is not an illusion.

Nihilist:


My point is actually not based on hindsight at all.

The Lords of the North had the foresight to realise that Jon Snow was going to lose to the Boltons, and decide to preserve the lives of their men by abstaining.

Sansa had the foresight to know that Jon would lose, and deliberately refused to enlist her forces under his leadership.

The only person to keep faith with him was a child who naturally isn't mature enough to fully understand the consequences of enlisting her men in a war they couldn't win.


This bit is particularly crucial because they all knew that this guy didn't have the men, the parentage or the acumen to take on the warden of thr north(by royal decree no less)

So what happened?

They fought, Jon lost, and was rescued by forces who he had neither summoned, nor had under control.

Does it sound logical that when he was shouting 'we fought, we won etc', that not a single person there would point out that he actually had to be rescued from his folly?

So Baelish just sat down there and let Jon share the credit, especially when littlefinger didn't even come to the battle for Jon?

my point has been simple, Jon has been making some pretty bad decisions, and his only backer up until ep 10 was a child....so why has no one called them out on this?

You are wrong. If the houses had backed him, he would have won most likely. Have you forgotten the battle against the Wildlings? With barely a hundred men, he defeated an army with giants and they were being attacked from both sides. No one had the foresight of anything.

The kid knew she had to fight for snow but still didn't want to risk her men so she gave 62. Can you see that she was actually smarter than the remaining houses?

Also, how can you call Jon a bad commander after he led the battle at the wall? He had a chance if not for Ramsay using his humanity against him.

An0nimus:


lmaooo...I was also shocked how Varys moved from Dorne to a boat just off Mereen

Actually, the shot we get of Dany's fleet is most likely not at Mereen. It makes no sense for the Tyrell fleet to sail all the way to Mereen; they probably rendezvous'd somewhere around Sunspear. In other words, there's a time skip between Olenna meeting Varys in Dorne, and the scene of Dany's fleet.

gj22:


Oga, there is no time travel in the show. It has already been talked about here that the timeliness are not concurrent. They don't happen at the same exact moment in spacetime. It has nothing to do with GRRM. It's just budget issues most likely. People have been complaining about it even from the beginning so, your GRRM point is invalid. How do you want them to show it? They are practically squeezing in months of real time into 45 mins.


The timelines are not concurrent, plain and simple.

No need to talk with you, alright?? Why flash and Varys meme online?

Unfathomable:


Exactly... the original plan was never to get Surrounded or 'enveloped' (as Jon put it). They were meant to face their opponents head on but like we already know emotions got the best of Jon.

No, there's literally nothing Jon could do about it. It's not that he is a bad commander, it's that Ramsay outplayed him. He had no choice but to go after Rickon, and when Rickon died, he couldn't just turn and go back to his troops or Ramsay would have shot him too.

Shame on Rickon for not running zigzag, though.

oyetpel:

No need to talk with you, alright?? Why flash and Varys meme online?

Because people are stupid. Don't be silly.
It's a fact that each season covers 1 year or so in Westeros, so, yes, it's about a year from Jon's death to Dany starting her invasion.

You guys really don't expect them to show every character travelling, right?

HeavenlyBang:


Because people are stupid. Don't be silly.
It's a fact that each season covers 1 year or so in Westeros, so, yes, it's about a year from Jon's death to Dany starting her invasion.

You guys really don't expect them to show every character travelling, right?

You don't understand nobody expects them to characters traveling or when they sleep and wake up. The shit started this season.

oyetpel:

No need to talk with you, alright?? Why flash and Varys meme online?

It's a joke. It's just a meme.

oyetpel:

You don't understand nobody expects them to characters traveling or when they sleep and wake up. The shit started this season.

It didn't start this season.

In season 1, think about when the imp traveled from winter fell to the wall and back to kings landing and how catelyn traveled from winter fell to kings landing and to the vale. This time line discrepancies have been established since season one. You just didn't notice it then.

gj22:


Power is not an illusion.

If people see you as powerful, then you are. Belief of power creates power. If men believe in a King, then this King will be able to manipulate these men. Its people's nature. This opinion in their minds is the shadow. When in truth power lies in THEIR hands.