Is this mumu sayin the 6million killed by adolf are killed in the mosque or are they muslims or jews only like bkh killin xtian in churches, don't mise truth pls

Series22: my guy, u d mind dis hypocrites? Na make e b say him talk. Gumi is 4rm shia islamic sect. Detained in saudi 4 terrorism. Wen d senior Gumi was alive, wen eva he preaches in kaduna dey must b riot in that town. Dis guys are terrorists.

. U lied three times 1 Gumi belong 2 the sunni sect not shia as u tried 2 proclaim 2 saudi authorities could not find any evidence against him so he was released 3 Gumi(senior) lives almost his entire life in kaduna.he used 2 preach almost everyday including this annual ramadan tafseer that his son took over after his death.so re u trying 2 tell us that during Gumis time there used 2 be crisis almost everyday in kaduna? There is nothing u can do about Islam the true religion!

Yes deres no compulsion in islam, 4 u Ȋ̝̊̅§ ur religion and 4 me Ȋ̝̊̅§ ♍Ɣ religion, u don't v to keep insultin every muslims, wen militant were strikin in niger delta dey didn't say christain sect, its not fair at all, Media Ȋ̝̊̅§ realy turnin d world upside down.

lacasa:

Hisbah acted wrongly.

Anϑ tђat 's the kind of ignorance we r talkin abt

. They choose 2 practice Islam and therefore they must abide by every Islamic rule.The type of ignorance that our shaykh is sayin here is that u must not force someone 2 accept ur religion.

All dis talk of nigerians callin oda nigerians terrorists z odd 2 say d least because nigerians r 2 illiterate 2 understand d usage of the word 'terrorist' all they do z copy western media...regardin xtians criticizin Islam, d mere fact dat it z xtians here on nl dat criticize a religion to which most r illiterate as 2 its teachings, discredits dia assertions. I mean most nigerian xtians dnt knw wot d bible says bt claim xtianity...2 summarize, its all illiteracy

drzed:

No. Muslims dont need to work hard to prove jack!

The difference between we Muslims and you Christians is that you take every bad action of any Muslim as being representative of Islam. We muslims do not generalise the bad actions of some Christians as representative of Christianity. Otherwise we Muslims would blame each and every Christian for:

1). The killing of 6 million Jews and 20 Million Russians by Adolf Hitler - with the connivance of German (and some say papal)Church
2). The massacre of millions of native North American Indians by land-hungry European Christians
3). The murdering of millions of native South Americans by the Spanish Conquistadors
4). The byatch-slapping of presumed witches by your pastors, especially those in Nigeria;
5). The molestation of kids by your 'holy' preachers, especially of the Catholic kind.
6)._________________________(Anyone can fill in the blanks here)....
7)....And list more here.
8].......... And even more here.

We Muslims do not generalise. We know that not all Christians are bad, just as we acknowledge that there are bad Muslims among us. So what is the difference between us? Well, you may not believe in what we believe; you may not like or tolerate us, but we judge each and every one of you according to his words and his deeds. The truth is that we KNOW about you because we were told (and warned) about you in the Glorious Quran. But for you, we on the other hand remain a mystery, an enigma, and unknown phenomenon which you love to hate. Simply because you refuse to even 'consider' making an attempt to know us.

Learn to separate a religion (yes, including Christianity) from its practitioners. The former may be ideal, the latter is definitely not, due to human tendency to err.

A little research about what Islam truly means and what a true Muslim is really like, cannot surely hurt you, will it? But no, most of you would rather believe CNN or what others tell you. For crying out loud: READ!

ps: The very first word revealed in the Glorious Qur'an happened to be 'READ'. .

. And ol those killings re not done by terrorist rather by some unidentified christians right?I ve come 2 realise that may be the word terrorist is now used 2 refer 2 muslims only.may Allah save us 4rm this and the punishement of hereafterm Ameen!

Austine.E:
...if there is no compulsion in islam,how come many Arab countries,including Saudi Arabia imposed it as a state religion even when they are other religions in those countries?why is it that no other religion,be it christainity,paganism,Hinduism is above the state,even in countries where they are dominant,this is called secularism and freedom of associatn!

That is not secularism Mr. Austin.E, Secularism is a word coined by a british writer George holyoake in 1851 to denote separation between government institutions and the persons mandated to represent the State from religious institutions and religious dignitaries. A country like america where neither Islam nor christianity is playing role or influencing their political terrain can be said to be practising secularism.

@amosy007

Firstly, I am not changing topic. A valid question was asked: 'Why are there no mosques in Saudi Arabia' and I have tried to explain to you that just because the Pope was personally or religiously obliged to allow a mosque to be built in Rome, does not mean the Saudis/Muslims must follow suit in Saudi Arabia or Makkah.

Secondly,... (and with all due respect to my mature and reasonable Christian brothers/sisters in Nairaland)... why is it that most of you die-hard anti-Islam, anti-muslim posters cannot discuss with us without resorting to insults and name-calling?

Perhaps I know why.

Regardless of the crazy ones among us (aka Boko Haram) our way of life (Islam) asks us to respect you people (Christians) as people of the Book/Bible who (ideally) worship(ed) the same God that we do; and in fact, any Muslim who does not believe in Jesus and his true message is NOT a faithful Muslim. Fact. Our religion and its true followers will always protect Christians and other minorities in our midst inasmuch as they live peacefully with us and do not oppress us. This is regardless of what is happening in the Northern Nigeria today, which is shameful and condemnable.

Most of you on the other hand, are not bound by any creed, be it moral, ethical or theological. Except a minority amongst you.

It is not tit4tat. You are fortunate that I am a Muslim and I fear Allah and the last Day.... and that I believe in forgiveness, even though I have the right to avenge your insults. Otherwise, I would not hesitate to insult you and everything that you stand for, and you best believe it, I KNOW how to insult people in the English language. Yet, I have never done so (insult, name-calling) in Nairaland, and inshaa Allah I will never descend that low.

If your religion does not control your manner of speech, well, mine does. Alhamdulillah. My religion judges even my intention, talk less of my speech and my actions. I leave you yo your own conscience, if you have any.

drzed:


What happened to turning the other cheek? Or was the Christianity of those days different from today's own? Let us not start swapping numbers on which religion killed the most historically, cos it is an argument you wont win.

Also Google this phrase: "history of christian violence" - without the quotation marks, and get some facts right.

You are just hilarious. Christianity is the only reason the world is not in blazes now. Do you think if Islam had their fingers on the nuclear trigger like America does...that this world will be any less peaceful today? Take a view of the hell of the Middle East and have a foretaste of what if offers...no wonder Israel is the only real democracy there. And back in the 90s before 9-11 opened American eyes I read something so laughable and insanely funny--but it was true. Emerging from an Islamic Meeting in Saudi Arabia, the Emir of Illorin was talking about one of their stated agendas discussed at the meeting: that more Muslim Scholars should be sent to the United States so that in time, Islam SHOULD conquer the world! And you wonder why only a few million Jews in the US and in Israel dominate more than a billion Muslims today? GOD IS WITH ISRAEL!

u'll neva c a news like dis on a Nigerian newspaper ....

Bloody hypocrites ! In oe breadth they insult shekhh Gummi for condemning The terror of BH and in another breadth they shout that Muslims are not coming out to condemn the terrorists.

joskid:
You are just hilarious. Christianity is the only reason the world is not in blazes now.

...Two world wars, Two Gulf wars, The Bosnian war, The current war in Afghanistan,...ah! The world is truly not in blazes. Oh, thank you Christian leaders of Western countries..... Thank you so much for such joyful and heavenly peace. In fact, the world is sooo peaceful, we are virtually in heaven.

joskid:
Do you think if Islam had their fingers on the nuclear trigger like America does...that this world will be any less peaceful today?

...And remind me what the Americans did with the nuclear trigger again in Hiroshima and Nagasaki?? Oh, but of course, it was a Muslim conspiracy to create the nuclear bomb and hand it to the Americans, the Britons, French, Russians and the Israelis.

joskid:
Take a view of the hell of the Middle East and have a foretaste of what if offers...no wonder Israel is the only real democracy there.

....Democracy. Yeah. You seek this world, whereas for us, this world is just a blink of an eye compared to eternity, our real abode. And no, we do not believe that democracy is the best thing that happened to this planet since the big-banng.

joskid:
And back in the 90s before 9-11 opened American eyes I read something so laughable and insanely funny--but it was true. Emerging from an Islamic Meeting in Saudi Arabia, the Emir of Illorin was talking about one of their stated agendas discussed at the meeting: that more Muslim Scholars should be sent to the United States so that in time, Islam SHOULD conquer the world!

...What can I say? Inshaa Allah

joskid:
And you wonder why only a few million Jews in the US and in Israel dominate more than a billion Muslims today? GOD IS WITH ISRAEL!

...You dominate a billion Muslims, yet most of you are scared sh1tless about Islam and Muslims, wherever you see us. You think weapons are power? Rubbish. Belief! - Now THAT is power!

Have a nice day!

[b][quote author=drzed]

First of all, dont ever use Boko Haraam as the S.I. unit of Muslims. Study Islam, if you have the chance (and the guts to know the truth) and see for yourself. As for quoting out of context...why should the verse (Q 9:29) not be seen in its right context? Wont you agree that "I come not to bring peace, but to bring a sword" (Gospel of Matthew 10:34)" can be used out of context to say Jesus (pbuh) is not the so-called prince of peace but a sword-wielding war-monger? (may God forgive me, for even thinking such thots).

Secondly, you are trying to use your biased logic, (laced with the words of Mahatma Gandhi) to rationalise or appraise Islam. And please dont twist my words: I clearly stated MURDER, not just any killing because there is 'lawful' killing (e.g. after conviction or during war). So, there is a huge difference. If someone came and killed my father, I would be inclined (and quite right) to ask for their trial and proportional punishment, but I would also consider Quran 42:40 whose meaning implies "The reward of evil is the evil thereof, but whosoever forgives and makes amends, his reward is upon Allah". So you see, Allah gave us the right to respond when we are wronged, but He (the Most Merciful, Most Generous) has promised us betterment if we forgive AND even make amends. Beautiful. Another verse says (Quran 24:22) "...Let them forgive and overlook. Do you not wish that Allah forgives you? Indeed Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful". Finally, as narrated in an authentic Hadith by Bukhari "When Allah completed the creation, He (Allah) wrote over His Throne: My Mercy overcomes My Anger".

It is in this same vein that I always forgive those who throw insults on me either virtually on Nairaland or physically in Naijaland. Not that I cannot respond. And not that by responding, I would have sinned. It is just better to forgive...and make amends.

Nevertheless, it is easier said than done when the issue or crime is say murder, as an example. That is why in Islam, the right to seek a just and equal compensation is extended to whomsoever wishes to exercise that right. Does Islam believe in capital punishment, yes it does. So do many states in the USA. But we are not here to compare Islam with the USA.

So when we say Islam is a religion of peace, you must understand that such peace is based on Justice. Without justice, any peace is artificial and unsustainable. In case of offence like murder, justice (and then peace) will come if the offended elect to forgive - and like the Qur'an said, follow it up by making amends (much better for them here and in the hereafter)...BUT justice can also be achieved by exacting retribution in equal measure.

I hope this creates better understanding and respect amongst us.
[/b]

^Your argument on content and context does not in any away sit well with me. I have a soft copy of the Qu'ran and I study it each time I have the chance to do so. While i cannot say I have sufficient depth of knowledge in Islamic affairs to interpret the Qu'ran, I will not pretend that the content of Qu'ran Sura 9 Aya 29 is not explicit enough to compel a half baked Islamic scholar to resort to violence. The content is so explicit and compelling, more like a command to do evil...if i may say so, unlike what we have in Mathew 10:34 that is vague and doesn't necessarily suggest violence.
Permit me to reproduce the favourite anthem of boko haram for an informed assessment:
Qu'ran 9v29 "Fight those people of the Book who do not believe in God and the last Day, who do not prohibit what God and His Apostle have forbidden, nor accept divine law, until all of them pay protective tax in submission".
The emphasise in the above chapter and verse is for moslems to fight those who do not share their believe while that of mathew 10;34 which you quoted above, is a passive comment by the speaker which in no way suggest physical harm to anybody.
I think the Islamic teachers should work hard at helping people like boko haram understand that such comments as found in Quran 9v29 can not be taken at it's face value in the 21st century. This way, they will help to ensure peace in the country and guard against the wanton destruction of lives and properties occasioned by the activities of boko haram.

Series22: My guy, How old r u? U must b a teenager. But sum teenager r inteligent na, i wonda ur own problm. Do u knw dat Gunmi's father was once arrestd by late Gen Abacha 4 inciting religious crises in kaduna?
Sencondly let me laugh @ ur stupidity about Gunmi's sect. Gunmi is d spiritual head of shia in Nigeria (feel free 2 ask google). D spiritual headquaters of Shia sect is in iran(about 80% shia'), saudi is 99% sunnis; and u knw hw muslims can kil each other wen it comes 2 shia vs sunni rivalry (d causes of syria's war). Gunmi was arested based on wat d saudi's percieved about him(rememba saudi hate iran like devil). Mind u, it took d intervention of GEJ(not evn yaradu) to get ur sheik out of saudi's cell. Nothn concern OBJ 4 d arrest...
Also saudi warned Nigeria about d dangers of Gunmi. But u knw Nigeria is a polarised society, where a camel can pass thru d eyez of a niddle witout qualms. My guy, Gunmi is a terrorist, period! Barka d sallah in advance bro.

u try bro, but what u said is what the government wants d common man to blive. Naija is complex, just take ur time to reason about d true sponsors of boko haram, Sentiments apart.

blank: So, why were people arrested in Kano for not fasting?

only the muslims were arrested for not fasting.

DANILSA: I second ur question. They need to work harder to prove that islam is a religion of peace as they claim.

see punk ass we dnt need to prove anyting to u take it d way u like who give a damn mtsw. Ass hole

drzed:

No. Muslims dont need to work hard to prove jack!

The difference between we Muslims and you Christians is that you take every bad action of any Muslim as being representative of Islam. We muslims do not generalise the bad actions of some Christians as representative of Christianity. Otherwise we Muslims would blame each and every Christian for:

1). The killing of 6 million Jews and 20 Million Russians by Adolf Hitler - with the connivance of German (and some say papal)Church
2). The massacre of millions of native North American Indians by land-hungry European Christians
3). The murdering of millions of native South Americans by the Spanish Conquistadors
4). The byatch-slapping of presumed witches by your pastors, especially those in Nigeria;
5). The molestation of kids by your 'holy' preachers, especially of the Catholic kind.
6)._________________________(Anyone can fill in the blanks here)....
7)....And list more here.
8].......... And even more here.

We Muslims do not generalise. We know that not all Christians are bad, just as we acknowledge that there are bad Muslims among us. So what is the difference between us? Well, you may not believe in what we believe; you may not like or tolerate us, but we judge each and every one of you according to his words and his deeds. The truth is that we KNOW about you because we were told (and warned) about you in the Glorious Quran. But for you, we on the other hand remain a mystery, an enigma, and unknown phenomenon which you love to hate. Simply because you refuse to even 'consider' making an attempt to know us.

Learn to separate a religion (yes, including Christianity) from its practitioners. The former may be ideal, the latter is definitely not, due to human tendency to err.

A little research about what Islam truly means and what a true Muslim is really like, cannot surely hurt you, will it? But no, most of you would rather believe CNN or what others tell you. For crying out loud: READ!

ps: The very first word revealed in the Glorious Qur'an happened to be 'READ'.

Dr, you are well informed...

Am a xtain bt I av a diff view,dnt tink dey re bad people aftall, because I. Learnnt dat der re chrchees in quatar uae kuwaits etc bt nt 1 bomb av bin thrown 2 any of dos chuches or re dey reeadin a diff quaran.xtains 2e av dier own fair share of warfare so we shudnt jst start criticizin islam lyk dat.bokoharam is poltical nt religious

ebamma: maybe sheikh gumi doesn't know how islam entered this country,uthman dan fodio fought a war with the hausas who were pagans then,and when he won the war the people who were alive were forced to convert to islam .islam has always been a war mongering and blood thirsty religion

By His (FufuMan oh sorry Ebaman) Frozen Brain, We shall know him..

d shiek say that in public but under closed door he will charge his misguided followers 2 kill innocent infidels(d quran charge muslims 2 kill d jews & non muslims)or dont all muslims-good,bad,bokoharams,al-quader read frm d same quoran

Is the Sheik aware of these Hadiths?



An example of how this rule was carried out.

Circumstance under which a Muslim life could be taken, notice the bolded. It appears there is compulsion here.

Sahih Muslim 16:4152
'Abdullah (b. Mas'ud) reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: It is not permissible to take the life of a Muslim who bears testimony (to the fact that there is no god but Allah, and I am the Messenger of Allah), but in one of the three cases:the married adulterer, a life for life, and the deserter of his Din (Islam), abandoning the community


Notice the statement of allah's Apostle in the bolded.

Sahih Bukhari 9:84:57
Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him

Is the Hadith contradicting the Quran?

Bereal247: Your argument on content and context does not in any away sit well with me. I have a soft copy of the Qu'ran and I study it each time I have the chance to do so. While i cannot say I have sufficient depth of knowledge in Islamic affairs to interpret the Qu'ran, I will not pretend that the content of Qu'ran Sura 9 Aya 29 is not explicit enough to compel a half baked Islamic scholar to resort to violence. The content is so explicit and compelling, more like a command to do evil...if i may say so, unlike what we have in Mathew 10:34 that is vague and doesn't necessary suggest violence.
Permit me to reproduce the favourite anthem of boko haram for an informed assessment:
Qu'ran 9v29 "Fight those people of the Book who do not believe in God and the last Day, who do not prohibit what God and His Apostle have forbidden, nor accept divine law, until all of them pay protective tax in submission".
The emphasise in the above chapter and verse is for moslems to fight those who do not share their believe while that of mathew 10;34 which you quoted above, is a passive comment by the speaker which in no way suggest physical harm to anybody.
I think the Islamic teachers should work hard at helping people like boko haram understand that such comments as found in Quran 9v29 can not be taken at it's face value in the 21st century. This way, they will help to ensure peace in the country and guard against the wanton destruction of lives and properties occasioned by the activities of boko haram.

First of all, I agree with you that Islamic scholars need to work towards enlightening the overzealous and the misguided ones amongst us as per Qur'an 9:29.

Secondly, I dont have the time to enlighten you on the reason/rationale for the revelation of Qur'an 9:29. In order to understand it, you need to read more of the chapter, understand it and appreciate the history of Islam during the time of the prophet (pbuh). Specifically, you should read the commentaries about the period of turmoil when this verse was revealed. Basically, it had to do with hypocrisy and betrayal by the people of the book (Jews and Christians of that time) in Madina with whom he (Muhammad, pbuh) had a pact. I will refer you to this link: http://theamericanmuslim.org/tam.php/features/articles/quran_929_commentary/

But I am not surprised by your reaction. All of a sudden Matthew 10:34 is now a passive statement? .... "I come not to bring peace, but to bring a sword"? Did you say the statement did not refer to bodily harm - abeg, which gospel and which verse did Jesus make this clarification? Or did one ancient monk forget to translate that part? I beg, I want to see the proof. Do you have the Hebrew version? Maybe he meant toothpick, and not sword. The statement is as clear as water. Unless you are telling us that the sword referred to here by Jesus, is meant for peeling potato, abi? You cannot use the word "peace" and "sword" in the same breath and tell us you were referring to something other than what it clearly means. Translate Matthew 10:34 to Nupe, Kalabari, Twi, Ashante or Creole language: it means the same thing. Let me give you the Pidgin version of Matthew 10:34: Jizoz talk say: "I nor carry bodi come salute una for yonder, Make nobodi try me - see di cutlass wey I hold for hand!".

But you know what, we Muslims know the true message of Jesus. So we dont hold Matthew 10:34 against any of you. Unlike how majority of you hold us by the Jugular as if we were all members of Al-Qaida or Boko Haram.

But let us not digress too much from the main topic.

The crux of the matter is that a muslim leader has come out to condemn the demands of Boko Haram that GEJ (or anyone else) must convert to Islam. Within the first two pages of this thread, most of you here have actively insulted the Sheikh and his religion. Some of you went as far as Shia-nism him, as if that would make him more (or less) peaceful than if he was a Sunni Sheikh (see me, see wahala).

When we Muslims keep quiet, you complain that we are passively supporting Boko Haram. Now that we are talking, some of you are here spewing gutter lyrics and calling us names.

The truth is many of you are uncomfortable with us, because we defy your twisted logic and expectations. Many of you would have preferred that the Sheikh (and all Muslims) kept quiet and not condemn Boko Haram. That way, you can all live happily ever after in your blissfully ignorant, ehen-i-told-you-so bubble that all Muslims are violent people.

How many violent Muslims have you honestly met (one-on-one) in your lifetime?

billyG: d shiek say that in public but under closed door he will charge his misguided followers 2 kill innocent infidels(d quran charge muslims 2 kill d jews & non muslims)or dont all muslims-good,bad,bokoharams,al-quader read frm d same quoran

Look if what you say is true, how come you are posting in peace here
We have enough people to do 30 suicide bombing daily. So why are we not doing it? Because it is forbidden to kill innocent and oneself
But your christian agenda of hate (while I was being brainwashed in school to believe that christianity means love) will not admit it

Did Rev King not read from the same Bible
Did Protestant and Catholic not read from the same Bible
The Christians who fought the wars of religion not read from the same Bible
Google Gunpowder plot, the Hutaree, Lord Resistance Army etc which Bible do they use
The Nigerian christians who discuss the causes of heinous crimes in the South and attribute all crimes in the North to Islam, what are thy taught in the church? - pure hate. Very simple

drzed:
...Two world wars, Two Gulf wars, The Bosnian war, The current war in Afghanistan,...ah! The world is truly not in blazes. Oh, thank you Christian leaders of Western countries..... Thank you so much for such joyful and heavenly peace. In fact, the world is sooo peaceful, we are virtually in heaven.

Ok. You do realize that these wars were not explicitly done "In the name of Jesus" by soldiers in order to win "infidels" to Christ right? You should understand the two main underlying forces in those wars...those that stood for democracy and freedom (the allies) and those that stood for pure hatred and evil (the axis which included Japan). And since you mentioned the war in Afghanistan...are you also proud that they not only provided sanctuary for a mass murderer (bin Laden) but their Taliban also inspired the Nigerian version of the Taliban that wrecked havoc in Yobe some years ago only to be succeeded by Boko Haram in the same vein?
Most of the axis-powers then were pure dictatorships bent on conquering the world by brute force. Picture Islam today. Picture Christianity. Democracy is easier in Christian lands because in Christianity NOBODY IS BORN A CHRISTIAN! You have to grow up to an age where you WILLINGLY choose to accept Christ as your Lord and Savior or not. Christianity respects the individual choice with the only consequence that you have to own up to whatever happens to you in the end. In Islam individual choice is nor respected and people are killed for making a choice for Christ. I have personal friends who have fled their homes because their muslim families will not accept them.

drzed: ...And remind me what the Americans did with the nuclear trigger again in Hiroshima and Nagasaki?? Oh, but of course, it was a Muslim conspiracy to create the nuclear bomb and hand it to the Americans, the Britons, French, Russians and the Israelis.

Again...study the historical context. Japan OFFICIALLY declared war on the US and attacked Pearl Harbor. The Americans had to make a tactical decision whether to
bomb a German city or a Japanese city. They figured out that they were already winning much of Europe but bleeding men in the Pacific. They had to send a stronger message to Japan who were quite relentless in their zeal to capture the whole Pacific for Japan. Now this was not done "in the name of Jesus" the way Jihad everywhere seems to pronounce every conflict in the name of allah.

Now...you forget to mention what happened AFTER the war. Look at Japan today. Look at its amazing transformation. Will Japan be able to get to where it is today without American help. Today Japan is a democracy and they are the strongest of friends and allies as if they never ever went to war--and that includes Germany.

drzed: ....Democracy. Yeah. You seek this world, whereas for us, this world is just a blink of an eye compared to eternity, our real abode. And no, we do not believe that democracy is the best thing that happened to this planet since the big-banng.

Dude...democracy is not about "seeking this world" but respecting the individual's decision to make informed choices. When you look at it critically...we can safely assume that even God Himself has willingly allowed himself to be a democrat even though he could be a ruthless despot. He has allowed Satan and his followers be the opposition to Christ in whatever form and has patiently endured all types of arguments and violence against Him. Yet even Christ Himself said in Revelations 3:20-21 "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.
To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne."

So you see...even Jesus Christ respects the individual choice...you can either accept Him or reject Him at your peril...but the choice is always yours. That is true democracy with ETERNAL dividends. But overwhelming evidence suggests otherwise for Muslims who have only brought violence, coercion and death if material seduction to conversion fails. And because Islam cannot engage in sustained peaceful dialog to win souls, it engages in fierce warfare against a group or nation to achieve that end. North Africa was once predominantly Christian...Islam did not come preaching peace to the natives there. It came with the sword. That is why
I cannot go to the streets of Saudi Arabia or Tehran and shout "Jesus loves you all"--they see that as a threat and that would be death sentence. Sometimes I think Christianity and Christian nations have been too tolerant for my liking...but then in the end I have to remember that Jesus respects the individual choice.

drzed: ...What can I say? Inshaa Allah

Now, how is that effort working for you?

drzed: ...You dominate a billion Muslims, yet most of you are scared sh1tless about Islam and Muslims, wherever you see us. You think weapons are power? Rubbish. Belief! - Now THAT is power!

Dude...even without guns and bombs the NAME OF JESUS ALONE dominates the more than a billion muslims, as well as those who claim to be Christians, Jews and every creature visible and invisible in the world today. Remove the weapons and let's dwell only on words and peaceful deeds...you will see that it is the muslims who will reach for their weapons at the slightest provocation. I have had a knife pointed and swung around my face by a muslim because I preached to him about Jesus. Another Hausa muslim pointed a finger at me in great anger because I told him "Jesus loves you!"

Dude...who is more scared? If Muslims are not scared of Jesus alone (not talking bombs) why not allow preachers and Christian missionaries go amd spread the gospel there? Are you sort of...afraid?

Have a nice day![/quote]

dexmond: Is the Sheik aware of these Hadiths?



An example of how this rule was carried out.

Circumstance under which a Muslim life could be taken, notice the bolded. It appears there is compulsion here.

Sahih Muslim 16:4152
'Abdullah (b. Mas'ud) reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: It is not permissible to take the life of a Muslim who bears testimony (to the fact that there is no god but Allah, and I am the Messenger of Allah), but in one of the three cases:the married adulterer, a life for life, and the deserter of his Din (Islam), abandoning the community


Notice the statement of allah's Apostle in the bolded.

Sahih Bukhari 9:84:57
Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him

Is the Hadith contradicting the Quran?

And how many people have seen killed cos they change there religion, I want facts.

joskid:

You are just hilarious. Christianity is the only reason the world is not in blazes now. Do you think if Islam had their fingers on the nuclear trigger like America does...that this world will be any less peaceful today? Take a view of the hell of the Middle East and have a foretaste of what if offers...no wonder Israel is the only real democracy there. And back in the 90s before 9-11 opened American eyes I read something so laughable and insanely funny--but it was true. Emerging from an Islamic Meeting in Saudi Arabia, the Emir of Illorin was talking about one of their stated agendas discussed at the meeting: that more Muslim Scholars should be sent to the United States so that in time, Islam SHOULD conquer the world! And you wonder why only a few million Jews in the US and in Israel dominate more than a billion Muslims today? GOD IS WITH ISRAEL!

This is laughable, why is your supposed peacefull isreal at war with all its neighbour?

@drzed

The context of Matthew 10:34

Matthew 10:32-38
32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.

34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn

“‘a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law —
36 a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’[b]

37 “Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me.

Explanation:

After saying he came to bring sword, he went further to show instances of the how the sword will operate.

"a man against his father,a daughter against her mother,a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law, a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household."

A father will be against his children for following Christ. Read about Christian persecution and see this sword in action.

If you have more questions, please feel free.

adaybayor:


And how many people have seen killed cos they change there religion, I want facts.

I have not seen one in my location, however, in the middle east, it is a daily occurrence. And you know those are the ones following the Sunnah of the prophet.

drzed:

First of all, I agree with you that Islamic scholars need to work towards enlightening the overzealous and the misguided ones amongst us as per Qur'an 9:29.

Secondly, I dont have the time to enlighten you on the reason/rationale for the revelation of Qur'an 9:29. In order to understand it, you need to read more of the chapter, understand it and appreciate the history of Islam during the time of the prophet (pbuh). Specifically, you should read the commentaries about the period of turmoil when this verse was revealed. Basically, it had to do with hypocrisy and betrayal by the people of the book (Jews and Christians of that time) in Madina with whom he (Muhammad, pbuh) had a pact. I will refer you to this link: http://theamericanmuslim.org/tam.php/features/articles/quran_929_commentary/

But I am not surprised by your reaction. All of a sudden Matthew 10:34 is now a passive statement? .... "I come not to bring peace, but to bring a sword"? Did you say the statement did not refer to bodily harm - abeg, which gospel and which verse did Jesus make this clarification? Or did one ancient monk forget to translate that part? I beg, I want to see the proof. Do you have the Hebrew version? Maybe he meant toothpick, and not sword. The statement is as clear as water. Unless you are telling us that the sword referred to here by Jesus, is meant for peeling potato, abi? You cannot use the word "peace" and "sword" in the same breath and tell us you were referring to something other than what it clearly means. Translate Matthew 10:34 to Nupe, Kalabari, Twi, Ashante or Creole language: it means the same thing. Let me give you the Pidgin version of Matthew 10:34: Jizoz talk say: "I nor carry bodi come salute una for yonder, Make nobodi try me - see di cutlass wey I hold for hand!".

But you know what, we Muslims know the true message of Jesus. So we dont hold Matthew 10:34 against any of you. Unlike how majority of you hold us by the Jugular as if we were all members of Al-Qaida or Boko Haram.

But let us not digress too much from the main topic.

The crux of the matter is that a muslim leader has come out to condemn the demands of Boko Haram that GEJ (or anyone else) must convert to Islam. Within the first two pages of this thread, most of you here have actively insulted the Sheikh and his religion. Some of you went as far as Shia-nism him, as if that would make him more (or less) peaceful than if he was a Sunni Sheikh (see me, see wahala).

When we Muslims keep quiet, you complain that we are passively supporting Boko Haram. Now that we are talking, some of you are here spewing gutter lyrics and calling us names.

The truth is many of you are uncomfortable with us, because we defy your twisted logic and expectations. Many of you would have preferred that the Sheikh (and all Muslims) kept quiet and not condemn Boko Haram. That way, you can all live happily ever after in your blissfully ignorant, ehen-i-told-you-so bubble that all Muslims are violent people.

How many violent Muslims have you honestly met (one-on-one) in your lifetime?

^It's more like you are having the impression that I am anti-Islam. I am not anti-Islam, rather I am anti-evil. Some of my best friends are moslems and I cannot possibly make friends with people whose religion I abhored.But like every good Nigerian, I owe it a responsibility to speak or write on anything i feel has the potential to spell doom for the country like the boko haram phenomenon.
Now, on the issue of content and contex, I really don't know whether to translate mathew 10:34 in yoruba language to make you understand that the statement does not in any way demand that christians should take up arms against any body. May be i should restate the succeeding verses of mathew 10:34 to help quell your ignorance:
34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
I hope the information above helps and I hope for time sake that you won't have to drag on this conversation for vain sake.