traeces:
I imagine you must think of yourself as very intelligent & well read. I really don't know about that but my heart goes out to You.
Although i usually don't involve in this kind of talk but i feel a very strong need to offer you & others like u a paradigm shift hence this reply.
First of all, God is neither a concept nor a creation of anybodies' imagination. God is a very real person that myself & countless others have had the privilege of walking & talking with. I feel him far more intimately than i feel anything in this physical world...
I've got so much more for you but lets continue from goldtraeces@gmail.com.
Thanks

I realy do not understand what your true intentions are when you dropped your unsolicited e-mail but you defeated that purpose the moment you tried to sound condescending and "all knowing" like the other Christian egomaniacs.
So typical of you religious zealots to comment about your deities with so much empty braggadocio and blind arrogance, arrogating to yourselves some divine esoteric knowledge unknown to people who do not share your christian beliefs or ideologies.
You will do well to comment on things you can actually defend with concrete proof and evidence and not some over-borrowed sound bites used by 21st centuries Pastors to humanize and exaggerate what they call "God".
If you have got anything to say to the contrary, please do, I am ever ready to intelligently defend my stance and beliefs on this issue. If all you have got is to throw up childish temper tantrums at comments you do not agree with then knock yourself out, you have the entire cyberspace to yourself, be my guest!

rhymz: oh come off it, you christian hypocrite.
Why are you so afraid to question the incoherent fairytales that you have been taught all your life. Is it because you were born into christianity and the europeand came with their Jesus story to twist the African mind? Tell me what physical proof you have or know of the existence of Christ besides the incoherent fairy tales in the new testament? Trust me you don't want me to go into that, else you will have reasons to doubt your irrational faith. I don't believe in the existence of the christian God, it is man made and thinks the way man wants him to think.

'fcuz, i bleve in bein gud doin right nd keepin a clean hrt.If derez God,fyn. If der iznt no probs. Tho i knw hardwork is tied to sum force sumwer.Sumtymes yu do evrythin but.. Hweva,yet, i take no restraint .Let no1 confine yur thought. I dnt bleve in makin my decisions arnd tha guidelines of anoda man.I respect life nd tha power dat keeps it.Sumtyms yu jus cnt fight it, dats wen yu knw.

Zico0:
'fcuz, i bleve in bein gud doin right nd keepin a clean hrt.If derez God,fyn. If der iznt no probs. Tho i knw hardwork is tied to sum force sumwer.Sumtymes yu do evrythin but.. Hweva,yet, i take no restraint .Let no1 confine yur thought. I dnt bleve in makin my decisions arnd tha guidelines of anoda man.I respect life nd tha power dat keeps it.Sumtyms yu jus cnt fight it, dats wen yu knw.

I don't seem to understand what you are trying to convey as your statement is rife with incoherent contradictions. "You don't believe in making your decisions around the guidelines of another man", realy? So the guidelines in the bible are what? Who do you think chose all the gospels, epistles and testaments of your bible that you so hold up as the divine words of some divine entity, extraterrestial aliens??
I doubt you any idea of what you are yapping about sef cos if you do, you will understand how confined your thought process is.
And don't try to pass the wrong impression that a person that do not believe in God is some evil person that has no respect for life, that line of argument is dumb. In fact, if you have not learnt any lesson from people like Oyedepo, it is the fact that being good, compassionate and loving has nothing to do with religious pity but the human essense and nature. The man is obviously a savvy but ruthless business man that puts profits first before human emotions, you will have to admit looking at his business models and actions.
Anybody can be goodhearted whether you are a christian monk or a devout humanist that cares little or nothing about organized belief systems and religions.
So again, I ask, what where you on about??

rhymz:
I realy do not understand what your true intentions are when you dropped your unsolicited e-mail but you defeated that purpose the moment you tried to sound condescending and "all knowing" like the other Christian egomaniacs.
So typical of you religious zealots to comment about your deities with so much empty braggadocio and blind arrogance, arrogating to yourselves some divine esoteric knowledge unknown to people who do not share your christian beliefs or ideologies.
You will do well to comment on things you can actually defend with concrete proof and evidence and not some over-borrowed sound bites used by 21st centuries Pastors to humanize and exaggerate what they call "God".
If you have got anything to say to the contrary, please do, I am ever ready to intelligently defend my stance and beliefs on this issue. If all you have got is to throw up childish temper tantrums at comments you do not agree with then knock yourself out, you have the entire cyberspace to yourself, be my guest!

Rhymz i actually dropped my email cos i didn't want to join you to derail this thread which is certainly not about the existence or non existence of God and also cos i actually felt a compelling need to help someone get a paradigm shift. Now I'll like you to note that it is the last time i will be responding to you or anyone else about the existence or non-existence of God on this thread. I'll be your guest if you open a separate thread or link me up via my email.
Now to the issue of discussion, Whether or not you believe God is does not change what the fact is. In Jn4:24, The bile says, "God is a Spirit..." and if you are as widely read as am thinking you are, then you should know that an essential characteristic of spirits is that they are incorporeal, that is without material form or substance. Now you talk about "defending the existence of God with concrete proof and evidence", Even though neither myself, nor God, nor anyone for that matter owes you this. I will nonetheless do you the favour of asking you to pause for a moment and consider the earth in which you live, the eyes with which you're reading this (You might want to know that of all the tens of thousands of connection the eyes have to the brain, Science has only been able to explain only about a hundred). Consider The universe of which the earth is only a minute almost infinitesimal part. Some of the stars you see at night are by far bigger than the whole earth yet even science with all of its borrowed precision has not been able to quantify them. Think about how a hen Lays its eggs and hatches them almost effortlessly, try to reproduce that process and lets have your results. Look at the organization and orderliness in nature and then tell me there is no divine hand behind all of that then I will tell you the bible was speaking of you about five thousand years ago when the holy spirit inspired the Psalmist to write what he wrote in Psalms 14:1,10:4.
Even in the physical domain, There are a number of things that we can't see, feel or touch but we believe sometimes know they exist e.g. Electrons and Witches. Why then will you allow your mind under any guise to subject the God of all the earth to the primitive level of the human Intellect. I fail to see how doubting the existence of God makes you intelligent really.
Also be informed that there is a scientific law known as Newton's second law of motion and it states that, "A body continues in its state of rest or uniform acceleration UNLESS acted upon by an external force." In other words, nothing just happens, something beyond it has to make it happen. Though you don't believe in God, I know you believe science. What science is saying is that for you to hold this view, their is a force beyond you that is compelling you to reason and think like you're doing and vice versa. Since that also agrees wholesale with the word of God, I buy it wholesale.
Pls read:



1 Cor 1:18-25

18 The Message that points to Christ on the Cross seems like sheer silliness to those hellbent on destruction, but for those on the way of salvation it makes perfect sense. This is the way God works, and most powerfully as it turns out. 19 It's written,

I'll turn conventional wisdom on its head,
I'll expose so-called experts as crackpots.

20 So where can you find someone truly wise, truly educated, truly intelligent in this day and age? Hasn't God exposed it all as pretentious nonsense? 21 Since the world in all its fancy wisdom never had a clue when it came to knowing God, God in his wisdom took delight in using what the world considered dumb — preaching, of all things! — to bring those who trust him into the way of salvation.

22 While Jews clamor for miraculous demonstrations and Greeks go in for philosophical wisdom, 23 we go right on proclaiming Christ, the Crucified. Jews treat this like an anti-miracle — and Greeks pass it off as absurd. 24 But to us who are personally called by God himself — both Jews and Greeks — Christ is God's ultimate miracle and wisdom all wrapped up in one. 25 Human wisdom is so tinny, so impotent, next to the seeming absurdity of God. Human strength can't begin to compete with God's "weakness."
(from THE MESSAGE: The Bible in Contemporary Language © 2002 by Eugene H. Peterson. All rights reserved.)


Friend, do yourself a favour, Get in the way of salvation more so because;
Heb 11:6
6 It's impossible to please God apart from faith. And why? Because anyone who wants to approach God must believe both that he exists and that he cares enough to respond to those who seek him
(from THE MESSAGE: The Bible in Contemporary Language © 2002 by Eugene H. Peterson. All rights reserved.)
Like i said, we can only continue this discussion only on another thread or from goldtraeces@gmail.com. Thanks my friend.

Before you make comments get your facts first, the jets dont belong to david oyedepo as a person the jets belongs to the ministry, winners chapel and is used for ministarial purposes. And winners is a big church so more will come.

wonlasewonimi:

JK Rowling sells more books than all Nigerian Pastors combined. She will never buy 4 private jets!

When last did you purchase JK Rowling's book and how many people have you seen it with?
I can boastfully tell you that where i am right now people are buying Pastor E.A Adeboye's book even in the USA, a lot of people are buying his books not to talk of the UK and ASIA.... so my dear friend its the scope of your exposure that depicts your level of your vision on the matter like this. If you are outta the country , you'll know whats up

freenature:

When last did you purchase JK Rowling's book and how many people have you seen it with?
I can boastfully tell you that where i am right now people are buying Pastor E.A Adeboye's book even in the USA, a lot of people are buying his books not to talk of the UK and ASIA.... so my dear friend its the scope of your exposure that depicts your level of your vision on the matter like this. If you are outta the country , you'll know whats up

Ignorance is bliss. Should I google it for you? Apart from paperbacks, she does sell on kindle.

This is not a matter of religion, Pastor Adeboye will not outsell JK Rowling in this life!

paleson: We are aware of all these. And look at their villages nothing to write home-about.IS A SHAME!

a Glorified villages.

aguiyi:
poverty mentality has beguilded you

Well, I don't think it has anything to do with poverty, as he never condemned having a private jet in the first place

rhymz:
So again, I ask, what where you on about??

no time to read all that. I knw things dnt jus hapn on their own. 7billion people go out evryday 2 make it but not all come back successful. Let 3people work hard in the same amount but the results will differ. Thats when yu acknowledge that force. I dnt go on abt the existence of God. But by the number of yrs i hv lived i knw some force exist. Thats y i go to church evry sunday 2 appease that power so that my will be done out of the 7billion people. Now if yu title that power God's then i blieve.
The power is immaterial(spiritual) but i 2 connect with it. There's christianity, budhism,judaism etc. I wz raised in christianity nd it seems most effective. Im no follower of adeboye,oyedepo or man: my goal is to reach that force. This is my take.

Tesiday:
God Bless You. End of discussion.

You have said it all, your intellect is commendable. cheers.....

Zico0:
no time to read all that. I knw things dnt jus hapn on their own. 7billion people go out evryday 2 make it but not all come back successful. Let 3people work hard in the same amount but the results will differ. Thats when yu acknowledge that force. I dnt go on abt the existence of God. But by the number of yrs i hv lived i knw some force exist. Thats y i go to church evry sunday 2 appease that power so that my will be done out of the 7billion people. Now if yu title that power God's then i blieve.
The power is immaterial(spiritual) but i 2 connect with it. There's christianity, budhism,judaism etc. I wz raised in christianity nd it seems most effective. Im no follower of adeboye,oyedepo or man: my goal is to reach that force. This is my take.

which force? An assumed force or an imagined one? I have no time to read your petty talk either, just know one thing, whatever force that is pushing you around is in your head and your mind, it will push you around if you want it to, it is all mental illusion. You should have better reasons than this vague claims of a force, you sound like a schizophrenic patient talking about some force and all that cock and bull yarn that can't seem to explain anything cogent and sensible.

You knw nuhtin about life.

aguiyi:
a very proud one

No! a well deceived one!!

When kenneth Copeland(1 of bishop's mentors) singlehandedly gav out a private jet,no 1 heard.now after learning frm such a man,y wont he av dese Jets.y must we join d country in celebrating poverty wen d bible tells us dat d just shall live by faith.not by d state of d economy.if i were u,i move out of my 'poverty thinking' and ask how he got where he is so dat i can stand on his shoulders.what if he didn't get dese jets, wil poverty die in d country?rmemba,what u criticize,u do not attract.

I dey laf hahahahahahahhahahahahahahhahahaha.

aguiyi:
poverty mentality has beguilded you

Shat up Ʊ® dirty mouth when ƔU̶̲̥̅̊ see the truth say it.

dangerzone: Right now i am very angry at that man called oyedepo, damn 3private jet for one individual?? what is he even preaching sef

use your brain ,oyedepo couldnt have own a single jet for nothing.he is very discipline man,he doesn't even drink miilk,can you see the kind of suit he wears? just check the material .those jet are for business.

EVIL people and enemies must see a true JESUSCHRIST follower or bornagain and run AWAY but how many bornagain are EMPOWERED by PASTORS to be a terror to evil men and women ?humanbeigns lack the light ,the mantle,the power that be to expose and disgrace evil people spiritually speaking