Dear Enigma,

Gather my points from my previous posts and you'll see that I was neither inflamatory nor polarised - I hope you'll find me so as I'm stating now.

Second, I didn't arduously seek to make the distinction between wine and alchohol - the Bible clearly made a distinction between various drinks, and that's what I've sought to present all along. I don't think the discussion should even have merited a single post if we arduously seek the word "alchohol" in the Bible - it just doesn't say "alchohol", but rather wine, strong drink/wine, vinegar, fruit of the vine, etc. So, that's one reason why I called for the distinction so we might have a rounded discussion on this.

Lastly, I would rather stick to what the Bible says at any one text or the other. Some got drunk in church as is clear from I Cor. 11:21; even so, as I have stated earlier in one of my posts, the Love Feast/Agapé is not the same as the Lord's Supper. That's why the apostle warned them to set things right among themselves. What I know Jesus gave the disciples was called "the fruit of the vine" - which could mean anything other than alchohol (see Matt. 26:29; Mark 14:25 and Luke 22:18). The Bible as the inspired word of God definitely has a reason for so wording these verses this way, and it's always my style to follow the advice that we should not go beyond what is written (cf. I Cor. 4:6). It was common practice in those days to have the juice of grapes as a simple customary drink. So, when the Bible says "fruit of the vine", I would rather not stretch this to mean "alchohol" if infact it is not stated categorically so.

Blessings and thanks for your insight.

4Get_me

Thanks and blessings too. I've actually enjoyed the discussion even if it might not have always appeared so.

@Kimba & SirKay

Though i read just the first page on this subject, i was impressed.

Dont let anybody pollute your christianity o.


Let them twist Bible to anything they want.

no way is it okay for a believer to take any kind of alcohol

Dont care.

Just dont care. Its your life.
If you perish from it, congrats.
If you dont, too bad.

@ hot-angel

I care.

JOKE:

Pastor:  Alcohol kills slowly.

Congregation: So? who is in a hurry to die anyway.
 

so this topic is still on?

Its not easy, are Nigerians on the list of the top-world's drunkards list?

Kimba, go to your room! .

@TV01

Kimba, go to your room!

I didnt know that the Moderator has created a ROOM for me

I do not take alcohol but I vehemently disagree with those who believe that satan will be carving your ass with his three pronged pitch fork if you drink even a drop of alcohol. Alcohol should be taken in moderation, it only becomes a 'sin' when taken to the point of intoxication, bearing in mind that even drinking Mountain Dew or Sunkist soda could be a 'sin' if moderation is flushed down the toilet.

Drink responsibly.

ON CIGARETTE smokin': I see no benefit in that even if when taken in moderation, you kill yourself with every inhalation, not the samerate alcohol, so let us not compare the two.

"Is It Right For A Christian To Take Alcohol" Read the article below, you decide,

Who is the king of the drug world?   

Who claims 50 times more lives than all the illegal drugs combined? Who costs the American people 130 billion dollars every year to mop up it's blood-bath of human slaughter? Who destroys 1 in every 4 families in America? Who kills over 200,000 Americans each year? Is it crack? Is it cocaine? Could it be heroin?

No, the undisputed heavy-weight champion of the drug world and number one killer of Americans is KING ALCOHOL!
And nobody dares utter a peep! 

THANKS TO KILLER ALCOHOL . . .

·        There are over 18 million alcoholics in America.

·        Cirrhosis of the liver kills over 30,000 each year and rising.

·        50 percent of the people on welfare are due to killer alcohol.

·        80 percent of all fire deaths are due to killer alcohol.

·        65 percent of the drownings

·        22 percent of home accidents

·        77 percent of falls

·        36 percent of pedestrian accidents

·        65 percent of all murders

·        40 percent of all assaults

·        35 percent of all rapes

·        30 percent of other sex crimes

·        30 percent of all suicides

·        Over 80 percent of all arrests are linked to killer alcohol!



And one of the most disturbing statistics of all - 60 PERCENT OF ALL CHILD ABUSE IS DUE TO KILLER ALCOHOL!

Let's wage a war on crack, on cocaine, on heroin, and marijuana! BUT DON'T DARE EVEN MENTION KILLER ALCOHOL!

During the Viet Nam war, 57,000 Americans gave their lives fighting for this country. A wailing wall was built in Washington with each soldiers' name engraved. But in that same 9-year period, when 57,000 died in Viet Nam OVER 2 MILLION AMERICANS were killed by killer alcohol! During the Viet Nam War, thousands of protesters were all over this country. What I want to know is where are the protesters against killer alcohol?



WHERE IS JANE FONDA WHEN WE REALLY NEED HER?
Nobody opens their mouth against killer alcohol! Nobody makes a sound! Who speaks out for over 7 million young children that live a life of child abuse, incest, and torture? Their little life is a hell on earth because of killer alcohol!



THE KILLER IS GLAMORIZED AND GLORIFIED!


The alcohol industry spends over 400 million dollars a year advertising and glorifying the killer! By age 18, American children on an average, have seen an estimated 100,000 beer commercials! They innocently watch as their favorite heroes glamorize and glorify killer alcohol. "You only go around once in life, so grab for all the gusto you can", they proclaim. But what they don't tell you is - every single day - at least 10 young people die because of drinking alcohol! God have mercy on these athletes, who prostitute their God-given athletic ability, sacrificing our young people on the altar of alcohol!

One of the beer commercial's favorite celebrities was Billy Martin, former manager of the New York Yankees. I bet you never saw a picture of the end of the drinking scene. Here's the real picture! After spending most of Christmas day at the local bar drinking, Billy and William Reedy, a Detroit bar owner, headed home. As they were driving home their pickup truck skidded over 200 feet off a winding, country road, then traveled another 100 feet down a four-foot-deep gully before striking a concrete culvert. Billy Martin smashed through the windshield, fractured his neck and was pronounced dead 23 minutes later.


BET YOU NEVER SAW THAT PICTURE!


But, wouldn't that make a good "Lite" beer commercial! Wouldn't that really show you "Miller Time"?



NO, THEY WON'T SHOW YOU THE END OF "HAPPY HOUR"!


Killer Alcohol is turning our highways into rivers of blood and our interstates into a slaughter-house! On the average, every 50th car you see is powered by a drunk driver on their way to murder an innocent victim! Nearly 700 a week will be killed, 100 a day, nearly 5 an hour - every 12 minutes somebody is killed by a drunk driver! Over 25 million Americans have died in traffic accidents because of alcohol. People ask what are we going to about AIDS? What I want to know is - what are we doing about those thousands of innocent people who are "LAMBS LED TO THE SLAUGHTER" on the highways across America by a drunk driver!

IN JUST ONE YEAR, alcohol will slaughter more Americans on our highways than all the American soldiers killed in World War II!

Some gullible parents are actually relieved that their children are drinking alcohol instead of using other drugs. But, what many parents don't know is - the number one killer of young people between the ages of 16 and 24 is ALCOHOL-RELATED AUTOMOBILE ACCIDENTS!

Next time you buy that drink . Next time you buy that six-pack. You are footing the bill for the murder of somebody's loved one, somebody's little child! JUST MAYBE - YOUR OWN! Next time your wife and children go to the grocery store, next time your husband goes to work - BEWARE, it just may be the last!


THERE'S A KILLER STALKING THE HIGHWAYS OF AMERICA!


The President and Congress have spared no expense, nor effort, to"to get guns off the streets." From "20/20", to "48-Hours", to the local news - you can't turn on the television, without hearing the horror of "guns and youth." Where are the "TV specials" on killer alcohol? And what's more, in nearly all youth related shootings - killer alcohol helps"pull the trigger". As one youth convicted of attempted murder, said, "most of the times we didn't think about planning drive-by shootings, 'cause we had all been DRUNK."

In April 29, 1992, the world was in shock, as the"L.A. Riots" left more than 50 people dead, 2,300 injured, and over $1 billion in damage. And guess who was there! KILLER ALCOHOL! U.S. News and World Report, (May 31, 1993) stated, ". . . liquor plainly inflamed the violence . . . you could smell the liquor on people's breath from several feet away." Not surprisingly, U.S. News and World Report, also said, "Yet official investigations of the 1992 riot have virtually IGNORED LIQUOR'S ROLE. . ."

A 16-year-old in Buffalo, N.Y. kills his father after drinking some beers with friends . . . A drunk father in South Carolina, cuts off the head of his baby. In jail, he's screaming, "How? How could I do such a thing? I loved my baby!" . . . A drunk husband pours gas on his wife and then sets her on fire. In jail, he's crying, "Why? What came over me? I loved my wife!" . . . Cari Lightner, a 13-year-old girl killed by a drunk driver, as she walked to a church carnival . . . 4 year-old, David Gunderman run over by a drunk driver as he stood on the sidewalk waiting for the ice cream man



. . . And killer alcohol keeps killing!

ONLY THE NAMES CHANGE!

The President and Congress, have repeatedly called to our attention, the country's large deficit. But what they don't tell you - killer alcohol costs tax payers over 130 billion dollars each year to mop up it's massacre! Wouldn't that go a long way in balancing our budget? Not even to mention the thousands of lives, homes, and marriages we'd salvage! No, let's cut back military! Let's cut back social security! Let's raise taxes! But don't dare do anything to halt killer alcohol!



WHY IS THAT?


Do you know what city has the highest per capita consumption of killer alcohol? YOU GUESSED IT! WASHINGTON, D.C.!

Killer alcohol can make an otherwise, faithful man or woman forget their marriage vows. Currently, 2 out of every 3 marriages end in divorce - and 2 out of every 3 adults drink alcohol! A Miami judge recently"shocked" the news media when he stated that a WHOPPING 90% OF ALL DIVORCES WERE CAUSED BY DRINKING PROBLEMS!



Killer alcohol has destroyed our homes!


85% of all the children in foster homes are there, thanks to killer alcohol! God only knows the thousands of women and children beaten black and blue - thanks to killer alcohol! God only knows the rivers of tears wept - thanks to killer alcohol!

Mental illness and the homeless is in epidemic proportions in America. A panel of 20 doctors and scientists was asked in Pageant Magazine, what is the greatest single cause of insanity in the U.S.? THEY ALL REPLIED WITHOUT EXCEPTION - ALCOHOL!

You've heard it said, one or two drinks won't hurt you, or an occasional drink may even be good for your health. NOT ACCORDING TO THE LATEST RESEARCH! An article in U.S. News and World Report states, "Alcohol begins to alter the functioning of virtually every organ from the moment it enters the body. . . experts believe even OCCASIONAL DRINKS CAN BE DANGEROUS." According to studies, you have at least a 1 in 10 chance of becoming an alcoholic with each sip! Research states, "Everytime you take a drink you are playing RUSSIAN ROULETTE! Any given "sip" you may pull the switch that will change your metabolism and turn you into a chronic alcoholic and destroy your life."



And 1 out of every 10 alcoholics commit suicide!

YOU'D BETTER THINK ABOUT THAT BEFORE YOU TAKE THAT "OCCASIONAL" DRINK!


The Bible gives a perfect description of alcohol in Proverbs 23:"Who hath WOE? Who hath SORROW? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? THEY THAT TARRY LONG AT THE WINE; they that go to seek mixed wine. Look not thou upon the wine when it is red, when it giveth his colour in the cup, when it moveth itself aright. At the last it BITETH LIKE A SERPENT, AND STINGETH LIKE AN ADDER. Thine eyes shall behold strange women, and thine heart shall utter perverse things."

The Bible says, ". . . at last it biteth like A SERPENT." Do you know what a serpent bite is? POISON! Did you know that alcohol is poison? Every major organ in your body is poisoned by alcohol. According to The Birmingham News (Nov. 19, 1990), "Scientific data show alcohol is THE MOST PHYSICALLY DETERIORATING drug there is. It causes more organic damage than any other drug. . ."Why is it when people get drunk, they have a tendency to vomit? Because your stomach knows POISON when it comes down! No wonder the bartender says, "NAME YOUR POISON"! When a man is drunk, he is INTOXICATED. Do you know what a TOXIC is? IT IS A POISON! A drunk man is a man who has LITERALLY POISONED HIMSELF!
Scientists have only recently discovered the physical process that creates the slurred speech and drunken stupor. Once in the blood stream, alcohol causes a coagulation of the red corpuscles referred to as "sludging". The blood thickens so that it cannot flow freely and clogs the metabolic exchange of life-giving oxygen. And when cells are deprived of oxygen - THEY DIE! And because brain cells require a high oxygen supply continuously, they are particularly vulnerable! And brain cells are the only cells that do not reproduce! Brain cells destroyed are never replaced! Autopsies performed on drinkers, often reveal hollow cavities in the skull, where ENTIRE CONVOLUTIONS OF THE BRAIN HAVE DISAPPEARED! And according to studies by Dr. Melvin H. Kinsley, brain damage occurs progressively from THE VERY FIRST DRINK! The next time you see that man staggering drunk - YOU ARE WATCHING A MAN LITERALLY DESTROYING HIS BRAIN!

I've had people tell me several times, Jesus drank wine. . . The Bible makes a clear distinction between fermented liquor and new wine, or grape juice. Speaking of fermented liquor, Proverbs 23 says, "Look not thou upon the wine when it is red (speaking of fermentation), when it giveth his colour in the cup, when it moveth itself aright (speaking of the bubbling and carbonation). At the last it BITETH like a serpent, and STINGETH like an adder."

A description of new wine is found in Isaiah 65:8, "as the NEW WINE is found IN THE CLUSTER." Not in a bottle! You can't get FERMENTED LIQUOR from a CLUSTER! Fermented LIQUOR is placed in a bottle, with yeast and allowed to FERMENT. Genesis 40:11 gives a clear picture of new wine, "I took GRAPES and PRESSED them in Pharaoh's cup."

People say, Jesus drank wine at the Last Supper with the apostles. HE DID? In Matthew, Mark and Luke where the account of the Last Supper is found, the word "wine" is never even mentioned. The Bible very carefully says they drank - "FRUIT OF THE VINE!"

What about when Jesus turned the water into wine at the marriage in Cana. If Jesus Christ turned water into fermented liquor, he directly disobeyed Habakkuk 2:15, "Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken also . . ." And, if Jesus disobeyed Habakkuk - HE WAS A SINNER! The Bible makes it very clear in 1 Peter 2:22, 2 Corinthians 5:21, and other verses - THAT JESUS CHRIST WAS WITHOUT SIN!

God has placed a very strong warning in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, "Be not deceived: NO DRUNKARDS, . . . shall inherit the kingdom of God."


IS ALCOHOL WORTH IT?


Friend, alcohol will never satisfy that unquenchable thirst, burning inside of you.



ONLY JESUS CHRIST CAN QUENCH THAT THIRST!


Jesus said in John 7:37,"IF ANY MAN THIRST, let him come unto me, and drink."

John 4:14 says, "But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him SHALL NEVER THIRST; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life."

you need to do an article [b]about killer food. [/b]It leads to diabetes, obesity, cardiac arrest

80% of wars are caused by lack of food
95% of prosititutes do it cause they don't have food
89% of armed robbers said they did it cause they had to eat e.t.c

crappy crap!

If we talk about moderation in drinking when should a christian stop? after how many bottles? ANd does it apply to everyone or is it as much as your faith can carry.
someplace in proverbs talks about giving strong drink to kings which will cause them to pervert justice.
If you say go on and drink, do you drink for medicinal issues like Paul told Timothy or you are shacking to have a nice time in the midst of unbelieving friends.
If it is okay for a Christain to take Alcohol where then is the differetiating line between someone who claims to be a christain and someone who doesn't have the slightest faith.
Before you act remember, whatever you will do that will make your brother to fall , you are supposed to stay away from such. At least for the other person's sake!

trailblaze:

If we talk about moderation in drinking when should a christian stop? after how many bottles?

[b]trailblaze [/b]does anybody tell you when to stop eating, or drinking water or how long a bath/shower should last.

How about how many hours a week should you study, or drive. or how long many times you should have sex with your spouse

bottom line it's all individual preference. But all of the above should be done in moderation.

Alchohol? No.

@trailblaze

If we talk about moderation in drinking when should a christian stop? after how many bottles? ANd does it apply to everyone or is it as much as your faith can carry.
someplace in proverbs talks about giving strong drink to kings which will cause them to pervert justice.
If you say go on and drink, do you drink for medicinal issues like Paul told Timothy or you are shacking to have a nice time in the midst of unbelieving friends.
If it is okay for a Christain to take Alcohol where then is the differetiating line between someone who claims to be a christain and someone who doesn't have the slightest faith.
Before you act remember, whatever you will do that will make your brother to fall , you are supposed to stay away from such. At least for the other person's sake

Preach it on!!!!!

kool, war against alcohol. It seems to be more of a spiritual problem. Interesting to see many ppl talk against alcohol. On another thread, ppl were proud to be loose, having slept with over 5 ppl, imagine that!

It is just better to abstain from alcohol, but I am curious to know what your views are on drinking wine? Is it ok for Christians to consume it? I used to, but stopped drinking wine a while back.

Like eating junk food, masturbating, watching porn and even drinking, everything is fine in moderation.

Reverend:

Like eating junk food, masturbating, watching porn and even drinking, everything is fine in moderation.

Hey! MR Kinky! You still they breathe. Christ shall soon arrest you. 1 Luv.

It would be very hard for a pretend, made up entity to arrest anybody. He can not even police the world he is supposed to have made.

@Reverend
John 8:44 "You are the children of your father, the devil, and you want to follow your father's desires. From the very beginning he was a murderer and has never been on the side of truth, because there is no truth in him. When he tells a lie, he is only doing what is natural to him, because he is a liar and father of all lies".

i heard if alcohol is taken in moderation,it is good 4 d body(can a doctor help us).if that is d case don't u think moderation is d key,christian or no christian.correct me if am wrong

Is it right for a christian to take alcohol?
Answer; yes {1}
Answer; No {2}
 
    1: yes, generally it's very wrong to say that Bible says christians should not take alcohol.
i know many christians reading this post will stir at me and none christian. yea get me right now! there are many thing which we consume that contain alcohol, like cassava, grape to mention but a few. The problem here is when do we take those things.
Taking grape when fermentation has not taking place is not wrong yet there is still alcohol in it. Vine which was the wine we normally see Bible mention is like grape, when taking at it fresh condition nourishes the body and give healthy life, and here i can say authoritatively that,that was the wine made by Jesus and also the wine recommended to Timothy by Paul.

The answer as No {2}; If the grape which you take fresh and it is not bad is allowed to ferment, if you take it, it become sin. Whenever those natural fruits pass through brew and fermentation has taking place is no more good for our consumption as christians.
The artificial nature of these beverages we have today is not good for consumption not only for christian but to any body who love his life.

When i was very small we take cocoa juice becuase my father have cocoa plantation, but if you allow that juice tiil morning if you take it, it would push you more than some  beer drink we have today. why? becuase fermentation has taking place.

The toxin produce during this period of fermentation is not good for our health and any body that destroys his/her body by what he consume God will not hold guitless, not only artificial alcohol, both other food we are taking in.

Of course it is perfectly ok for a christian to take alcohol as long as it is in moderation. There is absolutely no where in the bible that even remotely suggests that a christian should not drink alcohol, on the contrary there are several passages that endorse/ encourage/ allow the taking of alcohol as long as it is in moderation. I know a lot of so called christians who read their bibles upside down have tried endlessly to prove other wise but the simple truth is that the idea does not exist in the bible. Lastly Jesus christ took and gave his disciples wine at the last supper and he asked them to do it in memory of him. How much more evidence do we need that it is ok for christians to take alcohol. (pls note that there was no such thing as "non alcoholic wine" in the biblical times, because i know some hypocrites have tried to suggest without any scriptural backing that the wine Jesus took "might" be non alcoholic) The way some so called christians try to twist the scriptures

[center]Drinking is not good. Consider the effects of it on people that see you drinking alcohol also.www.dword4us..com[/center]

Very debatable topic and I dont know if it is approved or condemned in the Holy Bible. Some people's interpretation is that the Bible advocates moderation in the consumption of alcohol, while others claim that the Holy Bible completely disapproves of it. I dont know, my Church does not endorse it, and quite frankly, I tend to stay away from it, though at times, I have a desire to drink wine.

@Ndipe
there is nothing debatable about it, there is not one single scripture in the whole bible that remotely suggests we shouldn't drink as christians and Jesus christ drinking and serving his disciples wine should put an end to such debate except you don't beleive in Jesus or your bible. What is causing the debate is the unscriptural teachings some pastors tell their members, the problem is the false assumption the pastor is telling the truth any time he is preaching. The truth is that we need to verify all things we are told by our pastors ask them to show you were it is written in the bible. And when you read such references, be sure to read at least five verses before and five verse after the quoted verse so that they don't quote a verse out of context to you.