frosbel: we are not fools.

What do you call this ?

gboru: praying in front of a statue . Does it means worship? Its a form of adoration, honor. !!! Study more dude.

gboru: praying in front of a statue . Does it means worship? Its a form of adoration, honor. !!! Study more dude.

ijawkid:

Smh.........

Why must you guys go to the statute and pray in the first place??.........leave the statutes alone......

Can't you imitate Jesus for once in your lives??........

ijawkid: These catholics take us for fools.....how can people walk up to marys statute,bow down to it and then[b]LIE[/b ] to the world that they aint engaging idolatry............

Can't the catholics leave that dead image alone??.................

raqueal: I remember watching pillars of the earth, a movie from a novel by Ken Follet and so much fuss was made over relics. It just looked silly..they,(catholics) want relics, need to have a physical evidence of what they believe in. They aren't satisfied with praying to or through Mary(as they say), but still want to bow before her image.

Take away the images and you've taken away the core of their belief.

tobechi20: wrong. The image isnt the core of our belief. JESUS CHRIST IS

Ask just about any Roman Catholic apologist if Catholics pray to saints or the pictures, medals, statues, etc., that bear their likeness and the answer you are most likely to receive will be a resounding, "No!"

Forget the fact that Catholic Mary is a saint, Queen of Heaven and Earth, Co-Redeemer, Mediatrix, Advocate and Dispenser of God's Grace, she is still a saint. Forget all the countless books, booklets, leaflets and cards that bear words to use when invoking the aid/intervention of some one of the thousands of demigods who make up the pantheon of Catholic saints. Forget the millions of offertory candles burning before the images of Mary, Michael, Anthony of Porras, Judas Thaddeus, and the like. Forget all the sightings of men, women and children kneeling before such an image with heads bowed, hands clasped in prayerful attitude, as they fervently mouth heartfelt pleadings or tender sincere thanks to the spirit of the person the image represents. Catholics do not pray to saints.

Forget the two "miracles" attributed to one of Roman Catholicism's fast-track candidates for sainthood. As reported in today's newspaper, both so-called miracles were the result of prayers to the spirit of the not-so-long- dead candidate.

"PHILADELPHIA – When doctors first diagnosed 1-year-old Amy Wall with incurable nerve deafness several years ago, her parents prayed that their baby might someday learn sign language.

"But Amy's 7-year-old brother, Jack, believed in miracles. He wanted Amy to hear. And he demanded they pray for a cure.

"So the Bucks County, Pa., family prayed to the late Mother Katharine Drexel, a Roman Catholic nun from Philadelphia who devoted her life to the poor. Months later, Amy was not only hearing – but speaking.

"On Thursday, Pope John Paul II declared Amy's cure a miracle, one that clears the way for Mother Drexel to be named a saint of the Catholic Church." (David O'Reilly, Knight-Ridder Newspapers, "Nun's second miracle clears way for sainthood," San Antonio Express-News, January 29, 2000, p. 12B)

Okay, that's the second of the two required miracles. So what was the first miracle attributed to Drexel? Why, it was another deafness cure.

…The Vatican concluded in 1988 that a Bensalem boy, Robert Gutherman, was miraculously cured of deafness in 1974 after his family prayed to Mother Drexel for intercession." (David O'Reilly, Ibid.)

At this point, I do not doubt, at least a few Catholics might stand up to declare that there is nothing wrong in asking someone to pray for you. I could not agree more. At various times throughout every day, I offer intercessory prayers for my family and friends. There certainly is biblical precedent aplenty for intercessory prayer. For example:

Ephesians 6:18-19, "Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints; And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,"

The difference between intercessory prayer such as the kind I offer (biblical) and Catholic intercessory prayer (non-biblical) has to do with to whom the prayers are offered. When I pray, I pray only to God Almighty for, as a blood-bought child of God, I can go boldly into His presence. And when I do so, my High Priest stands with me.

Hebrews 4:14-16, "Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need."

When a Catholic prays, more likely than not, he will pray to Catholic Mary or the spirit of some other dead person Catholics call saints. In those prayers, they may ask the recipient to intercede for them before the throne of their supreme god, or goddess, as the case may be. More likely, they will ask that spirit to heal them, help them to find something that is lost, freshen a dry cow, etc. Those are prayers to a spirit, not to God, and that does not please the real God, the God of Scripture.

Deuteronomy 18:9-12, "When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee."

Looks to me like the families of Amy and Robert sure prayed to someone other than God. When they prayed they weren't even praying to one of the demigods Catholics call saints. Not much difference between Catholic offering of prayers to the ordinary spirit of dead Katharine Drexel and what we see New Age channelers, gypsy "mediums" or itinerant media faith healers doing. All are invoking powers not of God, despite their claims, and this is is something Almighty God has clearly told us is a no-no.

Need help with your prayers? God knows that all His children have needs, some of which they may not even be aware of. Being a loving and nurturing Father to His children, He provides that help in the form of a divine Intercessor.

Romans 8:26, "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered."

In other words, every Christian has God the Holy Spirit as his "prayer partner." Seems to me that is about as good as it gets, as far as our needs are concerned. And when we pray for others, we direct those pleadings not to some pale spirit but to Almighty God Himself.

Catholics, please put down your Catechism and pick up your Bible.

[url=http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Roman%20Catholicism/rcc2-pray.htm]Source[/url]

vanstanzy: Thank you brother for opening up such a discussion. I too am a Catholic and find it rather amusing sometimes when other denominations claim we worship statues. I found it even very annoying when someone who is supposed to be a fellow Catholic opened his mouth and claimed Catholics worship Mary and her Statue. Just because he sees women rolling on the ground before the Statue. This is totally wrong, because noone is allowed to worship any other than God Himself. But one thing that friend of mine and people around fail to understand, hitherto some Catholics themselves, is that worship is a thing of the mind and noone can tell anothers mind except God.
To the question of Catholics worshipping statues,
Not at all. It's against the Catholic faith to worship anyone or anything but God.

Catholics do honor Mary - because she followed God's will for her. We understand that all Mary can do comes from God and that she has no power on her own. She is a created being and not divine.

Worship comes from the mind, heart and soul of a person - not from some outward action. Those who insist that what Catholics do has to be worship because it looks like it is to them means that person is setting themselves up at the same level of God. Only God knows a person's heart. This is the exact type of judgement Jesus preaches against in Matt. 1:7 and so the person is going directly against Christ's teachings. It also means that they are spreading gossip about someone else that goes against Pro. 19:5 and Ex 20:16.

False worship is placing someone or something above God. That could money, power, our own convenience. That's far more common type of false worship than praying to Mary. Veneration is honoring someone/something but understanding that it is not equal to God and that all the power comes from God. They are very different things.

In my experience, people who have a strong dedication to Mary have an even stronger dedication to God. They may be more comfortable outwardly expressing the honor for Mary/saints which can give people a false impression (especially those who are not familiar with a particular culture). The thing is - if one is really dedicated to Mary or the saints, Mary/saints are going to point the person to God. They are in heaven, perfectly united with God - that's part of what God wants them to do. Whereas if someone is overly dedicated to power, money or themselves - that's not leading anywhere close to God.

Praying to Mary and the saints is about recognizing that ALL believers are part of the Body of Christ. One does not stop being part of the Body of Christ when one goes to heaven - in fact one becomes perfectly united with Christ. The bible teaches that believers are suppose to help and pray for each other - so God isn't going to prevent those in heaven from following Christ's teachings. Understanding that those in heaven can hear and help us isn't giving them powers equal to God - it's understanding that God does His will through His Body (which includes those in heaven).

Source: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120718044528AAwElPe

I rest my case...

vanstanzy: Thank you brother for opening up such a discussion. I too am a Catholic and find it rather amusing sometimes when other denominations claim we worship statues. I found it even very annoying when someone who is supposed to be a fellow Catholic opened his mouth and claimed Catholics worship Mary and her Statue. Just because he sees women rolling on the ground before the Statue. This is totally wrong, because noone is allowed to worship any other than God Himself. But one thing that friend of mine and people around fail to understand, hitherto some Catholics themselves, is that worship is a thing of the mind and noone can tell anothers mind except God.
To the question of Catholics worshipping statues,
Not at all. It's against the Catholic faith to worship anyone or anything but God.

Catholics do honor Mary - because she followed God's will for her. We understand that all Mary can do comes from God and that she has no power on her own. She is a created being and not divine.

Worship comes from the mind, heart and soul of a person - not from some outward action. Those who insist that what Catholics do has to be worship because it looks like it is to them means that person is setting themselves up at the same level of God. Only God knows a person's heart. This is the exact type of judgement Jesus preaches against in Matt. 1:7 and so the person is going directly against Christ's teachings. It also means that they are spreading gossip about someone else that goes against Pro. 19:5 and Ex 20:16.

False worship is placing someone or something above God. That could money, power, our own convenience. That's far more common type of false worship than praying to Mary. Veneration is honoring someone/something but understanding that it is not equal to God and that all the power comes from God. They are very different things.

In my experience, people who have a strong dedication to Mary have an even stronger dedication to God. They may be more comfortable outwardly expressing the honor for Mary/saints which can give people a false impression (especially those who are not familiar with a particular culture). The thing is - if one is really dedicated to Mary or the saints, Mary/saints are going to point the person to God. They are in heaven, perfectly united with God - that's part of what God wants them to do. Whereas if someone is overly dedicated to power, money or themselves - that's not leading anywhere close to God.

Praying to Mary and the saints is about recognizing that ALL believers are part of the Body of Christ. One does not stop being part of the Body of Christ when one goes to heaven - in fact one becomes perfectly united with Christ. The bible teaches that believers are suppose to help and pray for each other - so God isn't going to prevent those in heaven from following Christ's teachings. Understanding that those in heaven can hear and help us isn't giving them powers equal to God - it's understanding that God does His will through His Body (which includes those in heaven).

Source: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20120718044528AAwElPe

I rest my case...

Reyginus: help me with this
https://www.nairaland.com/1104124/problem-catholism-an-introspection

tobechi20:

i know a protestant girl who lost her mum . Each day, she wakes up, she greets d pics good morning. she would hug the enlarged pics of her mum. She would clean the image removing all the dirts.

No öne dared speak a negative word about her. Insult her late mum, she get angry. She beats you or starts crying if she is in capable of beating you. But her mum was dead. What would you call that?

vanstanzy: The truth has got to be told though. As a practicing Catholic and born into a Catholic family, i have to say

*i think* some Catholics get it wrong here cause throwing themselves in front of an image can be

seen by all as Idolatry. But again who can judge? when noone can see anothers mind.


When i appear before a Statue of Christ, i close my eyes and try to visualize on the Person of Christ, cos he's the

One am praying to.

Mods front page please i beg you all.

ijawkid:

I would define her actions as idolatry too.....I would never support any act of idolatry....all forms of idolatry are detestable before Yahweh.........

Hugging and greeting her late mums picture is tantamount to ancestral worship and ofcus idolatry.......

Idolatry is idolatry....let the truth be told....walking up to a fake marys statute and bowing to it is nothing but IDOLATRY.....

I just can't understand why catholics would not grasp this lucid scriptural truth....

Missonas: We wud keep arguing back and forth without refusing 2reason.we dnt worship idols,jst lyk d pentecoastals wud say dey dnt see deir pastors as demigods and d muslims wud say Jesus Christ is nt d son of God.so many disparities,dis is exactly wot d devil wants.whatever jst serve d Lord ur God with all your heart and LOVE one another,this we can do without arguements na shey?GOD IS LOVE!!!Peace...

tobechi20: you are funny brother.so you call talking ,greeting an image (a non living thin )worship.

Children who sing Rain rain go away Also worship the pain since its not living thing they are singing too.

Have you heard of personification?