Ihedinobi:

I'm not merely being sarcastic, shdemidemi, I'm mocking you.

Now, what do those Scriptures say that contradict what I said? And why do you have this penchant for qualifying the things that Scriptures say? Why do you add brackets? Are the Scriptures unclear without them?

DrummaBoy: @Ihedinobi

Your post where you say U will take prisoners if anyone detracts from the person of Jesus are the same reason I disagree with U.

How does an individual that teaches that there are elements and principles in the law of Moses applicable today, not detract from Christ?

Do you understand the persecution and hate Paul endured bc he taught that circumcision no longer applied to gentile Christians?

He called it the offence of the cross. So how do you convince me that tithing differ from circumcision? In fact circumcision is given greater prominence than tithe in the OT and Paul discountenanced it, how much more the tithe?

That anyone encourages believers to tithe, or say a person will not be saved except they tithe or that some laws of Moses still apply to Christians today - that person is saying Jesus' cross is not sufficient and is detracting from Christ and must be resisted.

Your views are interesting but I can't agree on your position on the law.

christemmbassey: pls can u explain this ur post, i hate to missudastand ppl. God bless.

shdemidemi:

see, being under the law means you would carry out all of it like 'an eye for an eye' , stoning people to death and all. We say the law of Moses is not for a christian does not mean some contents within the law of moses can't be found when we become spiritual.

shdemidemi:

I take the mock as a compliment then. It contradict because asides the common acceptance Christ, it teaches us not to accommodate any other gospel.

I put the bracket because of people like you who argue endlessly and find it difficult to discern easily.

shdemidemi: ^^^^my days, see questions. This Ihedinobi has to be a joke, check how many question his got up there for drummaboy. Good luck men, I am out of here.

shdemidemi:

Paul told his son to stay in that church which is a predominantly gentile church, but they still had people preaching a gospel that accommodate judaism to the church. Paul told Timothy to avoid history of how it was done before and how they are descendants of David or Abraham or anyone for that matter. Paul told him to stick to the gospel he taught him , he(Paul) knew if any other doctrine is added, it won't be the gospel of Christ anymore.

Bidam:

It is evidently clear to all and sundry that timothy learnt sacred scriptures NOT from Paul when he was a child but from his grandmother, Lois, and his mother, Eunice, he had learned to know the Scriptures from childhood (2Ti 1:5). The holy scriptures. The Books given by inspiration. The Jewish Scriptures are primarily meant, but a part of the New Testament was already written. Which are able to make thee wise unto salvation. Give thee the wisdom that leads to salvation. If the Old Testament could make him wise, how much more the New Testament! Through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

frosbel:

correct this time .

Bidam: what i still don't understand is how you can explain timothy knowing of the scriptures when he was a child .Paul wasn't there to teach him. It is very clear and evident from scriptures that someone taught timothy the scriptures..lemme quote KJV and other translations i googled so you will get the gist and meat of this matter.


2 Timothy 3:15

Viewing the King James Version.

And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

It is evidently clear to all and sundry that timothy learnt sacred scriptures NOT from Paul when he was a child but from his grandmother, Lois, and his mother, Eunice, he had learned to know the Scriptures from childhood (2Ti 1:5). The holy scriptures. The Books given by inspiration. The Jewish Scriptures are primarily meant, but a part of the New Testament was already written. Which are able to make thee wise unto salvation. Give thee the wisdom that leads to salvation. If the Old Testament could make him wise, how much more the New Testament! Through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Ihedinobi: The only thing I do not compromise on is Who the Lord Jesus is. On that matter, I'm ever a merciless warrior. Even though I may rebuke and chastise on doctrinal issues, on this one, I go all out and I take absolutely no prisoners. So every doctrine that takes something away from Christ by making Him less than the Scriptures make Him is one on which I will not compromise. Every spirit or attitude which does not receive Jesus as God come in the flesh and every doctrine that goes contrary to that is one I do not tolerate.

DrummaBoy: @Ihedinobi

Your post where you say U will take prisoners if anyone detracts from the person of Jesus are the same reason I disagree with U.

I did not say I will take prisoners, I said that I don't take prisoners under certain conditions. That's why I ask why it's difficult for you guys to read and understand people you think you are disagreeing with.

How does an individual that teaches that there are elements and principles in the law of Moses applicable today, not detract from Christ?

Do you have the stamina for that discussion? Or are you gonna shout all over the place, be outraged, walk out and return so many times that it will be impossible to discuss coherently with you?

Do you understand the persecution and hate Paul endured bc he taught that circumcision no longer applied to gentile Christians?

If he indeed taught what you said that he taught, why did he call us Christians the true circumcision?

He called it the offence of the cross. So how do you convince me that tithing differ from circumcision? In fact circumcision is given greater prominence than tithe in the OT and Paul discountenanced it, how much more the tithe?

What exactly did Paul call the offence of the Cross? Can you state it exactly?

That anyone encourages believers to tithe, or say a person will not be saved except they tithe or that some laws of Moses still apply to Christians today - that person is saying Jesus' cross is not sufficient and is detracting from Christ and must be resisted.

And have I taught that or even implied it in any way?

Your views are interesting but I can't agree on your position on the law.

I did not ask you to agree. I've never asked anyone to agree. I have demanded that my positions be properly, critically and honestly appraised. Have you done that?

shdemidemi:

You infer too much and wrongly sometimes, don't force the scriptures to say what you want. The man still refers to Timothy as a young man even until he wrote to Timothy about how he should conduct himself in church (and this was about when he was killed)
12 Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.
.
The boy you claim knew scriptures through the old testament was not even circumcised when Paul adopted him. All through Paul's ministry, all he was fighting against was the mixing of Jewish tradition of the law to christianity.



3 Him would Paul have to go forth with him; and took and circumcised him because of the Jews which were in those quarters: for they knew all that his father was a Greek.

Please, never try to link the jewish way or the scriptures from the time of Moses to the gospel of Christ that Paul preached. If you have to link, you can go to Adam or Abraham but definitely not Moses or the mosaic law.

Bidam: Do you study with a concordance bible at all or you just arrogantly love to argue for arguing sake? This your twisting of scripture is even more heretic than obadiah's.

Bidam: Do you study with a concordance bible at all or you just arrogantly love to argue for arguing sake? This your twisting of scripture is even more heretic than obadiah's.

DrummaBoy: Jesus said by their fruit you will know them. This confusing of law with grace: what has it led to in our church life?

1. Baby Christians: Believers who can't think for themselves but must depend on laws of do's and don'ts; or depend on a Pastor's thus saith the Lord.

2. Restoration of a new levithical priesthood: Men of God!

3. Prosperity gospel: when believers are not assured of an eternal security, they secure a temporal one for themselves.

4. Preoccupation with irrelevance: revivals and programs without end.

5. Biblical illiteracy: believer who do not know their bible. Who cannot divide the word rightly

6. Miracle seeking: and the consequent vulnerability of the church to quacks and false prophets. Case in point: T B Joshua.

7. A death of knowledge of church history: believer who do not know what led to the Reformation; stories of the great awakening; Wesley, Whitefield, Spurgeon, and even our own CAC apostle Babalola; etc.

Ihedinobi:

Lol.

1. Have I said that we Christians are under any law?

2. If the law of Moses is not for Christians, none of it will be found when we become spiritual.

ayoku777:

Common guy, so you mean without the law of Moses we can't but murder and commit adultery Remember Joseph overcame adultery temptation from potipher's wife over 500years before the Law of Moses. If you have the life of Christ we will manifest it by the Spirit and it will be without the law. This thing is too obvious bro.

Ihedinobi:

The exact same point where shdemidemi is stumbling all over the issue.

You know, it would be lovely if you guys recognized that once the Foundation is the same, we will only eventually agree. If you understood this, then we could really discuss.

I asked shdemidemi what the law of Moses was. If you'd been following that discussion, you'd have learned by now that I ask questions for a reason. Perhaps you should try to answer that question for yourself.

However, I will repeat to you what I've already said here on this thread: the Law that Moses received from God in the desert did not start existing there in the desert. It is Eternal. Have I not already said that to you specifically in different words?

The Law is Christ, it has never changed and it will never change. Joseph was responding to it when he chose to reject Potiphar's wife's offer, Abel was responding to it when he built an altar to the Lord and offered a sacrifice of blood. Job was responding to it as well when he made sacrifices for sin and took care of the poor and needy. That Law is spiritual and all men have dealt with it from the beginning and will do so until the end.

But something definitely changed after our Lord ratified the New Covenant. At the risk of sounding arrogant, I ask you to think and tell me what you think it was that changed. It's pretty easy to find in the Scriptures especially in the letter to the Hebrews which was specifically written to explain to Hebrew believers what had happened to Moses because of the Death and Resurrection of our Lord.

I am ready and willing to pursue as full an understanding of this issue as the Lord grants us now if you are too. If you're not right now, too bad.

DrummaBoy:



OK. I believe I got you wrong there. But It could still correctly be said that while you do not take prisoners on "certain condition", you will take prisoners on some other conditions - like in a case where you feel anyone is detracting from the person of the Lord. If not you would probably have stopped commenting here. My point in the above statement does not change, I believe your position on Law and grace detract from the person of Jesus and that is why the contention still remains.

It would have been good to answer my question straight away rather than betray pious arrogance with whether I have stamina or not. If I do not have stamina and you do, why don't you show it. I mean, by now we would all have been disciples of Ihedinobi if your stamina (for arguing) was than incredible.
But that said; I want to know how you can decipher whether an individual is shouting or not, when we are all limited here by electronic writing? And to use your medicine against you (a penchant for questioning) could you qoute any of my post anywhere on NL where I was "outraged". My style does not allow for the back and forth argument you seem to relish with the likes of demi and Boomark; that is why I make my point and leave it to your conscience to see whether it is true or not. But you have succeeded in making me change my style now and must say well done on that.

There would have been no need for us all to discuss this grace issue if Paul did not teach against cirmcumcision (Acts15:1,2; Galatians 2:4-6)

And you know very well that the circumcision I said Paul spoke against was circumcision of the flesh done with human hands. Of course, he showed us that the circumcision that means anything to God today is the one done in the heart. Like the working of God's Spirit in men's heart. The same way the laws are written on our hearts and the same way it is totally absurd to think that the bases for paying tithe is bc a written code in Moses laws command paying tithe. If we would follow the logic of how circumcision in the flesh has now translated to circumcision in the heart; so also a code of paying tithe and offering has now been translated to "giving as every man purposeth in his hearth" 2 corinthians 9:7. To teach any other thing from this is to teach false doctrine and it is to detract from Jesus' gospel

You find the offence of the cross related to circumcision in Galatians 5:11. And no wonder some folks are mortally offended if anyone insinuates Christians must not pay tithe.

To your credit you have not. But when you ally with those who do, one can assume that you do also.

So far will I go with my appraisal of your last post to me.

ayoku777:

Ok, if the Law of Moses is the same as the 'Law' of Christ, then which law was Paul talking about in 2Cor 3v7, which he referred to as the ministration of death, written and engraved in stones, which glory was to be done away? Please be direct, don't dance around semantics. Purity of heart and motive is needed to understand scripture and I need you to use both to answer this. What law was engraved in stone and done away with?

DrummaBoy:


The mystery behind the great danfo is revealed. He is Roman Catholic. He can loose his salvation. See where pentecostals got there doctrine from... Catholics. No wonder the morbid hatred for Paul; will Roman Catholics not hate him forever who through his writting delivered the church from the reign of Popery 1600 years after his death.

And some of these neo-Judaizers are trying to return us back, not to bondage to the Pope but to little popes called general overseers.

shdemidemi:

kindly show me where I have twisted anything from my response.

obadiah777: JUDAZ ISKARIATTTTTT SMDH

shdemidemi:

You infer too much and wrongly sometimes, don't force the scriptures to say what you want.

The man still refers to Timothy as a young man even until he wrote to Timothy about how he should conduct himself in church (and this was about when he was killed)
12 Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an example of the believers, in word, in conversation, in charity, in spirit, in faith, in purity.

The boy you claim knew scriptures through the old testament was not even circumcised when Paul adopted him. All through Paul's ministry, all he was fighting against was the mixing of Jewish tradition of the law to christianity.

Please, never try to link the jewish way or the scriptures from the time of Moses to the gospel of Christ that Paul preached. If you have to link, you can go to Adam or Abraham but definitely not Moses or the mosaic law.

Ihedinobi:

Lol.

1. Have I said that we Christians are under any law?

2. If the law of Moses is not for Christians, none of it will be found when we become spiritual.

obadiah777: JUDAZ ISKARIATTTTTT SMDH

ayoku777:

Common guy, so you mean without the law of Moses we can't but murder and commit adultery Remember Joseph overcame adultery temptation from potipher's wife over 500years before the Law of Moses. If you have the life of Christ we will manifest it by the Spirit and it will be without the law. This thing is too obvious bro.