9jacrip:

It is normal for people to sing exaggerated eulogies on one's passing.
Wait till it's WS time and you'd be surprised how people will sing his acclaim.
Between you make it seem like the award is not organized by these same western nations. Going by Wole's record of receiving honorary degrees from several universities and lecturing in diff schools in that same USA then...

You have just made my day. Pls as from now, let the foools continue to rant.

babyosisi:

Aren't we saying the same thing?
A virtual unknown in the USA despite his Nobel
What is your beef then?
People all over the world who desire fame want to be known in America so if America doesn't know you,the world doesn't know you
That is just the gospel truth

"Things Fall Apart" which you are making noise about being read is the United States is read more as a work of anthropology than a literary piece.

Ola Johnson:
"Things Fall Apart" which you are making noise about being read is the United States is read more as a work of anthropology than a literary piece.

That one is even better sef.

But don't get it twisted, Achebe is the classic writer of Africa, just like Shakespeare is for Europe.

This is the Father of Modern African Literature we are talking abt.
A status coveted by the Laurette Soyinka.smh

9jacrip:

At the bolded: you're so funny I yell ya. Where is Achebe coming up? Whenever a field comes up, it is those who have won reputable awards or acclaims that come up first! It is like saying because Wande Coal is good, his name comes up before Dbanj? LOL!. Between WS' name is not only relegated to WAfrican literature, it is written in the sands of time as the first African and Nigerian to win the most coveted award for writers.

It doesn't mean that Soyinka is not a local champion compared to Achebe

babyosisi:

Americans don't behave like Nigerians
They will call an evil man an evil man even in death and all his sins will be brought out
I saw that first hand when president Nixon died,nobody spared him
They are blunt like that

Absolute nonsense !!! The same America where Bush lied evilly about "weapons of mass destruction" as an excuse to use in destroying a whole Sovereign Country? Do you guys think before you come out with some crap to defend your prejudices and affiliations? Americans can be as hypocritical, as deceptive and as self-serving as they come !!!!!

babyosisi:

Aren't we saying the same thing?
A virtual unknown in the USA despite his Nobel
What is your beef then?
People all over the world who desire fame want to be known in America so if America doesn't know you,the world doesn't know you
That is just the gospel truth

1. Nobel prizes are not awarded on the basis of popularity let alone, one based on the US alone. In almost 110 years of the Nobel prize being awarded in literature, less than 10 Americans have won it. In almost 45 years of the Nobel prize being awarded in Economics, almost 45 Americans have won it. What does that indicate? That Americans are gods when it comes to economics but are below average in literature considering the US has the largest population of native English speakers. So America can never be a yardstick for measuring the popularity of writers. It is like stating, ignorantly, that artists not known in the US are not proper artists. Is the US known for Arts?

2. It is obvious that you live in the US and you want to vicariously claim greatness on the basis of your residence. Don’t be fooled, the US has quantity but lacks in quality in almost all facets of life. Europeans still, on average, have better quality of life than Americans. So don’t for one second think that your American made piece of junk called a car or house is better than what you will find in Europe. More Chevrolets are sold in the world, does it make it better than a Ferrari? Where am I going with this? Popularity or quantity means jack shit when quality is around.

3. Achebe will, obviously, be more popular than Soyinka in the US because he worked and lived there for several years. Unfortunately, Soyinka was too bothered with the mess in Nigeria that he chose to stay in Nigeria and fight for the rights of Nigerians. He put others above himself. Soyinka could have also found work as a tenured professor almost anywhere in the world.

If you are going to be a bigoted warrior, at least try to be an intelligent one. Instead of being a dullard. Don't offer meaningless opinion in a debate because you will get slaughtered. Who the hell is Pico writing for an obscure piece of trash called 'Daily Kos'?

ngozievergreen:

That one is even better sef.

But don't get it twisted, Achebe is the classic writer of Africa, just like Shakespeare is for Europe.

This is the Father of Modern African Literature we are talking abt.
A status coveted by the Laurette Soyinka.smh

Ngozieverdumb,

Don't you get tired of living up to your moniker? Why don't you try to borrow a brain for once. Ask someone around you to read your posts and offer constructive criticism. Or is everyone around you dumb? Achebe and Soyinka are both great writers; you don't need to put one down so as to elevate the other.

If you are going to be bigoted, at least be intelligent. You can't be bigoted and dumb at the same time.

Katsumoto:

Ngozieverdumb,

Don't you get tired of living up to your moniker? Why don't you try to borrow a brain for once. Ask someone around you to read your posts and offer constructive criticism. Or is everyone around you dumb? Achebe and Soyinka are both great writers; you don't need to put one down so as to elevate the other.

If you are going to be bigoted, at least be intelligent. You can't be bigoted and dumb at the same time.

I believe he/she just confirm that one can be both!

ngozievergreen:

It doesn't mean that Soyinka is not a local champion compared to Achebe

Ok a local champion getting world acclaimed award and recognition most covetted by every writer while an international champion died w/out any of such recognition only eulogies and maybe more book sold? Do not forget high sales doesn't necessarily mean top quality.

Check this: when the many generations come after and they hear Achebe wrote things fall apart which has sold millions of copies and translated into diff languages while Soyinka 'was' the first African/Nigerians to win the Noble Laureate prize. Which do you think they would rever most? The guy with the award which stamped his place or the man with sales?

Oh and do not forget the most trivial electronic manuals also get translated into many languages so its nothing really .

Katsumoto:

1. Nobel prizes are not awarded on the basis of popularity let alone, one based on the US alone. In almost 110 years of the Nobel prize being awarded in literature, less than 10 Americans have won it. In almost 45 years of the Nobel prize being awarded in Economics, almost 45 Americans have won it. What does that indicate? That Americans are gods when it comes to economics but are below average in literature considering the US has the largest population of native English speakers. So America can never be a yardstick for measuring the popularity of writers. It is like stating, ignorantly, that artists not known in the US are not proper artists. Is the US known for Arts?

2. It is obvious that you live in the US and you want to vicariously claim greatness on the basis of your residence. Don’t be fooled, the US has quantity but lacks in quality in almost all facets of life. Europeans still, on average, have better quality of life than Americans. So don’t for one second think that your American made piece of junk called a car or house is better than what you will find in Europe. More Chevrolets are sold in the world, does it make it better than a Ferrari? Where am I going with this? Popularity or quantity means jack shit when quality is around.

3. Achebe will, obviously, be more popular than Soyinka in the US because he worked and lived there for several years. Unfortunately, Soyinka was too bothered with the mess in Nigeria that he chose to stay in Nigeria and fight for the rights of Nigerians. He put others above himself. Soyinka could have also found work as a tenured professor almost anywhere in the world.

If you are going to be a bigoted warrior, at least try to be an intelligent one. Instead of being a dullard. Don't offer meaningless opinion in a debate because you will get slaughtered. Who the hell is Pico writing for an obscure piece of trash called 'Daily Kos'?

Well done for educating her. Too many ignoramuses here. Personally, Soyinka should keep to his pledge and take his deserved rest. The man does not deserve the insults from uncouth ingrates.

Imagine Soyinka who has always fought for all Nigerians when so many who are loud mouths today hid frightfully ? An old man who still showed up to march for GEJ in 2010 while the slimy and clannish elements 'eating' with the President today were all cowering in fear? Insults and hateful slurs is all Soyinka gets from absolute ingrates called "Nigerians".

The man should fashi Nigeria permanently abeg. Ditto for Falana et al. Have you noticed Falana has gone silent also? Let these guys start channelling their energy into what matters. Nigeria is a Nation of ethnocentric ingrates not really worth fighting for. Abeg bring on regionalism so that, officially, everyone will be mandated to go and mind their own business.

Gbawe:

Well done for educating her. Too many ignoramuses here. Personally, Soyinka should keep to his pledge and take his deserved rest. The man does not deserve the insults from uncouth ingrates.

Imagine Soyinka who has always fought for all Nigerians? An old man who still showed up to march for GEJ in 2010 while the slimy and clannish elements 'eating' with the President today were all cowering in fear? Insults and hateful slurs is all Soyinka gets from absolute ingrates. The man should fashi Nigeria permanently abeg. Ditto for Falana et al. Have you noticed Falana has gone silent also? Abeg bring on regionalism so that, officially, everyone will be mandated to go and mind their own business.

That should be the new Yoruba consciousness; there should be no more Yoruba lives on the line for a bunch of undeserving ingrates. I hope Falana also keeps mum.

ngozievergreen:
-He started saying that Achebe is wrongly labelled the Father of Modern African Lit (I thought the Nobel prize was the best award? )

For posterity, this is the view expressed by Soyinka

Soyinka: As you yourself have observed, Chinua himself repudiated such a tag – he did study literature after all, bagged a degree in the subject. So, it is a tag of either literary ignorance or “momentary exuberance” – ala [Nadine] Gordimer – to which we are all sometimes prone. Those who seriously believe or promote this must be asked: have you the sheerest acquaintance with the literatures of other African nations, in both indigenous and adopted colonial languages? What must the francophone, lusophone, Zulu, Xhosa, Ewe etc. etc. literary scholars and consumers think of those who persist in such a historic absurdity? It's as ridiculous as calling WS father of contemporary African drama! Or Mazisi Kunene father of African epic poetry. Or Kofi Awoonor father of African poetry.Education is lacking in most of those who pontificate.

ngozievergreen: He started insulting African Writers Series -of which Achebe headed, all because he,soyinka didn't qualify to join them.

Soyinka, W. (1970). The interpreters; London: Heinemann -- http://www.amazon.com/The-Interpreters-African-Writers-Series/dp/0435900765

Soyinka: I must tell you that, at the beginning, I was very skeptical of the Heinemann's African Series. As a literary practitioner, my instinct tends towards a suspicion of “ghetto” classifications – which I did feel this was bound to be. When you run a regional venture, it becomes a junior relation to what exists. Sri Lankan literature should evolve and be recognized as literature of Sri Lanka, release after release, not entered as a series. You place the books on the market and let them take off from there. Otherwise there is the danger that you start hedging on standards. You feel compelled to bring out quantity, which might compromise on quality.

I refused to permit my works to appear in the series – to begin with. My debut took place while I was Gowon's guest in Kaduna prisons and permission to publish The Interpreters was granted in my absence. Exposure itself is not a bad thing, mind you. Accessibility. Making works available – that’s not altogether negative. Today, several scholars write their PhD theses on Onitsha Market literature. Both Chinua and Cyprian Ekwensi – not forgetting Henshaw and others – published with those enterprising houses. It was outside interests that classified them Onitsha Market Literature, not the publishers. They simply published.

All in all, the odds come down in favour of the series – which, by the way, did go through the primary phase of sloppy inclusiveness, then became more discriminating. Aig Higo – who presided some time after Chinua – himself admitted it.

ngozievergreen: He didn't even attend the guy's burial.

He gave his reasons - the hawks were encircling...

@Katz&Gbawe: both you have said it all. Really the west needs this men and their like-minds.

ngozievergreen:

That one is even better sef.

But don't get it twisted, Achebe is the classic writer of Africa, just like Shakespeare is for Europe.

This is the Father of Modern African Literature we are talking abt.
A status coveted by the Laurette Soyinka.smh

Shut up! Wole Soyinka is believed to be the Williams Shakespeare of our time, they have the same initials, WS. Soyinka is sometimes rated higher because unlike Shakespeare who was a poet and dramatist, Soyinka, in addition to the two, is also a novelist. He also writes essays on happenings. Check out his essay on the Senate on same sex marriage, "Sexu.al Minority and Legislative Zealotry."

Ola Johnson:
Shut up! Wole Soyinka is believed to be the Williams Shakespeare of our time, they have the same initials, WS. Soyinka is sometimes rated higher because unlike Shakespeare who was a poet and dramatist, Soyinka, in addition to the two, is also a novelist. He also writes essays on happenings. Check out his essay on the Senate on same sex marriage, "Sexual Minority and Legislative Zealotry."

I am afraid you are not helping matters here.
Why do you insist on tagging Soyinka with labels that he has no need for, just because you want to antagonize his detractors?

If you continue in this vein, discerning minds may well conclude that this is more about Ola Johnson's catharsis rather than Soyinka or Achebe's place in the pantheon of literature.

Katsumoto:

Ngozieverdumb,

Don't you get tired of living up to your moniker? Why don't you try to borrow a brain for once. Ask someone around you to read your posts and offer constructive criticism. Or is everyone around you dumb? Achebe and Soyinka are both great writers; you don't need to put one down so as to elevate the other.

If you are going to be bigoted, at least be intelligent. You can't be bigoted and dumb at the same time.

Oya tell that to ola johnson

eGuerrilla:

I am afraid you are not helping matters here.
Why do you insist on tagging Soyinka with labels that he has no need for, just because you want to antagonize his detractors?

I have to agree with this.

Katsumoto always delivers and sets the record straight. I now see why after the encounter Dede had with him on the Oseni thread, Dede avoids any thread Katsumoto is present.

eGuerrilla:

I am afraid you are not helping matters here.
Why do you insist on tagging Soyinka with labels that he has no need for, just because you want to antagonize his detractors?

If you continue in this vein, discerning minds may well conclude that this is more about Ola Johnson's catharsis rather than Soyinka or Achebe's place in the pantheon of literature.

I've not used any tag that is exclusively Ola Johnson's. I got this "same initials, WS" from a literary column I read.

Katsumoto:

That should be the new Yoruba consciousness; there should be no more Yoruba lives on the line for a bunch of undeserving ingrates. I hope Falana also keeps mum.

I think this is the case. I think events of late and the divisive nature of GEJ has been a needed eye-opener for many Yorubas including myself. I still have love for all Nigerians but let us go back to regionalism so that, officially, everyone will be mandated to go and mind their own business. We can then take it from there when braggarts, ingrates and those into self-denial have learnt some valuable lessons about life and why it is never good, in an evil world, to take benevolent people for granted even as human nature leads many of us to be inclined to do this.

I know the Yorubas will have no problem with regionalism . The Yorubas have no deficiency at all in relation to the possession of innate qualities that has helped Nations and civilisations to build great Countries and empires. About time we stopped carrying the problems of Nigeria on our head, and working for peace and diplomacy, only to be insulted and given unsavoury tags for doing such. Imagine Soyinka receiving these insults by some while same folks deify an opportunist like GEJ and other clannish AGIP elements who surround him currently and have been responsible for where Nigeria is today?

Look at our heroes in the sands of time like Fawehinmi and others? Was it worth it? The same Femi Falana, insulted mercilessly and called all manner of names because of his fuel subsidy stance, was the one who fought to keep Ken Saro-Wiwa alive !!! Yorubas should maintain the tolerance and 'live and let live' persona we are noted for but we should now focus wholly and pragmatically on ourselves. That is already happening anyway while others continue to make noise. Let Nigeria, a nation of ethnocentric ingrates, take care of itself. The part in red in your post above I fervently agree with.

eGuerrilla:

I am afraid you are not helping matters here.
Why do you insist on tagging Soyinka with labels that he has no need for, just because you want to antagonize his detractors?

If you continue in this vein, discerning minds may well conclude that this is more about Ola Johnson's catharsis rather than Soyinka or Achebe's place in the pantheon of literature.

Well said. Why do Nigerians even do this? Do other African Nation have even a single Chinua Achebe or Wole Soyinka to even be in the position of ungraciously pitting these men against each other day in day out in a needless and ethnically vainglorious battle of supremacy?

Ola Johnson:
Shut up! Wole Soyinka is believed to be the Williams Shakespeare of our time, they have the same initials, WS. Soyinka is sometimes rated higher because unlike Shakespeare who was a poet and dramatist, Soyinka, in addition to the two, is also a novelist. He also writes essays on happenings. Check out his essay on the Senate on same sex marriage, "Sexu.al Minority and Legislative Zealotry."

Dude the world is full of subliminally gifted writers. Avid readers do not generally obsess over pitting them against each other to establish supremacy. They appreciate the individual talent and enjoy the nuanced finesse of the great and distinguished ones. I personally don't get the comparison between Soyinka and Shakespeare and why anyone would attempt to make such to begin with.

Ola Johnson:
"Things Fall Apart" which you are making noise about being read in the United States is read .

Stop right there
The important verb there is read


Can't say same for any of Soyinka's books
That is the difference

That is why Soyinka is a virtual unknown in the USA
His books are not read,Achebe's are

Ola Johnson:
Shut up! Wole Soyinka is believed to be the Williams Shakespeare of our time, they have the same initials, WS. Soyinka is sometimes rated higher because unlike Shakespeare who was a poet and dramatist, Soyinka, in addition to the two, is also a novelist. He also writes essays on happenings. Check out his essay on the Senate on same sex marriage, "Sexu.al Minority and Legislative Zealotry."

Bwahahahahahahahahahaha
And I just learned that on nairaland of all places

_{Oluwole Soyinka is WS}
Hahahahahaha

babyosisi:

Stop right there
The important verb there is read


Can't say same for any of Soyinka's books
That is the difference

That is why Soyinka is a virtual unknown in the USA
His books are not read,Achebe's are

I will leave you to continue to grope in your dyslexia.

At least you accept defeat graciously
That is noble

Ola Johnson:
I will leave you to continue to grope in your dyslexia.

babyosisi: At least you accept defeat graciously
That is noble

So says someone that quoted an obscure writer writing for an obscure publication as proof of Soyinka's lack of penetration as a writer.

I guess it wasn't obvious to you that you need polls to decide such matters. And then you will claim to be a doctor when in fact, your reasoning provides that you are no more than a carer in an old folks home.

Where is Ileke-idi when you need her?

Katsumoto:

So says someone that quoted an obscure writer writing for an obscure publication as proof of Soyinka's lack of penetration as a writer.

I guess it wasn't obvious to you that you need polls to decide such matters. And then you will claim to be a doctor when in fact, your reasoning provides that you are no more than a carer in an old folks home.

Where is Ileke-idi when you need her?

Kai
Na so e pain you reach sotay u dey look for underwear to sniff
Pathetic transgendered

babyosisi:

Kai
Na so e pain you reach sotay u dey look for underwear to sniff
Pathetic transgendered

Can you tell us why we should take the opinion of an obscure writer writing for an obscure publication as a proper benchmark of popularity?

Can you explain why the US is a proper sampling country for literature giving its below average performance in the Literature category of the Nobel prize?

Assuming you live South Central L.A, do you think more people in South Central will know someone living in Onitsha more than you?

I don't do gutter language, so I will ignore that.

Things Fall Apart has been translated into 50 languages, making Achebe the most translated African writer of all time.

Chinua Achebe wrote an infamous critique entitled “An Image of Africa: Racism in Conrad’s Heart of Darkness,” that accused the novel of being racist. Other literary critics have found Achebe’s essay very provocative and controversial.

Hmm
Na who dey popular pass?

Gbawe:

I think this is the case. I think events of late and the divisive nature of GEJ has been a needed eye-opener for many Yorubas including myself. I still have love for all Nigerians but let us go back to regionalism so that, officially, everyone will be mandated to go and mind their own business. We can then take it from there when braggarts, ingrates and those into self-denial have learnt some valuable lessons about life and why it is never good, in an evil world, to take benevolent people for granted even as human nature leads many of us to be inclined to do this.

I know the Yorubas will have no problem with regionalism . The Yorubas have no deficiency at all in relation to the possession of innate qualities that has helped Nations and civilisations to build great Countries and empires. About time we stopped carrying the problems of Nigeria on our head, and working for peace and diplomacy, only to be insulted and given unsavoury tags for doing such. Imagine Soyinka receiving these insults by some while same folks deify an opportunist like GEJ and other clannish AGIP elements who surround him currently and have been responsible for where Nigeria is today?

Look at our heroes in the sands of time like Fawehinmi and others? Was it worth it? The same Femi Falana, insulted mercilessly and called all manner of names because of his fuel subsidy stance, was the one who fought to keep Ken Saro-Wiwa alive !!! Yorubas should maintain the tolerance and 'live and let live' persona we are noted for but we should now focus wholly and pragmatically on ourselves. That is already happening anyway while others continue to make noise. Let Nigeria, a nation of ethnocentric ingrates, take care of itself. The part in red in your post above I fervently agree with.

Yorubas have which qualities that. build civilized wetin ?

Are u talking of the same yorubas that mismanaged our public assets for many yrs?
Abeg shut it, u ppl are as incompetent as hell.
Totally unproductive.

Katsumoto:

So says someone that quoted an obscure writer writing for an obscure publication as proof of Soyinka's lack of penetration as a writer.

I guess it wasn't obvious to you that you need polls to decide such matters. And then you will claim to be a doctor when in fact, your reasoning provides that you are no more than a carer in an old folks home.

Where is Ileke-idi when you need her?

Just prove her wrong and move on.
Ileke idi will only come and start abuses

We don't want that here