vooks:
No sir, wasn't me!

I have stated my position; Miracles are still with us but they are far much rare than purported
I have shared one
Here is something I have observed; seldom do skeptics witness miracles. I mean the rabid antitheist guy who demands a one-on-one Damascus experience is more likely to perish in their stubbornness

Miracles do not provoke faith in the haughty and the wicked, they increase their hardness just like Pharaoh. But for believers, they increase your faith.

There is a difference between seeking miracles so that you may believe and seeking them because you are a believer. Where do you fall?

Whether I believe or don't believe is irrelevant. What is a fact is that most so called miracles are not. Most can't be proven and most pastors and congregations tell bare face lies and claim miracles deceiving themselves and others in the process.

Let's start a new thread and I will gladly and freely give you comprehension classes

nnenneigbo:


So this your friend, conceived, went on maternity and when you saw her(looks like you didn't even recognise her), she had to remind you of the fact you prayed for her etc etc hmmm!

SirJohn,
This is interesting. Hope Swahili is not too much to confuse you.

The man Gilbert Deya had a ministry in Kenya and a UK branch. Childless couple were promised miracle babies. This was actually a cover for human trafficking. The wife claimed to give birth SEVERALLY in one year

At one point she had gone to a government hospital with a newborn to register the birth and for maternal care. The doctors got suspicious because she exhibited NO signs of a newly delivered woman. ALmost comical. The Kenyan authorities arrested her and secured a conviction. She is now canned.
Her husband was in the UK. He has used all means to fight extradition unfortunately


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcB4Gwqque4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IvqU3Fqzj8

Look at some headlines here

What's unremarkable is that some people still defend him after this

To answer your question, WHY DO CHRISTIANS (STAGE) FAKE MIRACLES?
1. Profit- the spectacular is a money magnet. The woman with the issue of blood risked stoning just to get the touch. Desperate miracle seekers will pay ANYTHING to get it

2. Foolishness- some believers imagine that they are helping the 'cause' by ascribing fake miracles to Jesus. They think it is perfectly in order to lie to win souls. The end justifies the means

cc dorox, Winsomex,esere826

SirJohn:
Okay guys let me drop a few of my opinions here

Let me start by stating again like I have done before that I believe in miracles. However, like @vooks and several other people have mentioned, I believe miracles are not as frequently occurring as some people would have us believe. It's not because of our unbelief or inefficiencies but simply because it is Almighty Gods will at this time.
There are documented supernatural and miraculous occurrences across the world including medical miracles, and a number of them are not even linked to Christianity nor were some of the recipients true believers.
Like vooks mentioned, its important we accept the reality on ground otherwise we will be snared into false hope and false belief system which eventually leads to the kinds of false testimonies we see today in the pentecostal circles.

The story of Jeff here on Nairaland is an example of how deep this syndrome has eaten into the church. I still find it hard to understand why people fake testimonies and lay claim to miraculous healings that never took place. In the Joagbaje-Jeff scenerio, what could possibly have happened? Why would Jeff openly lie about being cured of HIV? was it all planned? This bit we may never be able to answer like many other such claims.

Sadly, Jeffs case is not the only case I have unraveled in recent times. I remember a couple just like in vooks' story who were married without children for over five years. The couple was then introduced to a woman in PortHarcourt who was said to be an expert in fertility. She promised to help them get children through trado-medical treatment, she even bragged that she could make the woman conceive twins. They were asked to pay I think about 600k for this treatment, a male child went for a higher amount.

They paid and then the woman was given a concoction of herbal drugs and was given a time to meet with her husband. What she didn't know was that the drugs contained substances that mimic pregnancy symptoms including nausea, weight gain, enlarged bosoms, morning sickness and even swollen tommy (surprise right?). She was told that she could only visit the center for ante natal and that pregnancy tests may show negative but that she shouldn't worry about that. To cut the story short, she was also told that her delivery would be done in their centre and only by that woman. Nine months later, this woman was already carrying a bouncing baby girl, some months later, she was dedicating her baby in one of the pentecostal churches in Lagos, but never mentioned she had gone to meet this woman in PH. If you watch Channels news regularly, you would have seen the fake fertility doctor a couple of months back cos she has been arrested.

But here's a shocking twist to true story, this woman was never pregnant, the babies are not hers and she and her husband are unaware till date. she was given a sedative drug during the fake delivery during which she was even cut so she would bleed. I know some people reading this can already relate to it. But in the eyes of the church members and even the pastor, ANOTHER MIRACLE HAD HAPPENED

vooks:
....What's unremarkable is that some people still defend him after this

Exodus 21:2-6 If you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve for six years; but on the seventh he shall go out as a free man without payment. 3If he comes alone, he shall go out alone; if he is the husband of a wife, then his wife shall go out with him. 4If his master gives him a wife, and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall belong to her master, and he shall go out alone. 5But if the slave plainly says, ‘I love my master, my wife and my children; I will not go out as a free man,’ 6then his master shall bring him to God, then he shall bring him to the door or the doorpost. And his master shall pierce his ear with an awl; and he shall serve him permanently.

To answer your question, WHY DO CHRISTIANS (STAGE) FAKE MIRACLES?
1. Profit- the spectacular is a money magnet. The woman with the issue of blood risked stoning just to get the touch. Desperate miracle seekers will pay ANYTHING to get it
2. Foolishness- some believers imagine that they are helping the 'cause' by ascribing fake miracles to Jesus. They think it is perfectly in order to lie to win souls. The end justifies the means

forgive me, but I'm not comfortable with the word "lie" here. Maybe its me, but I tend to describe what you've stated as "deception".
"Lie" feels more like a pastor preaching and when he forgets the passage quickly lies and says "in genesis 1, God said in the beginning was the Word..."
"Deception" on the other hand sounds like someone with full and planned intention to purposely twist facts to serve an intended purpose

Read more about Christ Embassy from here http://www.edumacro.com/christ-embassy-international-pastor-chris-oyakhilome-and-rev-anita/

How is every one?

Kenyan28:
How is every one?

Me good. And you?

but he healed them. why you all up in his business tho

Hey people?
Long time.

Kenyan28:
Hey people? Long time.

yeah, how are you today?

Bump..

This post is very disturbing and I don't agree with much of the conclusions of the original poster HOWEVER I must confess that he is sincere and I want to say something somewhat corroborative of what he's said.

I too was a member of CE from 2002 through mid 2008 when due to a mysterious uneasiness and restlessness in my spirit, I quietly quit the place. I still hold Pastor Chris in very high esteem. However, I must confess that there seem to be a huge scam going on in the Healing School. To start with, I thought it wasn't something too malicious but from reading SirJohn here I must admit that the fakery is a clear reproach on the Blessed Holy Spirit. How did I arrive at this distasteful conclusion? In 2003 I enthusiastically sent a daughter of my convert in Ijegun, Satellite Town Lagos who was deaf and dumb to the healing school. The forms were free and I had faith. Sadly, my convert was very discouraged because of the way the school was run then. He told me that he met a man there who was confined to a wheelchair. He has had a lot of teaching from me as well as from tapes I had lent him so he was very handy in encouraging this sick man who seemed to have broken a spinal chord (I am not so sure but he was in a wheelchair though). My convert said this man got a healing during prayers before ever Pastor Chris prayed for him. He was able to walk somewhat haltingly but absolutely without pain. To my converts chagrin and surprise, during a Night of Bliss programme few days later, the very same man was confined to his wheelchair at a special healing school session and prayed for by Pastor Chris. I was there live in that service and how we screamed for joy as the man walked out of the chair. My convert was sorely discouraged. This was because the man was already healed before the staged 'healing'. And what's worse? They refused his deaf mute daughter the opportunity of being prayed for.

Well the staff of the Healing School were very strict so that one night, as this poor convert of mine was coming to Satellite town from Ikeja after school (and that costs a fortune!) his mute daughter had stepped on a spiky rod protruding from the bus as they were about to alight. The girl was mighty stubborn due to her deafness I assume. So her father asked her to come down and she kept musing rubbish being unable to tell the father her leg was stuck. In anger the father dragged her and her leg was badly torn leading to serious bleeding. They wound up in the hospital where she got stitches. They had to miss healing school classes for two days.

When they did resume inspite of tendering medical evidence as well as physical evidence of the little girl's injury, the staff refused to bulged but insisted that the girl had been disqualified and would have to commence a new session at the end of the current one. With this my convert angrily gave it up and did yell on them that they were only interested in praying for the wealthy and the "healed". He came off that place totally convinced that Pastor Chris was sincere but that his staff were very insincere.

Needless to say I was pleased with his conclusion but I was confused about the very idea of staging healed people to wheelchairs to fake instantaneous healings. With SirJohn's story now I am convinced that my fears in 2003 has been confirmed. I don't know what to think! [/b][b]

Healing school is going on in lagos . Just simply take a sick person there and find out for yourself not by other men story. I have 3 people there . One has complete miracle already without pastor chris praying for them yet. Just by the teaching in the classes and prayers of faith . The other who's husband had stroke and mental challenge for 2 years called yesterday . His mind is restored already . He's beginning to walk far better . Pastor chris has not laid hands on them yet . Many are healed .

erickatchy:
This post is very disturbing and I don't agree with much of the conclusions of the original poster

I told him same thing . The experience may be true but the conclusion was not right . I had people sent there . Many got healed some didn't . There could be human error also among the officials.

.

He told me that he met a man there who was confined to a wheelchair. He has had a lot of teaching from me as well as from tapes I had lent him so he was very handy in encouraging this sick man who seemed to have broken a spinal chord (I am not so sure but he was in a wheelchair though).

My convert said this man got a healing during prayers before ever Pastor Chris prayed for him. He was able to walk somewhat haltingly but absolutely without pain

I would want us to take note of the highlighted part above

To my converts chagrin and surprise, during a Night of Bliss programme few days later, the very same man was confined to his wheelchair at a special healing school session and prayed for by Pastor Chris. I was there live in that service and how we screamed for joy as the man walked out of the chair. My convert was sorely discouraged. This was because the man was already healed before the staged 'healing'. And what's worse?

I made enquiry about this . And I was told the people that are put on wheelchair are medically wheelchair cases. Even though they received some healing and improvement during the classes before being ministered to . They still have to be on wheelchairs medically until full healing when man of God prays for them. You can't over stretched the body of such people till they fully recover. It can cause harm. They are made to excercise Their faith at certain times in the classes . But it has to be under guidance . But the truth of the matter is that they came paralyzed and they left healed .

They refused his deaf mute daughter the opportunity of being prayed for

They are very strict in the classes . If you miss a class you may have to repeat. I sent a woman there last month . She arrived Saturday instead of Friday . She had missed two classes . They didn't admit her. I tried pressing buttons calling officials that I know . One simply advised me. " I will not lie to you , she has to come back on 17th she has missed 2 classes. Secondly the response of their healing qualifies them for final ministration. It is a school .

Well the staff of the Healing School were very strict so that one night, as this poor convert of mine was coming to Satellite town from Ikeja after school (and that costs a fortune!) his mute daughter had stepped on a spiky rod protruding from the bus as they were about to alight. The girl was mighty stubborn due to her deafness I assume. So her father asked her to come down and she kept musing rubbish being unable to tell the father her leg was stuck. In anger the father dragged her and her leg was badly torn leading to serious bleeding. They wound up in the hospital where she got stitches. They had to miss healing school classes for two days.

They are very strict . Even if the patient or student were parents of a senior pastor or co official . Same rule applies . They are strict to schedules .

Joagbaje:


Healing school is going on in lagos . Just simply take a sick person there and find out for yourself not by other men story. I have 3 people there . One has complete miracle already without pastor chris praying for them yet. Just by the teaching in the classes and prayers of faith . The other who's husband had stroke and mental challenge for 2 years called yesterday . His mind is restored already . He's beginning to walk far better . Pastor chris has not laid hands on them yet . Many are healed .

Why do men like you continue to deceive the vulnerable and the weak at heart? Surely, God will visit you, if not this life, definitely in the next

Boss13:


Why do men like you continue to deceive the vulnerable and the weak at heart? Surely, God will visit you, if not this life, definitely in the next

why are men like you blinded by Satan to always doubt .


John 7:12
12 And there was much murmuring among the people concerning him: for some said, He is a good man: others said, Nay; but he deceiveth the people.

Joagbaje:


why are men like you blinded by Satan to always doubt .


John 7:12
12 And there was much murmuring among the people concerning him: for some said, He is a good man: others said, Nay; but he deceiveth the people.

Why are those healed never on nairaland?

Joagbaje:



I made enquiry about this . And I was told the people that are put on wheelchair are medically wheelchair cases. Even though they received some healing and improvement during the classes before being ministered to . They still have to be on wheelchairs medically until full healing when man of God prays for them. You can't over stretched the body of such people till they fully recover. It can cause harm. They are made to excercise Their faith at certain times in the classes . But it has to be under guidance . But the truth of the matter is that they came paralyzed and they left healed .

Imoo, if that's the case, I think the congregation should have been notified before hand that the person had already been healed.

That is precisly why sirjohn claimed that the miracles was stage managed to make it seem like the person was healed instantly. This calls to question the motives of the organizers. Was it done that way to ascribe more publicity to pastor Chris as a faith healer? Things like this, the process should be open and transparent for all to see, so as not to create a platform for skeptics and unbelivers to dive on.

Hi every one?
Did I just bump this post? Yes I did.

This must be the latest gibberish from this b*****! HS my foot! NKT!

Joagbaje:


Healing school is going on in lagos . Just simply take a sick person there and find out for yourself not by other men story. I have 3 people there . One has complete miracle already without pastor chris praying for them yet. Just by the teaching in the classes and prayers of faith . The other who's husband had stroke and mental challenge for 2 years called yesterday . His mind is restored already . He's beginning to walk far better . Pastor chris has not laid hands on them yet . Many are healed .

Kenyan28:
This must be the latest gibberish from this b*****! HS my foot! NKT!

. Discerning eyes are opened on Jo and Christ Embassy frauds. Will keep referring to this thread and others to enlighten possible gullible ones.

Kenyan28:
This must be the latest gibberish from this b*****! HS my foot! NKT!

LOL, my dear... You still bitter after all these years?

How are you doing today? The HS has moved on.. You best do so too.

justice is very scarce in the world even as Jeremiah 12:10 declared who is good?,Prophets and pastors and apostles have destroyed my vineyard, they have trodden my portion under foot, they have made my pleasant portion a desolate wilderness.DO HUMAN BEIGNS REALLY LIKE TO HEAR THE TRUTH?::::: authority and judgement has come back to the earth,BEHOLD we are not begging human beigns to accept our truth and revelation and that is why we have told them,this is power as of old , that go and sin no more power of REAL Jesus Christ which is unbelievable to human beigns , so cant you see that we are wiser than you that criticize us?dont forget this that many are pretenders INFACT THEY are pretenders who will rather die that accept defeat just like Pharoah of bible time who preferred to sink in the ocean than accept defeat from moses even though pharoah knew the truth just like may evil people who read us knows our truth and revelation and many of his , pharoahs descendants are still in existence today so you that is ignorant and blind spiritually will not know but we know by the reason of the light and the mantle and the power that be and that is why we reveal the HIDDEN mystery OF HUMANBEIGNS ?you that think that you are wise?many human beigns like to stand at the gate of heaven ,enter they will never enter ,also allow others to enter they will never allow others to enter so you must think humanbeigns:we are speaking by the power that is unbelievable to human beigns *this is typical of all our truth and revelation and explanations about the night people ,the rich people and evil marine and occult world and those whom human beings believe in them so much that they were called by God or where made rich by God who are in existence today as being powerful and others as the descendants of the prophets and priests referred to here in the bible @#### Jeremiah 5,25, Your wrongdoings have kept God away;your sins have deprived you of good and peace and night sleep.26 “Among my people are the wicked,who lie in wait like men who snare birds and like those who set traps to catch people.27 Like cages full of birds,their houses are full of deceit;they have become rich and powerful,28 and have grown fat and sleek.Their evil deeds have no limit; they do not seek Gods justice and secular.They do not promote the case of the fatherless;they do not defend the just cause of the poor even when they do its for their own selfish reason unknowingly to the those benefiting from them?.29 Should I not punish them for this?”declares the Lord.“Should I not avenge myself.on such a nation as this?30 “A horrible and shocking thing has happened in the land,31 The prophets prophesy lies, the priests rule by their own authority,and my people love it this way.But what will you do in the end?is it not those we call CHAMELEONS Let this phrase as follows sink in you and we repeat that we keep telling you human beigns about them that are being referred to in those passages by God himself hence judgement has come again or cant you see the judgment is all over the place even though the worst judgement is happening spiritually now but because those being judged are pretenders we repeat who will rather die that accept defeat just like Pharoah of bible time who preferred to sink in the ocean than accept defeat from moses even though pharoah knew the truth just like may evil people who read us knows our truth and revelation and many of his pharoahs descendants are still in existence today so you that is ignorant and blind spiritually will not know but we know by the reason of the light and the mantle and the power that be and that is why we reveal the mystery ?you that think that you are wise?this is words of authority and power from real Jesus CHRIST, that we declare and they are spirits,who can battle with the God of justice,he that made the spiritual laws?we are not begging human beigns to accept the truth and thats why we have told them this is power as of Jesus Christ which is unbelievable to human beigns so cant you see that we are wiser than you that criticize us BUT AS USUAL ONLY TIME WILL TELL WHO IS GENUINE OR NOT?DO NOT SAY YOU WHERE NOT TOLD THAT KINGDOM OF GOD OF JUSTICE HAS COME AND JUDGEMENT HAS COME BACK TO THE EARTH:YOU ARE PERMITTED TO INVESTIGATE BUT HOW WOULD YOU INVESTIGATE WHEN YOU ARE SPIRITUALLY BLIND?JEREMIAH 5,21-22

Kenyan28:
This must be the latest gibberish from this b*****! HS my foot! NKT!

Gombs:

LOL, my dear... You still bitter after all these years?
How are you doing today? The HS has moved on.. You best do so too.

Kenya28 Forgive the Christ Embassy gang and move on with your life. (formerly Pastor and co-author) Anita has dissociated herself from the gang and moved on with her life how much more you.

Topgainer:


Kenya28 Forgive the Christ Embassy gang and move on with your life. (formerly Pastor and co-author) Anita has dissociated herself from the gang and moved on with her life how much more you.

Kenya28, listen to him.

Several years on, I'm glad this thread is still opening eyes.
I still stand by every word

SirJohn:
Several years on, I'm glad this thread is still opening eyes.
I still stand by every word

Gombs:

Joagbaje:
Healing school is going on in lagos.
Just simply take a sick person there and find out for yourself not by other men story. I have 3 people there. One has complete miracle already without pastor chris praying for them yet. Just by the teaching in the classes and prayers of faith. The other who's husband had stroke and mental challenge for 2 years called yesterday. His mind is restored already. He's beginning to walk far better. Pastor chris has not laid hands on them yet. Many are healed

Joagbaje:
I made enquiry about this.
And I was told the people that are put on wheelchair are medically wheelchair cases.
Even though they received some healing and improvement during the classes before being ministered to.
They still have to be on wheelchairs medically until full healing when man of God prays for them.

Why only wheel chairs, when are wooden legs going to be seen left behind at CEC healing grounds?

Joagbaje:
You can't over stretched the body of such people till they fully recover. It can cause harm.
They are made to excercise their faith at certain times in the classes. But it has to be under guidance. But the truth of the matter is that they came paralyzed and they left healed

Boss13:
Why do men like you continue to deceive the vulnerable and the weak at heart? Surely, God will visit you, if not this life, definitely in the next

Joagbaje:
why are men like you blinded by Satan to always doubt .
John 7:12
12 And there was much murmuring among the people concerning him: for some said, He is a good man: others said,
Nay; but he deceiveth the people.

Save your breath concerned Boss13, such men's consciences are seared with a hot iron
Resorting to sophistry and misusing John 7:12 to justify their deception course of action is the tell tale sign

Ranchhoddas:
Why are those healed never on nairaland?

You dey mind the Jero