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Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. - Politics (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Nobody: 10:54am On May 27, 2015
SUBSIDY NAA NI
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by nerodenero: 10:54am On May 27, 2015
Just to register presence and follow the discuss.
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Nobody: 10:54am On May 27, 2015
If subsidy is true,why is the government afraid to remove it?
And what are the benefits of subsidy removal?
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Koroaso: 10:55am On May 27, 2015
*****THEY HAVE RUINED THE COUNTRY********
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by jordyspices: 10:57am On May 27, 2015
Interesting continue
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Lillyj: 10:59am On May 27, 2015
Interesting....
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Realdeals(m): 11:03am On May 27, 2015
subsidy a scam! visit this thread https://www.nairaland.com/2339465/buhari-not-use-oil-marketers

"...In the short run, we will not use the marketers for the PMS importation... we shall give all our local PMS needs that NNPC cannot refine to foreign firms to refine for us and pay them the cost of refining...
"We shall provide transport to ship crude to and from the foreign refineries and pay the cost of refining for us...I believe that will remove the subsidy fraud in the short run...
"when I give you 200,000 bpd to refine, you must give me the equivalent outputs that it will bring in kerosene, PMS, Diesel etc...
"...But in the long run, we shall encourage local refineries..."

OrlandoOwoh:
When this marketers import fuel, they and the government make it look as if we don't export crude. Why should we even pay as much as 87 naira. Muhammdu Buhari has just given us a simple logic on fuel import. Look at this scenerio: I'm a cassava farmer that like garri but don't know how to make it from my cassava. I give my cassava to the woman that fries garri, why should I pay as much as the person that doesn't plant cassava before I eat garri? I could agree, base on the quantinty of cassava I'm ready to give to the garri frier, to pay her little money for the garri or nothing at all (after exchange of much cassava in a trade by barter manner).

6 Likes 1 Share

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Nobody: 11:04am On May 27, 2015
even if i say anything, will i be heard?
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by kinibigdeal(m): 11:05am On May 27, 2015
gohome:
Question



Answer

[b]Nigeria can no longer afford to pay subsidy on petroleum products full stop. Corruption or no corruption we do not have the money to pay. You have to let it sink in your head. We have an infrastructural decay that will take 200 billion dollars to fix, you have annual 'deficit' budget of less than 20 billion dollars of which 40 percent is used to fund lazy states and you want to continue to spend 25% of your the remaining budget to subsidize PMS?

Hope the anology below helps

You are the head of your house, and you have an annual budget of 100 naira. Rent in a dilapidated house is 20 Naira. School fees is 20 Naira. Transportation to work and school is 30 Naira. Fueling your generator is 30 Naira. Let say you want to start up a new business to increase your income and as such you need to save 20 Naira. You also need to move from your present apartment because the ceiling leaks water any time it rains, which will require you save an extra 10 Naira. You took a loan from the bank, and the monthly deduction is 10 Naira. You have relations that cannot run their family and they have come asking for money because the landlord is about to evict them from the house. In the middle of all these, Something happened and your annual budget is reduced to 50 Naira. Will you keep paying for fuel to light up your house while you cannot pay rent and your kids can not go to school?

Before you critic always put yourself in a leadership position and provide practical solution
[/b]


Question

Were you able to give this analysis when jonathan government made several attempt to remove it? were you not part of those that protested against it at ojota? Now those that oppose it during is government are trying to remove it! Our politics is all about interest and not about the citizen undecided

5 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by missKiffy(f): 11:06am On May 27, 2015
Someone should explain what subsidy is to me, in layman language
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by bandely(m): 11:06am On May 27, 2015
I see some folks hammering it that they told the rest of
Nigeria that "subsidy" should have been totally removed in
2012.
Well, I (and I know a lot of people too) supported the "non-
removal of subsidy" then on the grounds that:
1. Technically, they may not have been anything called
subsidy, as GMB reiterates in his recent interview with Daily
Trust. Rather, what we might have had were loopholes for
people who were hell-bent of running the country aground.
Suffice to say the "subsidy" may have been a facade
2. The second and most important one is that, even if there
is subsidy, the government of the day (2012) cannot be
trusted with the money realized from total removal of
subsidy, due to the perceived gargantuan corruption and
misappropriation that went unabated in the administration.
The logic was, we know they are going to steal it, then let's
have it in whatever manner instead.
I make bold to say it was the best decision to take as at then, and I'd gladly support it again (given the same
circumstance), afterall, in the end, the GEJ administration
did not act contrary to our belief that the money would
"disappeared" via corrupt means as witnessed with SURE-P
fund, the CBN-NNPC $20Billion among others.
However, an opportunity presents itself for GMB to totally
remove the subsidy, if at all the scheme exists! Nigerians
won't complain much this time, afterall, they've bought it
already this week for around 500naira per litre.

10 Likes 1 Share

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by kinibigdeal(m): 11:09am On May 27, 2015
Yomieluv:
If subsidy is true,why is the government afraid to remove it?

And what are the benefits of subsidy removal?


Government is NEVER afraid to remove subsidy but those that are against the interest of the country are against it e.g ojota protest. Hence, removing subsidy will save Nigeria from the headache of oil marketers and provide a platform for our capital expenditure.

2 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by jaybee(f): 11:09am On May 27, 2015
@ gohome Please answer these questions with facts and figures and stop beating about the bush.


omenka:
Interesting!

I have just a few questions.


1). How much were previous administrations paying for subsidy??


2). How much did Jonathan pay on assumption of duty as the president and in subsequent years as president??


3). What necessitated the geometric increase in the expenditure on subsidy soon after Jonathan took over?? It was about 300billion on the budget but burgeoned to nearly 2trillion at the end of the fiscal year. Was there a corresponding increase in the demand of products to have warranted such increase in "supply"?? Did Nigeria get thirstier for petroleum products??


4). Was there any supplementary budget passed by the NASS to accommodate the increase as stated in #3??


5). There were about 40 importers of products prior to Jonathan's regime. After he took over, the list went over the roof to about 150!! What was the reason behind this??


#waiting.

Cc: gohome.

5 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Kx: 11:10am On May 27, 2015
@ go home, why are you avoiding the questions below?

In addition,
a. What is the tangible evidence of how well the proceeds of the partial removal and SURE-P initiative?
b. What explains the price of N130 for kerosene that enjoins subsidy and should be sold at N50 official?
c. Where is the common sense of buying refined fuel from abroad while we export the raw crude when the same govt is preaching a ban to the importation of fish and other goods that we naturally produce locally?
e. How do you react to this revelation:
SenseiX:

A parliamentary committee last year found that the subsidy system, with its ever-increasing number of importers licensed by the government, was “fraught with endemic corruption and entrenched inefficiency. Much of the amount claimed to have been paid as subsidy was actually not for consumed” fuel, the committee found.

omenka:
Interesting!

I have just a few questions.


1). How much were previous administrations paying for subsidy??


2). How much did Jonathan pay on assumption of duty as the president and in subsequent years as president??


3). What necessitated the geometric increase in the expenditure on subsidy soon after Jonathan took over?? It was about 300billion on the budget but burgeoned to nearly 2trillion at the end of the fiscal year. Was there a corresponding increase in the demand of products to have warranted such increase in "supply"?? Did Nigeria get thirstier for petroleum products??


4). Was there any supplementary budget passed by the NASS to accommodate the increase as stated in #3??


5). There were about 40 importers of products prior to Jonathan's regime. After he took over, the list went over the roof to about 150!! What was the reason behind this??


#waiting.

Cc: gohome.

3 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by segiwest(m): 11:11am On May 27, 2015
Can't we just use the money for subsidy to build our refineries and also make the power sector 100%. People are buying fuel @#500/ltr to run our gens and cars.
Agreed that not everybody can afford it, but this past one-two weeks shows that we have misplaced priorities.
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Realdeals(m): 11:13am On May 27, 2015
@ gohome

What happen to the 445,000 barrel of crude produced for domestic consumption
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by nafiachi(m): 11:13am On May 27, 2015
Guys there is only one simple answer to all ur questions on subsidy, IT is FRAUD.
In one of the ops question and answer quote it said the marketers all rush to import PMS because subsidy is paid for it. ?
Now, I am a plantain and banana seller, going all the way to benue to buy plantain @ #10, plus transport and my profit I intend to sell @ #20, but the govt says abeg sell @ #13 to the people we'll pay u the remaining #7, to me that is fair enuff, but when I am told sell @#13 we'll give u #50 then that is lucrative.
Point is this the marketers are into this subsidy thing because they make more than normal, now it is left for the govt to correct the corruption in that deal not remove the subsidy all through, I believe that was the position we had in the Occupy Protests.
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Nobody: 11:17am On May 27, 2015
gohome:


Answer

[b]The subsidy issue is not shrouded in mystery. You have chosen to be ignorant. The average price of PMS around the world is about 1.1 dollars per liter. That's 220 Naira per liter. Poorer countries pay this. We produce 2.2 million barrels per day, rich countries like Russia US, China, India UK Brazil that produces up to 5 times more oil than we do pay this. Poorer countries like Haiti Angola Gabon also pay this. Even poorer and remote villages in Nigeria, burutu Nembe, mambila pay 200 plus for a liter. So what is the problem with it all gone? I'm 2012, sanusi and Iwealla with Allison went round TV stations explaining the steps to fully deregulate the downstream sector, no one listened. 65 Naira or nothing was the chant. I remember when Sanusi said the best way to put a fire out is to eliminate the source of the fire.

It was shame that GEJ and his ministers did not have the political tenacity to completely do way with this fire. Buhari seems to have it. He will remove it, fuel will sell at 180-220 per liter[/b]


we shal ask buhari d qestioon dey asked gej..shw us d cabal
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Sibrah: 11:17am On May 27, 2015
Intellectual subsidy!
Why is diesel still fixed at N140/Ltr when price of crude has gone through series of fluctuations since 2012?

1 Like

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by charlesucheh(m): 11:20am On May 27, 2015
omenka:
Interesting!

I have just a few questions.


1). How much were previous administrations paying for subsidy??


2). How much did Jonathan pay on assumption of duty as the president and in subsequent years as president??


3). What necessitated the geometric increase in the expenditure on subsidy soon after Jonathan took over?? It was about 300billion on the budget but burgeoned to nearly 2trillion at the end of the fiscal year. Was there a corresponding increase in the demand of products to have warranted such increase in "supply"?? Did Nigeria get thirstier for petroleum products??


4). Was there any supplementary budget passed by the NASS to accommodate the increase as stated in #3??


5). There were about 40 importers of products prior to Jonathan's regime. After he took over, the list went over the roof to about 150!! What was the reason behind this??


#waiting.

Cc: gohome.
to your no 5; To increase the cartel of people who claims 15 vessels of oil products arrived in a single day, in otherwords, they diverted some in the real sense to cameroon and other border countries. 15 vessel of oil products cannot arrive in a day and Nigerian will still strive to get petroleum products, it is a joint collaboration with cabals in the Navy,FIRS,people in the ministry of finance and the CBN with other agencies charged with the responsibility of ensuring that what came is really what is to syphon the accruals from the diverted vessels. My brother, the subsidy to me is really not the problem ooO! But the aim has been defeated by corrupt elements. Like LAMIDO SANUSI said and i quote;" corruption strives on a proper means of checks and balances, but when you provide a condusive environment for it, it survives".
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by kinibigdeal(m): 11:20am On May 27, 2015
bandely:
I see some folks hammering it that they told the rest of
Nigeria that "subsidy" should have been totally removed in
2012.
Well, I (and I know a lot of people too) supported the "non-
removal of subsidy" then on the grounds that:
1. Technically, they may not have been anything called
subsidy, as GMB reiterates in his recent interview with Daily
Trust. Rather, what we might have had were loopholes for
people who were hell-bent of running the country aground.
Suffice to say the "subsidy" may have been a facade
2. The second and most important one is that, even if there
is subsidy, the government of the day (2012) cannot be
trusted with the money realized from total removal of
subsidy, due to the perceived gargantuan corruption and
misappropriation that went unabated in the administration.
[s]The logic was, we know they are going to steal it, then let's
have it in whatever manner instead.
I make bold to say it was the best decision to take as at then, and I'd gladly support it again (given the same
circumstance), afterall, in the end, the GEJ administration
did not act contrary to our belief that the money would
"disappeared" via corrupt means as witnessed with SURE-P
fund, the CBN-NNPC $20Billion among others.
However, an opportunity presents itself for GMB to t[/s]otally
remove the subsidy, if at all the scheme exists! Nigerians
won't complain much this time, afterall, they've bought it
already this week for around 500naira per litre.



Your comment are too loopsided. The fact that you said you were against it in 2012 due to your unfounded fact speaks alot about your personality and you supporting it now enapse my conclusion. The protest against subsidy in 2012 was highly political and not for the interest of the nation, the calculation was to render this present administration ungovernable in lieu of their interest in 2015 which really work for them perfectly. Majority of the policy GEJ administration had then was strongly opposed through press and whatever platform because of their political calculation of 2015. The effect was, the more you oppose a beneficial policy, the more the aesthetic decay compiled and remain unsolved. Now the consequence of their unfounded critics is what they want to carry now which is almost impossible to solve in 8years. The problem we have as a nation is that our critics are never issue based but political gain

8 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by tunene66: 11:22am On May 27, 2015
in simply terms to me subsidy is ensuring that the price of a good or service is below the actual cost price-in other words, there is a loss. No concerning the Nigerian situation, the crude oil is sold in the international market at ruling price. Its based on this that the Federal Government bases its budget. So the crude is sold and we import, like any other country, refined oil at international price, together with it attendant cost of transportation, insurance and landing charges. These no doubt makes the cost of refined oil higher than crude (since value has been added). Now the Govt. arbitrarily fixes the refined oil (PMS) price. So the differential is called Subsidy

Well the counter argument is that ideally, the budget of Nigeria should be based on crude oil that is sold to external customers. The crude oil that is to be used eventually in the country should be sold at local cost of production price to refineries who will the send it back at a reduced price. States and LGAs will kick because it will mean reduced revenue, no wonder they wand an Accountant General of the Federal Republic

So to me there is subsidy but its being mismanaged because our monitoring agencies have been corrupt

The way out.....

1 Like

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Doracle2: 11:24am On May 27, 2015
With the reduction in crude oil price by almost 50% in the last 10 months, not sure we would be paying more than N120 without subsidy.

There should be plans to refine locally which should further reduce the price of petroleum products

gohome:


Answer

[b]The subsidy issue is not shrouded in mystery. You have chosen to be ignorant. The average price of PMS around the world is about 1.1 dollars per liter. That's 220 Naira per liter. Poorer countries pay this. We produce 2.2 million barrels per day, rich countries like Russia US, China, India UK Brazil that produces up to 5 times more oil than we do pay this. Poorer countries like Haiti Angola Gabon also pay this. Even poorer and remote villages in Nigeria, burutu Nembe, mambila pay 200 plus for a liter. So what is the problem with it all gone? I'm 2012, sanusi and Iwealla with Allison went round TV stations explaining the steps to fully deregulate the downstream sector, no one listened. 65 Naira or nothing was the chant. I remember when Sanusi said the best way to put a fire out is to eliminate the source of the fire.

It was shame that GEJ and his ministers did not have the political tenacity to completely do way with this fire. Buhari seems to have it. He will remove it, fuel will sell at 180-220 per liter[/b]

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Empredboy(m): 11:27am On May 27, 2015
Guys, i dnt want to talk as an economist dat i am but as a layman so dat we all will understand dis subsidy matter. Yes there is subsidy but the marketers are eating fat on the subsidy loopholes. Let me give u an exampl; this marketers will import fuel, show it to d NNPC for subsidy collection on what they imported, instead of them taking the fuel to nigeria filling stations they will take it back to outside d country either thru d sea or sell to benin rep people. Yet they sell back to this foreigners in d same price they sell in the international market. So they earn money frm naija govt for what they didnt import n sell back to outside country.
If govt removes subsidy n allow d forces of demand n supply to occur as its done in telecommunication then these criminals will be sent away.

1 Like

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by 9jatatafo(m): 11:29am On May 27, 2015
gen2briz:
Please who are the oil marketers they're paying this subsidy to?

I know 3 marketers but there are more. The ones I know are Oanda owned by Wale Tunubu, Capital Oil owned by Ifeanyi Ubah and Con Oil by Femi Otedola
Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by gbengus17: 11:32am On May 27, 2015
TO ME, THE GOVT SHOULD FORGET ABOUT ANY TYPE OF SUBSIDY. LET US BE LIVING OUR LIFE LIKE THAT. IF THE SUBSIDY IS REMOVED, PETROL WILL SELL FOR 140 - 150 PER LITRE, IS IT NOT BETTER THAN ALL THIS MESS WE ARE IN NOW. AN ECONOMIST EVEN ASSURED ME THAT, IF ALL IMPORTERS ARE ALLOWED TO BRING IN PETROL, PRICES WILL FALL SERIOUSLY, EVEN LESS THAN 130. HUMAN BEINGS ARE IN TOGO- BENIN- GNANA- BURKINA FASO, GO THERE AND SEE HOW MUCH PETROL COST THERE.THEY ARE STILL ALIVE AND DOING FINE.----------------------------------------------------- ANOTHER ISSUE IS THAT WE NIGERIANS WASTE FUEL A LOT. WE DRIVE UP AND DOWN ANYHOW, USE GENERATOR ANYHOW ETC, SUBSIDY REMOVAL WILL HELP TO REDUCE OUR CONSUMPTION PATTERN. TO ME THERE IS A BIG CARTEL BEHIND THIS SUBSIDY OF A THING, POCKETING SERIOUS MONEY. THE GOVT SHOULD USE THE MONEY TO RENOVATE OUR REFINARIES.

3 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Nobody: 11:33am On May 27, 2015
gohome:


Answer

[b]The subsidy issue is not shrouded in mystery. You have chosen to be ignorant. The average price of PMS around the world is about 1.1 dollars per liter. That's 220 Naira per liter. Poorer countries pay this. We produce 2.2 million barrels per day, rich countries like Russia US, China, India UK Brazil that produces up to 5 times more oil than we do pay this. Poorer countries like Haiti Angola Gabon also pay this. Even poorer and remote villages in Nigeria, burutu Nembe, mambila pay 200 plus for a liter. So what is the problem with it all gone? I'm 2012, sanusi and Iwealla with Allison went round TV stations explaining the steps to fully deregulate the downstream sector, no one listened. 65 Naira or nothing was the chant. I remember when Sanusi said the best way to put a fire out is to eliminate the source of the fire.

It was shame that GEJ and his ministers did not have the political tenacity to completely do way with this fire. Buhari seems to have it. He will remove it, fuel will sell at 180-220 per liter[/b]


ur last paragraph is rigged with st.upidity I must say.

3 Likes

Re: Subsidy 101: Q &A On Subsidy. by Empredboy(m): 11:37am On May 27, 2015
kinibigdeal:




Your comment are too loopsided. The fact that you said you were against it in 2012 due to your unfounded fact speaks alot about your personality and you supporting it now enapse my conclusion. The protest against subsidy in 2012 was highly political and not for the interest of the nation, the calculation was to render this present administration ungovernable in lieu of their interest in 2015 which really work for them perfectly. Majority of the policy GEJ administration had then was strongly opposed through press and whatever platform because of their political calculation of 2015. The effect was, the more you oppose a beneficial policy, the more the aesthetic decay compiled and remain unsolved. Now the consequence of their unfounded critics is what they want to carry now which is almost impossible to solve in 8years. The problem we have as a nation is that our critics are never issue based but political gain
you got it wrong, what make u a leader is an abililty to stand firm in ur belief. When OBJ wanted to deregulate telecommunication, sebi the gove of edo state then NLC president was against it but OBJ still had his way now we all are enjoying GSM. OBJ wanted to deregulate d oil sector we all were ignorantly against it but he tactically fustrated the cabals by increasing the PMS price but yar'dua reduse it thinking he was doing d nation good.

1 Like

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